Ocarina of Time - All Categories[N64]

FIERCELINKMASTER

Edit history:

FIERCELINKMASTER: 2006-05-22 11:47:00 pm

2006-05-22 11:37:47 pm

No the Quail is not riding the Q

While I don't categorize the 37th heat piece as being necessary... I do think it would be a cool thing to have. Maybe a few people will download the run just to found out what the heck we are talking about. Tongue

What's really important right now is to get to work on the strategy. Grin

Quote:

I played this game so much back in the day...and i want to go back and start playing again...and perhaps try to compete although unlikely ill ever win cause there are so amazing people on this site for this game.

Many Speed tricks just take advantage of flaws in the game. Like the ground jump. Don't say you're not good enough to be a runner because if you really dedicate yourself you can go beyond what you thought you were capable of.

Fail Boat

2006-05-23 12:21:04 am

forum lurker

Quote:

Many Speed tricks just take advantage of flaws in the game. Like the ground jump. Don't say you're not good enough to be a runner because if you really dedicate yourself you can go beyond what you thought you were capable of.

True that. I only found out about these tricks when I registered to this forum. Before that I didn't know a single glitch on OoT. I've only been on this forum for a month, so you should have no problem learning these tricks :D.

whacko_jacko

2006-05-23 02:01:44 am

Well, my suggestion is to just plan on collecting it. This way, when the official ruling comes, you can simply remove it from your route. This is assuming it really is easier to adjust a route by removing a task than adding one. If it is visa versa, then plan on not collecting it. You just decide on whatever is easier for the moment.

Hopefully people will stop commenting about the 37th heartpiece and just wait for official ruling. I'm pretty sure that every side of the argument has been stated, so there is probably no reason to restate what people have already said.

FIERCELINKMASTER

Edit history:

FIERCELINKMASTER: 2006-05-23 02:45:06 am

2006-05-23 02:38:23 am

No the Quail is not riding the Q

Quote:

True that. I only found out about these tricks when I registered to this forum. Before that I didn't know a single glitch on OoT. I've only been on this forum for a month, so you should have no problem learning these tricks :D.

I commend you for your hard work.

Quote:

Well, my suggestion is to just plan on collecting it. This way, when the official ruling comes, you can simply remove it from your route. This is assuming it really is easier to adjust a route by removing a task than adding one. If it is visa versa, then plan on not collecting it. You just decide on whatever is easier for the moment.

Hopefully people will stop commenting about the 37th heartpiece and just wait for official ruling. I'm pretty sure that every side of the argument has been stated, so there is probably no reason to restate what people have already said.

Agreed. If I may request something for everyone... if you see more discussion on the 37th heart piece try not to turn it into a Ganon's Tower discussion. :-/

This is a pretty complicated run.. right now we have to work on finding that master strategy much like we did to pure speed. Working on a run like this will definitely be a rewarding experince.

[quote]

True that.  I only found out about these tricks when I registered to this forum.  Before that I didn't know a single glitch on OoT.  I've only been on this forum for a month, so you should have no problem learning these tricks  :D.
[/quote]
I commend you for your hard work.
[quote]Well, my suggestion is to just plan on collecting it. This way, when the official ruling comes, you can simply remove it from your route. This is assuming it really is easier to adjust a route by removing a task than adding one. If it is visa versa, then plan on not collecting it. You just decide on whatever is easier for the moment.

Hopefully people will stop commenting about the 37th heartpiece and just wait for official ruling. I'm pretty sure that every side of the argument has been stated, so there is probably no reason to restate what people have already said.[/quote]
Agreed. If I may request something for everyone... if you see more discussion on the 37th heart piece try not to turn it into a Ganon's Tower discussion.  :-/

This is a pretty complicated run.. right now we have to work on finding that master strategy much like we did to pure speed. Working on a run like this will definitely be a rewarding experince.

ML7Serbian9Spartan

2006-05-23 02:47:52 am

Well thats good to hear. Ill guess ill look over the posts. So for instance when your in hyrule field..you just do backwalking or you side hopping as well...from left to right side? Also...how do you get a time of under a minute for marathon run?

FIERCELINKMASTER

Edit history:

FIERCELINKMASTER: 2006-05-23 03:09:48 am

2006-05-23 03:07:25 am

No the Quail is not riding the Q

Quote:

Well thats good to hear. Ill guess ill look over the posts. So for instance when your in hyrule field..you just do backwalking or you side hopping as well...from left to right side? Also...how do you get a time of under a minute for marathon run?

Backwalking on flat ground from point A to point B is faster then rolling or side hopping.

Side hopping is a means of changing direction quickly (try to utilize sidehopping in the Dampe Graveyard race) It may also be a faster way of traveling downhill slopes.

Rolling is usually for shorter distances where you have to change direction frequently.

As far as beating the marathon man in a minute you should as in request a video of it here.

ML7Serbian9Spartan

2006-05-23 03:45:23 am

I added you on AIM...so i can get more frequent help. Ill start Ocarina of Time..beginning of June...but i leave for the summer on the 11th soo ill try to get whatever i can in. Maybe try and master young link first. Ill post times on deku tree and etc. If you can tell me best routes and etc. This is my all time fav game so i want to make a good run!

whacko_jacko

Edit history:

whacko_jacko: 2006-05-23 04:08:28 am

2006-05-23 04:07:45 am

You could watch the TAS wip for a good route and tricks to practice, if you're really going for broke. It can be found on the N64 board over at Bisqwit's. Some of that stuff is pretty crazy, so don't be too discouraged if you cant replicate much. It will take you through a good chunk of the child link section to practice. This thread is really for discussing 100% runs though. I somehow assumed you were referring to a pure speed run, and if you weren't, then I apologize. Regardless, that TAS will show you a lot of great tricks and text skips and such to practice, if the descriptions aren't enough for you.

ML7Serbian9Spartan

2006-05-23 04:12:07 am

The only problem is i dont have divx....so can you find something with Windows Media Player...and my comp wont let me download divx. I know its hard stuff...but ill try and beat him(like i said before..prolly wont succeed but oh well)

YautjaElder

Edit history:

YautjaElder: 2006-06-07 07:25:10 pm

2006-06-07 07:05:47 pm

Speed is the key.

I'll more or less start working on a 100% OoT run this summer, if I can get a good route. I've managed to come up with a route for the Young Link section, but I know it isn't optimal. There are a lot of small improvements here and there, but I would like to know if it's an okay route overall, or if it sucks.

