Legend of Dragoon (Speed Run)

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Legend of Dragoon (Speed Run)

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Edit history:

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 02:01:25 am

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 02:00:45 am

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 01:58:51 am

2013-03-09 01:58:22 am

We require more minerals

So you do actually have no healing for Last Kraken? You have to grind through 4k health with him getting a variable number of turns to be able to get to the point where Meru can burst him down. I mean we're both throwing 5 TLs, how can you risk that with no healing items? What happens if he just blasts Albert or Dart multiple turns in a row? Even with Rose storm if you have no healing that's pushing your luck pretty far. Even if you are forced to use your one healing breeze in the battle and then have none after that it's still pushing it pretty hard.

The other problem is it seems like you're stretching those CPs in the moon very far while also making detours to pick up items how many menus are you using to push encounters? You said that you're not pushing them entire screens so are you doing large portions at any point? For instance I don't remember being able to get from the gravity grabber (the last item) to the super virage without having to push it pretty far. Same with getting from the inn the last time to the Archangel, it's possible but took so long that I"m not entirely sure if it was worth it.

Why not cut a few charm potions and just take a few encounters just for SS safety? That seems to be really pushing it. Especially since I get to Melbu with way more healing items and a party that doesn't take as much damage as yours and still usually get run pretty close to out.

So you do actually have no healing for Last Kraken? You have to grind through 4k health with him getting a variable number of turns to be able to get to the point where Meru can burst him down. I mean we're both throwing 5 TLs, how can you risk that with no healing items? What happens if he just blasts Albert or Dart multiple turns in a row? Even with Rose storm if you have no healing that's pushing your luck pretty far. Even if you are forced to use your one healing breeze in the battle and then have none after that it's still pushing it pretty hard.

The other problem is it seems like you're stretching those CPs in the moon very far while also making detours to pick up items how many menus are you using to push encounters? You said that you're not pushing them entire screens so are you doing large portions at any point? For instance I don't remember being able to get from the gravity grabber (the last item) to the super virage without having to push it pretty far. Same with getting from the inn the last time to the Archangel, it's possible but took so long that I"m not entirely sure if it was worth it.

Why not cut a few charm potions and just take a few encounters just for SS safety? That seems to be really pushing it. Especially since I get to Melbu with way more healing items and a party that doesn't take as much damage as yours and still usually get run pretty close to out.

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-03-09 06:51:01 am

The2012Robot: 2013-03-09 06:19:18 am

The2012Robot: 2013-03-09 06:16:12 am

2013-03-09 02:39:51 am

I run for fun :)

I don't really know what to say other than health isn't a problem for me with Last Kraken. I don't even use Rose Storm. But yeah, I think sometimes I have to use an HB in battle. Don't know how often. I kill KVS so fast that health isn't really an issue with them either, that's why I heal whatever damage I took afterwards to full so I'm 100% prepared for L+Z.

Menu delays... let me think... Well, probably have to hit the menu about 5 times for right before Archangel. To get through Mayfil without a CP, you have to hit a ton of menus on the HR screen. Still most likely faster than getting into a battle though. I delay into the Imago screen, which is a couple of menus. Nothing big. And I may have to delay into the Super Virage once or twice. I still have a bit of testing to do to make absolutely sure that I can make it to the end of the game reliably, but it seems like I can, at least in my experience.

I go through all my healing items almost every time I do a fresh Melbu fight. I just always seem to survive every time. Kinda just works out.

Edit: Man, I have no idea how you got a 35 on Melbu. I thought your ~39 was extremely lucky because of how long the boss stayed in his 2nd form. Your strategy doesn't seem much different from mine. Hell, my 1st form strategy is 2:00 faster than your WR, and it wouldn't have affected your 2nd form strategy at all! And my 4th form is 2:00 faster than yours as well! It's the 2nd and 3rd form where you really have me beat.

Whoa... suddenly I feel like... collaborating...? Seriously felt weird there for a second... What if on Melbu's second form, you used Meru's D.lvl.2 to get him to suck her in first, then use Haschel/Albert's D.lvl.2 to get him sucked in second (I know for a fact that Albert can 200 SP just in time to be sucked in)? I have every single one of your attacks in your WR Melbu run recorded (what? I'm thorough :P). Plotting my moves (with speed in mind and my knowledge of Albert in this battle) next to them, using only 2 extra moves, I could probably squeeze out around 13,075 damage. If Haschel got as many damage boosts as he did in your WR, it would be around 13,850. This would ensure a super short 3rd form (which I think is very important because if you don't overkill the 2nd form at all, 3rd form can take over 10 minutes). What do you think?

