It's just a possibility really, I might still be missing something. I wasn't running, just playing under running conditions mostly. I might have been a bit overleveled (30 at Menace) since just I killed stuff until it dropped its soul, only resetting if I still hadn't gotten it after minutes, but Stolas might make up for that. No changes on Abaddon, just jump behind him, hope he doesn't hop away or turn around and backdash spam Ukoback + Dead Pirate against the wall. This is all assuming no Bhuj of course, so since you're planning to get it anyway you're not completely mana-dependent.
SDA Forum
Quits halfway
Ah, that'd explain it. INT ends up making a pretty huge difference at low levels with Erinys. I'd have to compare the stats at 27 vs 30, but I do know that Lilith's +2 INT increases damage by 10 for each Erinys hit. So having the higher level there really makes a big difference. However, it's probably the same or less of a difference compared to Stolas, like you said, so only the Death fight would be different. Should be able to go ahead with your changes though, it'll probably end up being faster.
What weapon did you end up with toward the end, where'd you pick it up, and what's the atk on it? Just thinking that there's really a lot of time that goes into getting the Bhuj and since it can only be made up on a couple of boss fights, it really might not be worth it.
What weapon did you end up with toward the end, where'd you pick it up, and what's the atk on it? Just thinking that there's really a lot of time that goes into getting the Bhuj and since it can only be made up on a couple of boss fights, it really might not be worth it.
Since I was testing mana limits I didn't use weapons at all (other than Short Sword up to Malphas), but I'm not sure where I would even use one. If you really want one though there's the Durandal in Pinnacle.
Also, you could try manipulating a Flame Necklace off a Succubus for the +5 INT and skip the Satan's Ring.
Also, you could try manipulating a Flame Necklace off a Succubus for the +5 INT and skip the Satan's Ring.
Quits halfway
I could save after Paranoia and manipulate it off of the Succubus at the bottom of that room. T_T
And yeah, if you weren't running out of mana on Abaddon, you were overleveled. But perhaps with the added INT it'll end up working that way even at a lower level, I'll just add that fight to the list of things to test. Sounds like weapons are going to be pretty useless though, it would be awesome to cut out the Manticore soul manipulation.
And yeah, if you weren't running out of mana on Abaddon, you were overleveled. But perhaps with the added INT it'll end up working that way even at a lower level, I'll just add that fight to the list of things to test. Sounds like weapons are going to be pretty useless though, it would be awesome to cut out the Manticore soul manipulation.
Alternatively, save after reaching Pinnacle, get it off the one at the bottom or the row of Yokobi and go back to the save. Adds a save but means having the extra INT for Paranoia. And yeah, I was certainly overleveled, but maybe you could still get above 27 unless you were already killing everything convenient on your way. Maybe get Erinys after Paranoia so you can kill stuff throughout Pinnacle?
Quits halfway
I was already killing everything in that test run, I don't think I had heard of damage boosting. I had posted that I was nowhere near 28, which I don't think is going to change, should land right on 27 again probably. Erinys through Pinnacle wouldn't make a difference, it's a pretty easy run and Ukoback works on most of the enemies better. I'll test how much the INT boost helps on Paranoia, saving there instead of running ahead is about an 8 second penalty (I had timed how long save rooms take from entrance/exit but can't find where I noted it), but I may do it anyway just because getting Killer Clown + a good Paranoia fight is/was a nightmare.
Yokobi aren't an option, take way too long to kill.
Also, I guess it worked out that I hadn't started on the any% warpless, these changes are actually pretty major, but will hopefully save a good amount of time. Thanks for scrutinizing all of this stuff, I'm horrible at strategy and pretty stubborn to not change stuff
Yokobi aren't an option, take way too long to kill.
Also, I guess it worked out that I hadn't started on the any% warpless, these changes are actually pretty major, but will hopefully save a good amount of time. Thanks for scrutinizing all of this stuff, I'm horrible at strategy and pretty stubborn to not change stuff
If you'd still like to go with a (mostly) STR route (so you can make use of that lucky first segment), you could try a Bhuj+Devil approach (main differences are from Pinnacle onwards).
Manticore
(Bhuj + Potions)
Some Golem souls?
Ninja Suit
(Devil on the way to Cutall)
...
