Zelda II: The Adventure of Link

Svenne

Edit history:

Svenne: 2012-12-13 02:54:59 am

Svenne: 2012-12-13 02:51:06 am

2012-12-13 02:42:47 am

Smörgåsbord

Big congrats to John! Smiley

Now he has both the records on 100% and Any% SDA categories, he also got them recorded especially for SDA!

There now exist a #Zelda2 channel on SDA irc for those who are interested in learning this game and wants to know what's up.

dxtr

2012-12-13 05:09:20 am

Speedrunner

Wow, he's really pushing this! Great stuff!

l34ssl3oost

2012-12-14 03:28:41 pm

The video breaks for me around the 37 minute mark. is the problem on my end?

Svenne

2012-12-14 03:47:39 pm

Smörgåsbord

If it does not work, it is now on YouTube:

cak

2012-12-14 11:04:03 pm

twitch.tv/ccaakk

Awesome run.

Arctic_Eagle

2012-12-16 04:48:55 pm

Congrats to Pro JN, fantastic run!!! (The Twitch video broke for me too, 36.11 on the split timer).

presjpolk

Edit history:

presjpolk: 2013-01-14 12:51:14 pm

2013-01-14 12:50:46 pm

HELLO!

I'm going to try running Any% Up+A with major skips. Tips on executing the healer and fairy OOB glitches appreciated. Smiley

Also, congratulations to Arctic for regaining the 100% Extreme Rules crown. Smiley

inzult

2013-01-14 05:47:35 pm

Ok I think I got this thing pretty much figured out enough that I can diagram it. The two important key presses are both pressing b to initiate dialogue with the healer. For specifically shield town's healer, you want to aim for here and here:

9 steps and 1 step from the door respectively. As feasel mentioned, she takes two frames to move one step. For the first dialogue box you want to press B on the first frame she is 9 steps away. For the second dialogue box you want to press B on the last frame she is 1 step away. So this is indeed, two one-frame tricks.

Once you choose to clear the first dialogue box you have to press B again exactly 26 frames later. So be ready Smiley

Link's position is important, but you can be off by a bit and it will still work. As long as you're close enough to talk but not too far past the door you should be fine. Link does not have to be facing left.

After she goes into the house for the first time, the timing changes. So if (when) you miss it, you can reset her by exiting to the left and returning. People have said that they could get it to work but I haven't pinned down the timing.

If anyone has anything to add, please do so! Or, if I have anything wrong feel free to correct me :p

(this) townsperson's x position: $0053

Ok I think I got this thing pretty much figured out enough that I can diagram it. The two important key presses are both pressing b to initiate dialogue with the healer. For specifically shield town's healer, you want to aim for here and here:

[img]http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/5774/hglitch.png[/img]

9 steps and 1 step from the door respectively. As feasel mentioned, she takes two frames to move one step. For the first dialogue box you want to press B on the first frame she is 9 steps away. For the second dialogue box you want to press B on the last frame she is 1 step away. So this is indeed, two one-frame tricks.

Once you choose to clear the first dialogue box you have to press B again exactly 26 frames later. So be ready :)

Link's position is important, but you can be off by a bit and it will still work. As long as you're close enough to talk but not too far past the door you should be fine. Link does not have to be facing left.

After she goes into the house for the first time, the timing changes. So if (when) you miss it, you can reset her by exiting to the left and returning. People have said that they could get it to work but I haven't pinned down the timing.

If anyone has anything to add, please do so! Or, if I have anything wrong feel free to correct me :p

(this) townsperson's x position: $0053

presjpolk

2013-01-14 06:01:45 pm

HELLO!

Thanks very much. This weekend should be interesting. Smiley

presjpolk

Edit history:

presjpolk: 2013-01-15 09:15:22 pm

presjpolk: 2013-01-15 09:10:33 pm

2013-01-15 08:53:24 pm

HELLO!

Well I just confirmed you can get to glitch town that way on Virtual Console.

