Donkey Kong 64

deutsch_joe

Edit history:

deutsch_joe: 2006-01-24 05:30:48 am

2006-01-24 05:28:39 am

............... .......

Thanks for the notes, Wouter!

DateHell hasn't posted in a long time. I wonder if he still wants to do the run.

I'm still not 100% sure I want to, but the longer he doesn't post, the more likely that I will end up doing it.

I already have the Nintendo Power guide to Donkey Kong 64, but I don't like their guides, so I bought a Prima's guide for DK64 off of Ebay recently.

I think between those two guides, Wouter's notes and his videos, I think I might be able to work out some good routes - even though I don't actually have a Nintendo 64 with me. But don't worry, I shall get my Nintendo 64 pretty soon - within a month or so. (I have to drive all the way back to my house, you know!)

Something I thought of - bosses don't have to be fought as the very last part of a segment. (Well, maybe with the exception of the later levels.) Since you beat the boss and then walk out where you walked into Troff n' Scoff, they can be part of the route, as opposed to the end. (Just have to have enough bananas.)

Another thing I thought of - I think I might start two files at once when I actually start the one. One will be used for practicing segments before I attempt them and the other one will be for the actual run. So I'll have a route planned out and I'll go memorize run- practice - do the run - memorize the run - practice - do the run. Getting used to those pain in the ass boss fights and annoying mini-games beforehand would greatly benefit the run.

Something else - I think I'm going to start the run like so:

Go though all the starting crap.
Get Diddy. Then just get enough bananas to fight the boss and enough Golden Bananas to get to Angry Aztec as well as getting Donkey and Diddy equipped with moves, etc.
Go to Angry Aztec. Repeat the Jungle Japes procedure with Tiny and Lanky.
Go to Frantic Factory. Free Chunky and get him equipped with all of the necessities and then complete Frantic Factory. Then the game can be taken on for real.

By the way, who's actually interesting in seeing a speed run of this? Please post if you do, I just want to get a good idea of how much demand there is for this run.

Thanks for the notes, Wouter!

DateHell hasn't posted in a long time. I wonder if he still wants to do the run.

I'm still not 100% sure I want to, but the longer he doesn't post, the more likely that I will end up doing it.

I already have the Nintendo Power guide to Donkey Kong 64, but I don't like their guides, so I bought a Prima's guide for DK64 off of Ebay recently.

I think between those two guides, Wouter's notes and his videos, I think I might be able to work out some good routes - even though I don't actually have a Nintendo 64 with me. But don't worry, I shall get my Nintendo 64 pretty soon - within a month or so. (I have to drive all the way back to my house, you know!)

Something I thought of - bosses don't have to be fought as the very last part of a segment. (Well, maybe with the exception of the later levels.) Since you beat the boss and then walk out where you walked into Troff n' Scoff, they can be part of the route, as opposed to the end. (Just have to have enough bananas.)

Another thing I thought of - I think I might start two files at once when I actually start the one. One will be used for practicing segments before I attempt them and the other one will be for the actual run. So I'll have a route planned out and I'll go memorize run- practice - do the run - memorize the run - practice - do the run. Getting used to those pain in the ass boss fights and annoying mini-games beforehand would greatly benefit the run.

Something else - I think I'm going to start the run like so:

Go though all the starting crap.
Get Diddy. Then just get enough bananas to fight the boss and enough Golden Bananas to get to Angry Aztec as well as getting Donkey and Diddy equipped with moves, etc.
Go to Angry Aztec. Repeat the Jungle Japes procedure with Tiny and Lanky.
Go to Frantic Factory. Free Chunky and get him equipped with all of the necessities and then complete Frantic Factory. Then the game can be taken on for real.

By the way, who's actually interesting in seeing a speed run of this? Please post if you do, I just want to get a good idea of how much demand there is for this run.

Yoshi348

2006-01-24 05:37:51 am

dinosaur from the past

I might watch it.

Dragorn

2006-01-24 05:39:20 am

I thought it was just a surprise party!

I didn't care for this game as much as Rare's other platformers, but I'd probably watch it too.

EJO9876

2006-01-24 05:47:59 am

*Insert witty comment here*

i've been wanting to see this game run for a while. i might just play through this game again for the hell of it (not for speed though).

