Borderlands 2 [Updated - 18th January 2016]

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2012-09-24 11:55:54 am

Categories and what they mean:

Quote:

Any %:
completing the game doing as few or as many missions as the player wishes whilst completing the main story.
Timing ends after killing the warrior and using the vault key

100%:
A completion of the game which also completes all optional side quests before fighting the Warrior.
Timing ends upon handing in the final mission [If the last mission you do is killing the warrior timing ends upon using the vault key]

101%:
A completion of the game which also completes all optional side quests before fighting the Warrior and continues to complete the "You will die [seriously]" quest which is only unlocked after defeating the warrior.
Timing ends upon handing in the completed quest to Tannis in Sanctuary.

New Game:
Using a completely new Axton, Maya, Zero or Salvador character (Recording includes selecting "new game" from menu), Played up to Killing the Warrior. [No Badass ranks]

New Game With DLC:
Using a completely new Gaige or Krieg character WITH Gearbox weapons. (Recording includes selecting "new game" from menu), Played up to Killing the Warrior. [No Badass ranks]

New Game +:
Allows the use of "Badass ranks" (as these are gained from other play-throughs) Played from either level 1 up to killing the Warrior.

Double Run:
is a playthrough of the game from level 1 up to killing warrior in TVHM. [No Badass ranks]

UVHM Run:
Using a pre-made character of level 72 in Ultimate Vault hunter mode with a Lascaux (Blue SMG) and a Vladof Rocket Launcher. [No Money Limit] [No Badass ranks]

Character Save Files:

New game with DLC:
Gaige Perfect Sniper
Krieg Perfect Sniper

Thanks to Shiningface for supplying the NG with DLC saves.

UVHM:
Gaige
Axton
Zero
Maya
Salvador
Krieg

Thanks to OmegaDude1983 for supplying the UVHM character saves.

Quote:

Simply paste into "My Documents/My Games/Borderlands2/WillowGame/SaveData/[Random numbers] folder and rename it to a number which is not in use.

Example:
If you have save0001 - Save0012 Name the file to "Save0013" The matching "Save0013.sav.bak" will be created upon starting the game.

Records:

Leaderboard for everyones best times

NOTE: All records contained in this list are RTA timed runs with times for each loading screen removed from the final time.

Quote:

[A=Axton, M=Maya, S=Salvador, Z=Zer0, G=Gaige, K=Krieg]

New game (Any %):
A: 2:42:53 By TheFunCannon
M: 2:37:58 By TheFunCannon
S: 2:45:45 By TheFunCannon
Z: 2:29:34 By TheFunCannon / Part 2

New game With DLC (Any%):
G: 2:12:52 By TheFunCannon
K: 2:52:34 By TheFunCannon

New game With DLC (101%):
G: 5:52:09 By TheFunCannon

NG Co-op w/DLC:
2P: 1:52:28 By TheFunCannon and Zykoros
4P: 1:54:19 By Abahbob, Blackwayv, ShiningFace and TheFunCannon : ShiningFaces POV / TheFunCannons POV

Double Run:
G: 4:31:51 By TheFunCannon

UVHM72:
A: 1:59:47 By TheFunCannon
M: 1:59:32 By TheFunCannon
S: 2:05:45 By OmegaDude1983
Z: 1:57:32 By TheFunCannon
G: 2:03:45 By TheFunCannon
K: 2:12:13 By TheFunCannon

Note : Runs marked with "0:00:00 By -------" means a run has not been completed for this category.
The highlighted YELLOW Time is the fastest run of all listed

Tricks, Guides and Patcher:

Quote:

Routing: While this changes all the time mainly due to my segmented run requiring more and more Tiny Improvements to save mere seconds, we do have general routing guides in video form created by Professor Broman,
Part One
Part Two
Part Three

Tricks: can generally be found by either going to my Youtube which has most of the skips / glitches OR you can just read through everything in this thread Smiley

or just post your question most of us are perfectly happy to give you the answer.

Patcher:

DrMalcom's V1.8.4 to 1.1.0 Patcher.

Quote from 'drMalcom':

Remove the DLC's you don't need from the DLC folder inside the "data/Bl2_1.8.4_to_1.1.0.xdpatch" directory. I don't know which one is Gaige).

