Breath of Fire

Edit history:

__sdfg: 2010-06-19 11:05:06 am

2010-06-19 09:27:01 am

D:

The Acorn was intentional. If Ryu had defended, he probably would have survived being hit, and I've had bad luck in the past with him Slamming the enemies to death when he attacks. The mistake was not having Nina attack on the second-to-last turn so she'd die, too.

EDIT: Problem solved. I wasn't expecting this to happen, but I'll take it.

Also, I plan to buy more Acorns in Prima, so using them here doesn't matter much.

japanzaman

2010-06-19 08:48:45 pm

Really good segment. I'm glad to see you went back and cleaned that final battle up, as the segment now looks technically flawless. Getting a better draw on the final battle would have been nice, but it didn't cost you much time.

Something to keep in mind: You need to watch Bo and Ryu's ACT in the upcoming match and make sure Bo is attacking first, especially for Gremlin. It may not be an issue for you, but it can be from time to time depending on Bo and Ryu's agility gains. If Ryu does end up ahead of Bo then you can swap the StrawHT to get Bo up over the top.

Also, the next segment is fairly easy, and Nina should gain a level. It might be worth running this segment until you get 6 or 7 HP for Nina on her level up, as sometimes that can make all the difference in the Gremlin battle. If she has less than 50 HP, it can be very tough to keep her alive in the Gremlin's second stage. You can afford to loose her in that battle, but not until the very end unless you have a completely different strategy than I did, which I doubt.

Really good segment. I'm glad to see you went back and cleaned that final battle up, as the segment now looks technically flawless. Getting a better draw on the final battle would have been nice, but it didn't cost you much time.

Something to keep in mind: You need to watch Bo and Ryu's ACT in the upcoming match and make sure Bo is attacking first, especially for Gremlin. It may not be an issue for you, but it can be from time to time depending on Bo and Ryu's agility gains. If Ryu does end up ahead of Bo then you can swap the StrawHT to get Bo up over the top.

Also, the next segment is fairly easy, and Nina should gain a level. It might be worth running this segment until you get 6 or 7 HP for Nina on her level up, as sometimes that can make all the difference in the Gremlin battle. If she has less than 50 HP, it can be very tough to keep her alive in the Gremlin's second stage. You can afford to loose her in that battle, but not until the very end unless you have a completely different strategy than I did, which I doubt.

Dragondarch

2010-06-19 11:29:41 pm

Pudding%

Haven't read the whole thread, but I found something at GameFAQs that may help in terms of survival for Gremlin.

Quote:

Critical HP:
This status is applied to monsters whose hit points are reduced to 12.5% or
less of the maximum value through a non-phase-ending attack. It can only be
applied during Phase 1. If it is activated before Phase 1 comes to an end,
Critical HP status will remain on the enemy until the end of battle. Monsters
in critical HP status deal 131.25% normal damage when using a physical attack.
Note that any monster with the ability to use a recovery spell when under the
influence of this status can only do so during Phase 1.

Then...

Quote:

17 Gremlin

Location: Stone Robot (event)

HP: 1200 (600; 600)

By my calculations, it should be possible to knock Gremlin into phase 2 without him receiving the Critical HP status (activation point would be 525 damage taken). If you could knock him down by only 520 (5 Fry + 4 E.Key would work), then have Bo cast Fry once more, it would reduce him to 0, and start phase 2 without the damage bonus.

Haven't read the whole thread, but I found something at GameFAQs that may help in terms of survival for Gremlin.

[quote]Critical HP:
This status is applied to monsters whose hit points are reduced to 12.5% or
less of the maximum value through a non-phase-ending attack. It can only be
applied during Phase 1. If it is activated before Phase 1 comes to an end,
Critical HP status will remain on the enemy until the end of battle. Monsters
in critical HP status deal 131.25% normal damage when using a physical attack.
Note that any monster with the ability to use a recovery spell when under the
influence of this status can only do so during Phase 1.[/quote]

Then...

