Valkyrie Profile 2: Silmeria

2006-10-31 01:50:02 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Well I just finished another test run. I came up with a final time of 3 hours and 47 minutes (3:35 at the final save point, 12 min final two battles). That's quite an improvement over my last run. Phyress = ownage. Im positive this can be done in under 3:30, 3 tho, still is hard to fathom. I had an almost perfect Lezard Tower tho. Transferred the troll, Silmeria, and Lezard all on the first turn, well the troll used might reinforce. Good photon switches and everything.
I had some bumps along the rest of the way, I still did not find a good target to use Mithra's Holy Water on (I ended up using it against 1st form of final Lezard so he instant stuns, I'm sure theres a better place for it). I got slightly lost in the Forest of spirits, i encountered maybe 4 random battles (2 were in the Forest of Spirits, those plants are hard to jump over, I succeeded in jumping over them twice out of the four required times) that I had to run from. I forgot (LOL) to equip fists of iron and mental boost on Phyress after learning them, so some time can be saved on a few bosses. I'm still sure under 3:30 is possible.
Well, if anyones interested in this run I can polish up some of my plan, and figure out a way to segment this (since I did save quite a bit, there's some more time to be saved there.) For people that wanna comment on what I do, most of it is described a few posts before this. I did a few tweaks, and there are some things I learned from my 2nd run. The bow from the crab is not necessary, neither is solitary struggle. Magician slayer is awesome, I got it on both Phyress (for the 2 mages and lezard, I didn't in my first run), and alicia (for valkyrie). The tri-Emblem is not necessary, the only difference it would make is that you take less damage in the final, final boss battle, but that's a piece of cake anyways. There's probably some other things, but I'm too lazy to try to remember.

Well I just finished another test run. I came up with a final time of 3 hours and 47 minutes (3:35 at the final save point, 12 min final two battles). That's quite an improvement over my last run. Phyress = ownage. Im positive this can be done in under 3:30, 3 tho, still is hard to fathom. I had an almost perfect Lezard Tower tho. Transferred the troll, Silmeria, and Lezard all on the first turn, well the troll used might reinforce. Good photon switches and everything. 
         I had some bumps along the rest of the way, I still did not find a good target to use Mithra's Holy Water on (I ended up using it against 1st form of final Lezard so he instant stuns, I'm sure theres a better place for it). I got slightly lost in the Forest of spirits, i encountered maybe 4 random battles (2 were in the Forest of Spirits, those plants are hard to jump over, I succeeded in jumping over them twice out of the four required times) that I had to run from. I forgot (LOL) to equip fists of iron and mental boost on Phyress after learning them, so some time can be saved on a few bosses. I'm still sure under 3:30 is possible.
        Well, if anyones interested in this run I can polish up some of my plan, and figure out a way to segment this (since I did save quite a bit, there's some more time to be saved there.) For people that wanna comment on what I do, most of it is described a few posts before this. I did a few tweaks, and there are some things I learned from my 2nd run. The bow from the crab is not necessary, neither is solitary struggle. Magician slayer is awesome, I got it on both Phyress (for the 2 mages and lezard, I didn't in my first run), and alicia (for valkyrie). The tri-Emblem is not necessary, the only difference it would make is that you take less damage in the final, final boss battle, but that's a piece of cake anyways. There's probably some other things, but I'm too lazy to try to remember.

Alkaiser77

2006-10-31 01:58:26 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Check points for those who care, tho I should have taken more:

Save point at Evolver = 59 min
Before Ull = 2 hours
Lezards tower = 3 hours 20 min
Final Time : 3 hours 47 min

KareemZ.

Edit history:

KareemZ.: 2006-10-31 09:56:45 pm

2006-10-31 09:55:44 pm

Hello!

I was thinking about trying a speed run as well.

Ive finished the game 10 times...i have 9 little cristals.
I think it would be a good break from over powered enemies and that kind of stuff.

Ill read posts as i go...and find the best way around.
Wish me luck.

Btw, have you thaught about which Sealstones you will restore?

Alkaiser77

2006-10-31 11:08:57 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Err, I'm fighting like 2 random battles early on to restore sword blessing, and thats about it, only because its dirt cheap. You will not have enough crystals to restore ANYTHING else for the rest of the game.

Alkaiser77

2006-11-03 06:35:26 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

bump

Well, I'm gonna outline a plan for a final recorded run from me. I would love to hear any input before I start this, but it seems there isn't much interest on this. If all goes well, I should be able to obtain a sub 3:30 time. When releasing mage einherjar, I just used the best staves I had at the time, since most starting staves have at least 40 magic on the later mages, which is good enough. I also had 3 released with the dragonlore, deluge sceptor and unicorn's horn, though as I comment on later, it might be better to just buy an infinity rod at dipan castle and use that. You get the benefit of having more magic earlier, and don't have to spend 30 secs to a minute getting those 2 monsters into location to get the Unicorn's horn.

Ch 1: Don't bother getting the tri-Emblem. Run through, get Richelle and Kraad, I dunno if them being lvl 1 or 2 matters, but preferrably have them both at lvl 1.

Ch 2: This boss hurts. You need 150 crystals to restore Sword Blessing. You get 30 from the first skelly battle in the forest, maybe around 10 from the first boss, around 10 for this boss, and 30 for the required battle here. I plan on fighting on battle on the plains to DA a fish and get the blue ice rune for Magic Boost. That's another 30. You'll also get 30 for DA-transferring the Wyvern. Unless you are able to beat the first 2 bosses fast, or can knock crystals out of them, You'll need to DA another random battle. Doing another one also gets everyone to level 2, which might make the 2nd boss easier.
Trying to get 30 crystals from the 2 bosses might take effort and time, but you save time not having to fight that extra battle. I'll try both out and see which provides faster results, but I'll probably end up fighting that extra battle. Get Hrist's sword on the way out.

