Tomb Raider 3 run (complete)

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-31 11:25:58 am

2005-08-14 08:30:33 pm

While I haven't got my megadrive ready to record the Probotector and Alien soldier runs I wanted a run I could do on the computer, so I went for this game, which has always seemed like a prime choice for speedrunning for me, and it has a clock that tells you your finishing time. I could do TR2 but I don't really feel like it currently, plus I don't want to face the giant Spider bit Smiley

.

There is a problem however, as I can only record the game at more than 25 fps with Fraps if I set the game in software at 320x200 (I think) resolution (the game runs at 60+ in high resolution and full settings on D3D normally, but recording seems to self destruct that at anything above minimum settings). Luckily the current videos I have tried look quite a bit better than in game (major pixellation seems to be absent) when I watched them, so it's not too big a problem (although it has some implications on the run, as gaps etc are harder to judge with such terrible pixellation).

There seem to be some corrupt audio files on the game CD, so I may have to turn sound off on a level or two that uses the corrupt songs (hopefully it won't be an issue).

I have compressed a practice run of the first level (1:32, the twin galaxies record is apparently 1:17) and uploaded it to archive.org so the video quality can be judged (whether the quality is acceptable for here), but it is not up yet (I'll link when it is).

I may split a few of the very hard and long levels into multiple segments, but it depends how hard I actually find them (there might be easy ways past most of the difficult parts).

Thread title:

While I haven't got my megadrive ready to record the Probotector and Alien soldier runs I wanted a run I could do on the computer, so I went for this game, which has always seemed like a prime choice for speedrunning for me, and it has a clock that tells you your finishing time. I could do TR2 but I don't really feel like it currently, plus I don't want to face the giant Spider bit :) .

There is a problem however, as I can only record the game at more than 25 fps with Fraps if I set the game in software at 320x200 (I think) resolution (the game runs at 60+ in high resolution and full settings on D3D normally, but recording seems to self destruct that at anything above minimum settings). Luckily the current videos I have tried look quite a bit better than in game (major pixellation seems to be absent) when I watched them, so it's not too big a problem (although it has some implications on the run, as gaps etc are harder to judge with such terrible pixellation).

There seem to be some corrupt audio files on the game CD, so I may have to turn sound off on a level or two that uses the corrupt songs (hopefully it won't be an issue).

I have compressed a practice run of the first level (1:32, the twin galaxies record is apparently 1:17) and uploaded it to archive.org so the video quality can be judged (whether the quality is acceptable for here), but it is not up yet (I'll link when it is).

I may split a few of the very hard and long levels into multiple segments, but it depends how hard I actually find them (there might be easy ways past most of the difficult parts).

xeen

2005-08-14 09:09:41 pm

why don't you just mute the music, if I remember right it should work without problems. Alternatively you can try to either record with another pc or try to use a vcr. WEll lets see for the quality first, we can judge afterwards Smiley

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-14 09:50:39 pm

2005-08-14 09:49:34 pm

Music isn't an issue, as I've just found out that if the game encounters a corrupt music track it just stops playing music altogether (with no other repercussions), so it's not a problem. I'm not disabling it altogether though, as I like listening to it while I play Smiley

.

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-15 02:12:07 pm

2005-08-15 12:04:50 pm

The run is up

http://www.archive.org/details/ShaunFriendTombRaider3level1speedrunJungle

The page name is pretty long winded; it seems to have appended some of the other details I entered into it Smiley

.

Edit: I tried it and it works, so you can watch it in all its "glory" (it kind of breaks down as it goes along Tongue

).

xeen

2005-08-15 02:28:36 pm

The videos sound is quite low, however, that should be easy fixable using VirtualDub. The video quality is ok, the only thing that looks a little odd is the pixlated Lara, however, the elvel itself is quite normal, the game hasn't that high-res textures anyway Smiley

I guess you're good to go, the first level was impressive. Nice work.

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-15 02:49:18 pm

2005-08-15 02:41:57 pm

I thought the sound was a little low, but as you said it is easily fixable.