Cbenni's 1.7.0 to 1.6.0 to 1.3.1 to 1.1.0 Patcher: This Patcher will roll your game back to versions 1.7 / 1.6 / 1.3.1 & 1.1.0, should you wish to restore your game to the most recent version you can roll forward using the patcher or let stream update the game itself.
Patcher

VERSION 1.7.0 : If you are rolling back from version 1.7.0 you will need to play the game in offline mode otherwise the game will crash when trying to use more recent files (which are downloaded on start up) on an older game version.

Huge thanks to Cbenni and TheRTB for their previous patchers.

Vault-Hunters:

People who currently or in the past have run the game

Abahbob
Blackwayv
Cbenni (Retired from BL2)
Chfou
ChopperLopie
DonkeyKong
filly_vinyl
HeeroJay
Imysty (Retired from BL2)
Judgy (Retired from BL2)
Mr Derpish
negaphil
OmegaDude
Peach Waldo
Penta
PixelKaye
(Pbra)Ganza
ProfessorBroman (Retired from BL2)
TallKid
TeaWrex (Retired from BL2)
TheFunCannon
ShiningFace
stenkaempen
UberGoos(e) (Retired from BL2)
Vortale (Retired from BL2)
Your_Name_Here (retired from BL2 AFAIK)

If I forgot anyone I Apologize

Thread title:

[b][color="cyan"][u][size="18"]Categories and what they mean:[/size][/u][/color][/b]
[hidden=Catagories][quote]

[color="cyan"]Any %:[/color] 
completing the game doing as few or as many missions as the player wishes whilst completing the main story.
[color="yellow"]Timing ends after killing the warrior and using the vault key[/color]

[color="cyan"]100%:[/color]
A completion of the game which also completes all optional side quests before fighting the Warrior.
[color="yellow"]Timing ends upon handing in the final mission [If the last mission you do is killing the warrior timing ends upon using the vault key][/color]

[color="cyan"]101%:[/color]
A completion of the game which also completes all optional side quests before fighting the Warrior and continues to complete the "[color="yellow"]You will die [seriously][/color]" quest which is only unlocked after defeating the warrior. 
[color="yellow"]Timing ends upon handing in the completed quest to Tannis in Sanctuary.[/color]

[color="cyan"]New Game:[/color] 
Using a completely new Axton, Maya, Zero or Salvador character (Recording includes selecting "new game" from menu), Played up to Killing the Warrior.[color="red"] [No Badass ranks] [/color]

[color="cyan"]New Game With DLC:[/color] 
Using a completely new Gaige or Krieg character WITH Gearbox weapons. (Recording includes selecting "new game" from menu), Played up to Killing the Warrior. [color="red"][No Badass ranks][/color]

[color="cyan"]New Game +:[/color] 
Allows the use of "Badass ranks" (as these are gained from other play-throughs) Played from either level 1 up to killing the Warrior.

[color="cyan"]Double Run:[/color]
is a playthrough of the game from level 1 up to killing warrior in TVHM. [color="red"][No Badass ranks][/color]

[color="cyan"]UVHM Run:[/color] 
 Using a pre-made character of level 72 in Ultimate Vault hunter mode with a Lascaux (Blue SMG) and a Vladof Rocket Launcher. [color="yellow"][No Money Limit][/color] [color="red"][No Badass ranks][/color][/quote][/hidden]

[color="cyan"][u][b][size="18"]Character Save Files:[/size][/b][/u][/color]
[hidden][size="18"][color="cyan"]New game with DLC:[/color][/size]
[url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/53l42mfitxeys64/Save0004.sav]Gaige Perfect Sniper[/url]
[url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/wh8m7drlpslbkhn/Save9166.sav]Krieg Perfect Sniper[/url]

Thanks to [url=http://www.twitch.tv/Shiningface]Shiningface[/url] for supplying the NG with DLC saves.

[size="18"][color="cyan"]UVHM:[/color][/size]
[url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/3t33tdqlokfb2if/save0001%20%28Gaige%29.sav]Gaige[/url]
[url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/dbjrgmnxrpol2gg/save0002%20%28Axton%29.sav]Axton[/url]
[url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/ert9vf1fqb8uzp1/save0003%20%28Zero%29.sav]Zero[/url]
[url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/madwbvxos7quj1f/save0004%20%28Maya%29.sav]Maya[/url]
[url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/49jurh9le6y4kae/save0005%20%28Salvador%29.sav]Salvador[/url]
[url=https://www.dropbox.com/s/fsghwqn9u2fa1ii/save0006%20%28Krieg%29.sav]Krieg[/url]

Thanks to [url=http://www.twitch.tv/OmegaDude1983]OmegaDude1983[/url] for supplying the UVHM character saves.

