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Grandia (Any %) (Segmented)

Verifier Responses

Quote:
Ok, finished watching. Comments:

No cheating detected, A/V is mostly OK, with a few glitches here and there that I am going to assume were recording glitches.

General run comments:
- There was some debate that getting Alheal wasn't really necessary for the run, but I feel that its worth was vindicated during the run. There were a few battles in particular that I feel would have taken a fair bit longer without Alheal. That said, the runner claims that Alheal is learned at level 8, when it's actually learned at level 5, so the runner over-trained water magic and ended up wasting about 10 or so minutes in segment 15 due to that. I'm not sure if those extra 3 levels came even close to being saved due to the cast time decrease or the stat boosts from training the water magic beyond the level that was necessary. Healer is learned at level 8, and it was only ever used once, so that definitely did not pay for itself at all.
- The same segment above showed considerable sloppiness when the runner would go into the menu to heal and spam the confirm button to do the healing more times than necessary, causing wasted frames. The cost for this was likely at least a minute.
- One other spell the runner trained up for was getting Stram for Rapp, which I feel was completely unnecessary. It was only ever used once, and in the battle that it was used in (Baal battle during segment 84), Liete already comes with Stram, so I hardly think it was necessary to get it for Rapp as well.. especially since getting it required training up water magic as well, so there was a lot of wasted time here. During the time that the runner trains Rapp's earth magic, he also trains Justin's earth magic, which I don't see as necessary either. I mean, the stat boosts are nice and all, but unless that difference was life and death, I just don't see this being necessary at all. At the very least, if the stats were necessary, there should be a more efficient way to gain them in another way, because Diggin' takes forever to cast, and water magic on Rapp is never used in the run..
- There was a fair amount of hesitation during battles throughout the run, particularly when the runner ran out of SP on a character and would pause for up to a couple of seconds on a few occasions in order to figure out what to do. This was quite evident against the final boss, and there was a pretty significant case of this during the Hydra battle in segment 77, with quite a lot of very bizarre hesitation near the start and generally throughout.

That said, the planning was otherwise very good, and the strategies employed to kill the bosses and enemies along the way seemed very well thought out, for the most part. Execution, other than 1-2 pathing mistakes and some hesitation during battles, was pretty good as well.

Verdict: Accept the run. I think it's a fine initial entry for the game and a great starting point for future runners to improve upon. Verifier 2 did a great job of breaking down potential optimizations in terms of collecting mana eggs as well.


Quote:
OK, finally done watching the run. Marathon'd the last bit while watching Puwexil run FF9 Tongue

Audio/Video: Fine.
Cheating: None detected.

I'm not even sure how to begin this. There's just so much game here, yet there also so much cutscene. So I guess for starters I'll mention to any potential viewers that segments 20 and 90 are all cutscenes. If you want to see gameplay, skip those 2 Tongue

Spells:
-As verifier #1 said, we debated on whether Alheal was worth it. And I have to agree that it was, but not until at least disc 2. I think it was only used two or three times in all of disc 1, and it seemed like more of a luxury than a necessity. I think the training could have been done a bit differently, given that little bit. Namely, test where the water levels would be at the points they'd be required. Justin needs Crackle for the Boss in the Volcano, and then Feena needs it as well for the Milda fight - but Crackle only requires Water 2. Having Water 5 by the Milda fight would probably be about optimal. This also raises the question of whether getting Alheal on both Justin and Feena is necessary. Liete comes with Alhealer, and it just seems like overkill to have Alheal on 2 characters when 1 would probably suffice. Anyway, back to the testing idea - it pretty much boils down to how far off of having the necessary spells the runner would be, then only grinding the rest early on to make up the difference.
-Also, as verifier #1 said, the runner overtrained Water to 8. Healer is learned at 8, not Alheal, and it was only used once in the entire run. Could have easily done without it. I won't comment on the menu sloppiness that was mentioned since V1 did a good job summing it up.
-Stram for Rapp: I also agree with verifier #1 here. Liete comes with it, and it honestly didn't seem to help THAT much. I think he easily could have gotten away without training earth or water on Rapp at all. Cutting Water from Rapp would also mean one less Mana Egg to collect. Earth is debatable, because the defense bonus can be useful.
-Training Earth for Justin didn't even look necessary at all. I know it's extra STR, but I think Justin only got to Earth 3? It's hard to tell without being able to open the menu and look. Could have probably skipped that Mana Egg too.
-Speaking of Mana Eggs, the runner mentions you need 10 to have all elements on the final 4 characters (Justin needs all 4, Feena and Rapp start with Fire). But the question is why?
--Earth for Justin is unnecessary save for stats.
--If we eliminate training to learn Stram on Rapp, Earth and Water become unnecessary. Earth might still be useful for the occasional Diggin', though.
--If he used all 10 Mana Eggs, then Feena would also have earth. He never once uses this, so the Mana Egg collected was pointless.
--On that same note, he trains Wind for Rapp, which is also never used.
So, Mana Eggs necessary would be Wind/Water for Justin, Wind/Water for Feena, maybe Fire for Justin, and maybe Earth for Rapp. That's 6 Mana Eggs, with 4 being the bare minimum. The time spent getting the extra Eggs could be eliminated.

