Turok 2 hard mode speed run

2011-04-20 08:07:41 am

Thanks for the reminder, where possible I'll try to use the map instead of my character's eyes and look at the floor.

2011-04-20 12:25:59 pm

Well I just did Port of adia again this time segmented. Can't even remember how many saves I used lol, but i think it was 5. Pretty much blitzed every segment. Nothing went majorly wrong in any of them. I strafe constantly and cut corners but don't quite have the same speed as ewil's run but even if i did my time wouldn't match his time due to it being a harder difficulty and some enemies are hard to kill in one shot. Only my totem this time was a little crappy. I also still got that full health near the end. Not the one right before the end portal but the one before that. I think without it I'd certainly die, or lose time being careful not trying to get hit with low health either way. That's probably about 7 seconds slower than Ewils run right there getting that full health. My time 13:56, which I'm pretty proud of :D. Time for the same treatment to level 3. This should be fun :P....

Squeebles

2011-04-21 06:10:48 am

Nicely done, I certainly look forward to seeing the finished product ^u^ Also, considering the difference in enemy health and damage I'd call 13:56 a magnificent accomplishment!

giganotabehemoth87

2011-04-21 07:04:24 am

Thanks man !. I'm still not recording just yet, it's still a serious test run. It was a good time but it was still not quite the perfection I was aiming for. I found you can't actually save in the totem place itself (which was an obvious decision by the developers) You have to save just before the portal. I didn't save before the totem for some reason which is why my totem was crap. Well I've learned my lesson and when I do the actual recording I'll certainly aim to sub 13:50, maybe even try and sub 13:40. Which might only be possible if I skip that aforementioned full health. When I was doing that segment I was sure that, if I kept my health really good throughout the level, I could hopefully stay alive till the end without getting the full health, and just nab that very last full health before the totem portal when my health is seriously low. I'm sure It's possible anyway. So 13:3x would be the goal in the future for a recorded attempt.

Ewil

2011-04-21 07:24:19 am

Definitely segment totem, they're the most random places in entire game.

giganotabehemoth87

Edit history:

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-21 09:14:54 am

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-21 09:06:03 am

2011-04-21 09:02:48 am

Well I just did level 3 segmented. I was able to do it quickly because I had practiced it a lot on the single segment attempts. All went extremely good. I made the totem a segment and holy shit did it make a difference. I used my strategy on this totem to snipe with the pistol from the top of the slope as the gunners jump down into their building. The auto aim aims for their head so well and not one gunner had a chance and was dead as soon as they emerged. I thoroughly recommend this strategy. My time at the Hub is, 26:23. If I segmented the first level totem and cleaned up a few areas in the level, including skipping that full health, I think I could sub 26 by this point.

So anyway I'm about 1 minute, 24 seconds faster than my single segment levels run, which was 27:47 at this point.

giganotabehemoth87

Edit history:

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-23 04:09:24 am

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-22 06:01:43 pm

2011-04-22 05:59:47 pm

I've found a shortcut in level 2. Pretty good one this !. After getting the leap of faith talisman, Instead of going all the way round to drop down onto the area that takes you to the Primagen key. You can in fact jump across to that area right from the place where the talisman portal sits. It's really tricky however and needs to be a strafe jump. You see where the main road from the talisman portal dips into the water to the end of the level ? well walk along the left hand side brick section and position yourself so you are just past the pillar supporting the roof. Now get into strafe position and jump and move forward strafing, you have to land just on the very edge of the curved part of the wall, when you do, immediately hit jump again (still strafing) and you can land in the primagen key area. I would Probably put a save point coming out of the talisman portal just to do this. I think it would save around 20 - 30 seconds as a very rough estimate.

In the mean time I'll be looking for more shortcuts Tongue

[edit] tested it and it saves pretty much a dead on 20 seconds.

I've found a shortcut in level 2. Pretty good one this !. After getting the leap of faith talisman, Instead of going all the way round to drop down onto the area that takes you to the Primagen key. You can in fact jump across to that area right from the place where the talisman portal sits. It's really tricky however and needs to be a strafe jump. You see where the main road from the talisman portal dips into the water to the end of the level ? well walk along the left hand side brick section and position yourself so you are just past the pillar supporting the roof. Now get into strafe position and jump and move forward strafing, you have to land just on the very edge of the curved part of the wall, when you do, immediately hit jump again (still strafing) and you can land in the primagen key area. I would Probably put a save point coming out of the talisman portal just to do this. I think it would save around 20 - 30 seconds as a very rough estimate.

