Lufia

2006-02-07 06:52:23 am

May the way of the Hero lead to the Triforce

I'm almost positive that Lufia:FoD is impossible without a lot of luck manipulation. Sweet Waters aren't very effective, and battles can take 10-20 seconds to run. Add the random target and battles will take forever. Then bear in mind that dungeons will take 10-15 minutes if you factor in the battles. (And there are a LOT of dungeons.) Boss battles will take 5-10 minutes. Sea travel will take forever.

I honestly think that the slow battles are what will kill a run. I don't even think that a replay mode run would be possible.

Of course, if someone still tries I'll be happy to see it. I'm getting the negativity out of the way now. Wink

Dragondarch

2006-02-07 12:59:19 pm

Pudding%

Quote:

I hadn't looked at your queue in a while. I had no idea that every game you've ever played would jump the list! At this rate, I'd be better off doing it myself. In 2010.

BTW, I definitely think you should do Ogre Battle, then Tactics Ogre, then FF Tactics. There's a nice progression that way. Unless your queue isn't ordered within colors and you were going to do that anyway.

And just to let you know, me or Gorash will probably get around to BoF: DQ before you and Josh will definitely get around to SO2 before you. I don't know what else but that is one helluva long list. Wink

Anything in purple (In the Queue) could be done whenever I feel like it...the list isn't linear for the most part. After doing BoF 2 I may move to Ogre Battle for a change of pace, or I may not.

BoF:DQ would probably be better off in one of you guy's hands anyway...that's the only one I haven't finished and it would take quite some time for me to get up to a "speed run" skill level. SO2 is just way down there...mostly in the case that no one else has done it by the time I get to it.

And yeah, I was thinking of doing Ogre Battle before the other 2 anyway, since I have the most definite plan for that one (just need to do a refresher playthrough is all).

For now, though, I'm actually playing a free MMO with a buddy...mostly while I re-download all the remixes I had before I had to reformat my system.
Damn startup problems prevented me from backing any of it up either. Cry

[quote]I hadn't looked at your queue in a while. I had no idea that every game you've ever played would jump the list! At this rate, I'd be better off doing it myself. In 2010.

BTW, I definitely think you should do Ogre Battle, then Tactics Ogre, then FF Tactics. There's a nice progression that way. Unless your queue isn't ordered within colors and you were going to do that anyway.

And just to let you know, me or Gorash will probably get around to BoF: DQ before you and Josh will definitely get around to SO2 before you. I don't know what else but that is one helluva long list. ;)[/quote]

Anything in purple (In the Queue) could be done whenever I feel like it...the list isn't linear for the most part. After doing BoF 2 I may move to Ogre Battle for a change of pace, or I may not.

BoF:DQ would probably be better off in one of you guy's hands anyway...that's the only one I haven't finished and it would take quite some time for me to get up to a "speed run" skill level. SO2 is just way down there...mostly in the case that no one else has done it by the time I get to it.

And yeah, I was thinking of doing Ogre Battle before the other 2 anyway, since I have the most definite plan for that one (just need to do a refresher playthrough is all).

For now, though, I'm actually playing a free MMO with a buddy...mostly while I re-download all the remixes I had before I had to reformat my system.
Damn startup problems prevented me from backing any of it up either.  :'(

DTaeKim

2006-02-07 02:43:48 pm

These are the bosses I remember were difficult, even at normal levels.

1) Apprentice
- I read that Mid Arrows takes care of this guy really quickly.

2) Water Ghost.
- Damn Water spell wrecks havoc on your HP.

3) Sinistrals at the end of the game
- Enhasa summed it up best; needs some leveling to survive. Good thing Guard Daos is SUCH a pansy.

LinkTheValiant

2006-02-07 04:55:59 pm

May the way of the Hero lead to the Triforce

The Apprentice is easy if you have a few mid- to high- damage items. A couple of Hi-Potions help as well.

The Dark Ghost will be very hard at low levels simply due to the lack of multi-target healing. I'm not sure how to get around this. . .

The Sinistrals are somewhat easy and somewhat not. Gades relies on physicals, so healing is your best bet here. I don't know of any way to make his battle easier at low levels.

Amon uses mostly spells, so Mirror is your friend. Of course, that's assuming that you have the levels for it. . .

Same thing goes for Daos.

I've never been able to figure out why everyone thinks of Guard Daos as a pansy, unless maybe I've just gotten unlucky. Jerin's Mirror doesn't last long enough for her to protect the others, so she's the only one who's unconfused. The others all kill each other. What am I missing here?

DTaeKim

2006-02-07 07:53:38 pm

Well, I always use Mirror on Aguro and Hero. I also unequip Jerin's weapon to ease the pain.

I thought there was an item that cured Confusion, but I suppose my memory was off.

Enhasa

2006-02-14 01:30:19 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

DTaeKim, could you please do Lufia 1? You know what I think by now. I really am serious about the money, and if you love the game anyway...

LinkTheValiant, I thought Sweet Water worked 100%. That would mean all the difficulty would come from the really hard bosses at least.

Gades is verifiably insane. About Mirror, that's what everyone used in a normal game, but I don't think you'd have the levels for it. About Guard Daos, confusion is bad, but like in most other games it's more annoying than deadly. I'm sure if you can beat Gades you can beat the rest. Well, all in a row...

Dragondarch, free MMO? Progress Quest!

Mr Nice Guy

2006-02-14 09:57:09 am

i think that only a Lufia 2,3 and 4 are possible to do within 7 hours.
The evil thing in Lufia 1 is that you walk so damn slow, luckly you can move fast in the sequels.

Sir VG

2006-02-14 11:18:28 am

Fucking Weeaboo

Lufia II was IMO the best of the Lufia games. And after YEARS of begging, pleading, baftering with my local rental store to sell their copy, they SOLD IT UNDER MY NOSE *BLEEP*ING BASTARDS! Luckily for me, I found a copy on eBay and not for $100+! Mint copies of this are more expensive than Chrono Trigger or Final Fantasy III!

BTW, everybody needs to check out the new 4-disc album out. Especially on Disc 4, the new remix track of Battle #3 from Lufia II. It's like...OMFG YES!!!!!!!!!!

Dragondarch

2006-02-14 01:27:51 pm

Pudding%

Quote:

Dragondarch, free MMO? Progress Quest!

Already got bored of it...after one week of playing. MMOs just don't have the effect on me that they once did Wink

Oh, and Lufia II is now in the queue...probably will be the next game I do after BoF2.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-14 02:44:29 pm

2006-02-14 02:43:54 pm

Well, I would be willing. I have a copy of the cartridge at home, I could find an emulator online that could help me practice and figure out the best routes, and I could gauge the bosses at the levels I am at. My only problem is the incredible inconsistency of my cartridge. I've had four games vanish on the cartridge, which would be VERY bad if I was doing a speed run.

Right now, I was planning on whoring Foul Water at the recovery spots, since it's easiest that way. The first one I can think of is the cave north of Treck.

Like I said, Apprentice will be the first obstacle, but I figure spamming Mid Arrows will do the trick.

Water Ghost is definitely the first problem I am going to encounter.

Sir VG

2006-02-14 02:59:29 pm

Fucking Weeaboo

Quote:

Already got bored of it...after one week of playing. MMOs just don't have the effect on me that they once did Wink

Oh, and Lufia II is now in the queue...probably will be the next game I do after BoF2.

Damn you. Now I don't want to compete being that by the time I got part way through my FFMQ run, you had kicked my ass. Bastard. Tongue

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-14 09:14:22 pm

2006-02-14 09:13:39 pm

I got the game on an emulator, and I decided to see exactly how difficult the game is to speed run.

Currently, I'm at Belgen ready to rescue Jerin. I didn't use many sweet waters, so I figured I may have lost some time there. If this is the current pace I'm going, it will be difficult to break 7 hours on this game, let alone 8.