I do have to agree with Verifier #1 on the hesitation as well in battles. This generally occurred when the runner ran out of SP/MP, and was trying to figure out what to do next. The only time I can seriously overlook it is in the Gaia Core fight, since the runner is pretty well taxed to the limit as far as SP and MP go, and coming up with Attack-All abilities to deal with the small tentacles on the fly becomes more difficult the farther into the fight he goes. In addition, he's about 20-25 minutes into the segment at that point. Given how hard that fight looked, I'm going to bet that his nerves were getting to him a bit.

With that out of the way, the rest I have to say is all positive. The boss fights were well thought out, and the items picked up seemed to all be good choices, save maybe for some stat boosters. Unfortunately, it's difficult to tell what he picked up due to me not knowing German Tongue
I actually have to disagree with the other verifier on pathing mistakes. I didn't notice any glaring issues at all, and those that may have looked like it I would wager were there to get around difficult or otherwise impossible to avoid enemies. Obviously the runner would have to chime in here to be 100% sure.

Final Verdict: ACCEPT.
Reason: Though there were some errors (both planning and execution-wise) I don't feel they are enough to warrant a reject, considering how much time could be saved vs. how long this game is. I feel this is a good first entry for this game.


Decision: Accept

Congratulations to Chris-X!
Also congratulations to these verifiers for verifying this game in less than 2 months!
Thread title:  
So how many hours more is this run than whatever the current longest on SDA is?
Pudding%
The run is 13.5 hours, give or take. A little over 14 hours of video. Beats Skies of Arcadia by almost 1.5 hours Wink
Edit history:
Syrreal: 2012-12-19 03:04:47 pm
Personal text is in another place!
Ja, man, welch Überraschung direkt for Weihnachten. Vielen Dank für dieses Geschenk Chris-X und Gratulation zur überstandenen Verifizierung. Ich freu mich schon auf die 13,5 Stunden, sogar in Deutsch :D.

Congratulations!
Whew! What a marathon this was! It was a good run though, glad to see it will go up on the game page!
Weegee Time
I couldn't believe someone finished a run for this game.  Congratulations on the acceptance.  Wowza!
The Speedrunning Teacher
Congrats on the accept!

Now I'll have to work on a new, longer speedrun so I can get my title of 'Longest Speedrun' back! Tongue
Fucking Weeaboo
Maybe I should just do a Xenoblade Chronicles NG run and just remove all possibilities of you ever getting your title back. Tongue
Dragon Warrior VII

</thread>
Congratulations!

I anxiously wait for a run either as long as this or longer, single segment.
Why is it i can't find this run on the website yet?
Formerly known as Skullboy
The run hasn't been uploaded to the site yet. Please be patient, as this is a super busy time for SDA and most of the staff are involved with the marathon. I want to see the run too.
i would just expect a month later they would have it on :p grandia is my all time favourit game so looking forward to seeing it.
Oh my god! I've totally missed this whole thread!
I thought I would get an email when the verification is done. So sorry for being late Smiley

Thank you so much for your kind comments. After finishing the run I realized that it would be the longest currently uploaded run on SDA. This title is a bit strange because this is a SPEED running page, but I'm very proud of being the leader on that list now Wink
The longest run I watched was the FFIX run and it was amazing and not boring at all.

