Lufia

crackersdontmatter

StrangenessDSS

Edit history:

StrangenessDSS: 2006-03-29 01:26:18 am

2006-02-02 05:17:23 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

I haven't played this game for quite some time, so perhaps its not doable at all.

But im thinking about it, any ideas?

Thread title:

DTaeKim

2006-02-02 08:47:21 pm

It's relatively straightforward. I don't know of any low level game tactics though.

Dragondarch

2006-02-02 10:12:00 pm

Pudding%

First things first, which Lufia do you mean...there's more than one.

-Suzaku-

2006-02-02 10:22:21 pm

Eternal Understudy

The fact that the title is simply "Lufia" Makes me assume it's the first one "Fortress of Doom".

Sir VG

2006-02-02 11:04:20 pm

Fucking Weeaboo

The original would be harder than Lufia II, as the latter was a faster paced game...not to mention just generally harder due to how the stupid battle system worked. You can't pick your target, you pick within a range of them and the game picks for you. -_-

DTaeKim

2006-02-03 12:59:46 am

Don't forget the random battles. Sweet Water was a blessing.

Dragondarch

2006-02-03 10:43:08 am

Pudding%

Foul Water would also be a blessing if you needed a quick XP boost Wink

Mr_Nice_Guy

Edit history:

Mr_Nice_Guy: 2006-02-03 11:49:29 am

2006-02-03 11:49:08 am

Battle Is My Forte

Lufia 1 was a great game, only thing i hated were:
-slow moving in dungeons and world map
3 elf towers
-getting the metal pieces in the caves to make submarine.
-If monster that was targeted runs/killed, your member wont attack in the round.

Lufia 2 was the best in the series IMO.
- Slow moving is dealt with
- if monster is killed/runs away, character automatically attacks another monster
- no random encounters in dungeons (only world map)

Lufia 3 worst in the series imo:
- bad graphics (what you expect when you compare it with SNES graphics of the previous two games)
- Dungeons never stay the same (rooms change every time you enter)
- 9 party members of which only 3 can attack
- leader dead = game over

Lufia 4 wasnt good and wasnt bad
- you dont travel world map anymore, you click on the flashy area to move to the area.
- no sinnestrals like previous 3 games (love gades >_<)
- at least used Lufia2 system with a few improvements
- Return of Dekar (lufia 2 character)

personally, i would either choose:
Lufia 2 - Rise of the Sinnestrals (choose european version, doesnt have Dual Sword shrine glitched room)
or
Lufia 4 - The ruins of lore

Lufia 1 was a great game, only thing i hated were:
-slow moving in dungeons and world map
3 elf towers
-getting the metal pieces in the caves to make submarine.
-If monster that was targeted runs/killed, your member wont attack in the round.

Lufia 2 was the best in the series IMO.
- Slow moving is dealt with
- if monster is killed/runs away, character automatically attacks another monster
- no random encounters in dungeons (only world map)

Lufia 3 worst in the series imo:
- bad graphics (what you expect when you compare it with SNES graphics of the previous two games)
- Dungeons never stay the same (rooms change every time you enter)
- 9 party members of which only 3 can attack
- leader dead = game over

Lufia 4 wasnt good and wasnt bad
- you dont travel world map anymore, you click on the flashy area to move to the area.
- no sinnestrals like previous 3 games (love gades >_<)
- at least used Lufia2 system with a few improvements
- Return of Dekar (lufia 2 character)

personally, i would either choose:
Lufia 2 - Rise of the Sinnestrals (choose european version, doesnt have Dual Sword shrine glitched room)
or
Lufia 4 - The ruins of lore

Enhasa

2006-02-03 08:07:04 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

OMFG Lufia! I would gladly pay someone $50 or more to do a good Lufia 1 run.

I was actually thinking of maybe trying one myself, but since I have other things to do and I haven't really played it in a long time, the timeframe would maybe be around when Dragondarch gets around to Lufia 2 after BoF 1-4, Ogre Battle, Tactics Ogre, and FF Tactics. =/

Quote:

The original would be harder than Lufia II, as the latter was a faster paced game...not to mention just generally harder due to how the stupid battle system worked. You can't pick your target, you pick within a range of them and the game picks for you. -_-

Mostly the fact that it's easier and there's no random battles. And the targetting is based somewhat on weapon.

