Final Fantasy VIII

2005-11-08 04:26:43 pm

King of hearts

Been away for a while because of school. Just to let everyone know this run isn't dead. I have two days off this week so I'll be able to do a lot.

InsipidMuckyWater

2005-11-08 06:25:28 pm

Visit my profile to see my runs!

May the fates bless you. It's always nice to see a run resurrected. Grin

darkwasabi

2005-11-13 05:25:20 am

King of hearts

Now that I'm encoding this myself, would you guys accept this run? I've read in your FAQ that the reason you don't accept runs past 7 hours is because it takes a hell of a long time to encode something this long. So... other than it not really being a normal run, why not?

If not, could someone tell me how I would submit this to archive.org. The FAQ says to ask in a forum for things that are multiple video files. I've asked there and Radix37 (is that Radix from here? if so that wouldn't really make sence...) posted a link to a FAQ to this place...

Radix

2005-11-13 06:11:32 am

I'm addicted to games

You asked how to submit a run to archive's run collection. I gave you the answer... submit it here.

If it doesn't belong here it won't go there. If you submit it to archive yourself it ends up in "open source movies".

The reason for the 7 hour limit has little to do with encoding times. It's interest. I doubt very much people are going to want to watch 7+ hour runs unless it's a VERY well liked game with lots of action.

Pweisger

2005-11-13 06:30:10 am

PwNzRd!

Like FF7... damnit...

InsipidMuckyWater

2005-11-13 07:16:00 am

Visit my profile to see my runs!

It's alright, Pweisger, someday... someday...

darkwasabi

2005-11-13 10:34:40 am

King of hearts

So then why did you give me a link to this place even though you already said it wouldn't be accepted? That just didn't make sence to me...

Either way, I think your rules of making the limit down to 7 hours is pretty dumb.

First, the InternetArchive stated how it's speedrun section is for the purpose of archiving the fastest way to beat a game, not setting an arbitrary limit of 7 hours to any game that can't be beaten within those parameters.

Second, FF8 is a very poplular game and I think it would be a great addition to a speedrun archive site. Just because the game is not as popular as its predecessor, doesn't mean it isn't popular.

Third, you said you didn't base your approval of speedruns based on popularity. There are many unpopular games in your archive, but you are only complaining about this one. I've yet to see any correlation between run time, and the number of downloads for any run. In fact, if the run gets more than 300 downloads total, that would be more than enough to make it's file size to download ratio justifiable, as compared to some other runs.

Fourth, rules such as attaining a specific goal should be varied from game to game. Different games have different situations and should be accounted as such.

My complaint is that even if my run was a normal run, you still wouldn't have accepted it. So far you have 2 runs surpassing that arbitrary limit, even though my run would be 2 hours more, it is still only a small percentage more than 7 hours. I understand that there should be limits, but those rules should be flexible allowing acceptions in different situations. Your usage of the words, "but if things are slightly longer and still interesting they will be posted" is very broad and I feel that my run would fit into that category. If not, then please be more specific to prevent ambiguity.

Take this post any way you want. I'm not here to argue. But I've put a lot of effort and time into this run, and I just think a great game such as this should have a speedrun if someone makes it.

So then why did you give me a link to this place even though you already said it wouldn't be accepted?  That just didn't make sence to me...

Either way, I think your rules of making the limit down to 7 hours is pretty dumb.

First, the InternetArchive stated how it's speedrun section is for the purpose of archiving the fastest way to beat a game, not setting an arbitrary limit of 7 hours to any game that can't be beaten within those parameters.

Second, FF8 is a very poplular game and I think it would be a great addition to a speedrun archive site.  Just because the game is not as popular as its predecessor, doesn't mean it isn't popular.

Third, you said you didn't base your approval of speedruns based on popularity.  There are many unpopular games in your archive, but you are only complaining about this one.  I've yet to see any correlation between run time, and the number of downloads for any run.  In fact, if the run gets more than 300 downloads total, that would be more than enough to make it's file size to download ratio justifiable, as compared to some other runs.

Fourth, rules such as attaining a specific goal should be varied from game to game.  Different games have different situations and should be accounted as such.

My complaint is that even if my run was a normal run, you still wouldn't have accepted it.  So far you have 2 runs surpassing that arbitrary limit, even though my run would be 2 hours more, it is still only a small percentage more than 7 hours.  I understand that there should be limits,  but those rules should be flexible allowing acceptions in different situations.  Your usage of the words, "but if things are slightly longer and still interesting they will be posted" is very broad and I feel that my run would fit into that category.  If not, then please be more specific to prevent ambiguity.

Take this post any way you want.  I'm not here to argue.  But I've put a lot of effort and time into this run, and I just think a great game such as this should have a speedrun if someone makes it.