[hidden=Instructions][quote]Simply paste into "My Documents/My Games/Borderlands2/WillowGame/SaveData/[Random numbers] folder and rename it to a number which is not in use.

Example:
If you have save0001 - Save0012 Name the file to "Save0013" The matching "Save0013.sav.bak" will be created upon starting the game.[/quote][/hidden][/hidden]

[b][color="cyan"][u][size="18"]Records:[/size][/u][/color][/b]

[url=http://www.speedrun.com/bl2][size="18"]Leaderboard[/size][/url] for everyones best times

[hidden=Records]
[color="yellow"][size="18"]NOTE: All records contained in this list are RTA timed runs with times for each loading screen removed from the final time.[/size][/color]
 [quote][A=Axton, M=Maya, S=Salvador, Z=Zer0, G=Gaige, K=Krieg]

[color="cyan"]New game (Any %):[/color]
   A:            2:42:53   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/6076058]TheFunCannon[/url]
   M:            2:37:58   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/6529918]TheFunCannon[/url]
   S:            2:45:45   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/6143330]TheFunCannon[/url]
   Z:            2:29:34   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/4435225]TheFunCannon[/url] / [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/4435231]Part 2[/url]

[color="cyan"]New game With DLC (Any%):[/color]
   G:            2:12:52   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/v/5791567]TheFunCannon[/url]
   K:            2:52:34   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/6224197]TheFunCannon[/url]

[color="cyan"]New game With DLC (101%):[/color]
   G:            5:52:09   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/v/4419587]TheFunCannon[/url]

[color="cyan"]NG Co-op w/DLC:[/color]
   2P:          [color="Yellow"]1:52:28[/color]   By    [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/4981079]TheFunCannon and Zykoros[/url]
   4P:          1:54:19   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/abahbob]Abahbob[/url], [url=http://www.twitch.tv/blackwayv]Blackwayv[/url], [url=http://www.twitch.tv/shiningface]ShiningFace[/url] and [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon]TheFunCannon[/url] : [url=http://www.twitch.tv/shiningface/c/6371112]ShiningFaces POV [/url] / [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/6342046]TheFunCannons POV[/url]

[color="cyan"]Double Run:[/color]
   G:            4:31:51   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/v/5936504]TheFunCannon[/url]

[color="cyan"]UVHM72:[/color]
   A:         1:59:47   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/6262557]TheFunCannon[/url]
   M:         1:59:32   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/6254242]TheFunCannon[/url]
   S:         2:05:45   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/omegadude1983/c/4711312]OmegaDude1983[/url]
   Z:         1:57:32   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/6006159]TheFunCannon[/url]
   G:         2:03:45   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/v/4673161]TheFunCannon[/url]
   K:         2:12:13   By   [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thefuncannon/c/6417396]TheFunCannon[/url]

Note : Runs marked with "0:00:00 By -------" means a run has not been completed for this category.
The highlighted [color="yellow"] YELLOW[/color] Time is the fastest run of all listed[/quote][/hidden]

[b][color="cyan"][u][size="18"]Tricks, Guides and Patcher:[/size][/u][/color][/b]

[hidden="Tricks / Guides / Patcher"][quote][color="cyan"]Routing:[/color] While this changes all the time mainly due to my segmented run requiring more and more Tiny Improvements to save mere seconds, we do have general routing guides in video form created by Professor Broman,
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/professorbroman/c/2457401]Part One[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/professorbroman/c/2545148]Part Two[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/professorbroman/c/2590817]Part Three[/url]

[color="cyan"]Tricks:[/color] can generally be found by either going to my [url=http://www.youtube.com/user/judgementTaG/videos]Youtube[/url] which has most of the skips / glitches OR you can just read through everything in this thread :) or just post your question most of us are perfectly happy to give you the answer.