Sinistrals - Thunder with Selan, Trick with Artea, and attack with Guy and Maxim. They don't last too long, anyway. Finished the introduction and gained control of Hero at 17 minutes.

Mini Demons boss battle - The battle with Aguro was more difficult than I anticipated, given my levels of 4 with Lufia and Hero. Next time around, I figure that using Arrows may speed up the battle, especially when throwing them with Lufia. I also had to retry about 5 times here, since their Dew beat the crap out of my characters.

Goblins - I leveled beforehand, from 4 to 8. The extra levels made this battle a lot easier.

Apprentice - Actually, he wasn't that bad. I had 9 Mid Arrows to use, and I left with 1. The Hi Potion I picked up certainly helped in this battle.

Phantasm - Holy crap did I underestimate this boss. Confusion, Sleep, an attack that deals 30 damage to Hero, and Spark that does 20+ damage to all members. I got lucky in order to survive. Picking up the Ghost Ring is almost necessary, since with it, Hero dealt 50 damage compared to Aguro's 20.

Enhasa, I am definitely interested to hear how you managed to beat the bosses at lower levels. I may need those strategies to help my time.

I got the game on an emulator, and I decided to see exactly how difficult the game is to speed run.

Currently, I'm at Belgen ready to rescue Jerin.  I didn't use many sweet waters, so I figured I may have lost some time there.  If this is the current pace I'm going, it will be difficult to break 7 hours on this game, let alone 8.

Sinistrals - Thunder with Selan, Trick with Artea, and attack with Guy and Maxim.  They don't last too long, anyway.  Finished the introduction and gained control of Hero at 17 minutes.

Mini Demons boss battle - The battle with Aguro was more difficult than I anticipated, given my levels of 4 with Lufia and Hero.  Next time around, I figure that using Arrows may speed up the battle, especially when throwing them with Lufia.  I also had to retry about 5 times here, since their Dew beat the crap out of my characters.

Goblins - I leveled beforehand, from 4 to 8.  The extra levels made this battle a lot easier.

Apprentice - Actually, he wasn't that bad.  I had 9 Mid Arrows to use, and I left with 1.  The Hi Potion I picked up certainly helped in this battle.

Phantasm - Holy crap did I underestimate this boss.  Confusion, Sleep, an attack that deals 30 damage to Hero, and Spark that does 20+ damage to all members.  I got lucky in order to survive.  Picking up the Ghost Ring is almost necessary, since with it, Hero dealt 50 damage compared to Aguro's 20.

Enhasa, I am definitely interested to hear how you managed to beat the bosses at lower levels.  I may need those strategies to help my time.

Enhasa

2006-02-14 11:30:22 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

i think that only a Lufia 2,3 and 4 are possible to do within 7 hours.
The evil thing in Lufia 1 is that you walk so damn slow, luckly you can move fast in the sequels.

I can't guarantee elegance, but 1 is definitely sub 7. You move fast in towns though FWIW.

Quote:

Lufia II was IMO the best of the Lufia games. And after YEARS of begging, pleading, baftering with my local rental store to sell their copy, they SOLD IT UNDER MY NOSE *BLEEP*ING BASTARDS! Luckily for me, I found a copy on eBay and not for $100+! Mint copies of this are more expensive than Chrono Trigger or Final Fantasy III!

BTW, everybody needs to check out the new 4-disc album out. Especially on Disc 4, the new remix track of Battle #3 from Lufia II. It's like...OMFG YES!!!!!!!!!!

I've seen two more copies casually in the last couple years. If you didn't need mint, I could have bought one for you and sent it to you maybe. If you think this is expensive, try something from Enix like Ogre Battle SNES or Valkyrie Profile.

I posted the link to the torrent for the album earlier in this thread, but I don't know if it's still seeded well. I do have the mp3 for the (RIP) Lufia 3 for PS1 demo still. I love that song, although it reminds me of the saddest vaporware ever!

Quote:

Already got bored of it...after one week of playing. MMOs just don't have the effect on me that they once did Wink

Oh, and Lufia II is now in the queue...probably will be the next game I do after BoF2.

In case you didn't know (I can't tell), Progress Quest is not a "real" MMO.

About Lufia 2: Smiley

You are my hero.

Quote:

My only problem is the incredible inconsistency of my cartridge. I've had four games vanish on the cartridge, which would be VERY bad if I was doing a speed run.

The battery is dying on you, and it can only get worse. Please save yourself some grief and get a newer cart somehow.

Quote:

Enhasa, I am definitely interested to hear how you managed to beat the bosses at lower levels. I may need those strategies to help my time.

ZSNES and a lot of luck, sorry.

In general, you should level as little as possible for each boss, or else you will get diminishing returns. There should never be a battle that is "much easier." Abuse Sweet Water and Arrows/Mid Arrows/etc.

Sorry I can't be of more help but if it was easy or if I already knew everything, I would just do it myself instead of paying someone. You gotta work for it! Wink

Like when you're done, you should say, "that is easily the best gaming achievement I have ever done!" If you love the game it makes all the work that much more enjoyable.

[quote]i think that only a Lufia 2,3 and 4 are possible to do within 7 hours.
The evil thing in Lufia 1 is that you walk so damn slow, luckly you can move fast in the sequels.[/quote]
I can't guarantee elegance, but 1 is definitely sub 7. You move fast in towns though FWIW.

[quote]Lufia II was IMO the best of the Lufia games.  And after YEARS of begging, pleading, baftering with my local rental store to sell their copy, they SOLD IT UNDER MY NOSE *BLEEP*ING BASTARDS!  Luckily for me, I found a copy on eBay and not for $100+!  Mint copies of this are more expensive than Chrono Trigger or Final Fantasy III!

BTW, everybody needs to check out the new 4-disc album out.  Especially on Disc 4, the new remix track of Battle #3 from Lufia II.  It's like...OMFG YES!!!!!!!!!![/quote]
I've seen two more copies casually in the last couple years. If you didn't need mint, I could have bought one for you and sent it to you maybe. If you think this is expensive, try something from Enix like Ogre Battle SNES or Valkyrie Profile.

I posted the link to the torrent for the album earlier in this thread, but I don't know if it's still seeded well. I do have [url=http://www.cs.clemson.edu/~kjuang/files/Est3Demo.mp3]the mp3[/url] for the (RIP) Lufia 3 for PS1 demo still. I love that song, although it reminds me of the saddest vaporware ever!

[quote]Already got bored of it...after one week of playing. MMOs just don't have the effect on me that they once did  ;)

Oh, and Lufia II is now in the queue...probably will be the next game I do after BoF2.[/quote]
In case you didn't know (I can't tell), [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progress_Quest]Progress Quest[/url] is not a "real" MMO.

About Lufia 2: :) You are my hero.

[quote]My only problem is the incredible inconsistency of my cartridge.  I've had four games vanish on the cartridge, which would be VERY bad if I was doing a speed run.[/quote]
The battery is dying on you, and it can only get worse. Please save yourself some grief and get a newer cart somehow.

[quote]Enhasa, I am definitely interested to hear how you managed to beat the bosses at lower levels.  I may need those strategies to help my time.[/quote]
ZSNES and a lot of luck, sorry.

In general, you should level as little as possible for each boss, or else you will get diminishing returns. There should never be a battle that is "much easier." Abuse Sweet Water and Arrows/Mid Arrows/etc.

Sorry I can't be of more help but if it was easy or if I already knew everything, I would just do it myself instead of paying someone. You gotta work for it! ;) Like when you're done, you should say, "that is easily the best gaming achievement I have ever done!" If you love the game it makes all the work that much more enjoyable.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-15 07:01:31 am

2006-02-15 03:04:16 am

Okay, I'm just going to put the minimum level I expect to have the easiest time with the boss without overleveling.

Mini Demons - Lvl. 4 to 5, but restarting is probably needed. Won't lose much time though.

