Hagane (SNES)

2012-07-23 09:41:48 am

All the things

I've picked this game up recently as a speedrun project, and it's honestly very fun and flashy. There's a very well-done TAS available for it that shows off a number of zips, however after investigating them most are not reproducable by hand due to alternating frame inputs or other craziness. It is possible to do the walljump variation of the glitch, but consistency is still a long way off. To summarize how to pull it off:

1. Face away from a wall, jump, and use the grappling hook. Right after you fire it, press towards the wall and you will partially clip into it.
2. Right before you are clipped back out of the wall, you have roughly 2 frames to press down, which puts you into a crouch animation.
3. Once you're crouching, you have a window of 2 frames to jump. This has to occur at least 1 frame after pressing down; it cannot be on the same frame.

The jump by itself has pretty limited usefulness with a few exceptions, such as parts of Stage 2. Even then, it would need to be done consistently to save time, and that's something that's still quite difficult. Several other places you can use it to perform a small zip, but unfortunately it will only be possible to use overhanging ledges for this.

The rest of the game comes down to getting good luck/timing on bosses, which I haven't found to be too bad at all. If I'm reading the TAS notes correctly, the game's RNG is based on your score (for portions of it, at least). This can be abused in a run to ensure that several of the bosses always give a good pattern, with Boss 2 being the best example.

As for the stages, there's a lot of room for optimization in terms of both movement and invincibility abuse. You have a ton of invincibility during several of your flips and attacks, so abusing this can get you through some parts quicker than others. Also of note is that you can bounce off of some enemies to reach otherwise inaccessible ledges and things, which can significantly break up some levels.

I did a 1cc (2 deaths) of the game in 29:43 with very little practice and optimization, so it is definitely runnable. The rest of the tricks seem like a lot of fun too, and I'm looking forward to routing it further. I figured I'd open up a thread in case anybody else wanted to throw in some suggestions.

Thread title:

I've picked this game up recently as a speedrun project, and it's honestly very fun and flashy. There's a very well-done TAS available for it that shows off a number of zips, however after investigating them most are not reproducable by hand due to alternating frame inputs or other craziness. It is possible to do the walljump variation of the glitch, but consistency is still a long way off. To summarize how to pull it off:

1. Face away from a wall, jump, and use the grappling hook. Right after you fire it, press towards the wall and you will partially clip into it.
2. Right before you are clipped back out of the wall, you have roughly 2 frames to press down, which puts you into a crouch animation.
3. Once you're crouching, you have a window of 2 frames to jump. This has to occur at least 1 frame after pressing down; it cannot be on the same frame.

The jump by itself has pretty limited usefulness with a few exceptions, such as parts of Stage 2. Even then, it would need to be done consistently to save time, and that's something that's still quite difficult. Several other places you can use it to perform a small zip, but unfortunately it will only be possible to use overhanging ledges for this.

The rest of the game comes down to getting good luck/timing on bosses, which I haven't found to be too bad at all. If I'm reading the TAS notes correctly, the game's RNG is based on your score (for portions of it, at least). This can be abused in a run to ensure that several of the bosses always give a good pattern, with Boss 2 being the best example.

As for the stages, there's a lot of room for optimization in terms of both movement and invincibility abuse. You have a ton of invincibility during several of your flips and attacks, so abusing this can get you through some parts quicker than others. Also of note is that you can bounce off of some enemies to reach otherwise inaccessible ledges and things, which can significantly break up some levels.

I did a 1cc (2 deaths) of the game in 29:43 with very little practice and optimization, so it is definitely runnable. The rest of the tricks seem like a lot of fun too, and I'm looking forward to routing it further. I figured I'd open up a thread in case anybody else wanted to throw in some suggestions.

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2012-07-24 12:50:47 am

2012-07-24 12:37:54 am

All the things

Put in some effort on the bosses and some stage skips yesterday. Notes on boss HP and addresses below, verbatim from my notes:

7E102F - Miniboss 1 HP. 32 max.
7E11AF - Boss 1 HP. 50 max.
7E122F - Miniboss 2 HP. 36 Max.
7E102F - 2-3 Miniboss HP. 10 Max.
7E112F - Boss 2 HP. 40 max.
7E10AF - 3-2 miniboss right. 18 HP
7E142F - 3-2 miniboss left. 18 HP
7E11AF - Boss 3 HP. 60 Max; below 40, goes down to 30 until tail is fully grown; any damage done while/before growing resets to 30 after.
7E11AF - 4-1 miniboss HP. Max 25. Also present in 7E11D4
7E12AF - 4-2 miniboss. 20 HP
7E102F - Boss 4. 50 HP. Once below 30, resets to 50. Shingles have 6? 2nd form has 50 again, switches phases at 30. Last phase has 30.
7E182F - 5-1 miniboss 28 HP.
7E102F - Boss 5 HP. 30 HP

7E0901 - State. 00 if invuln, 80 if vuln
7E0514 - HP.

Damages:
T1J - 6, hits twice if aimed
T1A - 5, hits twice if aimed
T2J - 2, hits several times
T2A - 7, hits once
T3J - 25, hits once
T3A - 4, hits area
JumpKick - 1
Kunai - 2
Sword - 2
Grenade - 2 direct, 1 splash
Grappling - 1
Bomb - 3 sets of 2 dmg, 6 total

In addition, two stage skips:
1-3: With good timing, you can bounce off the second worm and use that to propel you just high enough to reach the ledge above, skipping a good chunk of the level. It will take good timing, but this saves a good 30 seconds or more.
4-3: After the first section with the lava pillars and in the "middle ground", the second main platform will have a guy that jumps off the edge and a floating robo. With proper timing, a good bounce off the robo can launch you high enough to bounce between the platforms and up on to one. Saves at least 30 seconds.

I managed to hit both in a run last night, and with a bunch of deaths + 1 continue + random time lost to resetting stream, I still came in under 28 minutes. So... it's really hard to say what a good run of this will be. Could even get as low as sub-20.

I still need to come up with a solid boss 4 strat, and look into all that RNG manip business. Overall this game is going to be a lot of fun to run; I've only started to experiment with different strategies and a lot of it at least looks awesome if nothing else. I will need to experiment with more invulnerability abuse as well. Just a lot to do! Look forward to it.

Put in some effort on the bosses and some stage skips yesterday. Notes on boss HP and addresses below, verbatim from my notes:

7E102F - Miniboss 1 HP. 32 max.
7E11AF - Boss 1 HP. 50 max.
7E122F - Miniboss 2 HP. 36 Max.
7E102F - 2-3 Miniboss HP. 10 Max.
7E112F - Boss 2 HP. 40 max.
7E10AF - 3-2 miniboss right. 18 HP
7E142F - 3-2 miniboss left. 18 HP
7E11AF - Boss 3 HP. 60 Max; below 40, goes down to 30 until tail is fully grown; any damage done while/before growing resets to 30 after.
7E11AF - 4-1 miniboss HP. Max 25. Also present in 7E11D4
7E12AF - 4-2 miniboss. 20 HP
7E102F - Boss 4. 50 HP. Once below 30, resets to 50. Shingles have 6? 2nd form has 50 again, switches phases at 30. Last phase has 30.
7E182F - 5-1 miniboss 28 HP.
7E102F - Boss 5 HP. 30 HP

7E0901 - State. 00 if invuln, 80 if vuln
7E0514 - HP.

Damages:
T1J - 6, hits twice if aimed
T1A - 5, hits twice if aimed
T2J - 2, hits several times
T2A - 7, hits once
T3J - 25, hits once
T3A - 4, hits area
JumpKick - 1
Kunai - 2
Sword - 2
Grenade - 2 direct, 1 splash
Grappling - 1
Bomb - 3 sets of 2 dmg, 6 total

In addition, two stage skips:
1-3: With good timing, you can bounce off the second worm and use that to propel you just high enough to reach the ledge above, skipping a good chunk of the level. It will take good timing, but this saves a good 30 seconds or more.
4-3: After the first section with the lava pillars and in the "middle ground", the second main platform will have a guy that jumps off the edge and a floating robo. With proper timing, a good bounce off the robo can launch you high enough to bounce between the platforms and up on to one. Saves at least 30 seconds.

I managed to hit both in a run last night, and with a bunch of deaths + 1 continue + random time lost to resetting stream, I still came in under 28 minutes. So... it's really hard to say what a good run of this will be. Could even get as low as sub-20.

I still need to come up with a solid boss 4 strat, and look into all that RNG manip business. Overall this game is going to be a lot of fun to run; I've only started to experiment with different strategies and a lot of it at least looks awesome if nothing else. I will need to experiment with more invulnerability abuse as well. Just a lot to do! Look forward to it.

scaryice

2012-07-24 02:55:00 am

Hopefully you already own the cart, with the way it's skyrocketed.

Omnigamer

2012-07-24 09:24:37 am

All the things

I own a JP cart, which was significantly cheaper, although still pricey.

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2012-07-26 02:11:19 am

Omnigamer: 2012-07-26 01:46:58 am

Omnigamer: 2012-07-26 01:41:19 am

Omnigamer: 2012-07-26 12:43:05 am

2012-07-26 12:42:21 am

All the things

Alright, I'm all set to do actual runs for this! I have gone through and optimized most stages to the best of my ability, but the most significant breakthroughs have come from new boss strats, which should guarantee me a quick kill against every boss and miniboss so long as I don't suck. In particular, I have a strat for the Amano-Ikazuchi that takes it out at a point earlier than the TAS if I pull it off correctly! There are only a couple other things to work out that would significantly help the run:
-Find a way to manipulate a blue flame in 1-1. This is the best stage for it since it's early, and there are 2 separate places where I can take time to kill things without penalty. Manipulating a couple extra bombs would do wonders as well.
-Better paths through 2-2. I have a decent idea of how I want to proceed, but getting through with enough health to skip through the laser walls is a bit rough. I will work on it.

