Pokemon Gold/Silver

2007-01-18 08:10:34 pm

dinosaur from the past

How much money would you have to spend on bitter medicines to keep them down, though? I'd imagine it be quite a bit of money...

AquaTiger

Edit history:

AquaTiger: 2007-01-18 08:33:22 pm

2007-01-18 08:24:37 pm

Never give up!

I was adding it while you were posting, but I'll repeat it here by paraphrasing from the guide I'm citing:

Fainting reduces a Pokemon's Happiness by 1.
Heal Powder and Energy Powder reduce Happiness by 5 each.
Energy Root reduces Happiness by 10.
Revival Herb reduces Happiness by 15.

A Pokemon's happiness when acquired always starts at 70 barring the use of a Friend Ball, which puts it at 200 (meaning traded Pokemon will always start at 70).

Considering that, it doesn't take all that many Energy Roots (the most cost-effective solution here) to reduce Happiness to its minimum.

I do admit that keeping it that way is kinda tough, due to two important things:

Every 512 steps taken with a Pokemon in the party increases its Happiness by 1.

And the one that might actually piss me off and ruin this strategy.....
Levelups raise a Pokemon's happiness by either 3 or 5.

That's a lot of Energy Roots to keep levelup bonuses out of the way, especially with a traded Pokemon like Machop.

So we're back to square one with this.

I have yet to see in a guide how much Happiness is required for the Return TM, although I imagine it's 220, the same Happiness score required for certain evolutions. If it's lower than that I'll be more likely to tolerate Return, but if it's only something like 150, Return's the way to go.

I was adding it while you were posting, but I'll repeat it here by paraphrasing from the guide I'm citing:

Fainting reduces a Pokemon's Happiness by 1.
Heal Powder and Energy Powder reduce Happiness by 5 each.
Energy Root reduces Happiness by 10.
Revival Herb reduces Happiness by 15.

A Pokemon's happiness when acquired always starts at 70 barring the use of a Friend Ball, which puts it at 200 (meaning traded Pokemon will always start at 70).

Considering that, it doesn't take all that many Energy Roots (the most cost-effective solution here) to reduce Happiness to its minimum.

I do admit that keeping it that way is kinda tough, due to two important things:

Every 512 steps taken with a Pokemon in the party increases its Happiness by 1.

And the one that might actually piss me off and ruin this strategy.....
Levelups raise a Pokemon's happiness by either 3 or 5.

That's a lot of Energy Roots to keep levelup bonuses out of the way, especially with a traded Pokemon like Machop.

So we're back to square one with this.

I have yet to see in a guide how much Happiness is required for the Return TM, although I imagine it's 220, the same Happiness score required for certain evolutions.  If it's lower than that I'll be more likely to tolerate Return, but if it's only something like 150, Return's the way to go.

Yoshi348

2007-01-18 10:16:03 pm

dinosaur from the past

All I've been able to get about Return/Frustration is that the maximum power of each is 102. It seems like it isn't a binary test, i.e. there's more than two possible power levels for each. The only problem is I can't figure out just how many power levels are possible. Whether the happiness scale is divided in to anywhere 1/4ths or 1/40ths, I have no clue.

FractalFusion

Edit history:

FractalFusion: 2007-01-19 01:31:40 am

2007-01-19 01:30:29 am

If H is happiness (0 to 255), then:

Return's base power = floor(2*H/5)
Frustration's base power = floor(2*(255-H)/5)

In other words, the scale is 2/5 and it takes 2 or 3 happiness points each time to raise Return's base power by 1.

AquaTiger

Edit history:

AquaTiger: 2007-01-19 01:43:27 am

2007-01-19 01:43:08 am

Never give up!

Hmmmm.....

This might very well help, but what I meant to ask was the Happiness level that would cause the TM giver to actually give you the Return TM, rather than how Happiness affects the move Return.

Yoshi348

2007-01-19 05:50:32 am

dinosaur from the past

Heh, sorry about that... been SO long since I've played GSC, so I'm not going to be much help on the overworld.

AquaTiger

Edit history:

AquaTiger: 2007-01-19 06:07:16 pm

2007-01-19 02:55:59 pm

Never give up!

Okay, I'm starting to look at my possibilities for the second part.

Note that unless I specify, Machop will be taking on any fights. Also note that I did all the prep for this part in the previous segment (mainly the Bicycle and a bunch of healing items - Fresh Water in my case since I didn't feel my funds would allow for enough Lemonade).