Wouter_Jansen

2006-01-24 10:50:41 am

Yes, a bunny riding a towel

I'll watch anything that beats my time ok Wink

It would really be great if you get a good enough time to be posted on SDA

YautjaElder

2006-01-24 11:31:59 am

Speed is the key.

This was my favorite game for a year back in the day...

If you can make a nice run, sure I'll watch it. Wink

starocean2nd

2006-01-24 03:36:46 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

I would definitely watch it!!!!

Paused

2006-01-24 04:42:45 pm

Yeah I would watch it too.

-Suzaku-

2006-01-24 04:43:53 pm

Eternal Understudy

I'd watch it, despite the fact that I very much dislike DK64.

Wouter_Jansen

2006-01-25 12:40:57 am

Yes, a bunny riding a towel

not to be confused with DK94 *looks at sig 1 post up* Wink

darkwasabi

2006-01-25 12:43:58 am

King of hearts

zOMG ME WATCH!

Metal

2006-01-25 12:44:03 am

Hmmm....

Yea mate I'll watch it loved that game and can't wait to see the run.

Good Luck

deutsch_joe

2006-01-25 05:32:27 am

............... .......

Well, alright then. Looks like there's plenty of people wanting to see this run.

I guess I'll start route planning when my Prima's guide comes in. I could use my Nintendo Power one, but they have a map for the banana ports, Banana Fairies, Troff n' Scoff and Battle Arena locations seperate from all of the Kong's maps. (One map for each Kong and the one just mentioned.) That makes six maps and is kind of irritating to plan a route out with.

Hopefully Prima's guide will be better. (They usually are.)

Remember, I don't have my N64 with me, so don't expect me to get started right away.

Rael

2006-01-25 05:35:15 am

I have the prima guide, just not with me

IIRC, it was the same way with the prima one

DateHell

Edit history:

DateHell: 2006-01-25 07:58:13 am

2006-01-25 07:56:13 am

po0oq

Heh, sorry about the late reply... let me clarify some things, I will not be doing a speedrun on DonkeyKong, not 101%, 100-bananas, not 6-bananas.

why?
- I simply do not have enough discipline and/or time to do a run
- It'd have to be pretty much perfect for me to think of it as acceptable, and I know I will never achieve such a thing
- I don't think of DK as that good a game tbh
- There's too many hazards in this long game... with no true segmenting I wouldn't have a chance. (N-coin for instance)

sorry if i got your hopes up Lips Sealed

btw, if I would do one, it would include all regular bananas Grin

edit:
I'm happy to help somebody else if/when he or she wants to have a go

edit2:
Deutsche/Rael, any chance of me seeing a digital copy of either (or both :P) of those guides? Smiley

Rael

2006-01-25 06:13:32 pm

Um, in March?

I kinda left all of my console stuff back in LA and I'm in Stockton, CA (near sacramento) writing this, and I won't have access to anything till spring break, and deutsche will probably have his prima guide by then anyway

sorry about that

mike89

2006-01-25 09:49:41 pm

SEGA Junkie

Quote:

- There's too many hazards in this long game... with no true segmenting I wouldn't have a chance. (N-coin for instance)

Just do what Dragorn did for Banjo-Tooie. Copy your save file, and if you screw up just delete the screwed-up one and copy the correct one again.

(Note that this doesn't go to anyone in particular, but anyone who wants to give this a go.)

FTC

2006-01-25 10:29:02 pm

Quote:

Just do what Dragorn did for Banjo-Tooie. Copy your save file, and if you screw up just delete the screwed-up one and copy the correct one again.

(Note that this doesn't go to anyone in particular, but anyone who wants to give this a go.)

... You can't copy data in Donkey Kong 64, IIRC.

CannibalK9

2006-01-25 10:33:53 pm

give me your eyes!!!

I haven't even played DK64 but I'm sure that has come up repeatedly throughout this topic.

deutsch_joe

2006-01-26 12:31:06 am

............... .......

Quote:

I have the prima guide, just not with me

IIRC, it was the same way with the prima one

I hope you're wrong about that... I guess we'll find out before the end of the week.

Quote:

- I simply do not have enough discipline and/or time to do a run
- It'd have to be pretty much perfect for me to think of it as acceptable, and I know I will never achieve such a thing
- There's too many hazards in this long game... with no true segmenting I wouldn't have a chance. (N-coin for instance)

...