Ch 3: Pretty much the same as I outlined previously, with a few key differences. I still think the 2nd Evolver battle can be done much quicker than I'm currently doing it (hitting it with 2 attacks from Phyress for about 150 each, 2 from Arngrim w/ Kraadicator for about 200-220 each from the back, trading turns with the Evolver, healing when necessary). The charge break might be useful here, but I saved it for Hrist. I wish you could obtain Mithra's Holy Water right now, but it's not worth backtracking for it.
Differences: Get the charge break next to Phyress. Don't read the poem in Crell, get the two magic accessories there from the old woman. Don't go through all of Chateau, just get a red weakness rune from a Satyr and get out. Crawsus, get Circe for her armors, and Adonis because no one can transfer better than him at Lezard's tower, not to mention he's a darn good heavy warrior to boot. Don't fight the crab for the bow, its not needed, but do get the dragonlore in the poison room (which I use as a shortcut anyways after getting the stone from those statues). Along the way, learn Magician Slayer on Phyress for an easier Walther/Gyne battle (Silver Mail from crawsus is a red armor rune). Release Mithra as soon as you could.

Ch 4: Get Mithra's Holy Water. Kill Ull, the computer is programmed to have him (and most bosses) target the weaker people. Since Phyress is much much stronger than the rest of the team, He'll chase the rest of your team around stupidly, while you stay behind him and attack. He should go down without ever attacking, and hopefully he won't cast his shield too much, even then, 2 attacks from Phyress breaks the shield immediately, so not much time lost. Have Alicia in this battle to learn Magician Slayer.
Equip Phyress with Ull's bow and magician slayer, get rid of flare blast and put in target throat. Silence Gyne. Kill Gyne, then Walther, hopefully he doesn't use a radial attack to save some time here. Release a mage einherjar with the Deluge Sceptor.
Here's where I'm having trouble deciding who to use Mithra's Holy Water on. In my 3:47 run, I used it on 1st form final lezard to instant stun him for a semi-free round of attacks on the crystal to finish that battle. It might be better to use it on one of the bosses from here on out, but in that run, I found Hrist, Odin, and Lezard to be easy and short. So in the end, I might still just save that water for 1st form final Lezard.
Against Hrist, I head straight for her, get behind her, keep attacking her without using double AP. When you have approx 15AP left, use a charge break, repeat. She'll fall before she gets to do anything.

Ch 5: Run straight through the Forest, get the confusion stone. Confuse Arcteris and kill him. Get out of the forest (I always get lost on the way out, I'm gonna experiment to see how to get out instantly, or input here from someone would be nice =).) Very similar to what I commented on earlier. I'm still trying to figure out the fastest way to Kill Heimdall. Do I blow 50+ Ap attacking him frontally (so when he attacks me I get it back), or use my AP smartly and attack him from the sides, though this would mean I'd have to break that portion of his card shield. He might regenerate that, so it's iffy here.
Asgard, buy around 10 Charge Breaks (and stock up on Fairy Tinctures and Union Plumes, I don't think any more than 10 of each is needed, but you have OTH to burn so...), I abuse these from here on out. Due to the nature of the computer targeting your weak chacters, you can stand behind almost all the bosses, use all your AP, charge break, repeat, and the boss will most likely be dead by now. He won't use radial attacks that often. Yggdrasil, I head straight to Odin, I don't bother getting any sealstones this time around. On the way out, I got the Unicorn's Horn on my 3:47 run, but the effort and time it takes to get those 2 monsters in position to reach it is probably not worth it. It's probably better to buy an infinity rod at Dipan to release a mage einherjar with, and have the final mage be released off of Walther's Deluge Sceptor.

Valhalla: I had a much cleaner Valhalla the 2nd time around. I still went for the Magic and Power bangles, the Mysteltein, and Gram. It takes about 30 secs to get the Gram, and gives Valkyrie around 50 more str (which with the 2 power bangles means around 80 ATK, having 1920 ATK instead of 2k ATK probably won't mean anything at all), but it might save some time to not get it. I'll probably not get it, but we'll see...The mysteltein gives 100 magic, with your magic bangles, should make up the time it takes to get it (also 30 secs-ish) in the battles against Freya and Lezard, and the crystal)

Ch 6: Don't get the tri-Emblem. Should already have supplies from Asgard. I didn't get any stones the 2nd time around. With Adonis, I transferred the troll, lezard and silmeria quite easily. The two battles combined probably took less than 1 minute (Adonis has 3 moves that knockback, at low levels too). The only treasures I got from this place was brahm's weapon, the heavy sword, the magic bangle, and the relfect armor. All things considered, the reflect armor probably won't due anything, since the HP and CON it gives to Valkyrie means nothing. It probably saves 5 seconds not getting it, so....Elchanan's Fingertip isn't needed, and might even be detrimental. The final lezard battles I approached exactly the same, except for the first form, When I knew I only needed one barrage from Phyress to kill the crystal, I used Mithra's Holy Water on Lezard. The 2nd form, I got behind Lezard and attacked. When I ran out of AP, I charge breaked. He only got to use his Great Magic, which doesnt do anything to Valkyrie.

Well, thats about it. Please, I would love comments on how to improve this before I start to seriously record. Getting it close to 3 hours would be very nice. There might even be some breakthrough I don't know about to get it sub-3.

bump

Well, I'm gonna outline a plan for a final recorded run from me. I would love to hear any input before I start this, but it seems there isn't much interest on this. If all goes well, I should be able to obtain a sub 3:30 time. When releasing mage einherjar, I just used the best staves I had at the time, since most starting staves have at least 40 magic on the later mages, which is good enough. I also had 3 released with the dragonlore, deluge sceptor and unicorn's horn, though as I comment on later, it might be better to just buy an infinity rod at dipan castle and use that. You get the benefit of having more magic earlier, and don't have to spend 30 secs to a minute getting those 2 monsters into location to get the Unicorn's horn.

Ch 1: Don't bother getting the tri-Emblem. Run through, get Richelle and Kraad, I dunno if them being lvl 1 or 2 matters, but preferrably have them both at lvl 1.

Ch 2: This boss hurts. You need 150 crystals to restore Sword Blessing. You get 30 from the first skelly battle in the forest, maybe around 10 from the first boss, around 10 for this boss, and 30 for the required battle here. I plan on fighting on battle on the plains to DA a fish and get the blue ice rune for Magic Boost. That's another 30. You'll also get 30 for DA-transferring the Wyvern. Unless you are able to beat the first 2 bosses fast, or can knock crystals out of them, You'll need to DA another random battle. Doing another one also gets everyone to level 2, which might make the 2nd boss easier. 
         Trying to get 30 crystals from the 2 bosses might take effort and time, but you save time not having to fight that extra battle. I'll try both out and see which provides faster results, but I'll probably end up fighting that extra battle. Get Hrist's sword on the way out.

