Digimon World for PSX

2010-09-17 04:10:38 pm

Just a boy and his digimon

Getting to 1 year of in-game time is a medal that is a pure waste of time. The only thing you can do is rest or train for no reason until you hit one year. That would probably be at least an hour of just resting. Also, the medal for catching 100 fish certainly wouldn't be very interesting to watch. An hour of fishing would be almost as bad as resting. It seems pointless to only collect some of the medals, though. It would feel incomplete to call it a 100% game and say "look, I collected all of the medals (that I thought were worth it)" and then show off your half-full medal collection.

So, personally, I also lean towards just prosperity points, but I didn't want to say what my opinion was on the matter before getting some other perspectives, as I didn't want to bias them with what I would like it to be.

Monzaemon can take on pretty much anyone when he is freshly digivolved if you have the right number of small recoveries Tongue

. And as for the sanctuary, I can safely say that he can. I originally put ice sanctuary in my test run, but I realized that it requires multiple battles and is out of the way from everything else, so I scrapped that idea. But, I did successfully do it with Monzaemon, so he is definitely allowed in. Digivolving to Monzy is very difficult to do without the Monzaemon suit, though. So, in order to do it inside of the mansion, you would need to train up numemon. He actually receives fewer points from each training session and would take longer to turn into an ultimate than just about any other digimon. Worse than that: there's no guarantee he would survive long enough to become an ultimate. Theoretically, you could throw all of your chips at numemon, but that means you would have to win battles as numemon to get those chips, which is near impossible, because numemon is useless. And throwing chips at numemon would hurt my soul a little.
On the other hand, raising Greymon is an interesting idea, but still leaves the problem of needing numemon in order to get to Warumonzaemon. They only open the doors for Monzy.

As for HalfMillennium, that plan also seems very solid. The only problem is that your plan requires both getting Monzaemon and then training to get a full-fledged Giromon. It seems like, if you couldn't get it done with one digimon, then the Mysty Egg would make for a sufficient virus ultimate without needing to train at all. Using the item could cut off 15-20 minutes of training. Also, using Hairgrower could help cut additional time off getting Bakemon.
Furthermore, your plan gets two vaccine ultimates, rather than one vaccine and one virus. Beating Skullgreymon with Bakemon could be even more difficult than beating it with Digitamamon, in addition to taking longer. I'm really sorry that I keep disagreeing with you. Personally, having played this game as much as I have, it always feels wrong not training my digimon so I understand why you feel like training is the best option, but I do believe that it is faster not to, so I am trying to go against my instincts.
And, I think that your definition of 100% seems reasonable. If I was the one doing it, I think I'd be up for the challenge of beating both Machinedramon battles. The only problem is that, I think that he has max stats and is supposed to only take 1 damage from your hits if you don't have 999 strength. So, it might not be feasible without a crapload of extra training. But, if it can be done, then I'd be game.

Getting to 1 year of in-game time is a medal that is a pure waste of time. The only thing you can do is rest or train for no reason until you hit one year. That would probably be at least an hour of just resting. Also, the medal for catching 100 fish certainly wouldn't be very interesting to watch. An hour of fishing would be almost as bad as resting. It seems pointless to only collect some of the medals, though. It would feel incomplete to call it a 100% game and say "look, I collected all of the medals (that I thought were worth it)" and then show off your half-full medal collection.

So, personally, I also lean towards just prosperity points, but I didn't want to say what my opinion was on the matter before getting some other perspectives, as I didn't want to bias them with what I would like it to be.

Monzaemon can take on pretty much anyone when he is freshly digivolved if you have the right number of small recoveries :P . And as for the sanctuary, I can safely say that he can. I originally put ice sanctuary in my test run, but I realized that it requires multiple battles and is out of the way from everything else, so I scrapped that idea. But, I did successfully do it with Monzaemon, so he is definitely allowed in. Digivolving to Monzy is very difficult to do without the Monzaemon suit, though. So, in order to do it inside of the mansion, you would need to train up numemon. He actually receives fewer points from each training session and would take longer to turn into an ultimate than just about any other digimon. Worse than that: there's no guarantee he would survive long enough to become an ultimate. Theoretically, you could throw all of your chips at numemon, but that means you would have to win battles as numemon to get those chips, which is near impossible, because numemon is useless. And throwing chips at numemon would hurt my soul a little. 
On the other hand, raising Greymon is an interesting idea, but still leaves the problem of needing numemon in order to get to Warumonzaemon. They only open the doors for Monzy.

As for HalfMillennium, that plan also seems very solid. The only problem is that your plan requires both getting Monzaemon and then training to get a full-fledged Giromon. It seems like, if you couldn't get it done with one digimon, then the Mysty Egg would make for a sufficient virus ultimate without needing to train at all. Using the item could cut off 15-20 minutes of training. Also, using Hairgrower could help cut additional time off getting Bakemon.
Furthermore, your plan gets two vaccine ultimates, rather than one vaccine and one virus. Beating Skullgreymon with Bakemon could be even more difficult than beating it with Digitamamon, in addition to taking longer. I'm really sorry that I keep disagreeing with you. Personally, having played this game as much as I have, it always feels wrong not training my digimon so I understand why you feel like training is the best option, but I do believe that it is faster not to, so I am trying to go against my instincts.
 And, I think that your definition of 100% seems reasonable. If I was the one doing it, I think I'd be up for the challenge of beating both Machinedramon battles. The only problem is that, I think that he has max stats and is supposed to only take 1 damage from your hits if you don't have 999 strength. So, it might not be feasible without a crapload of extra training. But, if it can be done, then I'd be game.

Baron Dante

Edit history:

Baron Dante: 2010-09-18 05:01:58 am

Baron Dante: 2010-09-18 04:57:07 am

Baron Dante: 2010-09-18 04:56:20 am

2010-09-18 04:53:54 am

It's a BIG HEAD!

You can beat Machinedramons Defence boosting skill (The one ot starts with and after that, only takes 1 damage expect for FINISH) by having a digimon tha can use that same move (Pretty much any digi with machine skills)

I wasn't sure If Greymon could get to the Sanctuary though.

