Banjo-Kazooie 100% (PAL)

2009-01-11 01:23:42 am

Yeh, sounds about right. I was wondering more out of curiosity as apposed to it being any sort of substantial time saver. Also does anyone happen to know if its faster to swim or get to the surface and jump + flap. I usually do that later, they are pretty much the same also.

Ive been considering the Clanker's Cavern route. This is what i'm planning

-Jump on pipe, mumbo token, notes, yellow jinjo
-Green jinjo and free clanker
-Blue Jinjo
-Defeat Crabs
-Jiggy in tunnel
-Notes in tunnel on bottom
-Honeycomb

-Notes up pole right of spring pad and MUMBOS2
-Left up spring pad, Orange guy and EHP2
*Possible change the order of these and jump straight onto Clanker's back, whatevers best

-Jiggy on clanker's back
-Up clanker's tail
-Notes on pipe, mumbo token
-Alcoves; 2 notes
-Shoot gold tooth, get jiggy
-8 notes, hoop race
-Swim out through bottom tunnel getting notes
-Up clanker's blowhole, notes, jiggy
-In blowhole
-Witch Switch, leave jiggy side
-Fly, get jiggy while flying, go into where bottles is
-Run through propella's of doom
-Pink Jinjo
-Leave as quick as possible

Anyone got any better idea's or see any flaws?

Yeh, sounds about right. I was wondering more out of curiosity as apposed to it being any sort of substantial time saver. Also does anyone happen to know if its faster to swim or get to the surface and jump + flap. I usually do that later, they are pretty much the same also.

Ive been considering the Clanker's Cavern route. This is what i'm planning

-Jump on pipe, mumbo token, notes, yellow jinjo
-Green jinjo and free clanker
-Blue Jinjo
-Defeat Crabs
-Jiggy in tunnel
-Notes in tunnel on bottom 
-Honeycomb

-Notes up pole right of spring pad and MUMBOS2
-Left up spring pad, Orange guy and EHP2
*Possible change the order of these and jump straight onto Clanker's back, whatevers best

-Jiggy on clanker's back
-Up clanker's tail
-Notes on pipe, mumbo token
-Alcoves; 2 notes
-Shoot gold tooth, get jiggy
-8 notes, hoop race
-Swim out through bottom tunnel getting notes
-Up clanker's blowhole, notes, jiggy
-In blowhole
-Witch Switch, leave jiggy side
-Fly, get jiggy while flying, go into where bottles is
-Run through propella's of doom 
-Pink Jinjo
-Leave as quick as possible

Anyone got any better idea's or see any flaws?

kowbrainz

2009-01-11 04:42:44 am

I can't really see how good the route is until you try it out a few times. In Clanker's Cavern a lot of it comes down to how much time you spend swimming around, so generally try to spend as little time underwater as possible in between sections of the run. Just try it and see though.

I believe swimming underwater *MIGHT* be faster than feathery flapping across the surface as Sami normally uses this method, although last time I asked he wasn't quite sure how much faster it was. It's a few frames difference either way really.

Sami

2009-01-11 05:17:22 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Quote from Gibbatizer:

Alright, there's really not much I can do at the moment without a console. I noticed in the clip also Sami that you jump and then let kazooie slide, before jumping again. Is this a provin way as the fastest form of moving on flat? Or is it all roughely the same.

Sliding is faster than jumping whole time but you need to jump again before sliding stops.

Qgstkpnjtp

2009-01-12 01:38:23 am

twitch.tv/fiveleafclover

Bold/coloured my additions

Quote from Gibbatizer:

-Jump on pipe, mumbo token, notes, yellow jinjo
-Green jinjo and free clanker
-Blue Jinjo
-Defeat Crabs
-Jiggy in tunnel - While you don't need to resurface in between the Snippets and the pipe, you will be extremely low on air. Resurfacing then diving back down will take probably 15 seconds, possibly more. If you're going to do multiple things underwater in sequence, try and order them so you're resurfacing where you'll be close to the surface anyway or can deviate at a shallow angle. The jiggy pipe is NOT close to the surface.
-Notes in tunnel on bottom
-Honeycomb

-Notes up pole right of spring pad and MUMBOS2
-Left up spring pad, Orange guy and EHP2
*Possible change the order of these and jump straight onto Clanker's back, whatevers best - What do you mean, 'jump straight to Clanker's back'? That's one heck of a jump, even from the MT up high.

