Okami (PS2)

groobo

Edit history:

groobo: 2012-11-05 04:01:28 am

2012-11-05 04:00:59 am

boss

Nice find.

Collision detection ftw. The room with the hanging flask is miles away from where you slashed but it's somewhere in the general direction you were facing, and it is loaded in the same level (you can drop into that room with the kt glitch). Now I'm pretty sure you can slash the flask from right where you enter the gardens (unless it worked because the nut was in the way, as in the game only checks whether the target isn't blocked by anything, then doesn't check again and just slashes everything else in that direction if it isn't -- I dunno, but it makes sense).

I haven't expected slash to work through walls. Makes me wonder what other skills we could use like this.

BlueGlass

2012-11-05 04:32:21 pm

Yep yep yep!

Awesome find. If it really is possible from anywhere with a proper angle, that would be a potentially massive timesaver (grab the key to prevent getting stuck on the wrong side of the locked door, then slash the rope). As far as other techniques, I know the elemental ones require actually being in the same room as the source, bloom checks your location (for the guardian saplings at least), CBs are based on the camera position, galestorm affects your surroundings... Trying to think of other situations where a PS activates a cutscene that moves Ammy, the poison-spewing pots in Tsuta don't exist until you clear the demon gates and get in range, the eyeballs in Moon Cave and Oni Island have various distance and other triggers...

Even still, if it doesn't work beyond what's in the video, that's still a good 20-30 seconds saved between loading, CBs, and travel time.

groobo

2012-11-05 05:52:23 pm

boss

You can't unlock gates from the rear. That's a dead end without the kt glitch, unless you unlock the gate before using this trick, which makes it not so awesome anymore :(.

I'm not entirely sure you actually have to be in the same room with a target to successfully use any of the elemental techniques -- think water dragon. Also IIRC the guardian saplings each have triggers you have to hit first before you can bloom them. Didn't test if you then can actually move away and bloom them from a distance but it's a thought.

BlueGlass

2012-11-05 10:19:05 pm

Yep yep yep!

Okay, still saves 20-30 seconds (rough guestimate). My conclusion on the elementals was based mostly on experimentation I've done in Moon Cave with Waterspout and Inferno, so it might not hold completely true. Just based on their nature, I doubt they could hit distant targets, but if it is possible, might it be usable in Oni Island (thinking of all the things that need to be thunderbolted there)? Actually testing this kind of stuff in any practical manner would need to be done on emulator, so I'll have to leave that up to you and others.

With the Guardian Saplings, I know Shinshu won't bloom from certain angles/distances, even when it's clearly visible, same with Taka, in addition to having to beat Waka 2 for the latter.

rocmox

2012-11-10 09:21:24 am

I was able to unlock the door in water dragon from the rear. I used the water through the door and the cutscene put me behind it, and then I did the fight and opened it up.

BlueGlass

2012-11-10 02:32:39 pm

Yep yep yep!

That sounds like another few second timesaver. Nice find.

groobo

2012-11-11 07:13:15 am

boss

How did you open the gate without the key? AFAIK you actually have to open it up beforehand so that it doesn't end up being a dead end.

BlueGlass

2012-11-11 06:49:36 pm

Yep yep yep!

From the sound of it, he had the key with him. If I'm wrong and this lets you skip the key entirely, all the better, as the Water Dragon key has always been an annoying detour.

I would like to play around with this a bit myself, but I'm trying to stay focused on Ecco for AGDQ right now.

groobo

Edit history:

groobo: 2012-11-12 07:18:54 am

2012-11-12 07:17:46 am

boss

So it's the old method? I hope I'm wrong here and rocmox found a way to do it without the key.

rocmox

Edit history:

rocmox: 2012-11-14 02:15:08 pm

2012-11-14 02:13:47 pm

I just had the key on me and used the water through the door and then got teleported inside and then used it from the other side. I was just responding to groobo saying you can't unlock gates from behind. Though if someone could find an oob in the room you could skip getting the key probably with a couple kt's.

groobo

2012-11-15 04:49:28 am

boss

Oh, sorry. BlueGlass' post under yours confused me a bit.

kwanzai

2012-11-19 03:52:46 pm

I just finished my first single segment NG+ run on Okami HD using all info in this topic.

http://www.twitch.tv/kwanzai/b/341405933

There's too many mistakes to even ask for critiques, but I figured I should post the video here as a starting point to at least make sure my route / strats are up to date. I used way more KTs than are necessary for most of the skips, since I am very bad at aiming wall jumps. I should be attempting more runs (hopefully much better ones) soon.