Deutsche/Rael, any chance of me seeing a digital copy of either (or both Tongue) of those guides?

Well, to be honest, I don't have a lot of time either. I'm in college taking three upper level physics classes, an upper level math class and one gen. ed. That, and I don't even have my N64.

I'm going to be doing this run inbetween days where I'm busy with homework assignments.

As for the perfection and hazards and all of that...just keep reading on. And, I'm only planning on getting 75 bananas with each Kong for each level as that's all I need for Banana Medals...and Banana Medals count towards the final percentage...so...

As for scanning my Nintendo Power guide...it's 128 pages. That's a lot of scanning (and work) to do on top of my assignments and planning/doing the speed run.

Quote:

You can't copy data in Donkey Kong 64, IIRC.

I don't think you can either. If not, what I plan on doing to help reduce mistakes is this:

Creating two new files. One will be to practice segments exactly how I plan them so if I encounter a kink, then I'll know how to deal with it/avoid it right away when I actually do the run. And the other one will actually be used to do the run.

Good idea or not?

[quote]I have the prima guide, just not with me
 
IIRC, it was the same way with the prima one[/quote]

I hope you're wrong about that... I guess we'll find out before the end of the week.

[quote]- I simply do not have enough discipline and/or time to do a run
- It'd have to be pretty much perfect for me to think of it as acceptable, and I know I will never achieve such a thing
- There's too many hazards in this long game... with no true segmenting I wouldn't have a chance. (N-coin for instance)
 
...

Deutsche/Rael, any chance of me seeing a digital copy of either (or both Tongue) of those guides?[/quote]

Well, to be honest, I don't have a lot of time either. I'm in college taking three upper level physics classes, an upper level math class and one gen. ed. That, and I don't even have my N64.

I'm going to be doing this run inbetween days where I'm busy with homework assignments.

As for the perfection and hazards and all of that...just keep reading on. And, I'm only planning on getting 75 bananas with each Kong for each level as that's all I need for Banana Medals...and Banana Medals count towards the final percentage...so...

As for scanning my Nintendo Power guide...it's 128 pages. That's a lot of scanning (and work) to do on top of my assignments and planning/doing the speed run.

[quote]You can't copy data in Donkey Kong 64, IIRC.[/quote]

I don't think you can either. If not, what I plan on doing to help reduce mistakes is this:

Creating two new files. One will be to practice segments exactly how I plan them so if I encounter a kink, then I'll know how to deal with it/avoid it right away when I actually do the run. And the other one will actually be used to do the run.

Good idea or not?

mike89

2006-01-26 03:01:17 am

SEGA Junkie

Quote:

... You can't copy data in Donkey Kong 64, IIRC.

Whoa. I forgot about that.

I guess the only other option is to do what deutsch_joe is planning and make two save files.

Alternatively, single-segment it. That should be fun. =D

DateHell

Edit history:

DateHell: 2006-01-27 10:59:09 am

2006-01-27 10:56:36 am

po0oq

Quote:

(...)
I don't think you can either. If not, what I plan on doing to help reduce mistakes is this: (...)

imo, It pretty much goes without saying that (to do a speedrun) you will play the game over and over and over again untill you're close to perfection... thus essentially it shouldn't matter because mistakes are assumed to be random... you don't know in which of the two you will or will not make them. Ofcourse in reality it is a good idea, just to refresh your memory Wink

plan:
1) play through the game thoroughly 'normal' way
2) play through the game writing every single thing down (not needed if gameguide is complete)
3) compile a rough route (might need several (or a lot :)) of play-throughs)
4) test route's individual segments and in 'one pass', editing where neccesairy (if too buggy, back to step 3)
5) practice like a madman... basically keep doing untill you dont progress anymore
6) record it Smiley

FFBlitzace

2006-01-27 05:26:59 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

I had the Bradygames guide and I'm sorry to say that I don't remember what the maps were like.

Anyway, I would love to see this run. I never finished this game myself. I was going through the game getting every single banana, and I go to the last stage and just lost interest for some reason.

deutsch_joe

Edit history:

deutsch_joe: 2006-01-28 11:09:29 pm

2006-01-28 11:04:34 pm

............... .......

I'm sorry I haven't replied in awhile, folks. I've been pretty busy. To make up for it, here's an extra long post.

