Zelda II: The Adventure of Link

presjpolk

Edit history:

presjpolk: 2013-06-17 07:22:38 am

presjpolk: 2013-06-17 07:22:02 am

presjpolk: 2013-06-17 07:16:45 am

2013-06-17 07:15:43 am

HELLO!

In my mind, any% glitch *is* any%.

I mean hey, if SDA want to separate those out, such that we have:

any% deathless
any% no-OOB up-a
any%
100% deathless
100% All Keys
100%
NG+ up-a
NG+ no-OOB up-a

Then that just leaves any% no door fairying to worm on in. Smiley

Also, don't forget there's PAL *and* FDS. Though each would have fewer categories, since you can't scroll lock on FDS, which eliminates the major skips categories. And you can't fairy through doors at all in PAL v2.

PS how do you do no Jump, no downstab? In Palace 7 don't you either have to go right, needing downstab and glove, or go left, and need at least jump to get over the wall?

Solairflaire

2013-06-17 08:01:36 am

Quote from presjpolk:

PS how do you do no Jump, no downstab? In Palace 7 don't you either have to go right, needing downstab and glove, or go left, and need at least jump to get over the wall?

I did say or, not and.

presjpolk

2013-06-17 08:30:11 am

HELLO!

My mistake. Smiley

presjpolk

2013-06-17 09:39:34 am

HELLO!

Thinking on the train. In the extreme Zelda 2 categories fill a 3D table of options. One axis is region (us eu JP) one axis is collection rate (any, low,100, ak) and the third is options allowed (deathless, 1cc, up-a, glitch).

The question for sda is which fraction of the categories are interesting and relevant.

Svenne

2013-06-17 09:58:53 am

Smörgåsbord

I want to keep the SDA Any% Deathless category as it is because it has a great history and is without a doubt the hardest category. I just needed to say that! Wink

Myask/eternaljwh

2013-08-10 12:09:57 am

I finished cataloguing killed enemies and XP on the All-Keys 100% route, up to the Great Palace.

http://pastebin.com/dY8ZS1np

on the Great Palace itself:

(The Great Palace is rather boring for these purposes, as speedrunners generally kill...one to four Golden Ras[20 ea, smalldrops], two Purple Myus[smalldrops], Thunderbird[1000 xp], and Dark Link. Additionally, a Red Fokka("dreadhawk") [a mere 70! each on US version, I believe], two Blue Fokkas[200? ea], three Fokkeru [200 ea], a Purple Bot[10, smalldrops], five-ish Fire Arnels [20 ea, small drops] and a Giant Purple Bot[makes 5 Purple Bots] are passed. As before, enemies in parentheses are either randomly-able-to-be-killed, randomly generated, or simply usually-not-killed by the speedrunner.

Which makes the GP subtotal Thunderbird's 1000 and change. I usually use this with the ~1500 from the Valley of Death to get Life 7 [8-8-7] post-Thunderbird, but nobody else does.

presjpolk

2013-08-10 12:26:03 am

HELLO!

I can't imagine stopping to kill all the P7 monsters myself, in any category.

inzult

2013-08-10 04:55:36 pm

Generally, I think runners stop to kill too many enemies as is! I have no doubt the top guys could get by with a few fewer levels.

Myask

2013-08-13 06:47:27 pm

Yes, that's why they're in parentheses in the version my work ethic required I do that included them, when I checked the XP values of each too:

http://pastebin.com/3vViNJQG

Blue and red fokkas don't drop anything, correct?

presjpolk

Edit history:

presjpolk: 2013-08-17 01:14:05 am

2013-08-14 06:36:10 am

HELLO!

Correct, neither is in the big 6.

http://redcandle.us/Zelda_II:_The_Adventure_of_Link#Drops_and_6_Counts

EDIT: Ha. For months I'd been linking people to the drop chart. Turns out I'd Typoed saving it, and made a PSD instead of a PNG. So if you weren't in Safari on MacOS, you couldn't see it. *sob* Fixed now

Svenne

2013-08-15 01:52:13 pm

Smörgåsbord

Fellas, he did it! He cut the one hour. 0:59:59 Any% Deathless. He is done with this game or so he says!

nayon

2013-08-15 01:53:53 pm

Quote from presjpolk:

Thinking on the train. In the extreme Zelda 2 categories fill a 3D table of options. One axis is region (us eu JP) one axis is collection rate (any, low,100, ak) and the third is options allowed (deathless, 1cc, up-a, glitch).