In the mean time I'll be looking for more shortcuts :P

[edit] tested it and it saves pretty much a dead on 20 seconds.

Squeebles

2011-04-23 06:30:40 am

Man, absolutely brilliant! If anyone's going to completely crack Turok 2 I'm sure it'll be you ^o^b

giganotabehemoth87

Edit history:

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-24 03:11:14 pm

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-24 12:55:55 pm

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-24 12:49:33 pm

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-24 12:43:51 pm

2011-04-24 12:07:10 pm

Hehe, thanks a lot !

Just to correct myself on something earlier, the pillar you have to stand in front of is actually a torch pillar, not a roof support one. You'll know what I mean when you see it. I've also found out that the trick itself can even be done without strafing, so it should be possible on N64. It's cool how the downward curved edge of the wall gives you added propulsion when you jump from it. But that doesn't mean you can simply stand on the curve and jump from it to reach the area, as you still need to necessary speed and 'bounce' effect from the first jump.

[EDIT] I've now just found out how to get the fast running glitch coming out of water every time. You have to be positioned underwater but just below the surface, aim towards the surface and do a double tap and hold to swim fast. your head should come out of the water just after the 2nd tap and you should be holding forward after that tap. Now jump out and you should have the glitch. Also the the glitch doesn't cancel when you let go of forward after this point when your on land. Pressing back does though (I think).

I've been messing around in the 3rd sister of despair area and using the river of soul water to speed the last part of it up considerably. At the part where you need to flick the switches either side of the gate to open the two houses doors. well as you go to flick the first switch, jump into the water near the ladder and do the fast walk glitch and come out the water using the ladder, flick the switch. Now with your added speed you can get to the switch on the other side via simple hop across to the platform where the gate is, and hop again to reach the switch. Pretty nifty trick huh ?. From there you can have more speed going to and from the houses that have the guarded keys, fast run back to the bridge, insert keys, stand on the bridge by letting go of forward (don't press backwards), snipe the sister. And now you can take the usually lengthy walk back to the portal in much less time thanks to the glitch also :P.

I'm starting to see the potential of this glitch to use it every time you exit water in the levels ahead. So far levels 1 and 3 don't have any water you need to go through, but level 2, 4, 5 and 6 do, and on lot's of occasions throughout those levels., and not to mention, with added speed comes a greater jumping distance, so much more shortcuts might be found, small ones or very large ones. This is pretty big breakthrough I feel and could possibly drastically shorten the games run length.

Hehe, thanks a lot !

Just to correct myself on something earlier, the pillar you have to stand in front of is actually a torch pillar, not a roof support one. You'll know what I mean when you see it. I've also found out that the trick itself can even be done without strafing, so it should be possible on N64. It's cool how the downward curved edge of the wall gives you added propulsion when you jump from it. But that doesn't mean you can simply stand on the curve and jump from it to reach the area, as you still need to necessary speed and 'bounce' effect from the first jump.

[EDIT] I've now just found out how to get the fast running glitch coming out of water every time. You have to be positioned underwater but just below the surface, aim towards the surface and do a double tap and hold to swim fast. your head should come out of the water just after the 2nd tap and you should be holding forward after that tap. Now jump out and you should have the glitch. Also the the glitch doesn't cancel when you let go of forward after this point when your on land. Pressing back does though (I think).

I've been messing around in the 3rd sister of despair area and using the river of soul water to speed the last part of it up considerably. At the part where you need to flick the switches either side of the gate to open the two houses doors. well as you go to flick the first switch, jump into the water near the ladder and do the fast walk glitch and come out the water using the ladder, flick the switch. Now with your added speed you can get to the switch on the other side via simple hop across to the platform where the gate is, and hop again to reach the switch. Pretty nifty trick huh ?. From there you can have more speed going to and from the houses that have the guarded keys, fast run back to the bridge, insert keys, stand on the bridge by letting go of forward (don't press backwards), snipe the sister. And now you can take the usually lengthy walk back to the portal in much less time thanks to the glitch also :P.

I'm starting to see the potential of this glitch to use it every time you exit water in the levels ahead. So far levels 1 and 3 don't have any water you need to go through, but level 2, 4, 5 and 6 do, and on lot's of occasions throughout those levels., and not to mention, with added speed comes a greater jumping distance, so much more shortcuts might be found, small ones or very large ones. This is pretty big breakthrough I feel and could possibly drastically shorten the games run length.

