FEZ

2013-05-04 03:41:30 pm

Since it seems we're going to use system time tampering in our runs, I did some tests with the clock tower and it appears that the moment you create your save file, the arms default to "9 o'clock" and start ticking forward. This means that we could predict when we are going to reach the clock tower, calculate what we need to change the time to and make the changes during one of the cutscenes.

I tested this by adding "-l zu_library" to the launch options, which places Gomez outside of the library (adjacent to the clock tower - starting in the clock tower makes the clock hands freeze) when you start a new game. Digging through the code confirms that save creation time and the clock arms are tied to each other.

If anyone wants to go have a look at the game's code or anything, here's a relevant GameFAQs thread: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/945079-fez/66110193

Freddeh

Edit history:

Freddeh: 2013-05-04 05:21:51 pm

Freddeh: 2013-05-04 04:28:19 pm

2013-05-04 03:53:52 pm

I'm actually working on getting batch files set up for changing system time right now as well! Will let you know once I find a more exact timing.

Woah, I just glitched something and it gave me an extra anticube where the red one spawns...I wonder if that's reproduceable.

Glitching an extra anticube from the clock tower is very reproduceable it seems, it looks like it has something to do with turning the red hand back over where the window is when you change the clock, so it spawns a 'fake' one and then the real one spawns basically on top of it. One time (not on stream unfortunately) I was able to get 3 or 4 cubes from the same spot, but I was unable to reproduce that consistently.

Patashu

2013-05-04 05:32:52 pm

in b4 infinite anticubes

Sloth

2013-05-04 05:37:41 pm

Glitching yourself infinite anti cubes is very easy. You can just google a guide for it but this makes the game stupid so we don't use it.

Freddeh

2013-05-04 10:23:14 pm

Nevermind then, back to practice!

Sloth

2013-05-05 02:35:05 pm

Okay, so with the new duping of cubes at the clock tower and other stuff I feel the need to make a list of the categories and rules for each category. So far we have:

Any%: Pretty obvious, duping allowed, no restrictions.
Any% Dupe-less: No duplicating of cubes, every individual cube may only be acquired once.
Yellow Cubes: Must acquire all yellow cubes.
Yellow Cubes Dupe-less: (I don't think you can dupe any yellow cubes yet so, this might not be a category)
209.4%: Must achieve 209.4% completion (all cubes, anti cubes and red cubes), no restrictions
209.4% Dupe-less: Achieve 209.4% completion, no duplicating of cubes.
All Collectibles: Acquire all collectibles in the game (All Cubes, Anti Cubes, Red Cubes, Maps, Artifacts and Keys) no restrictions
All Collectibles Dupe-less: Acquire all collectibles, No duplicating.

In anybody has any input on these categories I would love to hear it.
Also, an update on Any% Dupe-less, The new WR is 32:05.5 by myself.

Onin

2013-05-05 02:42:17 pm

How does duping affect 209,4%?

Sloth

2013-05-05 03:07:53 pm

Duping a cube increases your %. It's possible to dupe 32 anti cubes and get the 100% from those. You wouldn't because a lot of anti cubes are fast but it would still save a large amount of time.

qbicfeet

Edit history:

qbicfeet: 2013-05-06 01:09:48 am

qbicfeet: 2013-05-06 01:09:38 am

2013-05-06 01:05:54 am

Those categories sound good, Sloth. Only thing that needs to be addressed is the Up Up Up Up A flying command. I'd say it should counts as a cheat code and should not be allowed in runs, but that's just me.

Also, when does the game 'end' in 209,4% and All Collectibles? Just before the 64 cube ending? Or should disintegrating the heart in the Temple of Love also be a requirement?

Edit: oops

Quote:

- Fixed cloning/duplicate/infinite anti-cube glitch

Either we decide on a definite version, or we just play along with the patches (because there are still a lot of technical issues that could get in the way on previous versions).

UberGoose

2013-05-06 02:20:37 pm

Well, seeing as the patch gets rid of half of the categories, that probably wont be run anyway, the current patch would be ideal (for now).

Sloth

2013-05-06 05:50:00 pm

I agree that the current patch is ideal. To my knowledge nobody was planning on running any of the Duplication categories so it's not really an issue. Also, again, flying in this game is developer included and intended. It's certainly not a cheat, no more than every single anti cube that requires button inputs, and it involves completing the game and starting a new game+ to be able to use. If it is determined that completing the game once and collecting the rest using flying is faster in 209.4 or all collectibles then i don't see why not. Anyways, if it is, you can just have a no flying category. If this was the case, i would probably run the no-flying category because it seems more fun but this still isn't a reason to ban its use.