Here's what I have in mind so far:
-I'm going to take this gym slowly and fight EVERY trainer here, so Machop can get valuable experience. In this test I may need to exit once and get an X Defend or two so Machop can survive Miltank, but in the real run I'll have gotten that earlier in Goldenrod. I may also want one of the elemental punches next time.
-Standard getting the Squirtbottle and leaving after Whitney. Since I didn't get an elemental punch earlier this time, I'm going to detour and get one (probably Ice Punch, but Thunder Punch is another viable option).
-I'm going to detour to National Park to get TM28. I need it. Badly.
-I'll check which trainers are required, but if I have to wind up facing Bryan (Pidgey and Pidgeotto) or Mark (two Abras and a Kadabra), those battles will be fought with Croconaw. (I'm not concerned about Greg, despite the type disadvantage, as his Drowzee is one level short of what's necessary for a Psychic-based attack).
-Since it's pure Rock, I will be FIGHTING the Sudowoodo.
-I need to get to Ecruteak without using Dig in a single battle.
-If I am setting the day to Sunday, and I chose Thunder Punch as the elemental punch to learn, I will get the Magnet on route 37 and give it to Machop when he gets closer to Pokemon that are weak to Electric.
-The Eevee evolutions held by the Ecruteak Dancers will be taken out with Dig, except Umbreon and possibly Vaporeon, which will be fought with Machop's innate Fighting moves.
-If I have to fight every Pokemon in Morty's gym, that's a total of 15 battles. With that, and Dig's limited number of uses, you'd think I'd need to backtrack to a Pokemon Center in between. However, on a whim during the previous segment, I'd picked up an Ether (which was a hidden one) in Ilex Forest. Boy, am I now glad I got it.
-On the way to Olivine, if it turns out I have to face Toby, Chad, or Norman, their Pokemon will be fought with Croconaw. Same goes for Dana, but only for the Psyduck.
-The paths to Olivine are also the point where I will start running from wild Pokemon encounters - I don't believe the experience is justified by the time lost any longer.
-I really hope I don't have to face all the birds in the Olivine Lighthouse. Although if I do, this would be my initial reason for Ice Punch.
-Once at the bottom of the lighthouse, Surf is going to either Poliwag or Croconaw. Not sure which one yet. Either Machop (maybe Machoke by now) or Croconaw will be getting Strength - I need to see how useful it is as an attack.
-I plan on avoiding the trainers on the way to Cianwood.
-Chuck's gym will be a slugfest, so viewers would get a rare opportunity here. I'm worried a little about Poliwrath, I admit (Poliwrath is part of the reason I'm considering Thunder Punch).
-Flying back to Olivine (Spearow's second use finally becomes a reality), Jasmine ought to be easy with Machoke doing the fighting.
-I am taking a detour to Violet City, as across the body of water, I can snag a Rare Candy and a PP Up (both of which will be saved up for later). Barring possibly some more items in Goldenrod, this is the only detour I plan on making.
-I'll end the segment in Lake of Rage.

Brown_Bomber took about 48 minutes to go through an equivalent portion of the game. Because of the number of detours I'm planning on taking, I'm counting on at least 55.

Okay, I'm starting to look at my possibilities for the second part.

Note that unless I specify, Machop will be taking on any fights.  Also note that I did all the prep for this part in the previous segment (mainly the Bicycle and a bunch of healing items - Fresh Water in my case since I didn't feel my funds would allow for enough Lemonade).