BlueGlass

2012-11-20 09:08:11 am

Yep yep yep!

Since I'm awake super-early with nothing to do, I'll give this a watch and comment as I go. Greaat to see soneone actively working on this game again.

In the tutorial cave, you can walljump+airdash to climb the wall from the front, noticeably faster.

general movement: you want to be running straight forward as much as possible, changing direction using the camera, as it gets you to top speed faster. And for the stardust river, just draw one straight, thick line, then jump in.

For the second room of the tutorial cave, you can jump over a part of the water just before the stairs. It's a fairly hard jump, but saves a couple seconds on the way in and out both.

You'll want to make a small jump just as you reach the top of most staircases to cut out that little "bump" at the top.

After getting power slash, you can start running straight away, without having to wait for the camera to swing around. You need to rotate the stick along with the camera's movement to keep Ammy headed for the door, and the bars should come into view just in time to PS them and keep on running.

And another general comment while I'm thinking about it, there's a glitch where sometimes during a dash, Ammy will never get up to full speed, and the only way to fix this is to restart the dash. The above-mentioned method of running straight and using the camera for turning usually prevents this, but I still get it occasionally, usually at the mot annoying times.

On the way out of the cave, go down the left side of the stairs so you can make the aforementioned jump.

No need to go as far to the side as you did to skip the fight triger near the end of the room, and another note on movement: before reaching full speed, avoid anything that would make you jump or sharply change direction when possible.

You can PS the fruit immediately, without moving. Bring up the brush, and PS in the very upper-left corner of the screen.

With the turnip-digging, blotting the lady delays her considerably longer than a PS. If done well (blot her just before she gets close enough to go for a smack, and dig quickly), you can get through it with a blot every other turnip IIRC. Also, route it so you finish with the one closest to Mushi and Hayabusa.

Someone else, most likely groobo or paraxade, will have to advise on the KT glitching, since I have no personal experience with it.

Another general bit pf advice, don't jump before cutscenes, since (as you saw) the game often kills Ammy's momentum, and the thing doesn't trigger until she's on the ground. Also, why do I speedrun games where pushing objects around is one of the hardest things in the game?

No need for such a big circle when Blooming. IIRC the target area is just above the center of the tree.

I can't say for sure since I'm coming from the origin mirror rather than the GS, but going up the right side of Shinshu should be faster.

Issun is very picky about his straight lines, isn't he =)

One more general comment, during the post-battle, attacking brings Ammy up to running speed, and you can usually build up to a full dash straight after the fight ends. Orienting yourself properly is another matter entirely.

Something I'm noticing is that you're a bit slow on skipping cutscenes/speeding up text sometimes. This is just memorization of what needs to be done where.

I know there's a faster way to hit the trigger for the Agata mermaid spring that groobo used in one of his really old NG+ runs, but I can't remember it? Groobo, any idea?

For the digging game, turn Mr. Bamboo around straight away. It's faster to fall off the left side of the water. Also, have him Bloomed at the end.

When you get around to recording serious attempts, please, please, please turn off notifications

Whoah, I did not know you could skip the one pond in Ryoshima. Neat.

Just curious, did you attempt to skip the mushroom cutscene in Tsuta?

When going up Kusa to Gale Shrine, a Vine+PS can cut out some running time.

Yeah, I think KTing up the elevator shaft should be reserved for segmented.

Oh yeah, something I didn't mention earlier: when you bought the mermaid coins, you should've just pressed up once for 11.

When spinning the galaxy, it doesn't matter what kind of galestorm you use, so you should just do the curly-cue since it's fastest to draw.

No need to actually be on the dock when you use Sunrise.

Wow, Dragon Palace looks even more beautiful in HD. And I see that in return for drastically shortened loading times, the time it takes to save is significantly longer.

You only started speedrunning a few days ago? Wow, that makes this really, really impressive.

Wait until you're actually on the waterspout before activating it, that way you both rise faster and can jump off once it reaches the right height.

I hate the water dragon escape. Not only are the jumps fairly hard, but the acid falls randomly and can hit you in midair. In future, you might want to be prepared to use a KT glitch to recover, as even if you miss 2-3 times, that's still faster than falling down and having to ride the waterspout back up.

