Sword of Mana

Thomaz

Edit history:

Thomaz: 2009-02-17 10:12:00 am

2009-02-17 10:06:58 am

Catchin' them all

Hey guys.

Thinking of doing a Sword of Mana speedrun. It's probably not a game liked by a lot and is probably not to be compared to the other Mana games out there (although I have never played Legend and Heroes). Anyway, I like the game and can see a lot of potential for it to be speedrun. In-game timer, class system you could use (probably not the final class, but first two class changes would be nice). It's also a rather easy game. Magic sucks though. :X

I gotta be honest and say I haven't actually finished a girl run before (always choose the boy. >___>), but I have a hunch it's faster because there's a lot of girl saving and travelling to be done for the boy. I like the Sword way better then the Staff, mainly because of it's Deathblow, but you can't have it all. =P Besides, eventhough the girl is more build to be a magic caster, you could easily level her up to be physical based.

Class-wise, Ninja Master is the best obviously, with it's high crit ratio, evasion and excellent Chest trap remover ability, but I don't know if I'll ever get to that. Becoming a Ninja right before Lee should not be hard, you could easily powerlevel a bit on the bats and heal up. That extra +5% crit chance is quite useful, though Thief doesn't give the best Str boosts. Only Monk really does that.

Random class is good too, but only because you could manipulate 4 Str at once per level (although I never got it, I'm sure it's possible, since I got 4 MagDef in one level up one time).

I haven't looked at the money issues just yet, but buying Gummifrogs is gonna help a ton. A few mixed Meats will work wonders as well, but if money really is an issue, I could always try to manipulate a certain Meat from enemies to use it for the bosses.

Meat + PowUp from Salamander + Critical Hit + Deathblow = insane damage output.

Obvious advantage for using the girl is also that Magic will pretty much always hit. Unlike the magic trajectory of the other weapons...Incase you're up against monsters immune to physical.

I'll do a quick runthrough with the girl in a bit to see what works and doesn't.

I suppose I could always try to do both a boy and a girl run, since the girl part is probably too easy. At least the boy part has more bosses. =D

Currently doing a 100% file though, where I try to get every monster in Black. 500 Cursed Dolls to go before I can finally leave the Airship. :X Extremely overleveled ftw.

Any thoughts?

Thread title:

Hey guys.

Thinking of doing a Sword of Mana speedrun. It's probably not a game liked by a lot and is probably not to be compared to the other Mana games out there (although I have never played Legend and Heroes). Anyway, I like the game and can see a lot of potential for it to be speedrun. In-game timer, class system you could use (probably not the final class, but first two class changes would be nice). It's also a rather easy game. Magic sucks though. :X

I gotta be honest and say I haven't actually finished a girl run before (always choose the boy. >___>), but I have a hunch it's faster because there's a lot of girl saving and travelling to be done for the boy. I like the Sword way better then the Staff, mainly because of it's Deathblow, but you can't have it all. =P Besides, eventhough the girl is more build to be a magic caster, you could easily level her up to be physical based.

Class-wise, Ninja Master is the best obviously, with it's high crit ratio, evasion and excellent Chest trap remover ability, but I don't know if I'll ever get to that. Becoming a Ninja right before Lee should not be hard, you could easily powerlevel a bit on the bats and heal up. That extra +5% crit chance is quite useful, though Thief doesn't give the best Str boosts. Only Monk really does that.

Random class is good too, but only because you could manipulate 4 Str at once per level (although I never got it, I'm sure it's possible, since I got 4 MagDef in one level up one time).

I haven't looked at the money issues just yet, but buying Gummifrogs is gonna help a ton. A few mixed Meats will work wonders as well, but if money really is an issue, I could always try to manipulate a certain Meat from enemies to use it for the bosses.

Meat + PowUp from Salamander + Critical Hit + Deathblow = insane damage output.

Obvious advantage for using the girl is also that Magic will pretty much always hit. Unlike the magic trajectory of the other weapons...Incase you're up against monsters immune to physical.

I'll do a quick runthrough with the girl in a bit to see what works and doesn't.

I suppose I could always try to do both a boy and a girl run, since the girl part is probably too easy. At least the boy part has more bosses. =D

Currently doing a 100% file though, where I try to get every monster in Black. 500 Cursed Dolls to go before I can finally leave the Airship. :X Extremely overleveled ftw.

Any thoughts?

DoubleThink

2009-02-18 12:08:43 am

There's a word for that

Hmm. Unfortunately I'm not familiar with this Mana game, although it's a remake of Final Fantasy Adventure (which I know a bit more about), it's meant to be quite different. I'll watch it if it gets done though Smiley

Physical attacks are generally the way to go for speed in Mana games not named Secret, so I'll let that speak for itself. I remember a group of enemies guarding something fairly near to the start (a key maybe?) that would reappear if you left the screen and gave some pretty nice exp. Oh, and there were those blobby things you needed the right weapon and/or magic to kill. That's probably all I'm good for on this one >_>

LinkTheValiant

2009-02-18 06:41:33 pm

May the way of the Hero lead to the Triforce

Yay! Someone is bringing this up again!

