Amnesia: The Dark Descent

2010-12-02 04:35:59 pm

For those who don't know, Amnesia: The Dark Descent is a physics-based horror game in which the player (who has amnesia) must navigate through a castle guarded by monsters by completing a series of puzzles. The catch? You have absolutely no way to defend yourself. If you come across a monster, your only option is to run.

Now, my question is, what are people's thoughts on speedrunning his game? The game is pretty straightforward, however currently I know of one glitch that could be used to skip a certain puzzle. When you are in the cistern and need to drain the sewer, normally you need to drain it, go to the machine room to fix the other bridge, and then go to the Morgue. However, by utilizing a jump shown in this video: (at about 2:15). Doing this should eliminate the need to enter the machine room at all, saving a decent amount of time.

Now, the physics in this game can obviously be exploited, and currently I'm trying to find more tricks that could potentially save time. For example, I've been trying to find a way into the refinery early, which would eliminate the need to collect the acid. At the beginning of the game you can skip getting the lantern by jumping up the fallen rocks until you get outside the map, however this would cost time. However, I am attempting to do the same in the main hall area - but it seems to be more difficult. If we could figure out how to get into the refinery without using the acid, a decent amount of time could be saved right at the beginning of the game.

Thread title:

For those who don't know, Amnesia: The Dark Descent is a physics-based horror game in which the player (who has amnesia) must navigate through a castle guarded by monsters by completing a series of puzzles. The catch? You have absolutely no way to defend yourself. If you come across a monster, your only option is to run.

Now, my question is, what are people's thoughts on speedrunning his game? The game is pretty straightforward, however currently I know of one glitch that could be used to skip a certain puzzle. When you are in the cistern and need to drain the sewer, normally you need to drain it, go to the machine room to fix the other bridge, and then go to the Morgue. However, by utilizing a jump shown in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7Fzx0uSBe4 (at about 2:15). Doing this should eliminate the need to enter the machine room at all, saving a decent amount of time.

Now, the physics in this game can obviously be exploited, and currently I'm trying to find more tricks that could potentially save time. For example, I've been trying to find a way into the refinery early, which would eliminate the need to collect the acid. At the beginning of the game you can skip getting the lantern by jumping up the fallen rocks until you get outside the map, however this would cost time. However, I am attempting to do the same in the main hall area - but it seems to be more difficult. If we could figure out how to get into the refinery without using the acid, a decent amount of time could be saved right at the beginning of the game.

ExplodingCabbage

2010-12-02 07:28:28 pm

This uses the same engine as the Penumbra games, right? Make sure to familiarise yourself with tricks already known for them before starting a run.

Sid

Edit history:

Sid: 2010-12-02 10:32:27 pm

Sid: 2010-12-02 10:28:55 pm

Sid: 2010-12-02 10:28:17 pm

2010-12-02 10:27:53 pm

Now it's Sui^^

You know, that a good idea, is just go to YouTube and type in: "Amnesia The dark descent speedrun"? One of the users - phantagaming - pulled off really impressive speedrun of Amnesia, using many tricks he has found and finishing the game in 42 min 41sec.

And here you have an example of what he did to skip the machine room:
(sorry for the link, but apparently, YouTube plugin doesn't support '#t=')

If you think (or anyone else thinks), about really making a speedrun, you should watch it and analyse trick (some are not obvious - like the one with a key (link)

Quote from ExplodingCabbage:

This uses the same engine as the Penumbra games, right? Make sure to familiarise yourself with tricks already known for them before starting a run.

Nah... it's HPL2 Engine - it's far more advanced, then the one, used in Penumbra.

Waef

2010-12-02 11:28:36 pm

Ah wow. I dunno why but I never even thought to look it up on youtube haha. Well, I guess I should search for possible improvements, as that run already seems pretty amazing. I had no clue about the ladder exploit, that's definitely quite a bit faster. Still, I wonder if there's a way to exploit the physics to skip even more.

moozooh

2011-01-04 01:18:52 pm

Hail Discordia!