Ch 3: Pretty much the same as I outlined previously, with a few key differences. I still think the 2nd Evolver battle can be done much quicker than I'm currently doing it (hitting it with 2 attacks from Phyress for about 150 each, 2 from Arngrim w/ Kraadicator for about 200-220 each from the back, trading turns with the Evolver, healing when necessary). The charge break might be useful here, but I saved it for Hrist. I wish you could obtain Mithra's Holy Water right now, but it's not worth backtracking for it.
        Differences: Get the charge break next to Phyress. Don't read the poem in Crell, get the two magic accessories there from the old woman. Don't go through all of Chateau, just get a red weakness rune from a Satyr and get out. Crawsus, get Circe for her armors, and Adonis because no one can transfer better than him at Lezard's tower, not to mention he's a darn good heavy warrior to boot. Don't fight the crab for the bow, its not needed, but do get the dragonlore in the poison room (which I use as a shortcut anyways after getting the stone from those statues). Along the way, learn Magician Slayer on Phyress for an easier Walther/Gyne battle (Silver Mail from crawsus is a red armor rune). Release Mithra as soon as you could.

Ch 4: Get Mithra's Holy Water. Kill Ull, the computer is programmed to have him (and most bosses) target the weaker people. Since Phyress is much much stronger than the rest of the team, He'll chase the rest of your team around stupidly, while you stay behind him and attack. He should go down without ever attacking, and hopefully he won't cast his shield too much, even then, 2 attacks from Phyress breaks the shield immediately, so not much time lost. Have Alicia in this battle to learn Magician Slayer.
           Equip Phyress with Ull's bow and magician slayer, get rid of flare blast and put in target throat. Silence Gyne. Kill Gyne, then Walther, hopefully he doesn't use a radial attack to save some time here. Release a mage einherjar with the Deluge Sceptor.
             Here's where I'm having trouble deciding who to use Mithra's Holy Water on. In my 3:47 run, I used it on 1st form final lezard to instant stun him for a semi-free round of attacks on the crystal to finish that battle. It might be better to use it on one of the bosses from here on out, but in that run, I found Hrist, Odin, and Lezard to be easy and short. So in the end, I might still just save that water for 1st form final Lezard.
             Against Hrist, I head straight for her, get behind her, keep attacking her without using double AP. When you have approx 15AP left, use a charge break, repeat. She'll fall before she gets to do anything.

Ch 5: Run straight through the Forest, get the confusion stone. Confuse Arcteris and kill him. Get out of the forest (I always get lost on the way out, I'm gonna experiment to see how to get out instantly, or input here from someone would be nice =).) Very similar to what I commented on earlier. I'm still trying to figure out the fastest way to Kill Heimdall. Do I blow 50+ Ap attacking him frontally (so when he attacks me I get it back), or use my AP smartly and attack him from the sides, though this would mean I'd have to break that portion of his card shield. He might regenerate that, so it's iffy here.
           Asgard, buy around 10 Charge Breaks (and stock up on Fairy Tinctures and Union Plumes, I don't think any more than 10 of each is needed, but you have OTH to burn so...), I abuse these from here on out. Due to the nature of the computer targeting your weak chacters, you can stand behind almost all the bosses, use all your AP, charge break, repeat, and the boss will most likely be dead by now. He won't use radial attacks that often. Yggdrasil, I head straight to Odin, I don't bother getting any sealstones this time around. On the way out, I got the Unicorn's Horn on my 3:47 run, but the effort and time it takes to get those 2 monsters in position to reach it is probably not worth it. It's probably better to buy an infinity rod at Dipan to release a mage einherjar with, and have the final mage be released off of Walther's Deluge Sceptor.

Valhalla: I had a much cleaner Valhalla the 2nd time around. I still went for the Magic and Power bangles, the Mysteltein, and Gram. It takes about 30 secs to get the Gram, and gives Valkyrie around 50 more str (which with the 2 power bangles means around 80 ATK, having 1920 ATK instead of 2k ATK probably won't mean anything at all), but it might save some time to not get it. I'll probably not get it, but we'll see...The mysteltein gives 100 magic, with your magic bangles, should make up the time it takes to get it (also 30 secs-ish) in the battles against Freya and Lezard, and the crystal)

Ch 6: Don't get the tri-Emblem. Should already have supplies from Asgard. I didn't get any stones the 2nd time around. With Adonis, I transferred the troll, lezard and silmeria quite easily. The two battles combined probably took less than 1 minute (Adonis has 3 moves that knockback, at low levels too). The only treasures I got from this place was brahm's weapon, the heavy sword, the magic bangle, and the relfect armor. All things considered, the reflect armor probably won't due anything, since the HP and CON it gives to Valkyrie means nothing. It probably saves 5 seconds not getting it, so....Elchanan's Fingertip isn't needed, and might even be detrimental. The final lezard battles I approached exactly the same, except for the first form, When I knew I only needed one barrage from Phyress to kill the crystal, I used Mithra's Holy Water on Lezard. The 2nd form, I got behind Lezard and attacked. When I ran out of AP, I charge breaked. He only got to use his Great Magic, which doesnt do anything to Valkyrie.

Well, thats about it. Please, I would love comments on how to improve this before I start to seriously record. Getting it close to 3 hours would be very nice. There might even be some breakthrough I don't know about to get it sub-3.

rock1644

2006-11-03 01:48:08 pm

yes, a man carrying a gimp

Wow, I can't believe you guys already have a speedrun nearly completed for this game.

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-11-03 02:49:09 pm

2006-11-03 02:46:53 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

Quote:

Wow, I can't believe you guys already have a speedrun nearly completed for this game.

hahahahaha, I can't believe it either. Tongue

Alkaiser: it looks ~~good~~ amazing to me. However, one "Enhasa" is going to be playing this game soon and he's going to know a lot more about it than I do. Wink

You might want to wait for that, but it could also be a while before he has anything particularly meaningful to say, so if you want to go ahead...

