Bastion

2011-08-18 01:39:34 pm

I improved your Roathus lagoon run. If you roll the moment you have controls, you can skip the falling log. I'm grabbing the pike for now, until we figure it out where to get the pike vault. You can actually roll skip the first barrier, but your launch method works even faster and it's very reliable. The second barrier is the same, just executed faster, the top grass is definitely the best one to be launched at, very reliable. And I found a roll skip for the third barrier, you just have to be careful not to fall early, very easy to execute. Even with the screw ups I got to the queen fight 20 seconds faster. The fight was obviously much longer.

This area is pretty much done, with every barriers skipped lol.

I improved your Roathus lagoon run. If you roll the moment you have controls, you can skip the falling log. I'm grabbing the pike for now, until we figure it out where to get the pike vault. You can actually roll skip the first barrier, but your launch method works even faster and it's very reliable. The second barrier is the same, just executed faster, the top grass is definitely the best one to be launched at, very reliable. And I found a roll skip for the third barrier, you just have to be careful not to fall early, very easy to execute. Even with the screw ups I got to the queen fight 20 seconds faster. The fight was obviously much longer.

This area is pretty much done, with every barriers skipped lol.

Wago

2011-08-18 01:50:05 pm

Just a pointer, you might notice in your video that the portal was open way before you actually killed queen Ann. It basically open when he says you made her mad.

I knew about skipping the log, but I've always done it on the right, and its a bit harder.
And regarding the last barrier skip, if someone figure out a reliable way to skip it my jumping it would probably be faster.

Now its just a matter of practice it.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-18 02:17:46 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-18 02:13:31 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-18 01:58:58 pm

2011-08-18 01:57:20 pm

Yeah, this is the area that will make or break a SS run so far, but the third roll skip is easy you'll see. I didn't notice the early portal activation, thanks for pointing that out.

And the pike vault is in lost & found already, oh yeah!

Roll skipped the first barrier of Point lemaign, skipping some fights and the rifle pickup. Cheesy

and the last barrier can be skipped as well...

Wago

Edit history:

Wago: 2011-08-18 03:14:08 pm

Wago: 2011-08-18 03:12:25 pm

Wago: 2011-08-18 02:28:39 pm

2011-08-18 02:23:35 pm

This won't save any time. But i just found the best new game + way to beat the melting pot, video coming soon.

The portal turrets are pretty powerful, to bad they have no real use in a speedrun.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-18 03:07:53 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-18 03:01:14 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-18 02:32:06 pm

2011-08-18 02:30:16 pm

Showing only the two skips at the beginning and the end, rest is on rails and very boring. Only two ways to improve, by blindly rolling while the camera is messing around. I actually managed to roll to the half of the non-rail part blindly, but needless to say it will need a lot of practice.

Colford Cauldron: The barrier can be skipped with pike vault on the way, although on the way back it is VERY hard to do the skip, and the whole thing would save like 5 seconds or so if executed perfectly. Definitely doesn't worth it. Colford cauldron is just rolling, no need for the flamethrower.

Mount Zand: 'Boss' can be skipped here too, portal active from the start.

Showing only the two skips at the beginning and the end, rest is on rails and very boring. Only two ways to improve, by blindly rolling while the camera is messing around. I actually managed to roll to the half of the non-rail part blindly, but needless to say it will need a lot of practice.

Colford Cauldron: The barrier can be skipped with pike vault on the way, although on the way back it is VERY hard to do the skip, and the whole thing would save like 5 seconds or so if executed perfectly. Definitely doesn't worth it. Colford cauldron is just rolling, no need for the flamethrower.

Mount Zand: 'Boss' can be skipped here too, portal active from the start.

Wago

2011-08-18 03:29:46 pm

Its possible to skip the gate with all the turrets in the hanging garden, no vaulting needed, but you need to fall of the map.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-18 03:45:46 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-18 03:37:45 pm

2011-08-18 03:35:56 pm

I'm at Zulten's hollow, and as your video suggested it really is broken beyond belief. Managed to skip every barrier except the last one. You don't even need to fall, just roll into them at the right place.