YES.

Edit: Aaand I realize I don't know what to do once I've got it. I can get scroll lock but I can't seem to wrong warp.

Feasel was right. Glitching the healer in Rauru (Shield town) isn't so bad because you've got the texture to line yourself up. It's just a long enough delay she has to walk that you can't just mash. Real rhythm thing, but doable.

Bedtime though. Stayed up way too late doing this as it is. I'll pay for it tomorrow, heh.

presjpolk

Edit history:

presjpolk: 2013-01-16 08:10:53 pm

2013-01-16 07:48:42 pm

HELLO!

So I was wondering why JN didn't scroll lock before doing the hammer.

Um, yeah. Apparently if you're scroll locked and try to enter octarok cave from the right... you spawn over lava. Which means... you keep dying until you game over.

Edit: I want a raft skip so freaking bad. Hammer seems mandatory to get enough magic containers for tbird skip, but i want that raft skip.

scaryice

2013-01-16 09:38:45 pm

Quote from presjpolk:

Edit: I want a raft skip so freaking bad. Hammer seems mandatory to get enough magic containers for tbird skip, but i want that raft skip.

If you're doing the healer glitch, you don't need the raft. Did you not see the route video I posted here:

http://forum.speeddemosarchive.com/post/zelda_ii_the_adventure_of_link_157.html#zelda_ii_the_adventure_of_link_157

presjpolk

2013-01-16 10:03:05 pm

HELLO!

I knew it, I knew it. I knew there was some post I wasn't finding in this now-giant thread. Thank you. Guessing I missed it because it wasn't a video. Smiley

*watching*

Interesting. You don't get the hammer container.

The Daira fights so low level will take practice, but with this you skip the rooms I hate most, honestly. Jump cave included.

OK that palace 2 is the best thing ever.

Hmm. so how do you get to the eastern continent.

Oh you get the magic container then...

... Oh. oh wow I hadn't tried that yet. Wow. OK. Nice.

Thanks for the link!

Heidrage

2013-01-16 10:05:02 pm

Willing to teach you the impossible

lol

presjpolk

Edit history:

presjpolk: 2013-01-18 05:33:04 pm

presjpolk: 2013-01-18 05:30:13 pm

2013-01-18 05:28:03 pm

HELLO!

So, there's a red jar at the start of the Valley of Death, and sometimes it doesn't show. This is bad.

Inzult had found the memory location, but we never figured out what set it or cleared it.

Twitch user fiskbit has a theory, and I think it fits all the observations we've had about it. From #zelda2:

Quote:

09:15 < Fiskbit> The highest bit of $71FB tracks whether the red jar has been collected. Normally, it is cleared when you use the
raft to reach the second continent and set if you take the red jar (technically, it is set when you enter the room
and only cleared if you leave it and didn't collect the red jar).
09:15 < Fiskbit> If you encounter a large enemy on a safe square, the game will clear and then set the bit until you leave that
encounter, at which point it may clear the bit again. Whether it does this is determined by the direction you left
the last side-view room that contained scrolling ($071F). If you left that room to the right, the bit will remain
in a set state, and if to the left, it will be cleared.
09:15 < Fiskbit> So, the jar will not appear if you encounter a large enemy on a safe square after leaving the previous side-view
area that contained scrolling to the right. Using this, you can not only ensure that you can collect the jar once,
but you could potentially cause it to respawn.
09:15 < Fiskbit> Note that I came across a few large enemy encounters on the safe square that didn't seem to touch the bit at all,
and I don't know why. There may also be things that change this bit elsewhere in the game.

As I understand it, the upshot is that you have to pay attention whenever you get a hard/large encounter on a road/safe square after crossing in the raft. You must leave the next scrolling encounter to the LEFT.

Edit: as I'm thinking about it, if you get the skip after the river demon, you possibly hose yourself, since that's an encounter on a safe square, and the next encounter you exit right, not left.

So, there's a red jar at the start of the Valley of Death, and sometimes it doesn't show.  This is bad.