Beyond that, all I need is practice on the Worm skip and making sure my invincibility strats are sufficient for a couple other stages. Good execution on bosses is always nice too. I did a 20:30 earlier today with 1 death (at Amano-Ikazuchi! ARGH), but with the new strats sub 18:30 is definitely possible. We'll see what happens. I'll try to make a few videos for the bosses when I get a chance.

EDIT: Video below.

EDIT2: One last thing that's useless, but fun to mention. If you're holding down and back as you enter Boss 1's area, the game bugs out and thinks you're pressing left+right. Kind of fun to do just for the heck of it. You can backwards slide too. Style points are go!

EDIT3: Note to self: Look into the more advanced routes in 3-2 and 5-2, courtesy Dark Fulgore's canceled TAS.

Alright, I'm all set to do actual runs for this! I have gone through and optimized most stages to the best of my ability, but the most significant breakthroughs have come from new boss strats, which should guarantee me a quick kill against every boss and miniboss so long as I don't suck. In particular, I have a strat for the Amano-Ikazuchi that takes it out at a point earlier than the TAS if I pull it off correctly! There are only a couple other things to work out that would significantly help the run:
-Find a way to manipulate a blue flame in 1-1. This is the best stage for it since it's early, and there are 2 separate places where I can take time to kill things without penalty. Manipulating a couple extra bombs would do wonders as well.
-Better paths through 2-2. I have a decent idea of how I want to proceed, but getting through with enough health to skip through the laser walls is a bit rough. I will work on it.

Beyond that, all I need is practice on the Worm skip and making sure my invincibility strats are sufficient for a couple other stages. Good execution on bosses is always nice too. I did a 20:30 earlier today with 1 death (at Amano-Ikazuchi! ARGH), but with the new strats sub 18:30 is definitely possible. We'll see what happens. I'll try to make a few videos for the bosses when I get a chance.

EDIT: Video below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsKJUtplqNA

EDIT2: One last thing that's useless, but fun to mention. If you're holding down and back as you enter Boss 1's area, the game bugs out and thinks you're pressing left+right. Kind of fun to do just for the heck of it. You can backwards slide too. Style points are go!

EDIT3: Note to self: Look into the more advanced routes in 3-2 and 5-2, courtesy Dark Fulgore's canceled TAS.

Exo

2012-07-26 02:25:06 am

Sandbagging

Cool stuff Omni! Lookin forward to seeing this on stream Smiley

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2012-07-27 12:02:18 am

2012-07-26 10:56:03 pm

All the things

The good news:
-New skip for 5-2 that saves about 30 seconds and a lot of headaches
-New strategy for killing boss 5 in 1 cycle (TAS does it in 2!). See Video.

Bad news:
-I can't seem to manipulate Boss 5 consistently yet. Being able to predict the spawn point of the weak spot is crucial, and it appears that going through 5-5 differently will force him to go through different patterns, no matter how I manipulate him by position. I was able to isolate the address for the spawn point (and his attacks) but I haven't investigated how to guarantee the pattern yet. It's at 7E1044 for those curious.
-The strats for 3-2 and 4-2 that slightly speed up the elevator sequences seem too unreliable for a real-time run. Oh well.

So now I'm up to needing 5 bombs for a full run, meaning 4 bomb drops. This is starting to be an issue. I still haven't isolated how to force certain drops, nor have I looked into reliable stage 1 strats to get some of the stuff that I need. In any case, this run keeps improving... I'm getting really excited for attempts of it.

EDIT: Just checked out GTimeKiller's rejected TAS, and he uses some similar routes/skips to what I found. However, I'm still the only one to do the worm skip :p

The good news:
-New skip for 5-2 that saves about 30 seconds and a lot of headaches
-New strategy for killing boss 5 in 1 cycle (TAS does it in 2!). See Video.

Bad news:
-I can't seem to manipulate Boss 5 consistently yet. Being able to predict the spawn point of the weak spot is crucial, and it appears that going through 5-5 differently will force him to go through different patterns, no matter how I manipulate him by position. I was able to isolate the address for the spawn point (and his attacks) but I haven't investigated how to guarantee the pattern yet. It's at 7E1044 for those curious.
-The strats for 3-2 and 4-2 that slightly speed up the elevator sequences seem too unreliable for a real-time run. Oh well.

So now I'm up to needing 5 bombs for a full run, meaning 4 bomb drops. This is starting to be an issue. I still haven't isolated how to force certain drops, nor have I looked into reliable stage 1 strats to get some of the stuff that I need. In any case, this run keeps improving... I'm getting really excited for attempts of it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAcCcQpvnmU

EDIT: Just checked out GTimeKiller's rejected TAS, and he uses some similar routes/skips to what I found. However, I'm still the only one to do the worm skip :p

Omnigamer

2012-07-27 04:43:29 pm

All the things

Great news: I've found the RNG! I haven't really looked deeply into it yet, but isolating it was a major issue. The game uses 7E00AA-B as its main source of entropy, and it calls it for a lot of the graphical effects (flames during enemy death animations, charging up to swing the axe, etc). It also entirely influences Boss 5's pattern, at least. Unfortunately, it's not really manipulatable after the first stage, since it will be getting called/changed all the time for all sorts of fire effects, and in general these just won't be the same during a run unless you perform exactly the same every time. The assmbly for the RNG call is below:

Code:

c101e1 jsl $c0c434   [c0c434] A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e4 D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  2
c0c434 php                    A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e1 D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  2
c0c435 phd                    A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e0 D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  2
c0c436 sep #$20               A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  2
c0c438 lda #$00               A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c43a xba                    A:0000 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c43b lda #$00               A:0000 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c43d tcd                    A:0000 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c43e lda $aa       [0000aa] A:0000 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c440 lsr a                  A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizC V:  2
c0c441 lsr a                  A:0058 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  2
c0c442 lsr a                  A:002c X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  2
c0c443 lsr a                  A:0016 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  2
c0c444 sta $28       [000028] A:000b X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  2
c0c446 lda $ab       [0000ab] A:000b X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  3
c0c448 asl a                  A:0067 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  3
c0c449 asl a                  A:00ce X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c44a asl a                  A:009c X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizC V:  3
c0c44b asl a                  A:0038 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizC V:  3
c0c44c ora $28       [000028] A:0070 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  3
c0c44e eor #$ff               A:007b X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  3
c0c450 sta $28       [000028] A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c452 lda $aa       [0000aa] A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c454 ora $ab       [0000ab] A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c456 bne $c45e     [c0c45e] A:00f7 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c45e lda $aa       [0000aa] A:00f7 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c460 sta $ab       [0000ab] A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c462 clc                    A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c463 adc $28       [000028] A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c465 sta $aa       [0000aa] A:0034 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nVMxdizC V:  3
c0c467 lda $28       [000028] A:0034 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nVMxdizC V:  3
c0c469 pld                    A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NVMxdizC V:  3
c0c46a plp                    A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e0 D:1180 DB:83 nVMxdizC V:  3
c0c46b rtl                    A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e1 D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  3

In any case, it should be possible to determine a consistent route for 1-1 blue flame and a couple extra bombs by watching this value and trying several different paths. Another interesting note is that if you die, you will start at the beginning of the stage with the exact same AA/AB values as when you first entered. So if you go through, die, and then proceed mostly the same the next time, you are very likely to get the same drops.

Great news: I've found the RNG! I haven't really looked deeply into it yet, but isolating it was a major issue. The game uses 7E00AA-B as its main source of entropy, and it calls it for a lot of the graphical effects (flames during enemy death animations, charging up to swing the axe, etc). It also entirely influences Boss 5's pattern, at least. Unfortunately, it's not really manipulatable after the first stage, since it will be getting called/changed all the time for all sorts of fire effects, and in general these just won't be the same during a run unless you perform exactly the same every time. The assmbly for the RNG call is below:

[code]c101e1 jsl $c0c434   [c0c434] A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e4 D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  2
c0c434 php                    A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e1 D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  2
c0c435 phd                    A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e0 D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  2
c0c436 sep #$20               A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  2
c0c438 lda #$00               A:0007 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c43a xba                    A:0000 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c43b lda #$00               A:0000 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c43d tcd                    A:0000 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:1180 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c43e lda $aa       [0000aa] A:0000 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdiZC V:  2
c0c440 lsr a                  A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizC V:  2
c0c441 lsr a                  A:0058 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  2
c0c442 lsr a                  A:002c X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  2
c0c443 lsr a                  A:0016 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  2
c0c444 sta $28       [000028] A:000b X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  2
c0c446 lda $ab       [0000ab] A:000b X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  3
c0c448 asl a                  A:0067 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  3
c0c449 asl a                  A:00ce X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c44a asl a                  A:009c X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizC V:  3
c0c44b asl a                  A:0038 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizC V:  3
c0c44c ora $28       [000028] A:0070 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  3
c0c44e eor #$ff               A:007b X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nvMxdizc V:  3
c0c450 sta $28       [000028] A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c452 lda $aa       [0000aa] A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c454 ora $ab       [0000ab] A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c456 bne $c45e     [c0c45e] A:00f7 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c45e lda $aa       [0000aa] A:00f7 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c460 sta $ab       [0000ab] A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c462 clc                    A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c463 adc $28       [000028] A:00b0 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NvMxdizc V:  3
c0c465 sta $aa       [0000aa] A:0034 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nVMxdizC V:  3
c0c467 lda $28       [000028] A:0034 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 nVMxdizC V:  3
c0c469 pld                    A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01de D:0000 DB:83 NVMxdizC V:  3
c0c46a plp                    A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e0 D:1180 DB:83 nVMxdizC V:  3
c0c46b rtl                    A:0084 X:0002 Y:0000 S:01e1 D:1180 DB:83 nvmxdiZC V:  3[/code]

In any case, it should be possible to determine a consistent route for 1-1 blue flame and a couple extra bombs by watching this value and trying several different paths. Another interesting note is that if you die, you will start at the beginning of the stage with the exact same AA/AB values as when you first entered. So if you go through, die, and then proceed mostly the same the next time, you are very likely to get the same drops.

