Final Fantasy XIII Speedrun

2010-04-07 05:23:15 pm

1-Up!

Quote from VorpalEdge:

From... some guy on gamefaqs, partway down this thread:

Quote:

Random: Instant Chain has a 0.5% chance of activating after each hit and will not work on enemies above level 49.
This includes ALL bosses and a few of the marks such as Mission 51 and 64.

Very happy to see this. Tbh I think a speedrun would be much more enjoyable if every boss wasn't instant stagger spam.

Arrow

2010-04-07 06:41:42 pm

Now a hit show on the CW

Quote from Flip714:

Very happy to see this. Tbh I think a speedrun would be much more enjoyable if every boss wasn't instant stagger spam.

More enjoyable for the speed runner, perhaps, as they won't have to restart 100+ times for every boss until luck swings in their favor, but possibly less enjoyable for viewers, if it turns out that the only way to overcome the tougher bosses now is to have dedicated CP farming segments.

Also, depending on which bosses are truly immune to Death and which ones aren't, there still may be a fair amount of restarting Tongue

The status immunity thing is kind of frustrating. When Enemy Intel lists the enemy as being immune to a specific status, what it actually means is that they're resistant to it. In some cases, they're 100% resistant, but in many cases they aren't. And apparently some resistances decrease with stagger (Orphan, for example). Long/short - someone's going to need to test all the bosses in chapter 11-13 to see which are truly immune to Death, and which aren't.

[quote="Flip714"]
Very happy to see this.  Tbh I think a speedrun would be much more enjoyable if every boss wasn't instant stagger spam.
[/quote]

More enjoyable for the speed runner, perhaps, as they won't have to restart 100+ times for every boss until luck swings in their favor, but possibly less enjoyable for viewers, if it turns out that the only way to overcome the tougher bosses now is to have dedicated CP farming segments.

Also, depending on which bosses are truly immune to Death and which ones aren't, there still may be a fair amount of restarting :P The status immunity thing is kind of frustrating. When Enemy Intel lists the enemy as being immune to a specific status, what it actually means is that they're resistant to it. In some cases, they're 100% resistant, but in many cases they aren't. And apparently some resistances decrease with stagger (Orphan, for example). Long/short - someone's going to need to test all the bosses in chapter 11-13 to see which are [i]truly[/i] immune to Death, and which aren't.

Gorge express

Edit history:

Gorge express: 2010-04-08 02:49:57 am

2010-04-08 02:41:15 am

You shouldn't need to farm CP. The game has already been beaten without spending any CP whatsoever, and the cp gained from required fights should make you way stronger than any full farmed no CP characters.

Although if it comes to the point where you need to farm to get skills that will speedup boss fights, then the fight with the behemoth king and that other monster near the mines is probably the best place. I've also heard that there's a great spot in chapter 13 that you lose access to once the final boss is availible.

Also, if an enemy is shown to be immune to a specific status then they are 100% immune to it. However, when you stagger an enemy some of those immunities will disappear. Checking their intel again might show the changes, i'm not sure. And as far as i know, the final form of the final boss is the only boss that can be killed by death and only when he is staggered. and even then the chance is very very low. I haven't actually checked of course.

Arrow

2010-04-08 03:50:50 am

Now a hit show on the CW

Yeah, I finally found a list with the exact resistance chances (normal and staggered) for every enemy/boss, and as you said, Orphan 2 seems to be the only one who's vulnerable. Some other non-skippable enemies that it can be used against include Adamanchilid, Sanctum Templar, and Sahagin (not sure if they're all skippable or not). Jabberwocky/Bandersnatch and Wladislaus are vulnerable to Instant Chain.

Final notes on Death - only after a test run of actual speed run conditions will we be able to determine how viable it is. I think the time it saves on those fights, even if it's only three or four, makes it worth it, so it's more a matter of whether Vanille will have enough CP for it without any extra grinding.
Methods to increase chance of successful cast:
Multiple Sabs in party (the higher their level, the better)
Equip Belladonna or Malboro Wand
Cast Vigilance on Vanille
Debuff target (the more debuffs, the higher your chance of success)
Stagger the enemy (imagine trying to get a single hit Instant Chain AND first-cast Death in a single segment) Grin

Something else I learned...apparently you have a higher chance of getting shrouds to drop when you get low ratings at the end of battle. Also, the chance to drop a shroud is independent from the enemy's loot table? I'm really not sure how this works Huh?

Yeah, I finally found a list with the exact resistance chances (normal and staggered) for every enemy/boss, and as you said, Orphan 2 seems to be the only one who's vulnerable. Some other non-skippable enemies that it can be used against include Adamanchilid, Sanctum Templar, and Sahagin (not sure if they're all skippable or not). Jabberwocky/Bandersnatch and Wladislaus are vulnerable to Instant Chain.

Final notes on Death - only after a test run of actual speed run conditions will we be able to determine how viable it is. I think the time it saves on those fights, even if it's only three or four, makes it worth it, so it's more a matter of whether Vanille will have enough CP for it without any extra grinding.
Methods to increase chance of successful cast:
Multiple Sabs in party (the higher their level, the better)
Equip Belladonna or Malboro Wand
Cast Vigilance on Vanille
Debuff target (the more debuffs, the higher your chance of success)
Stagger the enemy (imagine trying to get a single hit Instant Chain AND first-cast Death in a single segment) ;D

Something else I learned...apparently you have a higher chance of getting shrouds to drop when you get [i]low[/i] ratings at the end of battle. Also, the chance to drop a shroud is independent from the enemy's loot table? I'm really not sure how this works ???

najzere

2010-04-09 02:17:08 am

Quote from Arrow:

Something else I learned...apparently you have a higher chance of getting shrouds to drop when you get low ratings at the end of battle. Also, the chance to drop a shroud is independent from the enemy's loot table? I'm really not sure how this works Huh?

Drops are based on the score you get at the battle rating. The farther below the target time you are, the higher the score and vice versa. The base score is 10,000, which is then modified up or down based on your time. The target time is calculated based on your party and equips, so not only do you have to have a slow fight, but the target time will already be really high on speed runs because you're not leveling your party or taking the time to farm for better equipment/upgrades. This also means you don't want to get preemptive, because that automatically raises the target time x1.2.

Star	Points	Shroud rate	Rare loot rate
0	Under 7000	x8	x0
1	7000-7999	x4	x0
2	8000-8999	x2	x0
3	9000-11999	x1	x1
4	12000-12999	x1	x3
5	Over 13000	x1	x5

[quote="Arrow"]
Something else I learned...apparently you have a higher chance of getting shrouds to drop when you get [i]low[/i] ratings at the end of battle. Also, the chance to drop a shroud is independent from the enemy's loot table? I'm really not sure how this works ???
[/quote]

Drops are based on the score you get at the battle rating. The farther below the target time you are, the higher the score and vice versa. The base score is 10,000, which is then modified up or down based on your time. The target time is calculated based on your party and equips, so not only do you have to have a slow fight, but the target time will already be really high on speed runs because you're not leveling your party or taking the time to farm for better equipment/upgrades. This also means you [i]don't[/i] want to get preemptive, because that automatically raises the target time x1.2.