Goblins - Lvl. 8, any lower and it's likely characters will fall in one or two hits.

Apprentice - Lvl. 10 and at least 1 Hi Potion.

Phantasm - Lvl. 11 wasn't bad, given favorable attacks by the boss.

Follower - Lvl. 12 was a nightmare. Lvl. 13, maybe 14 is needed here.

Right now, I'm at Ruan, ready to ascend the Red Tower and see how bad the Water Ghost will kick my ass at Level 15 for everyone but Jerin. Current time is 2:57.

Enhasa

2006-02-15 07:35:35 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Just wanted to add, make sure you know all the triggers exactly. Another thing is, a lot of your time is spent fighting regular enemies for XP? Can you buy stuff like Arrows to speed this up?

A final thing is, I wonder if there are still any forums online where you can find knowledgable Lufia people. This is a tough task and it'd be nice to have some more help. I tried gamefaqs and the board is pretty dead by now. I did find this out, but I don't know if it'd be helpful to you.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-16 12:29:41 am

2006-02-15 08:25:49 pm

Statistically, the Might Helmet is an incredible boon. It would be beneficial to equip it on Jerin, since it greatly increases defense and intelligence. I will have to see how much time it will take to do so.

As for triggers, these are the ones I've stumbled upon.

I'm unsure whether or not you actually need to talk to someone in order to travel to Sheran. I usually end up talking to the Princess to pick up 100 gold for a Dagger in the shop.

In Sheran, you need to talk to the first downed townsperson before triggering the next event.

In the cave to Sheran, you have to talk Danil the NPC.

Before leaving Alekia the second time, you have to talk to Lufia.

In Treck, you have to talk to the old man who sits near the dock.

I'm unsure what triggers the ship's apperance in the western island. I'm accustomed to talking to the captain in the lodge to do so, so it may be the case.

In Lorbenia, you have to enter the shop, head to the top floor, and talk to the lady near the second portion to trigger the stealing event. Then talk to the innkeeper.

In Grenoble, you have to talk to the old man in the Old Cave lobby.

In Kirof, you have to enter the item shop and listen to the young couple.

In Medan, you have to get near the castle. Once inside, you must listen to the princess ranting about the Hope Ruby. Then leave to trigger the second part of the Hope Ruby.

Back in Kirof, you have to enter in order to get the kid to join your team.

In Belgen, you have to talk to the lady in the back in the cave to open the route to the Dais Key.

In Dais, trigger the scene where they talk about Jerin, then attempt to leave.

Get Jerin in the Forest Station.

In Jenoba, you have to talk to the old lady at the bottom of the cider shop.

In Ruan, you have to talk to the jeweler about rubies and sapphires so you can get the Hope Ruby from the Medan mines. I'm not sure if you have to get the scene about the broken red sapphire to do so.

I am also wondering whether or not to get the Dragon Eggs.

The Might Shield is more than 2x the defensive value of the best shield anyone can equip.

The Might Bow is useless since I won't have Jerin attack anyway. On that note, Lufia hasn't earned a new weapon since I gave her the Dagger.

Raising everyone 2 levels may be more beneficial, especially in a speed run.

EDIT: Holy crap! I just beat the Water Ghost at Level 16! I used a total of 15 Big Arrows and 1 Flash from Lufia. She bit the dust. After every 2 Water Spells, I used a High Potion. Right now, I'm at Odel with 3:40 elapsed.

Statistically, the Might Helmet is an incredible boon.  It would be beneficial to equip it on Jerin, since it greatly increases defense and intelligence.  I will have to see how much time it will take to do so.

As for triggers, these are the ones I've stumbled upon.

I'm unsure whether or not you actually need to talk to someone in order to travel to Sheran.  I usually end up talking to the Princess to pick up 100 gold for a Dagger in the shop.

In Sheran, you need to talk to the first downed townsperson before triggering the next event.

In the cave to Sheran, you have to talk Danil the NPC.

Before leaving Alekia the second time, you have to talk to Lufia.

In Treck, you have to talk to the old man who sits near the dock.

I'm unsure what triggers the ship's apperance in the western island.  I'm accustomed to talking to the captain in the lodge to do so, so it may be the case.

In Lorbenia, you have to enter the shop, head to the top floor, and talk to the lady near the second portion to trigger the stealing event.  Then talk to the innkeeper.

In Grenoble, you have to talk to the old man in the Old Cave lobby.

In Kirof, you have to enter the item shop and listen to the young couple.

In Medan, you have to get near the castle.  Once inside, you must listen to the princess ranting about the Hope Ruby.  Then leave to trigger the second part of the Hope Ruby.

Back in Kirof, you have to enter in order to get the kid to join your team.

In Belgen, you have to talk to the lady in the back in the cave to open the route to the Dais Key.

In Dais, trigger the scene where they talk about Jerin, then attempt to leave.

Get Jerin in the Forest Station.

In Jenoba, you have to talk to the old lady at the bottom of the cider shop.

In Ruan, you have to talk to the jeweler about rubies and sapphires so you can get the Hope Ruby from the Medan mines.  I'm not sure if you have to get the scene about the broken red sapphire to do so.

I am also wondering whether or not to get the Dragon Eggs.

The Might Shield is more than 2x the defensive value of the best shield anyone can equip.

The Might Bow is useless since I won't have Jerin attack anyway.  On that note, Lufia hasn't earned a new weapon since I gave her the Dagger.

Raising everyone 2 levels may be more beneficial, especially in a speed run.

EDIT: Holy crap!  I just beat the Water Ghost at Level 16!  I used a total of 15 Big Arrows and 1 Flash from Lufia.  She bit the dust.  After every 2 Water Spells, I used a High Potion.  Right now, I'm at Odel with 3:40 elapsed.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-17 03:00:53 am

2006-02-16 11:29:38 pm

Sorry for the double post, but it's easier to divide things this way.

Right now, I'm at Linze with nearly 5 hour elapsed.

I thought the Guardian was going to be a difficult boss, since his spells deal 70+ damage to all characters.

Lufia and Jerin alone took him out. Lufia was the main damage dealer, casting Bolt every turn. Jerin healed her and Lufia every chance she got, and tossed some Mind Gourds when necessary.

EDIT: I'm at Herat, ready to get the last Alumina, but I have a problem. Right now, I have 5 hours 53 minutes elapsed. I have to still get the last Alumina, get Dual Blade, get the Power Oil, get the Glasdar Key, and then fight the final boss.

My biggest concern currently are my levels. I'm at an average of 27, which is about 5 to 6 levels lower than the walkthrough I'm using. While I can still destroy enemies in 2 hits, the damage dealt to me is incredible. I am often forced to heal after every battle I'm in, making the trek a dangerous war of attrition. Defense is what is keeping me alive, so I used a sequence break and bought the best equipment at Frederia, at the cost of my funds.

Needless to say, unless there are some PRIME leveling spots, I don't see this going under 7 hours...

Sorry for the double post, but it's easier to divide things this way.

Right now, I'm at Linze with nearly 5 hour elapsed.

I thought the Guardian was going to be a difficult boss, since his spells deal 70+ damage to all characters.

Lufia and Jerin alone took him out.  Lufia was the main damage dealer, casting Bolt every turn.  Jerin healed her and Lufia every chance she got, and tossed some Mind Gourds when necessary.

EDIT: I'm at Herat, ready to get the last Alumina, but I have a problem.  Right now, I have 5 hours 53 minutes elapsed.  I have to still get the last Alumina, get Dual Blade, get the Power Oil, get the Glasdar Key, and then fight the final boss.

My biggest concern currently are my levels.  I'm at an average of 27, which is about 5 to 6 levels lower than the walkthrough I'm using.  While I can still destroy enemies in 2 hits, the damage dealt to me is incredible.  I am often forced to heal after every battle I'm in, making the trek a dangerous war of attrition.  Defense is what is keeping me alive, so I used a sequence break and bought the best equipment at Frederia, at the cost of my funds.