Bat Company
((Bhuj + High/Potions))
((Devil on the way to Pinnacle))
Black Belt from Werewolf? Before/after Paranoia?
When to get Bhuj basically depends on how many Potions you need. Getting it before Balore seems better either way though, just posting it for completion's sake. 9 Potions should definitely last until before Menace, at which point you will have Black Panther, so even if you end up needing a second shopping trip it wouldn't cost too much time. Just inserting Devil into the INT route probably wouldn't work since Devil saps mana too, albeit at a slower rate. I'd still get the Mana Prisms for some of the longer fights.
Manticore
(Bhuj + Potions)
Some Golem souls?
Ninja Suit
(Devil on the way to Cutall)
...
Bat Company
((Bhuj + High/Potions))
((Devil on the way to Pinnacle))
Black Belt from Werewolf? Before/after Paranoia?
When to get Bhuj basically depends on how many Potions you need. Getting it before Balore seems better either way though, just posting it for completion's sake. 9 Potions should definitely last until before Menace, at which point you will have Black Panther, so even if you end up needing a second shopping trip it wouldn't cost too much time. Just inserting Devil into the INT route probably wouldn't work since Devil saps mana too, albeit at a slower rate. I'd still get the Mana Prisms for some of the longer fights.
Edit history:
Aftermath: 2010-08-22 04:40:15 pm
Aftermath: 2010-08-22 04:37:57 pm
Aftermath: 2010-08-22 04:34:47 pm
Aftermath: 2010-08-22 04:33:35 pm
Quits halfway
I don't think the STR route will be very fruitful. All of the latter half bosses will go faster with INT, especially Menace. I don't think you're saying to do a STR/INT hybrid, but if you are, that'll necessitate more segments, the time cost of which won't be made up I don't think. I think the only boss where STR might arguably be beneficial is Aguni. The early bosses die quickly enough that it's not a huge deal.
I think I might want to stick with my old plan of skipping Ninja Suit, but grabbing Olrox's Suit later.
I'd like to abandon that lucky save for NG glitchless, but the time lost in having a bad first segment (3 seconds) is made up for on Flying Armor. Skipping the Bhuj, I wouldn't even need a second Axe Armor soul, so I could really just continue it as planned, just with a sizable attack bonus. This also means that the first 4 segments from glitch/glitchless could be the same, which would be pretty neat. I was already going to go back and redo that second segment I posted to get rid of the mistakes, so I'll make sure to make it as best I can.
Also, I guess I'd have to look back, but I don't remember potions being an issue. I don't take a huge amount of damage just walking around between boss fights, and in the boss fights I shouldn't be getting hit.
So yeah, let's stick to the INT route for now, is this correct for how it'll be?
Let me know if I missed something you had suggested. I think when I get down to doing this run, I'll AR myself the specific souls/equipment I need and just do a bunch of playthroughs to work out all of the fine details like item management, leveling, and damage boosting. There's a bunch of sections that I got a lot of flak on in that old semi-skip run, so I'll definitely be fixing those.
I think I might want to stick with my old plan of skipping Ninja Suit, but grabbing Olrox's Suit later.
I'd like to abandon that lucky save for NG glitchless, but the time lost in having a bad first segment (3 seconds) is made up for on Flying Armor. Skipping the Bhuj, I wouldn't even need a second Axe Armor soul, so I could really just continue it as planned, just with a sizable attack bonus. This also means that the first 4 segments from glitch/glitchless could be the same, which would be pretty neat. I was already going to go back and redo that second segment I posted to get rid of the mistakes, so I'll make sure to make it as best I can.
Also, I guess I'd have to look back, but I don't remember potions being an issue. I don't take a huge amount of damage just walking around between boss fights, and in the boss fights I shouldn't be getting hit.
So yeah, let's stick to the INT route for now, is this correct for how it'll be?
1: Got the Axe Armor/Axe, saved before Flying Armor
2: Kill Flying Armor, run and save before Balore
3: Kill Balore, activate the Lab warp, save in Garden of Madness entrance
4: Activate the Garden warp, get a Yorick, don't get hit by the barrel like a noob again, save right before Dmitrii. At some point I think I worked out that this is a better save after all.
5: Dmitrii/Malphas, warp Garden and save before Dario.
