Simon the sorcerer

2010-09-26 11:42:41 pm

I know that adventure game runs are fairly sparse here on SDA, and I am currently doing a Simon the Sorcerer run. I am still planning my route atm. I have done a trial run (single segment, first attempt) and clocked in at 1:31:41. This was a relatively improvised run, with several mistakes, and this is more of an upper bound for the time than anything else.
The final run will probably be segmented, due to me wanting to luck manipulate the witch fight 3-0.
I realize that for the run to be accepted I will probably have to install Windows 98 and run it on there, I will be doing practice through ScummVM however.
Would anyone be interested in this run at all? I would like there to be more adventure games on SDA, so I am willing to run this on Windows 98 if that is necessary.

Thread title:

ZenicReverie

2010-09-27 08:25:52 am

Waiting hurts my soul...

I'm interested, and I'm sure others are as well. Good luck with getting a recording setup on an older Windows system.

ShadowWraith

2010-09-27 08:44:05 am

.

http://www.adventure-speedruns.com/sites/main.php

I don't think SDA actually accepts point and click adventure games, but this site does. Smiley

ZenicReverie

2010-09-27 08:49:45 am

Waiting hurts my soul...

Quote from ShadowWraith:

http://www.adventure-speedruns.com/sites/main.php

I don't think SDA actually accepts point and click adventure games, but this site does. Smiley

Myst isn't point and click?

Strigoides

2010-09-27 05:38:16 pm

I'm pretty sure there is this one quote people always post about this, lets see if I can find it...

Quote from FAQ:

We used to ban certain genres like fighting games for various reasons, but now we will accept any game where the speed of a speedrun is faster than that of experienced, normal play. This means that games such as fixed autoscrollers or rhythm games are generally not acceptable.

I agree that in some very linear adventure games, the speedrun may not be faster than "experienced, normal play", but with Simon the Sorcerer, this is definitely not the case. The route you take throughout the first section of the game (which takes the majority of the time) can change your time a lot, I am still sorting out my route.

Strigoides

2010-09-28 01:46:05 am

I have pretty much got my route down pat for the first section, after that there is not much to remember as it is much more linear.
I know the answer will probably be no, but is it within the rules to run Windows 98 in VitrualBox, and then run the game through that? I know that one of the objections to ScummVM is that it lets you change stuff in the game, and I wouldn't be able to do that through Windows 98 in VirtualBox.

d_arnold07

2010-09-28 05:29:19 am

yeh virtualbox is against the rules as well sorry.

good luck with the run! If you can't get an old computer running windows 98 you can always submit to http://www.adventure-speedruns.com/

Strigoides

2010-10-04 05:09:41 pm

Ok, I tried installing it on XP, and as far as I can tell, it is running perfectly normally. Is this within the rules? I am not running any virtualization or emulation software to get it to run, but it is running on a system that it was not originally designed for.

ZenicReverie

2010-10-04 06:13:28 pm

Waiting hurts my soul...

and it records? If so, upload a sample. I'm sure someone should be able to tell you if it's running at a normal speed.

Strigoides

2010-10-04 06:43:33 pm

I will try recording now. What software would you recommend?

ZenicReverie

2010-10-04 07:12:30 pm

Waiting hurts my soul...

Quote from Strigoides:

I will try recording now. What software would you recommend?

Whatever will work. Fraps probably won't, unless the game used DirectX. So, you'll need a screen capture program: VLC has one, Camtasia, Camstudio, etc.

Good luck.

Strigoides

2010-10-04 07:37:56 pm

No luck so far. Whenever I start playing, it looks fine - very pixelated, but fine. However, when I record, as soon as I start the game, the video displays it at what looks like the games native resolution, but at the top left of the screen, with massive color distortion. I tried with VLC and CamStudio, the only difference was that with CamStudio, the window jumped around a bit. Note that this is only in the video; when I am playing it looks fine.

ZenicReverie

2010-10-04 07:51:28 pm

Waiting hurts my soul...