P.S.: In case you didn't know, Melbu can go into 3rd after only 8000 damage to the 2nd. It. Is. AWFUL. And it's one thing that makes a Crush Dance-less run take so long. You overkilled him to 13,600 in your WR.

I don't really know what to say other than health isn't a problem for me with Last Kraken. I don't even use Rose Storm. But yeah, I think sometimes I have to use an HB in battle. Don't know how often. I kill KVS so fast that health isn't really an issue with them either, that's why I heal whatever damage I took afterwards to full so I'm 100% prepared for L+Z.

Menu delays... let me think... Well, probably have to hit the menu about 5 times for right before Archangel. To get through Mayfil without a CP, you have to hit a ton of menus on the HR screen. Still most likely faster than getting into a battle though. I delay into the Imago screen, which is a couple of menus. Nothing big. And I may have to delay into the Super Virage once or twice. I still have a bit of testing to do to make absolutely sure that I can make it to the end of the game reliably, but it seems like I can, at least in my experience.

I go through all my healing items almost every time I do a fresh Melbu fight. I just always seem to survive every time. Kinda just works out.

Edit: Man, I have no idea how you got a 35 on Melbu. I thought your ~39 was extremely lucky because of how long the boss stayed in his 2nd form. Your strategy doesn't seem much different from mine. Hell, my 1st form strategy is 2:00 faster than your WR, and it wouldn't have affected your 2nd form strategy at all! And my 4th form is 2:00 faster than yours as well! It's the 2nd and 3rd form where you really have me beat.

Whoa... suddenly I feel like... collaborating...? Seriously felt weird there for a second... What if on Melbu's second form, you used Meru's D.lvl.2 to get him to suck her in first, then use Haschel/Albert's D.lvl.2 to get him sucked in second (I know for a fact that Albert can 200 SP just in time to be sucked in)? I have every single one of your attacks in your WR Melbu run recorded (what? I'm thorough :P). Plotting my moves (with speed in mind and my knowledge of Albert in this battle) next to them, using only 2 extra moves, I could probably squeeze out around 13,075 damage. If Haschel got as many damage boosts as he did in your WR, it would be around 13,850. This would ensure a super short 3rd form (which I think is very important because if you don't overkill the 2nd form at all, 3rd form can take over 10 minutes). What do you think?

P.S.: In case you didn't know, Melbu can go into 3rd after only 8000 damage to the 2nd. It. Is. AWFUL. And it's one thing that makes a Crush Dance-less run take so long. You overkilled him to 13,600 in your WR.

Edit history:

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 10:40:15 pm

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 10:39:55 pm

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 10:33:47 pm

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 10:33:46 pm

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 10:33:45 pm

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 10:32:39 pm

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 10:30:34 pm

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 10:27:50 pm

Raelcun: 2013-03-09 10:26:03 pm

2013-03-09 10:20:08 pm

We require more minerals

You don't want Melbu to suck in a dragoon because then he gets the shoulder laser attack. When the person absorbed isn't a dragoon he's incapable of using that. The first form can be semi variable but I have a way of making it work out consistently. The 2nd phase in the WR was really bad because he sucked in Dart which is the worst thing that can happen. The third phase actually went faster than I intended I did more damage than I meant to and that's why phase 4 was ugly. I didn' have the dragoon levels for the 4th phase like I wanted.

The first phase locks himself into not doing anything while he's int he defensive counter-attack posture. So I transform both Dart and Haschel to do damage without triggering the counter attack so he gets no turns as D additions don't trigger it. Then I guard while I try to figure out when Melbu gets a turn (there's usually a visible pause as he gets a turn then does nothing.) If timed right then I can break the counter attack by attacking him normally and get 3-4 hits from Dart and Haschel until he gets another turn. He will immediately go back into the counter attack posture but at this point he's most of the way to phase 2. So I immediately trigger the counter attack and hit him normally and this will push him to phase 2 with the boss only taking 3 turns usually.

