TAS succesfully played back on real NES hardware.

2011-02-10 08:33:20 pm

RPG TASer

I figured SDA should know about this, given the chance that this is now open, available, and possible for anyone with at least a little technical background...

http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9580

Thread title:

cyghfer

2011-02-10 08:48:30 pm

that's really cool that it's possible to play back TAS's on hardware now, good job to the guy(s) who got that working

i'm curious if you guys know - smb is a pretty deterministic game, but does this work for games with a lot more luck involved?

in terms of fake runs being submitted to SDA, i don't foresee this becoming an issue really. we could still require video camera evidence of the runner playing the game if something looks especially fishy.

andrewg

2011-02-10 09:58:29 pm

Hi! I'm andrewg!

None of my runs are safe! Shocked

arkarian

2011-02-10 10:18:37 pm

gamelogs.org

Quote from cyghfer:

i'm curious if you guys know - smb is a pretty deterministic game, but does this work for games with a lot more luck involved?

Quote:

The game choice also makes a big difference as to whether the button presses can be played back or not. If the game relies on any uninitialized memory for randomness, or if it is heavily based on console timing, it may not work. In the case of Super Mario Bros however, as long as the button presses start play back at the right time, the movie will play back correctly.

DJS

Edit history:

DJS: 2011-02-11 06:38:00 am

2011-02-11 06:37:53 am

torch slug since 2006

We got a problem... but damn thats cool!

dunnius

2011-02-11 08:56:24 am

Intruding N313 and F014

Oh, so that's how Andrewg got 4:59 Tongue

I don't see this being a problem.

andrewg

2011-02-11 09:40:42 am

it's a problem for me I suppose. You know, if anyone gets a 4:58 now, I may have to wonder about this.

Rakuen

2011-02-11 09:45:29 am

Weegee Time

Not to be all "Rawr, proof!" but at this point in the SMB speedrunning process, wouldn't you almost have to have a camera pointed at the player just to make sure he/she isn't cheating?

tjp7154

2011-02-11 10:14:10 am

#Casual

I'd agree for games with a lot of competition, like say.... Super Mario Bros.

Also, only the NES has proof that it can be rigged to play a TAS.

ZenicReverie

Edit history:

ZenicReverie: 2011-02-11 10:55:07 am

2011-02-11 10:53:36 am

Waiting hurts my soul...

Quote from tjp7154:

Also, only the NES has proof that it can be rigged to play a TAS.

...and only for one game. Even for a short game like Marble Madness, there were issues and the game didn't finish. Excitebike was mentioned though as a future possibility, so watch out for that too andrewg. Wink

Greenalink

Edit history:

Greenalink: 2011-02-11 11:42:05 am

Greenalink: 2011-02-11 11:14:55 am

2011-02-11 11:14:01 am

DS Dictator

LegendofEvil is going to rise from his grave :/

V. Quick edit:
NES games via VC are easy to verifiy by pressing the home button, phew.

DarkKobold

2011-02-11 11:17:04 am

RPG TASer

Quote from cyghfer:

in terms of fake runs being submitted to SDA, i don't foresee this becoming an issue really. we could still require video camera evidence of the runner playing the game if something looks especially fishy.

The circuit is small enough, that it could be built into a controller, quite easily. Hell, I could see someone making one that used a button combination to turn on playback, so they could simply bring a controller around, and have it beat SMB at will.

Zeupar

2011-02-11 12:36:06 pm

Sonical!

Quote from tjp7154:

Also, only the NES has proof that it can be rigged to play a TAS.

Wii can play back TASes too.

andrewg

Edit history:

andrewg: 2011-02-11 01:01:51 pm

2011-02-11 01:00:41 pm

Hi! I'm andrewg!

So should my future runs require proof that I'm actually playing?

Quote from DarkKobold:

Quote from cyghfer:

in terms of fake runs being submitted to SDA, i don't foresee this becoming an issue really. we could still require video camera evidence of the runner playing the game if something looks especially fishy.

The circuit is small enough, that it could be built into a controller, quite easily. Hell, I could see someone making one that used a button combination to turn on playback, so they could simply bring a controller around, and have it beat SMB at will.

You'd have to be a good actor as well. Wink

I would hate to show proof. But if it could be done after the fact, I would be ok with it if SDA really needed proof. I just really don't want to record all my runs with a camera at the same time I play recording with my dvd recorder.

Most speedruns aren't really all that competitive, so this issue really isn't an issue.

Tigger77

2011-02-11 01:22:12 pm

I survived MIKE-Fest 1

all runs need to be watched live from mike so only at marathon you can get your records Cheesy

ZenicReverie

2011-02-11 01:33:29 pm

Waiting hurts my soul...

Quote from Tigger77:

all runs need to be watched live from mike so only at marathon you can get your records Cheesy

Are any runs done there auto-verified? Wink

It'd be awesome to get a speedrun completed live at a marathon.

Greenalink

2011-02-11 04:05:52 pm

DS Dictator

There is 1 old game the NESBot* will have difficulty on:
Megaman X2 all because of Console lag on Crystal Snail.

*I know the NESBot only TAS Nes games but the possible successor SNESBot will have problems playing back MMX2 on console ;).

Rakuen

2011-02-11 04:06:53 pm

Weegee Time

Quote from tjp7154:

I'd agree for games with a lot of competition, like say.... Super Mario Bros.

Well yeah, but it was more like the console record and TAS record are so impossibly close already.

romscout

2011-02-11 09:32:12 pm

that Metroidvania guy

LegendOfEvil better get on this! This is his big chance!!!!

Zealie

Edit history:

Zealie: 2011-02-13 03:41:33 am

2011-02-13 03:40:06 am

hmmm time to stop running NES games I guess... ;o

Also, what romscout said ^_^

[edit] BTW I have been practising some SMB and I think I might be able to pull of a 4:58 run *devil smiley add*

Spider-Waffle

(user is banned)

2011-02-14 05:00:32 pm

Don't think! feeeeeal

Quote from Greenalink:

There is 1 old game the NESBot* will have difficulty on:
Megaman X2 all because of Console lag on Crystal Snail.

*I know the NESBot only TAS Nes games but the possible successor SNESBot will have problems playing back MMX2 on console ;).

I'm pretty sure there's SNES emulators that very accurately simulate SNES hardware and thus lag.

Spider-Waffle

(user is banned)

Spider-Waffle

Edit history:

Spider-Waffle: 2011-02-14 05:08:35 pm

2011-02-14 05:06:32 pm

Don't think! feeeeeal

I'd recommend recording yourself playing for anyone planning on doing an amazing speedrun which many people will think is apocryphal. I was already planning on doing this for my future console runs, it's just part of being nice and considerate to your fans as well, an easy way to dispel at least 80% of the doubters.

Carcinogen

2011-02-15 12:30:17 pm

This is SO fucked.

SO fucked.

VorpalEdge

2011-02-15 01:18:53 pm

welcome to the machine

Quote from Spider-Waffle:

I'm pretty sure there's SNES emulators that very accurately simulate SNES hardware and thus lag.

The problem is that x2 uses a special chip. Its logic is fully emulated but its lag is not.

AniMeowzerz

2011-02-15 03:02:26 pm

Quote from Tigger77:

all runs need to be watched live from mike so only at marathon you can get your records Cheesy

Live verification is a cruel bitch :V
I would know.