GTA San Andreas Official Thread

Edit history:

Patrick: 2013-02-27 02:23:51 pm

2013-02-27 02:23:01 pm

Ok, some attachments. :-)
In the Hills fast-kill video I wasted ammo.

I found a program that probably doesnt work on the steam version with which you can nearly simulate save states. It lets you set position and speed with one hotkey. It is called gtasa control center. So I can do more testing now in less time.

Vertical Bird: not faster but interesting: I retried until getting a good landing near the boats and then destroyed them with the minigun, see attachment. I ended up being as slow as CannibalK9 and he hates the Hydra.

E: thought attachments were saved across login sessions, re-uploading

Patrick

2013-02-27 02:33:07 pm

...

Attachments:

A_Home_In_The_Hills-Drive_To_Roof.avi

A_Home_In_The_Hills_Quick_Kill_minigun.avi

High_Noon_Febuary_B.avi

Vertical_Bird_End_Febuary.avi

S.

2013-02-27 03:16:24 pm

These are some nice strats, I really love them.

Joshimuz

Edit history:

Joshimuz: 2013-02-27 06:51:40 pm

2013-02-27 06:49:27 pm

Indeed, I'm now trying to keep a document since you guys are just throwing awesomeness at me all the time and I shouldn't just rely on you to format it for me when I'm too lazy/forgetful to read through and try things.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1o2dAJD_VjdWPGDe5UylH4ImVWeLC2NVxhZ7HeWcBzRE/edit?usp=sharing

I'm also planning to write down all my current strategies for all the missions too, however that might take awhile...

Patrick

Edit history:

Patrick: 2013-02-28 02:18:39 am

2013-02-28 01:58:58 am

I uploaded all the attachments (except for Green Goo) to youtube for mobile users. http://youtube.com/noob3132

I need to look at High Noon more: how much to turn him in which direction. Maybe there is a (guess) <10% of him escaping that can be turned into (guess) <5% by proper analysis. I just didn't want to test it anymore after testing five or so minigun strategies on him.
Sure is: I would update the notes on that one with more details: to position yourself precisely in advance in order to get in as fast as probable and to mash F to get in as soon as possible. All this is not essential but increases the success rate.

Also the fact that you can start 'Vertical Bird' w/o taking any calls by walking into the invisible markers didn't make it on the forum. Who is to credit for that discovery btw?

E: Now the thing I always forget. Thank you Nixixix and thank you very much Joshimuz for the notes/starting to take notes, going to check whether they are 'complete enough' for me in more detail later.
The Don Pejote rockets probably take more time than the second 20 rockets in interdiction and 40 rockets are more than enough already, maybe even 40 are not worth it.

I uploaded all the  attachments (except for Green Goo) to youtube for mobile users. http://youtube.com/noob3132

I need to look at High Noon more: how much to turn him in which direction. Maybe there is a (guess) <10% of him escaping that can be turned into (guess) <5% by proper analysis. I just didn't want to test it anymore after testing five or so minigun strategies on him.
Sure is: I would update the notes on that one with more details: to position yourself precisely in advance in order to get in as fast as probable and to mash F to get in as soon as possible. All this is not essential but increases the success rate.

Also the fact that you can start 'Vertical Bird' w/o taking any calls by walking into the invisible markers didn't make it on the forum. Who is to credit for that discovery btw?

[b]E:[/b] Now the thing I always forget. Thank you Nixixix and thank you very much Joshimuz for the notes/starting to take notes, going to check whether they are 'complete enough' for me in more detail later. 
The Don Pejote rockets probably take more time than the second 20 rockets in interdiction and 40 rockets are more than enough already, maybe even 40 are not worth it.

Joshimuz

2013-02-28 09:31:43 am

Quote:

Also the fact that you can start 'Vertical Bird' w/o taking any calls by walking into the invisible markers didn't make it on the forum. Who is to credit for that discovery btw?

That was me that discovered it. Once I found it I tried testing starting other missions without the phone calls without success, I believe there is potential for a mission/gang territory skip glitch here, but so far I have never got it to work in anything other than Vertical Bird and Home Coming

Quote:

The Don Pejote rockets probably take more time than the second 20 rockets in interdiction and 40 rockets are more than enough already, maybe even 40 are not worth it.

I didn't know the amounts of rockets I got from each drop, so I just included both locations. I'll test it to see how many I use/need but your probably right

Nixixix

2013-02-28 10:30:29 am

The Interdiction amounts are actually 20 and 40, taking 0 and 8 seconds (from Patrick) respectively. The Don Peyote ones take much more than 8 seconds. I agree that you should spend the 8 seconds in Interdiction until you maybe find that you can't meaningfully use much more than 20.