Another issue is should the final time be what the game tells you at the end, or the finishing times of each level totalled up?

Using the final time would be a run where I do each level one at a time and do not go back. While using the separate times means I can come back later in the run and improve a level if I don't like the time I got (but didn't feel like improving it at the time). I'd probably prefer separate times, as it gives me more flexibility.

Another thing I should mention is that if someone uses the playstation version to try and beat my run it should be a separate category, as the playstation version is quite a bit tougher speedwise:

1. "Save" crystals do not heal you (and cure poison)
2. Weapons and medikits can be hotkeyed in the PC version (you do not need to enter the inventory).
3. The playstation version has FPS issues which make some jumps harder.

Then again, if someone beat ALL my times on a PS that wouldn't matter Smiley

.

The only other problem is that while dashing and crawling I cannot go left (right works fine) without releasing a key first. This is shown in the video as when I try to dash left after getting the key I crash into the wall as turning is so hard. I guess that's a benefit playstation players have Smiley

.

I thought the sound was a little low, but as you said it is easily fixable.

Another issue is should the final time be what the game tells you at the end, or the finishing times of each level totalled up?

Using the final time would be a run where I do each level one at a time and do not go back. While using the separate times means I can come back later in the run and improve a level if I don't like the time I got (but didn't feel like improving it at the time). I'd probably prefer separate times, as it gives me more flexibility.

Another thing I should mention is that if someone uses the playstation version to try and beat my run it should be a separate category, as the playstation version is quite a bit tougher speedwise:

1. "Save" crystals do not heal you (and cure poison)
2. Weapons and medikits can be hotkeyed in the PC version (you do not need to enter the inventory).
3. The playstation version has FPS issues which make some jumps harder.

Then again, if someone beat ALL my times on a PS that wouldn't matter :) .

The only other problem is that while dashing and crawling I cannot go left (right works fine) without releasing a key first. This is shown in the video as when I try to dash left after getting the key I crash into the wall as turning is so hard. I guess that's a benefit playstation players have :) .

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-16 02:21:25 pm

2005-08-16 01:59:26 pm

I just did my first "true" run of level 1: 1:36. However, I take a detour to get the shotgun.

I just realised that individual levels would be kind of dumb because it would be WAY too hard to verify. Therefore I will do each level one at a time and not go back (I'm pretty happy with level 1 anyway for now).

The only thing is that that means that I lose a few seconds saving at the start of each new level (and I have to remember to!).

Edit: Bah, I just remembered that I have to record the saving. Time for another run of that level I guess.

Edit2: Lol, this new run is 1:36 anyway. I did slip up once on the shortcut jump in both these runs, so if I did that I could probably have got a better or even time AND got the shotgun to, but I'm happy with the rest of it so I'll leave it as it is.

MMAN

2005-08-16 04:40:09 pm

Ffs! I got 99% of the way through Temple ruins and was putting the last keys in and it crashed Angry

. I've installed a patch now which hopefully fixes it, but as I can't load temple ruins with it I'll probably have to start yet again. Although I get the feeling that my lost artefact version already came with the patch (the new exe was the same size).

I might have to segment big levels out of necessity, but hopefully it was a one-off.

xeen

2005-08-16 05:08:15 pm

So you're going to do a segmented, but continious run? Well, then it's probably a good ideato also grab the med kits in the first level - I can remember there's one on the tree crossing your slide down, one on that thing where the stone rolls at you if you pick it up and the ape if you slided down gives you one if you kill him, however, I do not know if sliding down all the way makes you loose a shortcut, where you jump to that saving point.
As far as I can remember med kits are fewer on later levels an dif there are, they're far away from the route - at least from the one I took. However, I'm not sure whether your helath is reset on each level load or if there're enough save points - but it might be worth to loose a little time in the first levels and therefore save even more in the later levels.

Well. I don't remember the levels exactly nor do I know about good shortcuts, but well, I think you're going to do it quite well.