-Jiggy on clanker's back
-Up clanker's tail
-Notes on pipe, mumbo token
-Alcoves; 2 notes - Remembering that you'll need to swim part of the distance anyway...
-Shoot gold tooth, get jiggy
-8 notes, hoop race
-Swim out through bottom tunnel getting notes
-Up clanker's blowhole, notes, jiggy
-In blowhole
-Witch Switch, leave jiggy side
-Fly, get jiggy while flying, go into where bottles is
-Run through propella's of doom
-Pink Jinjo
-Leave as quick as possible

Basically, 2nd half is good, 1st half... wtf. In theory, it works well. But in practice, you have 6 bubbles of air. Go figure >.>

Bold/coloured my additions

[quote="Gibbatizer"]

-Jump on pipe, mumbo token, notes, yellow jinjo
-Green jinjo and free clanker
-Blue Jinjo
-Defeat Crabs
-Jiggy in tunnel - [color=red][b]While you don't need to resurface in between the Snippets and the pipe, you will be extremely low on air. Resurfacing then diving back down will take probably 15 seconds, possibly more. If you're going to do multiple things underwater in sequence, try and order them so you're resurfacing where you'll be close to the surface anyway or can deviate at a shallow angle. The jiggy pipe is NOT close to the surface.[/b][/color]
-Notes in tunnel on bottom 
-Honeycomb

-Notes up pole right of spring pad and MUMBOS2
-Left up spring pad, Orange guy and EHP2
*Possible change the order of these and jump straight onto Clanker's back, whatevers best - [color=red][b]What do you mean, 'jump straight to Clanker's back'? That's one heck of a jump, even from the MT up high.[/b][/color]

-Jiggy on clanker's back
-Up clanker's tail
-Notes on pipe, mumbo token
-Alcoves; 2 notes - [color=red][b]Remembering that you'll need to swim part of the distance anyway...[/b][/color]
-Shoot gold tooth, get jiggy
-8 notes, hoop race
-Swim out through bottom tunnel getting notes
-Up clanker's blowhole, notes, jiggy
-In blowhole
-Witch Switch, leave jiggy side
-Fly, get jiggy while flying, go into where bottles is
-Run through propella's of doom 
-Pink Jinjo
-Leave as quick as possible

[/quote]

Basically, 2nd half is good, 1st half... wtf. In theory, it works well. But in practice, you have 6 bubbles of air. Go figure >.>

Gibbatizer

2009-01-12 07:06:44 am

Yeh the lack of air was something I hadn't accounted for, you're right.

Quote:

What do you mean, 'jump straight to Clanker's back'? That's one heck of a jump, even from the MT up high.

I believe i saw a clip of Kowbrainz running your route and he made that jump. I don't think it would be 'that' hard using rattata peck.

Quote:

Remembering that you'll need to swim part of the distance anyway...

I assume you mean how you have to land in the water before jumping onto the platform where the chompa wall dude is, that's not a big time waster if you measure the jump.

Ok how about this:

-Jump on pipe, mumbo token, notes, yellow jinjo
-Green jinjo and free clanker
-Notes in tunnel on bottom
-Honeycomb
-Notes up pole right of spring pad and Mumbo Token
-Left up spring pad, Orange guy and HC
-Jiggy in tunnel
-Defeat Crabs
*Possibly get blue jinjo here
-Jiggy on clanker's back
-Up clanker's tail
-Notes on pipe, mumbo token
*Or here
-Alcoves; 2 notes
-Shoot gold tooth, get jiggy
-8 notes, hoop race
-Swim out through bottom tunnel getting notes
-Up clanker's blowhole, notes, jiggy
-In blowhole
-Witch Switch, leave jiggy side
-Fly, get jiggy while flying, go into where bottles is
-Run through propella's of doom
-Pink Jinjo
-Leave as quick as possible

Yeh the lack of air was something I hadn't accounted for, you're right.

[quote]What do you mean, 'jump straight to Clanker's back'? That's one heck of a jump, even from the MT up high.[/quote]
I believe i saw a clip of Kowbrainz running your route and he made that jump. I don't think it would be 'that' hard using rattata peck.

[quote]Remembering that you'll need to swim part of the distance anyway...[/quote]
I assume you mean how you have to land in the water before jumping onto the platform where the chompa wall dude is, that's not a big time waster if you measure the jump.