Also the absorption attack is programmed to prioritize dragoons and even more than that Dart in divine dragoon. Because of this the AI kind of breaks when he absorbs someone and then Dart goes Divine Dragoon. Doing this you can make him go through only a single phase of the absorption attack and knock him into the third phase without him wasting a bunch of time. The only problem with the second phase is if he absorbs Dart or if he gets lucky on the counter attacks.

Third phase really isn't much of an issue for me but it's where I use most of my healing and drop any extra attack items I still have. Priority is to get Dart back to level 5 dragoon before he switches to the last form and to get Meru DLevel 1 minimum, 2 is good as it allows for an extra freezing ring.

The last form I've found that if you actually use a speed down he gets more turns. (I have no idea why this is the case but it's consistent.) So I use a power up on Meru, Power down on Melbu (makes him not a threat to instant kill anyone) and a speed up on Dart (this is important for the AI manipulation.)

Meru uses a Trans Light (1000-1200) a PBX(~2300? I don't remember) and a Trans Light(Power Down wears off even though he only takes 2 turns, so this does less), and by then dart should have 1 or 2 dragoon levels left (1200 hits from full D Additions while Power Down is going) when it's Meru's turn again. Meru transforms and uses a freezing ring (500 each).

At this point the damage is 2x TL 1200 + I want to say 700, and PBX 2300 for 3200 damage.

Dart has hit 3 times for D additions doing 900 or 1200 (4 hits and 5 hits) doing usually 3600 more for 6800 total he's already past half.

If I have a second bandits ring Haschel gets an extra turn and hits twice for 700 each. 700-1400 for 7500 total.

Meru uses two Freezing rings (500 each) 8500

Dart uses the last two d levels on d additions for 800 or 900 each (4 hits and 5 hits) for 1800 more totalling 10300 damage. At this point he's under 2k to go depending on how much damage you did to phase 3 and he goes into dragon block mode and is no longer a threat.

D Magic triggers the AI to go into the dragoon block staff form and summon the adds. The turn order almost always works out so that both Meru and Dart will get 2 turns before the staff effect lands so they can both safely untransform. This gets rid of Melbu's capability to use any of his super long attacks and also the damage from the adds is significantly lower and Melbu is now super low health.

Dart and Haschel blast him with straight damage while the dragon block effect is still going and Meru does any needed healing. He dies and the 4th phase if done well has no opportunity to kill anyone as Dart is still transformed, Meru has Power up still active and has damage reduction and Haschel doesn't die in one hit from anything. In the WR I killed the third phase way faster than I intended to and Dart didn't have the DLevels, that's where everything went wrong. I was unable to do my well planned out 4th phase because the turn orders got all messed up and I got unlucky with the attacks he used.

You don't want Melbu to suck in a dragoon because then he gets the shoulder laser attack. When the person absorbed isn't a dragoon he's incapable of using that. The first form can be semi variable but I have a way of making it work out consistently. The 2nd phase in the WR was really bad because he sucked in Dart which is the worst thing that can happen. The third phase actually went faster than I intended I did more damage than I meant to and that's why phase 4 was ugly. I didn'  have the dragoon levels for the 4th phase like I wanted.

The first phase locks himself into not doing anything while he's int he defensive counter-attack posture. So I transform both Dart and Haschel to do damage without triggering the counter attack so he gets no turns as D additions don't trigger it. Then I guard while I try to figure out when Melbu gets a turn (there's usually a visible pause as he gets a turn then does nothing.) If timed right then I can break the counter attack by attacking him normally and get 3-4 hits from Dart and Haschel until he gets another turn. He will immediately go back into the counter attack posture but at this point he's most of the way to phase 2. So I immediately trigger the counter attack and hit him normally and this will push him to phase 2 with the boss only taking 3 turns usually.

Also the absorption attack is programmed to prioritize dragoons and even more than that Dart in divine dragoon. Because of this the AI kind of breaks when he absorbs someone and then Dart goes Divine Dragoon. Doing this you can make him go through only a single phase of the absorption attack and knock him into the third phase without him wasting a bunch of time. The only problem with the second phase is if he absorbs Dart or if he gets lucky on the counter attacks.

Third phase really isn't much of an issue for me but it's where I use most of my healing and drop any extra attack items I still have. Priority is to get Dart back to level 5 dragoon before he switches to the last form and to get Meru DLevel 1 minimum, 2 is good as it allows for an extra freezing ring.