Omnigamer

2012-07-27 09:04:47 pm

All the things

Argh. So it turns out it's not just Boss 5, but all of the bosses except 1. I have fairly consistent strategies for all of the minibosses regardless of their patterns, but the main issue is that beyond 1-1 it would be incredibly difficult to achieve a set RNG simply because the RNG is called and changes every time:
-Certain enemies perform actions (throwing axe, change directions, etc)
-Enemy death animations occur (bird feathers, explosions as they fall away)
-You kill an enemy
-Any sort of fire/flame attack from any source, including the faces throughout stage 5.

So I may have to abandon the possibility of tuning the entire run to be a set RNG and just hope for the stars to align for each of the quick kills that need it (basically just 2 and 5 at this point). It is still feasible to manipulate blue flames and a number of bomb drops in 1-1, but I haven't devised a consistent path for it yet. Beyond 1-1, it would be very hard to control, and it does carry over between each stage.

Bad

2012-07-28 05:36:11 pm

Hagane is a fantastic game, I'd love to own a cart but the prices suck at the moment. Best of luck with this Omni, looking forward to catching some streamed attempts!

Omnigamer

2012-07-28 08:16:29 pm

All the things

Thanks for the support Bad Cheesy

I did some practice runs earlier and landed an 18:30. Not bad, but still a lot of room to improve on the bosses (I got bad patterns on both 2 and 5). It's well on its way though. I still haven't gone through and mapped out a blue flame/bomb path for 1-1, but that's what I will focus on once my other stuff is finished up. Potential to get this below 17, although I might settle for sub-17:30 with a quick kill on either boss 2 or 5.

Exo

2012-07-29 02:24:19 am

Sandbagging

You and your asm magic :s

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 12:22:43 am

2012-08-03 12:11:05 am

All the things

Alright, I've found the relative odds for each of the drops:

1UP: 1.56%
Blue Flame: 1.56%
Red Flame: 9.38%
Kunai: 56.25%
Grenade: 26.56%
Bomb: 4.69%

These are all stored in a 64-byte table at $83/A48E, and are indexed by the 6 most significant bits of the RNG function. RNG function is the process listed a couple posts above, and is the value left in the accumulator after all that.

Some other interesting findings tonight:
-The RNG proceeds in an entirely predictable manner. Every time it is called, it uses that same process to alter itself. I can check tomorrow to actually verify that it gives a normal distribution, and see how long its period is, but that's just extra stuff.
-Some enemies have hard-coded drops, and killing them does not advance the RNG (their explosions still do, however). Axe guys, the bomb bays on the ships in 1-1, and the little floating bombers all fall into this category.
-Unfortunately it will not be possible to come up with a route that is able to guarantee drops/boss luck beyond 1-1. I went through the stage pacifist several times in a row, and not once was I able to keep the RNG consistent by the end.
-Other things that advance the RNG a ton: bird feathers (after killing them), the hover bombers shooting steam to move left and right, each action an axe guy does, and any time a ship turret fires. I imagine turtle movements and otherwise advance it as well.
-I can use all of this information along with the drop table to calculate which numbers will give what drops for the first ~100 iterations of the RNG. I can use that to devise a route that will hopefully guarantee me a blue flame and a couple of bombs.

For my own uses later:

Code:

4
4
3
4
1
5
4
4
5
4
4
5
3
4
5
4
4
5
4
4
5
4
4
6
4
4
5
2
4
5
3
4
5
4
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1	1.56%	1up
1	1.56%	Blue Flame
6	9.38%	Red Flame
36	56.25%	Kunai
17	26.56%	Grenades
3	4.69%	Bomb

Alright, I've found the relative odds for each of the drops:

1UP: 1.56%
Blue Flame: 1.56%
Red Flame: 9.38%
Kunai: 56.25%
Grenade: 26.56%
Bomb: 4.69%

These are all stored in a 64-byte table at $83/A48E, and are indexed by the 6 most significant bits of the RNG function. RNG function is the process listed a couple posts above, and is the value left in the accumulator after all that.

Some other interesting findings tonight:
-The RNG proceeds in an entirely predictable manner. Every time it is called, it uses that same process to alter itself. I can check tomorrow to actually verify that it gives a normal distribution, and see how long its period is, but that's just extra stuff.
-Some enemies have hard-coded drops, and killing them does not advance the RNG (their explosions still do, however). Axe guys, the bomb bays on the ships in 1-1, and the little floating bombers all fall into this category.
-Unfortunately it will not be possible to come up with a route that is able to guarantee drops/boss luck beyond 1-1. I went through the stage pacifist several times in a row, and not once was I able to keep the RNG consistent by the end.
-Other things that advance the RNG a ton: bird feathers (after killing them), the hover bombers shooting steam to move left and right, each action an axe guy does, and any time a ship turret fires. I imagine turtle movements and otherwise advance it as well.
-I can use all of this information along with the drop table to calculate which numbers will give what drops for the first ~100 iterations of the RNG. I can use that to devise a route that will hopefully guarantee me a blue flame and a couple of bombs.

For my own uses later:

[hidden][code]4
4
3
4
1
5
4
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5
4
4
5
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1	1.56%	1up
1	1.56%	Blue Flame
6	9.38%	Red Flame
36	56.25%	Kunai
17	26.56%	Grenades
3	4.69%	Bomb
[/code][/hidden]

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 08:42:32 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 05:22:37 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 05:19:23 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 04:23:58 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 04:12:26 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 04:03:22 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 03:46:14 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 03:31:20 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 02:23:48 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 02:17:12 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-03 02:14:15 pm

2012-08-03 02:10:58 pm

All the things

EDIT: Upgraded to 500 due to the very powerful combination around ~300.

Ladies and gentlemen, I present the first 500 drops in order. It looks like there are some great opportunities for manipulating the blue flames, and even a few bombs. I will play around with it a bit tonight.

Code:

Iteration	Item		RNG
1	'Kunai'		'0000'
2	'Kunai'		'100F'
3	'Kunai'		'0F0E'
4	'Kunai'		'0E1D'
5	'Kunai'		'1D3B'
6	'Kunai'		'3B67'
7	'Red Flame'		'67B0'
8	'Grenade'		'B034'
9	'Red Flame'		'3430'
10	'Grenade'		'30EC'
11	'Kunai'		'ECDD'
12	'Bomb'		'DD0F'
13	'Kunai'		'0F3E'
14	'Kunai'		'3E4A'
15	'Grenade'		'4A65'
16	'Kunai'		'65BE'
17	'Red Flame'		'BE62'
18	'Grenade'		'627B'
19	'Kunai'		'7B53'
20	'Red Flame'		'539D'
21	'Grenade'		'9D63'
22	'Red Flame'		'638C'
23	'Grenade'		'8C53'
24	'Red Flame'		'538D'
25	'Kunai'		'8D54'
26	'Kunai'		'547E'
27	'Grenade'		'7E36'
28	'Kunai'		'3652'
29	'Kunai'		'52EC'
30	'Grenade'		'ECBD'
31	'Kunai'		'BDF1'
32	'Red Flame'		'F111'
33	'Kunai'		'11FF'
34	'Kunai'		'FFDF'
35	'Kunai'		'DFE1'
36	'Kunai'		'E1E2'
37	'Red Flame'		'E2C3'
38	'Red Flame'		'C396'
39	'Kunai'		'965C'
40	'Kunai'		'5CF6'
41	'Grenade'		'F626'
42	'Kunai'		'26C3'
43	'Kunai'		'C356'
44	'Grenade'		'5620'
45	'Kunai'		'20BD'
46	'Kunai'		'BDB1'
47	'Kunai'		'B1D5'
48	'Kunai'		'D5B7'
49	'Grenade'		'B75B'
50	'Grenade'		'5BE5'
51	'Kunai'		'E526'
52	'Kunai'		'26D3'
53	'Kunai'		'D365'
54	'Kunai'		'652E'
55	'Kunai'		'2EDB'
56	'Grenade'		'DBED'
57	'Kunai'		'ED2E'
58	'Kunai'		'2E5B'
59	'Kunai'		'5B75'
60	'Kunai'		'75BD'
61	'Grenade'		'BD61'
62	'Bomb'		'618A'
63	'Grenade'		'8A71'
64	'Kunai'		'71C9'
65	'Grenade'		'C9AC'
66	'Kunai'		'AC11'
67	'Grenade'		'114F'
68	'Kunai'		'4F3A'
69	'Kunai'		'3A46'
70	'Kunai'		'46A1'
71	'Kunai'		'A136'
72	'Grenade'		'3622'
73	'Kunai'		'22BF'
74	'Kunai'		'BF93'
75	'Red Flame'		'9399'
76	'Grenade'		'995F'
77	'Kunai'		'5FC9'
78	'Kunai'		'C9CC'
79	'Red Flame'		'CC2F'
80	'1up'		'2F6C'
81	'Kunai'		'6C75'
82	'Kunai'		'75AD'
83	'Kunai'		'AD52'
84	'Grenade'		'527C'
85	'Grenade'		'7C54'
86	'Blue Flame'		'548E'
87	'Kunai'		'8E45'
88	'Grenade'		'4560'
89	'Kunai'		'6009'
90	'Red Flame'		'0908'
91	'Bomb'		'0877'
92	'Kunai'		'77EF'
93	'1up'		'EF70'
94	'Bomb'		'7078'
95	'Bomb'		'7870'
96	'Grenade'		'70E8'
97	'Kunai'		'E8D9'
98	'Grenade'		'D94B'
99	'Kunai'		'4BB6'
100	'Grenade'		'B6FA'
101	'Kunai'		'FA8A'
102	'Kunai'		'8AE1'
103	'Kunai'		'E132'
104	'Grenade'		'321E'
105	'Grenade'		'1EFC'
106	'Kunai'		'FC0C'
107	'Grenade'		'0C4B'
108	'Red Flame'		'4B86'
109	'Kunai'		'86CD'
110	'Grenade'		'CD60'
111	'Grenade'		'6089'
112	'Bomb'		'8980'
113	'Grenade'		'80E7'
114	'Kunai'		'E7D8'
115	'Kunai'		'D85A'
116	'Red Flame'		'5AD4'
117	'Red Flame'		'D426'
118	'Grenade'		'26E3'
119	'Kunai'		'E374'
120	'Red Flame'		'743C'
121	'Kunai'		'3CF8'
122	'Grenade'		'F828'
123	'Kunai'		'28A5'
124	'Bomb'		'A51A'
125	'Red Flame'		'1AC8'
126	'Kunai'		'C81B'
127	'Red Flame'		'1B99'
128	'Kunai'		'99DF'
129	'Grenade'		'DF41'
130	'Grenade'		'414C'
131	'Red Flame'		'4C37'
132	'1up'		'3773'
133	'Grenade'		'73FB'
134	'Kunai'		'FBBB'
135	'Grenade'		'BBFF'
136	'Kunai'		'FF3F'
137	'Grenade'		'3F4B'
138	'Kunai'		'4B56'
139	'Kunai'		'56A0'
140	'Grenade'		'A035'
141	'Kunai'		'3531'
142	'Kunai'		'31DD'
143	'Kunai'		'DDBF'
144	'Kunai'		'BFE3'
145	'Grenade'		'E3E4'
146	'Grenade'		'E4A5'
147	'Kunai'		'A55A'
148	'Grenade'		'5A04'
149	'Kunai'		'0463'
150	'Kunai'		'631C'
151	'Kunai'		'1CEA'
152	'Grenade'		'EA1B'
153	'Kunai'		'1B79'
154	'Kunai'		'79C1'
155	'Kunai'		'C124'
156	'Kunai'		'2411'
157	'Kunai'		'11CF'
158	'Red Flame'		'CFB2'
159	'Kunai'		'B2B6'
160	'Grenade'		'B68A'
161	'Kunai'		'8A21'
162	'Kunai'		'217E'
163	'Red Flame'		'7E66'
164	'Red Flame'		'667F'
165	'Kunai'		'7F17'
166	'Kunai'		'1725'
167	'Kunai'		'25B2'
168	'Kunai'		'B256'
169	'Grenade'		'5630'
170	'Kunai'		'30CC'
171	'Grenade'		'CCBF'
172	'Kunai'		'BFF3'
173	'Grenade'		'F3F3'
174	'Kunai'		'F3B3'
175	'Kunai'		'B377'
176	'Kunai'		'773F'
177	'Kunai'		'3FCB'
178	'Kunai'		'CBCE'
179	'Kunai'		'CE11'
180	'Kunai'		'112F'
181	'Kunai'		'2F1C'
182	'Red Flame'		'1C2A'
183	'Grenade'		'2A67'
184	'Kunai'		'67C0'
185	'Kunai'		'C043'
186	'Grenade'		'433E'
187	'Kunai'		'3E0A'
188	'Kunai'		'0A29'
189	'Bomb'		'2986'
190	'Grenade'		'86ED'
191	'Grenade'		'ED7E'
192	'Kunai'		'7EA6'
193	'Kunai'		'A6BB'
194	'Kunai'		'BB4F'
195	'Kunai'		'4F9A'
196	'Kunai'		'9AA0'
197	'Grenade'		'A0F5'
198	'Kunai'		'F5E5'
199	'Kunai'		'E586'
200	'Grenade'		'862D'
201	'Grenade'		'2DCA'
202	'Kunai'		'CAED'
203	'Kunai'		'ED3E'
204	'Red Flame'		'3E6A'
205	'Kunai'		'6A83'
206	'Kunai'		'83DA'
207	'Kunai'		'DA9C'
208	'Kunai'		'9CF2'
209	'Kunai'		'F222'
210	'Kunai'		'22FF'
211	'Kunai'		'FFCF'
212	'Kunai'		'CFD2'
213	'Red Flame'		'D2D4'
214	'Grenade'		'D4A6'
215	'Kunai'		'A65B'
216	'Grenade'		'5BF5'
217	'Kunai'		'F535'
218	'Kunai'		'35E1'
219	'Bomb'		'E182'
220	'Grenade'		'8269'
221	'Grenade'		'6942'
222	'Kunai'		'42AD'
223	'Kunai'		'AD82'
224	'Kunai'		'82A9'
225	'Kunai'		'A97E'
226	'Grenade'		'7EE6'
227	'Grenade'		'E6F7'
228	'Kunai'		'F787'
229	'Kunai'		'870E'
230	'Grenade'		'0E9D'
231	'Kunai'		'9DB3'
232	'Kunai'		'B3D7'
233	'Kunai'		'D799'
234	'Red Flame'		'991F'
235	'Kunai'		'1F8D'
236	'Kunai'		'8D94'
237	'Grenade'		'94BA'
238	'Grenade'		'BA6E'
239	'Kunai'		'6EC7'
240	'Kunai'		'C7DA'
241	'Kunai'		'DA5C'
242	'Grenade'		'5CB6'
243	'Grenade'		'B6EA'
244	'Grenade'		'EA7B'
245	'Kunai'		'7BD3'
246	'Kunai'		'D315'
247	'Kunai'		'15E3'
248	'Red Flame'		'E384'
249	'Grenade'		'844B'
250	'Kunai'		'4B06'
251	'Kunai'		'0655'
252	'Kunai'		'55EF'
253	'Kunai'		'EF90'
254	'Grenade'		'9096'
255	'Grenade'		'968C'
256	'Red Flame'		'8C23'
257	'Kunai'		'2360'
258	'Grenade'		'6029'
259	'Kunai'		'2926'
260	'Grenade'		'2693'
261	'Grenade'		'9329'
262	'Kunai'		'29F6'
263	'Kunai'		'F656'
264	'Grenade'		'56F0'
265	'Grenade'		'F080'
266	'Bomb'		'8077'
267	'1up'		'776F'
268	'Kunai'		'6FF8'
269	'Grenade'		'F8F8'
270	'Bomb'		'F868'
271	'Grenade'		'68E1'
272	'Grenade'		'E152'
273	'Kunai'		'523C'
274	'Kunai'		'3C18'
275	'Kunai'		'1856'
276	'Kunai'		'56D0'
277	'Bomb'		'D062'
278	'Kunai'		'625B'
279	'Grenade'		'5B35'
280	'Kunai'		'3581'
281	'Kunai'		'8128'
282	'Kunai'		'2815'
283	'Kunai'		'1593'
284	'Grenade'		'9339'
285	'Red Flame'		'3905'
286	'Grenade'		'0574'
287	'Kunai'		'741C'
288	'Kunai'		'1CDA'
289	'Grenade'		'DA0C'
290	'Kunai'		'0C6B'
291	'Kunai'		'6BA4'
292	'Kunai'		'A4E9'
293	'Bomb'		'E99A'
294	'Grenade'		'9A00'
295	'Kunai'		'005F'
296	'Grenade'		'5F59'
297	'Kunai'		'5963'
298	'Kunai'		'63CC'
299	'Blue Flame'		'CC8F'
300	'Kunai'		'8FC6'
301	'Kunai'		'C6C9'
302	'Grenade'		'C95C'
303	'Kunai'		'5CC6'
304	'Grenade'		'C6F9'
305	'Bomb'		'F989'
306	'Kunai'		'89F0'
307	'Kunai'		'F050'
308	'Kunai'		'504A'
309	'Kunai'		'4A45'
310	'Kunai'		'45A0'
311	'Kunai'		'A045'
312	'Kunai'		'4540'
313	'Grenade'		'40EB'
314	'Kunai'		'EBDC'
315	'Kunai'		'DC1E'
316	'Kunai'		'1E5C'
317	'Kunai'		'5C76'
318	'Kunai'		'76AE'
319	'Kunai'		'AE43'
320	'Kunai'		'435E'
321	'Grenade'		'5E28'
322	'Kunai'		'2845'
323	'Grenade'		'45C0'
324	'Bomb'		'C063'
325	'Kunai'		'635C'
326	'Red Flame'		'5C26'
327	'Red Flame'		'2663'
328	'Grenade'		'63FC'
329	'Grenade'		'FCBC'
330	'Kunai'		'BCF0'
331	'Grenade'		'F020'
332	'Kunai'		'201D'
333	'Bomb'		'1D1B'
334	'Kunai'		'1B49'
335	'Bomb'		'4994'
336	'Kunai'		'94FA'
337	'Kunai'		'FAAA'
338	'Kunai'		'AAFF'
339	'Grenade'		'FF4F'
340	'Grenade'		'4F5A'
341	'Grenade'		'5A64'
342	'Grenade'		'64BD'
343	'Grenade'		'BD71'
344	'Bomb'		'7199'
345	'Kunai'		'997F'
346	'Kunai'		'7FE7'
347	'Kunai'		'E7E8'
348	'Bomb'		'E869'
349	'Kunai'		'69E2'
350	'Kunai'		'E243'
351	'Kunai'		'431E'
352	'Grenade'		'1EEC'
353	'Kunai'		'ECFD'
354	'Kunai'		'FD2D'
355	'Kunai'		'2D5A'
356	'Kunai'		'5A84'
357	'Kunai'		'84DB'
358	'Red Flame'		'DB8D'
359	'Grenade'		'8DD4'
360	'Kunai'		'D4F6'
361	'Kunai'		'F6A6'
362	'Grenade'		'A63B'
363	'Kunai'		'3BD7'
364	'Kunai'		'D719'
365	'Grenade'		'19A7'
366	'Kunai'		'A70C'
367	'Blue Flame'		'0C9B'
368	'Kunai'		'9BD1'
369	'Red Flame'		'D113'
370	'Kunai'		'1301'
371	'Kunai'		'01D0'
372	'Kunai'		'D0B2'
373	'Kunai'		'B2A6'
374	'Red Flame'		'A67B'
375	'Kunai'		'7B13'
376	'Kunai'		'1361'
377	'Kunai'		'612A'
378	'Grenade'		'2A17'
379	'1up'		'1775'
380	'Kunai'		'75FD'
381	'Kunai'		'FD9D'
382	'Grenade'		'9DC3'
383	'Grenade'		'C3E6'
384	'Kunai'		'E6A7'
385	'Kunai'		'A73C'
386	'Kunai'		'3CC8'
387	'Grenade'		'C8FB'
388	'Kunai'		'FB6B'
389	'Kunai'		'6BB4'
390	'Kunai'		'B4F8'
391	'Kunai'		'F8A8'
392	'Kunai'		'A81D'
393	'Kunai'		'1D9B'
394	'Kunai'		'9BC1'
395	'Red Flame'		'C104'
396	'Kunai'		'04F3'
397	'Kunai'		'F3A3'
398	'Kunai'		'A368'
399	'Grenade'		'6831'
400	'Grenade'		'31AD'
401	'Kunai'		'AD92'
402	'Kunai'		'92B8'
403	'Grenade'		'B88C'
404	'Kunai'		'8C03'
405	'Kunai'		'0342'
406	'Grenade'		'420D'
407	'Kunai'		'0DEC'
408	'Kunai'		'EC0D'
409	'Kunai'		'0D4C'
410	'Kunai'		'4C77'
411	'Red Flame'		'77AF'
412	'Kunai'		'AF34'
413	'Grenade'		'3440'
414	'Grenade'		'40FB'
415	'Grenade'		'FBEB'
416	'Grenade'		'EB2C'
417	'Kunai'		'2C79'
418	'Grenade'		'79B1'
419	'Red Flame'		'B115'
420	'Bomb'		'1503'
421	'Kunai'		'03B2'
422	'Grenade'		'B276'
423	'Kunai'		'764E'
424	'Grenade'		'4EE9'
425	'Kunai'		'E9FA'
426	'Kunai'		'FA5A'
427	'Kunai'		'5AB4'
428	'Kunai'		'B408'
429	'Kunai'		'08C7'
430	'Kunai'		'C73A'
431	'Red Flame'		'3AC6'
432	'Kunai'		'C619'
433	'Grenade'		'19B7'
434	'Kunai'		'B71B'
435	'Kunai'		'1BA9'
436	'Kunai'		'A9EE'
437	'Kunai'		'EE4F'
438	'1up'		'4F6A'
439	'Grenade'		'6A73'
440	'Kunai'		'73CB'
441	'Red Flame'		'CB8E'
442	'Kunai'		'8ED5'
443	'Kunai'		'D5E7'
444	'Kunai'		'E788'
445	'Kunai'		'880F'
446	'Kunai'		'0F8E'
447	'Grenade'		'8E95'
448	'Kunai'		'95AB'
449	'Kunai'		'AB50'
450	'Grenade'		'509A'
451	'Kunai'		'9A90'
452	'Grenade'		'90E6'
453	'Kunai'		'E6D7'
454	'1up'		'D769'
455	'Kunai'		'69F2'
456	'Kunai'		'F252'
457	'Kunai'		'522C'
458	'Kunai'		'2C09'
459	'Grenade'		'0948'
460	'Kunai'		'48B3'
461	'Grenade'		'B327'
462	'Kunai'		'27F4'
463	'Kunai'		'F474'
464	'Red Flame'		'742C'
465	'Kunai'		'2CE9'
466	'Red Flame'		'E91A'
467	'Kunai'		'1A88'
468	'Kunai'		'88DF'
469	'Grenade'		'DF51'
470	'Grenade'		'515B'
471	'Kunai'		'5B45'
472	'Kunai'		'4590'
473	'Grenade'		'9036'
474	'Grenade'		'3632'
475	'Red Flame'		'32CE'
476	'Kunai'		'CEA1'
477	'Grenade'		'A1B6'
478	'Grenade'		'B69A'
479	'Kunai'		'9A30'
480	'Grenade'		'308C'
481	'Blue Flame'		'8C83'
482	'Kunai'		'83BA'
483	'Grenade'		'BA7E'
484	'Kunai'		'7ED6'
485	'Grenade'		'D6E8'
486	'Bomb'		'E879'
487	'Kunai'		'79F1'
488	'Grenade'		'F151'
489	'Kunai'		'513B'
490	'Grenade'		'3B27'
491	'1up'		'2774'
492	'Kunai'		'74FC'
493	'Grenade'		'FCAC'
494	'Kunai'		'ACE1'
495	'Red Flame'		'E112'
496	'Grenade'		'1200'
497	'Kunai'		'00DF'
498	'Kunai'		'DFD1'
499	'Kunai'		'D1D3'
500	'Kunai'		'D3B5'

