Freedom Planet

2015-08-24 09:31:58 pm

Hello everyone!
I’ve been running Lilac for a while now and was wondering if there is any material on some of zips like the one in thermal base with the moving ledges and the zip with the water shield in final dreadnaught, since I’m not sure how to pull them off.

Also, a huge thanks to Mylexsi as well as Johannhowitzer since I don’t know where I’d be without your videos.

Fladervy

Edit history:

Fladervy: 2015-08-26 08:50:58 pm

2015-08-25 08:25:35 pm

I slowed down at the end to align the boost, but doing so delayed the bulldozer loading. Avoiding that, the bottom route is around 2 seconds faster than the top one.

Edit:
Milla can use the infinite flutter trick to ignore the Thermal Base elevator.

Here's a simpler and better way do zip using objects as Milla.

Ultigonio

Edit history:

Ultigonio: 2015-08-26 09:38:30 pm

2015-08-26 09:35:32 pm

Interesting (possibly useless) Milla tech, not sure if it's been found/discussed previously but I did my best to ctrl + f every page for "ladder" so:

So far, I haven't been able to find any sort of use for this. I've explored a little around every stage, but the problem is that most ladders in the game have solid blocks on both sides, so there's no way to move oneself up from being slightly below the top of the ladder. Springs behave a bit funnily with this "trick" - if you Milla boost on top of one while it's repeatedly attempting to make you go higher, you'll gain a handful of pixels of height (maybe to the top of the spring's hitbox?), but that's about it.

One other thing I've noticed is that doing a downward boost around the edge of the ladder seems like it may do something along the lines of cancelling the climb animation, allowing you to get a little bit below the normal start point (as I did by accident here, at around 30 seconds: http://www.twitch.tv/ultigonio/v/13008444 ). It's really difficult for me to reproduce, though; takes maybe three or four tries.

Interesting (possibly useless) Milla tech, not sure if it's been found/discussed previously but I did my best to ctrl + f every page for "ladder" so:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U72cXxjZplc

So far, I haven't been able to find any sort of use for this.  I've explored a little around every stage, but the problem is that most ladders in the game have solid blocks on both sides, so there's no way to move oneself up from being slightly below the top of the ladder.  Springs behave a bit funnily with this "trick" - if you Milla boost on top of one while it's repeatedly attempting to make you go higher, you'll gain a handful of pixels of height (maybe to the top of the spring's hitbox?), but that's about it.

One other thing I've noticed is that doing a downward boost around the edge of the ladder seems like it may do something along the lines of cancelling the climb animation, allowing you to get a little bit below the normal start point (as I did by accident here, at around 30 seconds: http://www.twitch.tv/ultigonio/v/13008444 ).  It's really difficult for me to reproduce, though; takes maybe three or four tries.

Fladervy

Edit history:

Fladervy: 2015-08-27 08:16:10 pm

2015-08-27 05:04:38 pm

While testing the strat, this happened. This might be useful somewhere.

Fladervy

Edit history:

Fladervy: 2015-08-28 08:03:41 am

Fladervy: 2015-08-28 08:00:57 am

2015-08-28 07:58:33 am

So, there's an even simpler way to zip with objects as Milla.

It's way safer than moving towards the object, because you can try it again as long as you release the block too early (unless it's a bomb). Also, it's way easier to setup, because there's not a speed requirement anymore.

Ultigonio

2015-08-28 12:01:29 pm

Quote from Fladervy:

So, there's an even simpler way to zip with objects as Milla.

are you serious

I've been messing around with this one a little bit - I'm able to get it working with most things I've tried it on, but I seem to be having absolutely no luck getting it to work on shields - the block will just goofily pop up a tiny bit and then drop back down.

Fladervy

Edit history:

Fladervy: 2015-09-01 04:52:58 pm

Fladervy: 2015-08-31 07:08:08 am

Fladervy: 2015-08-30 07:31:45 pm

Fladervy: 2015-08-28 05:02:12 pm

2015-08-28 04:03:19 pm

It doesn't work like this on shields. They'll always pop up a tiny bit, like you said.

Edit:

Edit2:

Release the super shield burst and tap the block button at the same time. Then, it's possible to summon another block while the super shield burst is still active.

Edit3:
This trick has a lot of potential. Using this, Milla can, for example:
- Build speed without jumping, which means not losing some of it due to air friction;
- Attack bosses on the ground faster (or jump+attack);
- Build speed faster, summonning more blocks.