I took a look at the full San Fierro mission order, hoping to squeeze in a deathwarp from Lure to Amphibious Assault, but couldn't find an order where it would be useful. However, another optimization popped out. Could there be a reason why the mission order is:
Jizzy – (T-Bone Mendez + Mike Toreno) – (Mountain Cloud Boys + Ran Fa Li) – Lure
instead of:
Jizzy – (Mountain Cloud Boys + Ran Fa Li) – (T-Bone Mendez + Mike Toreno) – Lure?
The latter has much less travel between missions.

Joshimuz

Edit history:

Joshimuz: 2013-02-28 10:39:47 am

2013-02-28 10:39:37 am

Quote:

The latter has much less travel between missions.

That does make more sense and I can't think of why it wouldn't work, Mike Toreno is the only one which requires anything special, and that's the bike from T-Bone Mendez, which is still directly before it

Patrick

2013-02-28 02:57:26 pm

The wanted level after 'Jizzy' -> no Woozie call
That's why I tried the 'invisible marker trick' and it didn't work.

High Noon is much easier when getting in from the driver side. You then have more time to position CJ near the door [thing to open it]. Video following in roughly 16h or so. With practice the original strat could be worth the additional difficulty, but as you don't practice specific things much, it isn't.

A bust warp Lure -> Outrider is worth testing but I have not much hope, as the police station is near Outrider and the weapon loss doesn't matter at all (collect SMG in Outr., microSMG from Jizzy).

Nixixix

2013-02-28 11:09:03 pm

Thankfully saving between Jizzy and Mountain Cloud Boys doesn't take very long. And then you get to do T-Bone Mendez without stars too.

Outrider starts at the garage. Maybe you were thinking of the first marker during the mission? The distance to the garage is about the same from the police station as from the bustwarp line.

Patrick

Edit history:

Patrick: 2013-03-01 03:18:57 am

Patrick: 2013-03-01 03:17:03 am

2013-03-01 03:15:53 am

Will test that today. :-) Had dismissed that idea out of hand, I still doubt, but whatever.

I wrote a list of things that are still to be tested. It is incomplete afaik, maybe I will add things to it later.

pacifist=killing only the people that have to be killed to continue the game ('have to be killed' doesn't mean those that would otherwise take up to much health)

bust warp to Catalina's home: how late do the cops have to appear that bust warp isn't worth it? (on average, as the cars in Dillimore are random, too) Is turning right on the Y-intersection worth it in this specific case?

Jizzy satchel save strat (drive, jump out to have the car outside the explosion range, place satchels, run, boom)
post-'Jizzy' save (how much time it saves/wastes) which is essential for route change

Da Nang pacifist, on top - how reliable? Are there ways to make it 99% reliable (by enemy analysis - have no experience or knowledge about that)?
('downstairs': save: pacifist, running to the [to-be-freed] guys and back, no climbing, collecting the stuff from the armor+tec9 place; save because of the health refill after freeing the guys)

AK drops in Interdiction: one AK wouldn't have wasted time in Cannibal's run (he didn't collect it) maybe he was lucky, maybe more drops are possible

rocket strats in LV

LV - route 'Black Project late'): can enough microSMG ammo be collected in the missions, are 30 rounds AK enough in combination with the rockets? (=one AK drop in Interdiction, the helis only drop one/heli in Cannibal's run)

how much time the no-hunter-strat wastes (sounds strange, how much getting all-gold would have to waste to cause the hunter to be not worth it)

Black Project: too lazy to explain, will test that first, has to do with enemies being alerted quite late, let's you keep more armor

Return to Los Santos:
checking how easy it is to get two stars before Beat Down on B Dup, how often does that make a police vehicle drive to Grove Street (preferably a bike)

checking where to park the vehicle to prevent it from disappearing after Beat Down

Will test that today. :-) Had dismissed that idea out of hand, I still doubt, but whatever.

I wrote a list of things that are still to be tested. It is incomplete afaik, [i]maybe[/i] I will add things to it later.

pacifist=killing only the people that have to be killed to continue the game ('have to be killed' doesn't mean those that would otherwise take up to much health)

bust warp to Catalina's home: how late do the cops have to appear that bust warp isn't worth it? (on average, as the cars in Dillimore are random, too) Is turning right on the Y-intersection worth it in this specific case?

Jizzy satchel save strat (drive, jump out to have the car outside the explosion range, place satchels, run, boom)
post-'Jizzy' save (how much time it saves/wastes)  which is essential for route change

Da Nang pacifist, on top - how reliable? Are there ways to make it 99% reliable (by enemy analysis - have no experience or knowledge about that)?
('downstairs': save: pacifist, running to the [to-be-freed] guys and back, no climbing, collecting the stuff from the armor+tec9 place; save because of the health refill after freeing the guys)

AK drops in Interdiction: one AK wouldn't have wasted time in Cannibal's run (he didn't collect it) maybe he was lucky, maybe more drops are possible

rocket strats in LV

LV - route 'Black Project late'): can enough microSMG ammo be collected in the missions, are 30 rounds AK enough in combination with the rockets? (=one AK drop in Interdiction, the helis only drop one/heli in Cannibal's run)

how much time the no-hunter-strat wastes (sounds strange, how much getting all-gold would have to waste to cause the hunter to be not worth it)