Tazal terminals: Can't find any way to skip that stupid jumping, looks like it's bye bye rolling Sad

Wago

Edit history:

Wago: 2011-08-18 04:14:03 pm

2011-08-18 04:02:57 pm

Practicing the skips, and the cinderbrick one is really weird to me. There's like an invisible wall after the gate until you've killed enough enemies.

in prosper bluff I actually find it harder to do the first skip then the fireplace one. I noticed though, that its important to save the little brush bush or what ever it is behind the fireplace. I just couldn't do it if that was destroyed.

Caelint

2011-08-18 04:21:30 pm

Finished the game, and for today. Leaving Zulf definitely faster. I was hoping for some more big time savers like the fall before the bastion, no luck so far.

Cinderbrick skip is definitely harder, and I have doubts if it's worth it with the firepower you have in new game+, but as I mentioned before I managed to pull both launch skips off flawlessly without getting stuck. I'm just not sure this is single segment worthy.

I noticed the little bush too, it has something to do with the skip.

Wago

2011-08-19 05:58:30 pm

New PR 58:57 started timer at the file select and stopped when the final cut scene started.
The Tazal Terminals is a bitch still though, need a optimised hopping route, and the boss guy can still 2 shot you at level 10 without spirits. So i lost a lot of time here.
And some skips took a few tries.
But at least its an improvement by 16 min.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-19 06:45:09 pm

2011-08-19 06:40:59 pm

Are the bosses harder in ng+? I don't remember anyone two shotting me, you mean the guy before the jumping part? He's the only one I remember hitting hard. If you clarify which one you mean, maybe we can work out some cheap tactics. Grats for going under 1 hour.

After I can get pike vault I didn't find any use for it yet, interestingly the gates after you can get the vault in a new game cannot be skipped with the vault, like the triple door before encountering Zulf. I think I'll have a hammer + trip mine run and see how it goes.

Wago

Edit history:

Wago: 2011-08-19 10:03:16 pm

2011-08-19 07:56:12 pm

Yeah it was the guy right before the jumping part, which i really need to optimize lot. I found a safe strat though, which is just block, and strike once in between his attacks. I also died once on the first jawson bug illusion, I tried a new strat but it wasn't faster, and it killed me.

Can probably get sub 50:00 with close to no screwups though, with the current skips we know.

Arg, I would have gotten about 52 min if i didn't suck at The Tazal Terminals, I died 2-3 times on the guy with the last shart, just becuase blocking with the battering ram is worthless, takes like a full second for him to put it up... Luckily thats the easiest level to practise.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-20 01:41:24 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 01:37:31 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 01:34:48 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 01:31:07 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 12:20:35 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 12:01:27 pm

2011-08-20 11:53:18 am

I was messing around Tazal terminals, trying to find any time savers. I really want to break the game so we can skip that bloody battering ram Tongue

I was jumping around the barriers you need to break with the ram for an hour lol, but because of the hopping, they really were careful with the bounds at the final areas... only found a cool out of bounds skip for the first door but it really isn't a time saver, as it's a bit hard to go back in bounds. By the way you can easily make the boss before the platforms fall, just by blocking, because every block (not even need to be counter) pushes him back a little. I usually use the down left edge, I think a potion is there. If your pike have the pushback upgrade it's even a bit faster. It takes 5-10 seconds to kill him and no risk of dying at all because of blocking. I didn't find a way a skip him, I only managed to trigger the middle platforms, and you would need a very precise double jump (blindly because of the fixed camera at the fight). Make him fall is much easier.

So long story short, no luck skipping the ram so far Sad

As for now I'll just start a second round looking for things, as I have a much clearer view of what can be done.

Both gate of the Sundown path can be roll skipped ^^

Grabbing the pike anyway, so I won't need the flamethrower, as cutting grass is horrible with the hammer.

