Knytt and Knytt Stories Speedruns

2009-07-31 02:55:03 pm

Hi there.

I found a new game that is called Knytt.

It's a freeware but the quality is there.
The graphic and musical atmosphere is great and the gameplay very... speedrunnable!!
It's 2D platform, with classic enemies and traps.
There are power-ups like in Castlevania (run faster, jump higher/twice).
The original Knytt is NOT interesting (it's only exploration with few enemies and no power-ups).
Knytt Stories on the other side shall be great, especially as soon as you get the double-jump power-up.

I already found two techniques (ex: climbing walls faster by jumping repeatedly against the wall), but no glitches so far.

I think it could make a nice speedrun to watch, as the gameplay is very fast and nice to watch.

Here is a picture:

And the link:

http://nifflas.ni2.se/index.php?main=02Knytt_Stories&sub=03Download

Wink

Thread title:

Attachment:

knytt01.jpg

ExplodingCabbage

2009-07-31 04:49:04 pm

Played the first few levels ages ago, never much liked it, but maybe it gets better.

Note that this is by Nifflas, the creator of the much better-known Within A Deep Forest, which has a pretty darn good speedrun already (by Nifflas, its creator).

Are you planning on doing a run?

AdHoc

2009-08-01 03:17:29 am

I encourage you to play Knytt Stories again... maybe you just played the original Knytt?

I really think it has got potential!

Yes, I'd like to do a run, but I'm a lazy guy and that's why I'd rather do a segmented run than a complete runthrough (I'm too impatient and die too often).

Also, it could be nice if several people ran the game, much like the HL²DQ team, which is pretty impressive and effective.

What do you recon?

AdHoc

2009-08-01 03:20:06 am

About "Within A Deep Forest, why isn't it listed on SDA?

Could Knytt be accepted and be part of the SDA list?

ExplodingCabbage

2009-08-01 04:10:55 am

SDA doesn't take runs of freeware games at present, for many reasons, although it's been a controversial rule for a long time. Enhasa seemed ready to change the rule and have a benevolent dictatorship where SDA admins would decide what freeware games are notable and complete enough for SDA to accept runs of them, but then Enhasa disappeared and we don't know when he's coming back. I don't know for sure what Mike and Nate's view on the matter is - I think I recall Enhasa saying Mike agreed with him, but I may be wrong.

So,

Quote:

Within A Deep Forest, why isn't it listed on SDA?

Two reasons: SDA doesn't take runs of freeware games, and the run has no sound which would make it inadmissible even if it wasn't freeware.

Quote:

Could Knytt be accepted and be part of the SDA list?

Not at present, but by the time someone finishes a run of it, maybe. I'd go so far as to say probably, but there are absolutely no guarantees and naturally I can't speak for the admins.

However, even if it is never accepted, still do the run, you'll get attention from SDA folks just by linking to it on the forum.

SDA doesn't take runs of freeware games at present, for many reasons, although it's been a controversial rule for a long time. Enhasa seemed ready to change the rule and have a benevolent dictatorship where SDA admins would decide what freeware games are notable and complete enough for SDA to accept runs of them, but then Enhasa disappeared and we don't know when he's coming back. I don't know for sure what Mike and Nate's view on the matter is - I think I recall Enhasa saying Mike agreed with him, but I may be wrong.

So,

[quote]Within A Deep Forest, why isn't it listed on SDA?[/quote]

Two reasons: SDA doesn't take runs of freeware games, and the run has no sound which would make it inadmissible even if it wasn't freeware.

[quote]Could Knytt be accepted and be part of the SDA list?[/quote]

Not at present, but by the time someone finishes a run of it, maybe. I'd go so far as to say [i]probably[/i], but there are absolutely no guarantees and naturally I can't speak for the admins.

However, even if it is never accepted, still do the run, you'll get attention from SDA folks just by linking to it on the forum.

AdHoc

2009-08-01 04:36:06 am

Thanks for your very complete answer Wink

I suggest the creation of a "freeware speedruns list", clearly visible on the SDA website but apart of the normal runs. That would be perfect in my opinion.

But it's not my call and I'll try to run the game when I have some time. I hope some other people will be interested in doing it, so we can benchmark each others Smiley

ZenicReverie

2009-08-01 07:54:35 am

Waiting hurts my soul...

http://freewareruns.com/ might be a good place to host it for now if you finish the run before such a time as ExplodingCabbage explained happens.