Enhasa

Edit history:

Enhasa: 2006-11-03 05:29:36 pm

2006-11-03 05:28:59 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Don't wait for any one person, especially me.

Edit: I'm not going to check this thread anymore for a while, because I really really want to avoid spoilers.

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-11-03 07:17:28 pm

2006-11-03 07:14:12 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

This is true, and if he doesn't mind I probably would encourage him to get something up.

I, however, hate recording (on a VCR anyway...) and, were I doing this or any run, would take any excuse to both wait as long as possible and record as few times as possible. Not that I encourage this behavior...or discourage it either, as that would be hypocritical.

And, uhh, how did you know to read this page? Tongue

I have guesses, of course.

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-11-03 07:33:30 pm

2006-11-03 07:32:41 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

Hmm, okay, I might have a thing or two to say. I'm sure you know this basically much better than me by now, though.

Quote:

Don't fight the crab for the bow, its not needed, but do get the dragonlore in the poison room (which I use as a shortcut anyways after getting the stone from those statues). Along the way, learn Magician Slayer on Phyress for an easier Walther/Gyne battle (Silver Mail from crawsus is a red armor rune). Release Mithra as soon as you could.

Fuck those guys, there's something useful in the poison room? Sad

Quote:

Here's where I'm having trouble deciding who to use Mithra's Holy Water on. In my 3:47 run, I used it on 1st form final lezard to instant stun him for a semi-free round of attacks on the crystal to finish that battle. It might be better to use it on one of the bosses from here on out, but in that run, I found Hrist, Odin, and Lezard to be easy and short. So in the end, I might still just save that water for 1st form final Lezard.

I've never released Mithra, so I don't know how the Holy Water works (what I'm getting from you though is that it does >10,000 damage against a standard enemy, or perhaps >1,000 to absolutely any enemy). But I'd have to assume you want it for the crystal fight, since otherwise doing damage is an enormous pain in the ass.

Quote:

Get out of the forest (I always get lost on the way out, I'm gonna experiment to see how to get out instantly, or input here from someone would be nice =).) Very similar to what I commented on earlier.

IIRC, as you head back, head "outward" (down) the first chance you get, which should put you up in the place where you can go inward on the first of the four annoying screens. That could be wrong though. Other than that, you'll just have to follow the directions-it's bascially all one way though. I don't remember their being any elves on the way out, sucks since that'd be awesome.

Quote:

I'm still trying to figure out the fastest way to Kill Heimdall. Do I blow 50+ Ap attacking him frontally (so when he attacks me I get it back), or use my AP smartly and attack him from the sides, though this would mean I'd have to break that portion of his card shield. He might regenerate that, so it's iffy here.

I've fought him a lot...in SG. He doesn't regenerate there, so I'd be surprised if he did it in Chapter 5. However, he turns VERY fast, so good luck with that.

Quote:

I didn't get any stones the 2nd time around.

Does this mean that Lezard isn't affected by sealstones in the tower, or that you just don't care that he has 2x RDM?

I wish I could do more to help, because, well...see the previous post. But it looks like you've got most things down by now.

And, hell, people will figure stuff out. Then somebody will do a new run. The game's only been out a month; you could either give it some time, work with more stuff, or just go ahead. I'm quite impressed already-do what you want.

Hmm, okay, I might have a thing or two to say.  I'm sure you know this basically much better than me by now, though.
[quote]Don't fight the crab for the bow, its not needed, but do get the dragonlore in the poison room (which I use as a shortcut anyways after getting the stone from those statues). Along the way, learn Magician Slayer on Phyress for an easier Walther/Gyne battle (Silver Mail from crawsus is a red armor rune). Release Mithra as soon as you could.[/quote]
Fuck those guys, there's something useful in the poison room? :(
[quote]Here's where I'm having trouble deciding who to use Mithra's Holy Water on. In my 3:47 run, I used it on 1st form final lezard to instant stun him for a semi-free round of attacks on the crystal to finish that battle. It might be better to use it on one of the bosses from here on out, but in that run, I found Hrist, Odin, and Lezard to be easy and short. So in the end, I might still just save that water for 1st form final Lezard.[/quote]
I've never released Mithra, so I don't know how the Holy Water works (what I'm getting from you though is that it does [u]>[/u]10,000 damage against a standard enemy, or perhaps [u]>[/u]1,000 to absolutely any enemy).  But I'd have to assume you want it for the crystal fight, since otherwise doing damage is an enormous pain in the ass.
[quote]Get out of the forest (I always get lost on the way out, I'm gonna experiment to see how to get out instantly, or input here from someone would be nice =).) Very similar to what I commented on earlier.[/quote]
IIRC, as you head back, head "outward" (down) the first chance you get, which should put you up in the place where you can go inward on the first of the four annoying screens.  That could be wrong though.  Other than that, you'll just have to follow the directions-it's bascially all one way though.  I don't remember their being any elves on the way out, sucks since that'd be awesome.
[quote]I'm still trying to figure out the fastest way to Kill Heimdall. Do I blow 50+ Ap attacking him frontally (so when he attacks me I get it back), or use my AP smartly and attack him from the sides, though this would mean I'd have to break that portion of his card shield. He might regenerate that, so it's iffy here.[/quote]
I've fought him a lot...in SG.  He doesn't regenerate there, so I'd be surprised if he did it in Chapter 5.  However, he turns VERY fast, so good luck with that.
[quote]I didn't get any stones the 2nd time around.[/quote]
Does this mean that Lezard isn't affected by sealstones in the tower, or that you just don't care that he has 2x RDM?

I wish I could do more to help, because, well...see the previous post.  But it looks like you've got most things down by now.

And, hell, people [i]will[/i] figure stuff out.  Then somebody will do a new run.  The game's only been out a month; you could either give it some time, work with more stuff, or just go ahead.  I'm quite impressed already-do what you want.

Aborash

2006-11-03 09:34:22 pm

I h8 YaBB!

Erm, Im not sure if you guys knows about the hydra-exp-matic

Please, start releashing the Speedruns, cant wait!! Wink

Alkaiser77

Edit history:

Alkaiser77: 2006-11-03 10:32:19 pm

2006-11-03 10:04:54 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

There's nothing useful in the poison room, its just faster using it as a shortcut, since you get one of the stones at the statues, might as well use the statues to move you to the poison room, so you can use that newly acquired stone. I get the einherjar and staff there because they are right there.