You can get it here (.rtf format, 5 kb): http://files.filefront.com/OoT_100___Young_Link_routertf/;5121401;;/fileinfo.html

If you're going to fully understand it, you're probably gonna have to check the guides I linked to in the route. I know that I will have to go back in time once, for the Frogs Heart Piece(s) and the skulltula in Death Mountain Crater. I tried to get as much as possible done in the first Young Link section, but that might be a bad thing.

The thing that actually worries me the most is the Day/Night dealio. I'm going to try running the route as soon as I get my new GC copy of OoT (lost my old one), probably tomorrow.

I would be very glad if some skilled route planner could look it over. If there is something you don't understand, just ask.

Right now I'm having serious trouble with getting the biggoron sword trading-sequence and the big poe hunting into a good adult route... Angry

I've always been bad at planning. Once I get to the running part, things will go more smoothly... I hope.

Edit: I asked Radix about the 37th Heart Piece. He said it's the same thing as getting 101% for Metroid Prime 2: Echoes.

I'll more or less start working on a 100% OoT run this summer, if I can get a good route. I've managed to come up with a route for the Young Link section, but I know it isn't optimal. There are a lot of small improvements here and there, but I would like to know if it's an okay route overall, or if it sucks.

You can get it here (.rtf format, 5 kb): http://files.filefront.com/OoT_100___Young_Link_routertf/;5121401;;/fileinfo.html

If you're going to fully understand it, you're probably gonna have to check the guides I linked to in the route. I know that I will have to go back in time once, for the Frogs Heart Piece(s) and the skulltula in Death Mountain Crater. I tried to get as much as possible done in the first Young Link section, but that might be a bad thing.

The thing that actually worries me the most is the Day/Night dealio. I'm going to try running the route as soon as I get my new GC copy of OoT (lost my old one), probably tomorrow.

I would be very glad if some skilled route planner could look it over. If there is something you don't understand, just ask.

Right now I'm having serious trouble with getting the biggoron sword trading-sequence and the big poe hunting into a good adult route... >:( I've always been bad at planning. Once I get to the running part, things will go more smoothly... I hope.

Edit: I asked Radix about the 37th Heart Piece. He said it's the same thing as getting 101% for Metroid Prime 2: Echoes.

Amazing Ampharos

2006-06-07 09:28:35 pm

I don't see how the 37th heart piece is the same as the second missile launcher as in that you get the same item twice whereas here you get a well hidden item that's unique from every other item...

You almost certainly want to put off doubling your Deku Sticks. I doubt you're going to have serious capacity issues, and you have to ammend your rupee route to get an extra ten to afford the upgrade. You should get this upgrade right when you give the Skull Kid the Skull Mask as it will be less out of the way and you will have the extra rupees with less time lost. Either way, you should almost certainly end a segment after getting the sticks as the save warp to Link's house should save some time unless you can bomb yourself onto the bridge or your next task is in the lost woods.

Haunted Wasteland has a gold skulltulla in it; I'm pretty sure it appears as a kid. Also, be sure to get some bugs ASAP and to use them to get the Gold Skulltullas out of the dirt holes. This does require a bottle though... Getting the one by the Desert Colossus now is probably a good idea as kid link will never return there in an ideal route. Hmm, are there Gold Skulltullas in the Kid Link spirit temple that require the boomerang? If there are, you might be best changing the whole route around to have the boomerang when you come here(with some bombchus from the bottom of the well presumably to get Faroe's Wind while you are at Jabu Jabu). If not this is a lot easier than advertised.

Before you go to Jabu Jabu, you should probably go to Gerudo Valley and jump down to get the Skulltulla from the pile of dirt down there and the piece of heart behind the waterfall. Then you can take the river down to lake hylia.

Hmm, to take care of early bugs and bottles, perhaps a trip to Kakariko early to get bombchus from the well could be combined with getting the bottle from the cucoo lady. I think you're going to find your route constrained a lot by those skulltullas to be honest. Damage boosting might let you circumvent the need for the boomerang in some cases, but still...

I'm in a rush now, but I'll muse it over and see if there's more to be said later.

I don't see how the 37th heart piece is the same as the second missile launcher as in that you get the same item twice whereas here you get a well hidden item that's unique from every other item...

You almost certainly want to put off doubling your Deku Sticks.  I doubt you're going to have serious capacity issues, and you have to ammend your rupee route to get an extra ten to afford the upgrade.  You should get this upgrade right when you give the Skull Kid the Skull Mask as it will be less out of the way and you will have the extra rupees with less time lost.  Either way, you should almost certainly end a segment after getting the sticks as the save warp to Link's house should save some time unless you can bomb yourself onto the bridge or your next task is in the lost woods.

Haunted Wasteland has a gold skulltulla in it; I'm pretty sure it appears as a kid.  Also, be sure to get some bugs ASAP and to use them to get the Gold Skulltullas out of the dirt holes.  This does require a bottle though...  Getting the one by the Desert Colossus now is probably a good idea as kid link will never return there in an ideal route.    Hmm, are there Gold Skulltullas in the Kid Link spirit temple that require the boomerang?  If there are, you might be best changing the whole route around to have the boomerang when you come here(with some bombchus from the bottom of the well presumably to get Faroe's Wind while you are at Jabu Jabu).  If not this is a lot easier than advertised.

Before you go to Jabu Jabu, you should probably go to Gerudo Valley and jump down to get the Skulltulla from the pile of dirt down there and the piece of heart behind the waterfall.  Then you can take the river down to lake hylia.

Hmm, to take care of early bugs and bottles, perhaps a trip to Kakariko early to get bombchus from the well could be combined with getting the bottle from the cucoo lady.  I think you're going to find your route constrained a lot by those skulltullas to be honest.  Damage boosting might let you circumvent the need for the boomerang in some cases, but still...

I'm in a rush now, but I'll muse it over and see if there's more to be said later.

YautjaElder

Edit history:

YautjaElder: 2006-06-07 10:13:36 pm

2006-06-07 09:53:39 pm

Speed is the key.

Quote:

You almost certainly want to put off doubling your Deku Sticks. I doubt you're going to have serious capacity issues, and you have to ammend your rupee route to get an extra ten to afford the upgrade. You should get this upgrade right when you givethe Skull Kid the Skull Mask as it will be less out of the way and you will have the extra rupees with less time lost. Either way, you should almost certainly end a segment after getting the sticks as the save warp to Link's house should save some time unless you can bomb yourself onto the bridge or your next task is in the lost woods.