[quote]17 Gremlin

Location: Stone Robot (event)

HP: 1200 (600; 600)[/quote]

By my calculations, it should be possible to knock Gremlin into phase 2 without him receiving the Critical HP status (activation point would be 525 damage taken). If you could knock him down by only 520 (5 Fry + 4 E.Key would work), then have Bo cast Fry once more, it would reduce him to 0, and start phase 2 without the damage bonus.

__sdfg

2010-06-20 10:53:00 am

D:

Quote from japanzaman:

Something to keep in mind: You need to watch Bo and Ryu's ACT in the upcoming match and make sure Bo is attacking first, especially for Gremlin. It may not be an issue for you, but it can be from time to time depending on Bo and Ryu's agility gains. If Ryu does end up ahead of Bo then you can swap the StrawHT to get Bo up over the top.

I already had to do that. Sad

I need Bo to gain at least 3 Agil points from the next battle, because if he only gets 2 points, he'll tie Ryu and go second (the tiebreaker is party order, and the game automatically puts Ryu in front after the stone robot cutscene). Fortunately, this says that I have a 3/4 chance of getting the points I need, so it shouldn't be too hard.

Quote from Dragondarch:

By my calculations, it should be possible to knock Gremlin into phase 2 without him receiving the Critical HP status (activation point would be 525 damage taken). If you could knock him down by only 520 (5 Fry + 4 E.Key would work), then have Bo cast Fry once more, it would reduce him to 0, and start phase 2 without the damage bonus.

Thank you for noticing that. I have a copy of that document, but I had misread it as saying that 25% was the cutoff, so I had resigned myself to dealing with the damage boost. Keeping Gremlin's attack power in check will definitely make the battle easier/possible.

[quote="japanzaman"]
Something to keep in mind: You need to watch Bo and Ryu's ACT in the upcoming match and make sure Bo is attacking first, especially for Gremlin. It may not be an issue for you, but it can be from time to time depending on Bo and Ryu's agility gains. If Ryu does end up ahead of Bo then you can swap the StrawHT to get Bo up over the top.[/quote]
I already had to do that. :(  I need Bo to gain at least 3 Agil points from the next battle, because if he only gets 2 points, he'll tie Ryu and go second (the tiebreaker is party order, and the game automatically puts Ryu in front after the stone robot cutscene).  Fortunately, [url=http://www.gamefaqs.com/snes/563529-breath-of-fire/faqs/57133]this[/url] says that I have a 3/4 chance of getting the points I need, so it shouldn't be too hard.

[quote="Dragondarch"]
By my calculations, it should be possible to knock Gremlin into phase 2 without him receiving the Critical HP status (activation point would be 525 damage taken). If you could knock him down by only 520 (5 Fry + 4 E.Key would work), then have Bo cast Fry once more, it would reduce him to 0, and start phase 2 without the damage bonus.
[/quote]
Thank you for noticing that.  I have a copy of that document, but I had misread it as saying that 25% was the cutoff, so I had resigned myself to dealing with the damage boost.  Keeping Gremlin's attack power in check will definitely make the battle easier/possible.

japanzaman

2010-06-22 07:20:36 am

Strange, but I never noticed that critical hit carrying over into the second stage, no matter how many times I attacked him with E. Key. Perhaps I just got used to getting 4 E.Key shots off, which should happen fairly naturally assuming Ryu acorns and Nina forts for the first three turns. Either way, I don't see you having to worry about that critical hit as you should be using 4 E.Key anyway for that first stage.

Do remember that he will hit critical on the final round of the last stage, though, which can reach upwards to 40 damage to Bo and Nina.

Keep pluggin, as I'm looking forward to how your Gremlin battle turns out Grin

__sdfg

2010-06-26 02:07:00 pm

D:

The last time I wasn't happy with a segment, I posted it here and got a better one almost immediately after that, so I'm going to try that again.

Tantar 1.
Tantar 2.