Mithra's Holy Water does 10k guarenteed dmg. I've been thinking about this. It would be really nice to release him in Chapter 2, so you can get the water for Evolver (2nd form) or something, which is by far my longest battle, but it just seems impossible to do it. It's not worth backtracking to get it tho, and it seems wasted when used later on, when Phyress is doing 2-4K per 2 attacks, 10k dmg from an item won't save as much time as skipping a boss battle early on. Man why does Mithra have to appear at Lost Forest after release =/ Oh and, the water cannot be used on the crystal itself, since it is considered an object.

Thanks for the input on the forest! This will save some time.

Heimdall at Bifrost does regenerate. He also doesn't turn that fast, but with my strategy of fighting bosses it doesnt really matter. If one wave of attacks and a charge break isnt killing the boss, I move around to regain AP, since most bosses will go after the weaker group if they are somewhat close, I can manipulate the AI easily, so he'll never attack.

Lezard IS affected by all the stones. The thing is, its probably not worth spending any time to take any of them. It MIGHT be worth getting the 150% ATK no healing stone, since all I use are union plumes anyways, but it is somewhat out of the way, and that battle takes some time having to transfer the guy. I'll have to test this. Now that I think about it tho, I might save 1-2 minutes from the battles with the stone, so I'll probably end up getting it. I wish I could get rid of the 200% RDM stone, but any effect you dont want lezard to have, you must put on yourself, since there are no shells, and you dont have crystals to be able to restore it, having no battle menu is a BIG no.

I've also thought about it, and I'll probably replace arngrim with dylan in the kraken and evolver battles (and one other boss) so he can learn fists of iron and magician slayer for the lezard battles. Dylan's multipliers on his attacks are higher, so that's nice, I just wish he had more hp.

Yea, things will be discovered about the run. Usually though, those discoveries are abuses. There's not really much to abuse in this game I think. There's no instant kills to bosses, except transfers, which I fully abuse already. It's probably agreed that random battles should be kept to an absolute minimum. Thus, you won't have any accessories to get skills with, and no crystals to use sealstones with. I'm already getting the skills that increase damage output, I don't think any other skills would be worth it. Solitary struggle is not worth using the time to get the runes for. Furthermore you want your party alive during boss battles so they could get XP to be releasable.
I only fight 2 on purpose, and that's to get a blue ice run and a red weakness for mental boost and magician slayer. Going to Chateau to get that red weakness seems a bit out of the way tho, there are some to be found in ancient forest, but I don't think anyones strong enough to break off a part there.
To Aborash: I already knew about that, but Xp is never a concern, except for releasing, and theres enough to get everyone releasable by the final battle. Getting XP from the hydra is just a waste of time (it's not possible for me to even do that trick, due to my really weak characters, I can beat him quickly normally tho), but thanks for the thought =) I don't have problems with any bosses after Evolver 2nd form. I do wish there is some way to get Mithra to level 6 before end of chapter 2 tho.....
There probably will be very different opinions on who to make your monster character. Phyress I chose because she starts with Psychosama, and the multiplier on flame shot is too good to pass up. Rufus has even better multipliers, except there's a few problems to using him. You would either have to learn Psychosama on him, or release the str einherjar and save the mages for Valkyrie(and have alicia learn psychosama). The 2nd option seems rather nice, except for one thing. This would involve getting the runes for psychosama (well all you need is a red ice rune, and have to find/buy a red head/glove somewhere), and I think that's a waste of time, when Phyress has it already, even though her damage output is slightly less than Rufus' potential for the main game (its already been shown in the damage calculations post at gamefaqs that Rufus in post game owns, but we're not concered about that). The second issue with using rufus, is that you're gonna have one helluva time killing Odin and white dragon. The only character you would have that would be able to hurt him is Lezard, so that battle would be painfully slow. You don't even get Lezard for the white dragon, so I dunno what you would have to do there. I do know that Phyress DA's the white dragon, so there's + points for her. This is just my reasoning for using Phyress.
Well I'll be running this over thanksgiving break, and probably send the tapes in that weekend. I'll definitely get a sub 3:30 time, and who knows, maybe I'll get a time close to 3. Yea I don't mind putting up a time for others to break, because that in itself starts interest in this run, which is always welcome, since spineshark seems to be the only one replying (and Aborash!). Thanks for the input everyone, maybe something will be discovered between now and thanksgiving.

There's nothing useful in the poison room, its just faster using it as a shortcut, since you get one of the stones at the statues, might as well use the statues to move you to the poison room, so you can use that newly acquired stone. I get the einherjar and staff there because they are right there.

Mithra's Holy Water does 10k guarenteed dmg. I've been thinking about this. It would be really nice to release him in Chapter 2, so you can get the water for Evolver (2nd form) or something, which is by far my longest battle, but it just seems impossible to do it. It's not worth backtracking to get it tho, and it seems wasted when used later on, when Phyress is doing 2-4K per 2 attacks, 10k dmg from an item won't save as much time as skipping a boss battle early on. Man why does Mithra have to appear at Lost Forest after release =/ Oh and, the water cannot be used on the crystal itself, since it is considered an object.

Thanks for the input on the forest! This will save some time.

Heimdall at Bifrost does regenerate. He also doesn't turn that fast, but with my strategy of fighting bosses it doesnt really matter. If one wave of attacks and a charge break isnt killing the boss, I move around to regain AP, since most bosses will go after the weaker group if they are somewhat close, I can manipulate the AI easily, so he'll never attack.

Lezard IS affected by all the stones. The thing is, its probably not worth spending any time to take any of them. It MIGHT be worth getting the 150% ATK no healing stone, since all I use are union plumes anyways, but it is somewhat out of the way, and that battle takes some time having to transfer the guy. I'll have to test this. Now that I think about it tho, I might save 1-2 minutes from the battles with the stone, so I'll probably end up getting it. I wish I could get rid of the 200% RDM stone, but any effect you dont want lezard to have, you must put on yourself, since there are no shells, and you dont have crystals to be able to restore it, having no battle menu is a BIG no.

