Knack (PS4)

2014-01-11 03:32:51 pm

I was debating it, but I'm not sure how entertaining it would be. If I was going to run it, it would probably be easy mode because of all the one hitter quitters throughout the harder difficulties.

KrownLogic

2014-01-11 05:49:53 pm

FPS / RPG Runner

The one hit's are annoying, there was a few optimisations I made during Chapter 1 and Chapter 2 which made a huge difference to time but the enemies have ranged based switches on their animations depending on where the character is positioned and more annoyingly the archer enemies in the game make Hard Mode near impossible if you don't find good positioning in each spot.

I am going to finish a run soon keeping notes at the moment.

2014-01-12 03:05:21 am

I'd definitely be interested in seeing your results. I just think it might get stale over time unless there are some interesting skips or tricks discovered. Unfortunately the nature of the game I'm afraid.

KrownLogic

2014-01-12 04:26:41 am

FPS / RPG Runner

Yeah true, I was thinking the same but nobody has any skips or tricks that are worth nothing about at the moment.

Will stream today off my PS4 of my Knack Hard Mode Blind Run, just practice what's in the game properly and if there are any notable area's

2014-01-14 07:23:35 pm

I would suggest that if you don't have Diamond Knack yet, farm those diamonds and get him. You will save a ton of time and it will be a million times easier with Diamond Knack.

I'll reach out to ya later to talk about possible variations, etc. I have all the WRs for all the stages in the leaderboards (including Co-op) so if you have any questions let me know. Smiley

-Kasht

2014-01-14 09:13:30 pm

Quote from Kasht:

I would suggest that if you don't have Diamond Knack yet, farm those diamonds and get him. You will save a ton of time and it will be a million times easier with Diamond Knack.

I'll reach out to ya later to talk about possible variations, etc. I have all the WRs for all the stages in the leaderboards (including Co-op) so if you have any questions let me know. Smiley

-Kasht

How long do your runs usually go?

2014-01-15 12:41:21 am

Quote from Saint Connor:

How long do your runs usually go?

I have only focused on the Time Attack and Coliseum Attack stages so I haven't done a full run of the game with speedrunning in mind. That been said, I believe I finished the game with Diamond Knack on Very Hard in about 8 hours. Therefore, I believe that a good speedrun for the game, if using Diamond Knack on Easy and having all the gadgets, should take about 6 hours more or less. I guess I'll have to check it out myself. Smiley

MrLonghair

Edit history:

MrLonghair: 2014-01-15 11:38:57 am

MrLonghair: 2014-01-15 05:36:47 am

2014-01-15 05:36:34 am

Audio-guy. twitchtv:ohgoddamnit

I ended up with too many expensive pieces of tech to replace (Hauppauge Sad

) to buy the game. My idea was to get a co-op run going, any venture of a guess how well that would improve time? On HowLongToBeat.com there quickly appeared submissions of six hour runs (no way to verify..), making me wish I had the game just so I could spend weeks trying to find a way to sequencebreak because six hours of Knack with nothing but clean next-to-no-death play for it doesn't feel that exciting.

e: Thank you to the below post

2014-01-15 11:28:25 am

Quote from Kasht:

Quote from Saint Connor:

How long do your runs usually go?

I have only focused on the Time Attack and Coliseum Attack stages so I haven't done a full run of the game with speedrunning in mind. That been said, I believe I finished the game with Diamond Knack on Very Hard in about 8 hours. Therefore, I believe that a good speedrun for the game, if using Diamond Knack on Easy and having all the gadgets, should take about 6 hours more or less. I guess I'll have to check it out myself. Smiley

If you are getting 6hrs on easy, you're running quite a bit long. I did a casual run on easy with normal Knack in about 4 1/2 hrs. That's just powering through and ignoring a lot of unnecessary fights as there are only a few that trigger progression. Either way, barring any sequence breaks or solid glitches, this would be a pretty long...and unfortunately boring...game to run.

2014-01-15 01:54:10 pm

Quote from Saint Connor:

If you are getting 6hrs on easy, you're running quite a bit long. I did a casual run on easy with normal Knack in about 4 1/2 hrs. That's just powering through and ignoring a lot of unnecessary fights as there are only a few that trigger progression. Either way, barring any sequence breaks or solid glitches, this would be a pretty long...and unfortunately boring...game to run.