It seems that one will need 2 digimons anyways: Numemon and a digimon that can evolve from Sanctuary to Mansion.

One way to do it with one Digimon though: Start with Agu/Gabu (No really?), have hm evolve into Nume, go to Town Town, beat alot of stuff (Including Digitamamon and Sanctuary). have his poopmeter fill, and then feed Suka an Mysty Egg. (Or, even better, an digivolution item that makes him a machine digimon like Andromon, to make Machi2nd faster to kill)

Also yeah, I agree with with having to beat Machi2nd + 100 Prosp.

EDIT: Or, one could have a Sanctuaryable Champion, and then, at after being 360 hours at Champion, get an Vademon to Mansion (In that time, you'd have done all other stuff though)

EDIT2: Digitamamon is not Virus -.-

Maybe Sanctuary could be got to with Monzy, then beating Etemon (at 50 pros points?) then buying Gold Banana from him, degivolving to Suka and then feeding the Banaan to him?) and do Mansion?

You can beat Machinedramons Defence boosting skill (The one ot starts with and after that, only takes 1 damage expect for FINISH) by having a digimon tha can use that same move (Pretty much any digi with machine skills)

I wasn't sure If Greymon could get to the Sanctuary though.

It seems that one will need 2 digimons anyways: Numemon and a digimon that can evolve from Sanctuary to Mansion.

One way to do it with one Digimon though: Start with Agu/Gabu (No really?), have hm evolve into Nume, go to Town Town, beat alot of stuff (Including Digitamamon and Sanctuary). have his poopmeter fill, and then feed Suka an Mysty Egg. (Or, even better, an digivolution item that makes him a machine digimon like Andromon, to make Machi2nd faster to kill)

Also yeah, I agree with with having to beat Machi2nd + 100 Prosp.

EDIT: Or, one could have a Sanctuaryable Champion, and then, at after being 360 hours at Champion, get an Vademon to Mansion (In that time, you'd have done all other stuff though)

EDIT2: Digitamamon is not Virus -.-

Maybe Sanctuary could be got to with Monzy, then beating Etemon (at 50 pros points?) then buying Gold Banana from him, degivolving to Suka and then feeding the Banaan to him?) and do Mansion?

Jukebox_Hero

2010-09-18 12:28:55 pm

Just a boy and his digimon

Ah, crap. For some reason, I was totally positive that Digitamamon was a virus. Hmm, are we sure that you need a virus to enter? Or is it just that vaccines can't enter? I'm wondering how it treats data-types. I'm pretty certain you need a virus, but I'm willing to check. Crap. That throws my idea off.

If I could use the glitch to chain finishers, then I might be able to take down Machinedramon's 2nd fight with no problem once I get off the first one, even without a machine type. I don't know how many times a finisher can be chained though. For all I know, you might just be able to get off one extra. But double-finishers certainly wouldn't hurt.

You should beat the game loooooong before 360 hours as a champion, so Vademon doesn't seem like a good option. Golden Banana costs 50,000 BITs, which would require a lot of money-grinding and time spent. You'd be better off training to an ultimate in either of those cases. Andromon is data type, so he couldn't enter the mansion, but his item could conceivably be gotten by having drimogemon dig for treasure. But I don't know if the outcome of his treasure dig is determined by when you ask for it or when you pick it up. If it is determined by when you pick it up, then you can keep resetting until you got it. But, otherwise, it wouldn't be reasonable to try it.

So, at the moment, it seems like HalfMillenium's strategy is actually the most feasible. It would have to be either Bakemon to Giromon or Metal Greymon to Skullgreymon. I believe you can manipulate it so that you get Bakemon early if you train up brains and then lose a battle with your rookie. And Giromon would work well against Machinedramon's final fight. So, he is looking like the best option. But, the battle against Skullgreymon would still be very difficult with a Bakemon. I have to see if there is any better way. Maybe the chainsaw digivolution item could be gotten from the treasure dig in order to get giromon easier.

Sidenote: Still no progress to report on the current speedrun. Though I am now wondering if I should just use the in-game timer to keep track of my time. I have no idea how accurate it is, unfortunately.

Ah, crap. For some reason, I was totally positive that Digitamamon was a virus. Hmm, are we sure that you need a virus to enter? Or is it just that vaccines can't enter? I'm wondering how it treats data-types. I'm pretty certain you need a virus, but I'm willing to check. Crap. That throws my idea off.

If I could use the glitch to chain finishers, then I might be able to take down Machinedramon's 2nd fight with no problem once I get off the first one, even without a machine type. I don't know how many times a finisher can be chained though. For all I know, you might just be able to get off one extra. But double-finishers certainly wouldn't hurt.

You should beat the game loooooong before 360 hours as a champion, so Vademon doesn't seem like a good option. Golden Banana costs 50,000 BITs, which would require a lot of money-grinding and time spent. You'd be better off training to an ultimate in either of those cases. Andromon is data type, so he couldn't enter the mansion, but his item could conceivably be gotten by having drimogemon dig for treasure. But I don't know if the outcome of his treasure dig is determined by when you ask for it or when you pick it up. If it is determined by when you pick it up, then you can keep resetting until you got it. But, otherwise, it wouldn't be reasonable to try it.

So, at the moment, it seems like HalfMillenium's strategy is actually the most feasible. It would have to be either Bakemon to Giromon or Metal Greymon to Skullgreymon. I believe you can manipulate it so that you get Bakemon early if you train up brains and then lose a battle with your rookie. And Giromon would work well against Machinedramon's final fight. So, he is looking like the best option. But, the battle against Skullgreymon would still be very difficult with a Bakemon. I have to see if there is any better way. Maybe the chainsaw digivolution item could be gotten from the treasure dig in order to get giromon easier.

Sidenote: Still no progress to report on the current speedrun. Though I am now wondering if I should just use the in-game timer to keep track of my time. I have no idea how accurate it is, unfortunately.