Going by what I remember:

Theoretically magic can be faster since magic is generally more powerful against bosses. The only issue with this is the need for leveling various different spirits as opposed to one representative weapon type for each attack style. Not to mention that you get nothing but damage output from spirit levels, while weapon levels give extra deathblow growth. On top of this, weapon usage is free, while magic takes time to cast and is limited. (There aren't always gold statues around, and bosses-only is not optimal.)

The girl has the additional difficulty of being stuck with the Axe for Slash attribute. This is a bad thing. The Axe is powerful, yes, but it has a bad habit of leaving you vulnerable before connecting, and its combo is very slow. (Not to mention that she can't use her deathblows to travel as the boy can.)

Level-ups make convenient tight-spot healing. It may or may not be ideal, since you're lowering your damage output a little, but the time saved by not spending money and purchasing heals should be enough to make it up.

Look for Magic Rope manipulations. It's been too long for me to remember the specific points, but depending on how brave you are with extended segments, I think it's possible to cut some travel.

Now for someone to come along and disprove everything I just said.

Yay! Someone is bringing this up again!

Going by what I remember:

Theoretically magic can be faster since magic is generally more powerful against bosses. The only issue with this is the need for leveling various different spirits as opposed to one representative weapon type for each attack style. Not to mention that you get nothing but damage output from spirit levels, while weapon levels give extra deathblow growth. On top of this, weapon usage is free, while magic takes time to cast and is limited. (There aren't always gold statues around, and bosses-only is not optimal.)

The girl has the additional difficulty of being stuck with the Axe for Slash attribute. This is a bad thing. The Axe is powerful, yes, but it has a bad habit of leaving you vulnerable before connecting, and its combo is very slow. (Not to mention that she can't use her deathblows to travel as the boy can.)

Level-ups make convenient tight-spot healing. It may or may not be ideal, since you're lowering your damage output a little, but the time saved by not spending money and purchasing heals should be enough to make it up.

Look for Magic Rope manipulations. It's been too long for me to remember the specific points, but depending on how brave you are with extended segments, I think it's possible to cut some travel.

Now for someone to come along and disprove everything I just said.

Thomaz

Edit history:

Thomaz: 2009-02-19 03:58:18 pm

2009-02-19 10:11:28 am

Catchin' them all

Great! Reactions! Cheesy

You're not wrong. Wink

I've started a testrun with the girl and it's proving to be harder then Imagined so far.

I'm gonna start over and manipulate an Animal Meat from 1 of the 3 Rabites in the first area because the first boss is very annoying (Ivory Hellhound) and Magic only deals 1 damage. It also nets me slightly more experience so I can use the Level Up as a buff against him (was gonna do that anyway, but would have to beat more enemies). It would also be good to manipulate a Rotten Meat from a Zonbine, but I'm not sure if there's a room with only one. :/ Beating one is hard enough, but it would eventually fall to a FireMan from Salamander (and finish off with Wisp to still get the exp). Smiley

Ok, so Skull Beast drop them as well. At least there come with easy to kill enemies. ;p

At first, I was gonna buy a Magic Walnut from a manipulated Niccolo, but I think a Gummifrog is better in this case (sell two Angel Grails). I can also pick up one in the mansion. I'll probably have to beat two other enemies to be able to level up before the hound, but I've pretty much figured it out so far.

If I somehow manage to beat the Hellhound, I'm gonna use the Gold statue to level up on the bats with a Pwr Up boosted Bow attack. I am still not sure about what path I should choose, but it's either Warrior, Monk or Thief, maybe even Random. By the time I reach Lee, I'll have my DB gauge filled again.

I am already using the Magic Rope to warp some stuff. I was hoping to skip Niccolo's first appearance, but that's sadly scripted. Sad

There's also the Sickle, at least it's better then the Axe. >__> No triple Attack though. I'll probably end up abusing the Lance for physical.

I will also forge weapons as soon as I can, probably with manipulated chest drop items. Tongue

Gonna be hell to manipulate it all, but hey, those boosts are very welcome.

Anything else I'm forgetting?

Edit: actually, even with the Animal Meat, Pwr Up boost and +2 Atk from Monk, I only do at max 8 damage to the Hound with a crit. :/ Might just gonna have to try and get +4 Atk from random or devise a whole different level plan. ;(

Edit2: wait a minute, the Animal Meat didn't even help. :X Does that mean it doesn't work on bosses? :/

Edit3: I think I get it now. The FAQ says the boy's boss is DemiHuman, but the girl's boss is Fauna. I think he just made a mistake. Tongue

This means I need a Tough Meat. A lot tougher (lol) to manipulate since the only one on route without too much backtracking doesn't always appear and comes with two other monsters. Oh well, should still be doable, but I would also want Niccolo to appear there somewhere. I might still need that Animal Meat, so I'll see if there's a use for it later. Never hurts to have an easy item.

Edit4: turns out Boison Vine is Fauna. It's way later in the run, but oh well.

Edit5: yes, Tough Meat does work! Now, I need to find a way to level up quickly, get a Tough Meat and a Rotten Meat. :X I better start writing this up. Tongue

Great! Reactions! :D

You're not wrong. ;)

I've started a testrun with the girl and it's proving to be harder then Imagined so far.