[table]
[tr][td][center][u][b]Star[/b][/u][/center][/td][td][center][u][b]Points[/b][/u][/center][/td][td][center][u][b]Shroud rate[/b][/u][/center][/td][td][center][u][b]Rare loot rate[/b][/u][/center][/td][/tr]
[tr][td][center]0[/center][/td][td][center]Under 7000[/center][/td][td][center]x8[/center][/td][td][center]x0[/center][/td][/tr]
[tr][td][center]1[/center][/td][td][center]7000-7999[/center][/td][td][center]x4[/center][/td][td][center]x0[/center][/td][/tr]
[tr][td][center]2[/center][/td][td][center]8000-8999[/center][/td][td][center]x2[/center][/td][td][center]x0[/center][/td][/tr]
[tr][td][center]3[/center][/td][td][center]9000-11999[/center][/td][td][center]x1[/center][/td][td][center]x1[/center][/td][/tr]
[tr][td][center]4[/center][/td][td][center]12000-12999[/center][/td][td][center]x1[/center][/td][td][center]x3[/center][/td][/tr]
[tr][td][center]5[/center][/td][td][center]Over 13000[/center][/td][td][center]x1[/center][/td][td][center]x5[/center][/td][/tr]
[/table]

Gorge express

2010-04-09 01:22:23 pm

I know NCU runners get deceptisols and fortisols by getting 0 star ratings somewhere in chapter 2, and aegisols by getting 0 star ratings in chapter 4 using the enemy near the first vile peaks save point. Though being a speedrun and all, you might not want to wait to get 0 stars and just hope you get lucky.

If you are going to farm deceptisols, obviously you want to do it in chapter 2 before the target time gets high.

Arrow

2010-04-09 04:38:42 pm

Now a hit show on the CW

I guess what I'm most confused about is whether all enemies have an equal chance of dropping any type of shroud, or if some only drop certain types/none at all. For instance, I would assume in chapter 1 (before the tutorial about shrouds), enemies would have zero chance of dropping them. But if all enemies after the tutorial have a chance of dropping Deceptisols (even if it's just 1%), then it would be possible to just manipulate them from the forced encounters with resets. I don't think this is the case though.

Arrow

Edit history:

Arrow: 2010-04-12 06:53:11 am

2010-04-12 06:42:31 am

Now a hit show on the CW

So, I don't think anyone contributing to this thread has actually committed to making a run yet. I'm definitely interested in doing so, although it will be a while before I can actually start recording (I lack the proper equipment, for one thing). In the mean time, I've started a test run to help plan out my boss strategies, get an idea of how much CP I'll have to work with, what items I should go for, etc. While I most certainly will be trying to go quick, this test run probably won't yield a good time to compare recorded attempts to, as I plan to use battle restarts frequently rather than resetting when things don't go my way like I would in the real run (restarting battles does not reset the game clock). Also, I'm going to be picking up most treasures along the way provided that A. They don't require a lengthy detour and B. They don't require fighting an unnecessary battle, unless I deem the treasure to be indispensable. In the actual run, most of the treasures would be skipped, of course, but I want to get an idea of what I have to work with just in case it turns out towards the end of the run that I need to sell items for extra money. I'll make notes in this topic for each chapter as I progress.

Chapter 1 - Hanging Edge
All battles in this chapter are avoidable, aside from the cut scene prompted ones, of course. However, a few of the ones in Snow's sections are extremely tricky to avoid, so a segment break at the start of his first area would probably be wise. The only battle in the chapter in which I had to use a potion was Light/Sazh's fight against the Myrmidon. Even if it attacks both characters evenly, I'm pretty sure using one here is unavoidable. Doesn't really waste much time, though. I equipped Snow's Power Circle as soon as I picked it up. Both Iron Bangles remain unequipped for now.

Chapter 2 - Pulse Vestige
All battles in Van/Hope's first section are avoidable, aside from the cut scene one. However, I made the decision to fight the three Zwerg Scandroids guarding the Iron Bangle. I was able to manipulate a Deceptisol drop from this battle (even with five stars). The battle in Snow's first section is not skippable. I was able to manipulate a Fortisol drop here. All battles can be skipped in Light/Sazh's first area, however I chose to fight the group guarding the Gladius. Manipulated another Fortisol drop from this group and equipped the Gladius. Snow again...this battle can't be skipped. Can probably manipulate a shroud drop, but I didn't waste time trying because there was no save between the last fight and this one. Back to Van/Hope...all battles skippable here, but I chose to fight the Scandroids guarding the Fortisol chest. Again, a shroud can probably be manipulated, but I didn't try.

And that's as far as I am right now. I need to decide if I want to spend time farming for Deceptisols (I'm pretty sure this is the area you're supposed to do it). After that, the rest of the chapter should be cake. Chapter 3 is where things will start to get interesting.

So, I don't think anyone contributing to this thread has actually committed to making a run yet. I'm definitely interested in doing so, although it will be a while before I can actually start recording (I lack the proper equipment, for one thing). In the mean time, I've started a test run to help plan out my boss strategies, get an idea of how much CP I'll have to work with, what items I should go for, etc. While I most certainly [i]will[/i] be trying to go quick, this test run probably won't yield a good time to compare recorded attempts to, as I plan to use battle restarts frequently rather than resetting when things don't go my way like I would in the real run (restarting battles does not reset the game clock). Also, I'm going to be picking up most treasures along the way provided that A. They don't require a lengthy detour and B. They don't require fighting an unnecessary battle, unless I deem the treasure to be indispensable. In the actual run, most of the treasures would be skipped, of course, but I want to get an idea of what I have to work with just in case it turns out towards the end of the run that I need to sell items for extra money. I'll make notes in this topic for each chapter as I progress.

Chapter 1 - Hanging Edge
All battles in this chapter are avoidable, aside from the cut scene prompted ones, of course. However, a few of the ones in Snow's sections are [i]extremely[/i] tricky to avoid, so a segment break at the start of his first area would probably be wise. The only battle in the chapter in which I had to use a potion was Light/Sazh's fight against the Myrmidon. Even if it attacks both characters evenly, I'm pretty sure using one here is unavoidable. Doesn't really waste much time, though. I equipped Snow's Power Circle as soon as I picked it up. Both Iron Bangles remain unequipped for now.

Chapter 2 - Pulse Vestige
All battles in Van/Hope's first section are avoidable, aside from the cut scene one. However, I made the decision to fight the three Zwerg Scandroids guarding the Iron Bangle. I was able to manipulate a Deceptisol drop from this battle (even with five stars). The battle in Snow's first section is not skippable. I was able to manipulate a Fortisol drop here. All battles can be skipped in Light/Sazh's first area, however I chose to fight the group guarding the Gladius. Manipulated another Fortisol drop from this group and equipped the Gladius. Snow again...this battle can't be skipped. Can probably manipulate a shroud drop, but I didn't waste time trying because there was no save between the last fight and this one. Back to Van/Hope...all battles skippable here, but I chose to fight the Scandroids guarding the Fortisol chest. Again, a shroud can probably be manipulated, but I didn't try.