Inzult had found the memory location, but we never figured out what set it or cleared it.

Twitch user fiskbit has a theory, and I think it fits all the observations we've had about it. From #zelda2:

[quote]
09:15 < Fiskbit> The highest bit of $71FB tracks whether the red jar has been collected. Normally, it is cleared when you use the 
                 raft to reach the second continent and set if you take the red jar (technically, it is set when you enter the room
                 and only cleared if you leave it and didn't collect the red jar).
09:15 < Fiskbit> If you encounter a large enemy on a safe square, the game will clear and then set the bit until you leave that
                 encounter, at which point it may clear the bit again. Whether it does this is determined by the direction you left
                 the last side-view room that contained scrolling ($071F). If you left that room to the right, the bit will remain
                 in a set state, and if to the left, it will be cleared.
09:15 < Fiskbit> So, the jar will not appear if you encounter a large enemy on a safe square after leaving the previous side-view
                 area that contained scrolling to the right. Using this, you can not only ensure that you can collect the jar once,
                 but you could potentially cause it to respawn.
09:15 < Fiskbit> Note that I came across a few large enemy encounters on the safe square that didn't seem to touch the bit at all, 
                 and I don't know why. There may also be things that change this bit elsewhere in the game.
[/quote]

As I understand it, the upshot is that you have to pay attention whenever you get a hard/large encounter on a road/safe square after crossing in the raft.  You must leave the next scrolling encounter to the LEFT.

Edit: as I'm thinking about it, if you get the skip after the river demon, you possibly hose yourself, since that's an encounter on a safe square, and the next encounter you exit right, not left.

scaryice

2013-01-18 05:46:50 pm

If you do get the skip, couldn't you just quickly exit the second square by going left and reentering?

presjpolk

2013-01-18 06:46:24 pm

HELLO!

Quote from scaryice:

If you do get the skip, couldn't you just quickly exit the second square by going left and reentering?

Yeah but we didn't know that until now. Smiley

presjpolk

2013-01-19 12:01:23 pm

HELLO!

Correction from Fiskbit:

Quote:

16:46 < fisky> hey, PresJPolk, it's actually the last side-view area _before_ the encounter, not after
16:48 < fisky> basically, when you scroll the screen in a side-view area, $71f holds a value that indicates the direction. the last
direction the screen scrolls stays at that address
16:48 < fisky> when the encounter happens, the red jar will be marked as collected if that scroll direction is right, and clear if
it's left
16:50 < fisky> the direction you leave a room with scrolling is also the last direction the screen scrolled
16:50 < fisky> anyway, just thought i'd clear that up. thanks for posting the info!

feasel

2013-01-19 02:06:36 pm

difficult and stupidly random

Either I dont understand this theory, or there is a flaw in it, because I follow the guidelines and yet I frequently don't get that jar. Here is what happens in every any% run that i do:

1. Beat palace 6
2. Take the lower bridge to Thunder town (scrolling left), then back again (scrolling right).
3. Take the upper bridge that leads towards the graveyard/valley-of-death (scrolling left).
4. Force an encounter on a path tile right next to the graveyard. Encounter may be large or small, but there is no scrolling involved either way. Shouldn't matter which side i exit from.
5. (0 or more times:) Accidentally hit a random encounter on the graveyard instead of hitting it on top of the fixed encounter at the start of VOD that i wanted to skip. I always exit to the left (scrolling the screen leftward) regardless of whether this is a big or small encounter.
6. (0 or more times:) Accidentally walk into the fixed encounter at the start of VOD because i fail to manipulate the random mobs properly. Immediately exit to the left and try again (no screen scrolling has occurred).
7. Successfully get a random encounter on the path tile that is supposed to contain the fixed encounter. Encounter may be large or small, but there is no scrolling either way. Shouldn't matter which side i exit from.
8. Go to the spot where the red potion is.