Yeah, a lot of the headaches with older games are related to getting them to play, but the secondary ones come from trying to record. I'm not sure what else you could try. Check the knowledge base and tech support forum.

Strigoides

2010-10-04 08:37:29 pm

Tried VirtualDub as well; just got screwed up sound. I'll probably ask in the Tech Support board.

honorableJay

2010-10-06 03:27:48 pm

The Dork Knight himself.

Can you get this game to work in Vista or Win7? If so, Fraps can be set to record the desktop, which should include any windows drawn on top of it.

Strigoides

2010-10-06 03:35:16 pm

I don't have any computers running Vista or Windows 7.

El_Nino

Edit history:

El_Nino: 2011-01-31 06:18:05 am

El_Nino: 2011-01-31 06:17:10 am

El_Nino: 2011-01-31 06:14:28 am

2011-01-31 06:13:26 am

Adventure Speedruns

It is awesome to see someone is going to run simon the sorcerer.

If you have troubles recording the game, you can use ZD Games Recorder.
Maybe you have luck with this tool.

If you want to release your final video on my website Aventure-Speedruns.com you are always welcome.

Bromazepam

2011-02-01 02:43:14 am

Steam addict

I'd be happy to see good old Simon get speedrun.

About your recording problems, you said that strange things happen with Camtasia. Are you playing fullscreen or windowed? I'd imagine it goes bonkers if you're playing fullscreen because it's expecting to recording the same resolution as your desktop, and finds itself recording something else. If that's your problem, you might want to try to set your desktop resolution the same as the game - I don't remember Simon's resolution, but if it's too low you might not have that option in XP.
If you're having problems while recording a window, instead, I find it most strange, singe I did record DOS windows with Camtasia in the past.

Strigoides

2011-04-03 03:57:44 am

Thanks for the interest in the run. I kind of forgot about it after I couldn't get it to record, but I haven't tried ZD Games Recorder, or, since I was playing fullscreen, setting my desktop resolution to the same as Simon. I don't have time right now, but I will give these suggestions a try tomorrow.

Strigoides

2011-04-04 02:57:18 am

I tried setting my desktop resolution to that of Simon (640x480), but this did not produce a noticeable difference. I also tried ZDSoft Games Recorder, but this only produced a black screen for the video. Thanks for the suggestions anyway.

CleverDan

2015-03-21 01:31:22 pm

**Thread Necromancy**

Here we have my next point-and-click adventure game speedrun, this time for Simon The Sorcerer in 23:00. I didn't include the splits in the video recording this time, but I had them running next to the game while playing. I start time when you gain control in Calypso's hut at the beginning of the game, and end timing when you use the wax bucket on Sordid in the Fiery Pits of Rondar. Similar to my King's Quest VI run last time, I'm recording using OBS and ScummVM, running the MS-DOS version of the game from GOG.com. In this game, any% is basically the only worthwhile category, because there are only 2 additional items you could pick up for 100%, but you don't even use them, so forget it.

This is more of a proof-of-concept run rather than a refined speedrun, mostly nailing down the route. There are a few tweaks I still need to do (mostly finding the fastest dialogue pathing) and then it's just execution. This game is unique in that it has a "Speed mode" built in to the game by pressing CTRL+F, and then CTRL+F1 further speeds up the subtitles, so this game moves very quickly for a point-and-click adventure. Sadly, the DOS version is the fastest, because the voice acting can't be sped up, so we're stuck with the DOS version with inferior sound quality, but it's a trade-off we'll have to live with.

I predict that a lot of time could be saved from this run purely by being a faster and more accurate clicker than me. A lot of little bits of time are lost in all the inventory-management, movement, item-usage, and so on throughout the run, so there is a lot of room to improve. I'm guessing that possibly as low as 20 minutes would be do-able, just extremely difficult.

