Baldur's Gate 2 Finished

2008-12-05 09:43:13 am

Quote from ExplodingCabbage:

Quote from Smilge:

Feeblemind should be quicker, as I can't dialog him while I'm shapeshifted.

No, but someone else in the party can.

And meanwhile, Jaheira (or Minsc) can bless and chant you to help the THAC0 and maybe Imoen can hit you with improved haste from a scroll (if you have more than 1 attack per round in mindflayer form and if it would save more time than it would take to put the scroll in the quick item slot).

Another idea - look up the mindflayer attack in NearInfinity if you know how (I don't) and see if it uses a proficiency.

Hah, yeah I forgot I'd have party members. I'll do more research when I get home from work.

ExplodingCabbage

Edit history:

ExplodingCabbage: 2008-12-05 02:57:08 pm

2008-12-05 01:51:42 pm

Also, can't you use the mindflayer's psionic blast, or have Imoen cast web, to paralyse Gaelan so every attack hits?

Edit: Oh wait. I forgot about his uber saves.

Smilge

2008-12-05 06:34:41 pm

Having another party member talk lock him works well enough. Mind flayers form gets 3 or 4 attacks per round (not sure because of haste effects). I can improved invisibility to get a bonus 4 to my THAC0, and an improved haste would make it take no time at all.

I'm really happy with how quick I was moving through the quests for Bohdi. I think it will save about 2 or 3 minutes off the current run. Quite possibly more.

ExplodingCabbage

2008-12-05 08:52:48 pm

Quote from Smilge:

Having another party member talk lock him works well enough. Mind flayers form gets 3 or 4 attacks per round (not sure because of haste effects). I can improved invisibility to get a bonus 4 to my THAC0, and an improved haste would make it take no time at all.

I'm really happy with how quick I was moving through the quests for Bohdi. I think it will save about 2 or 3 minutes off the current run. Quite possibly more.

Guesses as to the final time you'll get?

Also - you sure improved invisibility boosts THAC0? I thought it was just meant to boost AC - and that doesn't actually work without Baldurdash installed.

Also - did you solve the problem of getting enough oils of speed? Although, I was thinking - if you get the Robe Of Vecna, you'll be able to cast haste instantly which I think will actually be QUICKER than using an oil of speed (just from what I've observed, potions seem to not be drunk instantly but have a short 'casting time' equivalent to that of a magic missile.

I don't understand why nobody's bought the Robe Of Vecna in runs before. It's bound to be a timesaver.

Also, I decided to tot up the total time saved with new routes and strategies to guesstimate the total run time you might acheive. I reckon I've probably estimated everything to a fair degree of accuracy, apart from chapter 3 which I don't really know much about yet. I've also added a new possible timesaver, and assumed it will work because it seems likely - skipping the cutscene that happens after you summon the avatar. My estimations are below; see if you think they're reasonable:

Different route to mistress's room: -20 seconds
Killing Mephit Portals: +40 seconds
Skipping cutscene in Promenade: -1 minute 45 seconds
Alternate Route for Chapter 3: Unknown at this point
Sending an NPC thief to pickpocket the gnome, saving backtracking: -45 seconds
Faster takedown of Bodhi: -5 seconds
Using a party member to stake Bodhi: -5 seconds
Use of party members gathering items in Suldanesslar: -30 seconds (wild guess, I don't know the level that well and there's all sorts of complications because you'll probably have to remove some people from the party so you can go fight the dragon, and then pick them up again on the way back to use against Irenicus)
Killing Irenicus's Dragon: -25 seconds
Cutscene skip after summoning Avatar?: -15 seconds if possible
Using party members to kill elemental guardians: -1 minute
Skull Trapping Irenicus in the tree: -40 seconds
One tear trick: -2 minutes 10 seconds
Traps to kill Irenicus instead of brain sucking: -20 seconds

Time wasted faffing around with reforming the party, resurrecting people, and such things: +30 seconds

Total time saved: 7:10 + savings on chapter 3
I reckon you can knock off 5 minutes on Chapter 3, which means you could possibly nail the run in just under half an hour.

[quote="Smilge"]
Having another party member talk lock him works well enough. Mind flayers form gets 3 or 4 attacks per round (not sure because of haste effects). I can improved invisibility to get a bonus 4 to my THAC0, and an improved haste would make it take no time at all.

I'm really happy with how quick I was moving through the quests for Bohdi. I think it will save about 2 or 3 minutes off the current run. Quite possibly more.
[/quote]

Guesses as to the final time you'll get?