Keep us up to date Smiley

(And please don't stop just in the middle of the game, like the Far Cry and Thief3)

I hope your game won't crash the next time (I know how this sucks, just did one thing really good and then... you're stuck or something else happens... or that you're not recording :()
xeen
ps: be VERY VERY careful with saving. It's not the first time I lost my latest save due the crappy save function.

So you're going to do a segmented, but continious run? Well, then it's probably a good ideato also grab the med kits in the first level - I can remember there's one on the tree crossing your slide down, one on that thing where the stone rolls at you if you pick it up and the ape if you slided down gives you one if you kill him, however, I do not know if sliding down all the way makes you loose a shortcut, where you jump to that saving point. 
As far as I can remember med kits are fewer on later levels an dif there are, they're far away from the route - at least from the one I took. However, I'm not sure whether your helath is reset on each level load or if there're enough save points - but it might be worth to loose a little time in the first levels and therefore save even more in the later levels.

Well. I don't remember the levels exactly nor do I know about good shortcuts, but well, I think you're going to do it quite well.

Keep us up to date :) (And please don't stop just in the middle of the game, like the Far Cry and Thief3)

I hope your game won't crash the next time (I know how this sucks, just did one thing really good and then... you're stuck or something else happens... or that you're not recording :()
xeen
ps: be VERY VERY careful with saving. It's not the first time I lost my latest save due the crappy save function.

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-16 05:24:15 pm

2005-08-16 05:22:45 pm

I did Temple ruins this time, there are a couple of mistakes and health wise it was quite bad as I got poisoned and also had to use a medikit (the first time I've had to while running this level), but it didn't lose me too much time. Although at one point I killed monkeys to get a medikit as an "experiment" in having some more health, but then as I used it later it was a waste. The time was 17:49.

The game does randomly crash after a save sometimes, but luckily the save itself still works after the crash. It happens when I save after the temple ruins (which means the video cuts out as soon as the save completes, so it was sort of convenient Smiley

).

From a test run I will use the High security complex (obviously I will do Nevade first) to start supplying myself for the rest of the game, as that is after I lose my stuff after being captured, and also has at least a couple of medikits right along the path.

xeen

2005-08-16 05:40:16 pm

wait, you can choose in which order you want to solve the levels, or did I somehow misunderstand your last paragraph?!

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-17 12:55:07 am

2005-08-17 12:47:54 am

Quote:

wait, you can choose in which order you want to solve the levels, or did I somehow misunderstand your last paragraph?!

Yes, you can choose between three places. Nevada is always the first choice as you lose most of your stuff there. Then the order can be either of the other two. But I will go with London then the South pacific, as the south pacific is the most difficult navigation (in terms of jumping) and combat wise IMO .

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-17 05:17:11 pm

2005-08-17 03:44:28 pm

Ok, I've got India done. Looking at it, I realise the Temple Ruins run was pretty bad, but I get most of the important stuff right, and if this is a low point that means my run can only get better Smiley

. The other levels are fine.

my times are:

Jungle: 1:36
Temple Ruins: 17:49
River Ganges: 3:36
Caves of Kaliya: 2:15

Temple ruins is the only one I am dissapointed with in hindsight, I could probably have shaved a minute or two off that time in the route I took. Mistakes in the others are pretty small, although getting stuck in River Ganges probably cost me 20 seconds or so, but the Quad bike collision can be difficult. I could have killed the boss quick by jumping to the platform he is on, but 6 shells aren't enough to finish it, and it seems kind of random there.

There is a problem with the Caves of Kaliya though, as there is an FMV that cuts off Fraps, so I had to restart it after the FMV to when I save, therefore in the final one that small section after will need to be appended to the Caves of Kaliya video.

I will compress and upload them now (other than the bit after caves of kaliya, as it is only a few seconds).

Is it a problem that a new save appears between Jungle and the Temple Ruins? As I made a new one to test ways past a couple of traps that were causing me trouble.