[u][b][color="cyan"]Patcher:[/color][/b][/u]

[color="cyan"][url=https://mega.nz/#!OBtgDBhZ!AGh05UkFglwxjBuSSsBi2jwPVpiJmnrXmeFkkHH5H1U]DrMalcom's V1.8.4 to 1.1.0 Patcher.[/url][/color] 
[quote='drMalcom']Remove the DLC's you don't need from the DLC folder inside the "data/Bl2_1.8.4_to_1.1.0.xdpatch" directory. I don't know which one is Gaige).[/quote]

[color="cyan"] Cbenni's 1.7.0 to 1.6.0 to 1.3.1 to 1.1.0 Patcher:[/color] This Patcher will roll your game back to versions 1.7 / 1.6 / 1.3.1 &  1.1.0, should you wish to restore your game to the most recent version you can roll forward using the patcher or let stream update the game itself.
[url=http://rtb.kassala.de/BL2/Borderlands%202%20patcher.zip]Patcher[/url]

[color="yellow"]VERSION 1.7.0 : If you are rolling back from version 1.7.0 you will need to play the game in offline mode otherwise the game will crash when trying to use more recent files (which are downloaded on start up) on an older game version.[/color]

Huge thanks to [url=http://www.twitch.tv/cbenni]Cbenni[/url] and [url=http://www.twitch.tv/thertb]TheRTB[/url] for their previous patchers.[/quote][/hidden]

[b][color="cyan"][u][size="18"]Vault-Hunters:[/size][/u][/color][/b]

[hidden]People who currently or in the past have run the game

[url=http://www.twitch.tv/abahbob]Abahbob[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/blackwayv]Blackwayv[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/Cbenni]Cbenni[/url] (Retired from BL2)
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/chfou]Chfou[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/chopperlopie]ChopperLopie[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/donkeykong1254]DonkeyKong[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/filly_vinyl]filly_vinyl[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/heerojay]HeeroJay[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/imysty]Imysty[/url] (Retired from BL2)
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/Judgy_]Judgy[/url] (Retired from BL2)
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/mr_derpish]Mr Derpish[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/negaphil]negaphil[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/omegadude1983]OmegaDude[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/peach_waldo]Peach Waldo[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/pentaleks]Penta[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/pixelkaye]PixelKaye[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/pbraganza](Pbra)Ganza[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/professorbroman]ProfessorBroman[/url] (Retired from BL2)
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/tallkid100]TallKid[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/teawrex]TeaWrex[/url] (Retired from BL2)
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/Thefuncannon]TheFunCannon[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/Shiningface]ShiningFace[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/stenkaempen]stenkaempen[/url]
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/ubergoos]UberGoos(e)[/url] (Retired from BL2)
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/vortale]Vortale[/url] (Retired from BL2)
[url=http://www.twitch.tv/your__name__here]Your_Name_Here[/url] (retired from BL2 AFAIK)

If I forgot anyone I Apologize[/hidden]

Judgy

Edit history:

Judgy: 2014-07-21 12:29:06 pm

2014-07-21 12:07:30 pm

Borderlands 2 Glitch Hunter/ router.

yeah found that like 2 months before AGDQ but kept it secret until AGDQ to try give the run some "New trick" hype, however, it was never used in the AGDQ co-op run [this can also be done using a runner from the C-A-R station]

It can also be done without the run up by any character ....

Judgy

2014-07-24 12:52:28 pm

Borderlands 2 Glitch Hunter/ router.

Can a Mod pass control of the first page to "OmegaDude1983" please. (or instruct me how to do it myself if I need to do it.)

Thank you.

Blackwayv

Edit history:

Blackwayv: 2014-07-29 12:00:51 am

2014-07-28 11:59:21 pm

Let's clarify some shit:

We have leaderboards that get updated very frequently.

There have been tons of strats and such that Funcannon and I (and Judgy apparently) have found for co-op that there are too many route changes for me to remember. I will make an Axton tutorial once Funcannon has his computer fixed.

The Skype group has really only been used for small discussions about irrelevant shit for months now. Nothing new.

Broman won't talk to me privately even though we have shit to clear up and it's pissing me off. I'm just gonna leave it at that until he contacts me, because I've tried contacting him privately several times.

Also, I have this little optimization for single-player
http://www.twitch.tv/blackwayv/c/4011365

That's about it.

TheFuncannon

2014-07-29 12:50:47 pm

Since drama seems inevitable, I may as well re-open a discussion we desperately need to be having. New Game save files. As we as a community have not come to a conclusion abut this yet, and there are people that are using them anyways, lets go ahead and start this.

Personally, in my own thoughts about them, and after switching back to resetting, I am against their use. There are many different runnable sniper rifles, and having a perfect 48 DOES save time. Also, I don't think removing resets warrants a good enough reason to save said time. Plus having them allowed is just drawing arbitrary lines in the sand of where the run "starts". What about this leaves it at a New Game category and not a New Game plus?