6: Dario, grab Cutall, and save near the Lilith.
7: Lilith soul and climb all the way to Zephyr (it's a nightmare).
8: Kill Zephyr, warp to the Lab, run into Subterranean Hell, get an Ukoback and save near the waterfall.
9: Get Dead Pirate and save before Bat Company.
10: Bat Company, warp to Village and buy 9 Mind Ups/High Mind Ups (leftover money on potions?), warp to Clocktower, run to the save in the Pinnacle.
11: Get Killer Clown, beat Paranoia with as few Mind Ups as possible, grab the Mana Prism in the mirror, save back in the Pinnacle.
12: Manipulate Flame Necklace, climb to Aguni and save. I've always thought that the bottom route (going past the Final Guards) is faster, so I want to skip that Mana Prism, unless it turns out to be vital.
13: Kill Aguni with luck manipulation and then run back to that same Pinnacle save.
14: Get Erinys, warp to Garden, get frustrated at the unskippable cutscene, warp to Dark Chapel and go down the Mine and save before Death.
15: Kill Death and save.
16: Navigate the fire rooms without getting hit, inch by the big sword things, get a Stolas somehow, and then save before Abaddon.
17: Kill Abaddon, get the first Black Panther, save at the end.
18:
2: Kill Flying Armor, run and save before Balore
3: Kill Balore, activate the Lab warp, save in Garden of Madness entrance
4: Activate the Garden warp, get a Yorick, don't get hit by the barrel like a noob again, save right before Dmitrii. At some point I think I worked out that this is a better save after all.
5: Dmitrii/Malphas, warp Garden and save before Dario.
6: Dario, grab Cutall, and save near the Lilith.
7: Lilith soul and climb all the way to Zephyr (it's a nightmare).
8: Kill Zephyr, warp to the Lab, run into Subterranean Hell, get an Ukoback and save near the waterfall.
9: Get Dead Pirate and save before Bat Company.
10: Bat Company, warp to Village and buy 9 Mind Ups/High Mind Ups (leftover money on potions?), warp to Clocktower, run to the save in the Pinnacle.
11: Get Killer Clown, beat Paranoia with as few Mind Ups as possible, grab the Mana Prism in the mirror, save back in the Pinnacle.
12: Manipulate Flame Necklace, climb to Aguni and save. I've always thought that the bottom route (going past the Final Guards) is faster, so I want to skip that Mana Prism, unless it turns out to be vital.
13: Kill Aguni with luck manipulation and then run back to that same Pinnacle save.
14: Get Erinys, warp to Garden, get frustrated at the unskippable cutscene, warp to Dark Chapel and go down the Mine and save before Death.
15: Kill Death and save.
16: Navigate the fire rooms without getting hit, inch by the big sword things, get a Stolas somehow, and then save before Abaddon.
17: Kill Abaddon, get the first Black Panther, save at the end.
18:
Let me know if I missed something you had suggested. I think when I get down to doing this run, I'll AR myself the specific souls/equipment I need and just do a bunch of playthroughs to work out all of the fine details like item management, leveling, and damage boosting. There's a bunch of sections that I got a lot of flak on in that old semi-skip run, so I'll definitely be fixing those.
The Potions are for Devil usage. It saps HP. No, I'm not suggesting a STR/INT hybrid. Not sure what you'd need Olrox's Suit for in either route version. It has the same STR bonus as Ninja Suit and for INT you have Elfin Robe. Menace might be slightly slower for phase 1 and the knee target, but faster for the head since Erinys can only do half its damage there.
For the route, I'd move Flame Necklace before Paranoia. Should be worth it (don't forget to supend back to the save room after killing the Succubus to shave off some time). If you really want to avoid the additional save too, you could always do Killer Clown + Paranoia + Pinnacle climb in one segment. >_> Generally, look for more suspend spots if you haven't already (for instance, after getting Balore's soul you can just suspend past the ice back to the entrance). I'm sure both Mana Prisms are needed. In the Pinnacle room with the Mana Prism, you could just dip into the lower right exit (go through the floor, then double jump back up after the room transition), get the Mana Prism and suspend back to that entrance to mitigate some of the time loss.