Black Project: too lazy to explain, will test that first, has to do with enemies being alerted quite late, let's you keep more armor

Return to Los Santos: 
checking how easy it is to get two stars before Beat Down on B Dup, how often does that make a police vehicle drive to Grove Street (preferably a bike)

checking where to park the vehicle to prevent it from disappearing after Beat Down

cpwr

2013-03-01 01:51:55 pm

If you're a good to very good heli pilot, heres a suggestion. Grab the heli in "Mike Toreno" and just fly in a pay and spray. The first pay and spray you can use is on the way by the train station, but it's a little tricky to get the heli inside because there are 2 lampposts in the way. The second one you can use is near the Pleasure Domes, its easier to get in and out, but it's a little off the way. If you finish the mission, you can use the heli to fly to the mission marker for Lure as well.
But you have to watch out, if you screw up the parking inside the pay and spray the heli will blow up and you fail the mission.

I try to make a video, but without a graphics card it will be very laggy. This strat sounds much more dangerous than it actually is Wink

Patrick

Edit history:

Patrick: 2013-03-01 03:07:30 pm

Patrick: 2013-03-01 03:05:27 pm

Patrick: 2013-03-01 03:04:48 pm

Patrick: 2013-03-01 03:02:33 pm

2013-03-01 02:59:34 pm

This sounds more spectacular than the strat I found an hour ago. :-) Unfortunately it will probably be slower - helicopters are way over-rated -, but it is worth testing.

High Noon: I tested it using the Save Anywhere Mod by Rapier (anywhere is misleading - anywhere outside missions would be correct). Very probably that does not influence the luck. As I am assuming that this is true or, also very probable, luck does not influence anything at all or both, testing is done now: I tested a strat again that I had discarded because it failed for some reason. The advantage of the 'new' strat is having 'much' more time to get in while still getting in from the passenger side. Did it 5-10 times in a row. Please never forget to hold the 'keep the door open button' - as that is essential to kill him.
attachment1 - nearly always gonna link to the attachments from now on
I did some testing on Black Project and guess what I found. :-) https://forum.speeddemosarchive.com/attachment/hXwjKIubvoxFka0MGkIObuWh%2FF4

Black Project (more detail on the rest of the mission), JIzzy satchels and route change tested next.

Josh, an update to the notes: The Da Nang Thang:do not alert the group on the way to the heart. Walk down instead of jumping. Surprisingly, running doesn't alert them, so run after climbing up. Do not risk to get stuck on one of them, run around them.

And: I once saw you not using the re-loading spawn trick - dunno if you do this more often - but I would prefer to never see that again. Re-loading spawns police bikes roughly 2 out of 3 times.

This sounds more spectacular than the strat I found an hour ago. :-) Unfortunately it will probably be slower - helicopters are way over-rated -, but it is worth testing.

High Noon: I tested it using the Save Anywhere Mod by Rapier (anywhere is misleading - anywhere outside missions would be correct). Very probably that does not influence the luck. As I am assuming that this is true or, also very probable, luck does not influence anything at all or both, testing is done now: I tested a strat again that I had discarded because it failed for some reason. The advantage of the 'new' strat is having 'much' more time to get in while still getting in from the passenger side. Did it 5-10 times in a row. Please never forget to hold the 'keep the door open button' - as that is essential to kill him.
[url=https://forum.speeddemosarchive.com/attachment/TBq0QJ5WMpVrZh3T%2Bl4ZVAUsy3g]attachment1 - nearly always gonna link to the attachments from now on[/url]
I did some testing on Black Project and guess what I found. :-) https://forum.speeddemosarchive.com/attachment/hXwjKIubvoxFka0MGkIObuWh%2FF4

Black Project (more detail on the rest of the mission), JIzzy satchels and route change tested next.

Josh, an update to the notes: The Da Nang Thang:do not alert the group on the way to the heart. Walk down instead of jumping. Surprisingly, running doesn't alert them, so run after climbing up. Do not risk to get stuck on one of them, run around them.

And: I once saw you not using the re-loading spawn trick - dunno if you do this more often - but I would prefer to never see that again. Re-loading spawns police bikes roughly 2 out of 3 times.

Attachments:

Black_Project_End_March.mp4

High_Noon_Last_Strat_Questionmark.mp4

cpwr

2013-03-01 04:12:25 pm

Can you post your Mike Toreno strat you found? As I said, mine is pretty consistant if you're a good pilot, but if you screw it up its completely over, so it might not be the best strat for single segment. And yeah, heli's are overrated, but in this case its much quicker than driving the limo.