And that's as far as I am right now. I need to decide if I want to spend time farming for Deceptisols (I'm pretty sure this is the area you're supposed to do it). After that, the rest of the chapter should be cake. Chapter 3 is where things will start to get interesting.

dexter

2010-04-12 07:23:29 am

Probably a good idea to farm some extra stuff since the time doesn't matter and this is probably not going to be the last test run anyway.
When you know exactly how many deceptisols / fortisols you need you can still decide where to [not] get them.

Arrow

2010-04-14 01:56:44 am

Now a hit show on the CW

Quote from dexter:

Probably a good idea to farm some extra stuff since the time doesn't matter and this is probably not going to be the last test run anyway.
When you know exactly how many deceptisols / fortisols you need you can still decide where to [not] get them.

Yeah, that was pretty much my thinking as well. It may turn out that I can just manipulate what I need along the way from forced encounters, but I'll have no way of knowing that until I'm actually finished with the test run. So for testing purposes, I decided to go ahead and farm 6 more Deceptisols (bringing my total to 7).

Chapter 2 (continued):
As a quick side note, all of the remaining battles in this chapter are skippable, aside from cut scene prompted ones and Anima. However, I went ahead and fought any enemies that were guarding chests (even if the contents weren't that valuable) just to get an idea of what shrouds could be manipulated along the way (as an alternative to the farming I already did). The Pantherons guarding the 100gil chest gave me another Deceptisol, and I was able to get a Fortisol to drop from the forced encounter at the end of this section (where Snow joins Hope and Van). Picked up the Power Wristband and equipped it on Lightning (Physical Wall 5). The Ghast at the top of the stairs, while skippable, also has a chance to drop a Deceptisol, so I went ahead and killed him for one (bringing my total up to 9). Fought the final battle before Anima so I could get the chest of Potions, and forced a Fortisol drop to boot (bringing the total to 5). Alright, so for Anima, the fastest strategy is to focus on his body, since destroying his arms isn't necessary like it is for Bart 1 or Havoc Skytank. Using a Fortisol for this fight not only maximizes speed, but is practically necessary if you're ignoring the arms. Even with the buffs, you'll definitely need to use two or three potions (keeping track of how many potions I use to get an idea of whether I'll need to go out of my way for them in the actual run).

Chapter 3 - Lake Bresha
As usual, all battles here can be skipped, aside from cut scene ones. Skipped the Pearlwing Staff since it would require fighting an extra battle, and only gives 3 extra Magic (plus, I'll probably be switching to the Belladonna Wand later). Had some lucky drops from the second forced encounter in the chapter (two Potions and a Phoenix Down). Chose to fight the enemies guarding the Silver Bangle, Phoenix Down, and Magician's Mark. The items will probably end up being unnecessary, but I figured it's better to be safe than sorry.

Currently saved after the Magician's Mark chest. Haven't invested any CP yet or customized the paradigm deck, but I'll definitely need to do the latter before the next area.

[quote="dexter"]
Probably a good idea to farm some extra stuff since the time doesn't matter and this is probably not going to be the last test run anyway.
When you know exactly how many deceptisols / fortisols you need you can still decide where to [not] get them.
[/quote]
Yeah, that was pretty much my thinking as well. It may turn out that I can just manipulate what I need along the way from forced encounters, but I'll have no way of knowing that until I'm actually finished with the test run. So for testing purposes, I decided to go ahead and farm 6 more Deceptisols (bringing my total to 7).

Chapter 2 (continued):
As a quick side note, all of the remaining battles in this chapter are skippable, aside from cut scene prompted ones and Anima. However, I went ahead and fought any enemies that were guarding chests (even if the contents weren't that valuable) just to get an idea of what shrouds could be manipulated along the way (as an alternative to the farming I already did). The Pantherons guarding the 100gil chest gave me another Deceptisol, and I was able to get a Fortisol to drop from the forced encounter at the end of this section (where Snow joins Hope and Van). Picked up the Power Wristband and equipped it on Lightning (Physical Wall 5). The Ghast at the top of the stairs, while skippable, also has a chance to drop a Deceptisol, so I went ahead and killed him for one (bringing my total up to 9). Fought the final battle before Anima so I could get the chest of Potions, and forced a Fortisol drop to boot (bringing the total to 5). Alright, so for Anima, the fastest strategy is to focus on his body, since destroying his arms isn't necessary like it is for Bart 1 or Havoc Skytank. Using a Fortisol for this fight not only maximizes speed, but is practically necessary if you're ignoring the arms. Even with the buffs, you'll definitely need to use two or three potions (keeping track of how many potions I use to get an idea of whether I'll need to go out of my way for them in the actual run).

Chapter 3 - Lake Bresha
As usual, all battles here can be skipped, aside from cut scene ones. Skipped the Pearlwing Staff since it would require fighting an extra battle, and only gives 3 extra Magic (plus, I'll probably be switching to the Belladonna Wand later). Had some lucky drops from the second forced encounter in the chapter (two Potions and a Phoenix Down). Chose to fight the enemies guarding the Silver Bangle, Phoenix Down, and Magician's Mark. The items will probably end up being unnecessary, but I figured it's better to be safe than sorry.

Currently saved after the Magician's Mark chest. Haven't invested any CP yet or customized the paradigm deck, but I'll definitely need to do the latter before the next area.

najzere

2010-04-14 11:21:44 am

Are you keeping track of the CP gained from encounters you'll likely skip in a real run? You wouldn't want to spend it and skew your results from being too powerful.

Arrow

2010-04-17 06:40:13 am

Now a hit show on the CW

Quote from najzere:

Are you keeping track of the CP gained from encounters you'll likely skip in a real run? You wouldn't want to spend it and skew your results from being too powerful.

Yes, I'm keeping a list of how much CP I earn, how much was from skippable encounters, and how much I invest in the Crystarium each time I do so.

Sorry that I haven't had any updates in a few days...been working a lot. I've got a day off tomorrow, so I'm planning to make some progress on the test run. Incidentally, a speed running guide was recently posted on gamefaqs (here). I haven't read the whole thing, but it looks to be fairly solid. He uses a lot of the same strategies I've been using (or am planning to use), but I definitely think his final time is improvable. He fights more skippable encounters than I do, even in Chapter 1 where there's no real benefit to doing so, and also farms (from battles and chests) a lot of materials to upgrade some of his accessories. If nothing else, I have a goal to shoot for now (his final time was 9:58), but I'll also be interested to compare how the deviations in our strategies affect the final time.

[quote="najzere"]
Are you keeping track of the CP gained from encounters you'll likely skip in a real run? You wouldn't want to spend it and skew your results from being too powerful.
[/quote]

Yes, I'm keeping a list of how much CP I earn, how much was from skippable encounters, and how much I invest in the Crystarium each time I do so.