Quote:

Alternatively, single-segment it. That should be fun. =D

Yeah, I bet! Tongue

I'm planning on doing a 101% speedrun and a 100-banana minimum run as well.

There is a very small chance of me doing a single segment for the latter of the two, but don't count on it.

Quote:

imo, It pretty much goes without saying that (to do a speedrun) you will play the game over and over and over again untill you're close to perfection... thus essentially it shouldn't matter because mistakes are assumed to be random... you don't know in which of the two you will or will not make them.

I understand what you're saying, but that's not what I ment.

What I meant was if I did something the wrong way during my practice run, say for example, I took a wrong turn during one of those annoying Mad Maze Maul minigames and lost because of it, then I can correct it by:

1. Starting over whatever I was doing. (In this case, the Mad Maze Maul.)

2. Do it correctly and remember how I did. (E.G. Take a left hand turn instead of a right.)

3. Then do it the right way the first time when I do the actual speedrun. (Take a left hand turn the first time.)

As far as random mistakes go, what I'm going to do is this:

If I make a huge mistake, such as forgetting to do something or doing something too early that costs me a lot of time to "work around," so to speak, in my route, then I'm starting the whole thing over. (If I have to start over, I probably won't play two simultaneous files.)

If I make more than a few (say 3 or more) medium mistakes throughout the run, such as dying or falling off a ledge or something, then I'm starting over.

If I make MANY minor mistakes that cost me a few seconds each throughout the run, then I'm starting over.

Quote:

I never finished this game myself. I was going through the game getting every single banana, and I go to the last stage and just lost interest for some reason.

...Eh? That's weird.

...Anyway, my freaking Prima's guide never came in. If it hasn't came in by Monday, then I'm going to complain to the seller.

I'm slowly getting prepared to do this run. I had to go to Wal-Mart yesterday and while I was there I picked up two packs of five blank Sony VHS tapes. (The bastards didn't have the high-grade like Nate recommended, so I had to stick with standard. Angry

) Now that I think about it, it was kind of stupid to get the extra pack, since I don't think that I'll be able to do a sub-7 to be able to get it on here. Therefore, Nate won't want to waste his time encoding it, so I'll have to encode it while I play myself and somehow get it to archive.org. (I have experience in video capturing, don't worry. I'll provide a low, normal and high quality in the same fashion that Nate does. [Differing the bitrate of the Divx codec before compression.] Also, I'll encode using S-video straight from my N64.)

But, I think my 100-banana run will be short enough. Therefore, I'm going to record that and send it to Nate. It shouldn't be long enough to need more than five tapes.

So, the extra pack will probably not even be needed. I might end up taking it back.

Concerning the 101% run, in all honesty, I don't think I'm going to be able to beat Wouter's run by a great deal like you people are probably expecting. See, while he did make a lot of mistakes and while his routes could use optimization (as well as a great deal of practice at shooting banana balloons, capturing Banana fairies and those annoying barrel minigames), his run overall, isn't THAT terrible. He seems to really improve what he's doing as his run goes on. When he does a good job on the run, I think trying to up the ante on those parts specifically would probably result in me doing it only very little better.

Also, I'm not giving any time estimates on how fast I can do this run, because in all honesty, I don't know. (I'm very sure that sub 7 is out of reach though.)

Also, I noticed that attacking while walking with Chunky and Lanky doesn't make them move any faster. (I'm not sure if walking around with Lanky's handstand does or not. The same goes for jumping in the air and summersaulting (sp?) forward with Chunky.) Rolling with Donkey and cartwheeling with Diddy, I'm pretty sure, does speed things up. With Tiny attacking, I think so, but I think I'd have to do it on a constant basis as I'm sure she sort of stops after recovering. These are some of the things I'm going to have to experiment with in my completed file before even starting my practice file.

I had more to say about this but I forgot what it was so I'll just stop here. That's enough for one post anyway. That, and I've had this window open for four hours because people keep calling me on my cell phone. Cry

I'm sorry I haven't replied in awhile, folks. I've been pretty busy. To make up for it, here's an extra long post.

[quote] Alternatively, single-segment it. That should be fun. =D[/quote]

Yeah, I bet! :P

I'm planning on doing a 101% speedrun and a 100-banana minimum run as well.