Here's what I have in mind so far:
-I'm going to take this gym slowly and fight EVERY trainer here, so Machop can get valuable experience.  In this test I may need to exit once and get an X Defend or two so Machop can survive Miltank, but in the real run I'll have gotten that earlier in Goldenrod.  I may also want one of the elemental punches next time.
-Standard getting the Squirtbottle and leaving after Whitney.  Since I didn't get an elemental punch earlier this time, I'm going to detour and get one (probably Ice Punch, but Thunder Punch is another viable option).
-I'm going to detour to National Park to get TM28.  I need it.  Badly.
-I'll check which trainers are required, but if I have to wind up facing Bryan (Pidgey and Pidgeotto) or Mark (two Abras and a Kadabra), those battles will be fought with Croconaw.  (I'm not concerned about Greg, despite the type disadvantage, as his Drowzee is one level short of what's necessary for a Psychic-based attack).
-Since it's pure Rock, I will be FIGHTING the Sudowoodo.
-I need to get to Ecruteak without using Dig in a single battle.
-If I am setting the day to Sunday, and I chose Thunder Punch as the elemental punch to learn, I will get the Magnet on route 37 and give it to Machop when he gets closer to Pokemon that are weak to Electric.
-The Eevee evolutions held by the Ecruteak Dancers will be taken out with Dig, except Umbreon and possibly Vaporeon, which will be fought with Machop's innate Fighting moves.
-If I have to fight every Pokemon in Morty's gym, that's a total of 15 battles.  With that, and Dig's limited number of uses, you'd think I'd need to backtrack to a Pokemon Center in between.  However, on a whim during the previous segment, I'd picked up an Ether (which was a hidden one) in Ilex Forest.  Boy, am I now glad I got it.
-On the way to Olivine, if it turns out I have to face Toby, Chad, or Norman, their Pokemon will be fought with Croconaw.  Same goes for Dana, but only for the Psyduck.
-The paths to Olivine are also the point where I will start running from wild Pokemon encounters - I don't believe the experience is justified by the time lost any longer.
-I really hope I don't have to face all the birds in the Olivine Lighthouse.  Although if I do, this would be my initial reason for Ice Punch.
-Once at the bottom of the lighthouse, Surf is going to either Poliwag or Croconaw.  Not sure which one yet.  Either Machop (maybe Machoke by now) or Croconaw will be getting Strength - I need to see how useful it is as an attack.
-I plan on avoiding the trainers on the way to Cianwood.
-Chuck's gym will be a slugfest, so viewers would get a rare opportunity here.  I'm worried a little about Poliwrath, I admit (Poliwrath is part of the reason I'm considering Thunder Punch).
-Flying back to Olivine (Spearow's second use finally becomes a reality), Jasmine ought to be easy with Machoke doing the fighting.
-I am taking a detour to Violet City, as across the body of water, I can snag a Rare Candy and a PP Up (both of which will be saved up for later).  Barring possibly some more items in Goldenrod, this is the only detour I plan on making.
-I'll end the segment in Lake of Rage.

Brown_Bomber took about 48 minutes to go through an equivalent portion of the game.  Because of the number of detours I'm planning on taking, I'm counting on at least 55.

AquaTiger

Edit history:

AquaTiger: 2007-01-19 08:40:50 pm

2007-01-19 08:02:41 pm

Never give up!

We officially have a problem.

I've completely forgotten to reckon with Dream Eater. Greg's Drowzee and Morty's Gengar both have it, and the latter case is more devastating because Croconaw can't save Machop (or Machoke) at that point. (Note that Machoke is outdistanced by pretty much anything within 10 levels, so it couldn't get a move off before being put to sleep.) I'm going to be trying a few more things to get around that, but if I can't get past that, I'm going to be forced to restart and try the Kadabra route. (I thought about the Gyarados idea for a moment, but decided way too much time would be lost raising it, and you'd have to wait until Ecruteak at best to have a decent Pokemon.)

Note that I tried to face Morty without using any stat-boosting items. Maybe an X Speed or two could be put to use here, so I can dig out of the way before Gengar can stop me. If I can get by the Gengar, the gym will have been a breeze, as the worst move anything else has is Night Shade (some of Morty's other ghosts have this), and I can survive those easily with a few healing items.

Note also that I'm not going to be able to get away with using Dig on the Kimono Girls' Espeon. I'll be tagging in Croconaw for that fight instead - Espeon takes two Digs to defeat and Confusion does too much damage to Machop for it to be worthwhile (remember, I want to skip that Pokemon Center).

I note that in an actual run, Morty would be too deep into the run to attempt any crazy tricks. So if no reliable options work, I may as well restart here.

Looking quickly at stats, I note that Whitney's Miltank actually has lower base Special Defense than base Defense. Which would make Kadabra a little more appealing.

Edit: And as far as Kadabra being the Pokemon of choice, there's a lot fewer enemies that concern me, but I'm wondering how I'm going to be handling Team Rocket's leaders (who like to use Dark-type Pokemon).

We officially have a problem.

I've completely forgotten to reckon with Dream Eater.  Greg's Drowzee and Morty's Gengar both have it, and the latter case is more devastating because Croconaw can't save Machop (or Machoke) at that point.  (Note that Machoke is outdistanced by pretty much anything within 10 levels, so it couldn't get a move off before being put to sleep.)  I'm going to be trying a few more things to get around that, but if I can't get past that, I'm going to be forced to restart and try the Kadabra route.  (I thought about the Gyarados idea for a moment, but decided way too much time would be lost raising it, and you'd have to wait until Ecruteak at best to have a decent Pokemon.)