Edit4:
For some reason, it's not possible to cancel the end lag into a normal shield burst.

Ultigonio

2015-09-02 09:00:14 pm

Quote from Fladervy:

Edit4:
For some reason, it's not possible to cancel the end lag into a normal shield burst.

Noticed this, too. I'm assuming it's similar to the way that you can't actually form a new block until the one you've thrown is destroyed.

Fladervy

Edit history:

Fladervy: 2015-09-06 07:01:19 am

2015-09-03 04:43:18 pm

johannhowitzer

2015-09-06 11:35:17 am

Viking it up

The current Lilac Dragon Valley board, with times replaced with the time behind one place above.

johannhowitzer	2:38.23
Mylexsi	+1.02
Yuuki_S	+2.24
Fladervy	+1.00
tailow	+2.88
Ai-Dail	+2.46
FlameHricane	+2.79
Jinzougen	+ .61
CptNanners	+ .75
Symmanke	+ .68
GregSiris	+ .83
Firestorm Edge	+1.34
Echnew	+ .08
masterkratos27	+ .59
RetroMadnessZone	+ .48
Zeph	+ .02
Flying Cactus	+2.69
Nedned2k	+8.19
Zurggriff	+2.44
Morelia	+1.35
Synn	+1:06.92

Check out that midsection. Competition got pretty crazy.

The current Lilac Dragon Valley board, with times replaced with the time behind one place above.

[table]
[tr]
	[td]johannhowitzer[/td]
	[td]2:38.23[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Mylexsi[/td]
	[td]+1.02[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Yuuki_S[/td]
	[td]+2.24[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Fladervy[/td]
	[td]+1.00[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]tailow[/td]
	[td]+2.88[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Ai-Dail[/td]
	[td]+2.46[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]FlameHricane[/td]
	[td]+2.79[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Jinzougen[/td]
	[td]+ .61[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]CptNanners[/td]
	[td]+ .75[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Symmanke[/td]
	[td]+ .68[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]GregSiris[/td]
	[td]+ .83[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Firestorm Edge[/td]
	[td]+1.34[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Echnew[/td]
	[td]+ .08[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]masterkratos27[/td]
	[td]+ .59[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]RetroMadnessZone[/td]
	[td]+ .48[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Zeph[/td]
	[td]+ .02[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Flying Cactus[/td]
	[td]+2.69[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Nedned2k[/td]
	[td]+8.19[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Zurggriff[/td]
	[td]+2.44[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Morelia[/td]
	[td]+1.35[/td]
[/tr]
[tr]
	[td]Synn[/td]
	[td]+1:06.92[/td]
[/tr]
[/table]

Check out that midsection.  Competition got pretty crazy.

Fladervy

Edit history:

Fladervy: 2015-09-25 06:32:32 am

Fladervy: 2015-09-18 11:35:45 am

Fladervy: 2015-09-16 07:58:38 am

Fladervy: 2015-09-14 10:30:34 am

2015-09-14 10:25:57 am

Hitting the core as the animation begins might be the reason this happens.
This might help a lot Lilac and Carol.
Note: this is the 4th core hit.

Edit:

This strat can be improved. Boosting a little earlier into the blocks can make this 2 seconds faster than this one.
The main problem is: how to get to the blocks at the right moment? I'll try to calculate this later.

Edit2:

jinzougen

2015-09-25 04:55:35 pm

Hello fellow FP runners. I'm fairly new and just finished learning the route for Lilac. I'm going to celebrate by doing my first single-segment run and I would love for lots of people to show up and watch me fail ^^. I'll be giving it a go around 11 a.m. eastern time on Sunday, Sept. 27. (That's 3 p.m. for Britain). Hope to see you in my channel then: twitch.tv/jinzougen

Ultigonio

Edit history:

Ultigonio: 2015-09-28 10:30:32 pm

Ultigonio: 2015-09-28 09:54:37 pm

2015-09-28 09:49:54 pm

Here's me borrowing a strat from Carol's route - since FN's midboss exists before the fight starts, you're able to deal massive damage to it before beginning the fight by utilizing the flutterblock glitch. I doubt it's more optimal just in terms of speed, but it's a little safer in that you're able to avoid damage entirely - as an added bonus, none of the floor is destroyed, making it easier to get a good running start out of the room (although I flubbed that in this video). One other thought is that you could deal damage on the way down with an upward shot, which should almost definitely result in saved time.