Patrick

2013-03-01 04:34:04 pm

I was refering to Black Project. Sry for that ambiguity.

cpwr

Edit history:

cpwr: 2013-03-02 04:59:27 pm

cpwr: 2013-03-02 03:24:07 pm

2013-03-01 07:42:51 pm

Sorry for another post, but you can't attach files when editing embarassed

As promised, here are the two pay and spray visits with the helicopter, they're pretty bad executed but I get a ton of lag and the recording doesn't make it better Sad

So you have to believe me, it's actually not that bad at all.

If you've done it a few times it get's real easy, just bring the heli down, line it roughly up with the gate, tap "W" once to get just enough air to fly it in. Don't worry, the blades arent completely solid and the heli is much more stable than you think. If you're inside you really want to hold "S" down so it doesn't move like it happened to me in the second pay and spray. To get out you just do it reverse Tongue

E:
Nice that you tried the strat. As I tested it yesterday, I had the van spawn next to the heicopter, so I took it right away and flew over to the place where you have to kill the guys. The heli stayed there and you can just fly out. If the van spawns by the tower, just trigger them to start driving, and get to the heli as fast as you can and then kill everyone. If you get the spawn on the runway, same deal. Funny enough, I tried it just a second age and now the heli despawns during the cutscene, so I have to find a place where you can land and keep the heli Roll Eyes

You did pretty good, just a few tries and you got it, if you practice it over the next week you'll get it every time for sure.

E2:
I have good and not so good news. The good one first. In Black Project you actually can jump from the top and land on the jetpack. The bad one is, I have to find the point again from where I jumped Cry

Sorry for another post, but you can't attach files when editing :embarassed:

As promised, here are the two pay and spray visits with the helicopter, they're pretty bad executed but I get a ton of lag and the recording doesn't make it better :( So you have to believe me, it's actually not that bad at all.

If you've done it a few times it get's real easy, just bring the heli down, line it roughly up with the gate, tap "W" once to get just enough air to fly it in. Don't worry, the blades arent completely solid and the heli is much more stable than you think. If you're inside you really want to hold "S" down so it doesn't move like it happened to me in the second pay and spray. To get out you just do it reverse :P

[b]E:[/b]
Nice that you tried the strat. As I tested it yesterday, I had the van spawn next to the heicopter, so I took it right away and flew over to the place where you have to kill the guys. The heli stayed there and you can just fly out. If the van spawns by the tower, just trigger them to start driving, and get to the heli as fast as you can and then kill everyone. If you get the spawn on the runway, same deal. Funny enough, I tried it just a second age and now the heli despawns during the cutscene, so I have to find a place where you can land and keep the heli ::)

You did pretty good, just a few tries and you got it, if you practice it over the next week you'll get it every time for sure.

E2:
I have good and not so good news. The good one first. In Black Project you actually can jump from the top and land on the jetpack. The bad one is, I have to find the point again from where I jumped :'(

Attachments:

payspray1.mp4

payspray2.mp4

Nixixix

Edit history:

Nixixix: 2013-03-03 05:30:17 am

Nixixix: 2013-03-03 03:44:43 am

Nixixix: 2013-03-03 03:02:49 am

2013-03-03 02:46:31 am

Stuff for next week I guess... I went through Las Venturas with the new mission order, and it worked out just fine, even without an AK from Interdiction. Ammo I spent (more than necessary):

SMG: 15 for You've Had Your Chips, 10 for Don Peyote, 5 for Intensive Care where the mafia in the ambulance then drop 60. Misappropriation and The Meat Business give even more.

Rockets: 12 for You've Had Your Chips, 1 for Misappropriation, 12 for The Meat Business. I'm sure that Meat Business can be done with much less; I didn't try to optimize it very much. 2 or 3 can be knocked off Chips as well.

Overall, SMG ammo is no problem if you don't spray it all over. Replacing rifles with rockets works, and 20 rockets is probably enough but requires more careful use than I could be bothered with. With an AK it should be absolutely no problem. You've Had Your Chips and The Meat Business should be practiced separately a couple of times first, I think.

---

High Noon: By pushing the car sideways as well as turning it clockwise, I got a situation where Pulaski didn't get in at all. Don't know what triggered it (just distance to the door from his scripted location?), didn't try to repeat it yet. The point of pushing sideways and clockwise was to make him start by reversing while turning, making it easy to enter from the passenger side. That was successful for me earlier.

Saint Mark's Bistro: Don't forget that you have a minigun, it's very nice here. Just leave over 50 bullets and you should be fine.

Learning to Fly / Parachute Onto Target: Try doing it with the frame limiter off. You'll need to open the parachute much later (at 26 seconds) but some time before that let go of W (at 25 seconds with my framerate) to avoid overshooting the target. My FPS may be just right for this, so I got a time of 29 seconds. Note that if you open your parachute too late, you'll die when you exit the flight school, so be careful. While still in school your health just flashes at zero.

I also timed the different SF mission orders from Josh's runs. Approximately correcting for time lost in crashes and different vehicles, I'd say that the old route is probably 0–10 seconds faster than the new one including saving. In favor of the new route, T-Bone Mendez without police (one crash wastes probably 10 seconds), and the save point near Woozie already bought (cutscene ~6 seconds) if needed for healing later. ETA: Also, less driving = less opportunities for crashing. More precise timing is in order, but neither route is a huge loss.