Edit: Actually, I won't upload it, as I will do the whole run first then submit it here, it shouldn't take too long if I can do the hardest levels alright. There don't seem to be that many people interested here anyway (although that may be because it is more of a "newer consoles" thing).

Ok, I've got India done. Looking at it, I realise the Temple Ruins run was pretty bad, but I get most of the important stuff right, and if this is a low point that means my run can only get better :) . The other levels are fine.

my times are:

Jungle: 1:36
Temple Ruins: 17:49
River Ganges: 3:36
Caves of Kaliya: 2:15

Temple ruins is the only one I am dissapointed with in hindsight, I could probably have shaved a minute or two off that time in the route I took. Mistakes in the others are pretty small, although getting stuck in River Ganges probably cost me 20 seconds or so, but the Quad bike collision can be difficult. I could have killed the boss quick by jumping to the platform he is on, but 6 shells aren't enough to finish it, and it seems kind of random there.

There is a problem with the Caves of Kaliya though, as there is an FMV that cuts off Fraps, so I had to restart it after the FMV to when I save, therefore in the final one that small section after will need to be appended to the Caves of Kaliya video.

I will compress and upload them now (other than the bit after caves of kaliya, as it is only a few seconds).

Is it a problem that a new save appears between Jungle and the Temple Ruins? As I made a new one to test ways past a couple of traps that were causing me trouble.

Edit: Actually, I won't upload it, as I will do the whole run first then submit it here, it shouldn't take too long if I can do the hardest levels alright. There don't seem to be that many people interested here anyway (although that may be because it is more of a "newer consoles" thing).

Chrischi

2005-08-18 05:17:27 pm

Heavy/Death-MeT aL 4 ever - With Full Force

hehe iam intrested... coz i love this game too and know how to play it and so... may be ill try to make a run through but dont have possibilities to record them -.- ^^

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-19 02:48:28 am

2005-08-19 02:41:28 am

I guess competition would be nice. If the best Twin Galaxies times are anything to go by, then I am missing out on some techniques that can shave quite a bit of time off, or they just got a completely perfect run. But if they do know something I don't then it's their problem if they have only run a few of the levels Tongue

.

blaat

2005-08-19 01:56:46 pm

I'm also interested, but I can't help you because I don't have a copy of the game Sad

good luck with the run !

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-21 01:59:08 am

2005-08-20 09:17:59 pm

I've done Nevada and am beginning London. My times were:

Nevada Desert: 13:30
High Security complex: 20:05
Area 51: 18:17

But I've just watched the videos and realised that the video has no sound on the high security complex. I also can't rerecord it or anything, as I have no saves for that level, and submissions are not allowed without sound. Would I be able to redo the level separately or something? (as you lose all your stuff there anyway it wouldn't be tough to verify). Of course that would mean the run has to be manual timed.

I might see if compressing in Virtualdub readds sound somehow, but probably not :-[

edit: looking in Virtualdub the sound does appear to be embedded in the video (as it says how much of it there is), but it does not seem to play or compress at all. That it is apparently there does give me some hope though. Maybe it can be "unlocked" again?

edit2: I've posted this issue in the tech support forum.

xeen

2005-08-21 01:13:40 pm

Yeah, good idea to ask there. For the timing you'd probably ask Radix directly, but he'll probably also reply to your thread in the other forum.

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-21 05:44:44 pm

2005-08-21 05:25:07 pm

On an unrelated note, after testing a little, would I be able to submit if I used Xvid to compress the videos rather than DivX? I just tested and I get equal to better quality for a smaller filesize. Plus it compresses MUCH quicker. Although, if it is not allowed I can of course still use DivX.

As for comments on the level runs themselves:

Nevada is good except for me getting a jump wrong making me take around a minute longer, however, my recovery is so smooth I decided to let it go as I was getting kind of sick of that section of the level Smiley

. On the Quad bike I almost fall off the roof getting the key, and reversing back takes a few seconds, but there isn't much space there.