The last form I've found that if you actually use a speed down he gets more turns. (I have no idea why this is the case but it's consistent.) So I use a power up on Meru, Power down on Melbu (makes him not a threat to instant kill anyone) and a speed up on Dart (this is important for the AI manipulation.)

Meru uses a Trans Light (1000-1200) a PBX(~2300? I don't remember) and a Trans Light(Power Down wears off even though he only takes 2 turns, so this does less), and by then dart should have 1 or 2 dragoon levels left (1200 hits from full D Additions while Power Down is going) when it's Meru's turn again. Meru transforms and uses a freezing ring (500 each).

At this point the damage is 2x TL 1200 + I want to say 700, and PBX 2300 for 3200 damage.

Dart has hit 3 times for D additions doing 900 or 1200 (4 hits and 5 hits) doing usually 3600 more for 6800 total he's already past half.

If I have a second bandits ring Haschel gets an extra turn and hits twice for 700 each. 700-1400 for 7500 total.

Meru uses two Freezing rings (500 each) 8500

Dart uses the last two d levels on d additions for 800 or 900 each (4 hits and 5 hits) for 1800 more totalling 10300 damage. At this point he's under 2k to go depending on how much damage you did to phase 3 and he goes into dragon block mode and is no longer a threat.

D Magic triggers the AI to go into the dragoon block staff form and summon the adds. The turn order almost always works out so that both Meru and Dart will get 2 turns before the staff effect lands so they can both safely untransform. This gets rid of Melbu's capability to use any of his super long attacks and also the damage from the adds is significantly lower and Melbu is now super low health.

Dart and Haschel blast him with straight damage while the dragon block effect is still going and Meru does any needed healing. He dies and the 4th phase if done well has no opportunity to kill anyone as Dart is still transformed, Meru has Power up still active and has damage reduction and Haschel doesn't die in one hit from anything. In the WR I killed the third phase way faster than I intended to and Dart didn't have the DLevels, that's where everything went wrong. I was unable to do my well planned out 4th phase because the turn orders got all messed up and I got unlucky with the attacks he used.

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-03-10 04:45:33 pm

The2012Robot: 2013-03-10 04:51:29 am

2013-03-10 04:49:39 am

I run for fun :)

I've never found the shoulder laser attack to be that big of a deal. Seems worth it to me to have full control of his 2nd form and overkill him. If you were to kill him after only one absorption, you would have a TON of damage to burn through on his 3rd form which can be randomly slowed down by his command-block if you're unlucky. I'd rather do as much damage as I can to his 2nd form- when he can't command-block me. Even if you get lucky on 3rd's command-block, you still have a lot more damage to plow through, which mean sitting through more cinematics and random long attacks.

My first form- Meru uses 2 magic (doesn't matter what), Dart and Albert use 2 additions each (and Melbu hasn't even gone into his counter-attack mode yet). Dart uses Special and attacks all 5 turns for guaranteed damage. Meru uses Freezing Ring, Albert uses his 2 D.additions. Kills him before he even comes out of counter-attack posture. This is consistent.

I've never seen 4th form get more speed from Speed Down (and I've used it a good amount of times). Nor have I ever seen him lose speed from it. Either way, yeah, Speed Down appears to be useless.

I don't see how you could possibly save time by killing his 2nd form after 1 absorption. You would lose more time on his 3rd than you saved on his 2nd, at least in my experience using lvl. 5 Madness Hero (comes decently close to lvl. 4 Crush Dance in total damage output). Even with Crush Dance, you've gotta be burning more time than you save. If you've really got a 35 this way though, I would love to actually see it. Please show us Smiley

Edit: Or I guess I could test it myself. Wouldn't actually take very long... I think it would still be useful to actually see your ~35 though.

I've never found the shoulder laser attack to be that big of a deal. Seems worth it to me to have full control of his 2nd form and overkill him. If you were to kill him after only one absorption, you would have a TON of damage to burn through on his 3rd form which can be randomly slowed down by his command-block if you're unlucky. I'd rather do as much damage as I can to his 2nd form- when he can't command-block me. Even if you get lucky on 3rd's command-block, you still have a lot more damage to plow through, which mean sitting through more cinematics and random long attacks.

My first form- Meru uses 2 magic (doesn't matter what), Dart and Albert use 2 additions each (and Melbu hasn't even gone into his counter-attack mode yet). Dart uses Special and attacks all 5 turns for guaranteed damage. Meru uses Freezing Ring, Albert uses his 2 D.additions. Kills him before he even comes out of counter-attack posture. This is consistent.

