Okage: Shadow King

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 06:44:04 pm

2014-01-13 06:43:35 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

Quote:

I plan on sharing every piece of data I come up with. When I hold the WR for this game, it's going to be because I'm a better gamer than you, not because I'm hiding stuff Wink (j/k)

Uhhh...okay....that sounds a bit antsy for a joke. Sad

Dabbit

2014-01-13 06:44:16 pm

Sorry, wasn't intentional. I have a strange sense of humor.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 06:48:24 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 06:47:16 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 06:46:35 pm

2014-01-13 06:45:32 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

I had a similar issue with damage. As far as doing damage it isn't calculated as a super-effective hit unless its an elemental attack. Normal attacks are neutral. It's Fire -> Electric -> Ice -> Fire. The bonus is also kind of small for that, didn't think it was worth going for really. Characters all have moves that are elemental, Flaming Tome, Flame Sword, Charged Parasol etc. Seriously I red that comment and I was kind of...freaking out? Was the word.

Dabbit

2014-01-13 06:50:39 pm

That's a good point. I was expecting a fairly linear damage progression, which is why I got so confused when I saw kisling getting a 70% damage boost from the combine attack. I can't come up with a rational explanation as to why he'd do that much damage, other than I screwed up somewhere. I probably won't have much of a chance to sit down and collect any numbers until this weekend, but i'll let you know what I come up with.

Again, sorry for the bad joke. It sounded better in my head.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 06:52:49 pm

2014-01-13 06:51:26 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

Also, here is something about EXP in this game. It seems the only serious study on its system that I came across. http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps2/471237-okage-shadow-king/faqs/19008 I bring it up because of something said underneath rule 5 labeled "NOTE:". Being lower level, gets you more exp. This means grinding at all is often very bad due to how fast and spikey leveling up is. You could actually come out of a dungeon with a higher level if you enter it with a lower one.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 07:01:42 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 07:00:17 pm

2014-01-13 06:57:42 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

Also I have attempted to program games in C++ like this one and know that there are 2 stat determiners in an RPG: Base stats, and starter stats. Starter stats are a character's stats at level 1, but Base stats determine level up increases. Ari has the highest base stats in the game, with even better HP, Attack, Def and Magic than Rosalyn, but they give him bad starter stats while giving Rosalyn high starter stats. It all doesn't even out until around level 30 though.

Quote:

I got so confused when I saw kisling getting a 70% damage boost from the combine attack.

Might have been a crit. Also characters are said to gain a slight increase in damage if they all attack at once. Combining is so commonly used throughout the game but it seems hard to do in bosses.

Dabbit

2014-01-13 07:20:36 pm

The xp thing is interesting. I have a save that I did my encounter chance testing on, doing 100 battles in each of the first two areas, took me an extra 8 hours and those guys are only 2-3 levels higher than my speedrun save Smiley

My initial thought was also criticals, but his damage was actually fairly consistent across 10 combine attacks. When you do the combine attack, the damage values that show up on screen all pop up whenever the attackers animation calls for it, so they fairly often overlap. So, I'm guessing that I switched Ari's and Kislings damage numbers.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 07:37:49 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 07:35:58 pm

2014-01-13 07:34:43 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

These last 2 bosses are quite frustrating and have been trolling me hard for a long time. There are parts of this game where the fastest way is found simply by finding something that works without circle healing involved.....VEK and Beilloune are nightmares underleveled. It feels like good attempts are so rare its hard to do the same thing over and over to determine whats fastest with these guys.

Dabbit

2014-01-13 07:41:00 pm

I completely understand. I installed the emulator to try and test those kinds of things easier, but my PC runs it at something like 2.5 frames/second. I think we're going to need a lot of patience with this game. I'm only a bit after BEK, I'll try to get to those guys soon, see if I can come up with anything. I doubt I'll have any major revelations, but I'll try my best.