Also - you sure improved invisibility boosts THAC0? I thought it was just meant to boost AC - and that doesn't actually work without Baldurdash installed.

Also - did you solve the problem of getting enough oils of speed? Although, I was thinking - if you get the Robe Of Vecna, you'll be able to cast haste instantly which I think will actually be QUICKER than using an oil of speed (just from what I've observed, potions seem to not be drunk instantly but have a short 'casting time' equivalent to that of a magic missile.

I don't understand why nobody's bought the Robe Of Vecna in runs before. It's bound to be a timesaver.

Also, I decided to tot up the total time saved with new routes and strategies to guesstimate the total run time you might acheive. I reckon I've probably estimated everything to a fair degree of accuracy, apart from chapter 3 which I don't really know much about yet. I've also added a new possible timesaver, and assumed it will work because it seems likely - skipping the cutscene that happens after you summon the avatar. My estimations are below; see if you think they're reasonable:

Different route to mistress's room: -20 seconds
Killing Mephit Portals: +40 seconds
Skipping cutscene in Promenade: -1 minute 45 seconds
Alternate Route for Chapter 3: Unknown at this point
Sending an NPC thief to pickpocket the gnome, saving backtracking: -45 seconds
Faster takedown of Bodhi: -5 seconds
Using a party member to stake Bodhi: -5 seconds
Use of party members gathering items in Suldanesslar: -30 seconds (wild guess, I don't know the level that well and there's all sorts of complications because you'll probably have to remove some people from the party so you can go fight the dragon, and then pick them up again on the way back to use against Irenicus)
Killing Irenicus's Dragon: -25 seconds
Cutscene skip after summoning Avatar?: -15 seconds if possible
Using party members to kill elemental guardians: -1 minute
Skull Trapping Irenicus in the tree: -40 seconds
One tear trick: -2 minutes 10 seconds
Traps to kill Irenicus instead of brain sucking: -20 seconds

Time wasted faffing around with reforming the party, resurrecting people, and such things: +30 seconds

Total time saved: 7:10 + savings on chapter 3
I reckon you can knock off 5 minutes on Chapter 3, which means you could possibly nail the run in just under half an hour.

ExplodingCabbage

2008-12-05 09:02:37 pm

Chapter 3 related stuff:
* What do you find if you kill Gaelan for his key and go to the Shadow Thief basement in Chapter 1 or 2 without having allied with either side?
* Once you've allied with Bodhi, do you have to wait to be ordered to kill Aran before he appears, or can you do it whilst in the guildhouse on the other quest there?

Smilge

Edit history:

Smilge: 2008-12-06 09:02:49 am

2008-12-05 10:13:24 pm

Quote from ExplodingCabbage:

* What do you find if you kill Gaelan for his key and go to the Shadow Thief basement in Chapter 1 or 2 without having allied with either side?

As soon as you pick up the key off his corpse, the combat log says "Journal Updated: Chapter 3" but the Chapter variable stays on 2. When I go to Aran Linvail, he talks as if I've paid the money and allied with the shadow thieves. The problem here is that Bohdi won't appear with the lanthorn until chapter 6. The graveyard tombs will be the map that had Lassal.

Quote from ExplodingCabbage:

* Once you've allied with Bodhi, do you have to wait to be ordered to kill Aran before he appears, or can you do it whilst in the guildhouse on the other quest there?

You can kill Aran at any time, but she won't give you the quest or let you turn it in until you've completed the first two. DAMURDOC's strategy was getting the package from Mook, turning that quest in to Bohdi, then going to the guildhall and killing the escort quest guy and killing Aran, then turning both of them in back at bohdi.

Quote from ExplodingCabbage:

Also - you sure improved invisibility boosts THAC0? I thought it was just meant to boost AC - and that doesn't actually work without Baldurdash installed.

Improved invisibility is *meant* to boost AC and saving throws. In reality it does neither and boosts THAC0 instead. This is with ToB installed and all the latest official patches. If it's a bug with my computer or game and not anyone elses, let me know. I'd hate to be rejected for a corrupted file.

Quote from ExplodingCabbage:

I don't understand why nobody's bought the Robe Of Vecna in runs before. It's bound to be a timesaver.

Nobody's had the Robe of Venca merchant around. It's a big time saver and I plan to buy it.

I would be thrilled with a sub 30 minute run, but it's too early for me to really take a good guess. Those times look reasonable for sure, but who really knows Smiley

Since we're mostly discussing the segmented run, I'll lay out what I've got so far. Question marks mean I'm not sure of the true viability.