Stuff for next week I guess... I went through Las Venturas with the new mission order, and it worked out just fine, even without an AK from Interdiction. Ammo I spent (more than necessary):

SMG: 15 for You've Had Your Chips, 10 for Don Peyote, 5 for Intensive Care where the mafia in the ambulance then drop 60. Misappropriation and The Meat Business give even more.

Rockets: 12 for You've Had Your Chips, 1 for Misappropriation, 12 for The Meat Business. I'm sure that Meat Business can be done with much less; I didn't try to optimize it very much. 2 or 3 can be knocked off Chips as well.

Overall, SMG ammo is no problem if you don't spray it all over. Replacing rifles with rockets works, and 20 rockets is probably enough but requires more careful use than I could be bothered with. With an AK it should be absolutely no problem. You've Had Your Chips and The Meat Business should be practiced separately a couple of times first, I think.

---

High Noon: By pushing the car sideways as well as turning it clockwise, I got a situation where Pulaski didn't get in at all. Don't know what triggered it (just distance to the door from his scripted location?), didn't try to repeat it yet. The point of pushing sideways and clockwise was to make him start by reversing while turning, making it easy to enter from the passenger side. That was successful for me earlier.

Saint Mark's Bistro: Don't forget that you have a minigun, it's very nice here. Just leave over 50 bullets and you should be fine.

Learning to Fly / Parachute Onto Target: Try doing it with the frame limiter off. You'll need to open the parachute much later (at 26 seconds) but some time before that let go of W (at 25 seconds with my framerate) to avoid overshooting the target. My FPS may be just right for this, so I got a time of 29 seconds. Note that if you open your parachute too late, you'll die when you exit the flight school, so be careful. While still in school your health just flashes at zero.

I also timed the different SF mission orders from Josh's runs. Approximately correcting for time lost in crashes and different vehicles, I'd say that the old route is probably 0–10 seconds faster than the new one including saving. In favor of the new route, T-Bone Mendez without police (one crash wastes probably 10 seconds), and the save point near Woozie already bought (cutscene ~6 seconds) if needed for healing later. [b]ETA: Also, less driving = less opportunities for crashing.[/b] More precise timing is in order, but neither route is a huge loss.

cpwr

2013-03-04 07:27:53 am

New jump position for "Black Project", but I still can't get the jump from the very top.

Attachment:

file (07).mp4

S.

2013-03-04 07:56:52 am

Do you think the jump from the top can be done straight into the jetpack without using the edgeglitch on one of the fences?

cpwr

2013-03-04 08:24:48 am

Yes, I've already done it. Now I have to find a reliable way to do it.

Patrick

2013-03-04 08:49:41 am

That is the same position as mine. I was confused when you said that and for some reason didn't say anything. Probably because I planned to post the other stuff that I know earlier and mention it then.

From the very top is seg'd stuff, MrGamerDerek's strat is interesting

Using the teleporting software I tested my strat (same as cpwrs strat) more than 15 times and in some rare cases you die. Chances: roughly one in five, but not sure.

The alternative is finding a jumping position further down where failure doesn't result in death.

It is not just positioning, after one failure I tried it more times after teleporting to that exact 'failure position' and tried again with roughly the same timing, couldn't replicate the failure.

no time left, gotta go^^^^

Nixixix

Edit history:

Nixixix: 2013-03-04 02:07:41 pm

2013-03-04 02:02:09 pm

New mission order for Los Santos. I offer different options and it gets complicated, sorry.

This saves some driving (instead of Binco – Grove – Smoke, just Binco – Smoke) and avoids saving to advance time. Avoiding saving to heal is possible but requires very careful play.

There's a lot of freedom in placing a set of missions that start from Grove Street and end nearby, but many of them have limited start times making some arrangements much worse than others. I hope I'm aware of all the time limits. Apart from the three flexibly placed missions listed in the end, I only know of Life's A Beach (22–06) and Management Issues (12–05). I'm sure the Management Issues limit is there just to spite us, as the mission sets the clock to 1600 when it starts. If it weren't for the limit, the route would be shorter.

Mission sequences that are same as before are without separating blank lines.

---

(don't save at all between Big Smoke and Ryder)
...
S Nines and AKs

BS OG Loc
OG Life's A Beach
BS Running Dog

S Drive-by
S Sweet's Girl
(time here is approximately 1330)

Grove1: Here you can do nothing, Home Invasion + save, or Home Invasion + Catalyst [+ Robbing Uncle Sam] with an optional save anywhere after Home Invasion timed depending on health.