Regarding the route, it can vary wildly up until entering the Tower for the last 5 1/2 minutes of the game. To enter the Tower, you need both the broomstick and the Druid's potion. To get the broomstick, you need to have given the staff and 30 gold pcs to the wizards in the bar, and you need to have learned the magic words from the tree in the mountains. Then you duel the witch in her hut, grab the broomstick, and high-tail it outta there once she turns into a Dragon. To get the potion, you need to rescue the druid from the Goblin's fortress, and give the rescued Druid the Toadsbane from Skull Island in the swamps. So, everything you do for the first 17 minutes is all smaller puzzles building up to getting the broomstick and the potion. Nothing can be skipped as far as I can tell, so it is all routing. I think my route is pretty good, but it might not be perfect yet. I haven't quite spent the time going through it to iron out all the small details (warping somewhere vs. walking, how many trips back to town, etc) but I think this is pretty close.

Anyway, here's what I have so far. Any feedback from anyone would be awesome, otherwise I might just move on to something else. I'm not entirely sure yet.

**Thread Necromancy**

http://youtu.be/jI-QwEMIme4

Here we have my next point-and-click adventure game speedrun, this time for Simon The Sorcerer in 23:00.  I didn't include the splits in the video recording this time, but I had them running next to the game while playing.  I start time when you gain control in Calypso's hut at the beginning of the game, and end timing when you use the wax bucket on Sordid in the Fiery Pits of Rondar.  Similar to my King's Quest VI run last time, I'm recording using OBS and ScummVM, running the MS-DOS version of the game from GOG.com.  In this game, any% is basically the only worthwhile category, because there are only 2 additional items you could pick up for 100%, but you don't even use them, so forget it.

This is more of a proof-of-concept run rather than a refined speedrun, mostly nailing down the route.  There are a few tweaks I still need to do (mostly finding the fastest dialogue pathing) and then it's just execution.  This game is unique in that it has a "Speed mode" built in to the game by pressing CTRL+F, and then CTRL+F1 further speeds up the subtitles, so this game moves very quickly for a point-and-click adventure.  Sadly, the DOS version is the fastest, because the voice acting can't be sped up, so we're stuck with the DOS version with inferior sound quality, but it's a trade-off we'll have to live with.

I predict that a lot of time could be saved from this run purely by being a faster and more accurate clicker than me.  A lot of little bits of time are lost in all the inventory-management, movement, item-usage, and so on throughout the run, so there is a lot of room to improve.  I'm guessing that possibly as low as 20 minutes would be do-able, just extremely difficult.

Regarding the route, it can vary wildly up until entering the Tower for the last 5 1/2 minutes of the game.  To enter the Tower, you need both the broomstick and the Druid's potion.  To get the broomstick, you need to have given the staff and 30 gold pcs to the wizards in the bar, and you need to have learned the magic words from the tree in the mountains.  Then you duel the witch in her hut, grab the broomstick, and high-tail it outta there once she turns into a Dragon.  To get the potion, you need to rescue the druid from the Goblin's fortress, and give the rescued Druid the Toadsbane from Skull Island in the swamps.  So, everything you do for the first 17 minutes is all smaller puzzles building up to getting the broomstick and the potion.  Nothing can be skipped as far as I can tell, so it is all routing.  I think my route is pretty good, but it might not be perfect yet.  I haven't quite spent the time going through it to iron out all the small details (warping somewhere vs. walking, how many trips back to town, etc) but I think this is pretty close.

Anyway, here's what I have so far.  Any feedback from anyone would be awesome, otherwise I might just move on to something else.  I'm not entirely sure yet.

CleverDan

2015-03-22 12:53:59 am

Quote:

I'm guessing that possibly as low as 20 minutes would be do-able, just extremely difficult.

It actually wasn't that difficult, it just took a few tries. Here( ) is Simon the Sorcerer any% in 20:19. This is mostly the same run as the last one I posted, just cleaner execution and a better layout as well.

Again, any thoughts or feedback would be appreciated Cheesy

LotBlind

2015-03-22 04:41:12 am

I'll take a look at this within a couple of days unless someone already has!