<Cerpin> Shall I have a go at explaining the exact process by which I got OOB?
<moozooh> go on.
<Cerpin> Basically, if you jump high enough up the rock barricade beside the door into the room with the hole in the ceiling
<Cerpin> You start to be able to see past the barricade
<Cerpin> Then what you need to do is crouch
<Cerpin> And get near a place where the edge of the rock slants smoothly back towards the rest of the barricade
<Cerpin> Then jump up
<Cerpin> And you should pop up through the ceiling
<Cerpin> I think what's happening is that my character is uncrouching
<Cerpin> Just as I land on the seam of the rock
<Cerpin> And that forces me through

Sid

2011-01-13 07:36:50 am

Now it's Sui^^

Why isn't this guy on SDA forums already? Or is he?!

moozooh

2011-01-13 09:07:18 am

Hail Discordia!

Haha, that's excellent. I'm starting to wonder if a lot more stages/puzzles could possibly be skipped that way, considering just how many places it's theoretically possible to get OOB from (basically any slanted surface under a low ceiling will suffice). This trick alone brings the target time to around 35 minutes or so, a couple more applications would place it under half an hour most likely.

Sid

2011-01-30 05:04:11 am

Now it's Sui^^

and another glitch found by phantagaming. Well, it looks like another talented player, who should be here, on SDA forums....

so, I wouldn't have to post his stuff here.

moozooh

2011-01-30 10:13:30 am

Hail Discordia!

Well, it appears the game can be considered broken wide open at this point. Not sure if I should feel happy or sad about it. Shocked

Apjjm

Edit history:

Apjjm: 2011-01-30 06:46:15 pm

Apjjm: 2011-01-30 03:09:28 pm

2011-01-30 01:57:47 pm

What?

It may be broken some more :).
I decided to play through the game using the currently known tricks & skips - but came across a little problem. You see, skipping the acid means you don't get the pot which can hold the explosive chemical (you get a different pot after the acid). If you don't have that, you can't get past the rocks in the storage. If you can't get past the rocks in the storage you can't get the machine rods for the lift.
So, I tried skipping the lift first. but sadly the game didn't want to be broken that badly. It didn't have some kind of trigger i could fire underneath or above the lift. After wasting some time looking for areas to use more object-jump-crouch tricks to go out of bounds I saw the above video - which gave a few new ideas to try. After a bit of experimenting it turns out you can save whilst inside objects, to push you out the map.
However, that still isn't quite enough to get the machine rods! As you not only have to navigate out of bounds (which isn't that bad, as the game rather kindly lets you fly up certain walls by hammering jump), but you also have to get back in bounds (although it is possible to grab items through walls, you can't get to where the machine rods thanks to an extended ceiling and lack of floor).
Infact, you then have to force/deform an object through a wall using some rather violent mouse movements, which you can then use to save-boost you back inside. You can then collect the rods, perform another save-boost back out of bounds - and some rather tricky wall-climbing segments later (especially the last two!), you have successfully skipped everything in the storage area, and are safe with skipping the first area.

With these new tricks it may be possible to speed up the first areas even more (I.e: not having to navigate out of bounds, and just saving through the "wall" that requires the acid).

It also appears you can also make some objects float by dropping them on your head whilst crouching, and then repeatedly jumping whilst trapped underneath.

Video (Starts with the lift area, which sadly doesn't work - but then goes onto all the storage stuff):

Youtube seems to have made the video darker.

Edit 2:
You can use the save trick with boxes in both the refinery (Skipping the trapdoor puzzle to save 10-20 seconds) and the study (so you don't have to wait for the window to become breakable and then do the jumping stuff).

It may be broken some more :).
I decided to play through the game using the currently known tricks & skips - but came across a little problem. You see, skipping the acid means you don't get the pot which can hold the explosive chemical (you get a different pot after the acid). If you don't have that, you can't get past the rocks in the storage. If you can't get past the rocks in the storage you can't get the machine rods for the lift.
So, I tried skipping the lift first. but sadly the game didn't want to be broken that badly. It didn't have some kind of trigger i could fire underneath or above the lift. After wasting some time looking for areas to use more object-jump-crouch tricks to go out of bounds I saw the above video - which gave a few new ideas to try. After a bit of experimenting it turns out you can save whilst inside objects, to push you out the map.
However, that still isn't quite enough to get the machine rods!  As you not only have to navigate out of bounds (which isn't that bad, as the game rather kindly lets you fly up certain walls by hammering jump), but you also have to get back in bounds (although it is possible to grab items through walls, you can't get to where the machine rods thanks to an extended ceiling and lack of floor).
 Infact, you then have to force/deform an object through a wall using some rather violent mouse movements, which you can then use to save-boost you back inside. You can then collect the rods, perform another save-boost back out of bounds - and some rather tricky wall-climbing segments later (especially the last two!), you have successfully skipped everything in the storage area, and are safe with skipping the first area.