Baron Dante

2010-09-18 04:51:55 pm

It's a BIG HEAD!

Note that Metal Greymon (Can use Machine skills IIRC) is a virus aswell, so if he is an feasible option, he can also be used to blow Skully off.

HalfMillennium

2010-09-18 04:55:03 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

The medal is for ten years. That almost certainly puts it out of range even if you go for all the other medals.

I picked Giromon because he requires very little training (three Parameters, all less than 50%) and two of his other requirements (low weight, lots of care mistakes) can easily be achieved by not feeding him much. With Bakemon, you can use Thunder Bolt to beat SkullGreymon. Giromon would need to learn Full Power from Mamemon - would the luck be worth it?

Baron Dante

2010-09-18 05:02:33 pm

It's a BIG HEAD!

Also, you shouldn't use the in-game timer. -.-

Giromon should be able to learn it through training brains in a segmented one.

Jukebox_Hero

Edit history:

Jukebox_Hero: 2010-09-18 11:26:14 pm

2010-09-18 11:23:32 pm

Just a boy and his digimon

Hmmm, at this point I have seriously been wondering just how much of a baller I am. I am wondering if it is feasible to beat Skullgreymon with numemon if I threw enough items at numemon. Because, if it was a ten minute long fight, then that would still be faster than training up a whole new digimon. But this is a serious long-shot.
I keep thinking of items to get a good ultimate to face Skullgreymon, but none seem to work. First, I thought of Mysty Egg. Then, I thought that maybe I could use the digivolution item that allows you to turn into megaseadramon. There's a 1 in 100 chance of getting it while fishing, so it could theoretically be done in a segmented run, but megaseadramon is a data-type. You can pick up a ray gun in back dimension, but obviously, that only becomes available after you have beaten the mansion.

I'd forgotten that the game only included the blue virus version of MetalGreymon for some reason. But he would still be more difficult to get than Giromon, I think, so I'm pretty sure I would still lean towards Giromon. As for learning moves, I would try to manipulate that through training in a 100%, since I would have to train there anyway. In the any%, I'll stick to learning them from required fights, though. It's annoying enough getting mamemon to appear. Trying to manipulate a tech out of that fight would make it way too annoying.

I just did a little test-run to clear a few things up. A few things I learned:
1) Drimogemon's treasure dig does not seem to be affected by the time that you pick up your item. I tried it three separate times at three separate times of day (one I did on a different day with a different digimon). Each time, I talked to him in a different position. No matter what, he gave me an Omnipotent every time. It seems like the item is determined from the moment you ask him to start the dig. Then you just have to wait.
2) Digivolution items do not raise your stats at all. The Monzaemon suit is an exception to this which had me confused. I went to a file where I had already beaten the game and gave hair grower and Mysty egg to a rookie. I wound up with a digitamamon with 300 HP and crap stats. So, even if it could be done with Digitamamon, he would be too weak for it. I assumed he would get certain base stats, as I never really used digivolution items other than the suit.
3) As expected, data types are not allowed in Myotismon's mansion. I tried with gabumon. (interestingly, he is data, while agumon is a vaccine).
4) The initial agumon recruitment fight actually can't be skipped. I got bored and tried to run past him, but even though you can outrun him, the game stops you at the bottom border and your character says "I can't get away from this guy".
5) Also, as expected, a sick gabumon will not pass out in Freezeland and be saved by Frigimon (possible that I didn't have him there long enough, but I'm going to call this confirmed that he can't do it). I'm going to try with Agumon at some point to be positive that getting him sick with moldy meat will prompt Frigimon helping you, but I don't see why it wouldn't.

Also, it seems like I did my math wrong and you don't get 1 prosperity point just for your character joining the town. Math isn't my strong point. But this shouldn't affect much. I'll go back and make sure everything else worked out alright and, worst case scenario, I'll just have to do a little curling during the any% to get Penguinmon and make up the point.

Also, interesting to note that I have just realized that some of the items that rarely drop in Centarumon's maze are autopilots. If I were to stop to get one, I could save a minute and 15 seconds of walking time off my first segment. I might have to go back and do this.

EDIT: Btw, in my standard playthrough file, the in-game timer reads 47 hours and I am only at 8 in-game years. So, getting 10 years is far beyond impossible in a speedrun. Just thought I would give a frame of reference. Maybe it could be done in 20 hours if you were resting constantly to make time pass quickly, but obviously, even that is ridiculous.

Hmmm, at this point I have seriously been wondering just how much of a baller I am. I am wondering if it is feasible to beat Skullgreymon with numemon if I threw enough items at numemon. Because, if it was a ten minute long fight, then that would still be faster than training up a whole new digimon. But this is a serious long-shot. 
I keep thinking of items to get a good ultimate to face Skullgreymon, but none seem to work. First, I thought of Mysty Egg. Then, I thought that maybe I could use the digivolution item that allows you to turn into megaseadramon. There's a 1 in 100 chance of getting it while fishing, so it could theoretically be done in a segmented run, but megaseadramon is a data-type. You can pick up a ray gun in back dimension, but obviously, that only becomes available after you have beaten the mansion.

I'd forgotten that the game only included the blue virus version of MetalGreymon for some reason. But he would still be more difficult to get than Giromon, I think, so I'm pretty sure I would still lean towards Giromon. As for learning moves, I would try to manipulate that through training in a 100%, since I would have to train there anyway. In the any%, I'll stick to learning them from required fights, though. It's annoying enough getting mamemon to appear. Trying to manipulate a tech out of that fight would make it way too annoying.