Ok how about this:

-Jump on pipe, mumbo token, notes, yellow jinjo
-Green jinjo and free clanker
-Notes in tunnel on bottom 
-Honeycomb
-Notes up pole right of spring pad and Mumbo Token
-Left up spring pad, Orange guy and HC
-Jiggy in tunnel
-Defeat Crabs
*Possibly get blue jinjo here
-Jiggy on clanker's back
-Up clanker's tail
-Notes on pipe, mumbo token
*Or here
-Alcoves; 2 notes
-Shoot gold tooth, get jiggy
-8 notes, hoop race
-Swim out through bottom tunnel getting notes
-Up clanker's blowhole, notes, jiggy
-In blowhole
-Witch Switch, leave jiggy side
-Fly, get jiggy while flying, go into where bottles is
-Run through propella's of doom 
-Pink Jinjo
-Leave as quick as possible

kowbrainz

2009-01-13 02:42:14 am

Yeah, the jump from the Mumbo Token to Clanker's back is fairly easy to pull off consistantly with the rat-a-tat rap at the end unless you pull off some big slice of fail and somehow slide off the sloped grate platform the wrong way. I haven't had anything go wrong with this jump recently though.

I don't collect the jiggy inside Clanker from the hoops while flying though. Any other flying manoevers I'm generally happy with, it's just this one usually ends in tears with me landing and generally looks terrible when you have to go all the way back to the other side of the room for the flight pad. At the same time, I haven't practiced it too much because of this, so it could be easier. Not sure.

Gibbatizer

2009-01-13 03:06:29 am

Quote:

I don't collect the jiggy inside Clanker from the hoops while flying though. Any other flying manoevers I'm generally happy with, it's just this one usually ends in tears with me landing and generally looks terrible when you have to go all the way back to the other side of the room for the flight pad. At the same time, I haven't practiced it too much because of this, so it could be easier. Not sure.

If you point yourself at the wall to the left and aim for a particular pillar/rib, fly all the way upto it, then turn toward the jiggy, you can pick it up perfectly due to natural descent. Bit hard to explain, but it is unfailable.

Gibbatizer

2009-01-14 10:41:16 pm

I couldn't sleep last night, so I devised ANOTHER Rusty Bucket Bay route. There's really probably no point posting it as i'll have to try it out to really see if it is faster or not, but i'm bored and it might provide some interest. Plus there may be some small differences to make it save those precious seconds.

-4 notes up ramp, pipe: notes & token
-Run left (towards front of ship), break open window, 3 notes + mumbo token
-312 111 + notes & jiggy
- jump of front of ship, notes on top of shark cage, go into window
- jiggy, notes
- Raise the anchor etc
- yellow jinjo, honey comb
- green sludge, green jinjo and notes
- 3 blue boxes
- Orange Jinjo!
- Drop box to explode
- Run across Crane, jump to witch switch jiggy
- Slow the propella's
- Boom Box
- Window next to Pipe that attacks
- Run up ramps collecting notes, up to jiggy at top of funnell
- Jump to the crane if possible (or do 312-111 here)
- Raise Cage
- Jump to lifeboat (optional), get jiggy
- Pipe
- Captains Room
- Get to Engine room (fastest way there) *possibly go in the window next to the pipe that attacks here
- Engine room, walk through window
-Collect notes on edge of ship
- jiggy between propella's
- Jinjo in water, jump through the grates
- 4 notes
- Leave

I couldn't sleep last night, so I devised ANOTHER Rusty Bucket Bay route. There's really probably no point posting it as i'll have to try it out to really see if it is faster or not, but i'm bored and it might provide some interest. Plus there may be some small differences to make it save those precious seconds.

-4 notes up ramp, pipe: notes & token
-Run left (towards front of ship), break open window, 3 notes + mumbo token
-312 111 + notes & jiggy
- jump of front of ship, notes on top of shark cage, go into window
- jiggy, notes
- Raise the anchor etc
- yellow jinjo, honey comb
- green sludge, green jinjo and notes
- 3 blue boxes
- Orange Jinjo!
- Drop box to explode
- Run across Crane, jump to witch switch jiggy
- Slow the propella's
- Boom Box
- Window next to Pipe that attacks
- Run up ramps collecting notes, up to jiggy at top of funnell
- Jump to the crane if possible (or do 312-111 here)
- Raise Cage
- Jump to lifeboat (optional), get jiggy
- Pipe
- Captains Room
- Get to Engine room (fastest way there) *possibly go in the window next to the pipe that attacks here
- Engine room, walk through window
-Collect notes on edge of ship
- jiggy between propella's
- Jinjo in water, jump through the grates
- 4 notes
- Leave

Qgstkpnjtp

2009-01-14 11:43:31 pm

twitch.tv/fiveleafclover

Quote from kowbrainz:

Yeah, the jump from the Mumbo Token to Clanker's back is fairly easy to pull off consistantly with the rat-a-tat rap at the end unless you pull off some big slice of fail and somehow slide off the sloped grate platform the wrong way. I haven't had anything go wrong with this jump recently though.

