OoT [N64] Segmented [Suspended]

UchihaSasuke

2006-10-16 11:19:55 pm

Stand: Devil's Call in your Heart

how long until these shortcuts are classified as "Secret Worlds" like in the Metroid Prime games?

xenos

2006-10-17 09:41:34 am

Quote:

Trust me, I wouldn't say something without first trying it. You're the one who needs to try it before saying "it doesn't work".

Edit: Besides, AKA's way is faster anyways.

I never said that anything wouldn't work. The only time I mentioned anything about something not working was when I said that the trick was precise and if you were slightly off when you fall, it won't work. I never said that the trick wasn't quicker, I was just saying that it won't save much time.
I did some testing and found that after you break through the first web, you have no forward momentum so you can't grab the vine without first landing in the water/platform etc. I only did two tests on this but in both I had absolutely no forward momentum whatsoever so I thought that was conclusive enough.
Some people seem rather dismissive of the old method. If you watched the video of me doing the old method, you will find it took me 35 seconds from when I land on the switch to when I land in the boss antechamber and I made mistakes in that video as well. Again I will say that it took me 31 seconds from when I landed in the water to when I landed in the boss antechamber. I didn't use AKA's newest technique but I doubt it will save much time. It took AKA 10 seconds from when he fell down till when he landed and it took me 18 seconds to land in the water after getting hit by the skulltula. In short - that trick isn't going to save a lot of time. I now change my estimate to <10 seconds. Unless you find something else to make this trick faster, my estimate will turn true, I think.

[quote]

Trust me, I wouldn't say something without first trying it.  You're the one who needs to try it before saying "it doesn't work".

Edit: Besides, AKA's way is faster anyways.[/quote]

I never said that anything wouldn't work. The only time I mentioned anything about something not working was when I said that the trick was precise and if you were slightly off when you fall, it won't work. I never said that the trick wasn't quicker, I was just saying that it won't save much time.
I did some testing and found that after you break through the first web, you have no forward momentum so you can't grab the vine without first landing in the water/platform etc. I only did two tests on this but in both I had absolutely no forward momentum whatsoever so I thought that was conclusive enough.
Some people seem rather dismissive of the old method. If you watched the video of me doing the old method, you will find it took me 35 seconds from when I land on the switch to when I land in the boss antechamber and I made mistakes in that video as well. Again I will say that it took me 31 seconds from when I landed in the water to when I landed in the boss antechamber. I didn't use AKA's newest technique but I doubt it will save much time. It took AKA 10 seconds from when he fell down till when he landed and it took me 18 seconds to land in the water after getting hit by the skulltula. In short - that trick isn't going to save a lot of time. I now change my estimate to <10 seconds. Unless you find something else to make this trick faster, my estimate will turn true, I think.

AKA

2006-10-17 11:51:12 pm

He's back!

You can easilly grab the vine from breaking the web, as soon Link in contact with it, he can shift his momentum in any direction, if you're using the original vid I posted of it then I wan't trying to go for a world record. I watched the TAS using the old method, and I reckon that if the trick I showed was done in a true optimal fashion then it would save 12-14 seconds. Anyway its much simplier than the other trick.

Edit: Radix has yet to reply about the legitimicy of this trick.

Fail Boat

2006-10-17 11:58:33 pm

forum lurker

Quote:

Edit: Radix has yet to reply about the legitimicy of this trick.

He hasn't even posted for 2 and a half weeks. I'm still waiting for him to update the verifier list. I think he is a little busy. Tongue

AKA

Edit history:

AKA: 2006-10-18 12:37:54 am

2006-10-18 12:37:05 am

He's back!

If thats the case I'll just go ahead and use it, but I'll aproach the basement like I did in the first uploaded vid. I don't cross the map and any point even though it might look like if when I get boosted initailly. I just get boosted sideways and all the walls temperily don't affect YL, the phisical environment still exists and I don't cross any empty space.

MissileWaster

2006-10-18 02:24:54 am

Quote:

If thats the case I'll just go ahead and use it, but I'll aproach the basement like I did in the first uploaded vid. I don't cross the map and any point even though it might look like if when I get boosted initailly. I just get boosted sideways and all the walls temperily don't affect YL, the phisical environment still exists and I don't cross any empty space.

You could try to do 2 different videos, one with the trick and one without. You would need to try to end the segment with the same amount of health on both, but that would save you some stress if he decides not to allow it cause then you would already have the segment done "properly" anyway.

Fail Boat

2006-10-18 02:27:12 am

forum lurker

Quote:

You could try to do 2 different videos, one with the trick and one without. You would need to try to end the segment with the same amount of health on both, but that would save you some stress if he decides not to allow it cause then you would already have the segment done "properly" anyway.

I think AKA is working on a Single-Segment run though...

MissileWaster

2006-10-18 03:43:23 am

Quote:

I think AKA is working on a Single-Segment run though...

Single-Segment discussion in a segmented topic? BLASPHEMY!

Well, let's just cross our fingers that Radix allows it (although, I don't think he will since you go through walls for it to work).

c4p7ain c0mp0s7

2006-10-18 04:17:28 am

Food goes in here

I'm pretty sure you go through a wall in Shadow early.

Manocheese

2006-10-18 05:42:14 am

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

Meh, might be separate category like Trials Skip/BLJ in SM64, but I don't know. It just... Doesn't seem as borderline.

AKA

Edit history:

AKA: 2006-10-18 06:35:49 pm

2006-10-18 06:34:41 pm

He's back!