I was gonna say Sweet and Foul Water, but I was beaten to it. I actually did a low level run on ZSNES back in the day. The sinistrals at the end were a run killer. You can actually make it to Gades at ~25, but even hoarding Miracles like a madman, he is impossible unless you level more. Impossible as in I even tried luck manipulating like crazy. I wonder if there's anywhere good to gain experience.

Personally, I think Lufia 1 is truly great, 2 is godly, and 3-4 were merely ok, 3 significantly better than 4. This is what happens when you have a new development team because the old one went bankrupt. Let's play a little game (I'll stick to RPGs):

Lufia 1, 2 vs 3, 4
Suikoden 1, 2 vs 3, 4, Tactics
Tales of Phantasia vs middle Tales vs Legendia
Ogre Battle, Tactics Ogre vs Ogre Battle 64, Knight of Lodis

There are more but those are ones that stick out as being generally agreed upon.

OMFG Lufia! I would gladly pay someone $50 or more to do a good Lufia 1 run.

I was actually thinking of maybe trying one myself, but since I have other things to do and I haven't really played it in a long time, the timeframe would maybe be around when Dragondarch gets around to Lufia 2 after BoF 1-4, Ogre Battle, Tactics Ogre, and FF Tactics. =/

[quote]The original would be harder than Lufia II, as the latter was a faster paced game...not to mention just generally harder due to how the stupid battle system worked.  You can't pick your target, you pick within a range of them and the game picks for you.  -_-[/quote]
Mostly the fact that it's easier and there's no random battles. And the targetting is based somewhat on weapon.

I was gonna say Sweet and Foul Water, but I was beaten to it. I actually did a low level run on ZSNES back in the day. The sinistrals at the end were a run killer. You can actually make it to Gades at ~25, but even hoarding Miracles like a madman, he is impossible unless you level more. Impossible as in I even tried luck manipulating like crazy. I wonder if there's anywhere good to gain experience.

Personally, I think Lufia 1 is truly great, 2 is godly, and 3-4 were merely ok, 3 significantly better than 4. This is what happens when you have a new development team because the old one went bankrupt. Let's play a little game (I'll stick to RPGs):

Lufia 1, 2 vs 3, 4
Suikoden 1, 2 vs 3, 4, Tactics
Tales of Phantasia vs middle Tales vs Legendia
Ogre Battle, Tactics Ogre vs Ogre Battle 64, Knight of Lodis

There are more but those are ones that stick out as being generally agreed upon.

DTaeKim

Edit history:

DTaeKim: 2006-02-03 08:27:43 pm

2006-02-03 08:27:14 pm

What about the cores? Slaying even ONE gives tremendous amounts of experience. If it weren't for the fact that they ran like crazy...

I think the final cores on Doom Island are vulnerble to Perish/Succumb. It's been forever since I played the game though.

Enhasa

2006-02-03 11:28:08 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

I just checked gamefaqs because I wanted to find out about those cores. I was pleasantly surprised to find that there is still decent FAQ writing activity going on, with a walkthrough, spoiler-free walkthrough, game script, and world map from 2005. Incidentally, Walker Boh even has a walkthrough apparently.

Apparently there are only Red Cores and Green Cores in Lufia 1. Going by what this one guy did, splitting the game into 37 sections, Red Cores are in part 28 and Green in 37, like you said.

I tried testing autokill on ZSNES for about 10 minutes, but I couldn't even meet any cores, let alone try to kill them. This is because I just relearned how deadly it is to even walk around at those levels. I now think that I will give someone who can do a low level run of Lufia 1 at least $100.

But then I realized something. You wouldn't be able to Perish/Succumb Green Cores anyway, because Lufia is the one who has them. Wink

(I have never had such a nice, fuzzy feeling typing something on the Internet as I did just there.) Also, if you were in high enough level to Succumb anyway, you probably wouldn't need more leveling. The same holds true for Perish and Red Cores. But I like the first explanation better.

Aside: a couple nights ago I downloaded the Estopolis Biography soundtrack from gamemp3s. I'm not a big VGM OST/remix downloading guy (I mostly have Sakuraba stuff), but I started listening and had to completely stop everything else I was doing and soak it in. I was feeling a little down, and it was like pure magic.