According to my understanding of what Fiskbit says, following the steps above there should be no chance at all of that potion not being there (regardless of how many times #5 or #6 happens). And yet still sometimes i don't get that red potion, as people have seen on my stream multiple times.

After the last bridge (#3), the scrolling flag should be set to Left, and there is nothing whatsoever that i do after that that involves scrolling rightward. #5 and #6 both only involve going left (never right), and #6 doesn't even involve screen scrolling. #4 and #7 are path encounters that involve no scrolling (i think i typically exit these to the left, but since there's no scrolling it shouldn't make any difference, right?).

Check out my broadcast from the other day: http://www.twitch.tv/feasel/b/357902435
watch from 26:00 onward and you'll see me scroll the screen left, exit 3 encounters leftward, and then sadly no potion. (in case it matters, the first half of the run is at the end of this broadcast http://www.twitch.tv/feasel/b/357821559)

Either I dont understand this theory, or there is a flaw in it, because I follow the guidelines and yet I frequently don't get that jar.  Here is what happens in every any% run that i do:

1. Beat palace 6
2. Take the lower bridge to Thunder town (scrolling left), then back again (scrolling right).
3. Take the upper bridge that leads towards the graveyard/valley-of-death (scrolling left).
4. Force an encounter on a path tile right next to the graveyard.  Encounter may be large or small, but there is no scrolling involved either way.  Shouldn't matter which side i exit from.
5. (0 or more times:) Accidentally hit a random encounter on the graveyard instead of hitting it on top of the fixed encounter at the start of VOD that i wanted to skip.  I always exit to the left (scrolling the screen leftward) regardless of whether this is a big or small encounter.
6. (0 or more times:) Accidentally walk into the fixed encounter at the start of VOD because i fail to manipulate the random mobs properly.  Immediately exit to the left and try again (no screen scrolling has occurred).
7. Successfully get a random encounter on the path tile that is supposed to contain the fixed encounter.  Encounter may be large or small, but there is no scrolling either way.  Shouldn't matter which side i exit from.
8. Go to the spot where the red potion is.

According to my understanding of what Fiskbit says, following the steps above there should be no chance at all of that potion not being there (regardless of how many times #5 or #6 happens).  And yet still sometimes i don't get that red potion, as people have seen on my stream multiple times.

After the last bridge (#3), the scrolling flag should be set to Left, and there is nothing whatsoever that i do after that that involves scrolling rightward.  #5 and #6 both only involve going left (never right), and #6 doesn't even involve screen scrolling.  #4 and #7 are path encounters that involve no scrolling (i think i typically exit these to the left, but since there's no scrolling it shouldn't make any difference, right?).

Check out my broadcast from the other day:    http://www.twitch.tv/feasel/b/357902435
watch from 26:00 onward and you'll see me scroll the screen left, exit 3 encounters leftward, and then sadly no potion.  (in case it matters, the first half of the run is at the end of this broadcast http://www.twitch.tv/feasel/b/357821559)

presjpolk

2013-01-19 09:02:23 pm

HELLO!

I've encouraged fiskbit to join the forums, or at least post as a guest, to deal with this.

Any way, I put up an 18:34 tonight. NG+. Glitched to the moon and back, but it's a legit 18:34 NG+ on Wii VC. Smiley

Fiskbit

2013-01-19 10:06:49 pm

Feasel: I watched through the run and found the problem. The information before was actually incomplete; the side-view scroll direction byte is set both by scrolling in a direction, as well as when you enter a scrolling area from the edge of the screen. Specifically, when you step into the VOD entrance forced encounter from above, Link enters the screen from the left side, so the scroll direction is initialized rightward. When stepping in from the bottom, Link enters from the right side, so it's initialized leftward. This does not affect encounters where Link is just dropped into an area, like with your standard enemy encounters, but you have to scroll to get out of those, anyway.

So, when you entered the forced encounter at 58:00, you set the scroll direction to the right, which made the safe large enemy encounter at 58:07 remove the red jar.