I'm gonna start over and manipulate an Animal Meat from 1 of the 3 Rabites in the first area because the first boss is very annoying (Ivory Hellhound) and Magic only deals 1 damage. It also nets me slightly more experience so I can use the Level Up as a buff against him (was gonna do that anyway, but would have to beat more enemies). It would also be good to manipulate a Rotten Meat from a Zonbine, but I'm not sure if there's a room with only one. :/ Beating one is hard enough, but it would eventually fall to a FireMan from Salamander (and finish off with Wisp to still get the exp). :) Ok, so Skull Beast drop them as well. At least there come with easy to kill enemies. ;p

At first, I was gonna buy a Magic Walnut from a manipulated Niccolo, but I think a Gummifrog is better in this case (sell two Angel Grails). I can also pick up one in the mansion. I'll probably have to beat two other enemies to be able to level up before the hound, but I've pretty much figured it out so far.

If I somehow manage to beat the Hellhound, I'm gonna use the Gold statue to level up on the bats with a Pwr Up boosted Bow attack. I am still not sure about what path I should choose, but it's either Warrior, Monk or Thief, maybe even Random. By the time I reach Lee, I'll have my DB gauge filled again.

I am already using the Magic Rope to warp some stuff. I was hoping to skip Niccolo's first appearance, but that's sadly scripted. :(

There's also the Sickle, at least it's better then the Axe. >__> No triple Attack though. I'll probably end up abusing the Lance for physical.

I will also forge weapons as soon as I can, probably with manipulated chest drop items. :P Gonna be hell to manipulate it all, but hey, those boosts are very welcome.

Anything else I'm forgetting?

Edit: actually, even with the Animal Meat, Pwr Up boost and +2 Atk from Monk, I only do at max 8 damage to the Hound with a crit. :/ Might just gonna have to try and get +4 Atk from random or devise a whole different level plan. ;(

Edit2: wait a minute, the Animal Meat didn't even help. :X Does that mean it doesn't work on bosses? :/

Edit3: I think I get it now. The FAQ says the boy's boss is DemiHuman, but the girl's boss is Fauna. I think he just made a mistake. :P This means I need a Tough Meat. A lot tougher (lol) to manipulate since the only one on route without too much backtracking doesn't always appear and comes with two other monsters. Oh well, should still be doable, but I would also want Niccolo to appear there somewhere. I might still need that Animal Meat, so I'll see if there's a use for it later. Never hurts to have an easy item.

Edit4: turns out Boison Vine is Fauna. It's way later in the run, but oh well.

Edit5: yes, Tough Meat does work! Now, I need to find a way to level up quickly, get a Tough Meat and a Rotten Meat. :X I better start writing this up. :P

ArtenXevious

2009-02-19 07:21:22 pm

You seem pretty set on the Girl, but that just means there's a Boy category just waiting to be tackled.

Link the Valiant is right about Magic Rope manipulations. It especially helps if there's a specific time to find the enemies you're manipulating. Also if you're powerleveling far from a golden Mana statue.

As far as magic is concerned, if you can maintain a good presence near an enemy use the Knuckles/Gloves/what-have-you. With those, you can control where the magic goes and can hit multiple enemies twice. If you're right next to something when you let loose, you can score three hits! Even better, using the Knucks for magic against bosses yields and ungodly number of hits (even if it's a 0 damage hit, it still counts for EXP).
So there's that.

You know, I think I've never really strayed that far from the gloves before, aside from Swording as the boy. Three hit combo plus (with good timing) you can pretty much keep an enemy pinned with the first attack continuously (see SirVG's Legend of Mana runs to get an idea). I'll have to try the lance out.

As far as level-ups go, you're probably best off manipulating levels at a save point. My suggestion for boss fights is to use Candy (that's right, that weak li'l healing item) to gain temporary invulnerability as well as heal for 40 HP. Was it 40? Anyway, you can cheap your way through the biggest, baddest attacks by nomming some.

Good luck with the run! I'd love to see it when it comes out!

You seem pretty set on the Girl, but that just means there's a Boy category just waiting to be tackled.

Link the Valiant is right about Magic Rope manipulations. It especially helps if there's a specific time to find the enemies you're manipulating. Also if you're powerleveling far from a golden Mana statue.

As far as magic is concerned, if you can maintain a good presence near an enemy use the Knuckles/Gloves/what-have-you. With those, you can control where the magic goes and can hit multiple enemies twice. If you're right next to something when you let loose, you can score three hits! Even better, using the Knucks for magic against bosses yields and ungodly number of hits (even if it's a 0 damage hit, it still counts for EXP).
So there's that.

You know, I think I've never really strayed that far from the gloves before, aside from Swording as the boy. Three hit combo plus (with good timing) you can pretty much keep an enemy pinned with the first attack continuously (see SirVG's Legend of Mana runs to get an idea). I'll have to try the lance out.

As far as level-ups go, you're probably best off manipulating levels at a save point. My suggestion for boss fights is to use Candy (that's right, that weak li'l healing item) to gain temporary invulnerability as well as heal for 40 HP. Was it 40? Anyway, you can cheap your way through the biggest, baddest attacks by nomming some.

Good luck with the run! I'd love to see it when it comes out!

