Guacamelee

2014-01-25 10:40:21 pm

Thanks for the advice Vulajin Smiley

Alright, with practice Tule Tree Mask Piece isn't terribly difficult as long as I'm calm and play it somewhat steadily. I can of course go balls out climbing the spike wall leading up to TreeTops, but my consistency drops considerably. Still working on routing the Sierra Morena Piece, and the Pollo Cavern piece just requires adaptability and memorization. The other two pieces are pretty simple though.

Weskurrr

2014-02-01 12:43:57 pm

I'm new to this forum and to speedrunning in general, and have chosen Guacamelee as my first speedgame because I love platformers and metroidvanias. I've been watching NiL8r's WR run for notes, but man, his execution is just unreal.

One thing I want to ask about is how do you guys format your notes, and what's the best way to go about getting everything from those notes to stick?

NiL8r

2014-02-01 05:47:41 pm

With my run I didn't make any notes. I just ran the game over and over again.

Tezur0

2014-02-03 03:46:52 am

Great run, NiL8r. Gonna pick up any% pretty soon.

Weskurrr

2014-02-03 06:34:54 am

I've started learning and practicing this game, and what an interesting game it is to run! My favorite trick so far is the Frog Cancel, where you uppercut to a platform that you can almost reach normally and Frog Slam to get on to it, then dodge to cancel that animation and keep moving; you can see it in Nil8r's run when he's climbing out of the desert and again in the Forest del Chivo when he's heading toward X'Tabay, I think.

Speaking of which (or should I say, witch?), how long did you have to practice to get fighting her down? My first attempt was very rough, as I died like 5 times.

NiL8r

2014-02-04 01:46:07 pm

With X'Tabay, the important thing is knowing where the safe spots and dead spots are. In her first phase, every time she teleports just picture her as the center of a clock, and you want to be standing at either 5 or 7 o'clock.

For the second and third phases, learn the "windups" for all of her moves. They all have a unique starting animation, so that will tell you where you need to dodge. Note that if she uses her thundercloud move, it is possible to still hit her with Olmec's Headbutt if you are standing close to the edge of her attack.

Another note, for the final phase, you can hit her before her sprite even shows up. As soon as you hear the shield sound effect, her hitbox is actually active, so you can Uppercut the left one or Slam the right one depending on which is closer.

Tezur0

2014-02-08 06:13:45 am

how do you infinite walljump properly? I'm suffering at Sierra Morena for like an hour already x_x

Weskurrr

Edit history:

Weskurrr: 2014-02-10 03:20:31 am

Weskurrr: 2014-02-10 03:20:20 am

Weskurrr: 2014-02-10 03:18:21 am

Weskurrr: 2014-02-10 03:17:56 am

Weskurrr: 2014-02-10 12:16:07 am

2014-02-10 12:14:53 am

To infinite wall jump, first cling to the wall you wish to scale, then dodge in the opposite direction and jump, then quickly push your d-pad (or stick) back towards the wall to cling again. Repeat until destination is reached.

A slower method is to cling, hold the opposite direction and jump as you start to fall, then cling again and repeat.

Edit: I'd highly suggest mastering the dodge cancel method, as it will save quite a few seconds over the course of a run.

Edit 2: Btw, thanks for the tips on X'Tabay, Nil8r; I've noticed my performance against her improving a lot since I took what you posted and applied it to my run. Cheers!

Fan

2014-02-10 08:57:34 pm

Quote from Tezur0:

how do you infinite walljump properly? I'm suffering at Sierra Morena for like an hour already x_x

i uploaded a quick vid to youtube with the x360ce controller overlay:

as weskurr stated, you're just dodging off the wall then jumping back on. takes some rhythm and getting used to, but once you get it it's pretty natural.

FriedEel

2014-02-11 10:09:57 pm

Wish I had known about this thread sooner!

A lot of the people I wanted to thank for posting videos are here.

Figure I'll introduce myself by contributing - this is something I figured out the other day which is a huge time saver in the fight right after the Jaguar Javier skip. You can rooster uppercut a cactus immediately after killing the 2nd or 4th. Tried a very long time to see if there's any other combination or if this could be utilized elsewhere, haven't had any luck. I didn't see it anywhere, but sorry if this has already been mentioned!

Video:

FriedEel

2014-02-11 10:37:11 pm

Quote from NiL8r:

To anyone who is checking this thread out:
I'm going to be offering this game for SGDQ, but I need some help with an idea I have for a donation incentive, assuming it gets into the marathon at all of course. But since this incentive would affect the estimate time, I still need to include it in my submission.