Chapter 1:
Grab Jaheria, Minsc.
?(Jump into mistresses room)?
Pick up Yoshimo, kill mephits.
Skip cutscene.
Save time on the surface by sending party members to different merchants.
Hit the Slums.

Chapter 2:
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Kill off some party members if possible.
Ally with bohdi.

Chapter 3:
Steal the package from mook.
Get my party members to die somehow around here.
Return to Bohdi.
Kill escort guy.
Kill Aran.
Remaining party members should die here.
Go to bohdi; spellhold

Chapter 4:
Jump to underdark.

Chapter 5:
Steal/kill gnome for light gem, kick out that member. (Leaves me with 2 or 3 bodies. Imoen, ?[yoshimo]?, jahiera/minsc)
Surface

Chapter 6:
Jump to Bohdi.
Stake and kick a member (leaves me with 1 or 2 bodies. Imoen, ?[Yoshimo]?)

Chapter 7:
Send my one or two people around collecting things. Gotta work on the specifics of this.
Kill the dragon (somehow)
?Skip the cutscene with the Avatar? I put this in question marks because skipping cut scenes is REALLY hard. It's a matter of milliseconds. I suppose I'd have to do it in a segmented run though.

Tree:
Send my people to lay traps for parasites if they can. Mabye do some backstabbing. Should work on this when I know who I'll have and what level they'll be.
Skull trap Irenicus, would be a good job for imoen if she turns out to be useless for traps/killing.

Hell:
Get a tear, not exactly sure what's quickest.
Lay a bunch of traps.
Win.

Single Segment run would be more like this:

Chapter 1:
Grab Jaheria, Minsc.
~~?(Jump into mistresses room)?~~
Pick up Yoshimo, kill mephits.
~~Skip cutscene.~~
Save time on the surface by sending party members to different merchants.
Hit the Slums.

Chapter 2:
Ally with Bayle.
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Kill off some party members if possible.
Ally with bohdi.

Chapter 3:
Send one party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 2)
~~Steal the package from mook.~~
Kill mook
Send one party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 1)
Go to bridge district kill traitors.
Send last party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 0)
Kill vampires
Get party members back at Aran (hopefully)
Go to spellhold
Get my party members to die somehow around here.
Return to Bohdi.
Kill escort guy.
Kill Aran.
Remaining party members should die here.
Go to bohdi; spellhold

Chapter 4:
Jump to underdark.
Party members can be left to die from vampires or something. They're better as bodies.

Chapter 5:
Steal/kill gnome for light gem, kick out that member. (Leaves me with ~~2 or 3~~ 1 or 2 bodies. ~~Imoen~~, ?[yoshimo]?, jahiera/minsc)
Surface

Chapter 6:
Have Drizzit kill Bohdi.
Jump to Bohdi.
Stake and kick a member (leaves me with 1 or 2 bodies. Imoen, ?[Yoshimo]?)

Chapter 7:
Send my one or two people around collecting things. Gotta work on the specifics of this.
Bribe the Dragon
Kill the dragon (somehow)
?Skip the cutscene with the Avatar? I put this in question marks because skipping cut scenes is REALLY hard. It's a matter of milliseconds. I suppose I'd have to do it in a segmented run though.

Tree:
Send my people to lay traps for parasites if they can. Mabye do some backstabbing. Should work on this when I know who I'll have and what level they'll be.
~~Skull trap Irenicus, would be a good job for imoen if she turns out to be useless for traps/killing.~~
Classic Cloudkill unless skull trap proves reliable.

Hell:
Get a tear, not exactly sure what's quickest.
~~Lay a bunch of traps.~~
Mind flayer Time stop, as in current run.
Win.

[quote="ExplodingCabbage"]
* What do you find if you kill Gaelan for his key and go to the Shadow Thief basement in Chapter 1 or 2 without having allied with either side?
[/quote]
As soon as you pick up the key off his corpse, the combat log says "Journal Updated: Chapter 3" but the Chapter variable stays on 2. When I go to Aran Linvail, he talks as if I've paid the money and allied with the shadow thieves. The problem here is that Bohdi won't appear with the lanthorn until chapter 6. The graveyard tombs will be the map that had Lassal.

[quote="ExplodingCabbage"]
* Once you've allied with Bodhi, do you have to wait to be ordered to kill Aran before he appears, or can you do it whilst in the guildhouse on the other quest there?
[/quote]
You can kill Aran at any time, but she won't give you the quest or let you turn it in until you've completed the first two. DAMURDOC's strategy was getting the package from Mook, turning that quest in to Bohdi, then going to the guildhall and killing the escort quest guy and killing Aran, then turning both of them in back at bohdi.