If I had used a Mrbl3 in the basement of the elder's house, I could have avoided the notification when it ran out (there are no enemies in the first part of the lake cave). However, getting another recording where I kill the General that fast has been... difficult.

japanzaman

2010-06-27 02:06:18 am

Segment looks passable, so complaints if you choose to keep it as I can sympathize with the dullness of resetting over and over until you get the slam from Hero in the first turn. Good luck with Gremlin Wink

__sdfg

2010-06-27 12:27:47 pm

D:

Well, I've now recorded over 100 attempts since the one I posted, and I was unable to kill General in two turns in any of those. It looks like my luck in the posted run was a fluke that made the run abnormally fast.

I'll wait a day before overwriting my saves in case someone else sees something they didn't like (I also should've used Herbs to heal rather than Cura; total mistake time for the segment is probably around 5 seconds), but I think I'm going to focus on my Gremlin strategy now.

japanzaman

2010-06-27 04:38:32 pm

And to think, these were actually the easy battles...

There really isn't that much luck involved with Gremlin, just execution. Are you planning on keeping everyone alive or is having Nina die acceptable?

__sdfg

2010-06-27 11:41:47 pm

D:

The hard battles will probably go faster because after dying a lot, I'll eventually give up, pick the best of the 4 or 5 battles where I actually survive, and move on. Tongue

I plan to keep everyone alive. Nina needs to stay alive until close to the end for the other two to have a chance, so letting her die doesn't gain me much time. Also, assuming I keep Bo and Ryu alive for everything, I can only let Nina die against one boss before Morteo if I want her to learn Warp by then, and EyeSpy seems like the best place for that to happen. I may play around with my strategy for the Squid and Octo battles and decide if I really need Bo to stay alive for them, though.

japanzaman

Edit history:

japanzaman: 2010-06-28 07:31:07 pm

2010-06-28 06:33:18 pm

Honestly, I would let Bo die off in almost all of the battles after Gremlin, as he won't be really contributing much after a Fry before you switch over to AB. You can then use that EXP to further boost Nina along, which can give you some wiggle room for Octo and Squid, which are tough battles to keep Nina alive in.

The Eye battle should be easy to keep Nina alive in as you can predict his movements fairly easily and he should only be getting one shot of lightning off if you use Mrbl1, which I'm assuming you will since you won't be able to save after sandworm. Cloud will also be VERY difficult to AB and keep Nina alive. So don't forget about that. Just beating Cloud on AB is about a 5% proposition, depending on how stout the hero is.

Also, I'm wondering why you need Nina to get warp after Morteo as you only really need it after Toad. Nina should easily get the experience for Morteo and Toad by hiding in the back, so as long as you make sure she'll hit that final level in those battles you'd free yourself up for better battles along the way. Having to keep her alive in the Octo, Cloud, Sandworm, and Squid battles can be quite a chore on AB, and could ruin a battle where Hero gets 3 or 4 slams. For all those battles, you should aim to get at least 3 slams with Hero, and let Nina fall where she falls.

That's just my take anyway...

Honestly, I would let Bo die off in almost all of the battles after Gremlin, as he won't be really contributing much after a Fry before you switch over to AB. You can then use that EXP to further boost Nina along, which can give you some wiggle room for Octo and Squid, which are tough battles to keep Nina alive in.

The Eye battle should be easy to keep Nina alive in as you can predict his movements fairly easily and he should only be getting one shot of lightning off if you use Mrbl1, which I'm assuming you will since you won't be able to save after sandworm. Cloud will also be VERY difficult to AB and keep Nina alive. So don't forget about that. Just beating Cloud on AB is about a 5% proposition, depending on how stout the hero is.

Also, I'm wondering why you need Nina to get warp after Morteo as you only really need it after Toad. Nina should easily get the experience for Morteo and Toad by hiding in the back, so as long as you make sure she'll hit that final level in those battles you'd free yourself up for better battles along the way. Having to keep her alive in the Octo, Cloud, Sandworm, and Squid battles can be quite a chore on AB, and could ruin a battle where Hero gets 3 or 4 slams. For all those battles, you should aim to get at least 3 slams with Hero, and let Nina fall where she falls.

That's just my take anyway...