You get your Deku Sticks maxed out when you get a Deku Stick upgrade, right?
I get the Deku Stick Upgrade, a skulltula, a Piece of Heart and I also give the skull mask to the skull kid in the same section, then I could damage boost across the poles into Hyrule field, that might be a good idea.

Quote:

Haunted Wasteland has a gold skulltulla in it; I'm pretty sure it appears as a kid.

Yeah, problem is that if you're gonna grab it as a kid, you're gonna need the boomerang. No other way around... But it's a quick grab as an adult with the longshot.

Quote:

Also, be sure to get some bugs ASAP and to use them to get the Gold Skulltullas out of the dirt holes. This does require a bottle though...

I get the first bottle fairly early in the route I made, and I'll pick out every bean soil, too. I get the bugs from one of the rocks in Goron City (close to one GS).

Quote:

Getting the one by the Desert Colossus now is probably a good idea as kid link will never return there in the ideal route.

In the current route I have to return there once... We might have to change the whole damn thing. Grin

Quote:

Hmm, are there Gold Skulltullas in the Kid Link spirit temple that require the boomerang? If there are, you might be best changing the whole route around to have the boomerang when you come here(with some bombchus from the bottom of the well presumably to get Faroe's Wind while you are at Jabu Jabu). If not this is a lot easier than advertised.

Remember that you need bombs/bombchus to access the bombchus in the well, and you shouldn't need to go into the well twice. There are 3 skulltulas in the well, and you need the boomerang for them.

Yes, there are 3 skulltulas in child spirit, one which require the boomerang, but that one is right above the Iron Knuckle door, so you can easily grab that one as an adult if you longshoot to the SG chest after getting the mirror shield. The other skulltula is also not far from where you need to go as an adult. The first one is only acessible as a child, though, and it would be a hella lot faster to grab it if you had the boomerang.

Quote:

Before you go to Jabu Jabu, you should probably go to Gerudo Valley and jump down to get the Skulltulla from the pile of dirt down there and the piece of heart behind the waterfall. Then you can take the river down to lake hylia.

There is one child skulltula in Gerudo Valley that requires boomerang, so going there before Jabu-Jabu would be a waste, I think. In the route, I take that skulltula, two heart Pieces (box and Waterfall) and the skulltula in the bean soil at the same time. Then I grab everything I need in Lake Hylia, I also plant a bean there.

Quote:

I think you're going to find your route constrained a lot by those skulltullas to be honest.

I planned the route so that I always have the requirements for the skulltulas when I get to them. As I said, the biggest problem is the Day/Night cycle. I have to check how that turns out. Of course this is just until I get the Sun's Song, but getting that before Jabu-Jabu (and boomerang) will result in multiple trips to the graveyard, as one skulltula there requires boomerang.

Quote:

Damage boosting might let you circumvent the need for the boomerang in some cases, but still...

I doubt it. Every skulltula (that requires boomerang) is so highly placed that there will probably be no substitute for the boomerang

Quote:

I'm in a rush now, but I'll muse it over and see if there's more to be said later.

Thank you for your reply, I hope we can sort this out. It'll be a beast, but I'll probably manage if I can get more people interested. Smiley

Edit: Also, notice that I skip both the Goron's bracelet and the Silver Scale. According to Radix, this is fully allowed. Cheesy

I had this strange feeling when I planned this... I knew in my head exactly where every skulltula/Heart Piece were and what was required to get it... I checked some FAQ to be sure, and I had zero mistakes. I didn't even forget anything. Shocked

[quote]You almost certainly want to put off doubling your Deku Sticks.  I doubt you're going to have serious capacity issues, and you have to ammend your rupee route to get an extra ten to afford the upgrade.  You should get this upgrade right when you givethe Skull Kid the Skull Mask as it will be less out of the way and you will have the extra rupees with less time lost.  Either way, you should almost certainly end a segment after getting the sticks as the save warp to Link's house should save some time unless you can bomb yourself onto the bridge or your next task is in the lost woods.[/quote]
You get your Deku Sticks maxed out when you get a Deku Stick upgrade, right?
I get the Deku Stick Upgrade, a skulltula, a Piece of Heart and I also give the skull mask to the skull kid in the same section, then I could damage boost across the poles into Hyrule field, that might be a good idea.

[quote]Haunted Wasteland has a gold skulltulla in it; I'm pretty sure it appears as a kid.[/quote]
Yeah, problem is that if you're gonna grab it as a kid, you're gonna need the boomerang. No other way around... But it's a quick grab as an adult with the longshot.

[quote]Also, be sure to get some bugs ASAP and to use them to get the Gold Skulltullas out of the dirt holes.  This does require a bottle though...[/quote]
I get the first bottle fairly early in the route I made, and I'll pick out every bean soil, too. I get the bugs from one of the rocks in Goron City (close to one GS).

[quote]Getting the one by the Desert Colossus now is probably a good idea as kid link will never return there in the ideal route.[/quote]
In the current route I have to return there once... We might have to change the whole damn thing. ;D

[quote]Hmm, are there Gold Skulltullas in the Kid Link spirit temple that require the boomerang?  If there are, you might be best changing the whole route around to have the boomerang when you come here(with some bombchus from the bottom of the well presumably to get Faroe's Wind while you are at Jabu Jabu).  If not this is a lot easier than advertised.[/quote]
Remember that you need bombs/bombchus to access the bombchus in the well, and you shouldn't need to go into the well twice. There are 3 skulltulas in the well, and you need the boomerang for them.

Yes, there are 3 skulltulas in child spirit, one which require the boomerang, but that one is right above the Iron Knuckle door, so you can easily grab that one as an adult if you longshoot to the SG chest after getting the mirror shield. The other skulltula is also not far from where you need to go as an adult. The first one is only acessible as a child, though, and it would be a hella lot faster to grab it if you had the boomerang.

[quote]Before you go to Jabu Jabu, you should probably go to Gerudo Valley and jump down to get the Skulltulla from the pile of dirt down there and the piece of heart behind the waterfall.  Then you can take the river down to lake hylia.[/quote]
There is one child skulltula in Gerudo Valley that requires boomerang, so going there before Jabu-Jabu would be a waste, I think. In the route, I take that skulltula, two heart Pieces (box and Waterfall) and the skulltula in the bean soil at the same time. Then I grab everything I need in Lake Hylia, I also plant a bean there.