[quote="ExplodingCabbage"]
Also - you sure improved invisibility boosts THAC0? I thought it was just meant to boost AC - and that doesn't actually work without Baldurdash installed.[/quote]
Improved invisibility is *meant* to boost AC and saving throws. In reality it does neither and boosts THAC0 instead. This is with ToB installed and all the latest official patches. If it's a bug with my computer or game and not anyone elses, let me know. I'd hate to be rejected for a corrupted file.

[quote="ExplodingCabbage"]
I don't understand why nobody's bought the Robe Of Vecna in runs before. It's bound to be a timesaver.
[/quote]
Nobody's had the Robe of Venca merchant around. It's a big time saver and I plan to buy it.

I would be thrilled with a sub 30 minute run, but it's too early for me to really take a good guess. Those times look reasonable for sure, but who really knows :)

Since we're mostly discussing the segmented run, I'll lay out what I've got so far. Question marks mean I'm not sure of the true viability.

Chapter 1: 
Grab Jaheria, Minsc.
?(Jump into mistresses room)?
Pick up Yoshimo, kill mephits.
Skip cutscene.
Save time on the surface by sending party members to different merchants.
Hit the Slums.

Chapter 2:
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Kill off some party members if possible.
Ally with bohdi.

Chapter 3:
Steal the package from mook.
Get my party members to die somehow around here.
Return to Bohdi.
Kill escort guy.
Kill Aran.
Remaining party members should die here.
Go to bohdi; spellhold

Chapter 4:
Jump to underdark.

Chapter 5:
Steal/kill gnome for light gem, kick out that member. (Leaves me with 2 or 3 bodies. Imoen, ?[yoshimo]?, jahiera/minsc)
Surface

Chapter 6:
Jump to Bohdi.
Stake and kick a member (leaves me with 1 or 2 bodies. Imoen, ?[Yoshimo]?)

Chapter 7:
Send my one or two people around collecting things. Gotta work on the specifics of this.
Kill the dragon (somehow)
?Skip the cutscene with the Avatar? I put this in question marks because skipping cut scenes is REALLY hard. It's a matter of milliseconds. I suppose I'd have to do it in a segmented run though.

Tree:
Send my people to lay traps for parasites if they can. Mabye do some backstabbing. Should work on this when I know who I'll have and what level they'll be.
Skull trap Irenicus, would be a good job for imoen if she turns out to be useless for traps/killing.

Hell:
Get a tear, not exactly sure what's quickest.
Lay a bunch of traps.
Win.

Single Segment run would be more like this:

Chapter 1: 
Grab Jaheria, Minsc.
[s]?(Jump into mistresses room)?[/s]
Pick up Yoshimo, kill mephits.
[s]Skip cutscene.[/s]
Save time on the surface by sending party members to different merchants.
Hit the Slums.

Chapter 2:
Ally with Bayle.
[s]Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Kill off some party members if possible.
Ally with bohdi.[/s]

Chapter 3:
Send one party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 2)
[s]Steal the package from mook.[/s]
Kill mook
Send one party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 1)
Go to bridge district kill traitors.
Send last party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 0)
Kill vampires
Get party members back at Aran (hopefully)
Go to spellhold
[s]Get my party members to die somehow around here.
Return to Bohdi.
Kill escort guy.
Kill Aran.
Remaining party members should die here.
Go to bohdi; spellhold[/s]

Chapter 4:
Jump to underdark.
Party members can be left to die from vampires or something. They're better as bodies.

Chapter 5:
Steal/kill gnome for light gem, kick out that member. (Leaves me with [s]2 or 3[/s] 1 or 2 bodies. [s]Imoen[/s], ?[yoshimo]?, jahiera/minsc)
Surface

Chapter 6:
Have Drizzit kill Bohdi.
[s]Jump to Bohdi.
Stake and kick a member (leaves me with 1 or 2 bodies. Imoen, ?[Yoshimo]?)[/s]

Chapter 7:
Send my one or two people around collecting things. Gotta work on the specifics of this.
Bribe the Dragon
[s]Kill the dragon (somehow)
?Skip the cutscene with the Avatar? I put this in question marks because skipping cut scenes is REALLY hard. It's a matter of milliseconds. I suppose I'd have to do it in a segmented run though.[/s]

Tree:
Send my people to lay traps for parasites if they can. Mabye do some backstabbing. Should work on this when I know who I'll have and what level they'll be.
[s]Skull trap Irenicus, would be a good job for imoen if she turns out to be useless for traps/killing.[/s]
Classic Cloudkill unless skull trap proves reliable.