(time here should be between 0400 and 1900, earlier leaves more room for error before Management Issues)
S Cesar Vialpando
CV High Stakes, Low-Rider
OG Madd Dogg's Rhymes
OG Management Issues (sets the clock to 1600)
OG House Party (cutscene)
C Burning Desire
(time at Grove here is approximately 0400)

Grove2: Here you can do nothing, or combinations of House Party, Catalyst, Robbing Uncle Sam (the last two provided you did Home Invasion in Grove1). It would be useful to spend extra health here because Doberman gives health+armor.

S Doberman
C Gray Imports
BS Wrong Side Of The Tracks
BS Just Business
(time at Grove here is approximately 14:20 after leaving Grove2)

Grove3: The remaining Grove Street missions in some order. What you can do depends on the time:
* 12–20 R Home Invasion (sets the clock to 2200 at the start; back at Grove at ~0140)
enables R Catalyst (takes ~2:40)
enables R Robbing Uncle Sam (takes ~3:35 from starting to being back at Grove)
* 20–06 OG House Party (takes ~7:25 because advances time by 6 hours in the end)
* 09–17 S Los Sepulcros (takes ~4:00)

Reuniting The Families
The Green Sabre

---

I got the time estimates from Josh's last run through Los Santos yesterday, not compensating for any mistakes. Variations of over a minute (in-game hour) are easily possible at most points even though the clock is reset in the middle.

Here are what I think are the two best options for the flexible mission placement:

The potentially save-free route:
Grove1: –
Grove2: –
Grove3 starting before 2000 (like estimated 1820): Home Invasion, House Party, either Catalyst or save, Los Sepulcros (save anywhere after this), Catalyst if not before, Robbing Uncle Sam
Grove3 starting after 2000: House Party, save, Los Sepulcros, Home Invasion (save anywhere after this), Catalyst, Robbing Uncle Sam
The hard part is the start with Running Dog, Sweet's Girl, and Madd Dogg's Rhymes all on one health bar. Eating at the Burger Shot could be used in an emergency. The end is also hard but I'm kind of assuming a healthy save there.

An easier route that guarantees 1–2 saves by spreading the lost health a bit better:
Grove1: Home Invasion, Catalyst, probably a save before or after Catalyst
Grove2: Robbing Uncle Sam
Grove3 starting ~2155: House Party, save, Los Sepulcros
Robbing Uncle Sam could be moved to any point in Grove3 before Los Sepulcros just as well. But I assume that you have enough health and armor left at Grove2 and rather take the little damage there.

In any case remember that you can heal fast from the Sprunk machine in Reuniting The Families, so you don't need to save before it if you're sure you don't mess it up.

If splits weren't involved, you could decide on the route based on your health after Sweet's Girl, but I think you'll want to pick one of the above (assume the earlier Grove3 time in the save-free route) and stick to it correcting the clock with saves. The save-free route should be faster even if you need two saves/eats. But not with three, and not if you die.

I could have easily made some mistakes here. Obviously I didn't test every variation, only the save-free route.

---

Bustwarps: I believe you always get two stars if you blow up two cars. It's a bit slow and dangerous if not careful, but a sure way to get police to spawn.

High Noon: Pushing the car away from Pulaski while he's opening the door has almost always worked for me. He stays out of the car, and you need to run him over. Even the minigun doesn't work there. Even when the pushing fails and he gets in, I haven't had a single instance where I couldn't jack him right back out, having turned the car a little. But that's me being lucky I think.

New mission order for Los Santos. I offer different options and it gets complicated, sorry.

This saves some driving (instead of Binco – Grove – Smoke, just Binco – Smoke) and avoids saving to advance time. Avoiding saving to heal is possible but requires very careful play.

[hidden]There's a lot of freedom in placing a set of missions that start from Grove Street and end nearby, but many of them have limited start times making some arrangements much worse than others. I hope I'm aware of all the time limits. Apart from the three flexibly placed missions listed in the end, I only know of Life's A Beach (22–06) and Management Issues (12–05). I'm sure the Management Issues limit is there just to spite us, as the mission sets the clock to 1600 when it starts. If it weren't for the limit, the route would be shorter.

Mission sequences that are same as before are without separating blank lines.

---

(don't save at all between Big Smoke and Ryder)
...
S Nines and AKs

BS OG Loc
OG Life's A Beach
BS Running Dog

S Drive-by
S Sweet's Girl
(time here is approximately 1330)

Grove1: Here you can do nothing, Home Invasion + save, or Home Invasion + Catalyst [+ Robbing Uncle Sam] with an optional save anywhere after Home Invasion timed depending on health.

(time here should be between 0400 and 1900, earlier leaves more room for error before Management Issues)
S Cesar Vialpando
CV High Stakes, Low-Rider
OG Madd Dogg's Rhymes
OG Management Issues (sets the clock to 1600)
OG House Party (cutscene)
C Burning Desire
(time at Grove here is approximately 0400)

Grove2: Here you can do nothing, or combinations of House Party, Catalyst, Robbing Uncle Sam (the last two provided you did Home Invasion in Grove1). It would be useful to spend extra health here because Doberman gives health+armor.