Needless to say, unless there are some PRIME leveling spots, I don't see this going under 7 hours...

Enhasa

2006-02-17 10:20:02 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Sorry if all of this is obvious to you, but I need to make sure for completeness.

Why are your treks so dangerous? Are you fighting every enemy you see? You ought to be burning through Sweet Waters like crazy. (I know earlier you said you might have lost time from not using them enough.) When you don't want to fight, use Smoke Balls. Then when you want to level, use Foul Water. And while you are fighting regular enemies, feel free to attack them like they are bosses (using Arrows and Bombs and so forth).

Items are really good in this game. Make sure you are also getting full effect out of Swing Wings, Escapes, Magic Guards, Power and Mind Gourds, and all the stuff like Floats that I'm sure you're using already. Later on, the stuff like Arrows and Bombs are located in the weapon shops.

Buffs are really good in this game too, and you can even use them multiple times with diminishing returns. Drain/Dread is extremely useful, and others are Courage for DFP, Fake for AGL, and Trick of course.

You can warp around like a madman too. Make sure you optimize the use of Escape and Warp, using them whenever you can. Also, it may be faster depending on the situation to step into a town so that you can just Warp to it later.

Let me know what you think.

Sorry if all of this is obvious to you, but I need to make sure for completeness.

Why are your treks so dangerous? Are you fighting every enemy you see? You ought to be burning through Sweet Waters like crazy. (I know earlier you said you might have lost time from not using them enough.) When you don't want to fight, use Smoke Balls. Then when you want to level, use Foul Water. And while you are fighting regular enemies, feel free to attack them like they are bosses (using Arrows and Bombs and so forth).

Items are really good in this game. Make sure you are also getting full effect out of Swing Wings, Escapes, Magic Guards, Power and Mind Gourds, and all the stuff like Floats that I'm sure you're using already. Later on, the stuff like Arrows and Bombs are located in the weapon shops.

Buffs are really good in this game too, and you can even use them multiple times with diminishing returns. Drain/Dread is extremely useful, and others are Courage for DFP, Fake for AGL, and Trick of course.

You can warp around like a madman too. Make sure you optimize the use of Escape and Warp, using them whenever you can. Also, it may be faster depending on the situation to step into a town so that you can just Warp to it later.

Let me know what you think.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-18 12:08:34 am

2006-02-18 12:07:08 am

I finished the game. All bosses after the Guardian are time-consuming, but bearable thanks to Jerin's Mirror. It's strange, because after I complained about the difficulty of the battles, I coasted the rest of the way. Go figure.

Quote:

Sorry if all of this is obvious to you, but I need to make sure for completeness.

It's all right. I would like as much help as I can, because after finishing this game, I remember why I loved this game. <3 the story.

Quote:

Why are your treks so dangerous? Are you fighting every enemy you see? You ought to be burning through Sweet Waters like crazy. (I know earlier you said you might have lost time from not using them enough.) When you don't want to fight, use Smoke Balls. Then when you want to level, use Foul Water. And while you are fighting regular enemies, feel free to attack them like they are bosses (using Arrows and Bombs and so forth).

They're dangerous simply because they hit hard. I hit just as hard. Sweet Waters, unfortunately, don't negate battles entirely; they just reduce the number. I fight the battles I want to fight. I use Smoke Balls against monsters I don't want to fight, such as Weretoads (Flood = death) and most of the final dungeons enemies. As for Arrows and Bombs, they help, but I stop purchasing them after I reach beyond Level 30.

Quote:

Items are really good in this game. Make sure you are also getting full effect out of Swing Wings, Escapes, Magic Guards, Power and Mind Gourds, and all the stuff like Floats that I'm sure you're using already. Later on, the stuff like Arrows and Bombs are located in the weapon shops.

Next time around, I will have to purchase more Mind and Power Gourds. Swing Wings and Escapes are unnecessary thanks to Jerin's Warp and Escape spells.

Quote:

Buffs are really good in this game too, and you can even use them multiple times with diminishing returns. Drain/Dread is extremely useful, and others are Courage for DFP, Fake for AGL, and Trick of course.

Unfortunately, Drain is the only spell I get to use frequently. The rest of the time, I have Lufia cast Flash/Bolt as much as possible (biggest damage-dealer until Hero and Aguro gets the Grand Blade). Jerin acts as utility healer. Hero manages to get the Fake spell; perhaps I should cast it next time around. Courage, Lufia's spell, is almost completely wasted since the damage it decreases does little good. Jerin doesn't even get Trick at my levels; only Hero gets it, and he's far better off attacking in the long run.

Quote:

You can warp around like a madman too. Make sure you optimize the use of Escape and Warp, using them whenever you can. Also, it may be faster depending on the situation to step into a town so that you can just Warp to it later.

That is what I did as soon as I got the ship. Decent experience and money, and quicker movement later on.

Quote:

Let me know what you think.

I appreciate the help.

As for the final set of bosses, here were my notes.

Jerin should reach Level 32 before these battles. It isn't necessary though. At the very least, Lufia and Jerin should be at least Level 28, so they can learn Boost.

Pirates - Take out Bosun ASAP. The longer he lasts, the more buff spells Pirates gets. Pirates can only hit one person at a time, and later begins casting Flood, which can be reflected.

Oil Dragon - Mirror may be cast, but two Boost spells can do as much healing. Hero and Aguro slash away. Power Gourd when there's free time, and have Lufia cast Bolt.

Nazeby - Weird boss. He begins casting weak spells, then escalates. Mirror stops most of his spells though. His Bounce spell is incredibly irritating though. Again, you just swipe away at his HP.

Gades - Hardest Sinistral. He can only attack and use Destroy. Attack deals 150+ damage to a single person, and Destroy takes at least 250+ HP from a person and kills Jerin outright. I need some more EX Potions next time around, as well as Power Gourds.

Amon - He KILLED himself with his spells reflected from Mirror. He doesn't attack as well (or at least from what I've noticed), and only casts spells. The only time someone took damage was when Mirror wore out and Jerin got outcasted by Amon.

Daos - Same as Amon.

Guard Daos - I should've left Lufia dead. Keeping Mirror on four people is difficult to maintain, and Lufia can only contribute about 100 damage when she's alive. Again, Hero and Aguro slash away and Jerin functions as Mirror caster and utility healer. Need some Power Gourds for this battle to speed things up.

Time at final save point: 8:07
Time after credits: 8:37

I finished the game.  All bosses after the Guardian are time-consuming, but bearable thanks to Jerin's Mirror.  It's strange, because after I complained about the difficulty of the battles, I coasted the rest of the way.  Go figure.

[quote]Sorry if all of this is obvious to you, but I need to make sure for completeness.[/quote]

It's all right.  I would like as much help as I can, because after finishing this game, I remember why I loved this game.  <3 the story.

[quote]Why are your treks so dangerous? Are you fighting every enemy you see? You ought to be burning through Sweet Waters like crazy. (I know earlier you said you might have lost time from not using them enough.) When you don't want to fight, use Smoke Balls. Then when you want to level, use Foul Water. And while you are fighting regular enemies, feel free to attack them like they are bosses (using Arrows and Bombs and so forth).[/quote]

They're dangerous simply because they hit hard.  I hit just as hard.  Sweet Waters, unfortunately, don't negate battles entirely; they just reduce the number.  I fight the battles I want to fight.  I use Smoke Balls against monsters I don't want to fight, such as Weretoads (Flood = death) and most of the final dungeons enemies.  As for Arrows and Bombs, they help, but I stop purchasing them after I reach beyond Level 30.