As a bonus, here's the MATLAB code I used to generate everything as well:

Code:

iterations = 100;
RNG = uint8(zeros(iterations+1,4));
drop = uint8(zeros(iterations,2));

for i=1:iterations
      
    drop(i,:) = bitxor(uint8([RNG(i,2) RNG(i,3)]),uint8([15 15]));
    if(bitor(RNG(i,1:2),RNG(i,3:4))==[0 0])
        RNG(i+1,:) = uint8([1 0 1 0]);
        RNG(i+1,4) = drop(i,2) + RNG(i+1,4);
    else
        RNG(i+1,1) = RNG(i,3);
        RNG(i+1,2) = RNG(i,4);
        RNG(i+1,3) = RNG(i,3);
        RNG(i+1,4) = drop(i,2) + RNG(i,4);
    end;

    if(RNG(i+1,4)>15)
        RNG(i+1,3) = drop(i,1) + RNG(i,3) + 1;
    else
        RNG(i+1,3) = drop(i,1) + RNG(i+1,3);
    end;
    RNG(i+1,:) = bitand(RNG(i+1,:),uint8([15 15 15 15]));
    
    itemval = bitor(bitshift(drop(i,1),4),drop(i,2));
    itemnum = drop_table(bitand(bitshift(itemval,-1),uint8(63))+1);
    if(itemnum==1)
        items{i} = '1up';
    elseif(itemnum==2)
        items{i} = 'Blue Flame';
    elseif(itemnum==3)
        items{i} = 'Red Flame';
    elseif(itemnum==4)
        items{i} = 'Kunai';
    elseif(itemnum==5)
        items{i} = 'Grenade';
    else
        items{i} = 'Bomb';
    end;
    
    hexRNG{i} = cat(1,dec2hex(RNG(i,:)));
end;

items = items';
hexRNG = hexRNG';

I've experimented with things a bit, and it's tricky to come up with a path that is able to get to the numbers I need consistently. Some helpful things to know:

-Killing most enemies advances the RNG by 6. Once for the drop, and 5 more for explosions.
-Constant drop enemies only advance with the explosions.
-Any enemy that is killed or falls off-screen will not use up any remaining explosion RNG.
-Killing birds advances the RNG a whopping 83(!) positions. This is the big thing that can be used to get up to the higher numbers.
-Axe guys advance the RNG once when they jump, and another time when they throw. I cann't avoid some of these events.
-The RNG advances by 10 as soon as the airship comes on screen. This always happens.
-Killing a turret advances the RNG by 1 total; killing a bomber bay does nothing.

Best path right now seems to be to start off, kill 2 birds with kunai, then kill a set amount of enemies/turrets on the first ship, then one more bird afterwards. The goal is to end on 293 or 299, so one way or another I get a bomb and a blue flame. I will still be experimenting for a bit.

EDIT2: And one of the better paths I could come up with:

EDIT: Upgraded to 500 due to the very powerful combination around ~300.

Ladies and gentlemen, I present the first 500 drops in order. It looks like there are some great opportunities for manipulating the blue flames, and even a few bombs. I will play around with it a bit tonight.