It's unwise to attempt more than four hits. A fifth, if they all connect reasonably well, will kill the miniboss before the fight starts, more-or-less softlocking the game.

Fladervy

Edit history:

Fladervy: 2015-10-01 06:46:42 am

Fladervy: 2015-10-01 06:46:31 am

Fladervy: 2015-10-01 06:46:28 am

Fladervy: 2015-10-01 06:18:31 am

Fladervy: 2015-09-30 08:44:28 am

2015-09-30 08:43:58 am

The fastest way to enter the arena is to take damage from the bombs, so Milla will be in hitstun animation while passing through the miniboss.
Also, dealing 5 hits as fast as possible isn't hard, and avoiding damage isn't a problem.
So I think it wouldn't be faster.

As a safer, alternative strat, however, I think it can be useful.

Edit:
I rerouted Pangu Lagoon's third screen.

Chromatrope

Edit history:

Chromatrope: 2015-10-20 12:03:42 pm

Chromatrope: 2015-10-18 01:32:58 pm

2015-10-16 06:12:45 am

Wait, what input was that again?

While trying to learn using the normal attack button as boost, and having the attack on a bumper, as well as learning the controller in general, I found out that the DV miniboss can be done about half a second faster by damaging the front orbs first, and then using an uppercut and continuing airkicks to take out the rear four. If done right, the final kick will take out all remaining orbs and hit the head. With enough training, this could be done consistently, as I even missed a kick.

Edit: Well nevermind, looking back at the SGDQ race, I saw Mylexsi get this, and I'm sure there must be other points where it has happened before. I'm kinda new to this all, didn't see this covered in this thread, Johann's tutorial or the DV WR. Anyways, I do think that this could be done more consistently using an uppercut like I did here, though, but I don't know enough to be 100% sure.

Edit 2: I've found that it is actually possible to destroy all orbs before he even pokes his head out. If paired with kicking just before he pokes out, this could potentially save another half second over the method above.

While trying to learn using the normal attack button as boost, and having the attack on a bumper, as well as learning the controller in general, I found out that the DV miniboss can be done about half a second faster by damaging the front orbs first, and then using an uppercut and continuing airkicks to take out the rear four. If done right, the final kick will take out all remaining orbs and hit the head. With enough training, this could be done consistently, as I even missed a kick.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGAJi7a_1iw

Edit: Well nevermind, looking back at the SGDQ race, I saw Mylexsi get this, and I'm sure there must be other points where it has happened before. I'm kinda new to this all, didn't see this covered in this thread, Johann's tutorial or the DV WR. Anyways, I do think that this could be done more consistently using an uppercut like I did here, though, but I don't know enough to be 100% sure.

Edit 2: I've found that it is actually possible to destroy all orbs before he even pokes his head out. If paired with kicking just before he pokes out, this could potentially save another half second over the method above.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ywctcDtdx8

SuccinctAndPunchy

2015-10-20 03:40:03 pm

You're not here.

Quote from Chromatrope:

Edit 2: I've found that it is actually possible to destroy all orbs before he even pokes his head out. If paired with kicking just before he pokes out, this could potentially save another half second over the method above.

Video's set to private, can't see shit captain.

Chromatrope

2015-10-21 03:59:15 pm

Wait, what input was that again?

Quote from SuccinctAndPunchy:

Quote from Chromatrope:

Edit 2: I've found that it is actually possible to destroy all orbs before he even pokes his head out. If paired with kicking just before he pokes out, this could potentially save another half second over the method above.

Video's set to private, can't see shit captain.

Whoops, should be fixed now.

Fladervy

2015-10-26 12:45:25 pm

Chromatrope

2015-10-27 05:04:30 am

Wait, what input was that again?

That is amazing, I would've never thought of using ground cyclone glides to get across that! Looks like it could be quite a bit easier than the divekicks as well.

FlameHricane

Edit history:

FlameHricane: 2015-11-11 07:31:27 pm

2015-11-11 04:37:21 pm

Well I forgot this was here, greetings fellow freedomers! So I was messing around in SB trying to find a better way to get past the slow down and drop part on the 3rd ship (just calling it that) and I found a pretty consistent way to go right through it. A visual queue that I use is right about when Lilac is in the middle of the corner of that ceiling (not exactly, but slightly to the left), I then jumpdive. Right after that, I tap left then immediately hold right. I failed the part after, but instead of landing on the crystals, you land around the edge of that platform and when you jump, glide, and cancel like normal, you'll have enough meter to make the boost off of the spikes.