Radix

Edit history:

Radix: 2005-11-13 12:26:23 pm

2005-11-13 12:25:57 pm

I'm addicted to games

Quote:

So then why did you give me a link to this place even though you already said it wouldn't be accepted? That just didn't make sence to me...

You asked at archive how to submit a speed run. I told you to submit it here. You did not say in your post at archive that it is not a "normal" run or that it was already discussed here. How was I to know from your post there that it had already been discussed here?

Quote:

Either way, I think your rules of making the limit down to 7 hours is pretty dumb.

So you think I should take a 40 hour run of some game that takes that long to beat? Sure bud.

Quote:

Second, FF8 is a very poplular game and I think it would be a great addition to a speedrun archive site. Just because the game is not as popular as its predecessor, doesn't mean it isn't popular.

Then do a normal run.

Quote:

Third, you said you didn't base your approval of speedruns based on popularity. There are many unpopular games in your archive, but you are only complaining about this one. I've yet to see any correlation between run time, and the number of downloads for any run. In fact, if the run gets more than 300 downloads total, that would be more than enough to make it's file size to download ratio justifiable, as compared to some other runs.

I dont know where you think I said that but I didn't. The runs are certainly posted based on popularity. There have been several cases of runs done on games that after months, nobody shows any interest in and there are no verifiers, so they get dumped.

For runs over the limit it is even more crucial to find a lot of people I think will give a damn, otherwise it's simply not worth my time.

Quote:

I understand that there should be limits

You said yourself you thought a limit was dumb.

[quote]So then why did you give me a link to this place even though you already said it wouldn't be accepted?  That just didn't make sence to me...[/quote]

You asked at archive how to submit a speed run. I told you to submit it here. You did not say in your post at archive that it is not a "normal" run or that it was already discussed here. How was I to know from your post there that it had already been discussed here?

[quote]Either way, I think your rules of making the limit down to 7 hours is pretty dumb.[/quote]

So you think I should take a 40 hour run of some game that takes that long to beat? Sure bud.

[quote]Second, FF8 is a very poplular game and I think it would be a great addition to a speedrun archive site.  Just because the game is not as popular as its predecessor, doesn't mean it isn't popular.[/quote]

Then do a normal run.

[quote]Third, you said you didn't base your approval of speedruns based on popularity.  There are many unpopular games in your archive, but you are only complaining about this one.  I've yet to see any correlation between run time, and the number of downloads for any run.  In fact, if the run gets more than 300 downloads total, that would be more than enough to make it's file size to download ratio justifiable, as compared to some other runs.[/quote]

I dont know where you think I said that but I didn't. The runs are certainly posted based on popularity. There have been several cases of runs done on games that after months, nobody shows any interest in and there are no verifiers, so they get dumped.

For runs over the limit it is even more crucial to find a lot of people I think will give a damn, otherwise it's simply not worth my time.

[quote]I understand that there should be limits[/quote]

You said yourself you thought a limit was dumb.

darkwasabi

2005-11-13 04:08:13 pm

King of hearts

Quote:

You said yourself you thought a limit was dumb.

I said how making an arbitrary limit and not letting it be a flexible rule is dumb, not setting a limit. I was up writing that at 5 in the morning so I guess it wasn't clear, sorry about that.

Quote:

Then do a normal run.

As I've said before, a normal run would not be as interesting as the Omega one. I could do both, I really want to do the Omega run, but the differences between the runs would be so small that it would be pointless to have two separate ones.

Since the diffference only occurs from a certain point in Disk 3 onwards, I thought that the run could just disjunction from that point to one file continuing a normal run, and the other using that save file to continue the Omega run. It would be pointless to have doubles of the exact same run up until that point. That's what I meant in my earlier posts saying that I would include a file for beating the final boss. I end a segment at that point normally anyway. Would this be acceptable?

[quote]
You said yourself you thought a limit was dumb.[/quote]

I said how making an arbitrary limit and not letting it be a flexible rule is dumb, not setting a limit.  I was up writing that at 5 in the morning so I guess it wasn't clear, sorry about that.

[quote] 
Then do a normal run. [/quote]

As I've said before, a normal run would not be as interesting as the Omega one.  I could do both, I really want to do the Omega run, but the differences between the runs would be so small that it would be pointless to have two separate ones.

Since the diffference only occurs from a certain point in Disk 3 onwards, I thought that the run could just disjunction from that point to one file continuing a normal run, and the other using that save file to continue the Omega run.  It would be pointless to have doubles of the exact same run up until that point.  That's what I meant in my earlier posts saying that I would include a file for beating the final boss.  I end a segment at that point normally anyway.  Would this be acceptable?

Pweisger

2005-11-14 02:24:09 am

PwNzRd!

The argument intensifies...

darkwasabi

2005-11-14 03:06:37 am

King of hearts

I dissagree! It is a productive discussion! As I've said before, I'm not here to argue.