For the route, I'd move Flame Necklace before Paranoia. Should be worth it (don't forget to supend back to the save room after killing the Succubus to shave off some time). If you really want to avoid the additional save too, you could always do Killer Clown + Paranoia + Pinnacle climb in one segment. >_> Generally, look for more suspend spots if you haven't already (for instance, after getting Balore's soul you can just suspend past the ice back to the entrance). I'm sure both Mana Prisms are needed. In the Pinnacle room with the Mana Prism, you could just dip into the lower right exit (go through the floor, then double jump back up after the room transition), get the Mana Prism and suspend back to that entrance to mitigate some of the time loss.
Quits halfway
Oh, right, that's how Devil works, my bad. And yeah, somehow I've never grabbed Elfin Robe for all this time. Wow, stupid decision on my part, that's what I get for just copying strategies instead of thinking about them. Yeah, that's wayyy better than Olrox. I suppose it requires testing, but like I said, I don't think that STR will be faster on any of the bosses in the last half of the game, with the exception of Aguni. Just curious if you've tested it, or were just throwing the STR route out there since I had the save for it.
So yeah, 10 second segment for Flame Necklace, then just do Killer Clown -> Aguni savepoint in one segment. Compared to the Zephyr and Lilith segments, it's not bad at all. I had no idea about save warping with suspend, I've never used suspend outside of the warp runs.
Getting the second Mana Prism sounds okay, but I'll still try to do without it during testing. As far as more suspend warps go, it's basically any room that you enter and leave from the same door? Off the top of my head, there's Malphas, Magic Seal 5, and getting the Cutall, in addition to the ones you listed. I'm not sure if it's worth it for 1 square rooms though.
So yeah, 10 second segment for Flame Necklace, then just do Killer Clown -> Aguni savepoint in one segment. Compared to the Zephyr and Lilith segments, it's not bad at all. I had no idea about save warping with suspend, I've never used suspend outside of the warp runs.
Getting the second Mana Prism sounds okay, but I'll still try to do without it during testing. As far as more suspend warps go, it's basically any room that you enter and leave from the same door? Off the top of my head, there's Malphas, Magic Seal 5, and getting the Cutall, in addition to the ones you listed. I'm not sure if it's worth it for 1 square rooms though.
I've played the STR route up to Paranoia and it seems to be working pretty well. Just to clarify, you're still using Yorick up to Dario (with some Bhuj support), so Bhuj only really "replaces" Erinys (which I think is the core of the INT route so I don't consider it a hybrid). For Zephyr and Bat Company, you can basically choose between INT (Yorick/Ukoback) or STR (Bhuj/Devil) approach, Paranoia should be a lot faster with Bhuj/Devil + some Ukoback support, Aguni (Bhuj/Devil + some Axe Armor support) as well, Death shouldn't be much slower if he stays low. For Abaddon, you can just do the old Ukoback + Dead Pirate and finish him with Bhuj/Devil, and Menace shouldn't be a problem as I already mentioned. Yeah, I'm still leaning towards the INT route, but I think the STR route is definitely feasible (but harder).
As for where to use suspend warping, that's about right, but as you can see from the Pinnacle Mana Prism example, it also works if you come across the exit you intend to take before you finish what you want to do in that room (in this case, get the Mana Prism). Also, since we're aiming for in-game time suspending should be always worth it even if it saves only half a second.
Also, you could try getting another Lilith in the Dario/Cutall segment and skip Stolas (IIrc, 2 Lilith = 1 Stolas). Seems like it would actually be less of a headache to get. Would also allow you to do Death and Abyss up to Abaddon in one segment if you want. Also, considering your plans for the Zephyr and Paranoia segments, combining segments 2+3 actually looks reasonable. For Abaddon, you shouldn't be running out of MP, but to be on the safe side (and go a bit faster) you can cast Ukoback with +INT soul and switch to Dead Pirate before it hits to get both effects.
ALSO, this is just the general route. Since your save already has the axe, you could just skip visiting Hammer entirely.
As for where to use suspend warping, that's about right, but as you can see from the Pinnacle Mana Prism example, it also works if you come across the exit you intend to take before you finish what you want to do in that room (in this case, get the Mana Prism). Also, since we're aiming for in-game time suspending should be always worth it even if it saves only half a second.