S Doberman
C Gray Imports
BS Wrong Side Of The Tracks
BS Just Business
(time at Grove here is approximately 14:20 after leaving Grove2)

Grove3: The remaining Grove Street missions in some order. What you can do depends on the time:
* 12–20 R Home Invasion (sets the clock to 2200 at the start; back at Grove at ~0140)
  enables R Catalyst (takes ~2:40)
  enables R Robbing Uncle Sam (takes ~3:35 from starting to being back at Grove)
* 20–06 OG House Party (takes ~7:25 because advances time by 6 hours in the end)
* 09–17 S Los Sepulcros (takes ~4:00)

Reuniting The Families
The Green Sabre

---

I got the time estimates from Josh's last run through Los Santos yesterday, not compensating for any mistakes. Variations of over a minute (in-game hour) are easily possible at most points even though the clock is reset in the middle.

Here are what I think are the two best options for the flexible mission placement:

The potentially save-free route:
Grove1: –
Grove2: –
Grove3 starting before 2000 (like estimated 1820): Home Invasion, House Party, either Catalyst or save, Los Sepulcros (save anywhere after this), Catalyst if not before, Robbing Uncle Sam
Grove3 starting after 2000: House Party, save, Los Sepulcros, Home Invasion (save anywhere after this), Catalyst, Robbing Uncle Sam
The hard part is the start with Running Dog, Sweet's Girl, and Madd Dogg's Rhymes all on one health bar. Eating at the Burger Shot could be used in an emergency. The end is also hard but I'm kind of assuming a healthy save there.

An easier route that guarantees 1–2 saves by spreading the lost health a bit better:
Grove1: Home Invasion, Catalyst, probably a save before or after Catalyst
Grove2: Robbing Uncle Sam
Grove3 starting ~2155: House Party, save, Los Sepulcros
Robbing Uncle Sam could be moved to any point in Grove3 before Los Sepulcros just as well. But I assume that you have enough health and armor left at Grove2 and rather take the little damage there.

In any case remember that you can heal fast from the Sprunk machine in Reuniting The Families, so you don't need to save before it if you're sure you don't mess it up.

If splits weren't involved, you could decide on the route based on your health after Sweet's Girl, but I think you'll want to pick one of the above (assume the earlier Grove3 time in the save-free route) and stick to it correcting the clock with saves. The save-free route should be faster even if you need two saves/eats. But not with three, and not if you die.

I could have easily made some mistakes here. Obviously I didn't test every variation, only the save-free route.

---[/hidden]
Bustwarps: I believe you always get two stars if you blow up two cars. It's a bit slow and dangerous if not careful, but a sure way to get police to spawn.

High Noon: Pushing the car away from Pulaski while he's opening the door has almost always worked for me. He stays out of the car, and you need to run him over. Even the minigun doesn't work there. Even when the pushing fails and he gets in, I haven't had a single instance where I couldn't jack him right back out, having turned the car a little. But that's me being lucky I think.

Patrick

2013-03-05 02:41:41 pm

Wow, that is a huge post. I am going to read this multiple times, then I am going to understand it all but now I have not enough time.
time limit for Ryder missions: Home Invasion for sure, rest needs testing.

@cpwr: I am sorry that I didn't tell you.
@Nixixix: No time today and tomorrow, I am going to read it until I understand everything eventually. :-)
time limits: Home Invasion: 12-unknown; Los Sepulcros: I am quite sure that there is
are there more Sprunk machines/chili dogs other than that and the one near the bar/Denise?
Btw, there is even armor in Re-uniting[...]. Up some stairs.

claims I am unsure of: untested, not everything is useful, some is 'emergency-only'
Los Sepulcros is save because of the car strat.
Sweet's Girl also: car strat;SMG in Big Smoke if lucky, Drive-by or 'Drive-thru'
Ryder's train mission: car strat
Robbing Uncle: need to check for armor in the crates outside you would normally steal, completely untested. Run for the vehicle (dunno the name), drive-by the two guys
Burning Desire: molotov strat ;they magically disappear after the mission
Running Dog: should be doable without damage by running around the victim's friends (wall between you and them) or car strat.
Big Smoke:restart when hit
[...]Rhymes health: don't see the problem, doesn't he kill the last guy with the knive and loses a ton on heath there?
Probably he needs to save health before Management Issues in case he is seen drowning the manager in the 'new' strat.
eating: for cannibal it wasted 20s or so (he needed to wait anyways) - so yes, emergency-only -
armor: apart from the obvious ones, I think no armor can be collected without wasting much time.

Jizzy: I found a surprisingly unspectacular save-strat for Jizzy_End. :-) Shoot the drivers, then the rest. Before the action starts you need to keep some distance, as far as I understood they have an invisible 'spook-o-meter'. Not sure about that, and no idea about the exact details.