__sdfg

2010-06-30 12:09:40 am

D:

I was planning to have Nina use ATK-Up on Shin against Morteo and Toad, and then leave Nina in. Looking at things again based on what you've said, I probably gain more time by letting her die in the earlier fights than I lose switching her out after the first round against Morteo/Toad.

I will be abusing death after EyeSpy and Squid, so I want as many people to die in those fights as possible. You are right that having everyone other than Ryu fall to Cloud is the only way to autobattle through it effectively. Looking at my spreadsheet, I need to make up for the lost Exp in those three fights by having Nina be one of at most three survivors against Octo, and then having a couple other people dead at the end of Morteo/Toad. If I do things right, Gremlin won't matter. The Octo fight is long-ish and keeping Nina alive will be a pain, but he and Squid both give such an insane amount of Exp that I can't skip both of them. If it's too slow to keep her alive, I'll use a Life2 near the end of the fight.

Also note that I'll be skipping the first two fights after I set sail from Auria, so I'll be missing out on ~1000 Exp per character that you might've factored into your run planning.

I was planning to have Nina use ATK-Up on Shin against Morteo and Toad, and then leave Nina in.  Looking at things again based on what you've said, I probably gain more time by letting her die in the earlier fights than I lose switching her out after the first round against Morteo/Toad.

I will be abusing death after EyeSpy and Squid, so I want as many people to die in those fights as possible.  You are right that having everyone other than Ryu fall to Cloud is the only way to autobattle through it effectively.  Looking at my spreadsheet, I need to make up for the lost Exp in those three fights by having Nina be one of at most three survivors against Octo, and then having a couple other people dead at the end of Morteo/Toad.  If I do things right, Gremlin won't matter.  The Octo fight is long-ish and keeping Nina alive will be a pain, but he and Squid both give such an insane amount of Exp that I can't skip both of them.  If it's too slow to keep her alive, I'll use a Life2 near the end of the fight.

Also note that I'll be skipping the first two fights after I set sail from Auria, so I'll be missing out on ~1000 Exp per character that you might've factored into your run planning.

japanzaman

2010-06-30 05:20:14 pm

I see your point in how you will be missing out on those two battles worth of experience, so I'll just assume you know what you are talking about in terms of experience. However, I don't know if I can agree on getting Shin before Toad, unless you feel an AB will make up all the time spent going and getting him. If you can Mrbl1 him with Ox and Ryu, the times aren't all that different to an AB from my testing. It would take you at least 3 minutes to get Shin, and I wonder if you could actually make that time up in the Toad fight. Undecided

Quote:

was planning to have Nina use ATK-Up on Shin against Morteo

... this means you found a way to get Shin before getting Ox?

__sdfg

Edit history:

__sdfg: 2010-07-03 12:50:02 pm

2010-06-30 06:02:02 pm

D:

No, it means that I was really tired when I posted that and forget that (a) I can't get Shin before Ox, and (b) I had rearranged my plan to get Shin after fighting Toad.

Sorry for the confusion. :-[

Update: Hmm, I just threw a decent Gremlin segment in the trash by thinking I could get away without using an Herb on Ryu before Talon. I am not happy about that.

On the upside, I learned that you can beat Gremlin in about 3:35 if you're lucky.

__sdfg

2010-07-06 09:09:27 pm

D:

Bumping with my current Gremlin work-in-progress:

I obviously need to cut down on the mistakes in the second part of the segment. That should happen with practice. Any comments on the strategy?

Also, I think 3:35 may have been overly optimistic for Gremlin. 3:45 seems more reasonable.

japanzaman

2010-07-06 09:59:33 pm

Overall, you've got the right strategy. Now I guess you have a good idea how much fun a single segment run was. Wink

Anyway, get on an emulator and practice the second half of that run a little more. You need to be able to do that under pressure when you finally get the perfect Talon/Gremlin fight, and you may only get one shot. Some other things that stood out:

1) Bo should use Fry every single round. Use a herb with Hero if somebody needs healing. That second phase is pretty easy to predict who needs healing when, so there's no reason Bo shouldn't be able to be completely devoted to Fry.