With these new tricks it may be possible to speed up the first areas even more (I.e: not having to navigate out of bounds, and just saving through the "wall" that requires the acid).

It also appears you can also make some objects float by dropping them on your head whilst crouching, and then repeatedly jumping whilst trapped underneath.

Video (Starts with the lift area, which sadly doesn't work - but then goes onto all the storage stuff):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_rK74FUms0
Youtube seems to have made the video darker.

Edit 2:
You can use the save trick with boxes in both the refinery (Skipping the trapdoor puzzle to save 10-20 seconds) and the study (so you don't have to wait for the window to become breakable and then do the jumping stuff).

Zeupar

Edit history:

Zeupar: 2011-01-31 06:05:22 am

Zeupar: 2011-01-31 06:04:42 am

2011-01-31 06:03:06 am

Sonical!

Quote from moozooh:

Well, it appears the game can be considered broken wide open at this point. Not sure if I should feel happy or sad about it. Shocked

You should feel happy, of course. Tongue

Apjjm

2011-02-01 11:45:37 am

What?

Tried playing around with the save trick in the final area to skip the orb-fetch stuff. It worked, almost:

phantasy

Edit history:

phantasy: 2011-02-02 03:03:43 am

2011-02-02 02:54:53 am

Heya, I'm phantagaming Smiley

I haven't browsed these forums in a while, but I noticed that I had some embedded views from here and decided to check it out Smiley

I'm happy you like my run ! I've actually started a new run this weekend for fun (which will be completed when I have the time for it). It isn't very optimized but I wanted to do a new one with the new glitches. I'm currently in Nave on my way to Transept for the remaining orb-pieces.
The videos you've posted Apjjm are very interesting Smiley

You've been trying the stuffs I've been trying out as well :p
I was a bit disappointed when I noticed that you need to get the elevator working to be able to trigger the next level, as well as it isn't possible to skip the orb-pieces, that would've been a very nice time saver. I fooled around in the cistern also but couldn't find a way to go OOB. However, if a way to reach the door is found I think the Morgue has to be completed at least to get the antidote to be able to use the door. I've found a nice shortcut in the Sewer as well, skipping all monsters and the need for the pipe. I'm also using the physics glitch to skip the need to open the doors in Nave. The glitch is a pain though since it barely occurs for me when I play in Windows Sad

I've tried the save inside object glitch you've discovered Apjjm but couldn't get it to work. Might look more into it later.

Is there anyone else who is going to attempt a speedrun ?

Edit: I just checked your channel Apjjm, seems you've found the Sewer-skip as well Smiley

I did it a bit different though; it is possible to jump around the large area on the left side by jumping over there at once after getting up on the path from the rocks. Difficult to explain. I can upload a video of it if you (or anyone else) is interested.

Heya, I'm phantagaming :)

I haven't browsed these forums in a while, but I noticed that I had some embedded views from here and decided to check it out :)
I'm happy you like my run ! I've actually started a new run this weekend for fun (which will be completed when I have the time for it). It isn't very optimized but I wanted to do a new one with the new glitches. I'm currently in Nave on my way to Transept for the remaining orb-pieces.
The videos you've posted Apjjm are very interesting :) You've been trying the stuffs I've been trying out as well :p
I was a bit disappointed when I noticed that you need to get the elevator working to be able to trigger the next level, as well as it isn't possible to skip the orb-pieces, that would've been a very nice time saver. I fooled around in the cistern also but couldn't find a way to go OOB. However, if a way to reach the door is found I think the Morgue has to be completed at least to get the antidote to be able to use the door. I've found a nice shortcut in the Sewer as well, skipping all monsters and the need for the pipe. I'm also using the physics glitch to skip the need to open the doors in Nave. The glitch is a pain though since it barely occurs for me when I play in Windows :( I've tried the save inside object glitch you've discovered Apjjm but couldn't get it to work. Might look more into it later.