Blackwayv

Edit history:

Blackwayv: 2014-07-29 04:37:20 pm

2014-07-29 03:53:37 pm

Why would I waste my time resetting for one if I have a save file that already has a perfect sniper? The character has never had any story progression or even moved at all.

You can get a perfect 48 just by resetting enough, therefore the only advantage a user of a save file gained over others is that the user didn't have to reset.

New game plus? I get that it's called new game, but that save file was a new game that save and quit, and was later pasted in.

The run starts when we gain movement, and we don't gain movement when making that save file.

If someone edits the save file, there is nothing they can edit that we cannot see clearly that gives them any real advantage.

IsraeliRD

2014-07-29 04:06:39 pm

Dragon Power Supreme

Quote from Judgy:

Can a Mod pass control of the first page to "OmegaDude1983" please. (or instruct me how to do it myself if I need to do it.)

Thank you.

Done. Shame to hear you retired, thank you very much for everything Smiley

Moss

2014-07-31 12:51:37 pm

Is there any way to get to 1.31 without the patcher? accidentally updated to 1.83 last night.

TheFuncannon

2014-07-31 07:48:02 pm

But the thing is NO ONE would reset for only a 48. It doesn't save enough time for that to be worth it. Also, if we're looking to reduce resets, why not leave weapons in the stash? this is why it's a silly idea to have arbitrary "start" points for the run. The point of this discussion in my mind is not about advantages gained from save files. It's the principle behind it.

If we're looking to remove RNG, why cherry pick what RNG is "good" and what is "bad"?

Blackwayv

Edit history:

Blackwayv: 2014-08-01 12:45:17 am

2014-08-01 12:44:10 am

ShiningFace reset for a 48.

Leaving weapons in the stash is blatant NG+. This is a new save file that got copied and pasted in later on.

Well, when do we start if not once we gain movement?

You can reset to get whatever you want at the start. What principle are we violating other than not pressing "New Game"?

"Good" RNG is faster, and we are talking about speedruns. "Bad" RNG is usually a reset. Why deal with even more RNG at the start?

The biggest question: HOW THE HELL IS THAT NG+?

Blackwayv

2014-08-01 12:50:46 am

Quote from Moss:

Is there any way to get to 1.31 without the patcher? accidentally updated to 1.83 last night.

No, you must patch down. Also, why play on 1.3.1? If you're going to be using the Mechromancer or playing Co-op, you need to be on 1.1.0 for speedruns because of the Amp Shield exploit.

Moss

2014-08-01 03:57:22 am

Quote from Blackwayv:

Quote from Moss:

Is there any way to get to 1.31 without the patcher? accidentally updated to 1.83 last night.

I can't figure out how to get the patcher to work with 1.83, it just breaks the game. I want 1.31 because of UVHM. At this point I'd be happy to get back to 1.1 though.
No, you must patch down. Also, why play on 1.3.1? If you're going to be using the Mechromancer or playing Co-op, you need to be on 1.1.0 for speedruns because of the Amp Shield exploit.

Moss

2014-08-01 04:10:54 am

I messed that response up, damn mobile phone :c Here it is again for clarity:
I can't figure out how to get the patcher to work with 1.83, it just breaks the game. I want 1.31 because of UVHM. At this point I'd be happy to get back to 1.1 though.

PeachWaldo

2014-08-01 10:13:59 am

UVHM was added to the game in 1.4 to which the patcher does not supply the necessary files for, you have to find them youself from somewhere

ShiningFace

2014-08-01 10:19:42 am

Put on the shelves since 2012

I'm sure all of you already know my stance on sniper resets, so I won't really bother wasting anybody's time by making them read why I think having to press new game is stupid.

By the way, considering the fact that we now start timing when SDA timing starts (Who by the way said it was fine to use a file), wouldn't that mean it validates the use of a file even more? Like I honestly can't wrap my head around the idea that this started to become an issue when we changed timing methods when it helped SUPPORT the idea.

TheFuncannon

2014-08-01 05:24:14 pm

SDA left it up to us. As a community we have made no decisions. Therefore the only valid method at this point is resetting.

If we can all come to the conclusion that save files are allowed, then sure. And honestly, this issue shouldn't be tied to when the timer starts. Who cares when. It's an arbitrary point that we chose to hit the split button the first time. We could have easily said we start upon character creation.

I personally don't see the difference in leaving a vladof in the stash (guaranteeing a weapon you always need), and creating a save file for a sniper (guaranteeing a weapon you always need).