Thomaz

2009-02-19 11:27:30 pm

Catchin' them all

Actually, I'm not really that set on using the Girl. It's just that the Boy has more bosses to fight and more paths to walk. :/

I'll probably end up doing both if a different category is allowed. Tongue

Knucks are indeed awesome. I don't remember when I get it as a girl though, I forgot.

Candy heal 30 btw. Tongue

I'll think about. Smiley

I'm gonna try to be level 3 before I reach Vinquette Hall, then try to get to 4 or 5 (have to see how long that would take) before tackling the Hound. A critical Tough Meated Pwr Up Bow does upwards to 16 damage at like 10 Str (I was trying out Monk only, but I have a gut feeling Random will be better, this was at level 4; imagine a level 5 Girl with about 3-4 more Str).

I'm glad people actually want to see this run. Tongue

Thomaz

Edit history:

Thomaz: 2009-05-21 11:38:00 am

2009-05-17 01:59:30 pm

Catchin' them all

I'm not dead. I'm still working on it. Smiley

In my testrun, I have just entered the Airship with 1:03 on the clock. No idea if this is fast and it's obviously not very good play, because it's a testrun.

My girl is level 7 atm, and she'll gain 3 levels in the Airship alone. Also, yay for overleveled partners. <3

Edit:

Right now, I just defeated Devius. I made a vid to showcase how powerful the girl actually is:

LinkTheValiant

2009-05-21 06:37:06 pm

May the way of the Hero lead to the Triforce

wow. Those are some NICE hits.

For the record, the boy has exactly one more boss battle than the girl. Wink

He fights Ankheg and Medusa, while the girl fights the Guardian. Sadly, you're absolutely correct in that the boy has more dungeon to walk through.

The Lance is an effective weapon, but unfortunately cannot combo nearly as effectively as the Sword. You're unlikely to get much stunlocking success with it except against slow enemies.

I'd like to assert confidently that you can get to the airship in under an hour, but I've never played through the girl's route. I know, I know, I'm pathetic, but I can't stand being without a decent slash weapon.

DoubleThink

2009-05-22 03:47:15 am

There's a word for that

Ugh, it uses that annoying text from the Final Fantasy ports >_> And yeah that's some pretty ridiculous damage right there. Is there anything in the girl's path that can't be killed like that?

Thomaz

Edit history:

Thomaz: 2009-05-23 05:06:39 pm

2009-05-22 05:37:55 pm

Catchin' them all

Yeah, it's obviously a testrun.

I am ironically mainly using the bow. It's double hit feature is neat and I can snipe stuff from a distance. It also has high hit.

Yes, there are a couple of bosses that don't die as quick. Dark Lord, Malyris, Boison Vine, Hydra to name a few. But still fast though, except for Boison Vine who I don't have a good strat for really.

Lee, Devius and Garuda are insane quick kills.

Also, the Guardian is pathetic. A couple of hits and a DB from Bogard is enough.

So, right now, I'm saved at around 2:12~ in Lorimar. Projected time to get to Malyris is about 5-6 minutes so with beating her and Magic Rope warping back, I should be around the 2:20 mark. On my way to perhaps the most important area of the game.

Yeah. Subland River! =D

Also, if Cyclopses seem beatable at some point, I might go for a Aerolite drop for forging. It might skip leveling after getting Brownie Ring.

Edit:

I have beaten the game in my testrun. Final save is 3:04 right before Julius. Of course, this is totally not optimised. Final save will easily go below 3 hours, but I'm afraid sub 3 hour for the whole game is not possible. I'm not sure of course but we'll see how much time I can remove. I ended up buying to many items and not enough Gummifrogs (hah, Golem was an OHKO with the right position. :P) and meats. Bow is my most used weapons, since it can hit more often. A triple hit with just one shot is not unlikely, like how Garuda and Kraken were killed.

I also ended up using my remaining levels after getting the Brownie Ring and put them all into Monk since the Random wasn't needed anymore but the extra fire power helped me to KO the bosses faster (like Golem for example, not using four levels I have gained at that time means I cannot OHKO him in one Deathblow, but I have to resort on hitting him more often so he'll just move to another spot and lose time).

Julius was a joke, the Bow easily gets like four hits on him when he's changing shields.

I upgraded my bow with an Althena Iron btw, so to give that extra power. In order of upgrade: Staff + Baobab Wood + Bow + Baobab Wood -> Bow + Althena Iron. So two Hothouse visits who are on the way. One Baobab Wood has to be manipulated in order to not backtrack.

I'm gonna talk it over with a friend, since we're probably gonna run the game together, but so far, it seems the testing is over and the real run is about to start. Grin

Yeah, it's obviously a testrun.

I am ironically mainly using the bow. It's double hit feature is neat and I can snipe stuff from a distance. It also has high hit.

Yes, there are a couple of bosses that don't die as quick. Dark Lord, Malyris, Boison Vine, Hydra to name a few. But still fast though, except for Boison Vine who I don't have a good strat for really.

Lee, Devius and Garuda are insane quick kills.

Also, the Guardian is pathetic. A couple of hits and a DB from Bogard is enough.