Also, you could try getting another Lilith in the Dario/Cutall segment and skip Stolas (IIrc, 2 Lilith = 1 Stolas). Seems like it would actually be less of a headache to get. Would also allow you to do Death and Abyss up to Abaddon in one segment if you want. Also, considering your plans for the Zephyr and Paranoia segments, combining segments 2+3 actually looks reasonable. For Abaddon, you shouldn't be running out of MP, but to be on the safe side (and go a bit faster) you can cast Ukoback with +INT soul and switch to Dead Pirate before it hits to get both effects.
ALSO, this is just the general route. Since your save already has the axe, you could just skip visiting Hammer entirely.
Quits halfway
I'll try to put 2/3 together. I'll have to grab the orb, but should still be less than a save.
No, not getting Lilith after Dario, Dario is a very, very random boss and I don't want to put a manipulation after a boss fight (there's no choice with zephyr though). Stolas will probably be easier.
Wouldn't want to do Death and Abaddon in one segment anyway, too random. I'm not sure if you tried the Ukoback switch thing you're suggesting, but that sounds pretty impossible to do, for various reasons.
Not sure why I'd skip Hammer because I have an Axe, as far as I can tell, I'll definitely be needing those Mind Ups.
No, not getting Lilith after Dario, Dario is a very, very random boss and I don't want to put a manipulation after a boss fight (there's no choice with zephyr though). Stolas will probably be easier.
Wouldn't want to do Death and Abaddon in one segment anyway, too random. I'm not sure if you tried the Ukoback switch thing you're suggesting, but that sounds pretty impossible to do, for various reasons.
Not sure why I'd skip Hammer because I have an Axe, as far as I can tell, I'll definitely be needing those Mind Ups.
You would save before Abaddon. No idea why Lilith/Dead Pirate switching would be impossible. You just cast an Ukoback with Lilith and go into the menu to switch to Dead Pirate before it hits, afterwards you switch back to Lilith and repeat. Don't have to do it for the whole fight, just a couple of times to reduce the number of needed Ukobacks in case it's needed. Hammer skip is for the STR route.
Sonic's biggest fan at heart
I don't believe anyone's tried this before, but I'm trying to map a route and work on speedrunning Dawn of Sorrow on a clear new game, something which, so far as I know, has only been done with TAS (and no, I'm not talking about 100% or break from the beginning with axe glitch.) I have part of the route planned out, and know certain souls with reasonable drop rates that could help a lot, even with marathon strats (if I'm saying that right.) I want to point this out now, and I'll edit this post with my route once I get that typed out.
Edit history:
Zwataketa: 2015-02-17 09:00:56 pm
Zwataketa: 2015-02-17 09:00:41 pm
Zwataketa: 2015-02-17 05:43:21 pm
Zwataketa: 2015-02-17 05:38:52 pm
Sonic's biggest fan at heart
Quote from Zwataketa:
I don't believe anyone's tried this before, but I'm trying to map a route and work on speedrunning Dawn of Sorrow on a clear new game, something which, so far as I know, has only been done with TAS (and no, I'm not talking about 100% or break from the beginning with axe glitch.) I have part of the route planned out, and know certain souls with reasonable drop rates that could help a lot, even with marathon strats (if I'm saying that right.) I want to point this out now, and I'll edit this post with my route once I get that typed out.
Okay, so you can't "edit" posts on this forum. Noted.