LotBlind

Edit history:

LotBlind: 2015-03-24 10:08:26 am

2015-03-23 11:23:17 am

In theory there could be a way to micro-manage the speedrun in a really optimal way. So e.g. when you get into the screen outside the bar, you could theoretically click once around the bar door to get Simon moving, then quickly select open and go back to the door to actually open it. However because the game runs so damn fast this will be considerably more challenging to pull off... Another set of micro-improvements can be had by using items when they're as close to the left edge of the inventory as possible. In the bar scene right after you combine the magnet and string
a) after you've collected two other items pushing them more to the right
b) at a time when your cursor was far away from the use command (well in a relative sense). Could you do it right after picking the rope and clapper up (but after getting Simon going again)?

And yeah learning your route even better (after the bar two left, then immediately two right, then before the transition select talk to or at least hover over it) will help you bring your cursor to the right place in good time. Do you have to wait until you're on the screen before selecting actions? Just to be sure you can't select convo options with the number keys?

Another general piece of advice would be to use cues from the previous screen to get close to the thing you need to click on the next one, but ofc if you have to select the action on the screen itself that won't help with anything but walking to places. Also can you already scroll the inventory into the right position before you've gotten to the screen where you need to use the next item?

Other than that... mash even harder? Can you use enter or some other keys to help with that? Drill convos and other smaller portions of the run several times over as well as doing full runs? TBF the execution is almost good enough now, but there's a few too many spots where you hesitate with what comes next so I think sub 20 really is a good goal to set.

EDIT:
Another practice technique I came up with is just walking around the place and seeing if you can remember which screen you're about to enter and where its exits are without really doing anything else.

In theory there could be a way to micro-manage the speedrun in a really optimal way. So e.g. when you get into the screen outside the bar, you could theoretically click once around the bar door to get Simon moving, then quickly select open and go back to the door to actually open it. However because the game runs so damn fast this will be considerably more challenging to pull off... Another set of micro-improvements can be had by using items when they're as close to the left edge of the inventory as possible. In the bar scene right after you combine the magnet and string
a) after you've collected two other items pushing them more to the right
b) at a time when your cursor was far away from the use command (well in a relative sense). Could you do it right after picking the rope and clapper up (but after getting Simon going again)?

And yeah learning your route even better (after the bar two left, then immediately two right, then before the transition select talk to or at least hover over it) will help you bring your cursor to the right place in good time. Do you have to wait until you're on the screen before selecting actions? Just to be sure you can't select convo options with the number keys?

Another general piece of advice would be to use cues from the previous screen to get close to the thing you need to click on the next one, but ofc if you have to select the action on the screen itself that won't help with anything but walking to places. Also can you already scroll the inventory into the right position before you've gotten to the screen where you need to use the next item?

Other than that... mash even harder? Can you use enter or some other keys to help with that? Drill convos and other smaller portions of the run several times over as well as doing full runs? TBF the execution is almost good enough now, but there's a few too many spots where you hesitate with what comes next so I think sub 20 really is a good goal to set.

EDIT:
Another practice technique I came up with is just walking around the place and seeing if you can remember which screen you're about to enter and where its exits are without really doing anything else.

CleverDan

Edit history:

CleverDan: 2015-03-26 10:08:09 pm

CleverDan: 2015-03-26 09:28:02 pm

CleverDan: 2015-03-26 09:22:20 pm

2015-03-26 09:17:29 pm

Thanks for the feedback LotBlind! I'll respond to your points and also post more notes and thoughts about this run. I haven't played the game since I got that run a week ago, and I just went and re-watched the run and took notes, so here we go!

Quote:

In theory there could be a way to micro-manage the speedrun in a really optimal way. So e.g. when you get into the screen outside the bar, you could theoretically click once around the bar door to get Simon moving, then quickly select open and go back to the door to actually open it. However because the game runs so damn fast this will be considerably more challenging to pull off.