Is there anyone else who is going to attempt a speedrun ?

Edit: I just checked your channel Apjjm, seems you've found the Sewer-skip as well :) I did it a bit different though; it is possible to jump around the large area on the left side by jumping over there at once after getting up on the path from the rocks. Difficult to explain. I can upload a video of it if you (or anyone else) is interested.

Sid

2011-02-02 08:46:13 am

Now it's Sui^^

Quote from phantasy:

Heya, I'm phantagaming Smiley

Greetings, speedrunner! Wink

So you are here... great!

---- Back to topic....

Quote from phantasy:

Is there anyone else who is going to attempt a speedrun ?

Can't promise, but I may try speedrunning it... only as 'casual speedrun', though.

Quote from phantasy:

I can upload a video of it if you (or anyone else) is interested.

I would be interested.

I also have been playing with AHK and scripts a little - wrote something, that barely works, but there seems to be a way to fly using objects, in similar way like in HL2, Oblivion of Fallout 3, but since the levels in game are quite narrow with a ceiling at quite low level (the levels meant to be claustrophobic), it's almost no use (especially when you can use objects to simply get through walls).

Apjjm

Edit history:

Apjjm: 2011-02-02 05:42:51 pm

Apjjm: 2011-02-02 05:39:13 pm

2011-02-02 05:38:40 pm

What?

Quote from phantasy:

Heya, I'm phantagaming Smiley

---
Is there anyone else who is going to attempt a speedrun ?

HI :). I was going to do a casual run-through of the game if only to record lots of smaller tricks which don't quite deserve their own video (There are some in the prison and also the area you get locked in after the chancel). I would consider doing a run, time permitting & if I feel like I haven't had enough of the game after completing the playthrough.

Quote:

I fooled around in the cistern also but couldn't find a way to go OOB. However, if a way to reach the door is found I think the Morgue has to be completed at least to get the antidote to be able to use the door.

Sadly it appears that the objects in the cistern are small, so they were set to not interact with the players "object" (I.e: they pass right through), so the only hope is going to be finding a glitch with non-manipulatable objects.

Quote:

I'm also using the physics glitch to skip the need to open the doors in Nave. The glitch is a pain though since it barely occurs for me when I play in Windows Sad

I've tried the save inside object glitch you've discovered Apjjm but couldn't get it to work. Might look more into it later.

Any tips for performing the physics glitch? I spent some time trying to do it the other day and was probably doing it wrong.
I am almost 100% sure I know what causes the save glitch, though. If you have ever dabbled in physics engine programming, there is a vector quantity you get from collision detection which defines the direction & distance needed to separate two objects in the minimal "push". Normally in Amnesia, when you are inside a grabbed object, the object ignores collisions with the player. However, for some reason when the game loads a save, you are both pushed apart by this vector to resolve the collision. This collision resolution is applied after collision detection, hence this allows you to skip through thin objects (or inside thicker objects). Knowing this makes it a little easier to predict and manipulate how and where you get pushed.

The flying thing would have use in navigating out of bounds areas, there might be a few areas it could have a use in.

[quote="phantasy"]Heya, I'm phantagaming :)
---
Is there anyone else who is going to attempt a speedrun ?
[/quote]
HI :). I was going to do a casual run-through of the game if only to record lots of smaller tricks which don't quite deserve their own video (There are some in the prison and also the area you get locked in after the chancel). I would consider doing a run, time permitting & if I feel like I haven't had enough of the game after completing the playthrough.

[quote]I fooled around in the cistern also but couldn't find a way to go OOB. However, if a way to reach the door is found I think the Morgue has to be completed at least to get the antidote to be able to use the door.[/quote]
Sadly it appears that the objects in the cistern are small, so they were set to not interact with the players "object" (I.e: they pass right through), so the only hope is going to be finding a glitch with non-manipulatable objects.