I like your method of Cherry Bombing the wrong side of the wall on Oni. Also, how did you magically get the lightning key back? I've never even heard of that before.

After Oni, the Ryoshima Coast warp is actually closer than N. Ryoshima, pretty sure. I could be misremembering, but I don't think so.

Umm, what happened at 2:01:17?

Wow, I never even thought of using the flower to skip the igloo fight. Was that mentioned somewhere in the topic and I just forgot about it, or did you come up with it yourself? If so, nice find.

For Orochi phase 1, when one head is doing its attack, you can move to another head so it starts as soon as the other finishes. We're pretty sure the fastest order is fire-darkness-fire-darkness-wind-wind, though I do remember experimenting a bit with fire-darkness-wind-darkness-fire-wind. The bell can also be destroyed with ex-slips the moment Orochi goes down.

Oh yeah, a general tip for the AoY refights. You don't want to be standing right on the spot the teleporter appears, just near it. If you're standing on it, you have to move off then back on to get it to activate.

When you're regaining powers from Yami, it's actually slightly faster to speed through the text than to skip the scene, oddly enough.

And yay for end credits! Even if they don't have the song. Epilogue too! Ahh, how I've missed you.

Anyway, as I said earlier, considering that this is your first speedrun, and with only a few days of practice at that, it was really pretty amazing. There's a lot to do and remember, the game isn't exactly short, and some of the stuff is pretty hard to pull off. I'm sory if it's a bit overwhelming throwing all this at you at once like this; I'm just really excited to see someone else showing interest in this game. I hope I was helpful, and best of luck on the run!

Wow, it took about four hours to do this. Now I need to eat breakfast.

Since I'm awake super-early with nothing to do, I'll give this a watch and comment as I go.  Greaat to see soneone actively working on this game again.

In the tutorial cave, you can walljump+airdash to climb the wall from the front, noticeably faster.

general movement: you want to be running straight forward as much as possible, changing direction using the camera, as it gets you to top speed faster.  And for the stardust river, just draw one straight, thick line, then [i]jump[/i] in.

For the second room of the tutorial cave, you can jump over a part of the water just before the stairs.  It's a fairly hard jump, but saves a couple seconds on the way in and out both.

You'll want to make a small jump just as you reach the top of most staircases to cut out that little "bump" at the top.

After getting power slash, you can start running straight away, without having to wait for the camera to swing around.  You need to rotate the stick along with the camera's movement to keep Ammy headed for the door, and the bars should come into view just in time to PS them and keep on running.

And another general comment while I'm thinking about it, there's a glitch where sometimes during a dash, Ammy will never get up to full speed, and the only way to fix this is to restart the dash.  The above-mentioned method of running straight and using the camera for turning usually prevents this, but I still get it occasionally, usually at the mot annoying times.

On the way out of the cave, go down the left side of the stairs so you can make the aforementioned jump.

No need to go as far to the side as you did to skip the fight triger near the end of the room, and another note on movement: before reaching full speed, avoid anything that would make you jump or sharply change direction when possible.

You can PS the fruit immediately, without moving.  Bring up the brush, and PS in the very upper-left corner of the screen.

With the turnip-digging, blotting the lady delays her considerably longer than a PS.  If done well (blot her just before she gets close enough to go for a smack, and dig quickly), you can get through it with a blot every other turnip IIRC.  Also, route it so you finish with the one closest to Mushi and Hayabusa.

Someone else, most likely groobo or paraxade, will have to advise on the KT glitching, since I have no personal experience with it.

Another general bit pf advice, don't jump before cutscenes, since (as you saw) the game often kills Ammy's momentum, and the thing doesn't trigger until she's on the ground.  Also, why do I speedrun games where pushing objects around is one of the hardest things in the game?

No need for such a big circle when Blooming.  IIRC the target area is just above the center of the tree.

I can't say for sure since I'm coming from the origin mirror rather than the GS, but going up the right side of Shinshu should be faster.

Issun is very picky about his straight lines, isn't he =)

One more general comment, during the post-battle, attacking brings Ammy up to running speed, and you can usually build up to a full dash straight after the fight ends.  Orienting yourself properly is another matter entirely.

Something I'm noticing is that you're a bit slow on skipping cutscenes/speeding up text sometimes.  This is just memorization of what needs to be done where.