[quote]Items are really good in this game. Make sure you are also getting full effect out of Swing Wings, Escapes, Magic Guards, Power and Mind Gourds, and all the stuff like Floats that I'm sure you're using already. Later on, the stuff like Arrows and Bombs are located in the weapon shops.[/quote]

Next time around, I will have to purchase more Mind and Power Gourds.  Swing Wings and Escapes are unnecessary thanks to Jerin's Warp and Escape spells.

[quote]Buffs are really good in this game too, and you can even use them multiple times with diminishing returns. Drain/Dread is extremely useful, and others are Courage for DFP, Fake for AGL, and Trick of course.[/quote]

Unfortunately, Drain is the only spell I get to use frequently.  The rest of the time, I have Lufia cast Flash/Bolt as much as possible (biggest damage-dealer until Hero and Aguro gets the Grand Blade).  Jerin acts as utility healer.  Hero manages to get the Fake spell; perhaps I should cast it next time around.  Courage, Lufia's spell, is almost completely wasted since the damage it decreases does little good.  Jerin doesn't even get Trick at my levels; only Hero gets it, and he's far better off attacking in the long run.

[quote]You can warp around like a madman too. Make sure you optimize the use of Escape and Warp, using them whenever you can. Also, it may be faster depending on the situation to step into a town so that you can just Warp to it later.[/quote]

That is what I did as soon as I got the ship.  Decent experience and money, and quicker movement later on.

[quote]Let me know what you think.[/quote]

I appreciate the help.

As for the final set of bosses, here were my notes.

Jerin should reach Level 32 before these battles.  It isn't necessary though.  At the very least, Lufia and Jerin should be at least Level 28, so they can learn Boost.

Pirates - Take out Bosun ASAP.  The longer he lasts, the more buff spells Pirates gets.  Pirates can only hit one person at a time, and later begins casting Flood, which can be reflected.

Oil Dragon - Mirror may be cast, but two Boost spells can do as much healing.  Hero and Aguro slash away.  Power Gourd when there's free time, and have Lufia cast Bolt.

Nazeby - Weird boss.  He begins casting weak spells, then escalates.  Mirror stops most of his spells though.  His Bounce spell is incredibly irritating though.  Again, you just swipe away at his HP.

Gades - Hardest Sinistral.  He can only attack and use Destroy.  Attack deals 150+ damage to a single person, and Destroy takes at least 250+ HP from a person and kills Jerin outright.  I need some more EX Potions next time around, as well as Power Gourds.

Amon - He KILLED himself with his spells reflected from Mirror.  He doesn't attack as well (or at least from what I've noticed), and only casts spells.  The only time someone took damage was when Mirror wore out and Jerin got outcasted by Amon.

Daos - Same as Amon.

Guard Daos - I should've left Lufia dead.  Keeping Mirror on four people is difficult to maintain, and Lufia can only contribute about 100 damage when she's alive.  Again, Hero and Aguro slash away and Jerin functions as Mirror caster and utility healer.  Need some Power Gourds for this battle to speed things up.

Time at final save point: 8:07
Time after credits: 8:37

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-18 07:13:23 pm

2006-02-18 12:10:39 am

As for the level building spots, I pinpointed these spots for level building.

1) Before Goblins mini-boss. Foul Water here. This helps me coast through the next continent, at least before Phantasm shows up and whoops my ass.
2) Before Water Ghost. Probably outside Ruan.
3) Before Pirates, probably inside a cave. There is an inn inside one of the caves; I plan to make liberal use of that.

As for the Dragon Shrine, I ended up taking the 2 levels. It proved to be the difference. Jerin learned Mirror, making EVERY boss battle easier to take on with my levels.

Enhasa

2006-02-18 10:38:22 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

I finished the game. All bosses after the Guardian are time-consuming, but bearable thanks to Jerin's Mirror. It's strange, because after I complained about the difficulty of the battles, I coasted the rest of the way. Go figure.

In general, unless there is something like Cores or harvesting that gives inappropriately high XP, you shouldn't really ever be coasting, because coasting implies being overleveled at points. In other runs like FF2 or CT, leveling is done in spurts because it is possible to progress without leveling (and then the spurt is just to catch back up to minimal levels). Since this isn't possible in Lufia, it would be faster to do more instances of less leveling (to get up to minimum for each boss) than it would be to level in large chunks. Speaking of harvesting, are you leveling using harvesters, or is that not any more effective? I also want to repeat that you should be treating regular enemy fights as you would bosses, using Arrows and Bombs and magic when appropriate.

Quote:

It's all right. I would like as much help as I can, because after finishing this game, I remember why I loved this game. <3 the story.

Of course. It's not like this game was very revolutionary in terms of gameplay. In fact, there are only 5 video game stories that I can say I really liked: Valkyrie Profile, Tales of Phantasia, Ico, and Lufia 1-2.

Quote:

As for Arrows and Bombs, they help, but I stop purchasing them after I reach beyond Level 30.

Level 30 is quite a ways in the game though. That's when Ex Arrows and Ex Bombs become obsolete?

Quote:

Next time around, I will have to purchase more Mind and Power Gourds. Swing Wings and Escapes are unnecessary thanks to Jerin's Warp and Escape spells.

Well obviously, but you don't have Jerin from the beginning.

Quote:

Unfortunately, Drain is the only spell I get to use frequently. The rest of the time, I have Lufia cast Flash/Bolt as much as possible (biggest damage-dealer until Hero and Aguro gets the Grand Blade). Jerin acts as utility healer. Hero manages to get the Fake spell; perhaps I should cast it next time around. Courage, Lufia's spell, is almost completely wasted since the damage it decreases does little good. Jerin doesn't even get Trick at my levels; only Hero gets it, and he's far better off attacking in the long run.

Drain is definitely the most useful since you get it the earliest. Fake is either useful or not for any particular fight. Usually not, but you have to see. So Courage is pointless for increasing DEF. What about Magic Guards for MGR? Trick is indeed too late to be useful.

Quote:

Jerin should reach Level 32 before these battles. It isn't necessary though. At the very least, Lufia and Jerin should be at least Level 28, so they can learn Boost.

If you can do it at say 28, that's a lot of time saved in leveling.

I also find that Lufia is mostly deadweight against Guard Daos. I remember as a kid I thought she should have come back all buff or something, but now I realize it's much more touching this way.

Do you have a time for final hit? Because that's how SDA times.

I forgot to say earlier: if you are getting the Dragon Eggs (and I think I would), I agree with the 2 levels.

Now for some quick questions and points.

1) Do you get stuff like the Flash Ring, Water Ring, etc?
2) How many Miracles do you end with/pick up? I don't need to tell you how good Miracles are.
3) I forget the name, but there's a dungeon that powers up every five levels. Is that ever worth doing past the first time?
4) I expected that you wouldn't be high enough level to have Mirror by the end actually. I know for a fact that when I played through the game once on the SNES, I completed it without too much difficulty without Mirror. I'm just saying, you said you were coasting at the end, and that sounds like too much XP to me, because the end is insane.
5) On that gamefaqs thread, somebody said something like "everyone already knows the Might Helm." Well, I think it would be a good idea to ask him or anybody else if there are more things like that. Or at least, for any suggestions for a speedrun.

[quote]I finished the game.  All bosses after the Guardian are time-consuming, but bearable thanks to Jerin's Mirror.  It's strange, because after I complained about the difficulty of the battles, I coasted the rest of the way.  Go figure.[/quote]
In general, unless there is something like Cores or harvesting that gives inappropriately high XP, you shouldn't really ever be coasting, because coasting implies being overleveled at points. In other runs like FF2 or CT, leveling is done in spurts because it is possible to progress without leveling (and then the spurt is just to catch back up to minimal levels). Since this isn't possible in Lufia, it would be faster to do more instances of less leveling (to get up to minimum for each boss) than it would be to level in large chunks. Speaking of harvesting, are you leveling using harvesters, or is that not any more effective? I also want to repeat that you should be treating regular enemy fights as you would bosses, using Arrows and Bombs and magic when appropriate.