High security complex has a part where I lose it and head for a keyhole without the key, and I also fumble quite a bit with a gap near the end. However, this level has quite a bit of a luck element with the prisoners and whether they attack the guards properly or not, and those bits went very well in this run, and the level has a couple of nice sequence breaks (I skip a box puzzle and also skip turning off a laser). A sub 20 would be pretty easily possible however.

The only mistakes I can recall in Area 51 is getting caught on a railing for a few seconds, and I also get blasted by a mounted gun near the end when I thought I had avoided the lasers, which might have led to me using more medikits than I could have (I'm not sure though, as I got damaged a little by a guard at the end). I did get a jump to skip a monkey swing wrong but it came out pretty funny as I climbed up onto a collapsing platform and therefore jumped up while standing on nothing Smiley

.

On an unrelated note, after testing a little, would I be able to submit if I used Xvid to compress the videos rather than DivX? I just tested and I get equal to better quality for a smaller filesize. Plus it compresses MUCH quicker. Although, if it is not allowed I can of course still use DivX.

As for comments on the level runs themselves:

Nevada is good except for me getting a jump wrong making me take around a minute longer, however, my recovery is so smooth I decided to let it go as I was getting kind of sick of that section of the level :) . On the Quad bike I almost fall off the roof getting the key, and reversing back takes a few seconds, but there isn't much space there.

High security complex has a part where I lose it and head for a keyhole without the key, and I also fumble quite a bit with a gap near the end. However, this level has quite a bit of a luck element with the prisoners and whether they attack the guards properly or not, and those bits went very well in this run, and the level has a couple of nice sequence breaks (I skip a box puzzle and also skip turning off a laser). A sub 20 would be pretty easily possible however.

The only mistakes I can recall in Area 51 is getting caught on a railing for a few seconds, and I also get blasted by a mounted gun near the end when I thought I had avoided the lasers, which might have led to me using more medikits than I could have (I'm not sure though, as I got damaged a little by a guard at the end). I did get a jump to skip a monkey swing wrong but it came out pretty funny as I climbed up onto a collapsing platform and therefore jumped up while standing on nothing :) .

Apathy

2005-08-21 05:52:16 pm

King n00b!

Xivd is free, so I don't see what the problem using it is..

When I was talking to him about my doom 3 run, the only thing he really wanted was for the audio to be encoded with the lame mp3 thing.. Which I did not know, because I half assed read the faq thing.
I did however, before encoding try to use the lame thing because I just happen to know about it, but couldn't get vdub to even show it as an option.

I ended up using some windows encoder.. It either comes with windows, or some update, or service pack.

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-21 06:13:01 pm

2005-08-21 05:57:50 pm

I thought I read in a FAQ or something here that entries had to be done in DivX, but that must have just been a recommendation. I already compress into Lame MP3 so that shouldn't be an issue.

However, I'll have to experiment with the compression ratios of Xvid more, as I just noticed that it is a bit inconsistent (some parts are better, like 90% of the first level, yet a lot of others are almost unwatchable). So if I can't find a good tradeoff in ratio I will probably use DivX anyway.

Apathy

2005-08-21 06:16:57 pm

King n00b!

I just went looking through faqs. It says how to use the encoder.. I don't think it's required that you use it, but I would talk with radix to make sure.

Radix

2005-08-21 06:22:02 pm

I'm addicted to games

divx and xvid use the same fourcc, so they can both decode stuff the other one makes. So yes, you can use it.

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-21 06:40:35 pm

2005-08-21 06:38:54 pm

Oh well, it doesn't matter now as I've decided to stay with DivX as when I set Xvids ratio to make up for the inconsistencies the file size becomes bigger than DivX. The quality increases on the bits that were better weren't that big anyway.

MMAN

Edit history:

MMAN: 2005-08-22 01:18:09 pm

2005-08-22 01:08:37 pm

Since I've found the video is broke can I do that level separately from the rest of the run? I'll check the old video to make sure I pick up and use the same items etc (hopefully it will end up "natural"). But I'm guessing that means the run has to be manual timed?