I just did a little test-run to clear a few things up. A few things I learned:
1) Drimogemon's treasure dig does not seem to be affected by the time that you pick up your item. I tried it three separate times at three separate times of day (one I did on a different day with a different digimon). Each time, I talked to him in a different position. No matter what, he gave me an Omnipotent every time. It seems like the item is determined from the moment you ask him to start the dig. Then you just have to wait. 
2) Digivolution items do not raise your stats at all. The Monzaemon suit is an exception to this which had me confused. I went to a file where I had already beaten the game and gave hair grower and Mysty egg to a rookie. I wound up with a digitamamon with 300 HP and crap stats. So, even if it could be done with Digitamamon, he would be too weak for it. I assumed he would get certain base stats, as I never really used digivolution items other than the suit.  
3) As expected, data types are not allowed in Myotismon's mansion. I tried with gabumon. (interestingly, he is data, while agumon is a vaccine). 
4) The initial agumon recruitment fight actually can't be skipped. I got bored and tried to run past him, but even though you can outrun him, the game stops you at the bottom border and your character says "I can't get away from this guy".
5) Also, as expected, a sick gabumon will not pass out in Freezeland and be saved by Frigimon (possible that I didn't have him there long enough, but I'm going to call this confirmed that he can't do it). I'm going to try with Agumon at some point to be positive that getting him sick with moldy meat will prompt Frigimon helping you, but I don't see why it wouldn't.

Also, it seems like I did my math wrong and you don't get 1 prosperity point just for your character joining the town. Math isn't my strong point. But this shouldn't affect much. I'll go back and make sure everything else worked out alright and, worst case scenario, I'll just have to do a little curling during the any% to get Penguinmon and make up the point.

Also, interesting to note that I have just realized that some of the items that rarely drop in Centarumon's maze are autopilots. If I were to stop to get one, I could save a minute and 15 seconds of walking time off my first segment. I might have to go back and do this.

EDIT: Btw, in my standard playthrough file, the in-game timer reads 47 hours and I am only at 8 in-game years. So, getting 10 years is far beyond impossible in a speedrun. Just thought I would give a frame of reference. Maybe it could be done in 20 hours if you were resting constantly to make time pass quickly, but obviously, even that is ridiculous.

Baron Dante

2010-09-19 03:33:54 am

It's a BIG HEAD!

I have to wonder why is Giromon an viable choice when he is not Virus? I thought mentioned it earlier. And since digivolve items don't add stats, it's easier to just go with Nume Cheesy

And Back Dimension is available as soon as you beat Mt. Infinity first time (There is the 20 or so day waiting time, but no need to do Mansion).

So you could get Vademon, but since the stats don't rise, that's useless.

Jukebox_Hero

2010-09-19 10:32:16 am

Just a boy and his digimon

Giromon is a viable choice because he comes from Bakemon, who is a virus. Beating Skullgreymon with Bakemon won't be easy, but certainly easier than with numemon. And I don't think I could consider it 100% if I didn't beat the mansion. Though, if I have to wait an additional 20 days before I could fight Machinedramon, then there's no way my Monzaemon would live that long. So, maybe training up to Giromon is my best option.

Btw, the moldy meat trick works like a charm with Agumon. He passes out before the end of the first screen and Frigimon picks him right up. Definitely worth it. Otherwise, you have to wait in Freezeland for 10 in-game hours (no sleeping, or it resets) before your digimon gets sick. So, this saves a very good deal of time.

Baron Dante

2010-09-19 02:06:51 pm

It's a BIG HEAD!

*headdesk* Oh well, then Giromon is the way to go, especially if you can find an viable way to have it learn Full Power. One thing I wonder is that what happens if an Virus Digimon digivolves into something else while in the Mansion? It would make SkullGreymon much easier if Bake could evolve into Giro while being there...

HalfMillennium

Edit history:

HalfMillennium: 2010-09-19 02:51:07 pm

2010-09-19 02:50:51 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

You can get to the Back Dimension once you've beaten Machinedramon.

Jukebox_Hero

2010-09-19 05:43:16 pm

Just a boy and his digimon

You mean that it can be done immediately after beating Machinedramon? If that's the case, then I might want to look into training Numemon like crazy and getting him to beat SkullGreymon. If I did the dirt-moving crap, I would get training to his health, offense, and defense. Plus, I would get 10,000 BITs to throw into small recoveries. Beating the whole game on one digimon would certainly be simpler (and more impressive). It seems like a waste to train numemon, but if the stats would carry over to Monzaemon, then it would make the rest of the game easier and I could beat the whole thing by day 15 once I got the rain plant to get Vegiemon.

Baron Dante

2010-09-20 02:04:34 am

It's a BIG HEAD!

I said about back dimension back there. But IIRC, it takes 25 days to open... But even after getting all dogomom (Vegi being the last presumably), would you just end it there? It's be more logcal to end it in either Digitamamon or BackDimension.

HalfMillennium

2010-09-20 01:52:10 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

The first time you go there, as far as I know of that, you can get there immediately after beating Machinedramon.

Jukebox_Hero

2010-09-20 07:02:23 pm

Just a boy and his digimon

Little update. I just tried making a super-powerful numemon to take on Skullgreymon. He made it through the mansion alright at first. Got him 2,000 HP, 1000 MP, 100 in every other stat, except brains, which was 300, so I could try the 'change' glitch. I also got him a better move: "odor spray". It seems like numemon actually has decaying stats. I got him to 308. A while later, he randomly had 295. All of his stats seem to just decrease over time. Aside from that, it seems like the supposed finisher glitch was a dud. I couldn't get it to work and tried 4 or 5 times. When I checked back, it only seemed to be from one source. Being a kid's game, it seems like Digimon had a lot of kids making up crap.
Anyway, I found out that you can only access Skullgreymon in the basement after getting shellmon, whose bulletin board informs you that Myotismon is retiring. When you go back to the mansion, Myotismon isn't there and you can go fight Skullgreymon. However, getting Shellmon entails beating Ogre fortress. When I failed at beating Ogremon's first encounter, even with 50 small recoveries and 7 MP floppies, I realized that the plan was doomed from the start. If I'd spent much more time training, then I wouldn't have time to beat the rest of the game. So, it looks like I'm sticking with Bakemon/Giromon as my finishers. I'll just have to deal with not beating the game on one digimon.
Though that does leave me with the question of how I want to allocate my chips? Do I give them all to Monzaemon so he can beat Mt. Inifnity easier, or do I save them for Bakemon/Giromon to make beating Skullgreymon and Machinedramon easier? I'm leaning towards Monzaemon, just because he fights more battles and he doesn't have the benefit of training, and I think making the majority of the battles go quicker with him will be the best time-saver. Theoretically, I could save some chips for Giromon, but I'm not sure how I would decide which to save. There are two brain chips and an MP chip in Grey Lord's Mansion that I would reserve for Bakemon, just because it would be out of my way to try to go there with numemon just for a few chips. The only reason I would want to do it before Bakemon was if there was a waiting period after freeing Myotismon before he will 'retire'.