Equinox

2014-01-13 07:48:25 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

Same thing happened to me. I turned it off cuz I thought my computer was going to get raped. Thought the save anywhere would be ideal for testing bosses.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 08:21:00 pm

2014-01-13 08:18:14 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

The thought that some of these bosses are going to be 100+ resets in the real deal is maddening enough, but the real issue is that some of them have dungeons before them. Running back to the top to save wastes considerable time. The dungeon I am going to hate doing this the most in is Big Tree Hole.

I mapped out all the dungeons already in paint and they are pretty linear. There should be no controversy about the fastest pathing inside of them. The only real puzzle is those damn urns.

Dabbit

2014-01-13 08:23:30 pm

Guidance jewels always take you back to the save point, right? That's at least something, but I agree, still not anywhere close to ideal. What in particular is puzzling about the urns? The best way to kill them, or the fastest way to hit all of them?

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 08:38:06 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 08:29:41 pm

2014-01-13 08:28:11 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

Fastest way to kill them, and yes guidance jewels are needed but not usable everywhere. There are really only 2 dungeons I didn't completely test urn killing, they are Aquatic Ruins and Escapeless Abyss, everywhere else I am sure I thoroughly tested them.

Dabbit

Edit history:

Dabbit: 2014-01-13 08:39:05 pm

2014-01-13 08:38:10 pm

I did some testing on the urns in the aquatic ruins, i don't have all of the data yet, but the single fastest time I got was by doing a combine attack with all 3 members, then 1 normal attack killed them. A combine attack with all 3 after they've gained a few levels (say the last 2 urns or so) killed them in one shot.

Also, I'm interested in the maps you drew. I was planning on posting this: http://i.imgur.com/YxYVOmT.png after I had created some more (it's the only one I have currently). I don't want to duplicate work you may have already done, so if you think yours are better, would you mind showing me? If you think mine are better, please just let me know and I'll create more when I get to them.

The map I drew is of the 2nd floor of the aquatic ruins.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 09:09:11 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 09:08:55 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 09:07:19 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 09:06:50 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 09:03:17 pm

2014-01-13 09:02:13 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

I don't know whose are better. Mine look similar to the minimap in game with a bit more detail on impassable terrain. I Don't believe I drew maps of Aquatic Ruins and Sealed Cave because they seemed too easy for the trouble but I could be wrong because I did try to make an Aquatic Ruins one. Escapeless Abyss, Big Tree Hole, Madril Sewer, Deep Grave Pit and Ruined City are the ones I have detailed maps of. ~~Hang on a second and let me get the Escapeless Abyss one.~~ Ehh the way I was gonna attach that didn't seem to work really. How did you attach yours?

Dabbit

2014-01-13 09:15:20 pm

I just created a free account on imgur and uploaded it.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 09:29:54 pm

2014-01-13 09:29:15 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

http://i.imgur.com/ShVEVI5.png was trying imageshack and it was different from when I remember. Smiley

I have the soundtrack for this game and I could give it to you if you wanted but I would have to find out how.

Dabbit

Edit history:

Dabbit: 2014-01-13 09:39:04 pm

2014-01-13 09:38:51 pm

Hahaha, oh man that dungeon is confusing. Yours is better than mine would be, because each object is much easier to understand, but the main problem (at least for me) is understanding which set of stairs leads where. Would it be possible to do something like [stair down icon]A, then on the other floor [Stair Up icon] A, etc etc?

And thank you very much for the offer, but I already have a copy of the soundtrack.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 09:47:33 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 09:47:12 pm

Equinox: 2014-01-13 09:45:46 pm

2014-01-13 09:45:12 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

There is actually, yellow stairs means down, white means up. Might be hard to see though, bad choice of colors. The entire thing is on a grid of squares anyway so we both had the right idea. My maps are not completely proportional though unfortunately, so yours have merit. My maps should also have numbers on the switches but the later ones are color coded better. Some of the floors end up having as many as 6-8 switches on them.