I've never seen 4th form get more speed from Speed Down (and I've used it a good amount of times). Nor have I ever seen him lose speed from it. Either way, yeah, Speed Down appears to be useless.

I don't see how you could possibly save time by killing his 2nd form after 1 absorption. You would lose more time on his 3rd than you saved on his 2nd, at least in my experience using lvl. 5 Madness Hero (comes decently close to lvl. 4 Crush Dance in total damage output). Even with Crush Dance, you've gotta be burning more time than you save. If you've really got a 35 this way though, I would love to actually see it. Please show us :)

Edit: Or I guess I could test it myself. Wouldn't actually take very long... I think it would still be useful to actually see your ~35 though.

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-03-11 06:09:45 am

2013-03-10 06:33:36 pm

I run for fun :)

Just confirmed that different attack/defend changes not only affect the boss turn order, but character turn order as well, at least on emulator.

2013-03-14 08:22:06 pm

I run for fun :)

I REALLY want there to be a glitch or sequence break we can use in this run, so I did a little testing.

First, I tried to find a way to duplicate items/equipment. Despite some interesting things you can do with the menus, I didn't discover anything useful.

After that I tried to think of some places where it might be possible to sequence break. I haven't tested any of these skip-ideas yet (all attempts to get past bosses with menu delay): 1st Virage, Firebird, Kongol, Mappi, Grand Jewel, Windigo.

I haven't been able to skip any cutscene I've ever tried with menu delay, but I honestly haven't tried getting past that many, so I'm not going to rule them all out. The bosses I listed are just ones that have cutscenes... I hesitate to list further bosses because then you would be losing a lot of experience. Windigo and GJ are probably pushing it experience-wise.

To really know for sure that none of the cutscenes in this game are skipable, we'd have to look at the actual code or test them through gameplay, hence why I'm posting this- if there's anyone out there that wants to help in a potentially big way, this is one of the ways you could do that- test cutscenes and look for glitches/exploits, and share any ideas you might have in this thread.

Side-note: I discovered that I only need 4 TLs on Zackwell and 8 CPs in Aglis. This gave me 2 extra TLs for Melbu, which along with some strategy development, I've gotten down to a 37. And yeah, I'm using Crush Dance now.

I REALLY want there to be a glitch or sequence break we can use in this run, so I did a little testing.

First, I tried to find a way to duplicate items/equipment. Despite some interesting things you can do with the menus, I didn't discover anything useful.

After that I tried to think of some places where it might be possible to sequence break. I haven't tested any of these skip-ideas yet (all attempts to get past bosses with menu delay): 1st Virage, Firebird, Kongol, Mappi, Grand Jewel, Windigo.

I haven't been able to skip any cutscene I've ever tried with menu delay, but I honestly haven't tried getting past that many, so I'm not going to rule them all out. The bosses I listed are just ones that have cutscenes... I hesitate to list further bosses because then you would be losing a lot of experience. Windigo and GJ are probably pushing it experience-wise.

To really know for sure that none of the cutscenes in this game are skipable, we'd have to look at the actual code or test them through gameplay, hence why I'm posting this- if there's anyone out there that wants to help in a potentially big way, this is one of the ways you could do that- test cutscenes and look for glitches/exploits, and share any ideas you might have in this thread.

Side-note: I discovered that I only need 4 TLs on Zackwell and 8 CPs in Aglis. This gave me 2 extra TLs for Melbu, which along with some strategy development, I've gotten down to a 37. And yeah, I'm using Crush Dance now.

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-03-19 12:37:04 am

The2012Robot: 2013-03-18 11:47:37 pm

2013-03-18 11:13:51 pm

I run for fun :)

I recently discovered that you can use a Sachet on Windigo's heart. Wait for him to capture one of your characters, destroy the weak snow cannons, then Sachet his now revealed heart for an insta-kill. The only problem is, I'm not 100% use what makes him use his capture move (if it's random or if you can manipulate him). In my on-going testing, it seems like he can't capture someone who is defending, so just defending doesn't work. Amount of damage done doesn't appear to be a factor- I obtained my fastest time of 2:09 (first attack to blood explosion) by 1-hit attacking with each character until he captured someone.