As I mentioned in my previous post, I haven't done a speedrun per-se. I have played the game with no intention to speedrun it and finished it in around 6 hours. I do not want to discourage KrownLogic to run it, but like MrLonghair says, the biggest challenge is in doing a deathless run. Some enemies in the game are very unforgiving, so I would like to see that run.

I'll keep working on a couple Time Attack and Coliseum Attack scores that I don't think are maxed out yet, but for the most part most of them will be pretty difficult to beat. Smiley

quinntendopower

2014-01-15 06:41:26 pm

Takahashi Meijin

Kasht, the man who never stops playing Knack! He has every 1st rank on the leaderboard lol

Kasht and I battled a bit on Time Attack 1! Lots of optimization there lol! That was fun by the way, that's the first time in awhile i've spent time on a time trial like that.

I got through very hard in about 4 hours with diamond knack. It's not that long of a game if you never die and skip as many fights as possible. diamond knack very hard was much easier then hard was with regular knack.

a good category would be very hard normal knack. enough with all the super easy boring categories for 3rd person action games already. this game is legitimately tough in sections and looks more fun when it's mostly a one hit paddy whack.

2014-01-15 11:04:21 pm

I don't know why this didn't hit me until now...but are you the same PR Julia player Kasht?

2014-01-16 07:55:30 am

@Saint Connon - Yes, I'm the Julia Tekken player from Puerto Rico! Smiley

Your name sounds familiar but I don't remember where I would have met you... Undecided

@quinntendopower - Hey man, it was great battling against you on that Stage 1 Time Attack challenge. I got a really bad blister on my right thumb going after the record but I finally got it. Cheesy

As surprising as it may seem, I haven't done a single speedrun on the game. I check the leaderboards once a week and if someone broke one of the records I go after it. Smiley

I have a wiki that I have been working on and would like to add this game to it. Of course, coming out with the right speedrun categories and rules for the game would be a good starting point. I'll hit you up quinntendopower via PM to start some discussion and show you what I already have for this game in the wiki. Smiley

-Kasht

2014-01-16 11:18:19 am

I did some thinking and I think some interesting speedrun categories will be:

1. Basic Knack | Hard | New Save Game - This is the most default category, its basically starting the game from the very beginning, with the default character, and the hardest difficulty available at the time. It also allows for the use of the in-game clock that shows in the Save file, which may allow for a segmented run submission.

2. Any Knack | Very Hard - Hardest difficulty, but can use Diamond Knack, and of course, use any gadgets that have already been found. As quinntendopower mentioned, I think this mode is easier than Basic Knack on Hard and 0 starting gadgets, and therefore easier to go for speed.

3. Vampire Knack | Very Hard | New Save Game - I would like to see someone do a run as Vampire Knack. I am not quite sure if it is even possible, but this would definitely get my attention and I wouldn't mind watching 4 hours of it or however it takes.

I am not sure if people want to do 100% (getting all 68 treasure chests) or doing it on Easy with Diamond Knack and all the gadgets. For the 100%, I really don't think it adds any value from a speedrun perspective, plus there is no way to track that all 68 treasure chests were found at the end. As for Diamond Knack with all gadgets on Easy, I really think it would be somewhat boring. Don't get me wrong, some enemies can still 1-shot you dead, but from a gameplay standpoint it doesn't really change. My guess is that if someone wants to do that run on Easy that's fine, they will probably get the fastest time possible for game completion, which is always good to know.

Anyways, I'll be glad to add any runs that people want to attempt to the wiki. There are no runs yet so it is not wise to force people into speedrunning a game a certain way. I'm really looking forward to seeing the first runs!

-Kasht

I did some thinking and I think some interesting speedrun categories will be:

1. Basic Knack | Hard | New Save Game - This is the most default category, its basically starting the game from the very beginning, with the default character, and the hardest difficulty available at the time.  It also allows for the use of the in-game clock that shows in the Save file, which may allow for a segmented run submission.

2. Any Knack | Very Hard - Hardest difficulty, but can use Diamond Knack, and of course, use any gadgets that have already been found.  As quinntendopower mentioned, I think this mode is easier than Basic Knack on Hard and 0 starting gadgets, and therefore easier to go for speed.