Understandably, getting less runs per day is not something that you guys want. But that's part of running a game that has heavy RNG. You reset. A lot. Removing RNG is pointless when the chances of anything runnable is almost 1/5. That is a laughably high percentage compared to most other games.

Blackwayv

Edit history:

Blackwayv: 2014-08-01 06:51:03 pm

2014-08-01 06:22:10 pm

You're generalizing too much. Why don't we just reinstall the game every time we want to run? It all has to be a new game, right? This is ridiculous. Wait, let's also turn on BAR and add a fucking shotgun into the vault because it's "guaranteeing a weapon you always need" and it's already CLEARLY NG+ (even though you're not guaranteed to even get that weapon spawn). The idea behind the Lascaux usage in UVHM is practically the same for a save file for the Vladof sniper in NG. You can always get a sniper, you can always get a Lascaux. Why not have a save file in Frostburn Canyon to get a Lascaux, then restart the story? Because it's a ridiculous waste of everyone's time.

TheFuncannon

2014-08-01 07:00:37 pm

UVHM is NG+. You are allowed to bring weapons in from other playthroughs. The agreed upon weapon to do so is the Lascaux, and comparing the two categories makes no sense. The only point you've brought to the table that I can see is the convenience of having a save file. If you're going to change my mind, I would like some other reason than "It takes too much time to reset." I personally don't see the point anymore as it is a game mechanic.

Before the idea was even brought up, we all reset without a question. It meant some days of attempts you might only get a few snipers, but you still got attempts in.

I would also like to make this clear. I would personally be much more supportive of the idea if you could ONLY use a 48 and/or getting the 48 saved no time. It saves time, and there are more than 35 usable combinations or sniper parts. Every single one of those usable snipers can beat the world record at the moment by the way. A 48 is completely optional.

So please, if you actually have other valid points, state them. I am not convinced yet.

Before the idea was even brought up, we all reset without a question. It meant some days of attempts you might only get a few snipers, but you still got attempts in.

I would also like to make this clear. I would personally be much more supportive of the idea if you could ONLY use a 48 and/or getting the 48 saved no time. It saves time, and there are more than 35 usable combinations or sniper parts. Every single one of those usable snipers can beat the world record at the moment by the way. A 48 is completely optional.

So please, if you actually have other valid points, state them. I am not convinced yet.

TheFuncannon

2014-08-01 07:05:13 pm

Also, almost everyone made their save file in Gibbed. That in and of itself should invalidate their use.

Blackwayv

2014-08-01 07:33:44 pm

Yeah. It's more convenient, and the only "sacrifice" is a feeling of arbitrary illegitimacy, maybe even guilt that people have when they use a save file. Yes, we're exploiting our ability to copy a file and paste it into a folder to avoid some RNG. Why is pressing the New Game button so sacred? The save file was practically frozen in time once you save and quit, according to the game.

TheFuncannon

2014-08-01 07:41:48 pm

Because without the new game button it becomes segmented. Just because you have to replay the same part of the intro cutscene doesn't remove the part where you're starting a run, stopping it, then starting it later. Without changing anything, you can technically go all the way to the claptrap cutscene, save quit, and still be at the same point in the run. So if you make a mistake in the first 2 minutes, may as well use the same save file right? It changes nothing right?

The new game button can't be abused, while a save file can.

Blackwayv

2014-08-01 07:59:08 pm

That's for us to decide if it's segmented. You end up at the exact same point in the story if you save and quit, so I say it's not.

If a save file is actually abused to gain an advantage over other players, it's not hard at all to tell. We know what to look for, we know how profiles/characters can be edited, and what side effects and such it has. The run is invalidated.

TheFuncannon

2014-08-01 08:02:56 pm

How is being segmented subjective? You either complete the run in 1 segment, or in more than 1. Having a save file is more than one segment regardless of the progress made.

Blackwayv

2014-08-01 08:04:54 pm

Saving and quitting = segmented. If you ever load a game, it's segmented technically. That's why a lot of games time with RTA. The run has never been single segment, it was IGT, then RTA w/o loads.

TheFuncannon

2014-08-01 08:09:05 pm

Fair point. But I still don't agree with removing RNG for the sake of convenience. I still need other reasons to feel like a save file is worthwhile.

Blackwayv

2014-08-01 08:13:22 pm

Can we all agree to leave this to preference?

I get that it's a bit one-sided, and a cop out for an argument, but we're too split on this. Neither side will be happy if we go one way (save files vs reset for parts). Both should be counted.

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