[quote]I think you're going to find your route constrained a lot by those skulltullas to be honest.[/quote]
I planned the route so that I always have the requirements for the skulltulas when I get to them. As I said, the biggest problem is the Day/Night cycle. I have to check how that turns out. Of course this is just until I get the Sun's Song, but getting that before Jabu-Jabu (and boomerang) will result in multiple trips to the graveyard, as one skulltula there requires boomerang.

[quote]Damage boosting might let you circumvent the need for the boomerang in some cases, but still...[/quote]
I doubt it. Every skulltula (that requires boomerang) is so highly placed that there will probably be no substitute for the boomerang

[quote]I'm in a rush now, but I'll muse it over and see if there's more to be said later.[/quote]
Thank you for your reply, I hope we can sort this out. It'll be a beast, but I'll probably manage if I can get more people interested. :)

Edit: Also, notice that I skip both the Goron's bracelet and the Silver Scale. According to Radix, this is fully allowed. :D

I had this strange feeling when I planned this... I knew in my head exactly where every skulltula/Heart Piece were and what was required to get it... I checked some FAQ to be sure, and I had zero mistakes. I didn't even forget anything. :o

FIERCELINKMASTER

Edit history:

FIERCELINKMASTER: 2006-06-07 10:03:50 pm

2006-06-07 10:03:30 pm

No the Quail is not riding the Q

Quote:

You get your Deku Sticks maxed out when you get a Deku Stick upgrade, right?

Yeah.

YautjaElder

2006-06-07 10:04:54 pm

Speed is the key.

Quote:

Yeah.

So that's 20... then 30... should be enough for the child section! Smiley

Amazing Ampharos

2006-06-07 11:53:52 pm

Ok, I thought about it, and I had a simple idea.

Do Jabu Jabu first. You'll have to make an extra trip to get Faeroe's Wind, but think of all the return trips you save. Actually, IMO, you could probably put off doing it until the Ice Cavern. The trip into Haunted Wasteland as an adult is probably about as time wasting as going back for the spell, and you can clear out kid link's spirit temple easily and save a return trip to Dodongo's Cavern(well, you have to go back in as an adult anyway, but I think you save at least a little time in there). It frees you up a lot as you can put Lon Lon Ranch whenever's convenient(i.e. whenever you run by closest) and it lets you do the second Gerudo Valley trip pretty easily(you don't have to worry about day/night as trip 2 will be after the sun's song so if you missed the skulltulla the first time due to day you can get it on the second trip); the second trip is basically running in, getting the Skulltulla on the wall if you don't have it, jumping down into the valley and getting the skulltulla from the dirt(do you have to plant this bean for adult link?), getting the piece of heart, going downstream, getting the skulltulla on the back of the house, getting the skulltulla from the dirt by the house, getting the piece of heart from diving in the house, and owl warping to the market(which means that if you have to you can make it a part of the last segment before the temple of time). Jabu Jabu first also gives you an early bottle; the other two are fairly well out of the way as you are right about one trip to the graveyard being best, and you might even get away with one trip to Kakariko too. And of course Lon Lon ranch should be avoided until you have a boomerang.

Hmm, I would probably want to do a route about like this(a lot of details forgotten, but this is a skeleton):

Sword and Shield
Great Deku Tree/Slingshot/Kokiri Emerald(savewarp)
Fairy Ocerina
Set Scarecrow's Song
Gold Scale/Fishing piece of heart(you can do both at once and be done with fishing forever)
Letter in a Bottle
King Zora
Light the torches around Zora's domain for a PoH
Fish
Jabu Jabu/Boomerang/Zora's Sapphire
Decend Zora's River obtaining everything with Boomerang(the piece of heart you need a cucoo for can be gotten when you go for the frogs)/Magic Beans
Savewarp
Child Spirit stuff with all those skulltullas being availiable/bombchus/silver gauntlets
Savewarp
Backwalk to market/Zelda's Lullaby/Zelda's letter
Goto Kakariko
Sun's Song/tons of skulltullas/giants wallet(if possible, I hope so)/show letter/cucoo gathering bottle
Use Bombchus to enter Dodongo's Cavern
Dodongo's Cavern/Bombs/Goron's Ruby
Goron City Gold Skulltullas/Bomb bag expansion/piece of heart from bombing pot
Magic Meter/Gold Skulltulla in Death Mountain Crater
Owlwarp/goto market/Ocerina of Time/Song of Time
Begin Happy Mask Quest
Goto Kakariko and drop off first mask
Return to Happy Mask Shop and retrieve Skull Mask
Savewarp(finally!)
alll the forest skulltullas/Slingshot capacity upgrade/piece of heart nearby/deku theater deku stick upgrade/saria's song
savewarp
give skull mask/2nd deku stick capacity upgrade/damage boost onto bridge/gerudo valley second visit(skulltullas, piece of heart)/go down river(2 skulltullas, piece of heart)/owlwarp to market
Get Spooky Mask
Goto Graveyard/give spooky mask/dampe's gravedigging tour/bottom of the well/lens of truth/you need the giant's wallet now if you couldn't get it before
Goto Market/Bunny Hood
Lon Lon Ranch/bottle/skulltullas/piece of heart/epona's song
Sell Bunny Hood to fill wallet
Mask of Truth
Savewarp
Show Mask of Truth to Deku Theater for Deku Nut upgrade
Savewarp
Backwalk to market
market minigames(slingshot upgrade/bomb upgrade/2 pieces of heart)/dog piece of heart/Become an Adult

Ok, here's what I left out:

Din's Fire: We're becomming a kid again pretty fast, and there's a skulltulla near the castle that requires the song of storms
Nayru's Love: We can get it as an adult
Faeroe's Wind: We can do it when we go to the Ice Cavern
2nd Deku Nut Upgrade: I honestly forgot where it is; I hope it's convenient and on the way at some point
Piece of Heart buried near Lake Hylia/hyrule field stuff in general: I hope we can do most/all of this as an adult as we'll have epona and bombs for the whole time then.
Piece of Heart that requires Cucoo on Zora's River: Easily obtained when we go back for the frogs
2nd trip to Deku Tree: You need bombs to get a skulltulla in there. The trip's placement is completely immaterial; it's completely out of the way and basically has to end with a savewarp. It can go wherever.
Misc. Gold Skulltullas: The ones I didn't mention should basically be right on the way to all those places(I.E. the ones hidden in trees). I think I set you up to be able to get all of them on this route; if I made a mistake let me know.
Planting beans: I don't know which have to be planted and which can be boosted around, but I put beans early in the route to try to alieviate that.