3. Vampire Knack | Very Hard | New Save Game - I would like to see someone do a run as Vampire Knack.  I am not quite sure if it is even possible, but this would definitely get my attention and I wouldn't mind watching 4 hours of it or however it takes.

I am not sure if people want to do 100% (getting all 68 treasure chests) or doing it on Easy with Diamond Knack and all the gadgets.  For the 100%, I really don't think it adds any value from a speedrun perspective, plus there is no way to track that all 68 treasure chests were found at the end.  As for Diamond Knack with all gadgets on Easy, I really think it would be somewhat boring.  Don't get me wrong, some enemies can still 1-shot you dead, but from a gameplay standpoint it doesn't really change.  My guess is that if someone wants to do that run on Easy that's fine, they will probably get the fastest time possible for game completion, which is always good to know.

Anyways, I'll be glad to add any runs that people want to attempt to the wiki.  There are no runs yet so it is not wise to force people into speedrunning a game a certain way.  I'm really looking forward to seeing the first runs!

-Kasht

CNDLongshot

2014-01-16 08:55:35 pm

I was looking into running Knack, but i was most likely going to go for just a normal New Game Any% run, so Basic Knack on Easy for fastest time. I've practice loosely up to Chapter 5-3 with a current time of 1:51:37. I know there is alot of time to be saved there. But the Categories that you have come up with Kasht seem like they would be much more entertaining then the normal gotta go Fast.

xdflames

2014-01-17 11:05:39 pm

Knack while skipping all of the cutscenes is really fast all things considered. I'm thinking sub 3 hours is very possible. Plus once you only die once or twice on a full run, the game is really easy. This is going off of normal, I doubt if I played on easy I would die at all. I'll do a rough estimate of how long an easy playthrough will take soon. 100% would be pretty rediculous if it counts you having to get 100% on that file, which would require all gems and gadgets I'd assume. An all treasure room run wouldn't add much more to an any% run either. Unless of course there actually ARE some skips to be found in this game.

This is going off of me (almost) getting the platinum trophy in knack, which involves way too many times going through the game trying to get every gem, done on normal.

2014-01-18 07:28:23 am

http://www.twitch.tv/maceron4444

I was thinking about running Knack myself but I still need to do a few more runs to come up with any new strategies.

KrownLogic

2014-01-19 01:35:03 pm

FPS / RPG Runner

Tried running this and after 2 playthroughs this game is very hard to run

quinntendopower

2014-01-20 12:05:13 pm

Takahashi Meijin

I didn't die a single time on very hard with Diamond Knack.

with practice, you could probably get all of hard with normal knack too.

XD, you can reload a treasure box if you don't get a diamond. just xmb and reload BEFORE you choose. Go for the places where chests are right after the checkpoint starts.

Edit history:

maceron: 2014-01-23 01:04:40 pm

2014-01-23 12:43:18 pm

http://www.twitch.tv/maceron4444

Just completed a normal run as default Knack with all the gadgets and I probably took around 3.5-4 hours (I stupidly forgot to set a stopwatch to time myself properly) to complete skipping all the cutscenes.
It wasn't a very good or optimized run granted I made too many mistakes trying to rush ahead, the game loves to punish you for that in those areas where you have to defeat all the enemies before advancing.
I'll try to find any skips and report them back here if successful.

quinntendopower

2014-01-23 01:17:17 pm

Takahashi Meijin

The biggest factor will be punch cancelling and magic use. Using the tornado can get you through big battles real quick if you use it properly.

Also, jumping constantly at certain growth levels of knack makes him move faster. Not all forms of knack benefit from jumping all the time though.

You can jump out of the punch right after the active frame, this sames frames and will add up considering how many attacks you need to do in this game.

I LOVE the immediacy of Knack, the downtime and time it takes to skip cutscenes is remarkable. I can't think of any other game of recent times that can load one mission to the next instantly. They obviously spent time with the design to make it snappy.

2014-01-23 02:49:21 pm

http://www.twitch.tv/maceron4444

You can use the double jump > dodge > attack combo in midair to make longer jumps.

2014-01-26 11:02:46 am

http://www.twitch.tv/maceron4444

Regarding speedruns with this game, would it be acceptable to run it as NG+ with all the gadgets or a vanilla run?

Would these be separate classifications? Vanilla runs will be pretty tough as Knack is a lot weaker and you HAVE to actively seek out sunstones for some parts of the game.