Note that I tried to face Morty without using any stat-boosting items.  Maybe an X Speed or two could be put to use here, so I can dig out of the way before Gengar can stop me.  If I can get by the Gengar, the gym will have been a breeze, as the worst move anything else has is Night Shade (some of Morty's other ghosts have this), and I can survive those easily with a few healing items.

Note also that I'm not going to be able to get away with using Dig on the Kimono Girls' Espeon.  I'll be tagging in Croconaw for that fight instead - Espeon takes two Digs to defeat and Confusion does too much damage to Machop for it to be worthwhile (remember, I want to skip that Pokemon Center).

I note that in an actual run, Morty would be too deep into the run to attempt any crazy tricks.  So if no reliable options work, I may as well restart here.

Looking quickly at stats, I note that Whitney's Miltank actually has lower base Special Defense than base Defense.  Which would make Kadabra a little more appealing.

Edit: And as far as Kadabra being the Pokemon of choice, there's a lot fewer enemies that concern me, but I'm wondering how I'm going to be handling Team Rocket's leaders (who like to use Dark-type Pokemon).

FractalFusion

2007-01-20 12:32:48 am

Quote:

Hmmmm.....

This might very well help, but what I meant to ask was the Happiness level that would cause the TM giver to actually give you the Return TM, rather than how Happiness affects the move Return.

Minimum happiness for Return: 150
Maximum happiness for Frustration: 49

Thanks to Visual Boy Advance.

P.S. My other post before was in response to Yoshi348's post, not yours.

AquaTiger

Edit history:

AquaTiger: 2007-01-20 01:25:59 am

2007-01-20 01:13:38 am

Never give up!

Okay, it turns out that Machoke is incapable of disposing of Gengar with a single Dig. At least if his Attack isn't powered up.

Also, it turns out that Poliwrath is going to be another problem for this run. He's faster than Machoke (even when the latter is five levels higher), and is able to inflict two status conditions (sleep, confusion) which will cause excessive problems for the time that will occur.

Judging from what I have so far and from what is to come, I have concluded that going with Machoke will be more trouble than it's worth. Thus, I am going to abandon using Machoke, start over, and try another plan with Kadabra.

(And when going with Kadabra, I plan on using only special moves. No Dig, no Return, nothing like that. Unless Ghost counts as a physical type, because I may use Shadow Ball at one point late in the run.)

Note that if Kadabra fails to work, my absolute last-ditch effort will be Feraligatr. If it comes to that, I plan on fishing up a Krabby right before Goldenrod to cover for the HMs I would otherwise teach to my starter (specifically Cut and Strength - maybe even Whirlpool - although in Silver, Cut would have to be taught to the starter first; I'll just make the starter forget the move in Blackthorn City. If anyone has better ideas feel free to speak up - just note that I can't go with Sandshrew because they're only readily accessible in Gold).

Okay, it turns out that Machoke is incapable of disposing of Gengar with a single Dig.  At least if his Attack isn't powered up.

Also, it turns out that Poliwrath is going to be another problem for this run.  He's faster than Machoke (even when the latter is five levels higher), and is able to inflict two status conditions (sleep, confusion) which will cause excessive problems for the time that will occur.

Judging from what I have so far and from what is to come, I have concluded that going with Machoke will be more trouble than it's worth.  Thus, I am going to abandon using Machoke, start over, and try another plan with Kadabra.

(And when going with Kadabra, I plan on using only special moves.  No Dig, no Return, nothing like that.  Unless Ghost counts as a physical type, because I may use Shadow Ball at one point late in the run.)

Note that if Kadabra fails to work, my absolute last-ditch effort will be Feraligatr.  If it comes to that, I plan on fishing up a Krabby right before Goldenrod to cover for the HMs I would otherwise teach to my starter (specifically Cut and Strength - maybe even Whirlpool - although in Silver, Cut would have to be taught to the starter first; I'll just make the starter forget the move in Blackthorn City.  If anyone has better ideas feel free to speak up - just note that I can't go with Sandshrew because they're only readily accessible in Gold).

petrie911

2007-01-20 01:28:51 am

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

Although it won't be important with Kadabra, Return and frustration are nearly continuous in their power level. you need 200 happiness for Return to have 80 power, and 55 happiness for Frustration to have 80 power. Each gains 2/5 of a point in power for each point of happiness in its direction. So when you get your pokemon with happiness 70, Frustration has 74 power, and return has 28.