I don't think our routes are all that different, but I think putting Jabu Jabu first(the key note on what I layed out) really helps insofar as the 100% in concerned. The second time as a kid will basically consist of going to the frogs and getting a few pieces of heart on the river, playing the purdue of light, getting din's fire, getting that REALLY annoying Skulltulla near Hyrule Castle, playing the Purdue of Light again, and returning to an adult, this time for good. All you need from being an adult for this is the song of storms, and since the hookshot segment(including the song of storms) is basically the first thing you do as an adult, the return to a child segment should be done immediately after the forest temple segment. If that doesn't work out and Din's Fire is really needed for an early shadow which saves a ton of time, Din's Fire could be picked up right before becoming and adult with minimum time loss(or, even better, right after getting the skull mask as we savewarp after that).

I hope I've been helpful; I really would have loved to do this myself, but my technical skills at this game are far from perfect, and I fear losing segments to missing jumping over gates and the like a lot. Good luck with this, and just let me know when the time comes do discuss adult link's route.

Ok, I thought about it, and I had a simple idea.

Do Jabu Jabu first.  You'll have to make an extra trip to get Faeroe's Wind, but think of all the return trips you save. Actually, IMO, you could probably put off doing it until the Ice Cavern.  The trip into Haunted Wasteland as an adult is probably about as time wasting as going back for the spell, and you can clear out kid link's spirit temple easily and save a return trip to Dodongo's Cavern(well, you have to go back in as an adult anyway, but I think you save at least a little time in there).  It frees you up a lot as you can put Lon Lon Ranch whenever's convenient(i.e. whenever you run by closest) and it lets you do the second Gerudo Valley trip pretty easily(you don't have to worry about day/night as trip 2 will be after the sun's song so if you missed the skulltulla the first time due to day you can get it on the second trip); the second trip is basically running in, getting the Skulltulla on the wall if you don't have it, jumping down into the valley and getting the skulltulla from the dirt(do you have to plant this bean for adult link?), getting the piece of heart, going downstream, getting the skulltulla on the back of the house, getting the skulltulla from the dirt by the house, getting the piece of heart from diving in the house, and owl warping to the market(which means that if you have to you can make it a part of the last segment before the temple of time).  Jabu Jabu first also gives you an early bottle; the other two are fairly well out of the way as you are right about one trip to the graveyard being best, and you might even get away with one trip to Kakariko too.  And of course Lon Lon ranch should be avoided until you have a boomerang.

Hmm, I would probably want to do a route about like this(a lot of details forgotten, but this is a skeleton):

Sword and Shield
Great Deku Tree/Slingshot/Kokiri Emerald(savewarp)
Fairy Ocerina
Set Scarecrow's Song
Gold Scale/Fishing piece of heart(you can do both at once and be done with fishing forever)
Letter in a Bottle
King Zora
Light the torches around Zora's domain for a PoH
Fish
Jabu Jabu/Boomerang/Zora's Sapphire
Decend Zora's River obtaining everything with Boomerang(the piece of heart you need a cucoo for can be gotten when you go for the frogs)/Magic Beans
Savewarp
Child Spirit stuff with all those skulltullas being availiable/bombchus/silver gauntlets
Savewarp
Backwalk to market/Zelda's Lullaby/Zelda's letter
Goto Kakariko
Sun's Song/tons of skulltullas/giants wallet(if possible, I hope so)/show letter/cucoo gathering bottle
Use Bombchus to enter Dodongo's Cavern
Dodongo's Cavern/Bombs/Goron's Ruby
Goron City Gold Skulltullas/Bomb bag expansion/piece of heart from bombing pot
Magic Meter/Gold Skulltulla in Death Mountain Crater
Owlwarp/goto market/Ocerina of Time/Song of Time
Begin Happy Mask Quest
Goto Kakariko and drop off first mask
Return to Happy Mask Shop and retrieve Skull Mask
Savewarp(finally!)
alll the forest skulltullas/Slingshot capacity upgrade/piece of heart nearby/deku theater deku stick upgrade/saria's song
savewarp
give skull mask/2nd deku stick capacity upgrade/damage boost onto bridge/gerudo valley second visit(skulltullas, piece of heart)/go down river(2 skulltullas, piece of heart)/owlwarp to market
Get Spooky Mask
Goto Graveyard/give spooky mask/dampe's gravedigging tour/bottom of the well/lens of truth/you need the giant's wallet now if you couldn't get it before
Goto Market/Bunny Hood
Lon Lon Ranch/bottle/skulltullas/piece of heart/epona's song
Sell Bunny Hood to fill wallet
Mask of Truth
Savewarp
Show Mask of Truth to Deku Theater for Deku Nut upgrade
Savewarp
Backwalk to market
market minigames(slingshot upgrade/bomb upgrade/2 pieces of heart)/dog piece of heart/Become an Adult

Ok, here's what I left out:

Din's Fire: We're becomming a kid again pretty fast, and there's a skulltulla near the castle that requires the song of storms
Nayru's Love: We can get it as an adult
Faeroe's Wind: We can do it when we go to the Ice Cavern
2nd Deku Nut Upgrade: I honestly forgot where it is; I hope it's convenient and on the way at some point
Piece of Heart buried near Lake Hylia/hyrule field stuff in general: I hope we can do most/all of this as an adult as we'll have epona and bombs for the whole time then.
Piece of Heart that requires Cucoo on Zora's River: Easily obtained when we go back for the frogs
2nd trip to Deku Tree: You need bombs to get a skulltulla in there.  The trip's placement is completely immaterial; it's completely out of the way and basically has to end with a savewarp.  It can go wherever.
Misc. Gold Skulltullas: The ones I didn't mention should basically be right on the way to all those places(I.E. the ones hidden in trees).  I think I set you up to be able to get all of them on this route; if I made a mistake let me know.
Planting beans: I don't know which have to be planted and which can be boosted around, but I put beans early in the route to try to alieviate that.