I've also thought about it, and I'll probably replace arngrim with dylan in the kraken and evolver battles (and one other boss) so he can learn fists of iron and magician slayer for the lezard battles. Dylan's multipliers on his attacks are higher, so that's nice, I just wish he had more hp.

Yea, things will be discovered about the run. Usually though, those discoveries are abuses. There's not really much to abuse in this game I think. There's no instant kills to bosses, except transfers, which I fully abuse already. It's probably agreed that random battles should be kept to an absolute minimum. Thus, you won't have any accessories to get skills with, and no crystals to use sealstones with. I'm already getting the skills that increase damage output, I don't think any other skills would be worth it. Solitary struggle is not worth using the time to get the runes for. Furthermore you want your party alive during boss battles so they could get XP to be releasable.
       I only fight 2 on purpose, and that's to get a blue ice run and a red weakness for mental boost and magician slayer. Going to Chateau to get that red weakness seems a bit out of the way tho, there are some to be found in ancient forest, but I don't think anyones strong enough to break off a part there.
         To Aborash: I already knew about that, but Xp is never a concern, except for releasing, and theres enough to get everyone releasable by the final battle. Getting XP from the hydra is just a waste of time (it's not possible for me to even do that trick, due to my really weak characters, I can beat him quickly normally tho), but thanks for the thought =) I don't have problems with any bosses after Evolver 2nd form. I do wish there is some way to get Mithra to level 6 before end of chapter 2 tho.....
         There probably will be very different opinions on who to make your monster character. Phyress I chose because she starts with Psychosama, and the multiplier on flame shot is too good to pass up. Rufus has even better multipliers, except there's a few problems to using him. You would either have to learn Psychosama on him, or release the str einherjar and save the mages for Valkyrie(and have alicia learn psychosama). The 2nd option seems rather nice, except for one thing. This would involve getting the runes for psychosama (well all you need is a red ice rune, and have to find/buy a red head/glove somewhere), and I think that's a waste of time, when Phyress has it already, even though her damage output is slightly less than Rufus' potential for the main game (its already been shown in the damage calculations post at gamefaqs that Rufus in post game owns, but we're not concered about that). The second issue with using rufus, is that you're gonna have one helluva time killing Odin and white dragon. The only character you would have that would be able to hurt him is Lezard, so that battle would be painfully slow. You don't even get Lezard for the white dragon, so I dunno what you would have to do there. I do know that Phyress DA's the white dragon, so there's + points for her. This is just my reasoning for using Phyress.
          Well I'll be running this over thanksgiving break, and probably send the tapes in that weekend. I'll definitely get a sub 3:30 time, and who knows, maybe I'll get a time close to 3. Yea I don't mind putting up a time for others to break, because that in itself starts interest in this run, which is always welcome, since spineshark seems to be the only one replying (and Aborash!). Thanks for the input everyone, maybe something will be discovered between now and thanksgiving.

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-11-04 12:08:56 am

2006-11-04 12:08:04 am

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

Actually, there are two shells in Lezard's tower. One is right where Lenneth joins, and the other is somewhere in the golden plains area (it's not out of the way, and it may even be in the room with the spring and the save, but I don't exactly remember). The bigger problem with the 200% RDM sealstone is that the Primordial Ooze monster is a total whore.

Word is, you can poison Odin. It's painfully slow to watch poison deaths, but possible in a worst-case scenario.

My guess is honestly that it's (sort of) easier to teach Brahms skills than Dylan (assuming that Transfers give skill learning "points") since Dylan won't have very much HP in Chapter 3 (he could, but you're using Kraad so he can be released, so it's not possible).

I'm not sure if I understand this part, but if you're talking about going to Chateau for one rune vs. going to Ancient Forest [an extra time] for one rune, I think the choice is obvious. Wink

Without fighting numerous random encounters, you simply can't hurt things there at level 2. But later on breaking parts in easier dungeons is faster than doing it in harder ones, obviously.

As I've said, I've had hardly any experience for Phyress, but she sounds like she fits needs for this run perfectly. The Valkyrie thing is, to me, the frustrating thing about thinking about buffing up Alicia as well, just like Odin is for Rufus.

Actually, there are [i]two[/i] shells in Lezard's tower.  One is right where Lenneth joins, and the other is somewhere in the golden plains area (it's not out of the way, and it may even be in the room with the spring and the save, but I don't exactly remember).  The bigger problem with the 200% RDM sealstone is that the Primordial Ooze monster is a total [i]whore[/i].

Word is, you can poison Odin.  It's painfully slow to watch poison deaths, but possible in a worst-case scenario.

My guess is honestly that it's (sort of) easier to teach Brahms skills than Dylan (assuming that Transfers give skill learning "points") since Dylan won't have very much HP in Chapter 3 (he could, but you're using Kraad so he can be released, so it's not possible).

I'm not sure if I understand this part, but if you're talking about going to Chateau for one rune vs. going to Ancient Forest [an extra time] for one rune, I think the choice is obvious. ;)  Without fighting numerous random encounters, you simply can't hurt things there at level 2.  But later on breaking parts in easier dungeons is faster than doing it in harder ones, obviously.

As I've said, I've had hardly any experience for Phyress, but she sounds like she fits needs for this run perfectly.  The Valkyrie thing is, to me, the frustrating thing about thinking about buffing up Alicia as well, just like Odin is for Rufus.

Alkaiser77

2006-11-04 03:17:54 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Haha, oh wow, I so didn't even know those shells existed (I'm such a nub), but my lezard fights weren't long so I dont think it is worth it to get those stones to shells (and fight those battles, especially since your saying ooze would be a pain, and most likely will be).

Phyress owns up Odin just fine. If someone else wants to do the run with Rufus or something, maybe poison is the way to go for Odin =) (which unforuntately would make that battle quite long)

Brahms won't be in any battles to actually learn skills, the transferring of the troll and silmeria/lezard doesnt allow you to get skill points (heck no-leader battles also dont give you skill points) Well he will from the non-homunculus lezard, but I want magician slayer and fists of iron for that battle. Random battles are not an option. I don't think using Dylan will be that much worse off than using Arngrim, but we'll see. If it is, then I can just have Dylan stand to the side for a boss battle. Since most of my boss battles are just Phyress vs the boss. I can use the expert's exps to help with releases if need be if Dylan is taking up XP there.