The question for sda is which fraction of the categories are interesting and relevant.

I feel like the JP version is different enough (due to leveling and death system changes) that it deserves to be its own category.

charleon

2013-08-15 02:05:14 pm

What is a man?

Quote from Svenne:

Fellas, he did it! He cut the one hour. 0:59:59 Any% Deathless. He is done with this game or so he says!

Holy mother of gooses! JN you are god! congratulations!

nmaster64

2013-08-15 02:27:28 pm

Quote from Svenne:

Fellas, he did it! He cut the one hour. 0:59:59 Any% Deathless. He is done with this game or so he says!

Holy. Crap.

The skills of legends.

A-M

2013-08-15 06:29:58 pm

Congrats JN ! The end was intense ^^

presjpolk

2013-08-15 11:51:45 pm

HELLO!

Quote from nayon:

Quote from presjpolk:

Thinking on the train. In the extreme Zelda 2 categories fill a 3D table of options. One axis is region (us eu JP) one axis is collection rate (any, low,100, ak) and the third is options allowed (deathless, 1cc, up-a, glitch).

The question for sda is which fraction of the categories are interesting and relevant.

I feel like the JP version is different enough (due to leveling and death system changes) that it deserves to be its own category.

I agree, but I'm not sure all Japanese version categories are really worth running. But if someone did, they definitely should be their own categories.

Garrison

2013-08-15 11:53:20 pm

Congrats to pro_jn, truly a great accomplishment

Chumlum

2013-08-16 05:53:15 am

An absolutely astounding achievement. A+

coolkid

2013-08-16 06:31:00 am

Epic_Jn

PJ

2013-08-16 06:48:30 am

Is PJ

Wow, way to go Pro_JN! That's incredible. Cheesy

dxtr

2013-08-16 08:45:05 am

Speedrunner

JN!!!!

Pass over the thread to someone more active.

Presjpolk maybe?

presjpolk

2013-08-16 01:11:45 pm

HELLO!

Oh actually I was just saying it may be safe for me to try any% again. Smiley

presjpolk

2013-08-26 08:34:13 pm

HELLO!

I've owed Solairflaire this test for about a month. http://www.twitch.tv/presjpolk/b/451972379

Myask/eternaljwh

2013-09-06 08:17:16 pm

traced encounter walk AI. Starts at 8423. (randomwalk is at 8488, literally just uses RNG to decide X -or-Y and +/- with two of its bits)

in pseudocode...

FOREACH encounter
-if (encounter is fairy) randomwalk (and go back to top of loop)
-if (global? framecount mod 256 <64) randomwalk (and go back to top of loop)
-if (0x70 - encounter's Y + Link's Y + 0x10 >= 0x20) GOTO LABEL
-if (enc's X - Link's X < 0x84) choose Right (and go back to top of loop)
--else choose Left (and go back to top of loop)
LABEL
-if (0x84 - enc's X + link's X + 0x10 >= 0x20) randomwalk (and go back to top of loop)
-if (enc's Y - Link's Y < 0x70) choose Down (and go back to top of loop)
--else choose Up

I'm still a little uncertain of my 8-bit arithmetic, so I left them as-is; I'll post my messier-commented notes which are much less translated in a bit.

Myask/eternaljwh

2013-09-06 08:34:42 pm

less clear for most:
Relevant addresses:

(on overworld)
12: framecounter
7f: Link's "relative" Y-pos in pixels, overworld
fd: screen position (X) in pixels thus a shorthand for Link's X position relative to map tiles
0203: unknown? seems to always be 0x84 on overworld from (very limited) testing; no other writes found on overworld

==unverified:==
4e:x (575) [82]
-2a:y (567)
4f:x (576) [83]
-2b:y (568)
==verified:==
50:x (577) [84]
-2c:y (569)
51:x (578) [85]
-2d:y (570)
52: xs (579) [86]
-2e: y (571)
53: X? (57a) [87]
-2f: Y? (572)
54: X. (57b) [88]
-30: y. (573)
55: X? (57c) [89]
-linked y: 31 (574)

thus

"$2a,x": y of encounters (2a-31)
"$4e,x": x of encounters (4e-55), filled 55 down, it seems
[both of above appear to be 128-based? locking to 0 will yield every-8-tiles immobile clumps]
"$575,x": X-vel of encounters
"$56d,X": y-vel of encounters
"$50e,x": timer of encounter.
"$82,x": encounter type. 00: inactive; 01: easy; 02: hard; 03: fairy. Nonstandard types result in Hard (and randomwalk), it seems?