Sorry that I haven't had any updates in a few days...been working a lot. I've got a day off tomorrow, so I'm planning to make some progress on the test run. Incidentally, a speed running guide was recently posted on gamefaqs ([url=http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/ps3/file/928790/59567]here[/url]). I haven't read the whole thing, but it looks to be fairly solid. He uses a lot of the same strategies I've been using (or am planning to use), but I definitely think his final time is improvable. He fights more skippable encounters than I do, even in Chapter 1 where there's no real benefit to doing so, and also farms (from battles and chests) a lot of materials to upgrade some of his accessories. If nothing else, I have a goal to shoot for now (his final time was 9:58), but I'll also be interested to compare how the deviations in our strategies affect the final time.

FatalPhantasms

2010-04-17 06:46:29 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Essentia's FFX run was I believe 10:25. So if you beat FFXIII in under 10:00, it's probably going to be accepted under the time limit. The guy in the GameFAQs speedrun FAQ says, "After loading a save, you get penalized for the load time. ~20 seconds." I'm not sure if we should enforce that or not.

Also, we should consider whether we want to run the XBOX 360 version or the PS3 version, because the XBOX 360 version can be installed to the hard drive. Whether that makes a miniscule difference or not in loading times, it may be able to shave at least a few minutes over a span of ~9 to 9.5 hours.

Arrow

2010-04-18 03:51:32 am

Now a hit show on the CW

Quote from FatalPhantasms:

The guy in the GameFAQs speedrun FAQ says, "After loading a save, you get penalized for the load time. ~20 seconds." I'm not sure if we should enforce that or not.

Also, we should consider whether we want to run the XBOX 360 version or the PS3 version, because the XBOX 360 version can be installed to the hard drive. Whether that makes a miniscule difference or not in loading times, it may be able to shave at least a few minutes over a span of ~9 to 9.5 hours.

On the one hand, I feel that the in-game timer is pretty accurate, so it would be silly not to use it. The extra time lost every time you load a save is not unusual compared to other games. That's always been the double-edge of making a segmented run vs. a SS one - segmented allows you to take more risks and perfect individual portions of the game, but at the cost of small amounts of time lost the more segments you have. It's also one of the things to consider when trying to improve runs: Will it save more time to make more segments for better luck manipulation, or to have less segments for less time lost from saving?

On the other hand, I don't know how much of a difference there is between the load times on the 360 and PS3, and that definitely would be something to take under consideration. I think that for now it would probably be best to just go with the in-game timer. If this game ever becomes super popular for competition in the future (for whatever reason), we can make the decision at that time whether runs on different versions should be timed manually, be different categories, etc. For the record, I'm practicing on the 360 version, and will be recording my run on the same, unless someone wants to buy me a PS3 Wink

Chapter 3 continued:
Alright, so in preparation for the Warmech rematch, I equipped the Silver Bangle on Vanille and the Magician's Mark on Sazh (he's not in this fight, but I figured it would save me a trip to the menu later), invested CP in stat bonuses for Light and Snow and picked up Water for Vanille, and set up the following Paradigm deck: Com/Rav/Rav, Com/Rav/Med, Rav/Rav/Rav, Com/Com/Rav. Now, a few comments about this setup. Firstly, all of the CP I invest is possible to earn from just the required fights, except for picking up Water with Vanille - this would require at least one or two of the extra battles I did. Personally, I think this is worthwhile since the boss is weak to Water, but it's debatable. Now, I also figured out that it's possible to prevent the boss from casting Crystal Rain if you stagger him immediately before he does so. The timing is pretty tight, but I was able to do it fairly consistently by starting the encounter with one round of Relentless Assault and then switching to Diversity until he was staggered. This makes getting Fringeward for Snow unnecessary (at least for now), and also means that you don't need him as a Sentinel in any of your paradigms for the fight. Finally, my paradigm setup might not be perfect for ATB canceling, but I end up having to switch a lot during the fight anyway (to heal and to restagger the boss), so I don't think a lot of time was lost here. I experimented with a lot of setups, and this was the one that yielded the fastest time (my best was 1:18 - 11 seconds faster than the time from that speed guide I linked earlier). The only things I did not do that could have improved the fight were using a Fortisol (debatable, since I probably wouldn't have been able to stagger him at the right time to interrupt Crystal Rain) and use Potions instead of having Van heal, which was intentional as I'm trying to conserve them as much as possible. I also got a Deceptisol drop from the fight.

Moving on, all of the remaining battles before the Behemoth can be skipped. I chose to pick up the Deneb Duellers - they may not be necessary, as I'll probably be switching to the Procyons later, and it's a rather lengthy detour to get them, but you don't have to fight any extra battles, so I figured that I might as well. Onto the Behemoth, I went ahead and equipped the Duellers on Sazh and invested some CP in stats, while also grabbing Powerchain for Light. I then made the following Paradigm deck: Com/Rav/Rav, Rav/Rav/Rav, Rav/Rav/Rav, Com/Rav/Rav. Didn't bother using Libra, just manually selected Attack and let Vanille figure out for herself what to do Wink

Liberal use of ATB canceling allows you to finish this fight quick enough that healing is unnecessary. The rest of the chapter is pretty straightforward. I skip all of the battles along the way, occasionally using the Deceptisol reset trick to do so. I pick up a few of the treasures that aren't too out of the way. Eventually I make my way to the Garuda Interceptor, which is an easy fight. I use exactly the same strategy as I did on Behemoth. Lots of ATB cancelling, no healing.

Snow's little fight here before his Eidolon battle is kind of interesting. The first time you do it, you will have to fight six soldiers in a row, however if you restart during the soldier fight OR the eidolon fight, you will only have to face three soldiers. Also, if you choose to fight the soldiers, only the first three will actually give you CP (probably since those are the only ones that "respawn" when you retry. Therefore, since it's a forced encounter, and it takes them a while to kill you anyway, I decided the best thing to do here was go ahead and kill the first three soldiers for the easy CP, and then let the next three kill me. Next we have Snow's annoying Eidolon fight. The only way I've found to make this go any faster is to make sure you're always Steelguarding everytime Shiva attacks, and hope that she uses her big attacks (Pirouette and Blizzara) a lot. The fastest I've managed is 2:10. Getting close to 2:00 is likely possible if you're lucky.

Chapter 4 - Vile Peaks
The speed run guide recommends farming for three Aegisols at the start here. I modified this plan, opting to farm for two and then fight the Pulsework Soldier - it's super easy to preempt and also has a chance to drop Aegisols. I figured it would save time since it's along the way, not to mention that it's worth more CP than the Thexteron. Saved at the start of Sazh/Hope's next area.

[quote="FatalPhantasms"]
The guy in the GameFAQs speedrun FAQ says, "After loading a save, you get penalized for the load time.  ~20 seconds."  I'm not sure if we should enforce that or not.