If you haven't heard it (most of you probably haven't), I also have a 30-min long, 5 movement symphonic arrangement of Lufia songs made by the guy who used to run the music section at RPGamer. It's pretty damn good for something you see online. I uploaded a RAR of the mp3s themselves and another RAR of the comments txt and sheet music TIFFs here (should be up by the time you read this).

I have a couple more things but that's enough for now.

I just checked gamefaqs because I wanted to find out about those cores. I was pleasantly surprised to find that there is [url=http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/snes/game/588452.html]still decent FAQ writing activity going on[/url], with a walkthrough, spoiler-free walkthrough, game script, and world map from 2005. Incidentally, Walker Boh even has a walkthrough apparently.

Apparently there are only Red Cores and Green Cores in Lufia 1. Going by what this one guy did, splitting the game into 37 sections, Red Cores are in part 28 and Green in 37, like you said.

I tried testing autokill on ZSNES for about 10 minutes, but I couldn't even meet any cores, let alone try to kill them. This is because I just relearned how deadly it is to even walk around at those levels. I now think that I will give someone who can do a low level run of Lufia 1 [i]at least[/i] $100.

But then I realized something. You wouldn't be able to Perish/Succumb Green Cores anyway, because Lufia is the one who has them. ;) (I have never had such a nice, fuzzy feeling typing something on the Internet as I did just there.) Also, if you were in high enough level to Succumb anyway, you probably wouldn't need more leveling. The same holds true  for Perish and Red Cores. But I like the first explanation better.

Aside: a couple nights ago I downloaded the [url=http://www.gamemp3s.net/2006/01/67]Estopolis Biography soundtrack[/url] from gamemp3s. I'm not a big VGM OST/remix downloading guy (I mostly have Sakuraba stuff), but I started listening and had to completely stop everything else I was doing and soak it in. I was feeling a little down, and it was like pure magic.

If you haven't heard it (most of you probably haven't), I also have a 30-min long, 5 movement symphonic arrangement of Lufia songs made by the guy who used to run the music section at RPGamer. It's pretty damn good for something you see online. I uploaded a RAR of the mp3s themselves and another RAR of the comments txt and sheet music TIFFs [url=http://www.cs.clemson.edu/~kjuang/files/]here[/url] (should be up by the time you read this).

I have a couple more things but that's enough for now.

Sir VG

2006-02-04 01:51:20 am

Fucking Weeaboo

Oh, you must be referring to Trickwater's "Memories of the Last War". That piece is BEAUTIFUL. Seriously, cry tears with me people!

I use to talk to him a long time ago back when he was a member of GameSekai Forums (which is now no more). He passed the piece on to me and I was stunned with what he did with that music.

Everybody must listen to it! THAT IS AN ORDER.

Enhasa

2006-02-04 05:07:10 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Yes, I can use more help promoting Trick's work. =) It's better than anything you'll ever find on OCRemix, for example.

I was thinking, maybe the original poster should edit the thread title to include "Enhasa will give you $100 if you can do a good Lufia 1 run." Wink

Although I guess all that would do is attract the riffraff.

rlxrlps

2006-02-04 09:16:33 am

<3

*enter riffraff*

I just need money Cry

Mr_Nice_Guy

2006-02-04 11:40:14 am

Battle Is My Forte

if i would do a run (i wont since im doing a MMBN2 run now, maybe after it) i will probably do a Lufia 2 run.

but i have a Lufia 2 question in advance:
Are you allowed to do retry mode from the start?
Its the same as normal mode except you get 4x exp and gold. Retry mode would be better if i want to beat the 1st gades fight to get Gades Blade.

-Suzaku-

2006-02-04 04:22:37 pm

Eternal Understudy

Yes and No
If a regular run was submitted first, then yes. Or if it was PROVEN that a sub 7 run without it isn't possible, then yes. It would obviously get its own category, too.

Enhasa

2006-02-05 08:35:00 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

rlxrlps, you came here without anything being posted in the thread title, so your riffraff status is suspect! Unless you searched the entire forum for "$100" on a whim. If so, I salute you!