[quote]It's all right.  I would like as much help as I can, because after finishing this game, I remember why I loved this game.  <3 the story.[/quote]
Of course. It's not like this game was very revolutionary in terms of gameplay. In fact, there are only 5 video game stories that I can say I [i]really[/i] liked: Valkyrie Profile, Tales of Phantasia, Ico, and Lufia 1-2.

[quote]As for Arrows and Bombs, they help, but I stop purchasing them after I reach beyond Level 30.[/quote]
Level 30 is quite a ways in the game though. That's when Ex Arrows and Ex Bombs become obsolete?

[quote]Next time around, I will have to purchase more Mind and Power Gourds.  Swing Wings and Escapes are unnecessary thanks to Jerin's Warp and Escape spells.[/quote]
Well obviously, but you don't have Jerin from the beginning.

[quote]Unfortunately, Drain is the only spell I get to use frequently.  The rest of the time, I have Lufia cast Flash/Bolt as much as possible (biggest damage-dealer until Hero and Aguro gets the Grand Blade).  Jerin acts as utility healer.  Hero manages to get the Fake spell; perhaps I should cast it next time around.  Courage, Lufia's spell, is almost completely wasted since the damage it decreases does little good.  Jerin doesn't even get Trick at my levels; only Hero gets it, and he's far better off attacking in the long run.[/quote]
Drain is definitely the most useful since you get it the earliest. Fake is either useful or not for any particular fight. Usually not, but you have to see. So Courage is pointless for increasing DEF. What about Magic Guards for MGR? Trick is indeed too late to be useful.

[quote]Jerin should reach Level 32 before these battles.  It isn't necessary though.  At the very least, Lufia and Jerin should be at least Level 28, so they can learn Boost.[/quote]
If you can do it at say 28, that's a lot of time saved in leveling.

I also find that Lufia is mostly deadweight against Guard Daos. I remember as a kid I thought she should have come back all buff or something, but now I realize it's much more touching this way.

Do you have a time for final hit? Because that's how SDA times.

I forgot to say earlier: if you are getting the Dragon Eggs (and I think I would), I agree with the 2 levels.

Now for some quick questions and points.

1) Do you get stuff like the Flash Ring, Water Ring, etc?
2) How many Miracles do you end with/pick up? I don't need to tell you how good Miracles are.
3) I forget the name, but there's a dungeon that powers up every five levels. Is that ever worth doing past the first time?
4) I expected that you wouldn't be high enough level to have Mirror by the end actually. I know for a fact that when I played through the game once on the SNES, I completed it without too much difficulty without Mirror. I'm just saying, you said you were coasting at the end, and that sounds like too much XP to me, because the end is insane.
5) On that gamefaqs thread, somebody said something like "everyone already knows the Might Helm." Well, I think it would be a good idea to ask him or anybody else if there are more things like that. Or at least, for any suggestions for a speedrun.

Mr_Nice_Guy

2006-02-18 11:54:22 pm

Battle Is My Forte

Quote:

3) I forget the name, but there's a dungeon that powers up every five levels. Is that ever worth doing past the first time?

Do you mean the cave? Forgot name, but its kinda like the ancient cave. The higher your level, the further you can in.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-19 01:09:24 am

2006-02-19 01:09:04 am

Quote:

In general, unless there is something like Cores or harvesting that gives inappropriately high XP, you shouldn't really ever be coasting, because coasting implies being overleveled at points. In other runs like FF2 or CT, leveling is done in spurts because it is possible to progress without leveling (and then the spurt is just to catch back up to minimal levels). Since this isn't possible in Lufia, it would be faster to do more instances of less leveling (to get up to minimum for each boss) than it would be to level in large chunks. Speaking of harvesting, are you leveling using harvesters, or is that not any more effective? I also want to repeat that you should be treating regular enemy fights as you would bosses, using Arrows and Bombs and magic when appropriate.

The bosses in this game are frustratingly random. While it is possible to skirt by on lower levels, the amount of resets would be incredible, since there is no convinient save point nearby said boss. Every single boss in the game requires a dungeon to navigate, and to be honest, I rather not go through the dungeon recollecting everything I lost. As for the Red Core, Green Core, Mimic, and Mimicker, I was only able to kill one of each, except for the Green Core. Those monsters give enough experience to give a level up instantly for at least one character or so. I could save tremendous amounts of time by abusing these monsters, the likelihood of doing so is low, since it requires a minimum of 5 hits of favorable damage followed by the fact that they must remain for that long. More often that not, they run, wasting the effort.

Quote:

Level 30 is quite a ways in the game though. That's when Ex Arrows and Ex Bombs become obsolete?

The problem with these items is their damage becomes rather obsolete thanks to the spells I am casting and attack power of Hero and Aguro. It got to the point where two attacks destroyed any monster, regardless. I hit Level 30 around the first time I entered Marse, after I got 1 Alumina piece.

Quote:

Well obviously, but you don't have Jerin from the beginning.

True. There are only two places though you would use an Escape; the Old Cave and the Cave Southwest of Belgen. The rest of the time, the game is kind enough to take you out of the dungeon. After those two dungeons, Jerin is available.

Quote:

Drain is definitely the most useful since you get it the earliest. Fake is either useful or not for any particular fight. Usually not, but you have to see. So Courage is pointless for increasing DEF. What about Magic Guards for MGR? Trick is indeed too late to be useful.

After the 1st run through, I have to say that AGL is the most important stat in the game. The more turns you get before the enemy, you can kill them faster, reducing their damage. Unfortunately, Fake comes too late to make of much use, though I imagine it can speed up the last few boss battles. As for Magic Guards, I didn't see much of an impact to warrant their use.

Quote:

If you can do it at say 28, that's a lot of time saved in leveling.

As in finish the game at 28? Possible, but highly unlikely. With that, it would mean that I run through the final four bosses with one source of healing: Boost, since Lufia is gone. It doesn't heal enough after a spell at that point; they deal 120+ damage to all allies. I think 32 is the lowest managable, since Mirror is an absolute must in finish the game with the least headache as possible. In addition, most of the final few bosses utilize spells as their main damage dealer. Mirror = reflected spells and less pain for me in general.

Quote:

Do you have a time for final hit? Because that's how SDA times.

I could tell you after I run the final portion again. Unfortunately, I think the exact definition states that the player has to lose control. I control the dialogue for half the epilogue, then the credits begin.

Quote:

I forgot to say earlier: if you are getting the Dragon Eggs (and I think I would), I agree with the 2 levels.

After thinking about it, I would stick with the 2 levels. Might Shield doesn't do enough to help Hero and Aguro. Might Bow is useless; Artea's Bow is more than enough to finish the game (and in fact, I never bought a single weapon for the girls).

I'll address the questions in the next post.

[quote]
In general, unless there is something like Cores or harvesting that gives inappropriately high XP, you shouldn't really ever be coasting, because coasting implies being overleveled at points. In other runs like FF2 or CT, leveling is done in spurts because it is possible to progress without leveling (and then the spurt is just to catch back up to minimal levels). Since this isn't possible in Lufia, it would be faster to do more instances of less leveling (to get up to minimum for each boss) than it would be to level in large chunks. Speaking of harvesting, are you leveling using harvesters, or is that not any more effective? I also want to repeat that you should be treating regular enemy fights as you would bosses, using Arrows and Bombs and magic when appropriate.[/quote]

The bosses in this game are frustratingly random.  While it is possible to skirt by on lower levels, the amount of resets would be incredible, since there is no convinient save point nearby said boss.  Every single boss in the game requires a dungeon to navigate, and to be honest, I rather not go through the dungeon recollecting everything I lost.  As for the Red Core, Green Core, Mimic, and Mimicker, I was only able to kill one of each, except for the Green Core.  Those monsters give enough experience to give a level up instantly for at least one character or so.  I could save tremendous amounts of time by abusing these monsters, the likelihood of doing so is low, since it requires a minimum of 5 hits of favorable damage followed by the fact that they must remain for that long.  More often that not, they run, wasting the effort.