Squeebles

2011-04-25 04:49:12 am

Man, that's some brilliant stuff there! I hadn't even considered the possibility of 'manufacturing' that water boost before- Congratulations on the discovery!

giganotabehemoth87

Edit history:

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-25 08:27:01 am

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-25 07:58:19 am

2011-04-25 07:36:25 am

You could actually use the water right at the start of level 1 to speed up the first beacon section, and keep the glitch going all the way to the first portal. That could ensure a sub 13 time no doubt. I'll test this out. Although I wouldn't blame Ewil for not wanting to do the level again just to save around 5 to 10 seconds via this glitch.

[edit] yep you can speed up the first area by around 5 - 7 seconds. You have to jump straight in the water as soon as you start, and use the little concrete slope to climb out. With the extra speed you can jump through the tunnels without touching down on the ground linking them and you can jump to the ladder from the 2nd tunnel too. It's noticeably much faster.

[edit 2] ahhh, there's a second pool of water in the main hall section just further on. You could use that to speed the first child rescuing section up. That would speed the level up considerably since the child is well out the way and you need to come back to get to the portal. Then further on at the 2nd and 3rd beacon section are more pools of water. Particularly the 3rd beacon area would benefit most, since you need to carry on, grabbing the shotgun, flick the switch, come down and rescue the 2nd child and back to the portal. Bloody hell, at this rate it might be possible to sub 12 minutes on this level but we'll see.

You could actually use the water right at the start of level 1 to speed up the first beacon section, and keep the glitch going all the way to the first portal. That could ensure a sub 13 time no doubt. I'll test this out. Although I wouldn't blame Ewil for not wanting to do the level again just to save around 5 to 10 seconds via this glitch.

[edit] yep you can speed up the first area by around 5 - 7 seconds. You have to jump straight in the water as soon as you start, and use the little concrete slope to climb out. With the extra speed you can jump through the tunnels without touching down on the ground linking them and you can jump to the ladder from the 2nd tunnel too. It's noticeably much faster.

[edit 2] ahhh, there's a second pool of water in the main hall section just further on. You could use that to speed the first child rescuing section up. That would speed the level up considerably since the child is well out the way and you need to come back to get to the portal. Then further on at the 2nd and 3rd beacon section are more pools of water. Particularly the 3rd beacon area would benefit most, since you need to carry on, grabbing the shotgun, flick the switch, come down and rescue the 2nd child and back to the portal. Bloody hell, at this rate it might be possible to sub 12 minutes on this level but we'll see.

Squeebles

2011-04-25 11:04:24 am

Man, absolutely brilliant! This also makes me wonder if there are signifigant jumping tricks that can be done involving the water boost. Also, just an odd thought that I'd been pondering but never fully developed- In the Death Marshes there's a guard tower near the portion of river that leads to the Primagen key, and I know from using a gameshark levitation code that if you're high enough in the air you just jump over the wood gate that stops you from getting in. Would you be interested in testing for some kind of glitch to follow the wall behind the guard tower to jump down and over the gate? I've tried a little but I always seem to get stuck and fall down just a little ways forward. If there was some way to make this work without a cheat code you could effectively grab the Primagen key before getting the Breath of Life talisman and avoid several minutes of backtracking, all you'd have to do is jump back in the water after grabbing the key and death warp out. This is all quite theoretical though, I'm really not sure if it's possible to get within range...

Man, absolutely brilliant!  This also makes me wonder if there are signifigant jumping tricks that can be done involving the water boost.  Also, just an odd thought that I'd been pondering but never fully developed- In the Death Marshes there's a guard tower near the portion of river that leads to the Primagen key, and I know from using a gameshark levitation code that if you're high enough in the air you just jump over the wood gate that stops you from getting in.  Would you be interested in testing for some kind of glitch to follow the wall behind the guard tower to jump down and over the gate?  I've tried a little but I always seem to get stuck and fall down just a little ways forward.  If there was some way to make this work without a cheat code you could effectively grab the Primagen key before getting the Breath of Life talisman and avoid several minutes of backtracking, all you'd have to do is jump back in the water after grabbing the key and death warp out.  This is all quite theoretical though, I'm really not sure if it's possible to get within range...

giganotabehemoth87

Edit history:

giganotabehemoth87: 2011-04-26 07:25:12 am

2011-04-25 02:54:50 pm

yeah I just tried it and I think I know the bit you mean. I think we tried doing this ages ago on the N64. It seems the developers consciously put very crafty invisible barriers all over the place on all points of possible access. You can't get round the boulder that sits on the edge no matter how hard I tried. I even tried a jump from the tower onto the thin piece of the building wall and walking along it and doing a curved jump to get onto the next line of wall and drop down into the small area past the boulder, which should be close enough to jump onto the fence. But they put a invisible barricade when I tried get onto the next piece of wall. I'm surprised that the gate itself doesn't stop you from jumping onto it. It's almost like they are teasing us.