I don't collect the jiggy inside Clanker from the hoops while flying though. Any other flying manoevers I'm generally happy with, it's just this one usually ends in tears with me landing and generally looks terrible when you have to go all the way back to the other side of the room for the flight pad. At the same time, I haven't practiced it too much because of this, so it could be easier. Not sure.

Ah, thought it was from the MT (in other words the opposite direction to where I go)

I also came up with a new route for CC but it's strictly XBLA only due to the fact that I'd be jumping from the pipe with the HH above the water to the semicircular pipe at the rear of the level.

I haven't tested it at all yet though.

@Gibb - Your new route is actually pretty similar to my new one. Only thing I don't like is the detour for the blue jinjo. You're probably better jumping down from the alcoves to the blue jinjo tunnel rather than getting it first just to keep things a bit smoother. Other than that though, that should be a good run.

[quote="kowbrainz"]
Yeah, the jump from the Mumbo Token to Clanker's back is fairly easy to pull off consistantly with the rat-a-tat rap at the end unless you pull off some big slice of fail and somehow slide off the sloped grate platform the wrong way. I haven't had anything go wrong with this jump recently though.

I don't collect the jiggy inside Clanker from the hoops while flying though. Any other flying manoevers I'm generally happy with, it's just this one usually ends in tears with me landing and generally looks terrible when you have to go all the way back to the other side of the room for the flight pad. At the same time, I haven't practiced it too much because of this, so it could be easier. Not sure.
[/quote]

Ah, thought it was from the MT (in other words the opposite direction to where I go)

I also came up with a new route for CC but it's strictly XBLA only due to the fact that I'd be jumping from the pipe with the HH above the water to the semicircular pipe at the rear of the level.

I haven't tested it at all yet though.

@Gibb - Your new route is actually pretty similar to my new one. Only thing I don't like is the detour for the blue jinjo. You're probably better jumping down from the alcoves to the blue jinjo tunnel rather than getting it first just to keep things a bit smoother. Other than that though, that should be a good run.

Qgstkpnjtp

2009-01-24 02:31:45 pm

twitch.tv/fiveleafclover

Who is The Crush 11? >.>

Also, LOL @ me still having GV and BGS despite not playing for like... well, since L4D came out

EDIT: Whoops, this is the '64 thread. Oh well.

AirmanRWP

2009-01-28 05:33:57 am

The Crush 11 is crushination from RareWitch Project. He's posted in the 'fastest mumbo mountain times' in the Banjo Kazooie Series forum.

kowbrainz

2009-01-29 06:30:20 am

Yeah Pyro already knows; Crush has posted in a topic on the New Consoles board for XBLA speedrunning.

Gibbatizer

2009-02-04 08:31:09 am

Bit of an update. im back running again, well recording. Failed again tonight to guess who!? But I wasn't doing brilliantly anyway, I went on for a little while but didn't improve. Um, that's about all. I checked the times for the last run attempt (the one where I smashed my controller), no wonder too, it was going brilliantly. Spiral Mountain 2.08 :S I didn't even know that was possible. Hopefully I still have it recorded, i'll upload it to youtube, oh yeh I found a way to do that. It will be recorded with a camera though, well a built in webcam so won't be great condition, but at least the option is there now.

That's it, im dedicating all of tomorrow to running so lets hope...

Play-doh

2009-02-07 03:20:10 am

How did the running two days ago go and how the hell did you get 2:08, very well done

Gibbatizer

2009-02-08 02:44:08 am

No luck AT ALL! I think only 1 of the attempts made it past Clanker's. Maybe 2 at best. I wasn't playing too badly, I was having a lot of luck on stuff like Ticker's tower, which I rarely stuff up now. But I dunno, just random shit kept wasting precious time, and I want it to be fairly perfect 'looking' otherwise there's no point bothering really.