AdHoc

2009-08-01 08:15:28 am

Thanks ZenicReverie for the tip.

But this website seems to be dead and has not really SDA's charisma. I'm really interested in "working" (playing might be a better term in our case) with experienced people like in this place.

But I understand the matter of the freeware question here.

I just finished the game BTW, with the two endings. I really hope someone else will be joining me. I think Google will index this thread in a few days, maybe people will find it by just searching for "knytt" on Google soon Tongue

AdHoc

2009-08-01 09:13:01 am

I just found out there's already a run of this game on YouTube... well, that's sad.

... even if I could improve and this one is in Easy Mode.

But it's always more fun when you're the first to speedrun a game :-[

ZenicReverie

2009-08-01 09:43:27 am

Waiting hurts my soul...

you should pick a really unknown game, or one that's hard to record if you want to speedrun a game for the first time. There are plenty of examples I could give, but I don't know what kind of systems you have to work with.

VorpalEdge

2009-08-01 01:02:17 pm

welcome to the machine

Quote from ZenicReverie:

you should pick a really unknown game, or one that's hard to record if you want to speedrun a game for the first time.

Huh? I'd pick something easy to record, personally. Tongue

Anyways, I've actually been working off-and-on (almost exclusively off) on a speedrun for the original Knytt, with max-run and lowgrav enabled, for quite some time. You probably won't be a dirty rotten cheater like me, so my route will likely be completely unusable for you, but there's ways to make composing a new one easy. If you choose to run it, I'd be glad to help.

AdHoc

2009-08-01 01:22:54 pm

I didn't even know you can cheat on this game Shocked

I'm rather fond of zero-cheating/100% original gaming.

I'll pass on scripts etc. Wink

VorpalEdge

2009-08-01 01:31:24 pm

welcome to the machine

Nah, it's not scripts. Just press the m and r keys at the same time for increased running speed, and l and g at the same time for low-gravity jumps. It's completely ingame (and only present in the first Knytt iirc), and it'd be a separate category anyways. Not that this actually matters, so, moving on...

Anyways, I watched the Machine speedrun (thanks for letting me know about it), and yeah, you definitely can improve it. The beginning is well-practiced, but the quality decreases the further into the run you go. Sad

I know what you mean about being the first to run a game, but it's a lot easier to improve something that already exists, you know?

AdHoc

2009-08-01 01:51:24 pm

Quote:

I know what you mean about being the first to run a game, but it's a lot easier to improve something that already exists, you know?

You're right.

After watching it a second time, I must say that it's maybe a litte boring to watch, especially the end, when after shutting down the machine, you have to run to the right for 2 minutes to actually finish the game.

I'll think about it some more Tongue

ashe_bug

Edit history:

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 03:06:00 am

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 03:05:33 am

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 03:05:31 am

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 03:05:30 am

2012-09-09 03:04:48 am

+2 against silly

Old thread is old, but not sure whether it's better to create a duplicate thread or commit necromancy... Lesser of two evils? Mods feel free to do whatever with it (split it, reprimand, etc).

Anyways, I started working on Knytt because, well... Let's just say a certain LPer got me in the mood for it and it's a better idea for a first run than FFIX single-segment (or Devil May Insta-Reject 2). Did a little poking about after doing a no warps run, and found out, well... there is no such thing as no warps. So after some talking in the IRC channel, vopeju (Vorpal? Not sure heh) found the old marked-up map from the verification topic. After pouring over that and the route outlined based on it (with some small letter changes), I went for it.

Now, this is really only with one day of practice -- after routing it warpless for about 3-4 hours -- but I managed to get a time of 13:35 for my best. This was with quite a few missteps and a few deaths - though I did manage to get by the slimes and do the castle bridge platforming section without dying in that attempt, iirc. I think I should be able to shave off another minute or two (perhaps even three) with better execution.

I'll probably be streaming more attempts of it tomorrow or sometime later in the week.

(edited to clarify I'm working on Knytt, not Knytt Stories; at least not yet. :P)

Old thread is old, but not sure whether it's better to create a duplicate thread or commit necromancy... Lesser of two evils? Mods feel free to do whatever with it (split it, reprimand, etc).

Anyways, I started working on Knytt because, well... Let's just say a certain LPer got me in the mood for it and it's a better idea for a first run than FFIX single-segment (or Devil May Insta-Reject 2). Did a little poking about after doing a no warps run, and found out, well... there is no such thing as no warps. So after some talking in the IRC channel, vopeju (Vorpal? Not sure heh) found the old marked-up map from the verification topic. After pouring over that and the route outlined based on it (with some small letter changes), I went for it.