This might make it easier to actually respawn the red jar after taking it, if you wanted to get it twice, since when you enter that forced encounter from the bottom, it sets the scroll direction left, which is exactly what you want.

Feasel: I watched through the run and found the problem. The information before was actually incomplete; the side-view scroll direction byte is set both by scrolling in a direction, as well as when you enter a scrolling area from the edge of the screen. Specifically, when you step into the VOD entrance forced encounter from above, Link enters the screen from the left side, so the scroll direction is initialized rightward. When stepping in from the bottom, Link enters from the right side, so it's initialized leftward. This does not affect encounters where Link is just dropped into an area, like with your standard enemy encounters, but you have to scroll to get out of those, anyway.

So, when you entered the forced encounter at 58:00, you set the scroll direction to the right, which made the safe large enemy encounter at 58:07 remove the red jar.

This might make it easier to actually respawn the red jar after taking it, if you wanted to get it twice, since when you enter that forced encounter from the bottom, it sets the scroll direction left, which is exactly what you want.

presjpolk

Edit history:

presjpolk: 2013-01-20 02:54:56 am

2013-01-20 02:54:05 am

HELLO!

Never mind that 18:34. Twitch ate it. So I just went and beat it a few times.

13:56. 11:xx is my goal though. Improvements we've found since: A few of those screens don't have to be walked across, but can be glitched where you walk right a little, then go back left. Also, there's a way to avoid the backtrack into death mountain after the hammer: take an intention death after picking up the hammer, walk left IMMEDIATELY after respawning, then walk RIGHT to the elevator to go up and out.

Also there's a slightly different route to palace 7 that may be faster. Instead of walking down past fire town, go back up into that cave north of fire town, go right and walk back left to glitch it, which warps you to the swamp cave past the river demon. Then just go right to the cave that wraps you direct to Palace 7. That should be fastest.

Don't know if this is really a category SDA wants though. It's pretty unfair to supersede Arctic with this, but how many categories do we want on site?

Never mind that 18:34. Twitch ate it. So I just went and beat it a few times.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgzXx5DosR0

13:56.  11:xx is my goal though.  Improvements we've found since:  A few of those screens don't have to be walked across, but can be glitched where you walk right a little, then go back left.  Also, there's a way to avoid the backtrack into death mountain after the hammer: take an intention death after picking up the hammer, walk left IMMEDIATELY after respawning, then walk RIGHT to the elevator to go up and out.

Also there's a slightly different route to palace 7 that may be faster. Instead of walking down past fire town, go back up into that cave north of fire town, go right and walk back left to glitch it, which warps you to the swamp cave past the river demon.  Then just go right to the cave that wraps you direct to Palace 7. That should be fastest.

Don't know if this is really a category SDA wants though.  It's pretty unfair to supersede Arctic with this, but how many categories do we want on site?

feasel

Edit history:

feasel: 2013-01-20 05:21:42 am

2013-01-20 04:49:53 am

difficult and stupidly random

Fiskbit, thanks! That makes a lot of sense.
Several people have pointed out that the potion seems less likely to spawn the more "misses" i have on the VOD-entrance-skip. Turns out, there was something to that theory.

So if you accidentally hit the VOD-entrance encounter, you should be able to walk far enough right that the screen begins to scroll, then turn around and exit leftward and that will set the scroll flag back to "left"? Alternatively you could not do that, but then after you've skipped the encounter successfully, enter back into it briefly from below (entering from the right and immediately exiting right).

scaryice

2013-01-20 04:59:26 am

Quote from presjpolk:

Don't know if this is really a category SDA wants though. It's pretty unfair to supersede Arctic with this, but how many categories do we want on site?

I'd be interested in seeing a glitched run on SDA, but not a NG+ run. I find those to be boring in every game.

presjpolk

2013-01-20 05:18:33 am

HELLO!

I do play to do straight any% next, but trying to learn the glitches *while* learning to fight the dairas underpowered, was a bit much. Smiley