Yes, this is perfectly possible, just very difficult to do. A very fast and accurate mouse hand is required for this game, because of the high speed that "fast mode" offers.

Quote:

Another set of micro-improvements can be had by using items when they're as close to the left edge of the inventory as possible. In the bar scene right after you combine the magnet and string...

Inventory management is something that I need to work on, and it really should just be part of the route, but I haven't put the time and effort into getting it to that level of optimization yet. You can scroll the inventory with the mouse wheel almost whenever, so that helps a lot. Also, combining the rope and magnet puts the new ropey-magnet at the top of the inventory, so doing it right before using it was a thought I had. Doing the combining while walking is smart, too, because that would definitely save some more time.

Quote:

Do you have to wait until you're on the screen before selecting actions? Just to be sure you can't select convo options with the number keys?

Yes, you have to wait until on screen to select an action. If you select "use", for example, while walking, Simon will continue walking, but stop at the edge of the screen.

Unless you can use the numpad (my keyboard doesn't have one), then no, you definitely cannot choose dialogue options with any keyboard input. ESC will skip a few cutscenes, but that's about it for the keyboard during the run.

Quote:

Also can you already scroll the inventory into the right position before you've gotten to the screen where you need to use the next item?

Yes I can do this a lot better. The mousewheel scrolls the inventory at almost any time during the game.

This run could be much better if I practiced it more. This is only run number 20 on the splits Smiley

I had my hand-written notes in front of me and I was checking them while running, and obviously I need to have the route down perfectly in order to not have to pause and think about what to do. Although, with the high speed that this game runs at, it makes this hard to do, as you are going 20 minutes non-stop one thing after another after another.

Anyway, here are my notes (mostly regarding the route) I took after my recent re-watch:

*Much faster curser movement in general is needed all throughout the run

*Need to find out when to combine the magnet and rope optimally

*Speech with ogre with thorn in foot was optimal

*After owl feather , need to see if using the map to warp back to town, then going to the witch's hut is faster than just walking straight to the hut.

*The woodworms in the stump have some sort of unknown method of deciding when they want to talk to you. Sometimes they talk to you the second time you're on screen (ideal) and sometimes they don't talk to you until the third time you see them, when you already have the mahogany. Need to figure this out

*Using that well handle is very tough, it's a small hitbox -_-

*Speech with protesting troll was optimal. I skip getting the sign he drops, making this a low%/any% run, I guess. That sign is the only optional item in the game, and it has no use.

*dialogue with oaf with beans was optimal, but I need to see if you can stay on screen and grab the beans or if you are forced to leave the screen and re-enter before you can grab the beans. I've always left and re-entered because that's what the game prompts you to do, automatically sending Simon walking to the edge of the screen after talking to the oaf, but you can stop him by selecting "use" or any other command so he halts at the edge of the screen.

*the dodgy geezer in town has a random speech he will initiate, but I dodged it with luck

*after grabbing watermelon behind the starting hut, I should have used the map to warp to town, then walked to the bar instead of walking straight to the bar

*using that beeswax on the beer tap actually has a really tight timing window when on fast mode. I don't always get that first try

*dwarf section optimal

*speech with the lumberjack has not been routed optimally, so I just click randomly to progress. This method works in most of the conversations in this game, but some choices have fewer text boxes than others, and some lead to the end result much quicker than others. This is one of those cases where you can choose any option, mash through it, and get the metal detector, but that's not optimal, obviously.

*swampling section optimal, but I should have map-warped, after getting toadsbane, to the center of the forest and gone up to the mountains from there, instead of walking all the way back from skull island, through the hut, and back to the main path

*the blacksmith has cycles, you can't put the rock or the ore on his anvil while he's using hammering it, so you have to be quick to hit the first cycle. It's not too hard though.

*I messed up the speech with the paleontologist in the pit. I have to talk to him again and re-do it Sad

*speech with woodworms has not been optimally routed

*golum speech was optimal

*I remove fast mode to pull the bandage on the mummy. I haven't been able to click it fast enough with fast mode on.