2) You should move Nina to the front of the party when using the final Mrbl3 in the cave to Auria. Nitpicky, but it does save a second or two.

3) Getting the G. Tiara before talking to Ross allows you to meet him without taking the extra step upwards from my experience. Less steps is less time.

This is probably one of the toughest parts of the game execution wise, so getting through it will mean you'll have cleared one of the largest hurdles. I would also consider using the shopping sequence as a chance to clear out a little more inventory that you won't be using. You're going to want to start organizing soon, and this might be a good time to start.

Overall, you've got the right strategy. Now I guess you have a good idea how much fun a single segment run was. ;)

Anyway, get on an emulator and practice the second half of that run a little more. You need to be able to do that under pressure when you finally get the perfect Talon/Gremlin fight, and you may only get one shot. Some other things that stood out:

1) Bo should use Fry every single round. Use a herb with Hero if somebody needs healing. That second phase is pretty easy to predict who needs healing when, so there's no reason Bo shouldn't be able to be completely devoted to Fry.

2) You should move Nina to the front of the party when using the final Mrbl3 in the cave to Auria. Nitpicky, but it does save a second or two.

3) Getting the G. Tiara before talking to Ross allows you to meet him without taking the extra step upwards from my experience. Less steps is less time.

This is probably one of the toughest parts of the game execution wise, so getting through it will mean you'll have cleared one of the largest hurdles. I would also consider using the shopping sequence as a chance to clear out a little more inventory that you won't be using. You're going to want to start organizing soon, and this might be a good time to start.

__sdfg

2010-07-07 07:24:19 pm

D:

Quote from japanzaman:

Overall, you've got the right strategy. Now I guess you have a good idea how much fun a single segment run was. Wink

Yeah, that's why I didn't even want to try a single segment run. Tongue

Quote:

1) Bo should use Fry every single round. Use a herb with Hero if somebody needs healing. That second phase is pretty easy to predict who needs healing when, so there's no reason Bo shouldn't be able to be completely devoted to Fry.

Actually, there is a good reason. Gremlin has 600 HP in the second phase, which I can match by using Fry six times and E.Key four times. Getting by with only five Fries is very unlikely, so I would say six turns is the minimum number required.

The first phase ends right after Bo uses Fry, so he'll have at most 13 AP going into the second phase. This means that I need to use at least three Acorns on Bo for him to be able to use Fry six or more times. Four E.Keys plus three Acorns is seven, so if I really want to end the second phase in six turns, Nina has to use one of the E.Keys or Acorns. That would mean going a turn without healing anyone at all. I'll try it if everyone comes out of the first phase with a lot of health, but I think it's a long shot.

Quote:

2) You should move Nina to the front of the party when using the final Mrbl3 in the cave to Auria. Nitpicky, but it does save a second or two.

Absolutely right. I can't believe I missed that. Also, I should check if I can use a Mrbl3 coming out of the dragon shrine so I can move Bo in front at the same time.

Quote:

3) Getting the G. Tiara before talking to Ross allows you to meet him without taking the extra step upwards from my experience. Less steps is less time.

Hmm, I haven't tried that. I'll give it a shot.

Quote:

I would also consider using the shopping sequence as a chance to clear out a little more inventory that you won't be using. You're going to want to start organizing soon, and this might be a good time to start.

I pick up some junk in the next couple segments that I can't get rid of (Icicle, Fife, the Book that's supposed to represent Karn's confidence but takes up a space in my inventory anyway). I left a few items near the top to push said junk further down. I'll clean out the Herbs and stuff in Prima.

[quote="japanzaman"]
Overall, you've got the right strategy. Now I guess you have a good idea how much fun a single segment run was. ;)
[/quote]
Yeah, that's why I didn't even want to try a single segment run. :P

[quote]1) Bo should use Fry every single round. Use a herb with Hero if somebody needs healing. That second phase is pretty easy to predict who needs healing when, so there's no reason Bo shouldn't be able to be completely devoted to Fry.[/quote]
Actually, there is a good reason.  Gremlin has 600 HP in the second phase, which I can match by using Fry six times and E.Key four times.  Getting by with only five Fries is very unlikely, so I would say six turns is the minimum number required.