I don't think our routes are all that different, but I think putting Jabu Jabu first(the key note on what I layed out) really helps insofar as the 100% in concerned.  The second time as a kid will basically consist of going to the frogs and getting a few pieces of heart on the river, playing the purdue of light, getting din's fire, getting that REALLY annoying Skulltulla near Hyrule Castle, playing the Purdue of Light again, and returning to an adult, this time for good.  All you need from being an adult for this is the song of storms, and since the hookshot segment(including the song of storms) is basically the first thing you do as an adult, the return to a child segment should be done immediately after the forest temple segment.  If that doesn't work out and Din's Fire is really needed for an early shadow which saves a ton of time, Din's Fire could be picked up right before becoming and adult with minimum time loss(or, even better, right after getting the skull mask as we savewarp after that).

I hope I've been helpful; I really would have loved to do this myself, but my technical skills at this game are far from perfect, and I fear losing segments to missing jumping over gates and the like a lot.  Good luck with this, and just let me know when the time comes do discuss adult link's route.

petrie911

2006-06-08 03:28:16 am

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

The 2nd Deku nut upgrade is under a bombable rock in the Lost Woods, IIRC. I think it's one of the ones near the Sacred Forest Meadow.

In your route, AA, you mention going back to Zora's River after becoming a child again. I'm *pretty* sure that the Owl will be there given the route you have, as he doesn't show up until you get Saria's song, and your route doesn't go back to Zora's river after Saria's song. So we may need to find a way around him.

Also, for the record, it's the Prelude of Light, not the Purdue of Light...

Manocheese

Edit history:

Manocheese: 2006-06-08 04:22:37 am

2006-06-08 04:22:28 am

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

I think our best bet for forming a near-optimal route would be to list the requirements of everything we're getting and then form chunks; we will get certain things chronologically adjacent to each other. We should then mold the chunks together and tweak them.

qqwref

2006-06-08 04:39:12 am

I like this site name cause it's easy to remember.

Sounds like the Majora's Mask run. Hmm...

Question: is the final run going to have the 37th heart piece or not? I think you should get it, but I'm not going to argue, I just want to know.

Manocheese

2006-06-08 04:43:48 am

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

Quote:

I asked Radix about the 37th Heart Piece. He said it's the same thing as getting 101% for Metroid Prime 2: Echoes.

Amazing Ampharos

2006-06-08 05:21:45 am

Argh, Prelude. I'm sorry; I feel dumb now.

Also, the issue with the owl is annoying, but I don't see any way around it. You have to go there with the Song of Storms which means with Saria's Song. So the owl will be there on at least one trip there unless you never go up the river. Is it faster to savewarp to Link's house and take the warp to the top of Zora's River? That would probably work out for getting to the frogs, but you need that cucoo either way, unless damage boosts or the boomerang can get that heart piece. If they can, awesome.

I don't think it works out so much like the MM run as this game is a lot more linear than MM(which after all the stunts people can pull has only the minimal linearity of the first three days and that you end with the MM fight; literally everything else in that game can be done out of order). I think breaking it into Child Link and Adult Link is best as we are doing; there's a bit of overlap but not much. After that I think we basically have to think about each area and think what items are required to get everything there. That was basically my philosophy for the route I suggested. The Boomerang is the fundamental requirement, and the silver gauntlets/bombchus are the next issue. With those you can literally do everything so it's just a matter of efficient travel times without screwing yourself(let's get all three sacred stones before Zelda's Lullaby!). I think adult breaks down similarly, but in it the hookshot is basically the one thing you need. Then you want hover boots, the longshot, and the bow ASAP. The hammer is nice, but it can really wait, and everything else is basically just needed in narrow contexts so you don't have to worry about it. I haven't put a lot of thought into the adult route, but it would probably go, dungeon wise:

Early Shadow(Hover Boots) -> Ice Cavern -> Forest(via warp in Zora's River) -> Kid Link II -> Water Temple -> Fire Temple -> Shadow Temple(to finish it) -> Spirit Temple -> Ganon

I'm not sure though; I think focusing on kid link now is the important thing. IMO his route is trickier as there are a lot more timesavers as an adult(warp songs, Epona) so there you can rearrange things with minimal time loss whereas as a kid a misplacement can force you to run across Hyrule Field an extra time which is not a good amount of time to lose. Not to mention the key exploration items, most notably bombs, are gotten as a kid so you have to plan to not have them for a while.

Argh, Prelude.  I'm sorry; I feel dumb now.

Also, the issue with the owl is annoying, but I don't see any way around it.  You have to go there with the Song of Storms which means with Saria's Song.  So the owl will be there on at least one trip there unless you never go up the river.  Is it faster to savewarp to Link's house and take the warp to the top of Zora's River?  That would probably work out for getting to the frogs, but you need that cucoo either way, unless damage boosts or the boomerang can get that heart piece.  If they can, awesome.

I don't think it works out so much like the MM run as this game is a lot more linear than MM(which after all the stunts people can pull has only the minimal linearity of the first three days and that you end with the MM fight; literally everything else in that game can be done out of order).  I think breaking it into Child Link and Adult Link is best as we are doing; there's a bit of overlap but not much.  After that I think we basically have to think about each area and think what items are required to get everything there.  That was basically my philosophy for the route I suggested.  The Boomerang is the fundamental requirement, and the silver gauntlets/bombchus are the next issue.  With those you can literally do everything so it's just a matter of efficient travel times without screwing yourself(let's get all three sacred stones before Zelda's Lullaby!).  I think adult breaks down similarly, but in it the hookshot is basically the one thing you need.  Then you want hover boots, the longshot, and the bow ASAP.  The hammer is nice, but it can really wait, and everything else is basically just needed in narrow contexts so you don't have to worry about it.  I haven't put a lot of thought into the adult route, but it would probably go, dungeon wise:

Early Shadow(Hover Boots) -> Ice Cavern -> Forest(via warp in Zora's River) -> Kid Link II -> Water Temple -> Fire  Temple -> Shadow Temple(to finish it) -> Spirit Temple -> Ganon

I'm not sure though; I think focusing on kid link now is the important thing.  IMO his route is trickier as there are a lot more timesavers as an adult(warp songs, Epona) so there you can rearrange things with minimal time loss whereas as a kid a misplacement can force you to run across Hyrule Field an extra time which is not a good amount of time to lose.  Not to mention the key exploration items, most notably bombs, are gotten as a kid so you have to plan to not have them for a while.

petrie911

2006-06-08 06:27:33 am

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

On the upside, I just thought of a way past the owl.