*don't open the iron maiden until AFTER the druid transforms and leaves.

*druid speech 1 is not optimally routed

*wizards at the bar speech is not optimally routed

*druid speech 2 is optimal

*The duel with the Witch has some sort of RNG that needs studying. It feels like she has some sort of pattern, but I haven't figured it out yet. I just use "sausages" as often as I can, basically, and it usually works pretty well, but you can go 3-0 against her, which I didn't this time.

*Once inside the tower, the game is completely linear.

*Misclicked hanging the shield on the hook, then brainfarted. I meant to hang it, then polish it, not polish it in the inventory, then hang it.

*magic mirror speech is optimal

*demons speech is not optimally routed - this is a big to-do, because I could definitely save a lot of time here

*Pits of Rondor was optimal

*Don't click anything after "use"ing the wand on Sordid. If you try to mash and skip Simon's dialogue, the game will just sit there and wait for a good 20 or 30 seconds for some reason before Simon zaps him. Just let this one progress on its own.

*I remove fast mode for the final usage of wax on Sordid. This has a really tight timing window on fast mode, and I don't like to risk it.

So, there's my novel on this game Smiley

As far as point-and-click adventure games go, this is one of the hardest ones to speedrun, IMO, because of the fast speed. Without fast speed, as the initial posts in this thread will show, a speedrun is over an hour. Granted, I've only routed and ran a couple other games (KQ5 and 6, a little bit of Gabriel Knight) but this one is by far the most difficult, possessing a higher skill-ceiling and potential for more and more time saved the better and more accurate you get. I don't know how much more energy I'll put into this game, but I'll stick around and update this thread if I do more runs.

Thanks for the feedback LotBlind!  I'll respond to your points and also post more notes and thoughts about this run.  I haven't played the game since I got that run a week ago, and I just went and re-watched the run and took notes, so here we go!

[quote]In theory there could be a way to micro-manage the speedrun in a really optimal way. So e.g. when you get into the screen outside the bar, you could theoretically click once around the bar door to get Simon moving, then quickly select open and go back to the door to actually open it. However because the game runs so damn fast this will be considerably more challenging to pull off.[/quote]

Yes, this is perfectly possible, just very difficult to do.  A very fast and accurate mouse hand is required for this game, because of the high speed that "fast mode" offers.

[quote]Another set of micro-improvements can be had by using items when they're as close to the left edge of the inventory as possible. In the bar scene right after you combine the magnet and string...[/quote]

Inventory management is something that I need to work on, and it really should just be part of the route, but I haven't put the time and effort into getting it to that level of optimization yet.  You can scroll the inventory with the mouse wheel almost whenever, so that helps a lot.  Also, combining the rope and magnet puts the new ropey-magnet at the top of the inventory, so doing it right before using it was a thought I had.  Doing the combining while walking is smart, too, because that would definitely save some more time.

[quote]Do you have to wait until you're on the screen before selecting actions? Just to be sure you can't select convo options with the number keys?[/quote]

Yes, you have to wait until on screen to select an action.  If you select "use", for example, while walking, Simon will continue walking, but stop at the edge of the screen.

Unless you can use the numpad (my keyboard doesn't have one), then no, you definitely cannot choose dialogue options with any keyboard input.  ESC will skip a few cutscenes, but that's about it for the keyboard during the run.

[quote]Also can you already scroll the inventory into the right position before you've gotten to the screen where you need to use the next item?[/quote] Yes I can do this a lot better.  The mousewheel scrolls the inventory at almost any time during the game.

This run could be much better if I practiced it more.  This is only run number 20 on the splits :)  I had my hand-written notes in front of me and I was checking them while running, and obviously I need to have the route down perfectly in order to not have to pause and think about what to do.  Although, with the high speed that this game runs at, it makes this hard to do, as you are going 20 minutes non-stop one thing after another after another.