Also, we should consider whether we want to run the XBOX 360 version or the PS3 version, because the XBOX 360 version can be installed to the hard drive.  Whether that makes a miniscule difference or not in loading times, it may be able to shave at least a few minutes over a span of ~9 to 9.5 hours.
[/quote]

On the one hand, I feel that the in-game timer is pretty accurate, so it would be silly not to use it. The extra time lost every time you load a save is not unusual compared to other games. That's always been the double-edge of making a segmented run vs. a SS one - segmented allows you to take more risks and perfect individual portions of the game, but at the cost of small amounts of time lost the more segments you have. It's also one of the things to consider when trying to improve runs: Will it save more time to make more segments for better luck manipulation, or to have less segments for less time lost from saving?

On the other hand, I don't know how much of a difference there is between the load times on the 360 and PS3, and that definitely would be something to take under consideration. I think that for now it would probably be best to just go with the in-game timer. If this game ever becomes super popular for competition in the future (for whatever reason), we can make the decision at that time whether runs on different versions should be timed manually, be different categories, etc. For the record, I'm practicing on the 360 version, and will be recording my run on the same, unless someone wants to buy me a PS3 ;)

Chapter 3 continued:
Alright, so in preparation for the Warmech rematch, I equipped the Silver Bangle on Vanille and the Magician's Mark on Sazh (he's not in this fight, but I figured it would save me a trip to the menu later), invested CP in stat bonuses for Light and Snow and picked up Water for Vanille, and set up the following Paradigm deck: Com/Rav/Rav, Com/Rav/Med, Rav/Rav/Rav, Com/Com/Rav. Now, a few comments about this setup. Firstly, all of the CP I invest is possible to earn from just the required fights, except for picking up Water with Vanille - this would require at least one or two of the extra battles I did. Personally, I think this is worthwhile since the boss is weak to Water, but it's debatable. Now, I also figured out that it's possible to prevent the boss from casting Crystal Rain if you stagger him immediately before he does so. The timing is pretty tight, but I was able to do it fairly consistently by starting the encounter with one round of Relentless Assault and then switching to Diversity until he was staggered. This makes getting Fringeward for Snow unnecessary (at least for now), and also means that you don't need him as a Sentinel in any of your paradigms for the fight. Finally, my paradigm setup might not be perfect for ATB canceling, but I end up having to switch a lot during the fight anyway (to heal and to restagger the boss), so I don't think a lot of time was lost here. I experimented with a lot of setups, and this was the one that yielded the fastest time (my best was 1:18 - 11 seconds faster than the time from that speed guide I linked earlier). The only things I did not do that could have improved the fight were using a Fortisol (debatable, since I probably wouldn't have been able to stagger him at the right time to interrupt Crystal Rain) and use Potions instead of having Van heal, which was intentional as I'm trying to conserve them as much as possible. I also got a Deceptisol drop from the fight.

Moving on, all of the remaining battles before the Behemoth can be skipped. I chose to pick up the Deneb Duellers - they may not be necessary, as I'll probably be switching to the Procyons later, and it's a rather lengthy detour to get them, but you don't have to fight any extra battles, so I figured that I might as well. Onto the Behemoth, I went ahead and equipped the Duellers on Sazh and invested some CP in stats, while also grabbing Powerchain for Light. I then made the following Paradigm deck: Com/Rav/Rav, Rav/Rav/Rav, Rav/Rav/Rav, Com/Rav/Rav. Didn't bother using Libra, just manually selected Attack and let Vanille figure out for herself what to do ;) Liberal use of ATB canceling allows you to finish this fight quick enough that healing is unnecessary. The rest of the chapter is pretty straightforward. I skip all of the battles along the way, occasionally using the Deceptisol reset trick to do so. I pick up a few of the treasures that aren't too out of the way. Eventually I make my way to the Garuda Interceptor, which is an easy fight. I use exactly the same strategy as I did on Behemoth. Lots of ATB cancelling, no healing.

Snow's little fight here before his Eidolon battle is kind of interesting. The first time you do it, you will have to fight six soldiers in a row, however if you restart during the soldier fight OR the eidolon fight, you will only have to face three soldiers. Also, if you choose to fight the soldiers, only the first three will actually give you CP (probably since those are the only ones that "respawn" when you retry. Therefore, since it's a forced encounter, and it takes them a while to kill you anyway, I decided the best thing to do here was go ahead and kill the first three soldiers for the easy CP, and then let the next three kill me. Next we have Snow's annoying Eidolon fight. The only way I've found to make this go any faster is to make sure you're always Steelguarding everytime Shiva attacks, and hope that she uses her big attacks (Pirouette and Blizzara) a lot. The fastest I've managed is 2:10. Getting close to 2:00 is likely possible if you're lucky.

Chapter 4 - Vile Peaks
The speed run guide recommends farming for three Aegisols at the start here. I modified this plan, opting to farm for two and then fight the Pulsework Soldier - it's super easy to preempt and also has a chance to drop Aegisols. I figured it would save time since it's along the way, not to mention that it's worth more CP than the Thexteron. Saved at the start of Sazh/Hope's next area.

Bp_

2010-04-18 10:38:56 am

just want to say gl for the run. I just finished the game and started the "Trial hunt mission" and its pretty cool.

Cant wait to see how you manage to speed run this game !!!

Carcinogen

2010-04-19 12:56:03 am

Quote from FatalPhantasms:

Essentia's FFX run was I believe 10:25. So if you beat FFXIII in under 10:00, it's probably going to be accepted under the time limit. The guy in the GameFAQs speedrun FAQ says, "After loading a save, you get penalized for the load time. ~20 seconds." I'm not sure if we should enforce that or not.

FFIV's IG timer does the same thing, and it is still used.

Arrow

2010-04-21 06:33:39 am

Now a hit show on the CW

I'm going to start condensing these progress updates a little bit. I'm mainly posting them so people can point out any possible improvements, ask questions, etc. The notes I'm making are starting to get really detailed (I wrote out a good four lines or so describing my strategy for the first fight in this update alone :P), and I don't think there's really any need to share all of that here. So, from this point onwards, I'll just summarize my progress, and if anyone has questions about specific fight details or whatever, I can respond to those directly rather than cluttering up this topic.

Chapter 4 continued:
Sazh/Van's first fight can't be skipped. An Aegisol can be dropped here, so that's one less I can farm at the start of this chapter. All of the remaining battles in this area until just before the Dreadnought can be skipped, however I went ahead and fought the enemies guarding the Black Belt, just in case I need it. I'm really hoping I won't, as this battle is a pain in the ass (although, on the plus side, it's worth a lot of CP and can also drop a Deceptisol). The next unskippable battle is a bit after Lightning rejoins the group. This one can also be manipulated for an Aegisol, so the farming I did should not be necessary in the recorded run (unless I need more than three Aegisols). The last couple battles before the boss can be skipped.