8423-loop: zero the xvel, yvel of encounters. only done when monsters SHOULD change direction.
check each encountertype($82,x), branch to 8435 if nonzero. Else, deX[so check next encounter slot down], and loop. On finishing, JMP 8332
8435: compare to 3 (fairy?), if carry set (>=3) branch to 8488
if not, load $12(?), subtract x40 (64), bcc (<64) to..8488
subtract 70 from "$2a,x"[enc-y]t with carry (30 becomes B0)
clear carry, adc $7f (??? is 0 here)
clear carry, adc x10, compare x20, bcs (>=20) to 8464 [x70-enc's Y+link's Y+0x10 >= 0x20]
(else)ldy 1 (+), lda "$4e,x" (enc-x)
sec, sbc $Fd, cmp $0203 (??), bcc (<) $845D [enc-x - link's x < 84]
ELSE, ldy xFF
[845d] tya, sta "$0575,x" x-vel of encounter; loop back to 842f
(8464)lda $0203 (?), set carry, sbc $4e,x(x-encounter)
clear carry, adc $fd(? is 50 here)
clear carry, adc x10, compare x20, bcs to 8488 [0x84 - enc's X + link's X + 0x10 >=0x20]
ldy 1
lda $2a,x(y-enc), set carry, sbc $7f(?), cmp x70, bcc 8481
IF NOT, ldy FF,
(8481) tya, (acc = ff), STA $56d,x(!) and loop back to 842f (which hits next X down, then goes back to 8423)

8488:ldy 1, lda $51B,x (?? x is still which-encounter though) [=9d]
If plus, leave y 1. if minus, make y FF.
AND x04, bne 84a1 [bit 4 is are-you-moving-x-or-y??]
IF NOT, tya (+/-1), sta $056d,x(!);clc, adc $2a,x(!);sta $2a,x; and loop back to 842f
84a1: tya (+/-1), sta $575,x(!); clc, adc $4e,x(!);sta $4e,x and loop back to 842f

==this checks for despawning and does so==
8332: set x 7, store it in $80 (?),
8336(loop) load "$050e,x" (timer)
BEQ(if zero) 833f (->840b)
load "$82,x" (enc-type)
bne(nonzero) 8342
else JMP 840b
840b: zero enc-type, enc-timer, deX, stx $80(?), bmi 841A (loop terminate) else JMP 8336

==what is probably the update-the-sprites-function==
8342: txa (encounter number), asl x4, tay (so Y is high-shifted encounter index)
lda $2a, x (enc-y); clc; adc $56d,x (enc-yvel); sta $2a,x(enc-y)
sec, sbc $7f (?); sta $280,y; sta $284,y
lda $4e, x (enc-x); clc; adc $575,x (enc-xvel); sta $4e,x(enc-x)
sec, sbc $Fd (?); sta $283,y; clc, adc x08; sta $287,y
TXA, PHA (push accumulator to stack!)
lda $12 (?), and x08, LSRx2 (so, x20 or x00), sta $07(?)
lda $82,x (enc-type), transfer to X(!), dex.
lda $8281,x (8281 for weak, 8282 for strong, 8283 for fairy...)
sta $282,y; $286,y
txa, aslx2, clc, adc $07(stored above), tax
(...@838b is where I stopped tracing this function)

less clear for most:
Relevant addresses:
[hidden](on overworld)
12: framecounter
7f: Link's "relative" Y-pos in pixels, overworld
fd: screen position (X) in pixels thus a shorthand for Link's X position relative to map tiles
0203: unknown? seems to always be 0x84 on overworld from (very limited) testing; no other writes found on overworld