I [i]know[/i] there's a faster way to hit the trigger for the Agata mermaid spring that groobo used in one of his really old NG+ runs, but I can't remember it?  Groobo, any idea?

For the digging game, turn Mr. Bamboo around straight away.  It's faster to fall off the left side of the water.  Also, have him Bloomed at the end.

When you get around to recording serious attempts, please, please, [i]please[/i] turn off notifications

Whoah, I did not know you could skip the one pond in Ryoshima.  Neat.

Just curious, did you attempt to skip the mushroom cutscene in Tsuta?

When going up Kusa to Gale Shrine, a Vine+PS can cut out some running time.

Yeah, I think KTing up the elevator shaft should be reserved for segmented.

Oh yeah, something I didn't mention earlier: when you bought the mermaid coins, you should've just pressed up once for 11.

When spinning the galaxy, it doesn't matter what kind of galestorm you use, so you should just do the curly-cue since it's fastest to draw.

No need to actually be on the dock when you use Sunrise.

Wow, Dragon Palace looks even more beautiful in HD.  And I see that in return for drastically shortened loading times, the time it takes to save is significantly longer.

You only started speedrunning a few days ago?  Wow, that makes this really, really impressive.

Wait until you're actually on the waterspout before activating it, that way you both rise faster and can jump off once it reaches the right height.

I [i]hate[/i] the water dragon escape.  Not only are the jumps fairly hard, but the acid falls randomly and can hit you in midair.  In future, you might want to be prepared to use a KT glitch to recover, as even if you miss 2-3 times, that's still faster than falling down and having to ride the waterspout back up.

I like your method of Cherry Bombing the wrong side of the wall on Oni.  Also, how did you magically get the lightning key back?  I've never even heard of that before.

After Oni, the Ryoshima Coast warp is actually closer than N. Ryoshima, pretty sure.  I could be misremembering, but I don't think so.

Umm, what happened at 2:01:17?

Wow, I never even thought of using the flower to skip the igloo fight.  Was that mentioned somewhere in the topic and I just forgot about it, or did you come up with it yourself?  If so, nice find.

For Orochi phase 1, when one head is doing its attack, you can move to another head so it starts as soon as the other finishes.  We're pretty sure the fastest order is fire-darkness-fire-darkness-wind-wind, though I do remember experimenting a bit with fire-darkness-wind-darkness-fire-wind.  The bell can also be destroyed with ex-slips the moment Orochi goes down.

Oh yeah, a general tip for the AoY refights.  You don't want to be standing right on the spot the teleporter appears, just near it.  If you're standing on it, you have to move off then back on to get it to activate.

When you're regaining powers from Yami, it's actually slightly faster to speed through the text than to skip the scene, oddly enough.

And yay for end credits!  Even if they don't have the song.  Epilogue too!  Ahh, how I've missed you.

Anyway, as I said earlier, considering that this is your first speedrun, and with only a few days of practice at that, it was really pretty amazing.  There's a lot to do and remember, the game isn't exactly short, and some of the stuff is pretty hard to pull off.  I'm sory if it's a bit overwhelming throwing all this at you at once like this; I'm just really excited to see someone else showing interest in this game.  I hope I was helpful, and best of luck on the run!

Wow, it took about four hours to do this.  Now I need to eat breakfast.

kwanzai

2012-11-20 12:20:33 pm

Wow! This is an amazing amount of useful information, thank you so much. Sorry you had to sit through such a brutally sloppy run :). I'm going to start practicing these things today.

Quote:

When you get around to recording serious attempts, please, please, please turn off notifications

Ah, yes, sorry about that. Been meaning to turn those off for awhile.

Quote:

Just curious, did you attempt to skip the mushroom cutscene in Tsuta?

I did not know I could skip that one.

Quote:

Oh yeah, something I didn't mention earlier: when you bought the mermaid coins, you should've just pressed up once for 11.

Did not even think of that lol. But now that I think about it, IIRC meat and slips are before coins in the menu so maybe starting the game with them is faster? Also, shouldn't affect KT times, if I used diagonal inputs like a smart person.

Quote:

And I see that in return for drastically shortened loading times, the time it takes to save is significantly longer.

Indeed. I wouldn't have saved at all, but I'm very bad at the Water Dragon skip and sometimes fall into the ocean floor. The second save in Kamui is because a missed igloo skip would end the run, and I getting that vine flower to open up can be weird. (Just to be sure. There is no way to kill the igloo w/o fire, correct?)