[hidden][code]Iteration	Item		RNG
1	'Kunai'		'0000'
2	'Kunai'		'100F'
3	'Kunai'		'0F0E'
4	'Kunai'		'0E1D'
5	'Kunai'		'1D3B'
6	'Kunai'		'3B67'
7	'Red Flame'		'67B0'
8	'Grenade'		'B034'
9	'Red Flame'		'3430'
10	'Grenade'		'30EC'
11	'Kunai'		'ECDD'
12	'Bomb'		'DD0F'
13	'Kunai'		'0F3E'
14	'Kunai'		'3E4A'
15	'Grenade'		'4A65'
16	'Kunai'		'65BE'
17	'Red Flame'		'BE62'
18	'Grenade'		'627B'
19	'Kunai'		'7B53'
20	'Red Flame'		'539D'
21	'Grenade'		'9D63'
22	'Red Flame'		'638C'
23	'Grenade'		'8C53'
24	'Red Flame'		'538D'
25	'Kunai'		'8D54'
26	'Kunai'		'547E'
27	'Grenade'		'7E36'
28	'Kunai'		'3652'
29	'Kunai'		'52EC'
30	'Grenade'		'ECBD'
31	'Kunai'		'BDF1'
32	'Red Flame'		'F111'
33	'Kunai'		'11FF'
34	'Kunai'		'FFDF'
35	'Kunai'		'DFE1'
36	'Kunai'		'E1E2'
37	'Red Flame'		'E2C3'
38	'Red Flame'		'C396'
39	'Kunai'		'965C'
40	'Kunai'		'5CF6'
41	'Grenade'		'F626'
42	'Kunai'		'26C3'
43	'Kunai'		'C356'
44	'Grenade'		'5620'
45	'Kunai'		'20BD'
46	'Kunai'		'BDB1'
47	'Kunai'		'B1D5'
48	'Kunai'		'D5B7'
49	'Grenade'		'B75B'
50	'Grenade'		'5BE5'
51	'Kunai'		'E526'
52	'Kunai'		'26D3'
53	'Kunai'		'D365'
54	'Kunai'		'652E'
55	'Kunai'		'2EDB'
56	'Grenade'		'DBED'
57	'Kunai'		'ED2E'
58	'Kunai'		'2E5B'
59	'Kunai'		'5B75'
60	'Kunai'		'75BD'
61	'Grenade'		'BD61'
62	'Bomb'		'618A'
63	'Grenade'		'8A71'
64	'Kunai'		'71C9'
65	'Grenade'		'C9AC'
66	'Kunai'		'AC11'
67	'Grenade'		'114F'
68	'Kunai'		'4F3A'
69	'Kunai'		'3A46'
70	'Kunai'		'46A1'
71	'Kunai'		'A136'
72	'Grenade'		'3622'
73	'Kunai'		'22BF'
74	'Kunai'		'BF93'
75	'Red Flame'		'9399'
76	'Grenade'		'995F'
77	'Kunai'		'5FC9'
78	'Kunai'		'C9CC'
79	'Red Flame'		'CC2F'
80	'1up'		'2F6C'
81	'Kunai'		'6C75'
82	'Kunai'		'75AD'
83	'Kunai'		'AD52'
84	'Grenade'		'527C'
85	'Grenade'		'7C54'
86	'Blue Flame'		'548E'
87	'Kunai'		'8E45'
88	'Grenade'		'4560'
89	'Kunai'		'6009'
90	'Red Flame'		'0908'
91	'Bomb'		'0877'
92	'Kunai'		'77EF'
93	'1up'		'EF70'
94	'Bomb'		'7078'
95	'Bomb'		'7870'
96	'Grenade'		'70E8'
97	'Kunai'		'E8D9'
98	'Grenade'		'D94B'
99	'Kunai'		'4BB6'
100	'Grenade'		'B6FA'
101	'Kunai'		'FA8A'
102	'Kunai'		'8AE1'
103	'Kunai'		'E132'
104	'Grenade'		'321E'
105	'Grenade'		'1EFC'
106	'Kunai'		'FC0C'
107	'Grenade'		'0C4B'
108	'Red Flame'		'4B86'
109	'Kunai'		'86CD'
110	'Grenade'		'CD60'
111	'Grenade'		'6089'
112	'Bomb'		'8980'
113	'Grenade'		'80E7'
114	'Kunai'		'E7D8'
115	'Kunai'		'D85A'
116	'Red Flame'		'5AD4'
117	'Red Flame'		'D426'
118	'Grenade'		'26E3'
119	'Kunai'		'E374'
120	'Red Flame'		'743C'
121	'Kunai'		'3CF8'
122	'Grenade'		'F828'
123	'Kunai'		'28A5'
124	'Bomb'		'A51A'
125	'Red Flame'		'1AC8'
126	'Kunai'		'C81B'
127	'Red Flame'		'1B99'
128	'Kunai'		'99DF'
129	'Grenade'		'DF41'
130	'Grenade'		'414C'
131	'Red Flame'		'4C37'
132	'1up'		'3773'
133	'Grenade'		'73FB'
134	'Kunai'		'FBBB'
135	'Grenade'		'BBFF'
136	'Kunai'		'FF3F'
137	'Grenade'		'3F4B'
138	'Kunai'		'4B56'
139	'Kunai'		'56A0'
140	'Grenade'		'A035'
141	'Kunai'		'3531'
142	'Kunai'		'31DD'
143	'Kunai'		'DDBF'
144	'Kunai'		'BFE3'
145	'Grenade'		'E3E4'
146	'Grenade'		'E4A5'
147	'Kunai'		'A55A'
148	'Grenade'		'5A04'
149	'Kunai'		'0463'
150	'Kunai'		'631C'
151	'Kunai'		'1CEA'
152	'Grenade'		'EA1B'
153	'Kunai'		'1B79'
154	'Kunai'		'79C1'
155	'Kunai'		'C124'
156	'Kunai'		'2411'
157	'Kunai'		'11CF'
158	'Red Flame'		'CFB2'
159	'Kunai'		'B2B6'
160	'Grenade'		'B68A'
161	'Kunai'		'8A21'
162	'Kunai'		'217E'
163	'Red Flame'		'7E66'
164	'Red Flame'		'667F'
165	'Kunai'		'7F17'
166	'Kunai'		'1725'
167	'Kunai'		'25B2'
168	'Kunai'		'B256'
169	'Grenade'		'5630'
170	'Kunai'		'30CC'
171	'Grenade'		'CCBF'
172	'Kunai'		'BFF3'
173	'Grenade'		'F3F3'
174	'Kunai'		'F3B3'
175	'Kunai'		'B377'
176	'Kunai'		'773F'
177	'Kunai'		'3FCB'
178	'Kunai'		'CBCE'
179	'Kunai'		'CE11'
180	'Kunai'		'112F'
181	'Kunai'		'2F1C'
182	'Red Flame'		'1C2A'
183	'Grenade'		'2A67'
184	'Kunai'		'67C0'
185	'Kunai'		'C043'
186	'Grenade'		'433E'
187	'Kunai'		'3E0A'
188	'Kunai'		'0A29'
189	'Bomb'		'2986'
190	'Grenade'		'86ED'
191	'Grenade'		'ED7E'
192	'Kunai'		'7EA6'
193	'Kunai'		'A6BB'
194	'Kunai'		'BB4F'
195	'Kunai'		'4F9A'
196	'Kunai'		'9AA0'
197	'Grenade'		'A0F5'
198	'Kunai'		'F5E5'
199	'Kunai'		'E586'
200	'Grenade'		'862D'
201	'Grenade'		'2DCA'
202	'Kunai'		'CAED'
203	'Kunai'		'ED3E'
204	'Red Flame'		'3E6A'
205	'Kunai'		'6A83'
206	'Kunai'		'83DA'
207	'Kunai'		'DA9C'
208	'Kunai'		'9CF2'
209	'Kunai'		'F222'
210	'Kunai'		'22FF'
211	'Kunai'		'FFCF'
212	'Kunai'		'CFD2'
213	'Red Flame'		'D2D4'
214	'Grenade'		'D4A6'
215	'Kunai'		'A65B'
216	'Grenade'		'5BF5'
217	'Kunai'		'F535'
218	'Kunai'		'35E1'
219	'Bomb'		'E182'
220	'Grenade'		'8269'
221	'Grenade'		'6942'
222	'Kunai'		'42AD'
223	'Kunai'		'AD82'
224	'Kunai'		'82A9'
225	'Kunai'		'A97E'
226	'Grenade'		'7EE6'
227	'Grenade'		'E6F7'
228	'Kunai'		'F787'
229	'Kunai'		'870E'
230	'Grenade'		'0E9D'
231	'Kunai'		'9DB3'
232	'Kunai'		'B3D7'
233	'Kunai'		'D799'
234	'Red Flame'		'991F'
235	'Kunai'		'1F8D'
236	'Kunai'		'8D94'
237	'Grenade'		'94BA'
238	'Grenade'		'BA6E'
239	'Kunai'		'6EC7'
240	'Kunai'		'C7DA'
241	'Kunai'		'DA5C'
242	'Grenade'		'5CB6'
243	'Grenade'		'B6EA'
244	'Grenade'		'EA7B'
245	'Kunai'		'7BD3'
246	'Kunai'		'D315'
247	'Kunai'		'15E3'
248	'Red Flame'		'E384'
249	'Grenade'		'844B'
250	'Kunai'		'4B06'
251	'Kunai'		'0655'
252	'Kunai'		'55EF'
253	'Kunai'		'EF90'
254	'Grenade'		'9096'
255	'Grenade'		'968C'
256	'Red Flame'		'8C23'
257	'Kunai'		'2360'
258	'Grenade'		'6029'
259	'Kunai'		'2926'
260	'Grenade'		'2693'
261	'Grenade'		'9329'
262	'Kunai'		'29F6'
263	'Kunai'		'F656'
264	'Grenade'		'56F0'
265	'Grenade'		'F080'
266	'Bomb'		'8077'
267	'1up'		'776F'
268	'Kunai'		'6FF8'
269	'Grenade'		'F8F8'
270	'Bomb'		'F868'
271	'Grenade'		'68E1'
272	'Grenade'		'E152'
273	'Kunai'		'523C'
274	'Kunai'		'3C18'
275	'Kunai'		'1856'
276	'Kunai'		'56D0'
277	'Bomb'		'D062'
278	'Kunai'		'625B'
279	'Grenade'		'5B35'
280	'Kunai'		'3581'
281	'Kunai'		'8128'
282	'Kunai'		'2815'
283	'Kunai'		'1593'
284	'Grenade'		'9339'
285	'Red Flame'		'3905'
286	'Grenade'		'0574'
287	'Kunai'		'741C'
288	'Kunai'		'1CDA'
289	'Grenade'		'DA0C'
290	'Kunai'		'0C6B'
291	'Kunai'		'6BA4'
292	'Kunai'		'A4E9'
293	'Bomb'		'E99A'
294	'Grenade'		'9A00'
295	'Kunai'		'005F'
296	'Grenade'		'5F59'
297	'Kunai'		'5963'
298	'Kunai'		'63CC'
299	'Blue Flame'		'CC8F'
300	'Kunai'		'8FC6'
301	'Kunai'		'C6C9'
302	'Grenade'		'C95C'
303	'Kunai'		'5CC6'
304	'Grenade'		'C6F9'
305	'Bomb'		'F989'
306	'Kunai'		'89F0'
307	'Kunai'		'F050'
308	'Kunai'		'504A'
309	'Kunai'		'4A45'
310	'Kunai'		'45A0'
311	'Kunai'		'A045'
312	'Kunai'		'4540'
313	'Grenade'		'40EB'
314	'Kunai'		'EBDC'
315	'Kunai'		'DC1E'
316	'Kunai'		'1E5C'
317	'Kunai'		'5C76'
318	'Kunai'		'76AE'
319	'Kunai'		'AE43'
320	'Kunai'		'435E'
321	'Grenade'		'5E28'
322	'Kunai'		'2845'
323	'Grenade'		'45C0'
324	'Bomb'		'C063'
325	'Kunai'		'635C'
326	'Red Flame'		'5C26'
327	'Red Flame'		'2663'
328	'Grenade'		'63FC'
329	'Grenade'		'FCBC'
330	'Kunai'		'BCF0'
331	'Grenade'		'F020'
332	'Kunai'		'201D'
333	'Bomb'		'1D1B'
334	'Kunai'		'1B49'
335	'Bomb'		'4994'
336	'Kunai'		'94FA'
337	'Kunai'		'FAAA'
338	'Kunai'		'AAFF'
339	'Grenade'		'FF4F'
340	'Grenade'		'4F5A'
341	'Grenade'		'5A64'
342	'Grenade'		'64BD'
343	'Grenade'		'BD71'
344	'Bomb'		'7199'
345	'Kunai'		'997F'
346	'Kunai'		'7FE7'
347	'Kunai'		'E7E8'
348	'Bomb'		'E869'
349	'Kunai'		'69E2'
350	'Kunai'		'E243'
351	'Kunai'		'431E'
352	'Grenade'		'1EEC'
353	'Kunai'		'ECFD'
354	'Kunai'		'FD2D'
355	'Kunai'		'2D5A'
356	'Kunai'		'5A84'
357	'Kunai'		'84DB'
358	'Red Flame'		'DB8D'
359	'Grenade'		'8DD4'
360	'Kunai'		'D4F6'
361	'Kunai'		'F6A6'
362	'Grenade'		'A63B'
363	'Kunai'		'3BD7'
364	'Kunai'		'D719'
365	'Grenade'		'19A7'
366	'Kunai'		'A70C'
367	'Blue Flame'		'0C9B'
368	'Kunai'		'9BD1'
369	'Red Flame'		'D113'
370	'Kunai'		'1301'
371	'Kunai'		'01D0'
372	'Kunai'		'D0B2'
373	'Kunai'		'B2A6'
374	'Red Flame'		'A67B'
375	'Kunai'		'7B13'
376	'Kunai'		'1361'
377	'Kunai'		'612A'
378	'Grenade'		'2A17'
379	'1up'		'1775'
380	'Kunai'		'75FD'
381	'Kunai'		'FD9D'
382	'Grenade'		'9DC3'
383	'Grenade'		'C3E6'
384	'Kunai'		'E6A7'
385	'Kunai'		'A73C'
386	'Kunai'		'3CC8'
387	'Grenade'		'C8FB'
388	'Kunai'		'FB6B'
389	'Kunai'		'6BB4'
390	'Kunai'		'B4F8'
391	'Kunai'		'F8A8'
392	'Kunai'		'A81D'
393	'Kunai'		'1D9B'
394	'Kunai'		'9BC1'
395	'Red Flame'		'C104'
396	'Kunai'		'04F3'
397	'Kunai'		'F3A3'
398	'Kunai'		'A368'
399	'Grenade'		'6831'
400	'Grenade'		'31AD'
401	'Kunai'		'AD92'
402	'Kunai'		'92B8'
403	'Grenade'		'B88C'
404	'Kunai'		'8C03'
405	'Kunai'		'0342'
406	'Grenade'		'420D'
407	'Kunai'		'0DEC'
408	'Kunai'		'EC0D'
409	'Kunai'		'0D4C'
410	'Kunai'		'4C77'
411	'Red Flame'		'77AF'
412	'Kunai'		'AF34'
413	'Grenade'		'3440'
414	'Grenade'		'40FB'
415	'Grenade'		'FBEB'
416	'Grenade'		'EB2C'
417	'Kunai'		'2C79'
418	'Grenade'		'79B1'
419	'Red Flame'		'B115'
420	'Bomb'		'1503'
421	'Kunai'		'03B2'
422	'Grenade'		'B276'
423	'Kunai'		'764E'
424	'Grenade'		'4EE9'
425	'Kunai'		'E9FA'
426	'Kunai'		'FA5A'
427	'Kunai'		'5AB4'
428	'Kunai'		'B408'
429	'Kunai'		'08C7'
430	'Kunai'		'C73A'
431	'Red Flame'		'3AC6'
432	'Kunai'		'C619'
433	'Grenade'		'19B7'
434	'Kunai'		'B71B'
435	'Kunai'		'1BA9'
436	'Kunai'		'A9EE'
437	'Kunai'		'EE4F'
438	'1up'		'4F6A'
439	'Grenade'		'6A73'
440	'Kunai'		'73CB'
441	'Red Flame'		'CB8E'
442	'Kunai'		'8ED5'
443	'Kunai'		'D5E7'
444	'Kunai'		'E788'
445	'Kunai'		'880F'
446	'Kunai'		'0F8E'
447	'Grenade'		'8E95'
448	'Kunai'		'95AB'
449	'Kunai'		'AB50'
450	'Grenade'		'509A'
451	'Kunai'		'9A90'
452	'Grenade'		'90E6'
453	'Kunai'		'E6D7'
454	'1up'		'D769'
455	'Kunai'		'69F2'
456	'Kunai'		'F252'
457	'Kunai'		'522C'
458	'Kunai'		'2C09'
459	'Grenade'		'0948'
460	'Kunai'		'48B3'
461	'Grenade'		'B327'
462	'Kunai'		'27F4'
463	'Kunai'		'F474'
464	'Red Flame'		'742C'
465	'Kunai'		'2CE9'
466	'Red Flame'		'E91A'
467	'Kunai'		'1A88'
468	'Kunai'		'88DF'
469	'Grenade'		'DF51'
470	'Grenade'		'515B'
471	'Kunai'		'5B45'
472	'Kunai'		'4590'
473	'Grenade'		'9036'
474	'Grenade'		'3632'
475	'Red Flame'		'32CE'
476	'Kunai'		'CEA1'
477	'Grenade'		'A1B6'
478	'Grenade'		'B69A'
479	'Kunai'		'9A30'
480	'Grenade'		'308C'
481	'Blue Flame'		'8C83'
482	'Kunai'		'83BA'
483	'Grenade'		'BA7E'
484	'Kunai'		'7ED6'
485	'Grenade'		'D6E8'
486	'Bomb'		'E879'
487	'Kunai'		'79F1'
488	'Grenade'		'F151'
489	'Kunai'		'513B'
490	'Grenade'		'3B27'
491	'1up'		'2774'
492	'Kunai'		'74FC'
493	'Grenade'		'FCAC'
494	'Kunai'		'ACE1'
495	'Red Flame'		'E112'
496	'Grenade'		'1200'
497	'Kunai'		'00DF'
498	'Kunai'		'DFD1'
499	'Kunai'		'D1D3'
500	'Kunai'		'D3B5'
[/code][/hidden]