Mylexsi

Edit history:

Mylexsi: 2015-11-12 01:47:07 pm

Mylexsi: 2015-11-12 01:45:04 pm

Mylexsi: 2015-11-12 01:44:05 pm

Mylexsi: 2015-11-12 01:43:57 pm

Mylexsi: 2015-11-12 01:41:44 pm

2015-11-12 01:39:56 pm

Regarding our little frame-war on FD1, I found a new small time saver.
With this, in addition to everything else, you can sub 50.0 on the screen transition; you get past the pylon's so early you don't even hear them go off, much less see it.

Note that you have to trigger the divekick first, then hold left, about halfway through the wind-up. Otherwise you clip onto the edge of the lift. The cue for the jump timing, if your eyes can even parse visual data that fast, is either the small arrow on the ground, or as the back of lilac lines up with the left edge of the red pillar in the background.
You also need the shortest of short-hops.

Have fun with this one, I'm having more trouble with it than the spike jump. And we all know it's gonna be fucking necessary.
And I cba any more tonight. I'm not really motivated enough. My best was a 1:45.2 with a missed attack on the boss, and a whole bunch of unecessary hitlag in a couple of places, so yeah, 43 is definitely possible.

Regarding our little frame-war on FD1, I found a new small time saver.
With this, in addition to everything else, you can sub 50.0 on the screen transition; you get past the pylon's so early you don't even [i]hear[/i] them go off, much less see it.

Note that you have to trigger the divekick first, [i]then[/i] hold left, about halfway through the wind-up. Otherwise you clip onto the edge of the lift. The cue for the jump timing, if your eyes can even parse visual data that fast, is either the small arrow on the ground, or as the back of lilac lines up with the left edge of the red pillar in the background.
You also need the shortest of short-hops.
https://youtu.be/jvzUV0tBGDc

Have fun with this one, I'm having more trouble with it than the spike jump. And we all know it's gonna be fucking necessary.
And I cba any more tonight. I'm not really motivated enough. My best was a 1:45.2 with a missed attack on the boss, and a whole bunch of unecessary hitlag in a couple of places, so yeah, 43 is definitely possible.

Mylexsi

Edit history:

Mylexsi: 2015-11-16 10:37:48 am

2015-11-16 10:35:21 am

I've been doing some maths and testing on the FD1 boss. First things first, the stuff that's useful for everyone: It takes 19 frames between pressing the B button and being able to kick again(in mid-air), going along the lines of this:

Frame No. - Thing that happens:
1 - Pressed Attack Button, kick animation starts
2 -
3 -
4 -
5 -
6 - 4 damage
7 -
8 -
9 -
10 -
11 - 4 damage
12 -
13 -
14 -
15 -
16 -
17 -
18 - Last frame of kick animation
19 - Lilac goes back to neutral state & receives inputs. If you are spamming kicks frame-perfect, this is the "1" of the next kick.

Note that to do dps calculations you should use 18 frames rather than 19; the 19th frame is the 1st frame you can be doing a 2nd kick, not the last frame of the 1st kick.

Other stuff to note, If you use Cyclone(2dmg per tick), the first tick is on the very next frame after you hit the button. Each subsequent tick is every 7th frame after that. It ticks a total of 12 times.
If you cause a tick of damage via cyclone, and press the attack button on the same frame(i.e. perfect timing/best-case), the kick's damage frames will be the 7th and 12th after the cyclone tick, and will end on the 19th frame as usual.
___

And now stuff that only really helps with the FD1 frame war:

The last phase of the boss has 45hp. There are 3 notable patterns to kill him with:

1 - 6 kicks (48dmg)
2 - 5 kicks + 3 ticks of cyclone (46dmg)
3 - 1 cyclone tick + 5 kicks + the first damage frame of the 6th kick (46dmg)

Assuming every single input is frame-perfect...

(1) takes (18*5) + 11 = 101 frames (11 instead of 18 on the last one because you dont need to wait until neutral state, just until that last damage tick)

(2) takes (18*3) + 1 + (7*2) + 18 + 11 = 98 frames (remember the 1st tick of cyclone only takes a single frame from input, and you can input Attack on the same frame you damage something)

(3) takes (18*3) + 1 + (18*2) + 6 = 97 frames

So, functionally, under normal circumstances, all those strats are equal, what with there being only 0.07s between them.
Realistically though, because of what we're fucking doing to this stage, you wanna kick 3 times, then do the fastest cyclone/kick you possibly can, then kick 2 more times.