So, right now, I'm saved at around 2:12~ in Lorimar. Projected time to get to Malyris is about 5-6 minutes so with beating her and Magic Rope warping back, I should be around the 2:20 mark. On my way to perhaps the most important area of the game.

Yeah. Subland River! =D

Also, if Cyclopses seem beatable at some point, I might go for a Aerolite drop for forging. It might skip leveling after getting Brownie Ring.

Edit:

I have beaten the game in my testrun. Final save is 3:04 right before Julius. Of course, this is totally not optimised. Final save will easily go below 3 hours, but I'm afraid sub 3 hour for the whole game is not possible. I'm not sure of course but we'll see how much time I can remove. I ended up buying to many items and not enough Gummifrogs (hah, Golem was an OHKO with the right position. :P) and meats. Bow is my most used weapons, since it can hit more often. A triple hit with just one shot is not unlikely, like how Garuda and Kraken were killed.

I also ended up using my remaining levels after getting the Brownie Ring and put them all into Monk since the Random wasn't needed anymore but the extra fire power helped me to KO the bosses faster (like Golem for example, not using four levels I have gained at that time means I cannot OHKO him in one Deathblow, but I have to resort on hitting him more often so he'll just move to another spot and lose time).

Julius was a joke, the Bow easily gets like four hits on him when he's changing shields.

I upgraded my bow with an Althena Iron btw, so to give that extra power. In order of upgrade: Staff + Baobab Wood + Bow + Baobab Wood -> Bow + Althena Iron. So two Hothouse visits who are on the way. One Baobab Wood has to be manipulated in order to not backtrack.

I'm gonna talk it over with a friend, since we're probably gonna run the game together, but so far, it seems the testing is over and the real run is about to start. ;D

Chent

2009-05-24 12:40:00 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Hi !

I posted in the previous Sword of Mana thread a few years ago.
I see that the game still hasn't been runned, and that you're the next one to try to do it.

I don't have the time to record a run myself, but i did design a route from start to end and the last test run i made was very promising if i refer to the official best time known : 02 hours 08 minutes last save, from a japanese site.
I don't know anything about the strats and routes used in this run (i just know the player used the girl) but i guess mine must be very close because my time is almost the same. I couldn't find the time to finish my last test run but i saved at 01:59 at Ishe just before heading to the sealed cave. At this point i'm obviously a few minutes away from the end. Last save will be somewhere between 02:08 and 02:18.

My run is segmented, using the girl, and the time is last save, just before Julius. The run is polished. I might find some time to play the last minutes in the coming weeks (i didn't play the game for more than a year). I will then be able to tell you the exact time. But it certainly isn't above 02:20.

I wanted to inform you so you can make the best possible run. Aim 02:15 ! Not more. Wink

If you need any advice, just ask ! I'm really busy but i will try to take the time to answer you !

From what i can remember that could be of some help to you :

- i use the girl (check ;))
- i take the Brownie Ring (that seems to be the case for you too)
- I don't ever enter a cactus house
- I don't ever temper a weapon
- I don't ever invest in anything other than INT and MIND levelwise
- Before the Brownie Ring, I do use NPC characters often for boss battles

Well, what else...
The critical battles (and by critical i mean those in which you can lose significant time if you don't have enough patience to reset the game until the battle goes well) seem to be Hydra and Dark Lord. Count Lee can be tricky and Malyris too, but everything else is a joke with the right strat.

I'm not 100% sure, but i think my lvl at the end was 25 on my last run.
Magic is efficient enough. The time you lose going into cactus houses for tempering is not worth the time saved by using melee weapons, if you even save some by doing so.
And the bow is so slow... It can't be a good choice for your weapon.

Sorry if my english hurts you, that's not my first language.

Good luck with the run !

Hi !

I posted in the previous Sword of Mana thread a few years ago.
I see that the game still hasn't been runned, and that you're the next one to try to do it.

I don't have the time to record a run myself, but i did design a route from start to end and the last test run i made was very promising if i refer to the official best time known : 02 hours 08 minutes last save, from a japanese site. 
I don't know anything about the strats and routes used in this run (i just know the player used the girl) but i guess mine must be very close because my time is almost the same. I couldn't find the time to finish my last test run but i saved at 01:59 at Ishe just before heading to the sealed cave. At this point i'm obviously a few minutes away from the end. Last save will be somewhere between 02:08 and 02:18.

My run is segmented, using the girl, and the time is last save, just before Julius. The run is polished. I might find some time to play the last minutes in the coming weeks (i didn't play the game for more than a year). I will then be able to tell you the exact time. But it certainly isn't above 02:20.

I wanted to inform you so you can make the best possible run. Aim 02:15 ! Not more. ;)

If you need any advice, just ask ! I'm really busy but i will try to take the time to answer you !

From what i can remember that could be of some help to you :

- i use the girl (check ;))
- i take the Brownie Ring (that seems to be the case for you too)
- I don't ever enter a cactus house
- I don't ever temper a weapon
- I don't ever invest in anything other than INT and MIND levelwise
- Before the Brownie Ring, I do use NPC characters often for boss battles

Well, what else...
The critical battles (and by critical i mean those in which you can lose significant time if you don't have enough patience to reset the game until the battle goes well) seem to be Hydra and Dark Lord. Count Lee can be tricky and Malyris too, but everything else is a joke with the right strat.