As for ending the run, it isn't really more logical to end in one place or another. It is a little more climactic, and therefore entertaining to watch, if I end it with a decisive boss battle. But really, if I had to sit around waiting for the rain plant to be available and I could eat up some of that time with the Second Machinedramon fight, then there is no reason to sit around doing nothing for a longer period of time before Vegiemon, just so that I can beat Machinedramon last. But, if the difference is negligible one way or another, then I will go for beating Machinedramon last, to make it more interesting.
When I finish the any% run, I will turn that file into a test-file for some of the things I intend to do in the 100%. For now, I am still seeing if I can improve the first segment by picking up an autopilot in Centarumon's maze.

Little update. I just tried making a super-powerful numemon to take on Skullgreymon. He made it through the mansion alright at first. Got him 2,000 HP, 1000 MP, 100 in every other stat, except brains, which was 300, so I could try the 'change' glitch. I also got him a better move: "odor spray". It seems like numemon actually has decaying stats. I got him to 308. A while later, he randomly had 295. All of his stats seem to just decrease over time. Aside from that, it seems like the supposed finisher glitch was a dud. I couldn't get it to work and tried 4 or 5 times. When I checked back, it only seemed to be from one source. Being a kid's game, it seems like Digimon had a lot of kids making up crap. 
Anyway, I found out that you can only access Skullgreymon in the basement after getting shellmon, whose bulletin board informs you that Myotismon is retiring. When you go back to the mansion, Myotismon isn't there and you can go fight Skullgreymon. However, getting Shellmon entails beating Ogre fortress. When I failed at beating Ogremon's first encounter, even with 50 small recoveries and 7 MP floppies, I realized that the plan was doomed from the start. If I'd spent much more time training, then I wouldn't have time to beat the rest of the game. So, it looks like I'm sticking with Bakemon/Giromon as my finishers. I'll just have to deal with not beating the game on one digimon. 
Though that does leave me with the question of how I want to allocate my chips? Do I give them all to Monzaemon so he can beat Mt. Inifnity easier, or do I save them for Bakemon/Giromon to make beating Skullgreymon and Machinedramon easier? I'm leaning towards Monzaemon, just because he fights more battles and he doesn't have the benefit of training, and I think making the majority of the battles go quicker with him will be the best time-saver. Theoretically, I could save some chips for Giromon, but I'm not sure how I would decide which to save. There are two brain chips and an MP chip in Grey Lord's Mansion that I would reserve for Bakemon, just because it would be out of my way to try to go there with numemon just for a few chips. The only reason I would want to do it before Bakemon was if there was a waiting period after freeing Myotismon before he will 'retire'.

As for ending the run, it isn't really more logical to end in one place or another. It is a little more climactic, and therefore entertaining to watch, if I end it with a decisive boss battle. But really, if I had to sit around waiting for the rain plant to be available and I could eat up some of that time with the Second Machinedramon fight, then there is no reason to sit around doing nothing for a longer period of time before Vegiemon, just so that I can beat Machinedramon last. But, if the difference is negligible one way or another, then I will go for beating Machinedramon last, to make it more interesting. 
When I finish the any% run, I will turn that file into a test-file for some of the things I intend to do in the 100%. For now, I am still seeing if I can improve the first segment by picking up an autopilot in Centarumon's maze.

Baron Dante

2010-09-21 02:10:40 am

It's a BIG HEAD!

Ooh, I thought you knew you needed Shellmon, which I never managed to get, no matter what I tried. -.- I even knew how to get him and still failed.

Numemon sounds awesome. It gets weaker in time? Awesome, I want one!

That means that you should get Monzy ASAP after getting Nume, just purely to have a few more damage per hit.

Could I have the segemnts you've done so far to look?

Jukebox_Hero

2010-09-22 08:09:35 pm

Just a boy and his digimon

I'd gotten so focused on the requirements for the any% that I got rusty on the requirements for the 100%. I'd forgotten how you got into the basement.
And trust me, I do everything in my power to get rid of that crapheap as fast as possible. I won't be holding on to numemon any longer than I have to.
I actually just went back and re-did the first segment, so that I got an autopilot from Centarumon's maze. It worked out great. I cut an entire minute off of my previous time. Also, according to the new set of rules, it states that time begins when you gain control of your character. I don't know if I am technically answering the questions about whether I prefer night/day as my character or as myself. But I'll start timing there, which means that I start about 50 seconds into the video. So, it's down to 10:58ish now. Another 3-5 seconds could have theoretically been cut off of it if I could get Agumon to accept the autopilot on the first try without needing to scold him, but it was starting to drive me crazy, so I'm gonna say that I am satisfied with it for now. I've already cut close to 4 minutes off of the test time on it. And I managed to cut an additional 8 seconds off of segment 2 thanks to some luck with the drimogemon fight. So, that would count as about 8:20.
I'm not sure how I would send you the video, though. I tried rapidshare, but it was giving me problems and said there was some error. I could post it on youtube, but I'd feel weird hosting the run somewhere other than SDA. The files are also huge because I can't get any compression program to work. Segment one is just under 700 Mb. If you can figure out a way I could send them to you, then you're free to check them out., though.