Upon entering from Hyrule field, bombhcu the rocks and store a ground jump. As long as you have the ground jump stored, dialogue is disabled and the owl won't talk to you. Thus you can walk right through. However, I do recommend testing this.

If you enter from the other end, you should never get close enough to the owl, IIRC, and can just warp back to the Temple of Time with the Prelude.

YautjaElder

Edit history:

YautjaElder: 2006-06-08 07:58:08 am

2006-06-08 07:56:26 am

Speed is the key.

Quote:

On the upside, I just thought of a way past the owl.

Upon entering from Hyrule field, bombhcu the rocks and store a ground jump. As long as you have the ground jump stored, dialogue is disabled and the owl won't talk to you. Thus you can walk right through. However, I do recommend testing this.

If you enter from the other end, you should never get close enough to the owl, IIRC, and can just warp back to the Temple of Time with the Prelude.

I can confirm... Smiley

There is a way to get the heart piece with the boomerang, though:

Fear.

I can easily do Shadow Early and skip Din's Fire in the same segment, so don't worrry about that. And about the adult route, remember that we'll have to get the Biggoron sword in there, AND the big poe hunting (there is a useful map on GameFAQ's).

This is what it looks like, might be easier to plan:

Kakariko Village: Cojiro
Lost Woods: Odd Mushroom
Kakariko Village: Odd medicine
Lost Woods: Saw
Gerudo Valley: Broken sword
Death Mountain Trail: Prescription
Zora's Domain: Eyeball frog
Lake Hylia: Eyedrops (could also get diving heart piece now)
Death Mountain Trail: Biggoron Sword

______________________________________

Your child route looks great, I'll check over it later and add in all the skulltulas. Thank you very much, you've inspired me even more to do this run. Grin

[quote]On the upside, I just thought of a way past the owl.

Upon entering from Hyrule field, bombhcu the rocks and store a ground jump.  As long as you have the ground jump stored, dialogue is disabled and the owl won't talk to you.  Thus you can walk right through.  However, I do recommend testing this.

If you enter from the other end, you should never get close enough to the owl, IIRC, and can just warp back to the Temple of Time with the Prelude.[/quote]
I can confirm... :)

There is a way to get the heart piece with the boomerang, though: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_N4mjRkyhM

Fear.

I can easily do Shadow Early and skip Din's Fire in the same segment, so don't worrry about that. And about the adult route, remember that we'll have to get the Biggoron sword in there, AND the big poe hunting (there is a useful map on GameFAQ's).

This is what it looks like, might be easier to plan:

Kakariko Village: Cojiro
Lost Woods: Odd Mushroom
Kakariko Village: Odd medicine
Lost Woods: Saw
Gerudo Valley: Broken sword
Death Mountain Trail: Prescription
Zora's Domain: Eyeball frog
Lake Hylia: Eyedrops (could also get diving heart piece now)
Death Mountain Trail: Biggoron Sword

______________________________________

Your child route looks great, I'll check over it later and add in all the skulltulas. Thank you very much, you've inspired me even more to do this run. ;D

Fail Boat

2006-06-08 08:07:40 am

forum lurker

I was starting a child route a long time ago. It's not finished yet, but almost is. I had to upload it because it's pretty long and specific. Incase anyone is wondering, it's a Word Perfect document.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=HI69UT8B

There is probably alot of spelling mistakes but Tongue

YautjaElder

2006-06-08 08:30:29 am

Speed is the key.

Quote:

I was starting a child route a long time ago. It's not finished yet, but almost is. I had to upload it because it's pretty long and specific. Incase anyone is wondering, it's a Word Perfect document.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=HI69UT8B

There is probably alot of spelling mistakes but Tongue

Too bad, I can't view it since I don't have word perfect. Sad

Amazing Ampharos, I noticed something... In your route, you get magic beans pretty early. I need 4 magic beans to get everything as an adult and that's 90 rupees! I dunno where to get all that money in your route. :-/

Amazing Ampharos

2006-06-08 09:38:45 am

Ok, you need 4... I didn't know how many we needed. Ok, that's a lot of money, and you probably won't get that much in Jabu Jabu. Hmm, I'm trying to think, are there any hidden money sources along the river or in Zora's Domain? I seem to remember there being a hard to reach hole at Zora's River with some money in it, and a round of the zora diving game nets some profit if you need it(only one round though as you can't collect the silver scale). We also do have the money drops from Jabu Jabu's Belly, and we can probably pick up a bit of money in Lake Hylia too. Odds are the fishing game will deplete everything you get out of the Great Deku Tree too so we can't count on that. Ideally we would wait a long time for this and buy them with the money from the bunny hood, but that almost has to come near the end by the nature of it, and I'm pretty sure beans early is ideal.

I think I figured something out, but you will hate me as it's an asinine solution at the very best. Right in front of the shop in Zora's Domain, there are two pots. One always has a blue rupee; the other always has a green one. My idea is to rapidly enter and exit the shop and harvest them. You exit the shop literally adjacent to them. Quickspin! You'll break both pots, and easily grab the rupees. 15 repititions of this is 90 rupees. We can assume you'll have one or two rupees left over after fishing(maybe more depending on the Deku Tree), you can snag a few rupees at the bottom of lake hylia/slashing bushes as you run by, and you'll pick up a few in Jabu Jabu so in practice it's actually considerably less; maybe only 7 or 8 repititions. Plus you can probably count on four random rupees as you drift down the river near Zora's Domain. I can't honestly believe I'm suggesting something so silly, but I think it's more time efficient than it seems.

The other option is to all out amend the route and get Zelda's Lullaby first. This lets us stop by the rupee room and we can play Zelda's Lullaby for the frogs for an easy 50 rupees. It sounds nice, but I'd hate to throw away the trip across hyrule field that we basically make extra for Zelda's Lullaby early. I think the stupid thing with the pots by the shop is actually faster. I would test it, but I was playing with my lousy yellow controller with a bad joystick so I couldn't quickspin(not to mention I'm not practiced enough to quickspin 100%). I hate that the diving game acts like you don't have a scale if you do prize upgrade; if it didn't this would be easy as the later diving game nets a 50 rupee profit. We can't even suck it up and do it an extra time because the silver scale replaces the gold...