Anyway, here are my notes (mostly regarding the route) I took after my recent re-watch:

*Much faster curser movement in general is needed all throughout the run

*Need to find out when to combine the magnet and rope optimally

*Speech with ogre with thorn in foot was optimal

*After owl feather , need to see if using the map to warp back to town, then going to the witch's hut is faster than just walking straight to the hut.

*The woodworms in the stump have some sort of unknown method of deciding when they want to talk to you.  Sometimes they talk to you the second time you're on screen (ideal) and sometimes they don't talk to you until the third time you see them, when you already have the mahogany.  Need to figure this out

*Using that well handle is very tough, it's a small hitbox -_-

*Speech with protesting troll was optimal.  I skip getting the sign he drops, making this a low%/any% run, I guess.  That sign is the only optional item in the game, and it has no use.

*dialogue with oaf with beans was optimal, but I need to see if you can stay on screen and grab the beans or if you are forced to leave the screen and re-enter before you can grab the beans.  I've always left and re-entered because that's what the game prompts you to do, automatically sending Simon walking to the edge of the screen after talking to the oaf, but you can stop him by selecting "use" or any other command so he halts at the edge of the screen.

*the dodgy geezer in town has a random speech he will initiate, but I dodged it with luck

*after grabbing watermelon behind the starting hut, I should have used the map to warp to town, then walked to the bar instead of walking straight to the bar

*using that beeswax on the beer tap actually has a really tight timing window when on fast mode.  I don't always get that first try

*dwarf section optimal

*speech with the lumberjack has not been routed optimally, so I just click randomly to progress.  This method works in most of the conversations in this game, but some choices have fewer text boxes than others, and some lead to the end result much quicker than others.  This is one of those cases where you can choose any option, mash through it, and get the metal detector, but that's not optimal, obviously.

*swampling section optimal, but I should have map-warped, after getting toadsbane, to the center of the forest and gone up to the mountains from there, instead of walking all the way back from skull island, through the hut, and back to the main path

*the blacksmith has cycles, you can't put the rock or the ore on his anvil while he's using hammering it, so you have to be quick to hit the first cycle.  It's not too hard though.

*I messed up the speech with the paleontologist in the pit.  I have to talk to him again and re-do it :(

*speech with woodworms has not been optimally routed

*golum speech was optimal

*I remove fast mode to pull the bandage on the mummy.  I haven't been able to click it fast enough with fast mode on.

*don't open the iron maiden until AFTER the druid transforms and leaves.

*druid speech 1 is not optimally routed

*wizards at the bar speech is not optimally routed

*druid speech 2 is optimal

*The duel with the Witch has some sort of RNG that needs studying.  It feels like she has some sort of pattern, but I haven't figured it out yet.  I just use "sausages" as often as I can, basically, and it usually works pretty well, but you can go 3-0 against her, which I didn't this time.

*Once inside the tower, the game is completely linear.

*Misclicked hanging the shield on the hook, then brainfarted.  I meant to hang it, then polish it, not polish it in the inventory, then hang it.

*magic mirror speech is optimal

*demons speech is not optimally routed - this is a big to-do, because I could definitely save a lot of time here

*Pits of Rondor was optimal

*Don't click anything after "use"ing the wand on Sordid.  If you try to mash and skip Simon's dialogue, the game will just sit there and wait for a good 20 or 30 seconds for some reason before Simon zaps him.  Just let this one progress on its own.

*I remove fast mode for the final usage of wax on Sordid.  This has a really tight timing window on fast mode, and I don't like to risk it.

So, there's my novel on this game :)  As far as point-and-click adventure games go, this is one of the hardest ones to speedrun, IMO, because of the fast speed.  Without fast speed, as the initial posts in this thread will show, a speedrun is over an hour.    Granted, I've only routed and ran a couple other games (KQ5 and 6, a little bit of Gabriel Knight) but this one is by far the most difficult, possessing a higher skill-ceiling and potential for more and more time saved the better and more accurate you get.  I don't know how much more energy I'll put into this game, but I'll stick around and update this thread if I do more runs.