Hagane (SNES)

2014-03-03 06:11:30 pm

All the things

The fire slides were something that the TAS did that I never really tried out. If you have a consistent way to set them up, great! I'll try to play around with zips tonight and we'll see what happens.

EpiclyEpic

2014-03-04 08:10:11 pm

I had a thought, do you know how the mini boss triggers works? Would it be possible to skip some of them at all?

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2014-03-04 11:06:26 pm

2014-03-04 10:52:42 pm

All the things

Found some minor new stuff in 3-2 to cut off about half a second from the closing cutscene. I have a video, but I'm going to wait until tomorrow to edit it. Summary: you have a ~18 frame window to execute a dragon punch at the edge of the screen and cause the screen to black out sooner. You can do other things that have some goofy effects, but they're quite a bit slower.

I experimented with zipping in various places, but for any serious zips it looks like I'll have to figure out more of just how it works. I managed to do the zip in 5-5 a small handful of times but most of the time it will just kill you.

Other misc notes:
-Jasei-Jyu cannot be manipulated by position. Just hope that she goes low so she can fall off the screen sooner. Another thing to chalk up to RNG.
-Zips in 5-4 are too inconsistent to be practical.
-Zip in 4-2 might work, but needs a consistent setup that doesn't kill you. If consistent method not found, investigate bottom path as alternative.
-TODO: Might be some wiggle room with the RNG sequence to get yet another bomb in stage 1. I need to go and recalculate it a bit.
-The fire pillars have a 3-pixel ledge on either side where you're safe. While still somewhat inconsistent, it doesn't seem to bad to incorporate into runs.
-TODO: Test slope mechanics a bit. Just determine how speed changes depending on movement type.
-Mini-zips in 2-2 are great if you can get them to work first try. Each one only saves about a quarter second though.

I was hoping to find more, but eh. It will do for now.

Found some minor new stuff in 3-2 to cut off about half a second from the closing cutscene. I have a video, but I'm going to wait until tomorrow to edit it. Summary: you have a ~18 frame window to execute a dragon punch at the edge of the screen and cause the screen to black out sooner. You can do other things that have some goofy effects, but they're quite a bit slower.

I experimented with zipping in various places, but for any serious zips it looks like I'll have to figure out more of just how it works. I managed to do the zip in 5-5 a small handful of times but most of the time it will just kill you.

Other misc notes:
-Jasei-Jyu cannot be manipulated by position. Just hope that she goes low so she can fall off the screen sooner. Another thing to chalk up to RNG.
-Zips in 5-4 are too inconsistent to be practical.
-Zip in 4-2 might work, but needs a consistent setup that doesn't kill you. If consistent method not found, investigate bottom path as alternative.
-TODO: Might be some wiggle room with the RNG sequence to get yet another bomb in stage 1. I need to go and recalculate it a bit.
-The fire pillars have a 3-pixel ledge on either side where you're safe. While still somewhat inconsistent, it doesn't seem to bad to incorporate into runs.
-TODO: Test slope mechanics a bit. Just determine how speed changes depending on movement type.
-Mini-zips in 2-2 are great if you can get them to work first try. Each one only saves about a quarter second though.

I was hoping to find more, but eh. It will do for now.

EpiclyEpic

Edit history:

EpiclyEpic: 2014-03-05 04:29:20 pm

EpiclyEpic: 2014-03-05 03:37:59 pm

2014-03-05 03:37:29 pm

I was able to get my time down to a 17:35. Ill have to rewatch it because Im pretty sure it had terrible play in it with some pretty bad luck. I found myself a good amount ahead a few times, but I either made a shitty mistake or had really bad luck. Either way I can improve this pretty easily and ill probably stream some more attempts later. I probably wont upload the run to youtube as I know ill beat it soon, but Ill highlight it and link it later.

EpiclyEpic

2014-03-18 06:19:32 pm

Is there a value I can track to see what pattern the 2nd boss will give me? (I really dont know much about ramwatch/tracking this kinda stuff.) I just get never get a good pattern and want to do some testing.

Omnigamer

2014-03-18 07:21:55 pm

All the things

If my notes are right, 7E1106 holds En-Mikoshi's current pattern. 7E1044 is Shura-Oh's pattern. Either pulls this from the next RNG value (7E00AA) and takes the lowest two bits. For En-Mikoshi, 0 is lasers, 1 is the electro balls, 2 is soul balls, and 3 makes him vulnerable. For Shura-Oh, 0 is top, 1 is left side, 2 is right side, and 3 is top.

EpiclyEpic

2014-03-19 09:33:53 pm

I dont like this game anymore. Sad

http://www.twitch.tv/epicly_epic/c/3918927

lurk

2014-03-20 11:22:50 am

gotta love en-mikoshit and shit-oh

Omnigamer

2014-03-20 11:40:05 am

All the things

Pretty much Sad

It's just 2 random events, but they can crush a lot of dreams.

Fantastic time, other than that. Keep it up!

EpiclyEpic

2014-03-20 02:20:50 pm

Yeah, I think if I would have stood on the left edge and got 3 blue balls, he would have given me the right side now that I think about it.