I'm not 100% sure, but i think my lvl at the end was 25 on my last run.
Magic is efficient enough. The time you lose going into cactus houses for tempering is not worth the time saved by using melee weapons, if you even save some by doing so. 
And the bow is so slow... It can't be a good choice for your weapon.

Sorry if my english hurts you, that's not my first language.

Good luck with the run !

Thomaz

Edit history:

Thomaz: 2009-05-24 05:11:49 pm

2009-05-24 05:00:10 pm

Catchin' them all

Is Magic really that good? I have never really considered it.

That final time at the end of the game really seems unreal, but maybe the Japanese text scrolls way faster?

Bow may be slow, but it hits multiple times in a row. And on most bosses, you don't have the time to go for the triple hit combo some weapons have. I use the Staff too, it's Deathblow can hit like SIX times if positioned right. Also, by tempering those weapons (I visit the Hot House only twice so not much time is lost I think).

Were Meats used at all? I can imagine, that with enough INT and a Meat, you can still deal considerable damage. I guess it's worth to try, but just right now I have a feeling physical is better. At least according to the game. Tongue

Obviously, if such a time is possible to achieve, I WILL go for it. No sense in speedrunning if I can't at least somewhat tie the other time. And yeah, I use NPCs sometimes. Only NPC I used on a boss was Bogard though. :/

But anyway, thanks for the advice and future help. Smiley

And don't worry about your language. I understand it just fine.

Is Magic really that good? I have never really considered it.

That final time at the end of the game really seems unreal, but maybe the Japanese text scrolls way faster?

Bow may be slow, but it hits multiple times in a row. And on most bosses, you don't have the time to go for the triple hit combo some weapons have. I use the Staff too, it's Deathblow can hit like SIX times if positioned right. Also, by tempering those weapons (I visit the Hot House only twice so not much time is lost I think).

Were Meats used at all? I can imagine, that with enough INT and a Meat, you can still deal considerable damage. I guess it's worth to try, but just right now I have a feeling physical is better. At least according to the game. :P

Obviously, if such a time is possible to achieve, I WILL go for it. No sense in speedrunning if I can't at least somewhat tie the other time. And yeah, I use NPCs sometimes. Only NPC I used on a boss was Bogard though. :/

But anyway, thanks for the advice and future help. :) And don't worry about your language. I understand it just fine.

Chent

2009-05-25 03:25:29 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Yes, Magic is that good. Go for it, otherwise you won't be able to realize the time you lose by going the melee way.

The time is perfectly real. Mine is very close. I'm must say i'm playing the japanese version though.
I don't think text scrolls technically faster, but i think there are less characters in japanese, so you might gain some time here. But we're speaking about few minutes at max. No way you can lose more than 10 mins because of that in the entire game, if you even lose some.
I can assure you that the text is LONG during plot scenes, even in the japanese version. Actually, text scrolling is what makes me lose the most time in this game.

Bow is slow. And if you use some deathblows skills with your staff, you are spending too much time hitting the boss or opening your ring to eat a gummyfrog (those are useless in my speedrun). Opening the ring actually takes some time ! You have to optimize your strat in every possible way.
By using the proper spirit with the knucks equipped, you hit the boss 3 times in a row on average. That means you can hit it 4, 5 or even more times in a row if you're good at using them, dealing thousands of HP in a matter of seconds.
Very few boss fights are taking more than 20/30 secs in the entire game(black wolf, hydra and dark lord if not played right, Julius) and a good majority is less than 10/15, so you can't be faster using weapons, and you obviously lose some time by buying/searching materials and tempering in Hot Houses.

Very few meats were used, simply because that's overkill and the time you spend to obtain them isn't worth it. In my latest run i used a meat in 3 fights : trivi, black wolf and Mindflare. Because i think the time i spend to obtain them (between 5 and 10 secs each, not counting all the resets because they are rare drops) is less than the time i gain by using them.

I guess you're not doing any lvl up right? I don't kill any random ennemy in the game, unless i need a meat drop. You just have to run and kill bosses.

I don't stop to buy anything either. I only use a couple walnuts found in chests and the only other chests i remember opening is the INT accessory you find in the desert - which is worth it ! - and the brownie ring.

I assume you know you can avoid breaking some seals by jumping? Seconds gained here, for each seal.
Do you use some rope tricks? They are very useful in a few situations.

As for NPC, i use Hero for Count Lee, Hydra and Dark Lord. (Tell me how you can be faster in the Count Lee fight? All you have to do is hit the select button, sala-buff yourself and hit the boss a few times. Under the right circonstances, it dies before being able to fly away from its first landing spot ! So a few secondes are necessary...) and Bogard for the Airship Guardian and Boison Vine (first and second forms).

All that being said, i do like the bow ! But the only time it's useful in this speedrun is in the black wolf fight. Wink

If that can help you, here are the times (Game Timer) i achieved at different points in my latest run :

- Count Lee save : 20 mins (19 is possible)
- Airship save (after the text heavy scene) : 43 mins
- Mindflare save : 01:05
- Ishe Cannon, after Dark Lord : 01:35
- Ishe Save, heading to sealed cave : 01:59

The time is perfectly achievable. Keep up the work ! Smiley

Yes, Magic is that good. Go for it, otherwise you won't be able to realize the time you lose by going the melee way.