Ok, I hope my rupee idea works. I think it comes down to how many rupees you have going into it. If you have 30, that's only 10 repititions, and 10 is pretty fast to be honest about it. 10 times entering and exiting the shop -> quickspinning. Unless that whole thing honestly takes 6 seconds, we lose less than a minute on rupee harvesting. I also know there's random 5 rupee chests in dungeons; do GDT and JJ have any handy? Can the rupee route for the kokiri shield be slightly amended to pick up a few extras? If we are clever about picking up a few extra here and there, we can probably be ready for 90 by then. The shop thing ensures we CAN get 90 no matter what, but it's probably not as fast as rupees that can be gotten in dungeons/a few of the nice ones lying around the kokiri forest.

We can get the diving heart piece as a kid really easily with almost no time loss; I worry about doing it when you do the eyedrops as we do have to worry about timers and possibly events overriding each other. And SNAP! As I was typing this post, I remembered something cool, I went to my N64 to check, and I was right. There are 40 rupees on the bottom of that pond. We can do this immediately after getting the gold scale for a fast 40 rupees. We had to do it anyway so it's not a horrible time loss; just the time to go back and forth from the fishing game. I think 40 rupees is probably worth it. That cuts down on the rapid 6 rupee thing quite a bit(it's over 6 repititions to get 40 rupees so this is almost undoubtedly faster).

Ok, so I think I have my solution. First of all maximize rupees gotten on the rupee route for the shield and in the two dungeons. With minor route modifications, that should yield us at least 20. We get 40 from the diving. That means we only have to do the pot thing 5 times! I think it all works out. This post was probably incoherent as I figured stuff out as I typed, but it's 3:32 AM, and I was playing Zelda. I don't feel like fixing it, and I think I got the message across. IMO my route stands.

Also, I didn't forget the biggoron sword sidequest; I just chose to not worry about it as adult link has a ton of planning to do, and I want to devote my mental energies to kid link right now. Also, Yautja Elder, thank you for pointing out such a flaw in my route; you inspired me to actually boot up this game and to play Zelda in the middle of the night/wee hours of the morning. If there are any further route problems, please let me know.

Ok, you need 4...  I didn't know how many we needed.  Ok, that's a lot of money, and you probably won't get that much in Jabu Jabu.  Hmm, I'm trying to think, are there any hidden money sources along the river or in Zora's Domain?  I seem to remember there being a hard to reach hole at Zora's River with some money in it, and a round of the zora diving game nets some profit if you need it(only one round though as you can't collect the silver scale).  We also do have the money drops from Jabu Jabu's Belly, and   we can probably pick up a bit of money in Lake Hylia too.  Odds are the fishing game will deplete everything you get out of the Great Deku Tree too so we can't count on that.  Ideally we would wait a long time for this and buy them with the money from the bunny hood, but that almost has to come near the end by the nature of it, and I'm pretty sure beans early is ideal.

I think I figured something out, but you will hate me as it's  an asinine solution at the very best.  Right in front of the shop in Zora's Domain, there are two pots.  One always has a blue rupee; the other always has a green one.  My idea is to rapidly enter and exit the shop and harvest them.  You exit the shop literally adjacent to them.  Quickspin!  You'll break both pots, and easily grab the rupees.  15 repititions of this is 90 rupees.  We can assume you'll have one or two rupees left over after fishing(maybe more depending on the Deku Tree), you can snag a few rupees at the bottom of lake hylia/slashing bushes as you run by, and you'll pick up a few in Jabu Jabu so in practice it's actually considerably less; maybe only 7 or 8 repititions.  Plus you can probably count on four random rupees as you drift down the river near Zora's Domain.  I can't honestly believe I'm suggesting something so silly, but I think it's more time efficient than it seems.

The other option is to all out amend the route and get Zelda's Lullaby first.  This lets us stop by the rupee room and we can play Zelda's Lullaby for the frogs for an easy 50 rupees.  It sounds nice, but I'd hate to throw away the trip across hyrule field that we basically make extra for Zelda's Lullaby early.  I think the stupid thing with the pots by the shop is actually faster.  I would test it, but I was playing with my lousy yellow controller with a bad joystick so I couldn't quickspin(not to mention I'm not practiced enough to quickspin 100%).  I hate that the diving game acts like you don't have a scale if you do prize upgrade; if it didn't this would be easy as the later diving game nets a 50 rupee profit.  We can't even suck it up and do it an extra time because the silver scale replaces the gold...

Ok, I hope my rupee idea works.  I think it comes down to how many rupees you have going into it.  If you have 30, that's only 10 repititions, and 10 is pretty fast to be honest about it.  10 times entering and exiting the shop -> quickspinning.  Unless that whole thing honestly takes 6 seconds, we lose less than a minute on rupee harvesting.  I also know there's random 5 rupee chests in dungeons; do GDT and JJ have any handy?  Can the rupee route for the kokiri shield be slightly amended to pick up a few extras?  If we are clever about picking up a few extra here and there, we can probably be ready for 90 by then.  The shop thing ensures we CAN get 90 no matter what, but it's probably not as fast as rupees that can be gotten in dungeons/a few of the nice ones lying around the kokiri forest.

We can get the diving heart piece as a kid really easily with almost no time loss; I worry about doing it when you do the eyedrops as we do have to worry about timers and possibly events overriding each other.  And SNAP!  As I was typing this post, I remembered something cool, I went to my N64 to check, and I was right.  There are 40 rupees on the bottom of that pond.  We can do this immediately after getting the gold scale for a fast 40 rupees.  We had to do it anyway so it's not a horrible time loss; just the time to go back and forth from the fishing game.  I think 40 rupees is probably worth it.  That cuts down on the rapid 6 rupee thing quite a bit(it's over 6 repititions to get 40 rupees so this is almost undoubtedly faster).

Ok, so I think I have my solution.  First of all maximize rupees gotten on the rupee route for the shield and in the two dungeons.  With minor route modifications, that should yield us at least 20.  We get 40 from the diving.  That means we only have to do the pot thing 5 times!  I think it all works out.  This post was probably incoherent as I figured stuff out as I typed, but it's 3:32 AM, and I was playing Zelda.  I don't feel like fixing it, and I think I got the message across.  IMO my route stands.

Also, I didn't forget the biggoron sword sidequest; I just chose to not worry about it as adult link has a ton of planning to do, and I want to devote my mental energies to kid link right now.   Also, Yautja Elder, thank you for pointing out such a flaw in my route; you inspired me to actually boot up this game and to play Zelda in the middle of the night/wee hours of the morning.  If there are any further route problems, please let me know.