2013-03-19 12:58:29 am

Quote:

Windigo

10,000 HP

Heart

3 HP

Snow Cannonx2

<= 400 HP

Battle ends when either Windigo or Heart dies. Lead off with a Speed Down on Windigo. Use a Speed Up on whoever.

If no attack item is used:

After 8 hits (mash to fail all additions), Windigo will grab a random character (favors character that previously attacked?) Afterwards, 2 Snow Cannons appear, take them out immediately. The heart opens itself up for a hit. Repeat two more times. Any hit can randomly trigger a Ghost Claw counter (believed to be a ⅓ chance, could be higher for failed additions?).

If attack item is used:

Grab counter is delayed, and he’ll start using an ice attack with a long animation.

2013-03-19 01:13:44 am

I run for fun :)

Great information Terribleno. This is exactly what I'm seeing. Just out of curiosity, did you figure this out yourself? I couldn't find this info on the internet. And of course, you don't need to repeat the process 2 more times when you've got a Sachet Wink

Wink

2013-03-19 01:19:38 am

Well, rinimt and myself were trying to figure out what his gimmick was when the battle seemed unreliable. Think we spent about 4 hours on this battle before realizing that it's hits, not damage that allows him to open up like that. He's a piece of cake compared to Grand Jewel and Lloyd, though. =\

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-03-19 03:31:15 am

The2012Robot: 2013-03-19 03:29:10 am

The2012Robot: 2013-03-19 03:28:21 am

2013-03-19 02:09:53 am

I run for fun :)

This new strategy is at least 2 minutes faster than my old one Smiley

And frees up a TON of inventory space- I was just using pure Burn Outs before.

Need help with GJ and Lloyd?

GJ: Dart uses Power Up and then Speed Up on Meru. Meru mashes 10-11 SNs while Dart and Albert use additions. He's not much of a problem with this simple but effective strategy.

Lloyd: Speed Up on Meru, Speed Down, then Power Up on Meru. Meru mashes 9 SNs, make sure everyone is healthy, then mash 1 more SN. Attack with someone until you land a hit to finish the fight. Dart and Albert just defend and heal if they have to throughout the battle. It's a very safe strategy and it's faster than you may think.

With that settled, I'm working on Crush Dance planning now. It doesn't look like it's going to save as much time as I thought it would. My best strategy for Melbu gives me a 37, which isn't the fastest. Going off that time though, Crush Dance saves 7 minutes over Volcano. But Crush Dance does less damage, so certain battles are affected to a certain degree. For instance, Lenus needs 3 extra attacks to kill. Crush Dance takes 1 second longer than Volcano, so there's 60 seconds. There are around 8-10 additions that I don't even need and as I said before, Crush Dance takes 8 seconds total over defending. That's at least 64 seconds, on top of whatever time is wasted prolonging the battle over using Volcano... but this all just a thought-process, no doubt with it's flaws. Even if all that was 100% accurate, I'm pretty sure Crush Dance will save me a couple of minutes at the very least in the end.

This new strategy is at least 2 minutes faster than my old one :) And frees up a TON of inventory space- I was just using pure Burn Outs before.

Need help with GJ and Lloyd?

GJ: Dart uses Power Up and then Speed Up on Meru. Meru mashes 10-11 SNs while Dart and Albert use additions. He's not much of a problem with this simple but effective strategy.

Lloyd: Speed Up on Meru, Speed Down, then Power Up on Meru. Meru mashes 9 SNs, make sure everyone is healthy, then mash 1 more SN. Attack with someone until you land a hit to finish the fight. Dart and Albert just defend and heal if they have to throughout the battle. It's a very safe strategy and it's faster than you may think.

With that settled, I'm working on Crush Dance planning now. It doesn't look like it's going to save as much time as I thought it would. My best strategy for Melbu gives me a 37, which isn't the fastest. Going off that time though, Crush Dance saves 7 minutes over Volcano. But Crush Dance does less damage, so certain battles are affected to a certain degree. For instance, Lenus needs 3 extra attacks to kill. Crush Dance takes 1 second longer than Volcano, so there's 60 seconds. There are around 8-10 additions that I don't even need and as I said before, Crush Dance takes 8 seconds total over defending. That's at least 64 seconds, on top of whatever time is wasted prolonging the battle over using Volcano... but this all just a thought-process, no doubt with it's flaws. Even if all that was 100% accurate, I'm pretty sure Crush Dance will save me a couple of minutes at the very least in the end.