[quote]I'm also using the physics glitch to skip the need to open the doors in Nave. The glitch is a pain though since it barely occurs for me when I play in Windows :( I've tried the save inside object glitch you've discovered Apjjm but couldn't get it to work. Might look more into it later.
[/quote]
Any tips for performing the physics glitch? I spent some time trying to do it the other day and was probably doing it wrong.
I am almost 100% sure I know what causes the save glitch, though. If you have ever dabbled in physics engine programming, there is a vector quantity you get from collision detection which defines the direction & distance needed to separate two objects in the minimal "push". Normally in Amnesia, when you are inside a grabbed object, the object ignores collisions with the player. However, for some reason when the game loads a save, you are both pushed apart by this vector to resolve the collision. This collision resolution is applied after collision detection, hence this allows you to skip through thin objects (or inside thicker objects). Knowing this makes it a little easier to predict and manipulate how and where you get pushed.

The flying thing would have use in navigating out of bounds areas, there might be a few areas it could have a use in.

phantasy

2011-02-03 02:57:14 pm

Nice ! Looking forward to your runs ! Smiley

Quote from Sid:

I also have been playing with AHK and scripts a little - wrote something, that barely works, but there seems to be a way to fly using objects, in similar way like in HL2, Oblivion of Fallout 3, but since the levels in game are quite narrow with a ceiling at quite low level (the levels meant to be claustrophobic), it's almost no use (especially when you can use objects to simply get through walls).

Whats AHK ?
Yeah the maps are very cramped. I also noticed that with the barrels it's possible to jump on them while they roll to do a very high jump. I haven't looked into it that much though since I don't know where it would be useful Smiley

Quote from Apjjm:

Any tips for performing the physics glitch? I spent some time trying to do it the other day and was probably doing it wrong.

Right now, the only thing you need is patience Smiley

I haven't found out what causes the glitch so I don't know how to consistently reproduce it. It can be extremely frustrating to reload a save until it occurs. So unfortunately my tip right now is to reload until it happens.

Quote from Apjjm:

I am almost 100% sure I know what causes the save glitch, though. If you have ever dabbled in physics engine programming, there is a vector quantity you get from collision detection which defines the direction & distance needed to separate two objects in the minimal "push". Normally in Amnesia, when you are inside a grabbed object, the object ignores collisions with the player. However, for some reason when the game loads a save, you are both pushed apart by this vector to resolve the collision. This collision resolution is applied after collision detection, hence this allows you to skip through thin objects (or inside thicker objects). Knowing this makes it a little easier to predict and manipulate how and where you get pushed.

Perhaps your save-glitch and the physics glitch are related somehow. Since the physics-glitch causes the player to be pushed by objects instead of the other way around. At the moment when the game is loaded the physics might be in this odd state, and sometimes it does not go into the correct state which might cause the physics glitch to occur. Just a thought Smiley

I've played around with the save-glitch and actually managed to do it in Nave to get through the locked doors. From my short experience though it is a bit difficult to get it to work against flat surfaces (like doors). When I tried it I usually got pushed to the left or right of the object so I think it is much easier to perform the glitch in corners. To do it with the doors in Nave I used a chair (coming from the Choir) and had to let it go slightly before saving and exiting, so there is open space between the door and the chair. I might be doing it wrong still though Smiley

It is faster with the save-glitch than the physics glitch though.

Quote from Sid:

I would be interested.

Here you go Smiley

Nice ! Looking forward to your runs ! :)

[quote="Sid"]I also have been playing with AHK and scripts a little - wrote something, that barely works, but there seems to be a way to fly using objects, in similar way like in HL2, Oblivion of Fallout 3, but since the levels in game are quite narrow with a ceiling at quite low level (the levels meant to be claustrophobic), it's almost no use (especially when you can use objects to simply get through walls).
[/quote]
Whats AHK ?
Yeah the maps are very cramped. I also noticed that with the barrels it's possible to jump on them while they roll to do a very high jump. I haven't looked into it that much though since I don't know where it would be useful :)

[quote="Apjjm"]Any tips for performing the physics glitch? I spent some time trying to do it the other day and was probably doing it wrong.
[/quote]
Right now, the only thing you need is patience :) I haven't found out what causes the glitch so I don't know how to consistently reproduce it. It can be extremely frustrating to reload a save until it occurs. So unfortunately my tip right now is to reload until it happens.