[quote]Level 30 is quite a ways in the game though. That's when Ex Arrows and Ex Bombs become obsolete?[/quote]

The problem with these items is their damage becomes rather obsolete thanks to the spells I am casting and attack power of Hero and Aguro.  It got to the point where two attacks destroyed any monster, regardless.  I hit Level 30 around the first time I entered Marse, after I got 1 Alumina piece.

[quote]Well obviously, but you don't have Jerin from the beginning.[/quote]

True.  There are only two places though you would use an Escape; the Old Cave and the Cave Southwest of Belgen.  The rest of the time, the game is kind enough to take you out of the dungeon.  After those two dungeons, Jerin is available.

[quote]Drain is definitely the most useful since you get it the earliest. Fake is either useful or not for any particular fight. Usually not, but you have to see. So Courage is pointless for increasing DEF. What about Magic Guards for MGR? Trick is indeed too late to be useful.[/quote]

After the 1st run through, I have to say that AGL is the most important stat in the game.  The more turns you get before the enemy, you can kill them faster, reducing their damage.  Unfortunately, Fake comes too late to make of much use, though I imagine it can speed up the last few boss battles.  As for Magic Guards, I didn't see much of an impact to warrant their use.

[quote]If you can do it at say 28, that's a lot of time saved in leveling.[/quote]

As in finish the game at 28?  Possible, but highly unlikely.  With that, it would mean that I run through the final four bosses with one source of healing: Boost, since Lufia is gone.  It doesn't heal enough after a spell at that point; they deal 120+ damage to all allies.  I think 32 is the lowest managable, since Mirror is an absolute must in finish the game with the least headache as possible.  In addition, most of the final few bosses utilize spells as their main damage dealer.  Mirror = reflected spells and less pain for me in general.

[quote]Do you have a time for final hit? Because that's how SDA times.[/quote]

I could tell you after I run the final portion again.  Unfortunately, I think the exact definition states that the player has to lose control.  I control the dialogue for half the epilogue, then the credits begin.

[quote]I forgot to say earlier: if you are getting the Dragon Eggs (and I think I would), I agree with the 2 levels.[/quote]

After thinking about it, I would stick with the 2 levels.  Might Shield doesn't do enough to help Hero and Aguro.  Might Bow is useless; Artea's Bow is more than enough to finish the game (and in fact, I never bought a single weapon for the girls).

I'll address the questions in the next post.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-19 07:37:09 am

2006-02-19 01:22:42 am

Quote:

Now for some quick questions and points.
1) Do you get stuff like the Flash Ring, Water Ring, etc?

Flash Ring is the MOST important accessory in the game. With it, Lufia's Flash is equal to Aguro or Hero's normal attack for most of the game. Bolt ends up being a real damage dealer, until Hero and Aguro get their final few weapons. I pick up the Ghost Ring for Phantasm and Water Ghost. The other rings, such as the Red, Purple, etc. I pick up for their stat boosts, and sell the rest for badly needed cash.

Quote:

2) How many Miracles do you end with/pick up? I don't need to tell you how good Miracles are.

I picked up around 28, though I only used about 2. I probably should have ended up selling some. I also probably will end up using more Miracles as Revives. The extra HP recovered helps.

Quote:

3) I forget the name, but there's a dungeon that powers up every five levels. Is that ever worth doing past the first time?

I end up going in there for the 3rd Floor for the equipment and items, but never until the 5th Floor, where it's mandatory.

Quote:

4) I expected that you wouldn't be high enough level to have Mirror by the end actually. I know for a fact that when I played through the game once on the SNES, I completed it without too much difficulty without Mirror. I'm just saying, you said you were coasting at the end, and that sounds like too much XP to me, because the end is insane.

Jerin learns Mirror at Level 32. It's only four levels beyond Boost. At the Water Ghost, I was around Lvl. 15-16. At Guardian, I was in my low 20s. At Pirates, I was in my low 30s/high 20s. Oil Dragon was low 30s. Nazeby was the only boss I wrote my levels down specifically. He was also the boss I first had Mirror with.

Nazeby
Hero - Lvl. 39
Lufia - Lvl. 38
Aguro - Lvl. 36
Jerin - Lvl. 33

Beyond that, add one level per boss. IIRC, I think my final levels were:

Hero - Lvl. 43
Lufia - Lvl. 38
Aguro - Lvl. 40
Jerin - Lvl. 37

The biggest reason for this sudden level jump was the experience change. Around the Water Ghost, the most experience I picked up was around 300. Around Odel, I suddenly gained around 600-800. At lower levels, these monsters level you up quickly. I think the Alumina quest alone bumped my levels by 3 - 4, even with Sweet Waters.

As for the coasting, well, it's more of a strategy. After Pirates, nearly every boss relies on spells to deal most of their damage. Mirror pretty much negates all of their damage, save for the odd physical attack which is quickly negated by Hero's Champion. That's why I said I was coasting; Mirror saved everyone's life in the final battles. Else, I would be looking at some serious power leveling.

Quote:

5) On that gamefaqs thread, somebody said something like "everyone already knows the Might Helm." Well, I think it would be a good idea to ask him or anybody else if there are more things like that. Or at least, for any suggestions for a speedrun.

I have a topic created for speed run help, but little interest in it so far. Maybe I ought to detail my run specifically and see if I can get more help. Monster statistics would help tremendously, especially the boss stats.

EDIT: You know, I just might be crazy enough to single-segment this. If not, well, I have an idea of how I'm going to segment this.

Segment 1: Alekia, before leaving for Sheran
Segment 2: Sheran, before leaving for Treck
Segment 3: Treck, before fighting Mini-Demons
Segment 4: Treck, after fighting Mini-Demons
Segment 5: Medan, before fighting Apprentice
Segment 6: Medan, before entering Ghost Cave.
Segment 7: Belgen, before Dais Key.
Segment 8: Dais, before entering Tower north of Dais.
Segment 9: Belgen, after fighting Follower.
Segment 10: Ruan, before righting Water Ghost.
Segment 11: Carbis, before going to Bakku.
Segment 12: Bakku, before ascending Tower of Light.
Segment 13: Linze, before descending into the cave.
Segment 14: Herat, before entering Purple Newt Cave.
Segment 15: Marse, before fighting Pirates.
Segment 16: Epro, before entering Oil Cave.
Segment 17: Arubus, before entering Glasadar Key cave.
Segment 18: Arubus, before ascending Glasadar Tower.
Segment 19: Shrine before Doom Island Fortress.

Any thoughts?

EDIT2: I HATE x17 the Follower with a passion. Mid Arrows do a paltry 18 damage; my best bet against this freaking sonuvagun is to go all out: Drain x2, then slash and Flash away. I'm at the Dais with 1:56 elapsed.

[quote]Now for some quick questions and points.
1) Do you get stuff like the Flash Ring, Water Ring, etc?[/quote]

Flash Ring is the MOST important accessory in the game.  With it, Lufia's Flash is equal to Aguro or Hero's normal attack for most of the game.  Bolt ends up being a real damage dealer, until Hero and Aguro get their final few weapons.  I pick up the Ghost Ring for Phantasm and Water Ghost.  The other rings, such as the Red, Purple, etc. I pick up for their stat boosts, and sell the rest for badly needed cash.

[quote]2) How many Miracles do you end with/pick up? I don't need to tell you how good Miracles are.[/quote]

I picked up around 28, though I only used about 2.  I probably should have ended up selling some.  I also probably will end up using more Miracles as Revives.  The extra HP recovered helps.