Special thanks to the verifiers! I can only repeat Flip's words: The verifying time is amazing and the suggestions for improvement are brilliant (maybe your speed was the reason I missed this thread).
I didn't spend that much time for planning the magic experience, but focused on boss fight strategy, items and the general route. Your comments concerning the useless water and earth magic are legitimate, of course! Without Healer and Stram and without the useless mana eggs some fights would have been much harder, but possible, though. The amount of saved time could all in all be round about 30 minutes, so this is worth giving it a try. Maybe I'll try it myself in a few months or years...

I'm looking forward to the video coming up.
Thank you again for your support and greetings from ice-cold Germany Smiley

Chris-X
Edit history:
Eternalspirit: 2013-01-29 07:16:45 pm
Quote from chris_x:
Oh my god! I've totally missed this whole thread!
I thought I would get an email when the verification is done. So sorry for being late Smiley

Thank you so much for your kind comments. After finishing the run I realized that it would be the longest currently uploaded run on SDA. This title is a bit strange because this is a SPEED running page, but I'm very proud of being the leader on that list now Wink
The longest run I watched was the FFIX run and it was amazing and not boring at all.

Special thanks to the verifiers! I can only repeat Flip's words: The verifying time is amazing and the suggestions for improvement are brilliant (maybe your speed was the reason I missed this thread).
I didn't spend that much time for planning the magic experience, but focused on boss fight strategy, items and the general route. Your comments concerning the useless water and earth magic are legitimate, of course! Without Healer and Stram and without the useless mana eggs some fights would have been much harder, but possible, though. The amount of saved time could all in all be round about 30 minutes, so this is worth giving it a try. Maybe I'll try it myself in a few months or years...

I'm looking forward to the video coming up.
Thank you again for your support and greetings from ice-cold Germany Smiley

Chris-X


But of course!

Your run inspired me to beat the game again, to be honest. Tongue I had totally forgotten how absolutely overpowered Justin's Dragon Cut was.. especially with the Energy Charm.

Also, if anyone actually wants to guarantee that their run will eclipse this run's time, they should run basically any Wild Arms game..
Weegee Time
Quote from Eternalspirit:
Also, if anyone actually wants to guarantee that their run will eclipse this run's time, they should run basically any Wild Arms game..

Wild Arms 4 has clocked in at 5:24, actually.  Maybe the original Wild Arms or Wild Arms 2 though.  Also, Xenogears with all its unskippable dialogue and such may be a contender.
Quote from Rakuen:
Quote from Eternalspirit:
Also, if anyone actually wants to guarantee that their run will eclipse this run's time, they should run basically any Wild Arms game..

Wild Arms 4 has clocked in at 5:24, actually.  Maybe the original Wild Arms or Wild Arms 2 though.  Also, Xenogears with all its unskippable dialogue and such may be a contender.


I'm thinking either Wild Arms 3 or 5 are actually the longest (at least it certainly felt that way), but certainly WA1 and 2 are very long by themselves. Xenogears also, though I've never played it so I don't know how long it actually is.

Remember when the speed run time limit was something like 6 hours? Tongue
Someone in the 'Longest Games to Speedrun' thread mentioned Xenogears takes 15:41:XX. A bit of a specific time, and WAY less than I would have figured.
Pudding%
Quote from Melodia:
Someone in the 'Longest Games to Speedrun' thread mentioned Xenogears takes 15:41:XX. A bit of a specific time, and WAY less than I would have figured.

Was that US or JP version? I can only imagine how much less text there is in JP...
Did they forget to upload this game or something? Sad still waiting to get to watch it.
Quote from jimmi33:
Did they forget to upload this game or something? Sad still waiting to get to watch it.

Man, I now wait 8 months for the upcoming Mafia run and that one is only 3 hours long and the game site already exists...
So it may take a few months more for Grandia, maybe till the end of the year. We just have to be patient...

Chris-X
Pudding%
They're probably trying to get through the backlog of games that were verified before this and still need to be posted. Patience.
HELLO!
You can't suddenly greatly increase the number of verified games without giving the updaters a backlog of their own!
The run is online now!