But Radix, what do you think about the split off point in the run. Ok, or no? Because I haven't seen any runs that do that, but the suggestion isn't really a bad one since I can't think of any reason why not.

dennis20014

2005-11-14 03:21:35 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Yea I'm all for this, ff8 is my fav. I'm currently watching the Kalak FFx Project, and it's awesome! It's not really the fastest but it's surely entertaining, I know this site is to host speed runs, but I'd rather watch it than see how fast someone can beat it, I mean if you want that, I'd just watch a minute of the person showing the in game clock or something you know? But thats just me I don't want to start a heated argument. Hope this and FF7 come soon! Grin

Nikuvilin

2005-11-14 08:54:30 am

DMC3,ZOE2 and Xenosaga 2.  Am I crazy?

I hope the omega run is accepted. I never had the skills to beat him. ( I didn´t check any FAQs). I could even verify it. If Radix accepts.

Lag.Com

2005-11-14 08:59:31 am

sda loyalist

There is some precedent to this; see the Majora's Mask page, where the 'first cycle' need not be recorded. This is presumably because it would be pretty similar for all players. Smiley

illuminated

2005-11-14 06:49:13 pm

I've never seen the omega portion be beaten, i did the ultima weapon but then again who hasn't? i would look foward to seeing this run as well.

Left Ventricle

2005-11-15 07:35:01 am

Right aorta

May I offer something? darkwasabi, I'd advise against taking Radix on on this subject. SDA is owned by him, and as with any private organization, he has the right to allow or disallow any content he so chooses. He picked seven hours as the limit for a reason, which he stated before. And I can agree with it, since I found myself almost falling asleep watching TSA's Wind Waker run (no offense TSA, it was a great run) which is 6h46m long. Granted, I would watch an FF8 run with great interest, but it boils down to what Radix decides. Even if he doesn't want to post it, you can always upload it to archive and post the link here.

darkwasabi

2005-11-15 12:52:31 pm

King of hearts

I know that. It's just that, well, it isn't the same... I love this site and I was really looking forward to having this posted up. That's why I'm trying hard. I think that Radix really is underestimating the popularity of this game. Many people say it isn't as good as *insert Final Fantasy game here*, but that doesn't mean they don't like it. It's like comparing apples and oranges. Heck, FFVII is my fourth favorite one (for me, from best down is 8, 10, 9, 7), but I still like the game a lot.

Lag.Com

2005-11-15 01:04:48 pm

sda loyalist

Argh! The popularity is not a huge issue here; yes, a run of Final Fantasy VIII is likely to go up, even if it is 'around' the 7 hour mark. But an Omega battle is not part of a speedrun. It's an impressive undertaking, but not suitable for display on SDA. Ask sdkess.

Radix

2005-11-15 03:00:19 pm

I'm addicted to games

To answer the other question, if you do a normal run and include a few alternate parts for the end where you do whatever it is you want to do extra to make it slower, that can be included as "bonus material". It's only been done once so far, with super metroid any% (no murder beam) and it would pretty much be a footnote.

darkwasabi

2005-11-15 10:25:44 pm

King of hearts

Cool! This is very much appreciated!

On a side note, the run's been kinda slow, but good because I've been optimizing the save points. Damn card battles were annoying because the cards the opponents use are not random. I've found out that once you load up a save and go face a person, they use one of the preselected bunch of hands. There's no way I can see how to change this without wasting time so I stuck with them. What sucked was that niether the Quistis nor Zell card was ever in their first hand, but my previous run did. I've had so much practice that I could have easily beaten them on the first hand, even with the crap I have. I end up getting them on their second hand.

Radix

2005-11-15 11:31:18 pm

I'm addicted to games

No annoying animated avatars. Especailly ones that are 160 KB.

darkwasabi

2005-11-18 05:02:20 am

King of hearts

Quote:

No annoying animated avatars. Especailly ones that are 160 KB.

Ok, but TSA has a gif that's 200 kB. I know he's been here longer but what the hell, that's not fair.

darkwasabi

2005-11-21 08:27:15 pm

King of hearts

Ok, this sucks. I have to restart the whole run because of something I forgot. I'm a complete moron.

Good news is that things will move along much quicker since I've gotten used to the "random" encounters and how to make them work for me. The card battles will be a breeze too. I've also come up with an alternate route for getting the cards so there will be no backtracking, might save a minute. I'm hoping to finish this before Thanksgiving break ends and start on Dark Cloud 1/2 to see if they're doable.

Varilion

2005-11-22 01:18:11 am

Speedruns 4-ever...

What did you forget, that is so important that you have to start over the run?

darkwasabi

2005-11-22 01:37:30 am

King of hearts

The Occult Fan, without it I don't have enough money to get on the train to Delling City.