Quote:

Also, how did you magically get the lightning key back?

I have no idea. thumbsup

Perhaps if you open the door before the lightning key despawns. I'll test this.

Quote:

Umm, what happened at 2:01:17?

My capture card was falling way behind the actual game (more than a few minutes) and I had to refresh it. During that blackness I fought the first kamui fight and Oki. I am still not sure how to skip that first fight, and I am still not confident in skipping Oki until I get the igloo skip down better.

Quote:

Wow, I never even thought of using the flower to skip the igloo fight. Was that mentioned somewhere in the topic and I just forgot about it, or did you come up with it yourself?

I just assumed that's how it was done from reading this forum, but whenever I tried it from the areas suggested by Parax / groobo, the fight would trigger mid air. Only solution I could find was to get close enough to make it open up, then grab it from the other side of the sapling like that.

Quote:

Wow, it took about four hours to do this. Now I need to eat breakfast.

Can't thank you enough for your time. It's tough to put all the pieces of the run together throughout the forums. Having all this info in one place is amazing.

Wow! This is an amazing amount of useful information, thank you so much.  Sorry you had to sit through such a brutally sloppy run :).  I'm going to start practicing these things today.

[quote]When you get around to recording serious attempts, please, please, please turn off notifications[/quote]
Ah, yes, sorry about that.  Been meaning to turn those off for awhile.

[quote]Just curious, did you attempt to skip the mushroom cutscene in Tsuta?[/quote]
I did not know I could skip that one.

[quote]Oh yeah, something I didn't mention earlier: when you bought the mermaid coins, you should've just pressed up once for 11.[/quote]
Did not even think of that lol.  But now that I think about it, IIRC meat and slips are before coins in the menu so maybe starting the game with them is faster?  Also, shouldn't affect KT times, if I used diagonal inputs like a smart person.

[quote]And I see that in return for drastically shortened loading times, the time it takes to save is significantly longer.[/quote]
Indeed.  I wouldn't have saved at all, but I'm very bad at the Water Dragon skip and sometimes fall into the ocean floor.  The second save in Kamui is because a missed igloo skip would end the run, and I getting that vine flower to open up can be weird. (Just to be sure. There is no way to kill the igloo w/o fire, correct?)

[quote]Also, how did you magically get the lightning key back?[/quote]
I have no idea. :thumbsup:  Perhaps if you open the door before the lightning key despawns.  I'll test this.

[quote]Umm, what happened at 2:01:17?[/quote]
My capture card was falling way behind the actual game (more than a few minutes) and I had to refresh it.  During that blackness I fought the first kamui fight and Oki.  I am still not sure how to skip that first fight, and I am still not confident in skipping Oki until I get the igloo skip down better.

[quote]Wow, I never even thought of using the flower to skip the igloo fight.  Was that mentioned somewhere in the topic and I just forgot about it, or did you come up with it yourself?[/quote]
I just assumed that's how it was done from reading this forum, but whenever I tried it from the areas suggested by Parax / groobo, the fight would trigger mid air.  Only solution I could find was to get close enough to make it open up, then grab it from the other side of the sapling like that.

[quote]Wow, it took about four hours to do this.  Now I need to eat breakfast.[/quote]
Can't thank you enough for your time.  It's tough to put all the pieces of the run together throughout the forums.  Having all this info in one place is amazing.

BlueGlass

2012-11-20 05:33:16 pm

Yep yep yep!

Quote from kwanzai:

Quote:

Just curious, did you attempt to skip the mushroom cutscene in Tsuta?

I did not know I could skip that one.

There's a very tiny window (probably only a frame or two) between the bit of using Sunrise to the mushrooms sprouting where you can skip the scene. Basically, it's one of those things where you just mash the button and pray. Missing it in an SS isn't a big deal at all, but you should at least make the attempt, since it cuts out about 15 seconds if you get lucky.

Quote from kwanzai:

Quote:

Oh yeah, something I didn't mention earlier: when you bought the mermaid coins, you should've just pressed up once for 11.

Did not even think of that lol. But now that I think about it, IIRC meat and slips are before coins in the menu so maybe starting the game with them is faster? Also, shouldn't affect KT times, if I used diagonal inputs like a smart person.