When I brought up Ancient forest, I meant the first time around. But like you said, its going to be impossible to actually break off a part (gogo level 2 parties!), so Chateau might be the only way to go (or you can completely skip magician slayer, but I dont think you would save time that way, since magician slayer helps for 4 battles, and it only takes like around a minute to get in and out of Chateau with the rune).

Thanks for the input! Haha you really do learn something new every day, even with a game you've ran through 3 times already.

Haha, oh wow, I so didn't even know those shells existed (I'm such a nub), but my lezard fights weren't long so I dont think it is worth it to get those stones to shells (and fight those battles, especially since your saying ooze would be a pain, and most likely will be).

Phyress owns up Odin just fine. If someone else wants to do the run with Rufus or something, maybe poison is the way to go for Odin =) (which unforuntately would make that battle quite long)

Brahms won't be in any battles to actually learn skills, the transferring of the troll and silmeria/lezard doesnt allow you to get skill points (heck no-leader battles also dont give you skill points) Well he will from the non-homunculus lezard, but I want magician slayer and fists of iron for that battle. Random battles are not an option. I don't think using Dylan will be that much worse off than using Arngrim, but we'll see. If it is, then I can just have Dylan stand to the side for a boss battle. Since most of my boss battles are just Phyress vs the boss. I can use the expert's exps to help with releases if need be if Dylan is taking up XP there.

When I brought up Ancient forest, I meant the first time around. But like you said, its going to be impossible to actually break off a part (gogo level 2 parties!), so Chateau might be the only way to go (or you can completely skip magician slayer, but I dont think you would save time that way, since magician slayer helps for 4 battles, and it only takes like around a minute to get in and out of Chateau with the rune).

Thanks for the input! Haha you really do learn something new every day, even with a game you've ran through 3 times already.

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-11-07 04:31:12 pm

2006-11-04 03:29:33 am

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

Quote:

When I brought up Ancient forest, I meant the first time around. But like you said, its going to be impossible to actually break off a part (gogo level 2 parties!), so Chateau might be the only way to go (or you can completely skip magician slayer, but I dont think you would save time that way, since magician slayer helps for 4 battles, and it only takes like around a minute to get in and out of Chateau with the rune).

Thanks for the input! Haha you really do learn something new every day, even with a game you've ran through 3 times already.

I'm not sure if you understood me or not, but I'll clarify. If you're talking about whether it's faster to go to Chateau to get a rune, or to go to Ancient Forest to get a rune, I say Ancient Forest always. Let's say you're coming out of the Dragonscrypt (or Crawsus, which I assume are the two best choices-it doesn't matter which of the two, or wherever at all). The map travel time difference is going to be virtually negligible between the two of them. But in the forest, the monsters are much easier, meaning you will break a part (and get out of a fight) more quickly.

Haha, I feel the same way about learning new things. I haven't finished Hard though, and my test run fell apart, so I'm actually "only" at two runthroughs right now.

[quote]When I brought up Ancient forest, I meant the first time around. But like you said, its going to be impossible to actually break off a part (gogo level 2 parties!), so Chateau might be the only way to go (or you can completely skip magician slayer, but I dont think you would save time that way, since magician slayer helps for 4 battles, and it only takes like around a minute to get in and out of Chateau with the rune).

Thanks for the input! Haha you really do learn something new every day, even with a game you've ran through 3 times already. [/quote]
I'm not sure if you understood me or not, but I'll clarify.  If you're talking about whether it's faster to go to Chateau to get a rune, or to go to Ancient Forest to get a rune, I say Ancient Forest always.  Let's say you're coming out of the Dragonscrypt (or Crawsus, which I assume are the two best choices-it doesn't matter which of the two, or wherever at all).  The map travel time difference is going to be virtually negligible between the two of them.  But in the forest, the monsters are much easier, meaning you will break a part (and get out of a fight) more quickly.

Haha, I feel the same way about learning new things.  I haven't finished Hard though, and my test run fell apart, so I'm actually "only" at two runthroughs right now.

Aborash

2006-11-06 02:21:47 pm

I h8 YaBB!

Guys, when are you gonna let us watch your Speedrun?

Really cant wait to see it Grin

Alkaiser77

Edit history:

Alkaiser77: 2006-11-11 02:15:52 pm

2006-11-11 02:04:21 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Ah, I've had a busy week so I couldn't reply. I'll be doing this run over Thanksgiving weekend, whichever day I'll be free. So Aborash, you'll have to wait until then (along with the month+ grace period or so to get verifiers and the vid verified).

Well, I wanted to make sure I could do a sub 3:30 before actually doing it, so here I am doing a third practice run. I just started chapter 4 and passed Sekulvia Gorge, and I'm 10-15 minutes ahead of my previous time(Previously, I was at the 2 hour mark at the save point right before Ull. Now, after Sekulvia Gorge I have 1:39 on the clock, although I'm trying out spineshark's suggestion of going back to Ancient Forest and getting the red weakness rune there. I'm guessing getting the rune and getting to that save point will take 5-10 minutes) . Looks like I'll need around 2-10 minutes of improvements to go to reach 3:30, and I have half the game left, so it's looking good.
One thing I noticed on this run is that I had 145 crystals before the Wyvern. If I could knock out 5 more crystals from bosses/forced battles, I'd have to fight one less battle on the plains. That would save around one minute. I'll look into this.

Another good thing is that I'm saving less and less, and getting a feel on how to segment this.
One thing I really wish I could change but probably end up not is having a 2 minute-ish segment in the beginning to the first save point. It's beyond annoying to get both Kraad and Richelle (1/8 chance, tho with the way pseudoranomness works - most likely having it based on the clock - makes this even more annoying) and having to do those 2 minutes over and over. On average its taken me 15 tries to get both, thus it seems really tempting to just have that segment =/. But we'll see, if I have a lot of free time whichever day I'll record, maybe I'll just keep doing new games until I get both.
Also, will there be any complains if there are around 30 segments in this? I want to segment this as much as possible to get the best time, bosses especially. Anything can go wrong, and I want everything to go right ;D.

Ah, I've had a busy week so I couldn't reply. I'll be doing this run over Thanksgiving weekend, whichever day I'll be free. So Aborash, you'll have to wait until then (along with the month+ grace period or so to get verifiers and the vid verified).