The first phase ends right after Bo uses Fry, so he'll have at most 13 AP going into the second phase.  This means that I need to use at least three Acorns on Bo for him to be able to use Fry six or more times.  Four E.Keys plus three Acorns is [i]seven[/i], so if I really want to end the second phase in six turns, Nina has to use one of the E.Keys or Acorns.  That would mean going a turn without healing anyone at all.  I'll try it if everyone comes out of the first phase with a lot of health, but I think it's a long shot.

[quote]2) You should move Nina to the front of the party when using the final Mrbl3 in the cave to Auria. Nitpicky, but it does save a second or two.[/quote]Absolutely right.  I can't believe I missed that.  Also, I should check if I can use a Mrbl3 coming out of the dragon shrine so I can move Bo in front at the same time.

[quote]3) Getting the G. Tiara before talking to Ross allows you to meet him without taking the extra step upwards from my experience. Less steps is less time.[/quote]
Hmm, I haven't tried that.  I'll give it a shot.

[quote]I would also consider using the shopping sequence as a chance to clear out a little more inventory that you won't be using. You're going to want to start organizing soon, and this might be a good time to start.[/quote]
I pick up some junk in the next couple segments that I can't get rid of (Icicle, Fife, the Book that's supposed to represent Karn's confidence but takes up a space in my inventory anyway).  I left a few items near the top to push said junk further down.  I'll clean out the Herbs and stuff in Prima.

japanzaman

2010-07-07 09:41:18 pm

Well, I can see your reasoning for the Gremlin fight, though I have to think getting a Fry in every time and getting all your E.Keys off could be possible. Finishing a round quicker would save you close to 15 seconds, so it might be worth trying for that if you can. If not, then I guess shoot for a single Cure.

I see why you would hold off on organizing until Prima. You get a few less items than I do in Auria so there really isn't any need until then. Good luck with this segment!

DoubleThink

2010-07-09 05:49:20 am

There's a word for that

I've just got back from holidays so I've been running around tearing my hair out trying to catch up on everything, but the progress on this segment so far looks really promising. Again I can only think of a couple of additional points that will probably turn out to be wrong:
-Is that last E.Key on Talon needed or can Ryu not pull 10 damage on his own?
-Is there no use for the PrisonCL hidden in the jail?

Axel Ryman

2010-07-09 06:03:36 am

We all scream for Eyes Cream

Quote from DoubleThink:

-Is there no use for the PrisonCL hidden in the jail?

Not unless they need an extra 20 Fate.

__sdfg

2010-07-10 11:16:41 am

D:

I cut about 20 seconds off the segment today, mostly by avoiding mistakes, but I ran out of disk space while recording, so I'm going to have to do it again (I still had the intermediate files lying around from when I encoded the last attempt for YouTube Angry

).

Ryu can do 10 HP damage to Talon, but he cannot do it reliably. I think he does 9 HP more often than not. I am willing to autobattle away the last 10 HP if I think Ryu can withstand two hits. If not, the time saved by autobattling one turn isn't worth potentially throwing away a successful Gremlin fight.

Axel is right about the PrisonCL. From my understanding, it would give someone a slight increase in critical hit percentage, with the downside of hardly giving them any defense. Nina and Karn have terrible armor anyway, so they're candidates, but I don't think the FATE boost is valuable enough for me to take the time to get it and equip it on either of them (it would also make Nina a lot faster, but she normally goes first because she casts magic, so that doesn't matter).

Also, I looked into the idea of having Bo Fry on every turn during the Gremlin fight some more. I think I can do it, but I need to have a phenomenally lucky first phase: either Bo and Nina both have to be at full health after the first phase, or Ryu needs to be at full health while the other two are maybe one hit down. If either situation ever comes up, I'll give it a shot.