Mr Nice Guy, it would count as a New Game + mode and you would need a normal mode first like Suzaku said. And even on Retry, you would want to lose to Gades anyway because the time you save with the Gades blade is nowhere near the time it would take you to beat him. You can already slaughter everybody. Honestly, I think Retry would be hella boring and don't see the point. Why isn't anyone suggesting a Gift run of the Ancient Cave? Now that's obvious.

About sub 7 being "possible" (lol), I will just copy and paste what I said in the "games too long?" thread:

on Jan 5th, 2006, 1:52am, Forgotten_One wrote:
Holy crap, Lufia 2? It's my favorite RPG of all-time, but I didn't take speed-running the game too seriously. I thought there was too much leveling involved, until I remembered the Ancient Cave...

This isn't the first time I've heard this now, so I'm confused. Lufia 1 probably has too much leveling involved, but Lufia 2? No way. The hardest fight in the game is Idura with only Maxim and Selan, and sadly, for the rest of the game, only the 2 Lions fight and maybe the Red Dragon fight could pose any sort of difficulty. Not only do you never need to level, you don't need to fight a single unnecessary fight the entire game. I play like that in all the RPGs I play normally anyway. Having no random encounters here in dungeons is a big boon.

In fact, the glaring lack of difficulty in my only complaint in what is maybe my favorite US-released SNES game. The only explanation I have is plot based -- that Neverland wanted to demonstrate just how powerful Maxim and company had become, to show how people could unite and rise up to defeat their oppressors, and to further tie the end of Lufia 2 to the start of Lufia 1 (because being the intro, the fighting with Maxim was of course very easy).

And about the AC, it's definitely not going to be worth the time. It is worth the time for a TAS since you can manipulate to get all the insane blue chests, but sadly it's because of this fact that quietkane has been going insane and progress has been stalled.

Anyway, if anyone were going to try a Lufia 2 speedrun, the two people to talk to are quietkane (working on the TAS WIP) and relnqshd (romhacker on gamefaqs who could tell you exactly how all the algorithms of the game work, line by line... but he's permanently MIA last I checked). The most annoying part of running this game if you want to do a good job is fighting those bosses over and over again to get the insanely powerful rare drops like Catfish Jewel. Of course, I've heard some people do this anyway, even when they aren't playing for speed, so maybe it's not all that bad...

rlxrlps, you came here without anything being posted in the thread title, so your riffraff status is suspect! Unless you searched the entire forum for "$100" on a whim. If so, I salute you!

Mr Nice Guy, it would count as a New Game + mode and you would need a normal mode first like Suzaku said. And even on Retry, you would want to lose to Gades anyway because the time you save with the Gades blade is nowhere near the time it would take you to beat him. You can already slaughter everybody. Honestly, I think Retry would be hella boring and don't see the point. Why isn't anyone suggesting a Gift run of the Ancient Cave? Now [i]that's[/i] obvious.

About sub 7 being "possible" (lol), I will just copy and paste what I said in the "games too long?" thread:

[i]on Jan 5th, 2006, 1:52am, Forgotten_One wrote:
Holy crap, Lufia 2?  It's my favorite RPG of all-time, but I didn't take speed-running the game too seriously.  I thought there was too much leveling involved, until I remembered the Ancient Cave...[/i]

This isn't the first time I've heard this now, so I'm confused. Lufia 1 probably has too much leveling involved, but Lufia 2? No way. The hardest fight in the game is Idura with only Maxim and Selan, and sadly, for the rest of the game, only the 2 Lions fight and maybe the Red Dragon fight could pose any sort of difficulty. Not only do you never need to level, you don't need to fight a single unnecessary fight the entire game. I play like that in all the RPGs I play normally anyway. Having no random encounters here in dungeons is a big boon.
 
In fact, the glaring lack of difficulty in my only complaint in what is maybe my favorite US-released SNES game. The only explanation I have is plot based -- that Neverland wanted to demonstrate just how powerful Maxim and company had become, to show how people could unite and rise up to defeat their oppressors, and to further tie the end of Lufia 2 to the start of Lufia 1 (because being the intro, the fighting with Maxim was of course very easy).
 
And about the AC, it's definitely not going to be worth the time. It is worth the time for a TAS since you can manipulate to get all the insane blue chests, but sadly it's because of this fact that quietkane has been going insane and progress has been stalled.
 