[quote="Apjjm"]I am almost 100% sure I know what causes the save glitch, though. If you have ever dabbled in physics engine programming, there is a vector quantity you get from collision detection which defines the direction & distance needed to separate two objects in the minimal "push". Normally in Amnesia, when you are inside a grabbed object, the object ignores collisions with the player. However, for some reason when the game loads a save, you are both pushed apart by this vector to resolve the collision. This collision resolution is applied after collision detection, hence this allows you to skip through thin objects (or inside thicker objects). Knowing this makes it a little easier to predict and manipulate how and where you get pushed.
[/quote]

Perhaps your save-glitch and the physics glitch are related somehow. Since the physics-glitch causes the player to be pushed by objects instead of the other way around. At the moment when the game is loaded the physics might be in this odd state, and sometimes it does not go into the correct state which might cause the physics glitch to occur. Just a thought :)

I've played around with the save-glitch and actually managed to do it in Nave to get through the locked doors. From my short experience though it is a bit difficult to get it to work against flat surfaces (like doors). When I tried it I usually got pushed to the left or right of the object so I think it is much easier to perform the glitch in corners. To do it with the doors in Nave I used a chair (coming from the Choir) and had to let it go slightly before saving and exiting, so there is open space between the door and the chair. I might be doing it wrong still though :) 
It is faster with the save-glitch than the physics glitch though.

[quote="Sid"]I would be interested.
[/quote]

Here you go :)

Sid

2011-02-03 03:14:01 pm

Now it's Sui^^

Quote from phantasy:

Whats AHK ?

AutoHotKey... I'm not sure, if it's still allowed at SDA, but it doesn't matter now - this was just for experimental purpose.

ShadowWraith

2011-02-04 02:37:41 am

.

It's not allowed at SDA.

Sid

2011-02-04 08:34:47 am

Now it's Sui^^

Quote from ShadowWraith:

It's not allowed at SDA.

I'm pretty sure, the guys from HL2DQ used it Wink

But let's not dig up this case right now Wink

weawer

2011-03-01 07:57:42 pm

Hello there pretty new to speedrunning but i am interested to pick this game up and do a single segment of it

Apjjm

Edit history:

Apjjm: 2011-03-13 08:47:06 pm

Apjjm: 2011-03-13 06:39:37 pm

2011-03-13 06:35:35 pm

What?

Some progress! Now have a run up to the back hall.

Will be re-doing some of the earlier segments at a later date (The entrance hall, for getting caught on that brick, and the refinery because it could be smoother). But hey, a good start at least. Going to clear out the back-hall & prison area in the next video (not looking forward to the machine room or end-of-storage segment, not at all). These sections also have some new routes and glitches.

@weawer
If you are looking into doing a single segment, i'd certainly be interested in seeing it, I can imagine the sewer being a headache area though.

phantasy

2011-03-14 12:46:43 am

Awesome ! That was some very nice tricks you've found Smiley

I look forward to see the next segments !

weawer

2011-03-14 04:35:40 am

since you can skip most of the sewers i cant imagine that being to much of an annoyance, there are three things im not looking forward to the dark place where you have to get the trinity rods, the jail (second part becouse of all the monster dodging you have to do) and the choir

weawer

Edit history:

weawer: 2011-03-14 04:56:31 am

2011-03-14 04:47:20 am

watching your first part a question arises from me what exactly are you allowed to do in a single segment run? you are not allowed to access the menu and save/load are you?(even if a trick depends on it)
also in the end what are you doing with the barrels?

Apjjm

2011-03-14 07:14:38 am

What?

You can't save & re-load unless it is absolutely required to progress, as far as i am aware. The barrel trick is insanely difficult, to do it i perform multiple jumps in rapid succession to "boost" of the barrels (kind of like you can do with the wooden posts and certain walls), just throwing the barrel and getting it to land in the right place is difficult to do quickly in any sort of fluid motion. The reason why i say the sewers are difficult, is because navigating the OOB area there is quite tricky, and usually ends up with a long fall.

In other news though - found a way to not kill yourself after doing the skip in the nave :).