Can you actually start with mermaid coins in NG+, or are they one of the removed items? I seem to remember them being removed, but it's been ages since I've done NG+, so I could be wrong. If they are missing, you should buy the meat bags along with them so you can just mash x to use ex-slips before you get around to feeding the dogs.

Quote from kwanzai:

(Just to be sure. There is no way to kill the igloo w/o fire, correct?)

Yeah, you need to light it on fire before you can damage it.

Quote from kwanzai:

Can't thank you enough for your time. It's tough to put all the pieces of the run together throughout the forums. Having all this info in one place is amazing.

Again, it's awesome to see someone working on this, and I wish you luck. If you have questions or anything, I'll do my best to help, but I doubt I'll be making another huge post like that one =)

[quote="kwanzai"][quote]Just curious, did you attempt to skip the mushroom cutscene in Tsuta?[/quote]
I did not know I could skip that one.[/quote]There's a very tiny window (probably only a frame or two) between the bit of using Sunrise to the mushrooms sprouting where you can skip the scene.  Basically, it's one of those things where you just mash the button and pray.  Missing it in an SS isn't a big deal at all, but you should at least make the attempt, since it cuts out about 15 seconds if you get lucky.

[quote=kwanzai][quote]Oh yeah, something I didn't mention earlier: when you bought the mermaid coins, you should've just pressed up once for 11.[/quote]
Did not even think of that lol.  But now that I think about it, IIRC meat and slips are before coins in the menu so maybe starting the game with them is faster?  Also, shouldn't affect KT times, if I used diagonal inputs like a smart person.[/quote]Can you actually start with mermaid coins in NG+, or are they one of the removed items?  I seem to remember them being removed, but it's been ages since I've done NG+, so I could be wrong.  If they are missing, you should buy the meat bags along with them so you can just mash x to use ex-slips before you get around to feeding the dogs.

[quote=kwanzai](Just to be sure. There is no way to kill the igloo w/o fire, correct?)[/quote]Yeah, you need to light it on fire before you can damage it.

[quote=kwanzai]Can't thank you enough for your time.  It's tough to put all the pieces of the run together throughout the forums.  Having all this info in one place is amazing.[/quote]
Again, it's awesome to see someone working on this, and I wish you luck.  If you have questions or anything, I'll do my best to help, but I doubt I'll be making another huge post like that one =)

Paraxade

Edit history:

Paraxade: 2012-11-21 10:54:13 am

Paraxade: 2012-11-21 10:53:57 am

Paraxade: 2012-11-21 10:52:50 am

2012-11-21 10:52:16 am

I would just link you to one of my runs but apparently there are none saved on Twitch. :/ Anyway, I haven't watched it yet because I haven't felt like sitting down for a couple hours so far tbh, but:

Quote from kwanzai:

Quote:

Oh yeah, something I didn't mention earlier: when you bought the mermaid coins, you should've just pressed up once for 11.

Did not even think of that lol. But now that I think about it, IIRC meat and slips are before coins in the menu so maybe starting the game with them is faster? Also, shouldn't affect KT times, if I used diagonal inputs like a smart person.

Yeah, I start with five meat bags.

Quote:

And I see that in return for drastically shortened loading times, the time it takes to save is significantly longer.

Indeed. I wouldn't have saved at all, but I'm very bad at the Water Dragon skip and sometimes fall into the ocean floor. The second save in Kamui is because a missed igloo skip would end the run, and I getting that vine flower to open up can be weird. (Just to be sure. There is no way to kill the igloo w/o fire, correct?)

heh, I don't even bother doing that water dragon skip; it's too inconsistent for me. But if Okami HD really has more consistent KT glitches then sure, go for it.

Quote:

Also, how did you magically get the lightning key back?

I have no idea. thumbsup

Perhaps if you open the door before the lightning key despawns. I'll test this.

Just go fast and don't waste an excessive amount of time and the lightning key reappears as you're running up the stairs. It's really, really easy.

Quote:

Wow, I never even thought of using the flower to skip the igloo fight. Was that mentioned somewhere in the topic and I just forgot about it, or did you come up with it yourself?

I just assumed that's how it was done from reading this forum, but whenever I tried it from the areas suggested by Parax / groobo, the fight would trigger mid air. Only solution I could find was to get close enough to make it open up, then grab it from the other side of the sapling like that.