Dabbit

2014-01-13 09:55:20 pm

I'm sorry, I wasn't very clear. I meant that there should be a way to show that if you go down the staircase in this room, you'll appear in this other room. Which rooms are connected, that is. The maps don't appear to line up 1 for 1, so having something specific like that would help me out.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-13 10:05:33 pm

2014-01-13 10:04:34 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

Each set of 4 by 5 grids lines up. If you stacked them all on top of one another the way they are side by side then they line up. Kinda hard to see though.

Equinox

Edit history:

Equinox: 2014-01-14 07:03:40 am

Equinox: 2014-01-14 07:01:39 am

Equinox: 2014-01-14 06:59:27 am

Equinox: 2014-01-14 06:57:52 am

2014-01-14 06:57:01 am

Obsessicus Parrotus

I'm gonna upload a successful Beilloune attempt once I compare the best times between these 2 groups. This fight is ridiculous with how close you come to dying every 15 seconds. One wrong move and its over and the menuing is the toughest I have seen in the game next to some gear changing segments. My best time so far on him is 6:35. One group beats him every time with the current strat, but the other is very luck reliant. Also I am positive this guys dps slowly increases as he takes more damage. 9999 HP is nothing to gawk at.

Speedruns are timed until the last moment of player control. In this case it is going through the last bit of text before Beilloune flees, right before the characters evacuate the falling Library. The text that follows is automated and cannot be sped up or altered by player control thus that is the end of the run.

Dabbit

2014-01-14 09:56:03 am

I guess I just need to stare at the map some more. Is the timer start at selecting new game, or after choosing Ari's name?

I've come up with a small handful of strats to test out this weekend against the urns in the Aquatic Ruins. Because the group will be leveling up after every urn, I'll be retesting the top 3 strats or so with every urn, until hitting the point where there's only the best one remaining (which I've already confirmed is combine attack with all 3 members). They are:

1) Normal attack with everyone.
2) Overdrive Rosalyn + Normal attack.
3) Overdrive Rosalyn and Kisling + Normal attack
4) Combine attack with 2 people (+ overdrive?)
5) Combine attack with 3 people

I'm planning on just straight up cutting a strat as soon as it's obvious it's not going to be the fastest, so this shouldn't take TOO long to do.

And I am really looking forward to that video! Smiley

Equinox

2014-01-14 10:35:37 am

Obsessicus Parrotus

Timer starts at first moment of control so...maybe. I meant to ask about that. I would refrain from naming him anything else though. I have had enough of this for now. The kind of mechanics I uncovered will be shown in the video.

Equinox

2014-01-14 05:27:16 pm

Obsessicus Parrotus

I remembered something, for RPGs with an in game timer they go by that except for the last segment where they add real time to it. At least this is how they used to do it when I found this site and it might have changed. The only problem is that there is no second timer sooo there may be a question about that.

I want to apologize if I may have seemed a bit too introverted earlier. Talking about boss strats and being secret and stuff was...silly. I am a very impish person and this is the first time I have ever worked with someone on a run. Typically people show some interest then peeter out after a little while but I am really happy someone else is showing consistent interest. You probably made that joke cuz of what I said and it is silly. As I said, I am an unhealthy obsessive. Tongue

I will have that attempt up when I make absolutely sure the fastest group for the boss works with the bit of the run before it which isn't a long shot really. Looks like we are talking about seconds here and I was forced to go back to VEK.

I remembered something, for RPGs with an in game timer they go by that except for the last segment where they add real time to it. At least this is how they used to do it when I found this site and it might have changed. The only problem is that there is no second timer sooo there may be a question about that.

I want to apologize if I may have seemed a bit too introverted earlier. Talking about boss strats and being secret and stuff was...silly. I am a very impish person and this is the first time I have ever worked with someone on a run. Typically people show some interest then peeter out after a little while but I am really happy someone else is showing consistent interest. You probably made that joke cuz of what I said and it is silly. As I said, I am an unhealthy obsessive. :P

I will have that attempt up when I make absolutely sure the fastest group for the boss works with the bit of the run before it which isn't a long shot really. Looks like we are talking about seconds here and I was forced to go back to VEK.