First test run around 1:10 not exact because of 2 restarts due to funny script failures, dying while a cutscene shows broke the game :P. And don't die to fall damage at the siege of Bastion, had to reload as the game didn't progress. Now to go under 1h in a new game seems possible, but I really need to improve some fights, and use the trip mine more and better. The prosper bluff fireplace skip will get on my nerves for sure... Perfect pre-bastion launch and Roathus lagoon went flawlessly, which is great. Practiced Tazal terminals a lot, as it was the bottleneck for you, and it went smoothly. Managed to skip all barriers at Zulten's hollow, but took a lot of rolling, I think I'll have practice runs there, as there are so many barriers.

I was messing around Tazal terminals, trying to find any time savers. I really want to break the game so we can skip that bloody battering ram :P I was jumping around the barriers you need to break with the ram for an hour lol, but because of the hopping, they really were careful with the bounds at the final areas... only found a cool out of bounds skip for the first door but it really isn't a time saver, as it's a bit hard to go back in bounds. By the way you can easily make the boss before the platforms fall, just by blocking, because every block (not even need to be counter) pushes him back a little. I usually use the down left edge, I think a potion is there. If your pike have the pushback upgrade it's even a bit faster. It takes 5-10 seconds to kill him and no risk of dying at all because of blocking. I didn't find a way a skip him, I only managed to trigger the middle platforms, and you would need a very precise double jump (blindly because of the fixed camera at the fight). Make him fall is much easier.

So long story short, no luck skipping the ram so far :(

As for now I'll just start a second round looking for things, as I have a much clearer view of what can be done.

Both gate of the Sundown path can be roll skipped ^^

Grabbing the pike anyway, so I won't need the flamethrower, as cutting grass is horrible with the hammer.

First test run around 1:10 not exact because of 2 restarts due to funny script failures, dying while a cutscene shows broke the game :P. And don't die to fall damage at the siege of Bastion, had to reload as the game didn't progress. Now to go under 1h in a new game seems possible, but I really need to improve some fights, and use the trip mine more and better. The prosper bluff fireplace skip will get on my nerves for sure... Perfect pre-bastion launch and Roathus lagoon went flawlessly, which is great. Practiced Tazal terminals a lot, as it was the bottleneck for you, and it went smoothly. Managed to skip all barriers at Zulten's hollow, but took a lot of rolling, I think I'll have practice runs there, as there are so many barriers.

Wago

Edit history:

Wago: 2011-08-20 05:12:17 pm

2011-08-20 04:44:53 pm

I don't have any luck finding anything cool on The Tazal Terminals either, I've only found silly bugs like

And you can't fall down edges while welding the ram at all.
And i did manage to get halfway through the jumping section, without jump, but then your stuck without and black rye, and there's no way to go. Might be a way to get all the way through, but i doubt it would even be worth it.
Jumping is still the worst part in the while game.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-20 05:22:32 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 05:19:15 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 05:17:30 pm

2011-08-20 05:15:27 pm

I have no problems with jumping (i was always good at platformers tho), there are some cuts you wouldn't be able to do without it, not to mention the tons of boulder. I get to the ram area under 3 minutes. I don't have a route for the platforms tho, just thinking on the fly. There are some platforms where you clearly land, but after that you fall through, it's annoying.

I even managed to get myself pushed down with the ram, unfortunately I still had the ram after. Cheesy

Wago

2011-08-20 05:31:17 pm

I got a pretty solid route, but I'm still looking in to if there's somewhere it would be worth vaulting over, because you get a much larger reach, and can skip some platforms.
Got my doubts its really worth it though.

Haven't timed how long i use to get to the ram though, but from starting the Tazal terminals to the end is about 8 min, and that was without some skips.

I'm also starting to get the "boss" guy down consistently, Takes about 5 or so stabs with a fully upgraded pike, unless i crit. And when i try to push him of the edge, he just teleports back behind me. Might be doing the push off wrong though.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:01:23 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 05:56:35 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 05:55:09 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 05:54:56 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 05:52:50 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 05:51:35 pm

2011-08-20 05:42:10 pm

2:53 screw ups all around Sad

ah well it's almost 2:00 am here. It's not that bad anyway. A flawless run would be around 2:45. Being reckless on the platforms just doesn't worth it, saving some seconds but risking falling.