Now, this is really only with one day of practice -- after routing it warpless for about 3-4 hours -- but I managed to get a time of 13:35 for my best. This was with quite a few missteps and a few deaths - though I did manage to get by the slimes and do the castle bridge platforming section without dying in that attempt, iirc. I think I should be able to shave off another minute or two (perhaps even three) with better execution.

I'll probably be streaming more attempts of it tomorrow or sometime later in the week.

(edited to clarify I'm working on Knytt, not Knytt Stories; at least not yet. :P)

AdHoc

2012-09-09 12:24:07 pm

Hi and thanks for using this old thread, it perfectly fits the need Smiley

I've only played Knytt Stories ot be honest, so good luck on the original game Wink

ashe_bug

Edit history:

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 09:24:06 pm

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 09:23:46 pm

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 09:23:30 pm

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 09:23:04 pm

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 09:22:51 pm

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 09:22:41 pm

ashe_bug: 2012-09-09 09:20:48 pm

2012-09-09 09:14:51 pm

+2 against silly

Got a new PB - 12:51.22 - tonight. I'll post a link to the Twitch highlight once the video decides to come up on past broadcasts. My apologies in advance for the venue/music - I got it on a group stream I broadcast on from time-to-time.

Considering I had a good four deaths (most of them in the yellow crystal area, ugh), not to mention a bunch of minor screw-ups towards the end because I was getting REALLY tense, I'm positive I can get sub-12. I think I'm going to shoot for 11:30, though 11:40 might be the limit as well, since I doubt I had a minute and a half of screw-ups (edit: Actually I had a good 20-30 seconds of screw-ups with the very last pair of warps heh). We'll have to see.

http://www.justin.tv/ponyslivenow/b/331678809

Mobiusman

2012-12-24 07:07:07 am

I know there aren't a lot of knytt speedrunners out there, but I'll necro this thread anyway to say I got an 11:23 with the same route. This game is very relaxing, even when you're playing it over and over again. There's still room for improvement, but I'm happy with the time.

VorpalEdge

Edit history:

VorpalEdge: 2012-12-25 03:08:39 am

VorpalEdge: 2012-12-25 03:02:38 am

VorpalEdge: 2012-12-25 02:47:19 am

2012-12-25 02:40:48 am

welcome to the machine

cool beans. enjoyed the run.

question: is it faster to run straight right past the slimes after the first item?

route has a lot of backtracking. =/ been eyeballing the map to see if I can improve it, but I can't come up with anything that doesn't look just as bad. shame.

some ideas for route segments that would prob be faster than current route, if they could be worked in:
-the warp out of gold-mines-spikes area drops you on top of the item above the mineshaft area. the warp a couple screens below where it drops you takes you back to goldmines. If you could get to the area where it drops you (I'm /so/ close) without having to take a warp there, you could go from the second goldspikes item down along the bottom row of the map, and up to the item that's currently collected second-to-last (in the purple square blocks area).
-having something coherent to do after getting the item in the sewers. sucks how you're 20 miles from everything else.
-not having to take the same warp twice
-possibly going left from the first high-clouds item (the one the route currently gets before going into the sewers), climbing the tower, going across the clouds again to the item above the ufo, and ending the run that way? could be worth it if there's a route out there that's really fast, except for not ending near the two back-to-back warps that take you to the far left of the map.

the closest thing I hit on to an alternate route is:
slime item
sewers item
warp to ico castle
roof item
spider item
warp to goldmines
two items here
warp to abandoned mines
item below warp
warp back to goldmines w/ warp below that item
go along bottom row to purple block item
warp to desert
that item that takes a long time to get where you have to go under a bridge and then all the way back out
left along the clouds to the first cloud item
left to the second cloud item
endgame

[edit] at the least, it would probably be faster to swap the items in the ico castle. on the first visit, get the spider item and hit warp to gold spikes area, on the second, get the one on the roof and then drop down the outside to find a much more convenient passage to the purple block area.

cool beans.  enjoyed the run.

question: is it faster to run straight right past the slimes after the first item?

route has a lot of backtracking. =/  been eyeballing the map to see if I can improve it, but I can't come up with anything that doesn't look just as bad.  shame.