I'd gotten so focused on the requirements for the any% that I got rusty on the requirements for the 100%. I'd forgotten how you got into the basement. 
And trust me, I do everything in my power to get rid of that crapheap as fast as possible. I won't be holding on to numemon any longer than I have to. 
I actually just went back and re-did the first segment, so that I got an autopilot from Centarumon's maze. It worked out great. I cut an entire minute off of my previous time. Also, according to the new set of rules, it states that time begins when you gain control of your character. I don't know if I am technically answering the questions about whether I prefer night/day as my character or as myself. But I'll start timing there, which means that I start about 50 seconds into the video. So, it's down to 10:58ish now. Another 3-5 seconds could have theoretically been cut off of it if I could get Agumon to accept the autopilot on the first try without needing to scold him, but it was starting to drive me crazy, so I'm gonna say that I am satisfied with it for now. I've already cut close to 4 minutes off of the test time on it. And I managed to cut an additional 8 seconds off of segment 2 thanks to some luck with the drimogemon fight. So, that would count as about 8:20. 
I'm not sure how I would send you the video, though. I tried rapidshare, but it was giving me problems and said there was some error. I could post it on youtube, but I'd feel weird hosting the run somewhere other than SDA.  The files are also huge because I can't get any compression program to work. Segment one is just under 700 Mb. If you can figure out a way I could send them to you, then you're free to check them out., though.

Baron Dante

2010-09-23 02:07:48 am

It's a BIG HEAD!

It's not a problem to have them up in Youtube. I have my (future, already accepted) run in youtube, and most of runs get there anyways. Smiley

You can also limit the videos to up to 25 persons, or only your friends. Wink

I want to see so I can try them out. BTW, do you use PS or PS2?

Harry9397

2010-09-23 04:29:47 pm

hello

I have never speedrun this game but this is one of my favorite games of all time, I really hope you do it Smiley

Jukebox_Hero

Edit history:

Jukebox_Hero: 2010-09-23 08:50:30 pm

2010-09-23 08:47:59 pm

Just a boy and his digimon

Thanks for the support, Harry. Hopefully, you'll enjoy the finished product. Nice to have the encouragement.

Alright, BD. I posted up the first two segments on youtube. I might redo them again, but I figure this should give an idea of what I'm up to. It seems that the amount of times you click 'your call' drastically effects how your digimon attacks (not that it makes any sense, since you're just telling him to do whatever he wants to do, as if he wasn't already going to do whatever he wanted to do). As stupid as it sounds, the way to replicate my agumon fight is to click 'your call' in rhythm to the battle music (if you're not sure exactly what I mean, then check the second video. It's what I do in the Drimogemon fight (and subsequently, what I do whenever I am bored)). I know that that isn't what I do in my first segment, but I actually got very lucky that I got the battle results that I did without clicking 'your call' along to the rhythm. I just happened to click it at the right times. The way to insure the same result is to go along to the rhythm. If it works, the two Agumon will make the EXACT same movements that mine did. If you can replicate the Agumon fight perfectly and do everything else correctly, then Centarumon's maze should be perfectly set up for you with an autopilot waiting right at the end. Also, if this doesn't work, let me know, in case these 'random' chances occur differently from disc to disc. I highly doubt it, though. It should work fine.
Segment 1:
Segment 2:

I am attempting to redo the first segment to see if I can set it up that I get both 'Moldy Meat' and an 'Autopilot'. If I can do this, then getting Frigimon will be so easy, I can use him to replace getting Leomon. Unfortunately, I checked and I did miscalculate the original prosperity points by adding 1 for myself (not sure what gave me the idea that you started with 1. Maybe I counted Coelamon as a rookie because he was tiny and so I attributed half of the points he gave me to myself. The point is that I think I will be adding Penguinmon to the run. My alternatives are: Angemon, Garurumon, Kabuterimon, Kuwagamon, Mamemon, Metal Mamemon, Mojyamon, Nanimon, Piximon, Seadramon, Tyrannomon, Vademon, and Vegimon. Angemon requires me to go through the ice sanctuary and fight multiple battles. Seadramon, Kuwagamon, and Kabuterimon all require me to collect cards to get the stupid fishing rod from Shogungekomon. Tyrannomon requires the entirety of Dino region, which is like 3 different fights. Garurumon is two separate fights. Mojyamon requires that you trade him a digiseabass, which requires the stupid fishing rod. Metal Mamemon and Piximon are tough fights that would take as much time as the curling, in addition to being out of my way and requiring me to waste resources (small recoveries and MP floppies). Nanimon would have me running all over digimon world and backtracking to find him. Vademon requires multiple visits to his little spot at different days. Vegimon would require me to rest for 5 days to get to day 15. So, Mamemon is the only one on the list that requires a reasonable amount of time, but still more than the 1:30-2:00 minutes to beat Penguinmon in a match, in addition to being out of the way. If I was going to replace Penguinmon, I think I would do it by putting in both Leomon and Frigimon. But I would have to also remove another rookie, because that would put me one point higher than was necessary and would mean that one rookie was a waste of time. If I was removing any rookies, it would be Patamon, but I'll have to really examine the amount of time it takes to beat Patamon 3 times and how many BITs he gives me to make that decision. I'll see what seems best and if I can survive without his reward.

Also, yes, I am going old school and playing this on a PS1. I even use the portable screen that attaches to the back of it, because otherwise, I would have to play using only the feedback that came out of my computer, which it is plugged directly into. My computer unfortunately doesn't play the sound during recording (only plays it during playback), so tricks like hitting 'your call' along to the rhythm of the music or using the music to determine whether it is night-time before the clock appears on the top left of the screen become unusable. And those are both time-saver that I like to use. Using the music to indicate when it is night-time is very useful in the resting segment to get Numemon, because I have to rest for multiple days and can't just waste time stopping after every rest to check if my numemon is ready to sleep. Anyway, that's today's rant. Good luck running and let me know if you come up with any tricks to cut time off my runs. It would be much appreciated.

EDIT: Apologies for the starting load-up screens on both of the videos. They will likely be cut out of the final run, but I left them in the recording so that there wouldn't be any problems with when to start timing. You can just skip the first 35 seconds of each video to get to the title screen.

Thanks for the support, Harry. Hopefully, you'll enjoy the finished product. Nice to have the encouragement.