The time is perfectly real. Mine is very close. I'm must say i'm playing the japanese version though. 
I don't think text scrolls technically faster, but i think there are less characters in japanese, so you might gain some time here. But we're speaking about few minutes at max. No way you can lose more than 10 mins because of that in the entire game, if you even lose some. 
I can assure you that the text is LONG during plot scenes, even in the japanese version. Actually, text scrolling is what makes me lose the most time in this game.

Bow is slow. And if you use some deathblows skills with your staff, you are spending too much time hitting the boss or opening your ring to eat a gummyfrog (those are useless in my speedrun). Opening the ring actually takes some time ! You have to optimize your strat in every possible way. 
By using the proper spirit with the knucks equipped, you hit the boss 3 times in a row on average. That means you can hit it 4, 5 or even more times in a row if you're good at using them, dealing thousands of HP in a matter of seconds. 
Very few boss fights are taking more than 20/30 secs in the entire game(black wolf, hydra and dark lord if not played right, Julius) and a good majority is less than 10/15, so you can't be faster using weapons, and you obviously lose some time by buying/searching materials and tempering in Hot Houses.

Very few meats were used, simply because that's overkill and the time you spend to obtain them isn't worth it. In my latest run i used a meat in 3 fights : trivi, black wolf and Mindflare. Because i think the time i spend to obtain them (between 5 and 10 secs each, not counting all the resets because they are rare drops) is less than the time i gain by using them.

I guess you're not doing any lvl up right? I don't kill any random ennemy in the game, unless i need a meat drop. You just have to run and kill bosses.

I don't stop to buy anything either. I only use a couple walnuts found in chests and the only other chests i remember opening is the INT accessory you find in the desert - which is worth it ! - and the brownie ring.

I assume you know you can avoid breaking some seals by jumping? Seconds gained here, for each seal.
Do you use some rope tricks? They are very useful in a few situations.

As for NPC, i use Hero for Count Lee, Hydra and Dark Lord. (Tell me how you can be faster in the Count Lee fight? All you have to do is hit the select button, sala-buff yourself and hit the boss a few times. Under the right circonstances, it dies before being able to fly away from its first landing spot ! So a few secondes are necessary...) and Bogard for the Airship Guardian and Boison Vine (first and second forms).

All that being said, i do like the bow ! But the only time it's useful in this speedrun is in the black wolf fight.  ;)

If that can help you, here are the times (Game Timer) i achieved at different points in my latest run :

- Count Lee save : 20 mins (19 is possible)
- Airship save (after the text heavy scene) : 43 mins
- Mindflare save : 01:05
- Ishe Cannon, after Dark Lord : 01:35
- Ishe Save, heading to sealed cave : 01:59

The time is perfectly achievable. Keep up the work ! :)

Thomaz

2009-05-25 03:44:16 am

Catchin' them all

Hm... I'm gonna try the Magic way then. Do you pick Random for the possible +3 INT boost or are you choosing the class with the +2 INT and +1 MDEF (Magician I think)?

Btw, I don't doubt you at all. My run was definitely not polished. I had to figure out a lot of things on the get go and mainly did not go for perfect unless it was easy to get. I realise that I went to far for some of the Meats. I used a Tough Meat for the Flail battle but the time saved is not enough I think (that's what I thought at first too, anyway).

Trivi, what boss is that? The bird?

Yeah, using those Gummifrogs, forging etc does take time. I did not think it would take so much time, but then again, I really didn't try the Magic route really. I definitely will. Do you remember what level you were at the wolf?

I'll start doing a testrun using Magic today. Smiley

Thanks for taking your time to help me! Cheesy

Chent

2009-05-25 06:30:45 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Yes i'm picking Magician for my lvl ups. When i hit 10 Magician lvls, i pick Sage for the next 5, to access the sorceress class. Then i go back to magician for all the remaining lvls.

Trivi is the unavoidable ennemy in the mansion. You have to hit it with magic as it is immune to weapons. A meat here allow me to beat it without crouching to regen mp.

I don't remember exactly the lvl i hit before black wolf... I think i lvl up two times by here.

Thomaz

2009-05-26 12:12:25 am

Catchin' them all

I have started a new testrun. Second segment is very annoying. I need a good set of enemies so I can manipulate an Insect Meat from the Bebe (using the Hero to beat them). I actually just got one but I messed up by talking to the wrong guy accidently. >___<

Oh well, we'll see how long this'll take, it's about 1% I think.

Chent

2009-05-26 02:28:00 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Yes, it can get really boring. That's just two segments at the beginning though, and a segment in the airship too, for the Mindflare's fight meat.

However, that's really for a perfect run. If you don't take any meat, you will lose very little time (i'd say between 1 and 3 mins, counting all 3 fights), so you will have a fairly good idea of the time you can achieve even if you don't grab those rare drops. It does change the strategy a bit though.
No meat for Trivi means crouching for mp.
No meat for Black Wolf means more bow hits. (Don't forget to sala-buff !)
No meat for Mindlfare means more walnuts.