There's one last pool of water that speeds up the Port of Adia considerably and that is the area where there is a key behind the waterfall guarded by an Endtrail. Jump into the pool as soon as you get there and use the speed going to the switch to open the door behind the waterfall, grabbing the key, running back up and round to the next portal. I tested it earlier and this is by far the biggest and best one and it saves around 20 seconds. I don't quite think sub 12 minutes on this level is feasible yet. All the water boosts combined total to around 40 seconds saved on this level. So you could be looking at a time of around 12:2x for perfect play.

yeah I just tried it and I think I know the bit you mean. I think we tried doing this ages ago on the N64. It seems the developers consciously put very crafty invisible barriers all over the place on all points of possible access. You can't get round the boulder that sits on the edge no matter how hard I tried. I even tried a jump from the tower onto the thin piece of the building wall and walking along it and doing a curved jump to get onto the next line of wall and drop down into the small area past the boulder, which should be close enough to jump onto the fence. But they put a invisible barricade when I tried get onto the next piece of wall. I'm surprised that the gate itself doesn't stop you from jumping onto it. It's almost like they are teasing us.

There's one last pool of water that speeds up the Port of Adia considerably and that is the area where there is a key behind the waterfall guarded by an Endtrail. Jump into the pool as soon as you get there and use the speed going to the switch to open the door behind the waterfall, grabbing the key, running back up and round to the next portal. I tested it earlier and this is by far the biggest and best one and it saves around 20 seconds. I don't quite think sub 12 minutes on this level is feasible yet. All the water boosts combined total to around 40 seconds saved on this level. So you could be looking at a time of around 12:2x for perfect play.

Squeebles

Edit history:

Squeebles: 2011-04-25 04:09:02 pm

2011-04-25 04:06:12 pm

Ah yes, sorry to hear it. I guess the developers were a little more crafty than they first appeared. Excellent advice on the water jumping too, thanks for the tip!

Ewil

2011-04-26 10:18:38 pm

A water jumping ? Cool.

giganotabehemoth87

2011-05-12 11:45:49 am

Sorry for my absence as of late, I'm a little preoccupied with a few things. My main speed run game (Super Metroid) is prioritized right now. I could have a decent run of that game in a couple of weeks, a month or two months... who knows. Once it's done I'll surely get back to work finishing off level 2 so I can start level 5. I'm sort of dreading it, namely Mantids shooting the living crap out of me at every turn making it frustrating to enjoy optimizing it.

Have you thought about doing Port of Adia again Ewil ? You can shave at least 40 seconds off your time using all the water boost tricks throughout the level. I guess sub 13 is possible after all Tongue

Ewil

2011-05-13 01:37:41 am

No, not really. I don't even know how the water boost works Smiley

giganotabehemoth87

2011-05-13 07:59:41 am

It only works in water that you can swim in. Go underwater but just under the surface and look up, preferably a 45 degree angle. Now double tap forward and hold so Turok swims fast but then reaches the surface quickly. Keep holding forward the whole time and jump out of the water, use ladder or whatever there is to get out and you have the fast speed. It's effectiveness in any given area varies from the amount of distance you have to travel in those areas. The best area that this trick works is the area with the houses and the key behind the waterfall. Just jump into the water, do the water boost and use it's speed to go and activate the switch to open the wall behind the waterfall and grab the key, and keep the speed going all the way back up and round to the next portal. This one saves around 20 seconds alone !

Ok, when I do my hard mode run I think it might be possible to sub 13 minutes using all the water boosts, so I'll certainly aim for that.

Level 3 though I'm pretty sure doesn't have any water boost possibilities. That's because all the water there is soul water and you get the talisman too far into the level where there isn't any water left. Only on the backtrack much later in the game to get the primagen key will any water boosts come into play.

It only works in water that you can swim in. Go underwater but just under the surface and look up, preferably a 45 degree angle. Now double tap forward and hold so Turok swims fast but then reaches the surface quickly. Keep holding forward the whole time and jump out of the water, use ladder or whatever there is to get out and you have the fast speed. It's effectiveness in any given area varies from the amount of distance you have to travel in those areas. The best area that this trick works is the area with the houses and the key behind the waterfall. Just jump into the water, do the water boost and use it's speed to go and activate the switch to open the wall behind the waterfall and grab the key, and keep the speed going all the way back up and round to the next portal. This one saves around 20 seconds alone !