Anyway, if anyone were going to try a Lufia 2 speedrun, the two people to talk to are quietkane (working on the TAS WIP) and relnqshd (romhacker on gamefaqs who could tell you exactly how all the algorithms of the game work, line by line... but he's permanently MIA last I checked). The most annoying part of running this game if you want to do a good job is fighting those bosses over and over again to get the insanely powerful rare drops like Catfish Jewel. Of course, I've heard some people do this anyway, even when they aren't playing for speed, so maybe it's not all that bad...

DTaeKim

2006-02-05 07:59:49 pm

Yeah, that was me. Like I said, I never took speedrunning the game seriously. I loved the plot of the game, and took things nice and slow.

Of course, I remember my only attempt at low level game was sabotaged by the Tarantula. Damn that insect.

Enhasa

2006-02-05 08:32:42 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Well, I certainly never advocate speeding through a game the first time. Wink

Anyway, the Tarantula is pretty damn tough. The Insect Crush helps out a lot over whatever later weapon you have at the time. The biggest thing is, you just need to stock up on Potions.

DTaeKim

2006-02-06 12:05:23 am

Insect Crush was on Maxim, Guy had the Fire Dagger.

Tia was tossing Potions left and right.

I used Blaze for all of his worth.

Enhasa

2006-02-06 03:40:19 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Well, I don't know what to say then, other than try again? When Dragondarch gets around to this game (in say, 2010 lol), we'll see what he thinks.

Mr_Nice_Guy

2006-02-06 06:22:52 am

Battle Is My Forte

couldnt you get the fire dager from where camu was after you revisit the tower and equip it to Guy?
That way you have 2 weapons that hurt the tarantula more

Dragondarch

2006-02-06 12:32:34 pm

Pudding%

Quote:

Well, I don't know what to say then, other than try again? When Dragondarch gets around to this game (in say, 2010 lol), we'll see what he thinks.

Hey, that's only 4 years...your estimates are wayyyy too short. I'd try 2020 Tongue

Enhasa

2006-02-06 04:40:21 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

In case anybody is wondering about the bounty, it is for doing a good run of Lufia 1. Anyone interested? Or does $100 not go as far as it used to...

Quote:

couldnt you get the fire dager from where camu was after you revisit the tower and equip it to Guy?
That way you have 2 weapons that hurt the tarantula more

Look above. He uses the Fire dagger.

Quote:

Hey, that's only 4 years...your estimates are wayyyy too short. I'd try 2020 Tongue

I hadn't looked at your queue in a while. I had no idea that every game you've ever played would jump the list! At this rate, I'd be better off doing it myself. In 2010.

BTW, I definitely think you should do Ogre Battle, then Tactics Ogre, then FF Tactics. There's a nice progression that way. Unless your queue isn't ordered within colors and you were going to do that anyway.

And just to let you know, me or Gorash will probably get around to BoF: DQ before you and Josh will definitely get around to SO2 before you. I don't know what else but that is one helluva long list. Wink

[b]In case anybody is wondering about the bounty, it is for doing a good run of Lufia 1. Anyone interested? Or does $100 not go as far as it used to...  :P[/b]

[quote]couldnt you get the fire dager from where camu was after you revisit the tower and equip it to Guy?
That way you have 2 weapons that hurt the tarantula more[/quote]
Look above. He uses the Fire dagger.

[quote]Hey, that's only 4 years...your estimates are wayyyy too short. I'd try 2020  :P[/quote]
:(

I hadn't looked at your queue in a while. I had no idea that every game you've ever played would jump the list! At this rate, I'd be better off doing it myself. In 2010.

BTW, I definitely think you should do Ogre Battle, then Tactics Ogre, then FF Tactics. There's a nice progression that way. Unless your queue isn't ordered within colors and you were going to do that anyway.

And just to let you know, me or Gorash will probably get around to BoF: DQ before you and Josh will definitely get around to SO2 before you. I don't know what else but that is one helluva long list. ;)

DTaeKim

2006-02-06 09:05:25 pm

I would be willing, seeing I still have my copy of Lufia for the SNES. I'm going to need to practice a lot though, since I haven't played the game for a year.