My incentive idea is to get the True/Good Ending. I'm unsure of how to offer it though. Make it a challenge incentive, emphasizing how difficult some of the Mask Pieces are to get (the Tule Tree especially is a HUGE pain to get without the Goat Climb move)? Or emphasize the humor in just flying through most of the Great Temple? Or go a different direction and make it a bidding war between reviving and not reviving the President's Daughter, akin to Kill/Save the Animals in Super Metroid.

Again, assuming this even does make it into the marathon, I'm unsure of how many people watching/donating will have even played the game, and so I'm also unsure of how to offer the incentive.

Also, any general things you guys want to point out about why this game would make a good marathon game would also be appreciated. Thanks for your time guys Smiley

Awesome! Hope you get a slot at SGDQ! I'm a little late on this and past a reasonable time for anything regarding the submission, but as someone already mentioned it'd definitely be worth it to send an e-mail to Drinkbox - they're all about the speedrunning aspect of the game and I'm sure would love to see their game played at one of the SDA marathons.

[quote="NiL8r"]To anyone who is checking this thread out:
I'm going to be offering this game for SGDQ, but I need some help with an idea I have for a donation incentive, assuming it gets into the marathon at all of course.  But since this incentive would affect the estimate time, I still need to include it in my submission.

My incentive idea is to get the True/Good Ending.  I'm unsure of how to offer it though.  Make it a challenge incentive, emphasizing how difficult some of the Mask Pieces are to get (the Tule Tree especially is a HUGE pain to get without the Goat Climb move)?  Or emphasize the humor in just flying through most of the Great Temple?  Or go a different direction and make it a bidding war between reviving and not reviving the President's Daughter, akin to Kill/Save the Animals in Super Metroid.

Again, assuming this even does make it into the marathon, I'm unsure of how many people watching/donating will have even played the game, and so I'm also unsure of how to offer the incentive.

Also, any general things you guys want to point out about why this game would make a good marathon game would also be appreciated.  Thanks for your time guys :)[/quote]

Awesome! Hope you get a slot at SGDQ! I'm a little late on this and past a reasonable time for anything regarding the submission, but as someone already mentioned it'd definitely be worth it to send an e-mail to Drinkbox - they're all about the speedrunning aspect of the game and I'm sure would love to see their game played at one of the SDA marathons.

Fan

Edit history:

Fan: 2014-02-12 01:59:03 pm

2014-02-12 01:58:40 pm

Quote from FriedEel:

Awesome! Hope you get a slot at SGDQ! I'm a little late on this and past a reasonable time for anything regarding the submission, but as someone already mentioned it'd definitely be worth it to send an e-mail to Drinkbox - they're all about the speedrunning aspect of the game and I'm sure would love to see their game played at one of the SDA marathons.

yeah i definitely think they'd be interested in a skype call during the run. i posed the vid i made about wall jumping to my twitter and was talkin to the devs about it and they said: "We knew this was in the game but didn't think people would be able to get through the Great Temple, much less speed run with it." which is pretty cool they left that in~ so i was inspired to go ahead and explain the platforming section of great temple for speedrunners since it confused the crap out of me the first time i got there:

also @friedeel: thats sweet! those damn cacti always annoy me especially when RNG hates you and they only throw red spiky balls at you.

[quote="FriedEel"]
Awesome! Hope you get a slot at SGDQ! I'm a little late on this and past a reasonable time for anything regarding the submission, but as someone already mentioned it'd definitely be worth it to send an e-mail to Drinkbox - they're all about the speedrunning aspect of the game and I'm sure would love to see their game played at one of the SDA marathons.
[/quote]

yeah i definitely think they'd be interested in a skype call during the run. i posed the vid i made about wall jumping to my twitter and was talkin to the devs about it and they said: "We knew this was in the game but didn't think people would be able to get through the Great Temple, much less speed run with it." which is pretty cool they left that in~ so i was inspired to go ahead and explain the platforming section of great temple for speedrunners since it confused the crap out of me the first time i got there: [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKsrPyAEC_8[/url]

also @friedeel: thats sweet! those damn cacti always annoy me especially when RNG hates you and they only throw red spiky balls at you.

NiL8r

2014-02-15 05:35:04 pm

Holy shit Eel, good stuff. Definitely gonna check those runs out when I get the chance.

FriedEel

2014-02-15 07:12:31 pm

Haha thanks man, appreciate your stopping by my twitch today. Hope your wrist heals up soon!