Freddeh

2013-05-06 06:21:48 pm

Could just have separate categories for New Game and NG+ for both any% and 209.4%. Now that the Dupes are gone that leaves room for those without having too many categories.

UberGoose

2013-05-06 06:30:00 pm

True, but flying doesn't even seem fun imo. You skip every bit of optimization available in the game and it just turns into flying to the cube and entering whatever code you need.

gleebzz

2013-05-06 09:07:35 pm

i agree with sloth. flying should be like caping in SMW in my opinion. just add the ", no flying" to the category i guess.

qbicfeet

Edit history:

qbicfeet: 2013-05-07 03:08:27 pm

2013-05-07 01:57:45 pm

Got 31:34 on my most recent run. Currently rendering + uploading, the only "big" change to Sloth's route is that I go into the ruined stargate room and pick up two cube bits there instead of the two cube bits in the Polytron HQ area. Also I seem to have shorter loading times, so I'm not sure how many seconds saved are thanks to that.

A near perfect run *should* be sub 31.

My clock tower strategy is to set my clock to 23:59:45 prior to running, start the run on 00:00:00, quickly set the clock to +1 day 17:50:00 (this gives me ~25 minutes to get to the hour cube) during the zoom-in (the game doesn't pause if made inactive during these) and lastly, during the second zoom-in after the reboot, "pre-load" the clock prompt with 06:00:00 so that I can get the 24 hour cube with a single press of a button.

jfryk

Edit history:

jfryk: 2013-05-07 09:45:53 pm

2013-05-07 09:43:36 pm

Forgive me if this is old news but I didn't find it in a brief search. I was at a door when I was trying to activate flying and instead of playing the transition/loading animation it instantly loaded the level but put me in a location other than the door I entered through. Very easy to repro and I'm sure it's been found. Just couldn't find it in a search and thought it was worth mentioning.

Edit: This is on doors that zoom-in and transition to the level behind you. Like the islands of the light-blue warp hub.

qbicfeet

2013-05-08 01:43:47 am

Here it is:

jfryk

2013-05-08 03:19:38 am

Cool thanks, I'm loving this game. I need to check out the run once I'm finished playing through it. Those slow transitions were killing me.

cracrayol

Edit history:

cracrayol: 2013-05-10 06:45:47 am

cracrayol: 2013-05-10 06:09:59 am

cracrayol: 2013-05-09 06:32:49 pm

cracrayol: 2013-05-09 06:32:32 pm

2013-05-09 05:44:34 pm

Hi,

I've made an "All Collectibles Dupe-less" + All map in gold in about 1h54m10s.
I know it's not a perfect run. There is some mistakes (sometimes big) and some optimisations to do but, for me ,who isn't a "pro" speedrun (it's my first attempt to make a speedrun), it's good enough. Also, I didn't make SS because, until now, i didn't know that it was possible to change time in-game for the clock tower ^^.
But, because i've played fez too much these days (I'm dreaming of it ^^ and takingno more pleasure), i'm stopping here for the moment.

So, here is the 4 parts of the run :

Hamachiro

2013-05-10 09:19:46 am

Quote from Sloth:

Okay, so with the new duping of cubes at the clock tower and other stuff I feel the need to make a list of the categories and rules for each category. So far we have:

Any%: Pretty obvious, duping allowed, no restrictions.
Any% Dupe-less: No duplicating of cubes, every individual cube may only be acquired once.
Yellow Cubes: Must acquire all yellow cubes.
Yellow Cubes Dupe-less: (I don't think you can dupe any yellow cubes yet so, this might not be a category)
209.4%: Must achieve 209.4% completion (all cubes, anti cubes and red cubes), no restrictions
209.4% Dupe-less: Achieve 209.4% completion, no duplicating of cubes.
All Collectibles: Acquire all collectibles in the game (All Cubes, Anti Cubes, Red Cubes, Maps, Artifacts and Keys) no restrictions
All Collectibles Dupe-less: Acquire all collectibles, No duplicating.

In anybody has any input on these categories I would love to hear it.
Also, an update on Any% Dupe-less, The new WR is 32:05.5 by myself.