Well, I wanted to make sure I could do a sub 3:30 before actually doing it, so here I am doing a third practice run. I just started chapter 4 and passed Sekulvia Gorge, and I'm 10-15 minutes ahead of my previous time(Previously, I was at the 2 hour mark at the save point right before Ull. Now, after Sekulvia Gorge I have 1:39 on the clock, although I'm trying out spineshark's suggestion of going back to Ancient Forest and getting the red weakness rune there. I'm guessing getting the rune and getting to that save point will take 5-10 minutes) . Looks like I'll need around 2-10 minutes of improvements to go to reach 3:30, and I have half the game left, so it's looking good.
        One thing I noticed on this run is that I had 145 crystals before the Wyvern. If I could knock out 5 more crystals from bosses/forced battles, I'd have to fight one less battle on the plains. That would save around one minute. I'll look into this.

Another good thing is that I'm saving less and less, and getting a feel on how to segment this. 
        One thing I really wish I could change but probably end up not is having a 2 minute-ish segment in the beginning to the first save point. It's beyond annoying to get both Kraad and Richelle (1/8 chance, tho with the way pseudoranomness works - most likely having it based on the clock - makes this even more annoying) and having to do those 2 minutes over and over. On average its taken me 15 tries to get both, thus it seems really tempting to just have that segment =/. But we'll see, if I have a lot of free time whichever day I'll record, maybe I'll just keep doing new games until I get both.
        Also, will there be any complains if there are around 30 segments in this? I want to segment this as much as possible to get the best time, bosses especially. Anything can go wrong, and I want everything to go right  ;D.

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-11-11 03:54:06 pm

2006-11-11 03:52:22 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

Nearly everybody that I know of would probably tell you that you should segment as much as it takes to get the best time you possibly can. If a save point isn't out of your way, I'd probably nearly always use it. But, say, after Odin, I wouldn't save right away, since you'd have to go backwards. Plus especially in that case the save is right there anyway.

For crystals...you should be able to get some from the Primordial Ooze, though that sounds sorta annoying. You'd also have to know exactly how many you need. Ouch.

Alkaiser77

Edit history:

Alkaiser77: 2006-11-12 05:37:01 am

2006-11-12 04:36:37 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Ok, I just finished my 3rd practice run. Final save point time of 2:59 (http://img120.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vp2ih9.jpg - for those who haven't played the game and don't want to be spoiled, don't click), final boss battle of 12 minutes. 3:11! Man, sub 3 just may be possible. I played really well though this time around, so I dunno if I can come up with 11 minutes in improvements....but I'm already really satisfied with this time, so you guys will probably be getting something around this.

Alkaiser77

2006-11-15 11:06:07 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Well, with some help from crate33 from Gamefaqs, I think I've come up with enough changes to bring up 11 minutes in improvements. So, to everyone looking forward to this run (all 5-10 of you! =P) expect a sub 3 hour run whenever this gets posted.

KareemZ.

2006-11-16 01:40:04 am

Hello!

Iam Setho_O from Gfaqs.

I am probably repeating myself : Good luck.
I am looking forward on seeying this

Pssst : Put it on Youtube.com or Archive.org before here.

Alkaiser77

2006-11-23 11:48:53 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Well, the time's almost come for me to do a recorded run. I just finished a mini test run, cleaning up my early half of the game. At Crawsus, I'm ahead of my 3:11 schedule by 8 minutes. So, I'm almost completely sure sub 3 is possible (3-4 minute savings with so much of the game left has to be possible). On another note, Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

Alkaiser77

Edit history:

Alkaiser77: 2006-11-27 01:23:45 pm

2006-11-27 01:04:17 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

IT'S OVERRRR!!! Man, recording a speedrun is a LOT more frustrating than just playing one. I guess the pressure gets to me. Well, I broke the 3 hour mark ... by quite a bit too. Final save time of 2:38:45 + approx a 7:15 final battle - 2:46:00 ish endgame time. I dunno if I want to send in the DVDs to Mike/Nate, or encode them myself. I'll most likely have my decision tomorrow. Overall I'm quite satisfied with the run - its "good" but no where near perfect, I hope people keep that in mind before watching. The forest of spirits in particular...I just could not jump over those 2 plant mini bosses (well I did once out of the 4 jumps you need to make, and I attempted them many many many times). All the bosses went really well though. I seriously could not have hoped for better Evolver battles. Well, hopefully this run gets posted in soonish. To the verifiers (and regular viewers), have fun watching this run! It was way more fun than I thought it would be, I originally thought this would be a chore.

Though one thing that really really really pisses me off, though its entirely my fault, is that I overwrote my original game -_-. There goes my 11 SG, perfect released boosted Freya and Angel Slayer....sigh...Oh well, there was nothing left to do in the game.

IT'S OVERRRR!!! Man, recording a speedrun is a LOT more frustrating than just playing one. I guess the pressure gets to me. Well, I broke the 3 hour mark ... by quite a bit too. Final save time of 2:38:45 + approx a 7:15 final battle - 2:46:00 ish endgame time. I dunno if I want to send in the DVDs to Mike/Nate, or encode them myself. I'll most likely have my decision tomorrow. Overall I'm quite satisfied with the run - its "good" but no where near perfect, I hope people keep that in mind before watching. The forest of spirits in particular...I just could not jump over those 2 plant mini bosses (well I did once out of the 4 jumps you need to make, and I attempted them many many many times). All the bosses went really well though. I seriously could not have hoped for better Evolver battles. Well, hopefully this run gets posted in soonish. To the verifiers (and regular viewers), have fun watching this run! It was way more fun than I thought it would be, I originally thought this would be a chore.

Though one thing that really really really pisses me off, though its entirely my fault, is that I overwrote my original game -_-. There goes my 11 SG, perfect released boosted Freya and Angel Slayer....sigh...Oh well, there was nothing left to do in the game.

getter77

2006-11-27 02:33:01 pm

100% runs=great to watch

Congrats on your success Grin

and condolences on your perfect file loss. Cry

Marty81

2006-11-27 05:49:29 pm

Wow. That's one hell of a time. Congrats.

I'd be happy to be a verifier for this.