Thanks Omni! en mikoshi was nice yesterday for once (since I started running this) and gave me the fastest pattern 2 runs in a row, so that restored a little faith :p

Omnigamer

2014-03-20 03:09:24 pm

All the things

One thing left to consider: Ohon jumps up towards Shura-Oh's arms with a set timing and gets the fist pattern. Fist is a fair bit faster than orbs, so if it can be manipulated then may as well. If it was just chance though, then oh well. Another (minor) thing to chalk up to luck.

EpiclyEpic

Edit history:

EpiclyEpic: 2014-03-20 11:10:16 pm

EpiclyEpic: 2014-03-20 11:09:59 pm

2014-03-20 10:52:41 pm

15:21! Couldve been much better, but I had some mid level mistakes that added up pretty quickly.

http://www.twitch.tv/epicly_epic/c/3924568

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2014-03-22 03:08:00 pm

Omnigamer: 2014-03-21 02:02:52 pm

2014-03-21 02:00:58 pm

All the things

Watched your run and wanted to point out a few things:

-Setting up the TAS kill strat for Boss 1 is possible, but I haven't found a way to make it consistent yet. Saves ~.5 sec or so.
-Ohon's strat for 2-1 is slower. Try for either the TAS strat, or hope for him to do his low pattern. I don't know what the time difference is, but I'm fairly certain a low pattern kill is ideal.
-Divekicks for the flame slides in 2-3 (both onto and off the platforms) can save some number of frames.
-En-mikoshi doesn't take any damage at all during his first initial phase. It doesn't do anything at all, to the best of my knowledge.
-You can save almost a second by sliding in the last danger section of 3-2 instead of bouncing. The conveyors help, and you have the HP to take the hits.
-Do you really need the extra bomb in 4-2?
-Throw a kunai at the foot soldier after the climb in 4-3 to reduce a handful of lag frames.
-Doom Train can be optimized a bit more, but I'm still not sure how.
-It looks like you tried to use a bounce setup for the very last part of 5-4. Did you find something that works reasonably well? I was only able to get something to work in non-practical conditions.

Watched your run and wanted to point out a few things:

-Setting up the TAS kill strat for Boss 1 is possible, but I haven't found a way to make it consistent yet. Saves ~.5 sec or so.
-Ohon's strat for 2-1 is slower. Try for either the TAS strat, or hope for him to do his low pattern. I don't know what the time difference is, but I'm fairly certain a low pattern kill is ideal.
-Divekicks for the flame slides in 2-3 (both onto and off the platforms) can save some number of frames.
-En-mikoshi doesn't take any damage at all during his first initial phase. It doesn't do anything at all, to the best of my knowledge.
-You can save almost a second by sliding in the last danger section of 3-2 instead of bouncing. The conveyors help, and you have the HP to take the hits.
-Do you really need the extra bomb in 4-2?
-Throw a kunai at the foot soldier after the climb in 4-3 to reduce a handful of lag frames.
-Doom Train can be optimized a bit more, but I'm still not sure how.
-It looks like you tried to use a bounce setup for the very last part of 5-4. Did you find something that works reasonably well? I was only able to get something to work in non-practical conditions.

EpiclyEpic

2014-03-22 12:17:38 pm

-Ill have to mess around with the 2-1 mini-boss to see if I can get the TAS strat down then. I do get the pattern where he goes low quite often though.
-I was just irritated with En-Mikoshi, thats why I was hitting him at the start :p
-As for 3-2, what section do you mean exactly? The top part before the drop/2nd elevator section?
-I like to have 2 bombs for the final boss, thats why I grabbed the bomb in 4-2. I typically hope for an earlier one, but if I dont have 4 there I just go for it.
-In 5-4 I just happened to air tumble a little low, thats why I bounced kind of silly. One of the many mistakes in the run.

Omnigamer

2014-03-22 03:09:20 pm

All the things

TAS boss strat for 2-1 is also not necessarily faster. Ideally it may even be worth while to use a bomb on him. For either pattern the goal is to kill him as close to the center as possible so he disappears quicker. The lower he is, the better.

EpiclyEpic

2014-03-22 07:54:00 pm

Cant seem to manipulate Shura-Oh into fisting me (lol)

I made a save state just before the fight starts, so maybe thats why idk

EpiclyEpic

Edit history:

EpiclyEpic: 2014-05-15 11:29:55 am

2014-05-15 11:29:13 am

Did a little research on the 2-1 boss. It seems using a bomb can save a second, so I guess if you have an extra bomb at that point it could be worth it. This was with him giving a high pattern, not sure if he moves horizontally.

Also, ill be doing more runs of this soon to see if I can get closer to Ohons run.

Omnigamer

2014-05-15 03:34:40 pm

All the things

I also want to get back into it, but I probably won't be able to until after SGDQ. Good luck!

EpiclyEpic

2014-05-27 07:52:49 pm

I got my sum of best down to 15:03 just by cleaning up my Stage 2. Also this happened today:

Good way to lose a good looking run-http://www.twitch.tv/epicly_epic/c/4342340

and I finally got a recording of this, bombless 3-2 strat-http://www.twitch.tv/epicly_epic/c/4342368

lurk

Edit history:

lurk: 2015-01-23 04:47:11 pm

2015-01-23 04:35:37 pm

i found a zip in 2-2 http://puu.sh/eVZ7b/992d9b7d46.jpg

it's weird to bounce off the blocks at the bottom and seamlessly zip through. i think you have to scroll the screen upward to make the next series of blocks fall