As a bonus, here's the MATLAB code I used to generate everything as well:

[hidden][code]iterations = 100;
RNG = uint8(zeros(iterations+1,4));
drop = uint8(zeros(iterations,2));

for i=1:iterations
      
    drop(i,:) = bitxor(uint8([RNG(i,2) RNG(i,3)]),uint8([15 15]));
    if(bitor(RNG(i,1:2),RNG(i,3:4))==[0 0])
        RNG(i+1,:) = uint8([1 0 1 0]);
        RNG(i+1,4) = drop(i,2) + RNG(i+1,4);
    else
        RNG(i+1,1) = RNG(i,3);
        RNG(i+1,2) = RNG(i,4);
        RNG(i+1,3) = RNG(i,3);
        RNG(i+1,4) = drop(i,2) + RNG(i,4);
    end;

if(RNG(i+1,4)>15)
        RNG(i+1,3) = drop(i,1) + RNG(i,3) + 1;
    else
        RNG(i+1,3) = drop(i,1) + RNG(i+1,3);
    end;
    RNG(i+1,:) = bitand(RNG(i+1,:),uint8([15 15 15 15]));
    
    itemval = bitor(bitshift(drop(i,1),4),drop(i,2));
    itemnum = drop_table(bitand(bitshift(itemval,-1),uint8(63))+1);
    if(itemnum==1)
        items{i} = '1up';
    elseif(itemnum==2)
        items{i} = 'Blue Flame';
    elseif(itemnum==3)
        items{i} = 'Red Flame';
    elseif(itemnum==4)
        items{i} = 'Kunai';
    elseif(itemnum==5)
        items{i} = 'Grenade';
    else
        items{i} = 'Bomb';
    end;
    
    hexRNG{i} = cat(1,dec2hex(RNG(i,:)));
end;

items = items';
hexRNG = hexRNG';[/code][/hidden]

I've experimented with things a bit, and it's tricky to come up with a path that is able to get to the numbers I need consistently. Some helpful things to know:

-Killing most enemies advances the RNG by 6. Once for the drop, and 5 more for explosions.
-Constant drop enemies only advance with the explosions.
-Any enemy that is killed or falls off-screen will not use up any remaining explosion RNG.
-Killing birds advances the RNG a whopping 83(!) positions. This is the big thing that can be used to get up to the higher numbers.
-Axe guys advance the RNG once when they jump, and another time when they throw. I cann't avoid some of these events.
-The RNG advances by 10 as soon as the airship comes on screen. This always happens.
-Killing a turret advances the RNG by 1 total; killing a bomber bay does nothing.

Best path right now seems to be to start off, kill 2 birds with kunai, then kill a set amount of enemies/turrets on the first ship, then one more bird afterwards. The goal is to end on 293 or 299, so one way or another I get a bomb and a blue flame. I will still be experimenting for a bit.

EDIT2: And one of the better paths I could come up with:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8K6giXcvw8&feature=youtu.be

Exo

Edit history:

Exo: 2012-08-04 03:44:45 am

Exo: 2012-08-04 03:43:29 am

Exo: 2012-08-04 03:42:43 am

2012-08-04 03:42:08 am

Sandbagging

It seems like you're wasting a lot of time getting those drops (mainly by killing the birds). Are you sure they're worth getting in 1-1?
I can see how getting bomb drops can speed things up but what would the life-up be used for besides consistency?

Bad

2012-08-04 07:46:17 am

Yeah, I saw your runs before you were using the S1 RNG manipulation and it seemed you were doing fine on health, the bombs are useful but as Exo said, is it worth losing the time?

Omnigamer

2012-08-04 08:17:29 am

All the things

When I timed it out, I lose about 3-4 seconds on 1-1 to get the blue flame + bombs. I can gain this back on 2-2 by not having to stop or slow down/stop on the final section with the flame pit, conveyor belt, and laser walls. It also allows me to not have to be cautious as I'm going through 3-2. So I feel like it evens out, but we'll see once I get to attempts.