The Dreadnought is the first boss where skipping so many battles starts to make a noticeable difference. I'm still testing a few strategies here, but I'm reasonably confident the second phase can be done with just two potions (and no Med paradigm). I'm also still debating how best to invest CP at this point. I'll definitely be picking up Bravery, Faultsiphon, and Deprotect (for Sazh, Light, and Van respectively), but deciding which stats to take beyond that sort of depends on which abilities I'm going to be wanting to work towards next. For the sake of my test run, I stuck to taking stats in the Syn and Sab trees. Anyway, the first phase can be done without healing, if you're lucky (that is to say, patient). In the second phase of the fight, I'm pretty sure the boss can be downed in a single stagger and, as I said, with just two potions, but it's ridiculously luck dependent. I was hoping to finish Chapter 4 tonight, but I easily spent a good three hours working on just Dreadnought, so I'm pretty burned out. I'll continue tomorrow.

I'm going to start condensing these progress updates a little bit. I'm mainly posting them so people can point out any possible improvements, ask questions, etc. The notes I'm making are starting to get really detailed (I wrote out a good four lines or so describing my strategy for the first fight in this update alone :P), and I don't think there's really any need to share all of that here. So, from this point onwards, I'll just summarize my progress, and if anyone has questions about specific fight details or whatever, I can respond to those directly rather than cluttering up this topic.

Chapter 4 continued:
Sazh/Van's first fight can't be skipped. An Aegisol can be dropped here, so that's one less I can farm at the start of this chapter. All of the remaining battles in this area until just before the Dreadnought can be skipped, however I went ahead and fought the enemies guarding the Black Belt, just in case I need it. I'm really hoping I won't, as this battle is a pain in the ass (although, on the plus side, it's worth a lot of CP and can also drop a Deceptisol). The next unskippable battle is a bit after Lightning rejoins the group. This one can also be manipulated for an Aegisol, so the farming I did should not be necessary in the recorded run (unless I need more than three Aegisols). The last couple battles before the boss can be skipped.

The Dreadnought is the first boss where skipping so many battles starts to make a noticeable difference. I'm still testing a few strategies here, but I'm reasonably confident the second phase can be done with just two potions (and no Med paradigm). I'm also still debating how best to invest CP at this point. I'll definitely be picking up Bravery, Faultsiphon, and Deprotect (for Sazh, Light, and Van respectively), but deciding which stats to take beyond that sort of depends on which abilities I'm going to be wanting to work towards next. For the sake of my test run, I stuck to taking stats in the Syn and Sab trees. Anyway, the first phase can be done without healing, if you're lucky (that is to say, patient). In the second phase of the fight, I'm pretty sure the boss can be downed in a single stagger and, as I said, with just two potions, but it's ridiculously luck dependent. I was hoping to finish Chapter 4 tonight, but I easily spent a good three hours working on just Dreadnought, so I'm pretty burned out. I'll continue tomorrow.

najzere

2010-04-23 07:41:50 pm

No testing to prove this, but from playing the game I would think that strength for your Commandos and magic for your Ravagers would be the best stats, since you'll mostly be wanting to end fights early, rather than endure them with high HP.

Also, you might be able to use the Boost synthesis group to speed up your ATB gauges:

Weapons

Antares Deluxes (Sazh): Found in ch. 12 or bought at Plautus's Workshop for 11,000 Gil
Axis Blade (Lightning): Found in ch. 7 or bought at Plautus's Workshop for 15,000 Gil
Otshirvani (Hope): Found in ch. 12 or bought at Plautus's Workshop for 28,200 Gil

Accessories

Hermes Sandals: Mark Mission 34, dismantle Tetradic Crown (found in ch. 13 - not much help)
Sprint Shoes: Upgrade Hermes Sandals with Perovskite, dismantle Tetradic Tiara
Whistlewind Scarf: Item sphere in ch. 9 or Moogleworks for 1,000 Gil
Aurora Scarf: Upgrade Whistlewind Scarf with Rhodochrosite
Nimbletoe Boots: Upgrade Aurora Scarf: with Cobaltite

I don't know if you want to take the time to upgrade anything, but if you farm Incentive Chips in ch. 9, you can quickly make enough to buy everyone Whistlewind Scarves. Your ATB gauge will fill up 10% faster with two items, 15% with three, 20% with four and 30% faster with five items.

No testing to prove this, but from playing the game I would think that strength for your Commandos and magic for your Ravagers would be the best stats, since you'll mostly be wanting to end fights early, rather than endure them with high HP.

Also, you might be able to use the Boost synthesis group to speed up your ATB gauges:

[b]Weapons[/b]
[list]
[li]Antares Deluxes (Sazh): Found in ch. 12 or bought at Plautus's Workshop for 11,000 Gil[/li]
[li]Axis Blade (Lightning): Found in ch. 7 or bought at Plautus's Workshop for 15,000 Gil[/li]
[li]Otshirvani (Hope): Found in ch. 12 or bought at Plautus's Workshop for 28,200 Gil[/li]
[/list]

[b]Accessories[/b]
[list]
[li]Hermes Sandals: Mark Mission 34, dismantle Tetradic Crown (found in ch. 13 - not much help)[/li]
[li]Sprint Shoes: Upgrade Hermes Sandals with Perovskite, dismantle Tetradic Tiara[/li]
[li]Whistlewind Scarf: Item sphere in ch. 9 or Moogleworks for 1,000 Gil[/li]
[li]Aurora Scarf: Upgrade Whistlewind Scarf with Rhodochrosite[/li]
[li]Nimbletoe Boots: Upgrade Aurora Scarf: with Cobaltite[/li]
[/list]

I don't know if you want to take the time to upgrade anything, but if you farm Incentive Chips in ch. 9, you can quickly make enough to buy everyone Whistlewind Scarves. Your ATB gauge will fill up 10% faster with two items, 15% with three, 20% with four and 30% faster with five items.

Arrow

Edit history:

Arrow: 2010-04-28 10:16:50 pm

2010-04-28 06:38:50 am

Now a hit show on the CW

Yeah, I'm probably going to be taking advantage of the ATB boost, but I'll have to do experimenting with the other synthesis abilities I have available at the time (Power Boost, Instant Chain, etc.) to make sure it's optimal in each fight. Will definitely be using at least one Aurora Scarf no matter what (for immediate Instant Chains, Death, and Haste).

It's been a while since I updated my progress...partially because Dreadnought was such a pain, but mostly because I got into the StarCraft 2 beta Grin

Don't worry, I'm still going to be working on this in the downtime between matches when I get tired of being owned. Anyway, I've pretty much given up on trying to down Dreadnought in one stagger (during phase 2). Every once in a while I'll get lucky (Dreadnought targeting specific characters so I only have to use one potion before the Wrecking Ball, Light not missing any of her attacks) and get him down to around 1/4 health before the stagger wears off, but that's the best I've been able to manage. I've experimented with all sorts of alternate strategies...switching up my equipment, spending my CP in various ways, casting Vigilance...I've even managed to interrupt the first Wrecking Ball cast (the same way I did Crystal Rain on Warmech), but doing so actually makes the battle take longer because you have to forgo buffing/debuffing, resulting in less damage during the stagger, and then you still get a Wrecking Ball to the face as soon as the stagger ends. So, I compromised to using a safer phase two strategy, using potions and a Med paradigm, and downing the boss during his second stagger. I'm not happy with it, but it's still a 5-star time, and I'm sick of fighting the guy. Time to move on.