I will try to search my notes to find where i take those meats, if that can help. I remember that for the Mindflare meat, it's in the airship, in a room where magic dolls must spawn. For the first, it's south of first village, going to the chobin hood fight. And the second one, just after leaving the first cave.

Thomaz

Edit history:

Thomaz: 2009-06-04 11:19:37 am

2009-06-02 02:50:39 pm

Catchin' them all

I really need that Tough Meat because I'll never survive his ball attack without it. Sad

Unless I use a Gumdrop or something and I don't have any. But yeah, no luck getting the Meat just yet. It's really getting boring.

Edit: I had to start over because I saved over the segment I was using. Doesn't matter, because I just got an Insect Meat! Cheesy

Now to try for the Tough Meat again, I'm sure I'll be stuck here for a while again.

Btw, Trivy is not KO'd by two Salamander spells. One spell at max deals 14 or so, with a double burn, that would be 14 x 2 + 4 x 2 = 36. That's 4 HP short. :/

I could crouch or use up the Magic Walnut I got in Lee's mansion. I level up after this fight, but maybe I should kill a random Bat so I have more Int to kill it? (or use the level up as a free Magic Walnut, that could actually work) I have to equip the Bow for killing the thing to free Salamander anyway.

Though, when I get that Tough Meat, the Hellhound will be a lot easier, dealing 4 damage per hit with a Salamander Buff. I figured I'm picking up the Gum Drop as well, there are two I could pick up even. For now, I skip the first Gum Drop.

I really need that Tough Meat because I'll never survive his ball attack without it. :( Unless I use a Gumdrop or something and I don't have any. But yeah, no luck getting the Meat just yet. It's really getting boring.

Edit: I had to start over because I saved over the segment I was using. Doesn't matter, because I just got an Insect Meat! :D Now to try for the Tough Meat again, I'm sure I'll be stuck here for a while again.

Btw, Trivy is not KO'd by two Salamander spells. One spell at max deals 14 or so, with a double burn, that would be 14 x 2 + 4 x 2 = 36. That's 4 HP short. :/

I could crouch or use up the Magic Walnut I got in Lee's mansion. I level up after this fight, but maybe I should kill a random Bat so I have more Int to kill it? (or use the level up as a free Magic Walnut, that could actually work) I have to equip the Bow for killing the thing to free Salamander anyway.

Though, when I get that Tough Meat, the Hellhound will be a lot easier, dealing 4 damage per hit with a Salamander Buff. I figured I'm picking up the Gum Drop as well, there are two I could pick up even. For now, I skip the first Gum Drop.

Chent

2009-06-05 03:06:22 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

For Trivi, i use the lvl up to regen mp. I keep the lvl up gained in the plains after the cave up to this fight. I cast sala two times, use the lvl up, and cast it one last time. Then, i have enough mp to buff myself during all the black wolf fight, in which i use a meat, too.

You don't need any gumdrop for black wolf. Sala buff, eat your meat, and hit it with your bow from the greatest distance possible. It will never attack you. You might lose a few seconds using your bow instead of the staff, but you gain enough time by avoiding a lot of other things : opening a gumdrop chest, being hit by the wolf, opening your menu to heal, etc...

I must have been very lucky with the meat drops, because i remember i only reseted my gba a few times (around 10) each spot. The drop rate is between 7% and 9% for those meats.

Thomaz

2009-06-05 07:54:01 am

Catchin' them all

So you beat an extra monster as well? With the total exp, I level up right after Trivy ( Chobin Hood + 2 Rabites & Bebe + Rabite who's in the way lol + 4 Chobin Hoods + 2 Rabites & Chobin Hood). One extra Bat would get me a level up right before Trivy and I could use it to regen my MP like you said

But from what I read, you fought more monsters and got a second level up? Did I get that right? Also, do you pick up the Magic Walnut in the room next to Salamander?

You have msn btw? Tongue

Sorry for all these questions, I just want to make sure the run is as good as possible. ^_~

Kingnahum18

Edit history:

Kingnahum18: 2010-08-23 11:38:56 am

2010-08-20 03:17:41 pm

Get 'er Done!

I believe this is pretty much the same as Final Fantasy Adventure, but with added stuff. I'm not sure there are many glitches, as there aren't usually many on mobile games.

Though since it has the leveling system that could be a major player in it, as could the class system. Magic vs. Melee?

BTW how many people have this and play it?

Rakuen

2010-08-20 03:34:51 pm

Weegee Time

This thread will probably be useful to you:

http://forum.speeddemosarchive.com/post/sword_of_mana6.html

Also, I have it, and have completed it once.

Kingnahum18

2010-08-21 02:09:39 pm

Get 'er Done!

Anyone still on this thread?

Thomaz

2010-08-21 06:46:00 pm

Catchin' them all

I still want to do this run, I just don't really know the best way to go on, using Magic. The first part (especially the Hellhound) is pretty hard to do fast when your attack is so low. I haven't played in a while too, I'll pick up soon. Smiley

Dragondarch

2010-08-21 11:08:20 pm

Pudding%

I actually had an interest in doing a run on this game (or 2, with each character)...I have other projects going on right now, though.

If I come up with any information that may be helpful I'll be sure to post it here Smiley