2013-03-19 08:58:48 am

Quote:

Need help with GJ and Lloyd?

As I had mentioned to you previously, Grand Jewel still needed to be tested because we routed him without proper Attack Up strats. Llyod just sucks since he's an evade freak, and his HP total.

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-03-19 10:40:51 am

2013-03-19 10:38:41 am

I run for fun :)

I just looked through every single one of your posts in this thread, and not one of them says anything about the Grand Jewel and the Power Up... seriously guys? ...I'm just going to let this go. Anyways, yeah, even though these bosses are basically easy, they still aren't very fun.

2013-03-19 12:06:15 pm

Thought I mentioned it when you were PM'img me on Youtube. Guess not? Oops Sad

Sad

2013-03-19 12:11:32 pm

I run for fun :)

Pm'ing on me on Youtube... wow, I completely forgot about that (Lenophis). I see it now. My bad. I'm surprised YOU remembered that. lol

2013-03-19 12:35:45 pm

Yeah, about Crush Dance, it seems like the two best battles to raise it are Zackwell and whatever that caterpillar is called. They're already timesinks, and the damage dropoff isn't that bad, especially considering how much of that you'll make up again with Melbu (that was our theory anyway, never tested it).

Sadly, with full-time working kicking in again, I won't have the time to complete my segmented run. I'm still stuck on segment 2 from November. Wish I had the time to commit to this. Sad

Sad

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-03-19 05:13:47 pm

2013-03-19 04:36:33 pm

I run for fun :)

That's too bad, although I'd gladly trade you my free time for your full-time job Sad

Sad

Having time for work AND play can be the toughest job of all.

I've already done a good amount of hypothesizing about how many extra Crush Dances I'll need after my fastest battle times are worked out, so I'll leave it at that. Maybe I won't have to grind any at all, but I'm doubtful... only more testing will tell, of course.

P.S.: Guess I shouldn't be surprised that you remember your own P.M.s Tongue

Tongue

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-03-28 06:58:38 pm

The2012Robot: 2013-03-28 05:04:36 pm

2013-03-28 04:32:34 pm

I run for fun :)

I may be having some trouble with my slim PS2. (All of the below has to do with loading flawless TLoD discs)

It seems to make a lot of noise half of the time. It sounds like the laser goes back and forth at a relatively fast pace for like 5-10 seconds, then goes back to normal. It really only starts on loading screens and can sometimes continue into gameplay. I wouldn't be as worried if it wasn't so frequent (and I have a good amount of experience with the PS2).

This happens frequently when running on fast disc speed, but it also happens (albeit less often) on regular disc speed. Fast disc speed still loads faster than regular, but there is another thing that worries me- sometimes the game can take 3+ extra seconds to load. I haven't done enough testing to determine if my PS2 has problems randomly with each loading screen, or if it has to do with certain loading screens in particular. Or if the longer loading screens have to do with fast disc speed.

I know my PS2 doesn't have the best laser because of it's model (I did some research), but I'm wondering if that's actually the problem. Is the behavior I've described familiar to anyone else?

Edit: It just took forever loading up the first Hellena cutscene. It doesn't look like fast disc speed is even goin to be an option right now. Testing regular...

Regular disc speed has been absolutely fine so far (I'm just out of Bale). And my PS2 times seem close to my emulator times so far.

I may be having some trouble with my slim PS2. (All of the below has to do with loading flawless TLoD discs)

It seems to make a lot of noise half of the time. It sounds like the laser goes back and forth at a relatively fast pace for like 5-10 seconds, then goes back to normal. It really only starts on loading screens and can sometimes continue into gameplay. I wouldn't be as worried if it wasn't so frequent (and I have a good amount of experience with the PS2).

This happens frequently when running on fast disc speed, but it also happens (albeit less often) on regular disc speed. Fast disc speed still loads faster than regular, but there is another thing that worries me- sometimes the game can take 3+ extra seconds to load. I haven't done enough testing to determine if my PS2 has problems randomly with each loading screen, or if it has to do with certain loading screens in particular. Or if the longer loading screens have to do with fast disc speed.

I know my PS2 doesn't have the best laser because of it's model (I did some research), but I'm wondering if that's actually the problem. Is the behavior I've described familiar to anyone else?