I would like to point out something about 209.4% dupe-less, i think this category will be quite ridiculous due to a few anti-cube in one specific room, the one with the 4 dimentional clock, i don't think it's that of a good idea, in runs these cube should be skipped, the only way to get them quickly will make the run "TAS"-ish (also i don't wanna spoil anything so that why i am not exact in what i say, altrough you might all understand it)

[quote="Sloth"]Okay, so with the new duping of cubes at the clock tower and other stuff I feel the need to make a list of the categories and rules for each category. So far we have:

Any%: Pretty obvious, duping allowed, no restrictions.
Any% Dupe-less: No duplicating of cubes, every individual cube may only be acquired once.
Yellow Cubes: Must acquire all yellow cubes.
Yellow Cubes Dupe-less: (I don't think you can dupe any yellow cubes yet so, this might not be a category)
209.4%: Must achieve 209.4% completion (all cubes, anti cubes and red cubes), no restrictions
209.4% Dupe-less: Achieve 209.4% completion, no duplicating of cubes.
All Collectibles: Acquire all collectibles in the game (All Cubes, Anti Cubes, Red Cubes, Maps, Artifacts and Keys) no restrictions
All Collectibles Dupe-less: Acquire all collectibles, No duplicating.

In anybody has any input on these categories I would love to hear it.
Also, an update on Any% Dupe-less, The new WR is 32:05.5 by myself.[/quote]

I would like to point out something about 209.4% dupe-less, i think this category will be quite ridiculous due to a few anti-cube in one specific room, the one with the 4 dimentional clock, i don't think it's that of a good idea, in runs these cube should be skipped, the only way to get them quickly will make the run "TAS"-ish (also i don't wanna spoil anything so that why i am not exact in what i say, altrough you might all understand it)

gleebzz

Edit history:

gleebzz: 2013-05-10 09:42:20 am

2013-05-10 09:41:23 am

Quote from Hamachiro:

I would like to point out something about 209.4% dupe-less, i think this category will be quite ridiculous due to a few anti-cube in one specific room, the one with the 4 dimentional clock, i don't think it's that of a good idea, in runs these cube should be skipped, the only way to get them quickly will make the run "TAS"-ish (also i don't wanna spoil anything so that why i am not exact in what i say, altrough you might all understand it)

we talked about this. we are sort of split on whether going outside the game to collect the clock cubes fast is allowed or not. so far it is allowed in any% (which makes sense). for the other catagories i dont know if its been hashed out yet. i wouldn't dont worry about spoilers. people trying to speedrun a game have most likely already completed it.

(also. nice runs cracrayol, qb, and sloth!)

qbicfeet

2013-05-10 10:08:38 am

Quote from Hamachiro:

I would like to point out something about 209.4% dupe-less, i think this category will be quite ridiculous due to a few anti-cube in one specific room, the one with the 4 dimentional clock, i don't think it's that of a good idea, in runs these cube should be skipped, the only way to get them quickly will make the run "TAS"-ish (also i don't wanna spoil anything so that why i am not exact in what i say, altrough you might all understand it)

We do it in any% and it doesn't interfere with the game very much or makes the run feel "cheated" IMO. If we didn't use it, it would take us 1 day and 17 hours to get max completion, which sort of defeats the entire point of speed running. If you watch my any% run you can see that changing the system clock is super quick, super easy and can be done during certain cut scenes that you can't skip anyway.

Hamachiro

2013-05-10 02:38:47 pm

i know but in 209.4% we have to collect all (if not duped) so i think we should eitheir allow it or don't run max% otherwise it will be ridiculous, only Seg runs could do it. so i think we should allow that imho

qbicfeet

Edit history:

qbicfeet: 2013-05-10 02:52:01 pm

2013-05-10 02:51:39 pm

Quote from Hamachiro:

i know but in 209.4% we have to collect all (if not duped) so i think we should eitheir allow it or don't run max% otherwise it will be ridiculous, only Seg runs could do it. so i think we should allow that imho

"regular" duping was patched either way. Currently the only way to do it is to change your system clock at the same time you pick up the clock tower cubes so you'd have to do it anyway Smiley

Sloth

2013-05-10 05:28:03 pm

Quote:

i know but in 209.4% we have to collect all (if not duped) so i think we should eitheir allow it or don't run max% otherwise it will be ridiculous, only Seg runs could do it. so i think we should allow that imho

This is pretty silly, obviously it's going to be allowed in every category where its required :P. We've already began using it in any% and every other category it's either required or useless. 209.4, required, All Collectibles, required, 32 Golds, Useless.