There is a very small chance of me doing a single segment for the latter of the two, but don't count on it.

[quote] imo, It pretty much goes without saying that (to do a speedrun) you will play the game over and over and over again untill you're close to perfection... thus essentially it shouldn't matter because mistakes are assumed to be random... you don't know in which of the two you will or will not make them. [/quote]

I understand what you're saying, but that's not what I ment.

What I meant was if I did something the wrong way during my practice run, say for example, I took a wrong turn during one of those annoying Mad Maze Maul minigames and lost because of it, then I can correct it by:

1. Starting over whatever I was doing. (In this case, the Mad Maze Maul.)

2. Do it correctly and remember how I did. (E.G. Take a left hand turn instead of a right.)

3. Then do it the right way the first time when I do the actual speedrun. (Take a left hand turn the first time.)

As far as random mistakes go, what I'm going to do is this:

If I make a huge mistake, such as forgetting to do something or doing something too early that costs me a lot of time to "work around," so to speak, in my route, then I'm starting the whole thing over. (If I have to start over, I probably won't play two simultaneous files.)

If I make more than a few (say 3 or more) medium mistakes throughout the run, such as dying or falling off a ledge or something, then I'm starting over.

If I make MANY minor mistakes that cost me a few seconds each throughout the run, then I'm starting over.

[quote]I never finished this game myself. I was going through the game getting every single banana, and I go to the last stage and just lost interest for some reason.[/quote]

...Eh? That's weird.

...Anyway, my freaking Prima's guide never came in. If it hasn't came in by Monday, then I'm going to complain to the seller.

I'm slowly getting prepared to do this run. I had to go to Wal-Mart yesterday and while I was there I picked up two packs of five blank Sony VHS tapes. (The bastards didn't have the high-grade like Nate recommended, so I had to stick with standard.  >:( ) Now that I think about it, it was kind of stupid to get the extra pack, since I don't think that I'll be able to do a sub-7 to be able to get it on here. Therefore, Nate won't want to waste his time encoding it, so I'll have to encode it while I play myself and somehow get it to archive.org. (I have experience in video capturing, don't worry. I'll provide a low, normal and high quality in the same fashion that Nate does. [Differing the bitrate of the Divx codec before compression.] Also, I'll encode using S-video straight from my N64.)

But, I think my 100-banana run will be short enough. Therefore, I'm going to record that and send it to Nate. It shouldn't be long enough to need more than five tapes.

So, the extra pack will probably not even be needed. I might end up taking it back.

Concerning the 101% run, in all honesty, I don't think I'm going to be able to beat Wouter's run by a great deal like you people are probably expecting. See, while he did make a lot of mistakes and while his routes could use optimization (as well as a great deal of practice at shooting banana balloons, capturing Banana fairies and those annoying barrel minigames), his run overall, isn't THAT terrible. He seems to really improve what he's doing as his run goes on. When he does a good job on the run, I think trying to up the ante on those parts specifically would probably result in me doing it only very little better.

Also, I'm not giving any time estimates on how fast I can do this run, because in all honesty, I don't know. (I'm very sure that sub 7 is out of reach though.)

Also, I noticed that attacking while walking with Chunky and Lanky doesn't make them move any faster. (I'm not sure if walking around with Lanky's handstand does or not. The same goes for jumping in the air and summersaulting (sp?) forward with Chunky.) Rolling with Donkey and cartwheeling with Diddy, I'm pretty sure, does speed things up. With Tiny attacking, I think so, but I think I'd have to do it on a constant basis as I'm sure she sort of stops after recovering. These are some of the things I'm going to have to experiment with in my completed file before even starting my practice file.

I had more to say about this but I forgot what it was so I'll just stop here. That's enough for one post anyway. That, and I've had this window open for four hours because people keep calling me on my cell phone.  :'(

deutsch_joe

2006-02-11 12:04:15 am

............... .......

Don't reply all at once, people.

Anyway, thought I'd update since I haven't replied in a long long time.

The Prima's guide came in, but it's not much better than the Nintendo power on in terms of maps. -___-

And.... this weekend, I'm leaving school to go back to my parent's houses. (Yes, that's plural.) So I'll get my Nintendo 64 and start working on a speed run next week because, like I said, there are a few things that I want to try in the game before I can start route planning.