So now, the route in progress:
So, it starts off normally, going to the right to get Yoko, switching to the short sword when I get it, and also grinding for the Warg soul if I don't get it on the way through the room before Yoko. Warg isn't that rare a soul, and I just think it's easier to use (I CANT AIM BONEZ) and overall more effective against enemies for a common soul, so it's worth it I believe. Then I fight Flying Armor, as usual, then go onwards, skipping the crystal, and grabbing the Claymore, Mace, and moneybag in the same room as the mace, stopping by the save point for a health and mana refill if necessary. Then I got to Hammer and sell all my stuff minus the potions (and Axe if it happens to drop from an Axe Armor, but it usually doesn't for me), and buy a Rapier, Axe (if it didn't drop from the axe armor), leather armor (for protection, cause otherwise I'd easily die), and a brass knuckle or more, depending on if I got any Zombie souls. If I did, I go to Yoko to upgrade them to Cestus's and sell them, buying some health and mana potions, maybe one or two uncurse/anti-venom, if I can afford it. And if I happened to get axe armor's soul, I use that to upgrade the axe to a battle axe (which could help against bosses, but isn't too high a concern that I need to spend time grinding for it). Then, after that's all settled, I go to the wizardry lab and get through it normally, grinding for the manticore soul, as that is a necessity for bosses. Then I fight Balore with the Rapier and Manticore soul, or the Rapier and Warg soul (need to find out which is faster), and then get to the Garden of Madness as usual. Refill at the save point if necessary, and use the warp to get back to Hammer and sell the rapier and leather armor to get a Main Gauche (and upgrade the axe if I have the axe armor soul and haven't upgraded it already), then warp back to the garden and get to the Chapel, grabbing the breastplate and Une soul (and Doppelganger, obviously) on the way. Fight Dmitrii using Une soul once, then axe the rest of the time (pretty slow, but works effectively at this point in the game, and using Manticore is a BAD idea against him), then fight Malphas with the axe and manticore soul, grab the hoop earring to sell later (I need money for potions and mana ups, since there's no way to get over the limit of 9 without succubus glitch out of bounds, which I'm trying to avoid), and warp from the chapel to the garden of madness, making my way to Dario, who I fight using the manticore and axe. That's as far as I've gotten so far. I'll update when I add to the route, and I'll be studying the TAS route as well (the one that doesn't skip the entire game). One of my main concerns is how I'll deal with Rahab ...
Also, something of note, I do not have an Aria of Sorrow cartridge, so at the moment, I have to stick with the normal drop rates without the Rare Ring from the beginning.
Edit: never mind you can edit posts. I swear, I didn't see the pencil earlier. Odd.
And I just found out bare fists are better than the sword against Flying armor. So change in that.
Another edit: ok, so there ISNT an in bounds TAS with Soma that isnt 100%. Well, I've got my work cut out for me then.
Could someone please tell me how to predict Gergoth's jump attack and dodge accordingly? That's whats ruining my test runs at the moment. That, and Rahab.
Sonic's biggest fan at heart
I don't care if no one is listening to me, I will still continue this!
I've updated the route a bit. For one, getting the axe armor soul is now a necessity, as is getting a SECOND manticore soul, to upgrade the battle axe to a bhuj, which deals with the dark lord candidates more quickly, and removes any issues that stew from Gergoth. Also, I need to get three zombie souls in the beginning after beating Flying Armor, so i can ensure I have enough money for a few potions and mind ups. I will update once I expand on the route a bit more.
Still don't know how to deal with Rahab.
I've updated the route a bit. For one, getting the axe armor soul is now a necessity, as is getting a SECOND manticore soul, to upgrade the battle axe to a bhuj, which deals with the dark lord candidates more quickly, and removes any issues that stew from Gergoth. Also, I need to get three zombie souls in the beginning after beating Flying Armor, so i can ensure I have enough money for a few potions and mind ups. I will update once I expand on the route a bit more.
Still don't know how to deal with Rahab.
Visually Appealing
I believe there is a video somewhere of a new game glitchless run. Might've been segmented though, not sure. It's quite old. I'm not sure if it synthesized any weapons, but I do remember it using great swords most of the run.
I believe you should not be buying any armor, because potions and mind ups are super important at the end.
Offensive souls I'm not sure. Axes are helpful early, I used Yorick in my old run, but once you get Killer Clown that would be your best bet I think.
Finally, I see mention of Rahab and Gergoth. They can be skipped with the Cutall special attack. Use it on the one way barriers leading to the clock tower and Subterranian Hell.
::edit:: Here is the first segment of the run I mentioned. Also you might want to check out Romscout's No Memory Corruption Run. It does warp around, but he doesn't write weapons and stuff into his inventory.
I believe you should not be buying any armor, because potions and mind ups are super important at the end.
Offensive souls I'm not sure. Axes are helpful early, I used Yorick in my old run, but once you get Killer Clown that would be your best bet I think.
Finally, I see mention of Rahab and Gergoth. They can be skipped with the Cutall special attack. Use it on the one way barriers leading to the clock tower and Subterranian Hell.