some ideas for route segments that would prob be faster than current route, if they could be worked in:
-the warp out of gold-mines-spikes area drops you on top of the item above the mineshaft area.  the warp a couple screens below where it drops you takes you back to goldmines.  If you could get to the area where it drops you (I'm /so/ close) without having to take a warp there, you could go from the second goldspikes item down along the bottom row of the map, and up to the item that's currently collected second-to-last (in the purple square blocks area).
-having something coherent to do after getting the item in the sewers.  sucks how you're 20 miles from everything else.
-not having to take the same warp twice
-possibly going left from the first high-clouds item (the one the route currently gets before going into the sewers), climbing the tower, going across the clouds again to the item above the ufo, and ending the run that way?  could be worth it if there's a route out there that's really fast, except for not ending near the two back-to-back warps that take you to the far left of the map.

the closest thing I hit on to an alternate route is:
slime item
sewers item
warp to ico castle
roof item
spider item
warp to goldmines
two items here
warp to abandoned mines
item below warp
warp back to goldmines w/ warp below that item
go along bottom row to purple block item
warp to desert
that item that takes a long time to get where you have to go under a bridge and then all the way back out
left along the clouds to the first cloud item
left to the second cloud item
endgame

[edit] at the least, it would probably be faster to swap the items in the ico castle.  on the first visit, get the spider item and hit warp to gold spikes area, on the second, get the one on the roof and then drop down the outside to find a much more convenient passage to the purple block area.

VorpalEdge

Edit history:

VorpalEdge: 2012-12-25 03:19:59 am

2012-12-25 03:15:01 am

welcome to the machine

Forgot to attach the map that gets repeatedly referenced in this topic as well. The markup on it is dumb; I wish I had a clean copy so I could do it properly...

Attachment:

knyttmap.png

Mobiusman

2012-12-26 04:43:16 pm

thanks for posting that map, I'd been looking for a working link to it. and thanks so much for your routing comments! I am kind of skeptical that the route along the bottom of the map is faster, but I will definitely try it out when I have time. I have no idea if switching the castle order is faster, but I'll try that too. And finally, yes, going back past the slimes is at least two seconds faster than the video. It did occur to me to go that way, but then I basically forgot about it, haha.

bill

2012-12-27 10:18:15 am

Love that video! Absolutely great run, and I can't wait for more improvements!

Mobiusman

Edit history:

Mobiusman: 2013-01-02 12:24:37 pm

2013-01-02 12:24:15 pm

so, unless I'm missing something, it is unfortunately impractical to warp to the gold area after getting the spider item. you want to climb back up the shaft on the screen above and to the left of the spider - but once you're at the bottom, you can't reach the walls. back to the drawing board on that front.

ashe_bug

2013-01-15 02:42:22 am

+2 against silly

Oh hey, more people running this game! I'll have to admit, it's been a while since I've actually sat down for attempts again, but now that AGDQ's over and I have a free semester (kinda), as well as an out-of-commission capture card, gotta work more on it myself!

Great job on the 11:23, Mobiusman!

After doing the main route a couple of times, I'll start experimenting a bit. Though I do know, with the splits I (used to) have, the best time possible using that route is ~10:30. It'd take "perfect" execution, though, since it was just adding up the best times I've had on each split, which... is a little unfair haha.

The gear, I think, is the most out-of-the-way item, and unfortunately there isn't really anything near it, so... it might be a necessary evil. I'll definitely check around for the order of items, though, see if there's not anything better. TBH, because of how out-of-the-way it is, there might not BE a better order, since you'd just be delaying the inevitable by leaving it there.

Oh hey, more people running this game! I'll have to admit, it's been a while since I've actually sat down for attempts again, but now that AGDQ's over and I have a free semester (kinda), as well as an out-of-commission capture card, gotta work more on it myself!

Great job on the 11:23, Mobiusman!

After doing the main route a couple of times, I'll start experimenting a bit. Though I do know, with the splits I (used to) have, the best time possible using that route is ~10:30. It'd take "perfect" execution, though, since it was just adding up the best times I've had on each split, which... is a little unfair haha.

The gear, I think, is the most out-of-the-way item, and unfortunately there isn't really anything near it, so... it might be a necessary evil. I'll definitely check around for the order of items, though, see if there's not anything better. TBH, because of how out-of-the-way it is, there might not BE a better order, since you'd just be delaying the inevitable by leaving it there.

AdHoc

2013-01-16 01:45:03 pm

Wait, are you guys running Knytt or Knytt Stories?

I always thought the latter was far more interesting to play/watch.