Chapter 4 continued:
Pretty straightforward up until Odin. For this fight, I found the easiest method to be popping an Aegisol beforehand and then just switch between Rav/Rav and Med/Med throughout the fight. I'm not too worried about their scarcity anymore...seems like a lot of the required fights can be manipulated to drop them. The rest of the chapter is just a matter of fighting a few required fights with Sazh to hit switches. Picked up a couple treasures that I probably won't end up needing, and fought one skippable encounter (for an Ember Ring which the speed guide recommended picking up). Ran through Snow's little flashback. Saved at beginning of chapter 5.

Yeah, I'm probably going to be taking advantage of the ATB boost, but I'll have to do experimenting with the other synthesis abilities I have available at the time (Power Boost, Instant Chain, etc.) to make sure it's optimal in each fight. Will definitely be using at least one Aurora Scarf no matter what (for immediate Instant Chains, Death, and Haste).

It's been a while since I updated my progress...partially because Dreadnought was such a pain, but mostly because I got into the StarCraft 2 beta ;D Don't worry, I'm still going to be working on this in the downtime between matches when I get tired of being owned. Anyway, I've pretty much given up on trying to down Dreadnought in one stagger (during phase 2). Every once in a while I'll get lucky (Dreadnought targeting specific characters so I only have to use one potion before the Wrecking Ball, Light not missing any of her attacks) and get him down to around 1/4 health before the stagger wears off, but that's the best I've been able to manage. I've experimented with all sorts of alternate strategies...switching up my equipment, spending my CP in various ways, casting Vigilance...I've even managed to interrupt the first Wrecking Ball cast (the same way I did Crystal Rain on Warmech), but doing so actually makes the battle take longer because you have to forgo buffing/debuffing, resulting in less damage during the stagger, and then you still get a Wrecking Ball to the face as soon as the stagger ends. So, I compromised to using a safer phase two strategy, using potions and a Med paradigm, and downing the boss during his second stagger. I'm not happy with it, but it's still a 5-star time, and I'm sick of fighting the guy. Time to move on.

Chapter 4 continued:
Pretty straightforward up until Odin. For this fight, I found the easiest method to be popping an Aegisol beforehand and then just switch between Rav/Rav and Med/Med throughout the fight. I'm not too worried about their scarcity anymore...seems like a lot of the required fights can be manipulated to drop them. The rest of the chapter is just a matter of fighting a few required fights with Sazh to hit switches. Picked up a couple treasures that I probably won't end up needing, and fought one skippable encounter (for an Ember Ring which the speed guide recommended picking up). Ran through Snow's little flashback. Saved at beginning of chapter 5.

najzere

2010-04-28 01:34:28 pm

Sounds like you're doing pretty good so far. Smiley

Did you get a Doctor's Code when you beat Anima at the end of Chapter 2? You can upgrade it to max and dismantle it for an elixir and some shrouds. You get another Doctor's Code in an item sphere in the beginning of Chapter 6 too. The elixirs might be life savers at the end of the game.

Arrow

2010-05-01 04:16:01 am

Now a hit show on the CW

Small progress update: Chapter 5 is pretty easy so far. You don't have to fight nearly as many battles down in the trial range as I had assumed. Only the enemy pack closest to the force fields needs to be defeated. The Behemoths are easy since I have Launch by the time I fight the first one. However, the pack of 10 Crawlers after the first Behemoth is almost impossible without having Fira. This was more or less a poor CP planning mistake on my part, and the whole reason why I'm doing this test run Tongue

I invested the majority of Hope's CP in his Syn tree during chapter 4 when I easily could have spent it on Rav (and had Fira by now). The Syn stats are more beneficial (I have 40 more HP than I would if I just went Rav), but the only battle it could potentially make a difference on is Odin, and I doubt it will be a deal breaker. In fact, I may not need to invest CP in Hope's Syn tree at all, since I'll probably be using Aegisols for most of the difficult encounters. Will have to see how things go. I considered restarting from an earlier save file (I think the closest one I have to when I spent the CP is right before Dreadnought), but unless I run into an encounter that I absolutely cannot win without dropping below 40 health, it shouldn't make a huge difference. Plus, if it does turn out that I need to invest CP in the Syn tree (for the accessory slot, or Barfire, or Haste, or whatever), then my stats will end up balancing out later in the test run regardless.

Something interesting I came upon while looking through the speed guide on gamefaqs: apparently Zantetsuken (Odin's ultimate Gestalt ability) can cast Death on bosses...even ones that are immune to Death Shocked

I already knew it cast Death on low health enemies, but I assumed it only worked on low level (non-boss) enemies like Random: Instant Chain, and certainly not on enemies immune to Death. But this is clearly not the case, since it works on Cid who is A. Level 68 and B. Immune to Death Tongue

Apparently all that matters is that you bring the enemy's health below a certain threshold. I dug through the No-CP-Usage topics (where this strat apparently originated from) and found the following formula:

3 x Odin's PA x (Chain Bonus)^2 = Minimum amount of life necessary.

Now, what I'm wondering is what the PA value is. I think it has something to do with the Eidolon's power level (they gradually get stronger as you progress through the game), but I don't know how one would go about determining this information. Also, I need to figure out if there are really no limitations (aside from the minimum health) to what I can use this on. This would shorten some of the later encounters significantly, so I'd really like to get more info about it. I may ask this on the gamefaqs board as well.

Small progress update: Chapter 5 is pretty easy so far. You don't have to fight nearly as many battles down in the trial range as I had assumed. Only the enemy pack closest to the force fields needs to be defeated. The Behemoths are easy since I have Launch by the time I fight the first one. However, the pack of 10 Crawlers after the first Behemoth is almost impossible without having Fira. This was more or less a poor CP planning mistake on my part, and the whole reason why I'm doing this test run :P I invested the majority of Hope's CP in his Syn tree during chapter 4 when I easily could have spent it on Rav (and had Fira by now). The Syn stats are more beneficial (I have 40 more HP than I would if I just went Rav), but the only battle it could potentially make a difference on is Odin, and I doubt it will be a deal breaker. In fact, I may not need to invest CP in Hope's Syn tree at all, since I'll probably be using Aegisols for most of the difficult encounters. Will have to see how things go. I considered restarting from an earlier save file (I think the closest one I have to when I spent the CP is right before Dreadnought), but unless I run into an encounter that I absolutely cannot win without dropping below 40 health, it shouldn't make a huge difference. Plus, if it [i]does[/i] turn out that I need to invest CP in the Syn tree (for the accessory slot, or Barfire, or Haste, or whatever), then my stats will end up balancing out later in the test run regardless.

Something interesting I came upon while looking through the speed guide on gamefaqs: apparently Zantetsuken (Odin's ultimate Gestalt ability) can cast Death on bosses...even ones that are immune to Death :o I already knew it cast Death on low health enemies, but I assumed it only worked on low level (non-boss) enemies like Random: Instant Chain, and certainly not on enemies immune to Death. But this is clearly not the case, since it works on Cid who is A. Level 68 and B. Immune to Death :P Apparently all that matters is that you bring the enemy's health below a certain threshold. I dug through the No-CP-Usage topics (where this strat apparently originated from) and found the following formula:

3 x Odin's PA x (Chain Bonus)^2 = Minimum amount of life necessary.