Edit: It just took forever loading up the first Hellena cutscene. It doesn't look like fast disc speed is even goin to be an option right now. Testing regular...

Regular disc speed has been absolutely fine so far (I'm just out of Bale). And my PS2 times seem close to my emulator times so far.

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-04-11 01:38:57 am

The2012Robot: 2013-04-11 01:18:26 am

The2012Robot: 2013-04-03 01:12:30 am

The2012Robot: 2013-04-02 02:52:20 am

2013-04-02 02:20:32 am

I run for fun :)

4/11 12:18 AM PST: Streaming for at least half an hour now.

http://www.twitch.tv/the2012robot

2013-04-05 12:37:35 pm

Speed Runner

I Hope this game gets more Hype i plan to run it eventually depending on what my viewers vote for so far they wanna see FF10 FF9 and tactics before LoD xD

Edit history:

The2012Robot: 2013-04-05 02:21:07 pm

The2012Robot: 2013-04-05 02:21:02 pm

The2012Robot: 2013-04-05 02:19:51 pm

2013-04-05 02:17:16 pm

I run for fun :)

I'm not really "advertising" my stream anywhere but here and I don't get very many viewers. I would obviously like to see some more hype as well, but I'm no online marketer. If I were to do a real attempt on twitch right now, I doubt I would ever get above 10 viewers. And 10 viewers would actually be a major improvement in my audience count xD If you guys have any suggestions for spreading the word about a TLoD speed run, I'd love to hear it Smiley

Your viewers have good taste- I love all 3 of those FFs, and TLoD... well, it's kind of like using a controller on a book that you have to mash X to read through while occasionally using the analog stick to scroll through all the pages with pictures.

2013-04-05 03:37:42 pm

Speed Runner

yea hahahaha My only suggestion is, I have only been speedrunning and streaming for one month I have 300 followers and get on avg 10-20 a day now and my average viewer count is now in the 70s so I'd say jsut be consistent and offer something different than normal and you might get results I will admit I have been very fortunate in my early success

2013-04-06 12:40:40 am

I run for fun :)

Wow. Very cool. I wish I could stream consistently, but alas- my 25 GB data-cap keeps me from doing so. Maybe I could go tell some other forums about the run to get the word out.

2013-06-14 04:40:53 pm

Just wondering what the status is on the speedruns for LoD. I have been considering running this and want to see if there are still active runners to work on notes and stuff with.

2013-06-22 11:43:25 pm

I run for fun :)

I haven't worked on it in over a month now. Slowly got bored and more easily distracted having to mash 'X' for hours. There's a reason for there being no accepted run on this site. Tons of dialogue and cutscenes get pretty tiring after awhile. It takes an hour just to get to the first boss fight on disc 3 alone. Regardless of what anyone says, I am completely convinced that this game comes down more to luck than skill. Just look at Michael- he can commonly make all your previous good luck meaningless and there's no known way to control him. If you've read the rest of the thread, you also know that bosses can randomly double-turn you with whatever attack they feel like using. I'm not sure how this game's luck compares any other RPG, but it's bad enough for me to rethink ever putting real time in to attempt a great run.

Maybe I make it sound bad, but really it all just comes down to how much time you have and want to ~~waste~~ spend on it. I had fun routing it and knowing how to utterly destroy the game was good enough for me personally (the route is probably 98% done). Maybe that will be good enough for you or you'll actually go the distance. Who knows. Either way, I'm willing to help.

I haven't worked on it in over a month now. Slowly got bored and more easily distracted having to mash 'X' for hours. There's a reason for there being no accepted run on this site. Tons of dialogue and cutscenes get pretty tiring after awhile. It takes an hour just to get to the first boss fight on disc 3 alone. Regardless of what anyone says, I am completely convinced that this game comes down more to luck than skill. Just look at Michael- he can commonly make all your previous good luck meaningless and there's no known way to control him. If you've read the rest of the thread, you also know that bosses can randomly double-turn you with whatever attack they feel like using. I'm not sure how this game's luck compares any other RPG, but it's bad enough for me to rethink ever putting real time in to attempt a great run.

Maybe I make it sound bad, but really it all just comes down to how much time you have and want to [s]waste[/s] spend on it. I had fun routing it and knowing how to utterly destroy the game was good enough for me personally (the route is probably 98% done). Maybe that will be good enough for you or you'll actually go the distance. Who knows. Either way, I'm willing to help.

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