My method for the igloo turtle skip is something like, run around to get to full speed, then I run to the left of the rock, barely behind the igloo turtle trigger, jump, then press into the rock on the right. That usually gets the flower to open up. Then I land, go back in front of the rock, jump + double jump and then dash into the wall for a little extra height and grab the flower. It's really weird and kinda tricky but it usually works fairly consistently.

I would just link you to one of my runs but apparently there are none saved on Twitch. :/ Anyway, I haven't watched it yet because I haven't felt like sitting down for a couple hours so far tbh, but:

[quote="kwanzai"][quote]Oh yeah, something I didn't mention earlier: when you bought the mermaid coins, you should've just pressed up once for 11.[/quote]
Did not even think of that lol.  But now that I think about it, IIRC meat and slips are before coins in the menu so maybe starting the game with them is faster?  Also, shouldn't affect KT times, if I used diagonal inputs like a smart person.[/quote]

Yeah, I start with five meat bags.

[quote][quote]And I see that in return for drastically shortened loading times, the time it takes to save is significantly longer.[/quote]
Indeed.  I wouldn't have saved at all, but I'm very bad at the Water Dragon skip and sometimes fall into the ocean floor.  The second save in Kamui is because a missed igloo skip would end the run, and I getting that vine flower to open up can be weird. (Just to be sure. There is no way to kill the igloo w/o fire, correct?)[/quote]

heh, I don't even bother doing that water dragon skip; it's too inconsistent for me. But if Okami HD really has more consistent KT glitches then sure, go for it.

[quote][quote]Also, how did you magically get the lightning key back?[/quote]
I have no idea. :thumbsup:  Perhaps if you open the door before the lightning key despawns.  I'll test this.[/quote]

Just go fast and don't waste an excessive amount of time and the lightning key reappears as you're running up the stairs. It's really, really easy.

[quote][quote]Wow, I never even thought of using the flower to skip the igloo fight.  Was that mentioned somewhere in the topic and I just forgot about it, or did you come up with it yourself?[/quote]
I just assumed that's how it was done from reading this forum, but whenever I tried it from the areas suggested by Parax / groobo, the fight would trigger mid air.  Only solution I could find was to get close enough to make it open up, then grab it from the other side of the sapling like that.[/quote]

My method for the igloo turtle skip is something like, run around to get to full speed, then I run to the left of the rock, barely behind the igloo turtle trigger, jump, then press into the rock on the right. That usually gets the flower to open up. Then I land, go back in front of the rock, jump + double jump and then dash into the wall for a little extra height and grab the flower. It's really weird and kinda tricky but it usually works fairly consistently.

BlueGlass

2012-11-21 11:33:50 am

Yep yep yep!

Quote from Paraxade:

Just go fast and don't waste an excessive amount of time and the lightning key reappears as you're running up the stairs. It's really, really easy.

Awesome to know, as juggling those keys was always extremely annoying.

Paraxade

2012-11-21 12:08:20 pm

Not sure why you'd juggle keys anyway. IIRC even if it doesn't reappear it doesn't really waste much time, only a couple seconds. Tongue

BlueGlass

2012-11-21 02:13:05 pm

Yep yep yep!

Because you need the key for the lightning platforms after that. A NG run can't KT glitch, remember?

kwanzai

Edit history:

kwanzai: 2012-11-21 02:22:08 pm

2012-11-21 02:21:31 pm

Quote from BlueGlass:

You can PS the fruit immediately, without moving. Bring up the brush, and PS in the very upper-left corner of the screen.

I saw an old post by groobo saying this works as well, but I just can't seem to get it. Are you saying as soon as I zone from tutorial to kamiki, hold brush and PS the top left corner before I can even see the fruit? This doesn't seem to work for me.

Quote from Paraxade:

Yeah, I start with five meat bags

Is the fifth meat bag because Tei (orange dog) always steals the food when you try to feed Ko (purple dog) in front the princess' house? This never happened to me when practicing, but now it seems to happen every time. I hope there's a way to consistently avoid it.

Paraxade

Edit history:

Paraxade: 2012-11-21 03:04:18 pm

Paraxade: 2012-11-21 03:04:16 pm

2012-11-21 03:03:16 pm

It happens every time for me. I always just give him the extra meat bag now. The way I think of it, if I start with four meat bags and he steals it, then I've just lost a ton of time because now I have to run back to the beginning of Kusa, buy an extra bag, and take it back. If I start with five meat bags and only feed four, then now I have an extra meat bag in my inventory that I can't offload without wasting time.