Anyway I ended up somehow breaking another controller. I dunno how, they're getting weak in their old age. I had a bean bag handy which I kept throwing it at so it wouldn't break, but even that managed to stuff it somehow.

Im thinking i might just send in the 2.40.50. I watched it all the way through for the first time, and its really not too bad at all. There was the stuff up in MMM, but aside from that it was mint (MMM). There was the death aswell, which didn't waste much time, but was so stupid and easy to avoid. Oh and the witch, 8! missed beak bombs *lowers head in disgrace*. Other than those it's fairly good.
Anyway, i'll wait a bit longer and a few more tries when I get a chance.

For the 2.08, I went right and jumped up at the yellow flowers and proceeded on that route. The places you can get lucky are; where the colliwobbles placed, how high the honeycombs fly out of the colliwobble and the rock, and how smooth your jump into the water is, but especially how smooth you resurface.
Must have had a good combo of each...

No luck AT ALL! I think only 1 of the attempts made it past Clanker's. Maybe 2 at best. I wasn't playing too badly, I was having a lot of luck on stuff like Ticker's tower, which I rarely stuff up now. But I dunno, just random shit kept wasting precious time, and I want it to be fairly perfect 'looking' otherwise there's no point bothering really.

Anyway I ended up somehow breaking another controller. I dunno how, they're getting weak in their old age. I had a bean bag handy which I kept throwing it at so it wouldn't break, but even that managed to stuff it somehow.

Im thinking i might just send in the 2.40.50. I watched it all the way through for the first time, and its really not too bad at all. There was the stuff up in MMM, but aside from that it was mint (MMM). There was the death aswell, which didn't waste much time, but was so stupid and easy to avoid. Oh and the witch, 8! missed beak bombs *lowers head in disgrace*. Other than those it's fairly good. 
Anyway, i'll wait a bit longer and a few more tries when I get a chance.

For the 2.08, I went right and jumped up at the yellow flowers and proceeded on that route. The places you can get lucky are; where the colliwobbles placed, how high the honeycombs fly out of the colliwobble and the rock, and how smooth your jump into the water is, but especially how smooth you resurface.
Must have had a good combo of each...

kowbrainz

2009-02-08 11:02:12 pm

Another one? Sheesh. I know I keep a separate controller for BK since other games like Smash Bros wore out the control stick like hell, but I still don't know how yours are breaking so easily. Tongue

Yeah, give it a few more shots if you can; I'd really like to see something under 2.40 if possible. 8 beak bomb misses against Grunty sounds pretty bad; I assume you were going for speccy hits from far away rather than just getting up in her face and hitting her then. Ah well; doesn't matter too much I suppose.

Gibbatizer

2009-02-09 03:03:39 am

dunno what went wrong, missed a few, so was a distance away and tried a few long ones. That was probably my worst grunty EVER, usually I only miss once, twice at most

DRybes

2009-02-10 06:51:07 pm

O Zlda?

what kowbrainz said + work on perfecting your poorer courses maybe? I would be concerned if you're throwing controllers into anything... you can't be that way when you run, i've thought about it and it's just a waste of a good controller...

marshmallow

2009-02-16 01:46:10 am

Jack of all Trades

This is my last good run to not get owned yet. Good job! Is the PAL version of BK slow or is it the same?

Play-doh

2009-02-16 01:32:02 pm

Sure, Bk-PAL(australia & europe) is 25 frames per sec. compared to NTSC(u.s.) of 30 frames per second

Raft

2009-02-19 01:49:04 am

I believe they run the same, at least I think I saw that in another thread or earlier in this one. Kowz, Gibb or other banjo players verify?

Qgstkpnjtp

2009-02-19 11:18:17 pm

twitch.tv/fiveleafclover

Quote from marshmallow:

This is my last good run to not get owned yet. Good job! Is the PAL version of BK slow or is it the same?

>.>

I won't comment.

=P

kowbrainz

2009-02-20 12:23:15 am

Yeah, Rare's done fairly well keeping the versions the same actually. I couldn't notice anything different in the speeds when I started running the Live Arcade version, nor in my experimentation with the NTSC rom.

Gibbatizer

2009-02-20 09:01:30 pm

no idea sorry. I am in possession of my final controller. So when I get the time block i'll continue attempts...

DRybes

2009-02-21 05:17:16 pm

O Zlda?

to marsh (and others?): the first 5 or so pages of this thread were spent trying to determine the answer to that question...