Now, what I'm wondering is what the PA value is. I think it has something to do with the Eidolon's power level (they gradually get stronger as you progress through the game), but I don't know how one would go about determining this information. Also, I need to figure out if there are really no limitations (aside from the minimum health) to what I can use this on. This would shorten some of the later encounters significantly, so I'd really like to get more info about it. I may ask this on the gamefaqs board as well.

ofcourse

2010-05-02 03:58:07 pm

I love Rogue Squadron and stories.

eh this is probably old information by now but oh well

gotta good bit of the way into a ncu myself missions 1-9 and 20 done so far without upgrades mission12 is a bit too much and will probably force me to upgrade . the chain bonus part thing is sadly up to 9.99 squared, odins pa can be found on lights status screen need to hit left or square or something but you can get to odin;s status form there can also check what pa odin while have at certain points by looking at the battle mechanics guide on gamefaqs . odin does make for a nice and fast cid battle.

also was somewhere in the ncu topics and its in the speedrun faq now so you have probably seen it, from an e-mail to the guy who wrote the speedrun faq , concerning the shiva fight

Hello, I really appreciate your speed run guide, only at the end of ch.3 and
I'm already 4 mins behind... oh well, you're too much haha

I saw that you were able to beat the Shiva Sisters in 2:21. I did it in
1:35.

As soon as the battle starts, switch to Rav and do froststrike x3 while
Nix ATB Charges.

Before she's done with it, go Sen and shield 3x, her spinning move should
increase the Gestalt bar by quite a bit. Then just go back to Rav and
froststrike x3 again until she's almost done with the next ATB Charge.
Just keep switching between Sen and Rav and that should save you those few
seconds.

I know it's not much, but hey, few seconds here and there adds up right?

Regards,
psxsquall

eh this is probably old information by now but oh well

gotta good bit of the way into a ncu myself missions 1-9 and 20 done so far without upgrades mission12 is a bit too much and will probably force me to upgrade . the chain bonus part thing is sadly up to 9.99 squared, odins  pa can be found on lights status screen need to hit left or square or something but you can get to odin;s status form there can also check what pa odin while have at certain points by looking at the battle mechanics guide on gamefaqs .  odin does make for a nice and fast cid battle.

also was somewhere in the ncu topics and its in the speedrun faq now so you have probably seen it, from an e-mail to the guy who wrote the speedrun faq , concerning the shiva fight
[spoiler]
 Hello, I really appreciate your speed run guide, only at the end of ch.3 and 
I'm already 4 mins behind... oh well, you're too much haha

I saw that you were able to beat the Shiva Sisters in 2:21. I did it in
1:35.

As soon as the battle starts, switch to Rav and do froststrike x3 while 
Nix ATB Charges.

Before she's done with it, go Sen and shield 3x, her spinning move should
increase the Gestalt bar by quite a bit. Then just go back to Rav and 
froststrike x3 again until she's almost done with the next ATB Charge. 
Just keep switching between Sen and Rav and that should save you those few 
seconds.

I know it's not much, but hey, few seconds here and there adds up right?

Regards,
psxsquall
[/spoiler]

Arrow

2010-05-02 07:22:09 pm

Now a hit show on the CW

Yep, I already got a reply about the PA on gamefaqs (I knew about the Eidolon status screen, I was just confused about what PA stood for, since it's called Strength in the US version). And I also caught that update in the Speed Guide about the Shiva battle. Pretty obvious, in hindsight...I don't know why I didn't even consider switching paradigms when I was testing it before.

Currently trying a few strategies for the Aster Protoflorian (Bulbasaur) fight at the end of Chapter 5, and then it's on to Chapter 6, which should be relatively short.

Arrow

2010-05-04 05:38:35 am

Now a hit show on the CW

Bleh, so sick of Bulbasaur. I spent a few hours retrying until I finished with a decent time, only to realize part way through Chapter 6 that I had forgotten to unequip Lightning, so I got to do it all over again Tongue

It's one of the most luck dependent fights, and is going to be a real pain in the recorded run. There's a battle that I can't skip right before the boss which will have to be part of the same segment, which means I'll have to redo both every time I restart. The boss itself must use Exoproofing Lightning and Water to get the fastest time, which means I only have a 1 in 6 chance of even getting a usable fight, still dependent on a number of other variables. If I want to use Odin for the fight, that reduces my usable fights to 1 in 12, since I will then have to get the exoproofings in a specific order. I'm still not sure if it's best to do that, however. Odin saves maybe 30 seconds on the boss; alternately, I can use him in the previous fight to not only save time in that encounter, but also save an extra trip to the Crystarium. I'll have to play around with it more during the actual run.

Anyway, Chapter 6 is awesome. There's only one required fight in the whole chapter (the boss), and I only stop for one additional battle (to pick up the Procyons, which will almost definitely be necessary for Random: Instant Chain abuse). Not only that, but most of the enemy packs are extremely easy to avoid. I could probably manage the whole chapter in a single recorded segment. Enki/Enlil are relatively easy, provided they don't gang up on one person. Unfortunately, I don't have enough CP to pick up Thunder with Sazh or Vanille, so killing Enki takes a lot longer than I would have liked, but not much to be done about that. On to Chapter 7!

Bleh, so sick of Bulbasaur. I spent a few hours retrying until I finished with a decent time, only to realize part way through Chapter 6 that I had forgotten to unequip Lightning, so I got to do it all over again :P It's one of the most luck dependent fights, and is going to be a real pain in the recorded run. There's a battle that I can't skip right before the boss which will have to be part of the same segment, which means I'll have to redo both every time I restart. The boss itself [i]must[/i] use Exoproofing Lightning and Water to get the fastest time, which means I only have a 1 in 6 chance of even getting a usable fight, still dependent on a number of other variables. If I want to use Odin for the fight, that reduces my usable fights to 1 in 12, since I will then have to get the exoproofings in a specific order. I'm still not sure if it's best to do that, however. Odin saves maybe 30 seconds on the boss; alternately, I can use him in the previous fight to not only save time in that encounter, but also save an extra trip to the Crystarium. I'll have to play around with it more during the actual run.

Anyway, Chapter 6 is awesome. There's only one required fight in the whole chapter (the boss), and I only stop for one additional battle (to pick up the Procyons, which will almost definitely be necessary for Random: Instant Chain abuse). Not only that, but most of the enemy packs are extremely easy to avoid. I could probably manage the whole chapter in a single recorded segment. Enki/Enlil are relatively easy, provided they don't gang up on one person. Unfortunately, I don't have enough CP to pick up Thunder with Sazh or Vanille, so killing Enki takes a lot longer than I would have liked, but not much to be done about that. On to Chapter 7!

IcedCube

2010-05-04 06:21:23 am

PROTIP: upload demo runs to YouTube for to entertain icedcube.