==unverified:==
4e:x   (575) [82]
-2a:y   (567)
4f:x   (576) [83]
-2b:y   (568)
==verified:== 
50:x   (577) [84]
-2c:y   (569)
51:x   (578) [85]
-2d:y   (570)
52: xs (579) [86]
-2e: y  (571)
53: X? (57a) [87]
-2f: Y? (572)
54: X. (57b) [88]
-30: y. (573)
55: X? (57c) [89]
-linked y: 31 (574)

thus

"$2a,x": y of encounters (2a-31)
"$4e,x": x of encounters (4e-55), filled 55 down, it seems
[both of above appear to be 128-based? locking to 0 will yield every-8-tiles immobile clumps]
"$575,x": X-vel of encounters
"$56d,X": y-vel of encounters
"$50e,x": timer of encounter.
"$82,x":  encounter type. 00: inactive; 01: easy; 02: hard; 03: fairy. Nonstandard types result in Hard (and randomwalk), it seems?[/hidden]
[hidden]8423-loop: zero the xvel, yvel of encounters. only done when monsters SHOULD change direction.
check each encountertype($82,x), branch to 8435 if nonzero. Else, deX[so check next encounter slot down], and loop. On finishing, JMP 8332
8435: compare to 3 (fairy?), if carry set (>=3) branch to 8488
if not, load $12(?), subtract x40 (64), bcc (<64) to..8488
subtract 70 from "$2a,x"[enc-y]t with carry (30 becomes B0)
clear carry, adc $7f (??? is 0 here)
clear carry, adc x10, compare x20, bcs (>=20) to 8464 [x70-enc's Y+link's Y+0x10 >= 0x20]
(else)ldy 1 (+), lda "$4e,x" (enc-x)
sec, sbc $Fd, cmp $0203 (??), bcc (<) $845D [enc-x - link's x < 84]
ELSE, ldy xFF
[845d] tya, sta "$0575,x" x-vel of encounter; loop back to 842f
(8464)lda $0203 (?), set carry, sbc $4e,x(x-encounter)
clear carry, adc $fd(? is 50 here)
clear carry, adc x10, compare x20, bcs to 8488 [0x84 - enc's X + link's X + 0x10 >=0x20]
ldy 1
lda $2a,x(y-enc), set carry, sbc $7f(?), cmp x70, bcc 8481 
IF NOT, ldy FF,
(8481) tya, (acc = ff), STA $56d,x(!) and loop back to 842f (which hits next X down, then goes back to 8423)

8488:ldy 1, lda $51B,x (?? x is still which-encounter though) [=9d]
If plus, leave y 1. if minus, make y FF.
AND x04, bne 84a1 [bit 4 is are-you-moving-x-or-y??]
IF NOT, tya (+/-1), sta $056d,x(!);clc, adc $2a,x(!);sta $2a,x; and loop back to 842f
84a1: tya (+/-1), sta $575,x(!); clc, adc $4e,x(!);sta $4e,x and loop back to 842f

==this checks for despawning and does so==
8332: set x 7, store it in $80 (?),
8336(loop) load "$050e,x" (timer)
BEQ(if zero) 833f (->840b)
load "$82,x" (enc-type)
bne(nonzero) 8342
else JMP 840b
840b: zero enc-type, enc-timer, deX, stx $80(?), bmi 841A (loop terminate) else JMP 8336

==what is probably the update-the-sprites-function==
8342: txa (encounter number), asl x4, tay (so Y is high-shifted encounter index)
lda $2a, x (enc-y); clc; adc $56d,x (enc-yvel); sta $2a,x(enc-y) 
sec, sbc $7f (?); sta $280,y; sta $284,y
lda $4e, x (enc-x); clc; adc $575,x (enc-xvel); sta $4e,x(enc-x)
sec, sbc $Fd (?); sta $283,y; clc, adc x08; sta $287,y
TXA, PHA (push accumulator to stack!)
lda $12 (?), and x08, LSRx2 (so, x20 or x00), sta $07(?)
lda $82,x (enc-type), transfer to X(!), dex.
lda $8281,x (8281 for weak, 8282 for strong, 8283 for fairy...)
sta $282,y; $286,y
txa, aslx2, clc, adc $07(stored above), tax
(...@838b is where I stopped tracing this function)[/hidden]