Quote from BlueGlass:

Because you need the key for the lightning platforms after that. A NG run can't KT glitch, remember?

No, but I'm pretty sure an NG run can jump. Tongue

It's always been a non-issue for me lately because the key always reappears, so the details are hazy, but I'm sure you don't need the key there, nor do you need to KT glitch.

BlueGlass

2012-11-21 04:48:40 pm

Yep yep yep!

@kwanzai: Yeah, but it has to be the very top-left, as in right at the edge of the screen. If you try several times and still can't get it for whatever reason (maybe there's some minor change in HD tht makes it not work), then IIRC jumping left gets the fruit onscreen a lot faster than running forward then left like you did in the video.

@Parax: I could've sworn there was a point where the key was either necessary or saves time. If not it at least gives something to stand on in case the jump goes wrong. Falling into cursed water is bad.

kwanzai

Edit history:

kwanzai: 2013-01-02 10:39:18 am

2012-12-07 07:21:02 pm

I've gotten my time down to 2:05:53 by implementing the advice given here, still with a bunch of mistakes (including an igloo skip miss causing a load) and pretty terrible KTing for the most part. Although I actually got into the ark pretty quickly and had by far my fastest Orochi yet, which got me some good time.

In case anyone is interested, this one is much less painful to watch Smiley

http://www.twitch.tv/kwanzai/c/1763420

The timer in the video is way off because my capture card was being funky again. The video was lagging pretty far behind.

I can't find any way to activate the Agata mermaid spring w/o just running up there. I've tried swimming around in it while the zone is cursed, but no luck.

I'm not sure if using KTs to bloom Taka is faster than just running around through that cave, but I'm pretty sure it is if I don't completely screw it up.

I always have trouble slashing the poison pots in Tsuta Ruins. I jump towards them from the third mushroom platform. I'm not sure if I'm not high enough or just too far away.

Also, random question, but since I had to load from a save file mid run, is it no longer single segment but still RTA?

Edit: Ignore the above everything, down to 1:54:40.
http://www.twitch.tv/kwanzai/c/1810970

I've gotten my time down to 2:05:53 by implementing the advice given here, still with a bunch of mistakes (including an igloo skip miss causing a load) and pretty terrible KTing for the most part.  Although I actually got into the ark pretty quickly and had by far my fastest Orochi yet, which got me some good time.

In case anyone is interested, this one is much less painful to watch :)
[url]http://www.twitch.tv/kwanzai/c/1763420[/url]

The timer in the video is way off because my capture card was being funky again.  The video was lagging pretty far behind.

I can't find any way to activate the Agata mermaid spring w/o just running up there.  I've tried swimming around in it while the zone is cursed, but no luck.

I'm not sure if using KTs to bloom Taka is faster than just running around through that cave, but I'm pretty sure it is if I don't completely screw it up.

I always have trouble slashing the poison pots in Tsuta Ruins.  I jump towards them from the third mushroom platform.  I'm not sure if I'm not high enough or just too far away.

Also, random question, but since I had to load from a save file mid run, is it no longer single segment but still RTA?

Edit: Ignore the above everything, down to 1:54:40. 
[url]http://www.twitch.tv/kwanzai/c/1810970[/url]

Chokehold

2012-12-07 10:58:05 pm

When in doubt, use explosives.

I'm gonna need to read this topic waaay back after being gone for it for so long. And with buttloads of new things to have a look at.

I was actually considering, as soon as I get the Elgato HD capture device working properly, to do a glitchless NG+ run, in case I haven't mentioned this already. Sorry if so.
Would that even be a considered submission or am I wasting time with that?
This is my first run and I haven't exactly practiced practiced, but I have lazily run through the game and done things sloppily, ending up with an end time of 6:02 something. I'm guesstimating I can bring that down by about an hour, making the total run five hours.

scintilliaSD

2013-01-09 10:41:31 pm

I was actually looking at some information regarding this game with the hopes of speedrunning it, and this thread has been super helpful. Thanks, guys. I might splurge and buy it soon after AGDQ is over. Smiley

Since I'll have to do a full runthrough of the game before I can unlock NG+, is there anything I need to do in the normal runthrough that is absolutely necessary to prepare for the NG+ run? Thanks in advance. The game seems really interesting.