In exact terms

Return power= Happiness*2/5
Frustration power= 102-happiness*2/5

DTaeKim

2007-01-20 02:34:34 am

Shadow Ball, as a Ghost-type attack, relies on the ATK stat. You're better off avoiding it.

AquaTiger

Edit history:

AquaTiger: 2007-01-20 02:57:11 am

2007-01-20 02:55:47 am

Never give up!

The only reason I even MENTIONED Shadow Ball is because I'm looking for a good way to take out Sabrina without resorting to catching another Pokemon. (Although if I do have to capture another Pokemon to handle that task well, I'm ready.)

Kadabra's Special Attack may be quite high, but so are the Special Defenses of Sabrina's three Pokemon (Alakazam, the highest-levelled of the three, actually has the WEAKEST Special Defense of the three, I believe, and it's still higher than 80).

I know it sounds like I'm dreading farther ahead than I need to, but I think this is better than stumbling through a larger number of strategies.

Yoshi348

2007-01-20 04:58:30 am

dinosaur from the past

Yeah, Shadow Ball may be worth considering if your opponent's Def to Sp.Def imbalance is greater than your Kadabra's Attack to Sp.Attack imbalance.

AquaTiger

Edit history:

AquaTiger: 2007-01-21 04:31:26 pm

2007-01-21 04:30:04 pm

Never give up!

I looked at the base statistics, and giving Kadabra Shadow Ball will NOT be worth it.

Kadabra has lower Attack than any of Sabrina's trio has Defense. In total, this means there's probably not all that many ways I can deal with Sabrina (not taking into account any 'stat-up' strategies).

If I find that that battle is as tough as I'm thinking, I think what I'm going to do is this. After getting the eighth badge in Johto, I'm going to get the Master Ball from Prof. Elm, head back to Blackthorn City, go into that end of the Dark Cave, and catch a Wobbuffet (here's hoping one can be caught at a higher level than, say, level 25). Sure, he takes loads of damage from everything, but as long as he doesn't faint, he can return it for double damage (sure gives a whole new meaning to the infamous Team Rocket quote). Would come in handy against some Elite Four members (*coughKarencough*) and Red's Snorlax too.

petrie911

2007-01-21 11:02:27 pm

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

Shadow Ball will actually be useful, as it will do more damage to Sabrina's pokemon than either an elemental punch or Psychic. Your attack may be lower than everything's defense, but Shadow Ball is a SE, which makes quite a difference.

Yoshi348

Edit history:

Yoshi348: 2007-01-22 12:27:50 am

2007-01-22 12:27:38 am

dinosaur from the past

What (base) power would be the attack you would use instead of Shadow Ball?

Amazing Ampharos

Edit history:

Amazing Ampharos: 2007-01-22 04:52:00 am

2007-01-22 04:51:48 am

An elemental punch is base 75. Shadow Ball is base 80X2=160. If he went with Psychic, that would be base 90X1.5X.5=67.5 which is worse than an elemental punch.

Jacob91

Edit history:

Jacob91: 2007-01-22 07:46:08 am

2007-01-22 07:43:13 am

idk about the legitimacy of this or if it has already been said, but cant you catch an abra on route 34, teach it elemental punches from goldenrod, maybe make a segment to evolve it by trading and then just dominate?

EDIT: Wow after reading the page I notice you were talking about kadabra!

damn thats a cool coincidence.

I swear I didnt know.

Yoshi348

2007-01-22 08:23:14 pm

dinosaur from the past

Quote:

An elemental punch is base 75. Shadow Ball is base 80X2=160. If he went with Psychic, that would be base 90X1.5X.5=67.5 which is worse than an elemental punch.

Ah okay then... so the Shadow Ball would be more powerful than the punch if 160*Atk/Def > 75*S.Atk/S.Def , or simplifying to 32*A/D > 15*SA/SD... so rule of thumb is that Shadow Ball should be unless SA*D > a little more than 2*A*SD.

Okay so maybe this doesn't help at all, but god dangit, I like math!

DTaeKim

2007-01-22 10:15:57 pm

If you're intent on using Shadow Ball, you might want to see if an X-Attack or two makes a difference there.

AquaTiger

Edit history:

AquaTiger: 2007-01-22 11:52:41 pm

2007-01-22 11:49:31 pm

Never give up!