You could go through the wall and skip the block as a child in the Shadow Temple, but the method required is near impossible on a console, it would require a bombchu to be set off and then to drop from the metal grate and then get boosted sideways by the bombchu and into the area where Kazooie CC'd as a child, although it probally isn't worth it even if it was easily replicatable.

EDIT: Mikwuyma has said the the trick is OK, so I guess I can use it now.

YautjaElder

2006-10-18 06:37:48 pm

Speed is the key.

Quote:

EDIT: Mikwuyma has said the the trick is OK, so I guess I can use it now.

Yay!

ewic

2006-10-19 01:24:54 am

Ewic Juice

I just knew you guys had more to talk about!

Hurray for me bumping this thread! Cheesy

hurray?

Hur...Ray?

*Leaves room*

Acryte

Edit history:

Acryte: 2006-10-19 06:24:19 am

2006-10-19 03:35:15 am

Zelda Scientist®

AKA, I like your idea and I have a new way to set it up so it saves more time.

Fail Boat

Edit history:

Fail Boat: 2006-10-19 04:42:09 am

2006-10-19 04:40:48 am

forum lurker

I'm thinking of speedrunning this game. The only thing tunring me off is the level of perfection asserted by the community. I don't really have the patience to do an absolutely perfect speedrun. There would be no huge mistakes (like falling off a ledge) just a little bit of tiny mistakes, such as accidentally running into a wall. Doing an absolutely perfect run would drive me insane (like it did to TSA). So what do you guys think? Would you mind a non-TAS-like speedrun?

Manocheese

2006-10-19 06:16:44 am

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

I know that you wouldn't let down everyone's hard work by submitting a crap run just to have the record, but don't worry about making it perfect. I realize how difficult it is to get everything just right; once I press Record, I suddenly can't play for crap. @_@

Fail Boat

2006-10-19 07:03:42 am

forum lurker

Quote:

I know that you wouldn't let down everyone's hard work by submitting a crap run just to have the record, but don't worry about making it perfect. I realize how difficult it is to get everything just right; once I press Record, I suddenly can't play for crap. @_@

Yeah I can't play worth shit when I hit record either. My heart starts going a thousand miles an hour. Don't worry, I won't "pull a DJS". I'll be doing all the time-saving tricks and stuff found so far (except the odd one or two such as text skip in Dodongo's Cavern).

YautjaElder

Edit history:

YautjaElder: 2006-10-19 11:14:14 am

2006-10-19 11:13:55 am

Speed is the key.

TSA's run wasn't perfect... my run isn't gonna be perfect... no speed run is perfect...

So why would yours have to be? Tongue

I hope you'll go ahead with this fluffy. Wink

AKA

Edit history:

AKA: 2006-10-19 12:22:23 pm

2006-10-19 12:08:31 pm

He's back!

Quote:

AKA, I like your idea and I have a new way to set it up so it saves more time.

That what I envisioned for a segmented/TAS run, exept you can still do the old richchet method and shift you're momentum forward when breaking the web, which'll enable you to grab the web.

EDIT: I've tried using the normal web skultullas in the Deku tree to boost into the water, but the reason why I think it doesn't work is because the water isn't loaded in the room below the first web despite the fact I using a near sideways boost. The logic is pretty obvious when performing vine glitch on enemies

15 paces above a skulltulla and drop
17 paces above a web skulltulla and drop

Its just a damm shame it doesn't work as an Adult or as a child in MM. I think the trick in the Tree works because the walls don't temprerilly affect YL while he's been hit after the first second or so.

Acryte

2006-10-19 12:41:32 pm

Zelda Scientist®

No, it just works in OoT. Anywhere as Kid link, as long as it is a climbable texture. Ladders are not textures and do not work. MM is just different in some ways. This is one of them.

YautjaElder

2006-10-19 01:12:45 pm

Speed is the key.

I couldn't get it to work on the vines on the walls in Gerudo's Fortress...

Whenn

2006-10-19 06:02:09 pm

Lalala

You know, this thread makes you think,
Majora's Mask and Wind Waker weren't bad, but no one has as much interest in running them as they have in running this.
If you ask me, Twilight Princess probably won't last for too long and eventually people (*cough* TSA) will return to running this game, and I bet there are a dozen more tricks just waiting to be found.

OoT is EPIC.

AKA

2006-10-19 07:13:23 pm

He's back!

The closer TP gets to being released the more negative my feelings are towards the game. My questions are will it be enjoyable to play, will it be speedrun friendly and will there be any sequence breaks other than just a few speed tricks that save 5-10 seconds.

coolcwer2

2006-10-19 07:26:43 pm

I'll speedrun TP for sure, I know I won't have (Or I'm assuming) the WR or even beat anyone for long, but I WILL speedrun it, becuase I think it is going to be the best game ever, like OoT, and OoT is fun to Speedrun.

mwl

Edit history:

mwl: 2006-10-19 07:43:37 pm

2006-10-19 07:43:29 pm

Quote:

I'll speedrun TP for sure, I know I won't have (Or I'm assuming) the WR or even beat anyone for long, but I WILL speedrun it, becuase I think it is going to be the best game ever, like OoT, and OoT is fun to Speedrun.

Good luck. You don't even know if it's practical to speedrun that game yet. The rumours indicate that the programmers have been quite careful about preventing sequence breaks this time. You can say that they'll always eventually be discovered, but look at The Wind Waker. It just can't be broken up as easily as OoT or MM.