Alright, BD. I posted up the first two segments on youtube. I might redo them again, but I figure this should give an idea of what I'm up to. It seems that the amount of times you click 'your call' drastically effects how your digimon attacks (not that it makes any sense, since you're just telling him to do whatever he wants to do, as if he wasn't already going to do whatever he wanted to do). As stupid as it sounds, the way to replicate my agumon fight is to click 'your call' in rhythm to the battle music (if you're not sure exactly what I mean, then check the second video. It's what I do in the Drimogemon fight (and subsequently, what I do whenever I am bored)). I know that that isn't what I do in my first segment, but I actually got very lucky that I got the battle results that I did without clicking 'your call' along to the rhythm. I just happened to click it at the right times. The way to insure the same result is to go along to the rhythm. If it works, the two Agumon will make the EXACT same movements that mine did. If you can replicate the Agumon fight perfectly and do everything else correctly, then Centarumon's maze should be perfectly set up for you with an autopilot waiting right at the end. Also, if this doesn't work, let me know, in case these 'random' chances occur differently from disc to disc. I highly doubt it, though. It should work fine. 
Segment 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hL3-1gJToA 
Segment 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ra5YhIMDDas

I am attempting to redo the first segment to see if I can set it up that I get both 'Moldy Meat' and an 'Autopilot'. If I can do this, then getting Frigimon will be so easy, I can use him to replace getting Leomon. Unfortunately, I checked and I did miscalculate the original prosperity points by adding 1 for myself (not sure what gave me the idea that you started with 1. Maybe I counted Coelamon as a rookie because he was tiny and so I attributed half of the points he gave me to myself. The point is that I think I will be adding Penguinmon to the run. My alternatives are: Angemon, Garurumon, Kabuterimon, Kuwagamon, Mamemon, Metal Mamemon, Mojyamon, Nanimon, Piximon, Seadramon, Tyrannomon, Vademon, and Vegimon. Angemon requires me to go through the ice sanctuary and fight multiple battles. Seadramon, Kuwagamon, and Kabuterimon all require me to collect cards to get the stupid fishing rod from Shogungekomon. Tyrannomon requires the entirety of Dino region, which is like 3 different fights. Garurumon is two separate fights. Mojyamon requires that you trade him a digiseabass, which requires the stupid fishing rod. Metal Mamemon and Piximon are tough fights that would take as much time as the curling, in addition to being out of my way and requiring me to waste resources (small recoveries and MP floppies). Nanimon would have me running all over digimon world and backtracking to find him. Vademon requires multiple visits to his little spot at different days. Vegimon would require me to rest for 5 days to get to day 15. So, Mamemon is the only one on the list that requires a reasonable amount of time, but still more than the 1:30-2:00 minutes to beat Penguinmon in a match, in addition to being out of the way. If I was going to replace Penguinmon, I think I would do it by putting in both Leomon and Frigimon. But I would have to also remove another rookie, because that would put me one point higher than was necessary and would mean that one rookie was a waste of time. If I was removing any rookies, it would be Patamon, but I'll have to really examine the amount of time it takes to beat Patamon 3 times and how many BITs he gives me to make that decision. I'll see what seems best and if I can survive without his reward.

Also, yes, I am going old school and playing this on a PS1. I even use the portable screen that attaches to the back of it, because otherwise, I would have to play using only the feedback that came out of my computer, which it is plugged directly into. My computer unfortunately doesn't play the sound during recording (only plays it during playback), so tricks like hitting 'your call' along to the rhythm of the music or using the music to determine whether it is night-time before the clock appears on the top left of the screen become unusable. And those are both time-saver that I like to use. Using the music to indicate when it is night-time is very useful in the resting segment to get Numemon, because I have to rest for multiple days and can't just waste time stopping after every rest to check if my numemon is ready to sleep. Anyway, that's today's rant. Good luck running and let me know if you come up with any tricks to cut time off my runs. It would be much appreciated.

EDIT: Apologies for the starting load-up screens on both of the videos. They will likely be cut out of the final run, but I left them in the recording so that there wouldn't be any problems with when to start timing. You can just skip the first 35 seconds of each video to get to the title screen.

Baron Dante

Edit history:

Baron Dante: 2010-09-24 01:13:36 am

Baron Dante: 2010-09-24 01:13:01 am

2010-09-24 12:23:24 am

It's a BIG HEAD!

But since this is an segmented run, wouldn't you have a possibility of using the regular shop at the town with it's random card packages to get 3 100 point cards and get the fishing rod, get Seadramon, Kabuterimon and Kuwagamon for 6 points? Especially since Monochromon is in the shop at that point anyways.

I'll look those videos when I get to my PS. You know, I always tried to click your call (Or any other order) in the rhytm of the music xD

Ok: There's some minor optimations onsegment 2, when speaking to the white ball of fur in the town and the white cloth of levitation. -.-

On segment 1, couldn't you first scold Agu and then feed the Auto? It'd save few seconds, if it can be done.

And have you done seg 2 again since updating seg 1? You have to do so then anyways.

Jukebox_Hero

2010-09-24 11:24:04 am

Just a boy and his digimon

Hmm, theoretically, I suppose getting three 100-pointers isn't impossible. The question is whether or not the card machine is based on the in-game timer. If it is, then I might keep coming up with the same cards. But you have raised a valid point, as much as I hate the idea of changing my strategy so drastically. 6 points could mean completely removing factorial town. But I'll mess around with it and see how plausible it is to do.

Yeah, I think I mentioned that segment 2 was sloppy in the description. I could definitely do it better and I intend to. I just put it up to give you an idea of what it would look like. That isn't the final version. I almost ran past Yuramon for a moment and then had to go back, and buying the autopilot could have been smoother. I should have pressed up to get to the 'see ya' option instead of hitting down twice. Bakemon looks sloppy, because he doesn't immediately respond to you when you click on him, so I am running into him for a second before he responds, but there is little I can do to make that go much faster other than hesitate less on the final question for fear of accidentally saying 'yes' to it and having to redo the whole thing.
I suppose scolding Agumon beforehand is certainly a possibility.
I have yet to successfully redo segment 1. I have been attempting to find out if there is a reasonable way to get both the auto-pilot and the moldy meat from Centarumon's maze. Had to take a break because it was driving me crazy. But, yes, I will have to redo segment 2 if I update segment 1 and I intend to, even if I don't.