Wanted to post this video of a cool thing I just figured out in Temple of War a few minutes ago - definitely risky strats but man it looks nice.

khaled13

2014-02-16 10:02:51 am

congrats on all the 3 WRs friedel , awesome stuff

i was wondering how the hell you climb so fast then i saw your guitar videos ..... o:

NiL8r

2014-02-16 12:55:25 pm

Yeah, even if I get a perfect run I doubt I can match that wall climbing speed any time soon. Gonna take a lot of practice

FriedEel

2014-02-16 01:15:24 pm

Thanks guys :3

Optimizing the wall climbing was something I ended up putting a lot of time into. I actually switch to the d-pad when I'm climbing up walls on the right side of the character, and use the analog stick for walls on the left side (the motion kinda makes sense with how the muscles in the thumb work). I had alot of problems with input errors on the Xbox controller's dpad so I ended up purchasing a Dualshock 3. From a personal standpoint it's been much better - might try out some Logitech controllers though too since I still have moments where I swear I'm holding down left and there's no movement.

and lol Khaled, yeah I think that fingerstyle guitar definitely helps. I'm a total wimp but my fingers are super buff.

FriedEel

2014-02-23 06:00:25 pm

Ended up knocking the normal any% run down to [55:40] last night after a long, long.. long night of attempts. http://www.twitch.tv/friedeel/c/3776910

The run I did right before it would have been even better, but I not choked on Calaca.

I think I wanna grind it down to sub 55, maybe lower, before switching to the other categories.

Fan

2014-02-23 06:49:19 pm

grats on making it past cuts, nil8r! guacamelee at sgdq should be good

FriedEel

2014-02-24 04:57:54 am

Quote from Fan:

grats on making it past cuts, nil8r! guacamelee at sgdq should be good

Ohh, so the second round of cuts were the last? Congrats nil8r! Look forward to tuning in for that, you'll do us proud!

FriedEel

2014-02-24 08:31:54 pm

I'm so sorry for spamming this thread, but I had to share this one! Got a time of [54:45] tonight, probably the best temple I've ever had. http://www.twitch.tv/friedeel/c/3783149

Gonna be working on the 100% category now.

NiL8r

2014-02-26 07:36:46 pm

Hey Eel, you forgot to mention that your run was also deathless :O

And that you only messed up the wall climbing like... less then 10 times. That's unbelievable especially with you fast you're going.

vorpal

2014-02-26 08:53:40 pm

neat way to get a bit of extra jump height before doublejump. can't find anywhere to use it besides getting that stamina piece a little early, but i haven't looked for minor platforming framesavers.

tried comboing this with the buffer extrajump rocmox posted back at the beginning of this thread, but i couldn't get it to really work. you can't headbutt until the airdodge is finished, so you're too far away from the wall already to rooster back. also, it doesn't actually work, in the sense that i wasn't able to headbutt then jump again (you can, of course, headbutt after the 2nd jump, but unless you're trying to make your way out from under an overhang that couldn't possibly help).

maybe it's doing the extra jump and headbutt at the same time and therefore canceling the jump or something, idk. it's hard to be sure though. it's probably not that hard if you've practiced it for a while, but i haven't, and when you only get it like 1/10 or 1/20 times it's hard to be sure whether the headbutt eats the extra jump or you just missed it.

http://youtu.be/P85hAAhKcqE

neat way to get a bit of extra jump height before doublejump.  can't find anywhere to use it besides getting that stamina piece a little early, but i haven't looked for minor platforming framesavers.

tried comboing this with the buffer extrajump rocmox posted back at the beginning of this thread, but i couldn't get it to really work.  you can't headbutt until the airdodge is finished, so you're too far away from the wall already to rooster back.  also, it doesn't actually work, in the sense that i wasn't able to headbutt then jump again (you can, of course, headbutt after the 2nd jump, but unless you're trying to make your way out from under an overhang that couldn't possibly help).

maybe it's doing the extra jump and headbutt at the same time and therefore canceling the jump or something, idk.  it's hard to be sure though.  it's probably not that hard if you've practiced it for a while, but i haven't, and when you only get it like 1/10 or 1/20 times it's hard to be sure whether the headbutt eats the extra jump or you just missed it.

NiL8r

Edit history:

NiL8r: 2014-02-27 06:40:03 pm

2014-02-27 06:39:41 pm

Thanks Vorpal. So both Headbutt and Slam give you extra height while in the air. It seems safe to assume that Derp Derp would as well? Gonna have to take a hard look at each room when I get to play this again for small time savers. Eel was using a lot that I hadn't thought of in his run as well.

VorpalEdge

Edit history:

VorpalEdge: 2014-02-27 07:54:25 pm

2014-02-27 07:53:17 pm

welcome to the machine

headbutt doesn't actually give you height in and of itself, it just gives you back control over your movement. after a walljump you're stuck moving away from the wall for a long time, right? headbutt cancels that and lets you turn around sooner, which lets you get some height from a walljump and then use rooster without moving too far away from the wall to reach a ledge.

jump + rooster VS jump + part of a walljump + rooster

derpderp can probably be used for similar shenanigans, although given that you have other tools by the time you get it (doublejump) there may not be a point.

btw, eel, i enjoyed watching your run.