I've been doing some maths and testing on the FD1 boss. First things first, the stuff that's useful for everyone: It takes 19 frames between pressing the B button and being able to kick again(in mid-air), going along the lines of this:

[u]Frame No. - Thing that happens:[/u]
1 - Pressed Attack Button, kick animation starts
2 - 
3 - 
4 - 
5 - 
6 - 4 damage
7 - 
8 - 
9 - 
10 - 
11 - 4 damage
12 - 
13 - 
14 - 
15 - 
16 - 
17 -
18 - Last frame of kick animation
19 - Lilac goes back to neutral state & receives inputs. If you are spamming kicks frame-perfect, this is the "1" of the next kick.

Note that to do dps calculations you should use 18 frames rather than 19; the 19th frame is the 1st frame you can be doing a 2nd kick, not the last frame of the 1st kick.

Other stuff to note, If you use Cyclone(2dmg per tick), the first tick is on the very next frame after you hit the button. Each subsequent tick is every 7th frame after that. It ticks a total of 12 times.
If you cause a tick of damage via cyclone, and press the attack button on the same frame(i.e. perfect timing/best-case), the kick's damage frames will be the 7th and 12th after the cyclone tick, and will end on the 19th frame as usual.
___

And now stuff that only really helps with the FD1 frame war:

The last phase of the boss has 45hp. There are 3 notable patterns to kill him with:

1 - 6 kicks (48dmg)
2 - 5 kicks + 3 ticks of cyclone (46dmg)
3 - 1 cyclone tick + 5 kicks + the first damage frame of the 6th kick (46dmg)

Assuming every single input is frame-perfect...

(1) takes (18*5) + 11 = [b]101 frames[/b] (11 instead of 18 on the last one because you dont need to wait until neutral state, just until that last damage tick)

(2) takes (18*3) + 1 + (7*2) + 18 + 11 = [b]98 frames[/b] (remember the 1st tick of cyclone only takes a single frame from input, and you can input Attack on the same frame you damage something)

(3) takes (18*3) + 1 + (18*2) + 6 = [b]97 frames[/b]

So, functionally, under normal circumstances, all those strats are equal, what with there being only 0.07s between them.
Realistically though, because of what we're fucking doing to this stage, you wanna kick 3 times, then do the fastest cyclone/kick you possibly can, then kick 2 more times.

Chromatrope

2015-11-17 03:24:20 am

Wait, what input was that again?

Jesus christ, I leave for two weeks and suddenly everyone is making sweet sweet love to FD1?! Holy shit this is insane. I do suppose that with all of the pace segmentation with the teleporters it is easier to do the execution well on this stage than on more open stages, but wow, 6+ seconds of improvement in the last few weeks is insane! I'm gonna need to learn FD1 now before it's too late, LMAO.

Mylexsi

2015-11-17 03:48:44 pm

Quote from Chromatrope:

Jesus christ, I leave for two weeks and suddenly everyone is making sweet sweet love to FD1?! Holy shit this is insane. I do suppose that with all of the pace segmentation with the teleporters it is easier to do the execution well on this stage than on more open stages, but wow, 6+ seconds of improvement in the last few weeks is insane! I'm gonna need to learn FD1 now before it's too late, LMAO.

NO. DOn't touch it. It's a black hole from which there is no return.
You play a bit and maybe you get a decent time
but its not good enough
and it's been like 5 hours
but
you're so close
just a few more attempts
goddamn that one almost had it but you choked on the boss
well now your willpower is renewed
but it's like 3am
not that you've noticed
doesn't matter
you're close
...just a few more...

Chromatrope

2015-11-18 01:28:00 am

Wait, what input was that again?

Basically what happened to me in Dragon Valley the last few weeks. Done the beginning perfectly and fully skipped the ladder even? Perfect jumpdives over the bumps? Ant fight gone right? Single-cycle miniboss? Good, now you either mysteriously screw up the high uppercut, miss the ceiling walk or miss the cyclone launch, but never more than one. Then, I curse to the gods and start it up again.

I have yet to have a single attempt where one of these did not mysteriously go wrong, and it's probably been like 50+ hours on just Dragon Valley already.

Also, I am never playing the non-Steam version of the game again, lost a PB to cloud sync.