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2012-08-04 08:42:29 pm

Omnigamer: 2012-08-04 06:57:15 pm

2012-08-04 06:56:52 pm

All the things

I worked out a different route that loses only 1 second to manipulation and guarantees me two bombs in the first ship section (so no time lost to pick them up). It also has the *chance* for a blue flame later during ship 2, but not guaranteed. As we've determined from my runs earlier today, bombs are a required commodity, so this should help out quite a bit :p Look for it in runs coming soon.

EDIT: I played around with the Boss 5 RNG too. It looks like the RNG only advances when he performs an attack while you're not on his platform. I tried doing some fancy math to check whether it's possible to predict the next core spawn point based on observing his attacks, but it doesn't look like it is. However, it is important to note that the RNG resets to whatever it was when you entered the room the first time. So I can potentially death abuse if I get a guaranteed spawn on the opposite side of where I'm aiming. Still not ideal, but it's a compromise between 2 and 3 cycles, and gives it to me guaranteed. Unfortunately, that's still only 50% that the core will spawn on either side; the other half of the time it will spawn in the center. So in the end, lame boss is still lame.

The plan seems to be this:
-Start on the platform for 3 cycles. Might be good to get hurt for 2-3 times, in case of it spawning on the other side.
-Set up for the 1 cycle and hope. If it doesn't happen, and it spawned on opposite side, kill self, set it up again for other side. If it spawned in the middle, do the groundfire instead for a total of 10 damage (w/ bomb). Try to kill it normally after this; can be done in 3 cycles with a lucky dragon punch.
-Probably best idea to drive it right first and take the hits, since that's the harder location to get a blind spot set up.
-His blue flames and lightning attacks aren't "unlocked" until you've done enough damage to him, so those will never occur in the first cycle. Quickest to hope for is several fist pumps.

I worked out a different route that loses only 1 second to manipulation and guarantees me two bombs in the first ship section (so no time lost to pick them up). It also has the *chance* for a blue flame later during ship 2, but not guaranteed. As we've determined from my runs earlier today, bombs are a required commodity, so this should help out quite a bit :p Look for it in runs coming soon.

EDIT: I played around with the Boss 5 RNG too. It looks like the RNG only advances when he performs an attack while you're not on his platform. I tried doing some fancy math to check whether it's possible to predict the next core spawn point based on observing his attacks, but it doesn't look like it is. However, it is important to note that the RNG resets to whatever it was when you entered the room the first time. So I can potentially death abuse if I get a guaranteed spawn on the opposite side of where I'm aiming. Still not ideal, but it's a compromise between 2 and 3 cycles, and gives it to me guaranteed. Unfortunately, that's still only 50% that the core will spawn on either side; the other half of the time it will spawn in the center. So in the end, lame boss is still lame.

The plan seems to be this:
-Start on the platform for 3 cycles. Might be good to get hurt for 2-3 times, in case of it spawning on the other side.
-Set up for the 1 cycle and hope. If it doesn't happen, and it spawned on opposite side, kill self, set it up again for other side. If it spawned in the middle, do the groundfire instead for a total of 10 damage (w/ bomb). Try to kill it normally after this; can be done in 3 cycles with a lucky dragon punch. 
-Probably best idea to drive it right first and take the hits, since that's the harder location to get a blind spot set up.
-His blue flames and lightning attacks aren't "unlocked" until you've done enough damage to him, so those will never occur in the first cycle. Quickest to hope for is several fist pumps.

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2012-08-07 11:05:54 pm

2012-08-07 10:59:21 pm

All the things

OK, sooooo the perfect* luck finally happened, and I hit 16:33 (from start to last hit on boss; subtract ~7 seconds for SDA timing). However, I don't think I can submit this for a couple reasons. One, I screwed up the first miniboss of 5-1 (~5 sec). Second, I lost a ton of time on Boss 4 because he gave me a bad initial position and then trolled me with the tiles (2 sets of 3, and I missed one rotation...). This cost me ~20 seconds. Finally, I didn't get the complete Boss 1 quick kill, which cost me something in the neighborhood of 6 seconds. So yeah... may have to keep working on it until lightning strikes twice. Overall though, I'm happy I was able to pull this off despite the issues. I tallied up my best splits and the time came out at 16:04.4, so that's the time to expect for a near perfect run. For reference, DarkFulgore's TAS completes it in 16:05 (not sure what timing)

This also means I have to be a lot more strict with my resets. If I miss the worm skip, reset. If I don't get the perfect pattern for Bosses 2 or 5, reset. If I miss the Boss 1 quick kill, reset. It will be a fun couple weeks trying to get this :-/

EDIT: Oh and as for the randomness seen in some of the attempts where I try to manipulate it and nothing works, it turns out that it initially loads the RNG addresses with the bytes stored in 7E00AC, which is uninitialized memory. So sometimes it will load all 0s, other times it might still have some latent data sitting around in it.

OK, sooooo the perfect* luck finally happened, and I hit 16:33 (from start to last hit on boss; subtract ~7 seconds for SDA timing). However, I don't think I can submit this for a couple reasons. One, I screwed up the first miniboss of 5-1 (~5 sec). Second, I lost a ton of time on Boss 4 because he gave me a bad initial position and then trolled me with the tiles (2 sets of 3, and I missed one rotation...). This cost me ~20 seconds. Finally, I didn't get the complete Boss 1 quick kill, which cost me something in the neighborhood of 6 seconds. So yeah... may have to keep working on it until lightning strikes twice. Overall though, I'm happy I was able to pull this off despite the issues. I tallied up my best splits and the time came out at 16:04.4, so that's the time to expect for a near perfect run. For reference, DarkFulgore's TAS completes it in 16:05 (not sure what timing)

This also means I have to be a lot more strict with my resets. If I miss the worm skip, reset. If I don't get the perfect pattern for Bosses 2 or 5, reset. If I miss the Boss 1 quick kill, reset. It will be a fun couple weeks trying to get this :-/

EDIT: Oh and as for the randomness seen in some of the attempts where I try to manipulate it and nothing works, it turns out that it initially loads the RNG addresses with the bytes stored in 7E00AC, which is uninitialized memory. So sometimes it will load all 0s, other times it might still have some latent data sitting around in it.

PJ

2012-08-08 12:25:37 am

Is PJ

Wow. It only took you 1 week to get perfect luck? Definitely go for broke then!

Congrats, btw. Wink

Omnigamer

2012-08-08 12:40:12 am

All the things

I'm looking into the probabilities for that perfect luck now, actually. I already knew I only had a 25% chance for Boss 5, but I've looked into Boss 2 now and he also only has a 25% chance of dropping the container at any given cycle. Honestly though, I could afford 1 cycle lost on him so long as all else goes well. For Boss 4, it doesn't look like the RNG is used for launching his shingles, and his initial stage is still mostly manipulatable by position, so that's a tossup. So on paper there's only a 6.25% chance of getting perfect luck, which is reasonable enough. I'll just have to keep going until I get one that I can be satisfied with. More resets means more attempts, so we'll see what happens.

PJ

2012-08-08 12:42:20 am

Is PJ

6.25% is ridiculously high. Like, it's not even worth mentioning it's RNG based. Haha. I'm glad it'll end up being that easy instead of 1/10000 or something. I'm sure you'll get the run soon!

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2012-08-08 12:45:28 am

2012-08-08 12:44:59 am

All the things

Boss 2 is supposed to be 25%, but my success rate for him is closer to 1/20 :-/ The problem with manipulatable RNG is that it will likely end up in the same general position each time you do it, leading to the same results (mostly terrible). So I've started switching it up and killing the odd enemy to make things interesting.

Omnigamer

Edit history:

Omnigamer: 2012-08-21 03:35:56 pm

2012-08-21 03:08:00 pm

All the things

Before I forget, I found a new way to do the Worm Skip that saves an additional ~3-4 seconds. My best time is currently 16:21, but in that run I had a 2-cycle Shrua-Oh fight, so I can't keep it. With the newer skip and otherwise good execution/luck, I could be looking at sub-16 (barely). My goal in the meantime however is to beat Dark Fulgore's 16:05 TAS.

Actually, going back and watching it, I'm wondering where it saves time over my run. He has a 2-cycle En-Mikoshi and Shura-Oh, doesn't do any sort of worm skip, and the stage movements are not as optimized. It doesn't appear that the game lags when it should though, so I'm wondering how much that plays into it. Faster elevator in 3-2. Better 4-2 path with rocks and quicker quick kill. Faster lava but slower skip in 4-3. Bad stage 4 boss. Slower 5-2 skip. Made boss 5 do 3 quick patterns, although was 2 cycles. Amano-Ikazuchi is comparable.

So yeah, I really don't know why that TAS is so much faster. I don't think lag plays a huge part in the run, but it's at least a couple seconds. Most of my stages are better optimized, as well as the boss fights... *shrug*

Before I forget, I found a new way to do the Worm Skip that saves an additional ~3-4 seconds. My best time is currently 16:21, but in that run I had a 2-cycle Shrua-Oh fight, so I can't keep it. With the newer skip and otherwise good execution/luck, I could be looking at sub-16 (barely). My goal in the meantime however is to beat [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vf6_QKjM-7Y]Dark Fulgore's 16:05 TAS[/url].

Actually, going back and watching it, I'm wondering where it saves time over my run. He has a 2-cycle En-Mikoshi and Shura-Oh, doesn't do any sort of worm skip, and the stage movements are not as optimized. It doesn't appear that the game lags when it should though, so I'm wondering how much that plays into it. Faster elevator in 3-2. Better 4-2 path with rocks and quicker quick kill. Faster lava but slower skip in 4-3. Bad stage 4 boss. Slower 5-2 skip. Made boss 5 do 3 quick patterns, although was 2 cycles. Amano-Ikazuchi is comparable.

So yeah, I really don't know why that TAS is so much faster. I don't think lag plays a huge part in the run, but it's at least a couple seconds. Most of my stages are better optimized, as well as the boss fights... *shrug*

Exo

2012-08-21 03:18:47 pm

Sandbagging

Beating the TAS is always a good goal haha. Make me proud ;P