Also, I am glad to hear that I'm not the only one who hits commands in rhythm to the music lol.

Hmm, theoretically, I suppose getting three 100-pointers isn't impossible. The question is whether or not the card machine is based on the in-game timer. If it is, then I might keep coming up with the same cards. But you have raised a valid point, as much as I hate the idea of changing my strategy so drastically. 6 points could mean completely removing factorial town. But I'll mess around with it and see how plausible it is to do.

Yeah, I think I mentioned that segment 2 was sloppy in the description. I could definitely do it better and I intend to. I just put it up to give you an idea of what it would look like. That isn't the final version. I almost ran past Yuramon for a moment and then had to go back, and buying the autopilot could have been smoother. I should have pressed up to get to the 'see ya' option instead of hitting down twice. Bakemon looks sloppy, because he doesn't immediately respond to you when you click on him, so I am running into him for a second before he responds, but there is little I can do to make that go much faster other than hesitate less on the final question for fear of accidentally saying 'yes' to it and having to redo the whole thing. 
I suppose scolding Agumon beforehand is certainly a possibility. 
I have yet to successfully redo segment 1. I have been attempting to find out if there is a reasonable way to get both the auto-pilot and the moldy meat from Centarumon's maze. Had to take a break because it was driving me crazy. But, yes, I will have to redo segment 2 if I update segment 1 and I intend to, even if I don't.

Also, I am glad to hear that I'm not the only one who hits commands in rhythm to the music lol.

Baron Dante

2010-09-25 07:04:55 am

It's a BIG HEAD!

Well, if it's on game-timer, it'd be even better if one can figure times to get 100-pointers. No randomness.

I didn't see the descs since they are in youtube and we are here Tongue

I'll try some stuff today.

Does Seadramon join?

I'd feel bored to just see him battle... But that said, wuld it affect if you pressed select to show opponents health constantly?

Jukebox_Hero

2010-09-25 10:24:38 am

Just a boy and his digimon

The point of saying that it might be on the in-game-timer was to say that, while it might be possible to manipulate, it might also require standing around waiting, which might not be worth it. Also, I have read a few sources claiming that it is difficult, but possible to catch Seadramon with the old rod. Although I am now recalling how annoying catching him is, as you constantly have to release tension to keep your line from breaking, and he struggles for like 2-3 minutes before you can pull him in. Still, if you can get him, then Kuwagamon and Kabuterimon would take like an additional 30 seconds to get and no battles. It would be pretty funny beating the game without going to Factorial Town, since you would never be told about Analogman. You would just kind of go to the top of Mt. Infinity and have to fight some random dude. I'm reading conflicting sources though. Some say that he only appears when you have 25-30 prosperity points. Others say you need to talk to Tankmon after beating Warumonzaemon, Angemon after recruiting him, or read Shellmon's bulletin board in order to be informed about the Lake Guardian before you can encounter Seadramon. I'll do some experimenting with it. It hurts my soul a little knowing that every digimon who seems to be quicker to get gives me fewer and fewer chips. You get SO MANY from factorial town. But, if it's faster, than I'll live without them.
Every source I have read says that Seadramon technically 'joins' by offering himself as transportation to Beetle Land and that he gives you 2 PP.

Also, I am fairly certain that pressing select to show your opponent's health doesn't really help at all. I generally have a basic idea of what my opponent's health is based on the last time I hit them. I can't think of any reason that I would really care how much health they had, as it wouldn't really change my strategy at all, unless I wasn't sure whether my FINISH would end the battle and wanted to check, or if I was debating using a small recovery and wasn't sure if my next attack would beat the enemy before I needed to use it. If it makes you more comfortable to do, then feel free. But I don't really bother with it.

The point of saying that it might be on the in-game-timer was to say that, while it might be possible to manipulate, it might also require standing around waiting, which might not be worth it. Also, I have read a few sources claiming that it is difficult, but possible to catch Seadramon with the old rod. Although I am now recalling how annoying catching him is, as you constantly have to release tension to keep your line from breaking, and he struggles for like 2-3 minutes before you can pull him in. Still, if you can get him, then Kuwagamon and Kabuterimon would take like an additional 30 seconds to get and no battles. It would be pretty funny beating the game without going to Factorial Town, since you would never be told about Analogman. You would just kind of go to the top of Mt. Infinity and have to fight some random dude. I'm reading conflicting sources though. Some say that he only appears when you have 25-30 prosperity points. Others say you need to talk to Tankmon after beating Warumonzaemon, Angemon after recruiting him, or read Shellmon's bulletin board in order to be informed about the Lake Guardian before you can encounter Seadramon. I'll do some experimenting with it. It hurts my soul a little knowing that every digimon who seems to be quicker to get gives me fewer and fewer chips. You get SO MANY from factorial town. But, if it's faster, than I'll live without them. 
Every source I have read says that Seadramon technically 'joins' by offering himself as transportation to Beetle Land and that he gives you 2 PP.

Also, I am fairly certain that pressing select to show your opponent's health doesn't really help at all. I generally have a basic idea of what my opponent's health is based on the last time I hit them. I can't think of any reason that I would really care how much health they had, as it wouldn't really change my strategy at all, unless I wasn't sure whether my FINISH would end the battle and wanted to check, or if I was debating using a small recovery and wasn't sure if my next attack would beat the enemy before I needed to use it. If it makes you more comfortable to do, then feel free. But I don't really bother with it.

Jamma

2010-09-25 11:37:35 am

Nuts! Gotta get to Narshe on the fly

To this day I don't know how, but I actually really liked this game... the Digimon franchise doesn't intrest me in the slightest, but I enjoyed many of the games' aspects. I will fully support the speedrunning of this. Smiley