[quote]3) I forget the name, but there's a dungeon that powers up every five levels. Is that ever worth doing past the first time?[/quote]

I end up going in there for the 3rd Floor for the equipment and items, but never until the 5th Floor, where it's mandatory.

[quote]4) I expected that you wouldn't be high enough level to have Mirror by the end actually. I know for a fact that when I played through the game once on the SNES, I completed it without too much difficulty without Mirror. I'm just saying, you said you were coasting at the end, and that sounds like too much XP to me, because the end is insane.[/quote]

Jerin learns Mirror at Level 32.  It's only four levels beyond Boost.  At the Water Ghost, I was around Lvl. 15-16.  At Guardian, I was in my low 20s.  At Pirates, I was in my low 30s/high 20s.  Oil Dragon was low 30s.  Nazeby was the only boss I wrote my levels down specifically.  He was also the boss I first had Mirror with.

Nazeby
Hero - Lvl. 39
Lufia - Lvl. 38
Aguro - Lvl. 36
Jerin - Lvl. 33

Beyond that, add one level per boss.  IIRC, I think my final levels were:

Hero - Lvl. 43
Lufia - Lvl. 38
Aguro - Lvl. 40
Jerin - Lvl. 37

The biggest reason for this sudden level jump was the experience change.  Around the Water Ghost, the most experience I picked up was around 300.  Around Odel, I suddenly gained around 600-800.  At lower levels, these monsters level you up quickly.  I think the Alumina quest alone bumped my levels by 3 - 4, even with Sweet Waters.

As for the coasting, well, it's more of a strategy.  After Pirates, nearly every boss relies on spells to deal most of their damage.  Mirror pretty much negates all of their damage, save for the odd physical attack which is quickly negated by Hero's Champion.  That's why I said I was coasting; Mirror saved everyone's life in the final battles.  Else, I would be looking at some serious power leveling.

[quote]5) On that gamefaqs thread, somebody said something like "everyone already knows the Might Helm." Well, I think it would be a good idea to ask him or anybody else if there are more things like that. Or at least, for any suggestions for a speedrun.[/quote]

I have a topic created for speed run help, but little interest in it so far.  Maybe I ought to detail my run specifically and see if I can get more help.  Monster statistics would help tremendously, especially the boss stats.

EDIT: You know, I just might be crazy enough to single-segment this.  If not, well, I have an idea of how I'm going to segment this.

Segment 1: Alekia, before leaving for Sheran
Segment 2: Sheran, before leaving for Treck
Segment 3: Treck, before fighting Mini-Demons
Segment 4: Treck, after fighting Mini-Demons
Segment 5: Medan, before fighting Apprentice
Segment 6: Medan, before entering Ghost Cave.
Segment 7: Belgen, before Dais Key.
Segment 8: Dais, before entering Tower north of Dais.
Segment 9: Belgen, after fighting Follower.
Segment 10: Ruan, before righting Water Ghost.
Segment 11: Carbis, before going to Bakku.
Segment 12: Bakku, before ascending Tower of Light.
Segment 13: Linze, before descending into the cave.
Segment 14: Herat, before entering Purple Newt Cave.
Segment 15: Marse, before fighting Pirates.
Segment 16: Epro, before entering Oil Cave.
Segment 17: Arubus, before entering Glasadar Key cave.
Segment 18: Arubus, before ascending Glasadar Tower.
Segment 19: Shrine before Doom Island Fortress.

Any thoughts?

EDIT2: I HATE x17 the Follower with a passion.  Mid Arrows do a paltry 18 damage; my best bet against this freaking sonuvagun is to go all out: Drain x2, then slash and Flash away.  I'm at the Dais with 1:56 elapsed.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-20 05:01:30 am

2006-02-20 04:47:57 am

SURPRISE! Cheesy

Dais Save - 1:56
Follower - Hero: 14, Lufia: 13, Aguro: 13

Ruan 1st Save - 2:21

Ruan 2nd Save - 2:27

Ruan 3rd Save - 2:33
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

Odel - 3:02

Arus - 3:22

Bakku - 3:46 (Before Tower of Light 1)

Carbis - 3:58 (Before Tower of Light 2)

Linze - 4:10

Marse - 4:17 (Before Alumina Quest)

Marse - 4:25

Frederia - 4:51 (Before final Alumina)

Marse - 5:02 (Before Pirates)
Pirates - Hero: 29, Lufia: 28, Aguro: 26, Jerin: 26

Carbis - 5:22 (Before Dual Blade)

Epro - 5:31 (Before Oil Cave)
Oil Dragon - Hero: 32, Aguro: 29, Lufia: 31, Jerin: 28

Arubus - 5:52 (Before Glasdar Key)

Arubus - 6:02 (Before Glasdar Tower)
Nazeby (1st run) - Hero: 39, Lufia: 38, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 33
Nazeby (2nd run) - Hero: 36, Lufia: 35, Aguro: 33, Jerin: 32

Old Man - 6:20 (Before Doom Island Fortress)
Gades - Hero: 37, Aguro: 34, Jerin: 33
Amon - Hero: 38, Aguro: 35, Jerin: 33
Daos - Hero: 39, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 34
Guard Daos - Hero: 40, Aguro: 37, Jerin: 35, Lufia: 36

Final Blow: 6:44
Loss of Player Control: 6:49

And the stats.

Post Credits Time: 6:53
Dead count: 0
Rakke Dead cnt: 4
Lufia Dead cnt: 12
Aguro Dead cnt: 7
Jerin Dead cnt: 7
Rest count: 34
Battle count: 368
Runaway count: 49
Boss lose cnt: 0
Opened Box: 345/655
Got item: 79/136

That's right, I improved my time by an astonishing 1 hour 47 minutes!!!

How do you like that, Enhasa?

[b]SURPRISE![/b]  :D

Dais Save - 1:56
Follower - Hero: 14, Lufia: 13, Aguro: 13

Ruan 1st Save - 2:21

Ruan 2nd Save - 2:27

Ruan 3rd Save - 2:33
Water Ghost - Hero: 15, Lufia: 15, Aguro: 14, Jerin: 17

Odel - 3:02

Arus - 3:22

Bakku - 3:46 (Before Tower of Light 1)

Carbis - 3:58 (Before Tower of Light 2)

Linze - 4:10

Marse - 4:17 (Before Alumina Quest)

Marse - 4:25

Frederia - 4:51 (Before final Alumina)

Marse - 5:02 (Before Pirates)
Pirates - Hero: 29, Lufia: 28, Aguro: 26, Jerin: 26

Carbis - 5:22 (Before Dual Blade)

Epro - 5:31 (Before Oil Cave)
Oil Dragon - Hero: 32, Aguro: 29, Lufia: 31, Jerin: 28

Arubus - 5:52 (Before Glasdar Key)

Arubus - 6:02 (Before Glasdar Tower)
Nazeby (1st run) - Hero: 39, Lufia: 38, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 33
Nazeby (2nd run) - Hero: 36, Lufia: 35, Aguro: 33, Jerin: 32

Old Man - 6:20 (Before Doom Island Fortress)
Gades - Hero: 37, Aguro: 34, Jerin: 33
Amon - Hero: 38, Aguro: 35, Jerin: 33
Daos - Hero: 39, Aguro: 36, Jerin: 34
Guard Daos - Hero: 40, Aguro: 37, Jerin: 35, Lufia: 36

[b]Final Blow: 6:44
Loss of Player Control: 6:49[/b]

And the stats.

Post Credits Time: 6:53
Dead count: 0
Rakke Dead cnt: 4
Lufia Dead cnt: 12
Aguro Dead cnt: 7
Jerin Dead cnt: 7
Rest count: 34
Battle count: 368
Runaway count: 49
Boss lose cnt: 0
Opened Box: 345/655
Got item: 79/136

That's right, I improved my time by an astonishing [b]1 hour 47 minutes!!![/b]

How do you like that, Enhasa?