I still suck at skipping the first barrier, and hitting the damn ice block blindly.

Wago

Edit history:

Wago: 2011-08-20 06:07:39 pm

2011-08-20 05:46:28 pm

That's pretty much how i does it, Except i just kill the boss instead, seems faster in a new game+.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:18:10 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:16:34 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:11:34 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:11:23 pm

2011-08-20 06:09:52 pm

I prefer blocking, it's extremely safe, he hits HARD, and I won't risk screwing up a SS run that late for 2 seconds. If you have knockback for your pike, you can try mixing tactics, if he doesn't fall he dies anyway Cheesy

Have you considered switching specials by the way? There is a point where pike vault isn't useful anymore (can you skip anything else than prosper bluff with it?). If you would switch for something very powerful ng+ special or whatever, it would really worth it. Switching takes 5 seconds, and you would obliterate the powerful bosses.

Wago

2011-08-20 06:20:41 pm

Maybe, the 50% extra crit chance is pretty good though, and probably saves more time overall.
Its a bit RNG involved, but hitting for 140 basically means everything gets oneshot, except for the later levels. Infact i have managed to 2 shot the boss.

And i used to run with brusher's sweep before i learned gate vaulting, and with the sweep just throws the bosses of the edge pretty much.
I use vault once in the quarry, and to skip pressing the button to get to the ram, that's what i can think of right now. Its basically just goes down if its worth spending that time to change it.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:31:30 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:26:38 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:26:20 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:25:28 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:25:03 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-20 06:23:31 pm

2011-08-20 06:22:29 pm

You can easily roll skip the ram gate. Exactly where you are in your screenshot Tongue

I make the quarry boss fall too, although I'm still trying to work out its pattern, so I can do it efficiently. Funny how easily it jumps to its death lol.

Mentioning the quarry, I'm still trying to figure out the best route there, it's a maze. I don't press any switches just trying to roll through as fast as possible, but simply following my instincts isn't very reliable.

Wago

Edit history:

Wago: 2011-08-20 06:41:12 pm

Wago: 2011-08-20 06:41:06 pm

2011-08-20 06:37:41 pm

Yeah, but i think vaulting the gate is faster and in the jumping part, there is a place i can vault and skip about 2-3 jump, its still a timing matter if its worth it though.

And in the quarry, i only press the switch before the boss, but that's just because its on the way anyways, and its faster then skipping the last stones. And yeah you can manipulate the boss pretty easily, in a ng+ though with a armor piercing weapons its just 2-3 hits anyways.

Caelint

2011-08-20 06:41:09 pm

With that damage output, do you even need to risk the Cinderbrick skip or any monster gauntlet related skips at all?

Wago

Edit history:

Wago: 2011-08-21 01:50:19 am

Wago: 2011-08-21 01:33:58 am

Wago: 2011-08-20 06:59:17 pm

2011-08-20 06:45:01 pm

Well, else i still need to wait for spawns. But for the first half of the game everything basically die in 1-2 hits. And a crit does 3 times the damage of a regular hit.

Don't jump and use the portal in midair. or this might happend

Im getting the wild outskirt skip pretty consistently, with one fall. I think 2 falls is about the same time as running around. So its worth trying even if it takes an extra fall.

I also finally managed to pull off the skip ClockworkSeal mentioned, and its faster then doing the last barrier skip, if i could manage to do it consistently, I'll upload a video of it tomorrow or something.

Caelint

Edit history:

Caelint: 2011-08-22 01:17:44 pm

Caelint: 2011-08-22 12:42:40 pm

2011-08-21 11:37:07 am

1:05:30 and I screwed up pretty much every skip. I think I'll just kill the quarry boss next time, it really got on my nerves today with its very hectic behavior.

After a few tries it's 1:01:51... seems like sub 1h in a new game is pretty much a perfect run. I reached the point where every second saved would be a struggle and I'm not sure I'm up for that. Maybe under 1:01, but sub 1h, with the currently known skips would take hundreds of tries and near perfect execution. At least it's a clear baseline for now if anyone will ever want to seriously run this game in new game.