::edit:: Here is the first segment of the run I mentioned. Also you might want to check out Romscout's No Memory Corruption Run. It does warp around, but he doesn't write weapons and stuff into his inventory.
that Metroidvania guy
I've done completely glitchless runs of DoS, but with AoS cart. Takes about an hour (at least with very few attempts), doesn't require much farming. There's a few different possible routes, but I'm pretty sure you should never have to fight Gergoth (I don't consider using cutall special to hit switches as a glitch, and it would be odd if anyone did). If you can wait a weekend or two when I have free time, I can attempt to write out my route(s).
My main approach to doing Soma runs is to get Devil and then charge forward as fast as possible, as adding too many soul drops to the run will just result in sadness. The only ones I really consider are ones that would make your weapon significantly faster on Menace; I think using Lilith on the Durandal is ok since she's right next to a Devil farming spot anyway. There are enough money bags and valuable weapons laying around that you shouldn't need to worry about money even if you don't have the AoS cart, so that shouldn't be a big deal. But yea, definitely skip Gergoth and just go to Zephyr from the Guest House. There's no way the detour through the tower could be worth it.
My main approach to doing Soma runs is to get Devil and then charge forward as fast as possible, as adding too many soul drops to the run will just result in sadness. The only ones I really consider are ones that would make your weapon significantly faster on Menace; I think using Lilith on the Durandal is ok since she's right next to a Devil farming spot anyway. There are enough money bags and valuable weapons laying around that you shouldn't need to worry about money even if you don't have the AoS cart, so that shouldn't be a big deal. But yea, definitely skip Gergoth and just go to Zephyr from the Guest House. There's no way the detour through the tower could be worth it.
Sonic's biggest fan at heart
Few things of note:
-I'm not working on a glitchless run, I'm working on a new game all bosses no memory corruption run. Succubus glitch will be used, but only at a few areas later on (aka, getting into Paranoia's room, haven't thought about much after that.) From what I know, not even the TASers have done that yet. So skipping bosses is a no-no (even mini paranoia, since he technically IS a boss. I have a quick easy strategy for him though.)
-I've thought about it, and I guess I can skip getting the leather armor from hammer.
-The devil soul just seems to risky for me, and I want to minimize the number of souls I have to grind for. Manticore is much closer to the beginning of the run, and also necessary for getting the Bhuj, so I myself think that's the better option. My preference, if you will.
-I saw romscout's no memory corruption run already, and it should be pretty obvious from my first point that that's not what I'm after.
-I choose the warg soul over skeleton and axe armor because its super early in the game and I don't want to have to aim (and constantly miss) multiple bones that do little damage at enemies. I'm sticking with the Warg soul.
-I know about the glitch to instantly get to the top of the condemned tower via axe special, but I don't know how to do it. If anyone could teach me, that'd really help.
-I have made changes to and expanded the route a bit from what was in that other post. I'll be working on a segmented speedrun soon that uses the ingame timer (meaning I don't have to be as fast in the menus, but that's not saying I'll take my time in them or anything.)
-I'm not working on a glitchless run, I'm working on a new game all bosses no memory corruption run. Succubus glitch will be used, but only at a few areas later on (aka, getting into Paranoia's room, haven't thought about much after that.) From what I know, not even the TASers have done that yet. So skipping bosses is a no-no (even mini paranoia, since he technically IS a boss. I have a quick easy strategy for him though.)
-I've thought about it, and I guess I can skip getting the leather armor from hammer.
-The devil soul just seems to risky for me, and I want to minimize the number of souls I have to grind for. Manticore is much closer to the beginning of the run, and also necessary for getting the Bhuj, so I myself think that's the better option. My preference, if you will.
-I saw romscout's no memory corruption run already, and it should be pretty obvious from my first point that that's not what I'm after.
-I choose the warg soul over skeleton and axe armor because its super early in the game and I don't want to have to aim (and constantly miss) multiple bones that do little damage at enemies. I'm sticking with the Warg soul.
-I know about the glitch to instantly get to the top of the condemned tower via axe special, but I don't know how to do it. If anyone could teach me, that'd really help.
-I have made changes to and expanded the route a bit from what was in that other post. I'll be working on a segmented speedrun soon that uses the ingame timer (meaning I don't have to be as fast in the menus, but that's not saying I'll take my time in them or anything.)