I cut about 20 seconds off the segment today, mostly by avoiding mistakes, but I ran out of disk space while recording, so I'm going to have to do it again (I still had the intermediate files lying around from when I encoded the last attempt for YouTube >:( ).

Ryu can do 10 HP damage to Talon, but he cannot do it reliably.  I think he does 9 HP more often than not.  I am willing to autobattle away the last 10 HP if I think Ryu can withstand two hits.  If not, the time saved by autobattling one turn isn't worth potentially throwing away a successful Gremlin fight.

Axel is right about the PrisonCL.  From my understanding, it would give someone a slight increase in critical hit percentage, with the downside of hardly giving them any defense.  Nina and Karn have terrible armor anyway, so they're candidates, but I don't think the FATE boost is valuable enough for me to take the time to get it and equip it on either of them (it would also make Nina a lot faster, but she normally goes first because she casts magic, so that doesn't matter).

Also, I looked into the idea of having Bo Fry on every turn during the Gremlin fight some more.  I think I can do it, but I need to have a phenomenally lucky first phase:  either Bo and Nina both have to be at full health after the first phase, or Ryu needs to be at full health while the other two are maybe one hit down.  If either situation ever comes up, I'll give it a shot.

Axel Ryman

2010-07-10 12:03:13 pm

We all scream for Eyes Cream

Quote from __sdfg:

.
Axel is right about the PrisonCL. From my understanding, it would give someone a slight increase in critical hit percentage, with the downside of hardly giving them any defense. Nina and Karn have terrible armor anyway, so they're candidates, but I don't think the FATE boost is valuable enough for me to take the time to get it and equip it on either of them (it would also make Nina a lot faster, but she normally goes first because she casts magic, so that doesn't matter).

Well it could be of some use to Karn and his Transformations. If they get Criticals then they can deal a hefty amount of damage, especially in his later forms(Doof and Puka in particular).

__sdfg

Edit history:

__sdfg: 2010-07-10 05:21:21 pm

2010-07-10 02:04:49 pm

D:

Hmm, that is a good point. I went back and checked... Karn's Luck ranges from 51 to around 70-ish over the course of a speedrun, so +20 is a significant boost. The RPGDL page linked earlier in the thread suggested that the critical rate is FATE/510. It would be nice if someone with the elite ROM hacking skills could confirm that, but assuming it to be true, it might let me shoot for another Slam in some of the longer fights. I'll have to think about it.

EDIT: I just recorded a run (all of it, this time) about 17 seconds faster than the one on YouTube. I got the PrisnCL, so it was actually about as fast as the run I lost. I'd say this gives me a good starting point on which to improve. I still want to experiment with getting through the second phase in six rounds (as discussed previously) and/or killing Nina a few rounds before the end (which requires some planning to keep Bo and Ryu alive).

japanzaman

2010-07-12 07:08:04 am

If the critical hit rate is FATE/510 then you get about a 4% boost. Not really sure if that is worth sacrificing survivability for Karn, as an incredibly good battle could be ruined by dying and completely offset the gains. My gut says go with the sturdier setup and wait for the great battle to come.

Also, I am very aware of how difficult it is to get Fry off every round. However, it is possible to get through that first phase with everyone at max HP so it should at least be a realistic goal to shoot for.

Also, double check that DVD before you record! Shocked

DoubleThink

2010-07-12 07:45:03 pm

There's a word for that

Quote from japanzaman:

If the critical hit rate is FATE/510 then you get about a 4% boost. Not really sure if that is worth sacrificing survivability for Karn, as an incredibly good battle could be ruined by dying and completely offset the gains. My gut says go with the sturdier setup and wait for the great battle to come.

I'm don't remember it being mentioned that he actually gets better armour though...
*threadsearch*
Here is the only thing I could find, where you suggest giving him the IcySH and the HornHT, leaving his armour slot unchanged. If he never really gets an upgrade then it can't hurt to get it; otherwise it's a matter of whether a few extra crits would make up for potential extra healing, in which case I agree with you and it's probably not worth it.