Mike Toreno -> Woozie: death abuse could save a few seconds. 50s when driving badly, 40s abusing death. You then get one SMG from Outrider and Jizzie's micro-SMG. This is a very close one.

no use: Death to get rid of stars before Mountain Cloud Boys saves to little to be worth the weapon loss unfortunately.

Mike Toreno:
general facts: this always worked for me: get out of the heli at full speed, it will re-spawn right next to you after freeing Toreno.
after freeing Toreno, you get teleported to the same place every time (not absolutely certain).

saved: I timed 25s saved when flying from the van to the Pleasure Domes, but only 15s or so compared to decent driving (Josh messed up in both runs I got the driving time from), i.e. w/o driving the Stretch to the heli. I waited 30s in front of the Pay'n'Spray to simulate the spraying. Going to re-do this, but the time should roughly be right.
time lost:
van near heli: 0-5s, with optimization, i.e. a straight line from the chase trigger point ("shit there they are") to the heli and from it to the van stopping place.
elsewhere: 20s or more.

A Home in the Hills Quick Kill:
If you run the efficient micro-route that I used in the video, the success rate should rise from 90-95 percent to 99. Also saves 2s.

No time left... ;-)

Wow, that is a huge post. I am going to read this multiple times, then I am going to understand it all but now I have not enough time. 
time limit for Ryder missions: Home Invasion for sure, rest needs testing.

@cpwr: I am sorry that I didn't tell you.
@Nixixix: No time today and tomorrow, I am going to read it until I understand everything eventually. :-) 
time limits: Home Invasion: 12-unknown; Los Sepulcros: I am quite sure that there is
are there more Sprunk machines/chili dogs other than that and the one near the bar/Denise?
Btw, there is even armor in Re-uniting[...]. Up some stairs.

claims I am unsure of: untested, not everything is useful, some is 'emergency-only'
Los Sepulcros is save because of the car strat.
Sweet's Girl also: car strat;SMG in Big Smoke if lucky, Drive-by or 'Drive-thru'
Ryder's train mission: car strat
Robbing Uncle: need to check for armor in the crates outside you would normally steal, completely untested. Run for the vehicle (dunno the name), drive-by the two guys
Burning Desire: molotov strat ;they magically disappear after the mission
Running Dog: should be doable without damage by running around the victim's friends (wall between you and them) or car strat.
Big Smoke:restart when hit
[...]Rhymes health: don't see the problem, doesn't he kill the last guy with the knive and loses a ton on heath there?
Probably he needs to save health before Management Issues in case he is seen drowning the manager in the 'new' strat.
eating: for cannibal it wasted 20s or so (he needed to wait anyways) - so yes, emergency-only - 
armor: apart from the obvious ones, I think no armor can be collected without wasting much time.

Jizzy: I found a surprisingly unspectacular save-strat for Jizzy_End. :-) Shoot the drivers, then the rest. Before the action starts you need to keep some distance, as far as I understood they have an invisible 'spook-o-meter'. Not sure about that, and no idea about the exact details.

Mike Toreno -> Woozie: death abuse could save a few seconds. 50s when driving badly, 40s abusing death. You then get one SMG from Outrider and Jizzie's micro-SMG. This is a very close one.

no use: Death to get rid of stars before Mountain Cloud Boys saves to little to be worth the weapon loss unfortunately.

Mike Toreno:
general facts: this always worked for me: get out of the heli at full speed, it will re-spawn right next to you after freeing Toreno.
after freeing Toreno, you get teleported to the same place every time (not absolutely certain).

saved: I timed 25s saved when flying from the van to the Pleasure Domes, but only 15s or so compared to decent driving (Josh messed up in both runs I got the driving time from), i.e. w/o driving the Stretch to the heli. I waited 30s in front of the Pay'n'Spray to simulate the spraying. Going to re-do this, but the time should roughly be right.
time lost:
van near heli: 0-5s, with optimization, i.e. a straight line from the chase trigger point ("shit there they are") to the heli and from it to the van stopping place.
elsewhere: 20s or more.

A Home in the Hills Quick Kill: 
If you run the efficient micro-route that I used in the video, the success rate should rise from 90-95 percent to 99. Also saves 2s.

No time left...  ;-)

cpwr

2013-03-05 04:31:00 pm

Did you time the difference between driving from the Pleasure Domes to Woozie and flying? If there isn't that much of a time advantage this strat is pretty much useless, also it's kind of dangerous, just too inconsistent I guess.

Patrick

Edit history:

Patrick: 2013-03-05 11:14:44 pm

2013-03-05 11:08:47 pm

I didn't, do you want to do it (neutral question)?
The strat would be awesome even if it would save <10s in any case. It just looks awesome. :-D Depends on one's preferences in regards to speed-entertainment traid-offs.

There is a route with the stretch directly to the tuning shop (nitro;spraying; jumping from the airport to the docks) and then driving to Jizzy like in the mission 'Jizzy'. Will test whether it is worth it time-wise. After some tests my guess is that it saves under 5s and is more risky because of COPs on the road.