Ok, when I do my hard mode run I think it might be possible to sub 13 minutes using all the water boosts, so I'll certainly aim for that.

Level 3 though I'm pretty sure doesn't have any water boost possibilities. That's because all the water there is soul water and you get the talisman too far into the level where there isn't any water left. Only on the backtrack much later in the game to get the primagen key will any water boosts come into play.

Squeebles

2011-06-07 02:29:57 am

Hm, thought I might as well add a bit of advice to this thread so here it goes- On the Mother and Primagen boss fights I am now certain that you should only use explosive shredder shells against their head- Their unusual body types and the projectile's poor hit detection almost always result in a hit somewhere else than the vulnerable area- Which doesn't count for much of anything. In terms of route planning, I'm absolutely certain that it's better to get Primagen keys 1 and 3 as soon as possible to avoid extra walking from one end of the world hub to the other. Also the razor wind can be substituted for a great deal of other ammo after you get it: For most cases against normal enemies you can just throw it first(any hit on the body is good) and then switch weapons. Looking at the boss health meter for the Primagen I've noticed that the weapon does twice the damage of an explosive shredder shell- I'd go so far as to say that it should be considered a priority to learn how to use the razor wind if you don't have a plan to arrive at the Primagen with full ammo, and it also does the fastest damage I've seen to the first round Mother boss.

Hm, thought I might as well add a bit of advice to this thread so here it goes- On the Mother and Primagen boss fights I am now certain that you should only use explosive shredder shells against their head- Their unusual body types and the projectile's poor hit detection almost always result in a hit somewhere else than the vulnerable area- Which doesn't count for much of anything.  In terms of route planning, I'm absolutely certain that it's better to get Primagen keys 1 and 3 as soon as possible to avoid extra walking from one end of the world hub to the other.  Also the razor wind can be substituted for a great deal of other ammo after you get it: For most cases against normal enemies you can just throw it first(any hit on the body is good) and then switch weapons.  Looking at the boss health meter for the Primagen I've noticed that the weapon does twice the damage of an explosive shredder shell- I'd go so far as to say that it should be considered a priority to learn how to use the razor wind if you don't have a plan to arrive at the Primagen with full ammo, and it also does the fastest damage I've seen to the first round Mother boss.

giganotabehemoth87

2011-06-07 07:08:35 am

I remember messing around with razor wind back in the day and being shocked at it's strength. Using it on the mother boss myself at her head was a lot of fun. But being on hard mode certain enemies might withstand one throw from it so it could be risky but who knows. I'll give it a bash.

Man when I return to this game I'm going to have to do a whole revision of this thread to make sure I haven't missed anything. What a wealth of knowledge here :P.

Squeebles

2011-06-07 02:49:47 pm

I know what you mean, and when it doesn't get 'em as a main weapon it's very easy to get discouraged from making regular use of it- Just remember that the point of the weapon is that you start the attack with it and immediately switch to the next weapon after it's airborne. I find that with weapon select on 'quick' this becomes a much easier move to pull off. Not sure how the PC weapon select is done though...

giganotabehemoth87

2011-06-07 04:51:40 pm

Yeah I just cycle through using the wheel on the mouse using my index finger. Should be fast enough to switch to something efficient without getting hurt myself.

Exo

2011-06-08 03:02:04 am

Sandbagging

Using the number keys should make it more efficient. Not sure how Turok handles key configs but you could just set the weapon slots to keys closer to wsad or even on your mouse buttons.

P.S.: I demand some route test videos Tongue

giganotabehemoth87

2011-06-08 07:28:04 am

Yeah I completely forgot you can assign weapons to keys. I've just put shredder, Firestorm cannon and charge dart on the 3 keys above the W,S,A and D. Which are probably the most useful weapons in the game that I use all the time.

Test videos: That won't be for a while I'm afraid. I gotta nail this Super Metroid run then I'll make some headway on it. I hate juggling lots of different things at once

Squeebles

2011-06-10 09:08:35 am

Two more quick tips; After getting the Primagen Key from the Hive it's possible to get back without dying, but you need to diagonal jump from the closest and highest point from the bridge to the ledge. I had to see the bridge after getting the Eye of Truth to figure out that it might be high enough. Second, in the Primagen's lightship the best weapon to kill the wheel robots with(after the charge dart blast of course) is the plasma rifle- Since it's officially an explosive hit the wheel robots have to do one of their two fast death animations, rather than having a chance at wasting a solid 8 seconds waiting for their normal animation to finish and reveal the ammo pickup.