In all honesty, Forgotten One, I'm probably going to have to resort to an X-Attack or two to deal any reasonable damage (that's how much I'm concerned about Kadabra's physical attack stat).

Since with weaknesses the move Shadow Ball suddenly has more base power than Hyper Beam, I'm probably sold on the idea. Note, however, that I'm going to probably wait until right outside Sabrina's gym to teach it to Kadabra, unless I can find uses for that move before then.

Anyway, the only remaining Pokemon that concerns me when using Kadabra for a whole run is Houndoom. For what I know right now, there's only a few moves Kadabra can learn that really do anything feasible to him. I count four moves, and I won't be able to reach one of them before I'm done fighting Houndoom enemies. The four are Dynamicpunch (single-super-effective, and despite accuracy and Kadabra's attack issues, it may be my best bet), Thunderpunch (a move I'm more reserving for another Dark-type, Murkrow), Dig (single-super-effective, but requires quite a detour and takes a longer time to use), and Zap Cannon (the aforementioned unreachable move). The physical-type moves may actually work well, though, because Houndoom has less base physical defense than another problematic Pokemon, Espeon. Consider that Dynamicpunch suddenly becomes a 200-base-power attack against Dark enemies (I'm curious, would it be a 400-base-power attack against a Pokemon like Tyranitar, who I believe is double-weak to Fighting?). I think the accuracy issue is pretty easy to deal with, frankly.

In all honesty, Forgotten One, I'm probably going to have to resort to an X-Attack or two to deal any reasonable damage (that's how much I'm concerned about Kadabra's physical attack stat).

Since with weaknesses the move Shadow Ball suddenly has more base power than Hyper Beam, I'm probably sold on the idea.  Note, however, that I'm going to probably wait until right outside Sabrina's gym to teach it to Kadabra, unless I can find uses for that move before then.

Anyway, the only remaining Pokemon that concerns me when using Kadabra for a whole run is Houndoom.  For what I know right now, there's only a few moves Kadabra can learn that really do anything feasible to him.  I count four moves, and I won't be able to reach one of them before I'm done fighting Houndoom enemies.  The four are Dynamicpunch (single-super-effective, and despite accuracy and Kadabra's attack issues, it may be my best bet), Thunderpunch (a move I'm more reserving for another Dark-type, Murkrow), Dig (single-super-effective, but requires quite a detour and takes a longer time to use), and Zap Cannon (the aforementioned unreachable move).  The physical-type moves may actually work well, though, because Houndoom has less base physical defense than another problematic Pokemon, Espeon.  Consider that Dynamicpunch suddenly becomes a 200-base-power attack against Dark enemies (I'm curious, would it be a 400-base-power attack against a Pokemon like Tyranitar, who I believe is double-weak to Fighting?).  I think the accuracy issue is pretty easy to deal with, frankly.

yoshmaster5

2007-01-23 03:02:40 am

Also tenkiforecast

*base stats are off Serebii.net FR/LG pokedex*
YES. Kadabra's Attack stat is... er... ****.
LG/FR it's base attack is 35. that's... pathetic.

Dynamic Punch with an X-Accuracy can be deadly against dark types, but there's also defense stats to be taken into consideration as well. Tyranitar has a base defense of 110, which is above average. That means even for taht, X-attacks may need to be used, and if the tyrant lizard attacks then... Kadabra's screwed.

Houndoom, however, would probably fall to one hit, with a Base defense of 50.

Possibly, for Sabrina, a different poke should be used if it's this horrible trying to get this to work...

petrie911

2007-01-23 04:54:15 am

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

I calculated it all out, and Shadow Ball is the most powerful move against all of Sabrina's pokemon. 35 base attack may be pathetic, but Psychics resist Kadabra's most powerful move Psychic and the elemental punches are weak.

As for Houndooms...Dynamic Punch may not be the best idea, although it depends on how many crunches Kadabra can take, as you may miss quite a few times. Still, there aren't many other options besides Tpunch (Dig is almost definitely out).

mike89

Edit history:

mike89: 2007-01-23 08:12:33 am

2007-01-23 08:11:42 am

SEGA Junkie

It's only a small detour to the Ho-Oh at L40 if you want it... Since you can pick it up any time after ~~the Radio Tower incident,~~ Clair realistically, since you'd need the Master Ball, it can be used in the Elite Four and against Sabrina/any other trainer with difficult pokemon. And since Blue and Red have such powerful Pokemon, you might want the two to play with.