Hell:
Get a tear, not exactly sure what's quickest.
[s]Lay a bunch of traps.[/s]
Mind flayer Time stop, as in current run.
Win.

ronrab

2008-12-06 10:13:47 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Wouldn't bribing the dragon (even if you use the trick of dropping everything you need first) be strictly quicker than fighting it? I can't imagine any strategy technique that will get you out of there faster than just saying 'ok, take all my stuff'. It's not like your strategy for the rest of the run needs any money ...

ExplodingCabbage

2008-12-06 12:01:43 pm

Ideas:

Quote:

Chapter 1:
Grab Jaheria, Minsc.
?(Jump into mistresses room)?
Pick up Yoshimo, kill mephits.

Do we actually need to do this? I don't know whether Familiars can be ordered to leave an area; if they can, couldn't you take your familiar into your pack, jump the door by polymorph, letting your party die, then let your familiar out near the exit, order your character to talk to the familiar and then send the familiar out so that you start the conversation with it right as you leave the area?

Quote:

Skip cutscene.
Save time on the surface by sending party members to different merchants.

On reflection, I doubt this will actually save time. Remember you need to boot them from the party so you can get into the Adventurer's Mart, and the time spent kicking them out of the party and taking them back in again probably outweighs the tiny amount of walking time saved.

Quote:

Hit the Slums.

Chapter 2:
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Kill off some party members if possible.
Ally with bohdi.

Chapter 3:
Steal the package from mook.
Get my party members to die somehow around here.
Return to Bohdi.
Kill escort guy.
Kill Aran.
Remaining party members should die here.
Go to bohdi; spellhold

Suggestion for an alternative route for Chapters 2/3, which only works if the Mook on the Shadow Thief quest has the package on her corpse (I can't remember):
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Go to Guildhall; get the first Shadow Thief quest from Aran
Kill aran
Kill Mook and take the package
Ally with Bodhi and give her the package
Kill escort guy
Return to Bodhi
Spellhold

I'm not sure if this is possible, and if so I'm not sure if it's quicker.[/quote]

Quote:

Chapter 4:
Jump to underdark.

Chapter 5:
Steal/kill gnome for light gem, kick out that member. (Leaves me with 2 or 3 bodies. Imoen, ?[yoshimo]?, jahiera/minsc)
Surface

Chapter 6:
Jump to Bohdi.
Stake and kick a member (leaves me with 1 or 2 bodies. Imoen, ?[Yoshimo]?)

Why kick them? Just arrange for them to die in some way and keep a body.

Quote:

Chapter 7:
Send my one or two people around collecting things. Gotta work on the specifics of this.
Kill the dragon (somehow)
?Skip the cutscene with the Avatar? I put this in question marks because skipping cut scenes is REALLY hard. It's a matter of milliseconds. I suppose I'd have to do it in a segmented run though.

Tree:
Send my people to lay traps for parasites if they can. Mabye do some backstabbing. Should work on this when I know who I'll have and what level they'll be.

I think Cowled Wizards drop Horrid Wilting scrolls. That might be the quickest way to take down the elementals? Or does the damage depend on level? You could also get a Wail Of The Banshee in there from a Limited Wish scroll, not sure what the odds of success are.

Quote:

Skull trap Irenicus, would be a good job for imoen if she turns out to be useless for traps/killing.

Hell:
Get a tear, not exactly sure what's quickest.
Lay a bunch of traps.
Win.

Sounds awesome.

Ideas:

[quote]Chapter 1: 
Grab Jaheria, Minsc.
?(Jump into mistresses room)?
Pick up Yoshimo, kill mephits.[/quote]

Do we actually need to do this? I don't know whether Familiars can be ordered to leave an area; if they can, couldn't you take your familiar into your pack, jump the door by polymorph, letting your party die, then let your familiar out near the exit, order your character to talk to the familiar and then send the familiar out so that you start the conversation with it right as you leave the area?

[quote]Skip cutscene.
Save time on the surface by sending party members to different merchants.[/quote]

On reflection, I doubt this will actually save time. Remember you need to boot them from the party so you can get into the Adventurer's Mart, and the time spent kicking them out of the party and taking them back in again probably outweighs the tiny amount of walking time saved.

[quote]Hit the Slums.

Chapter 2:
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Kill off some party members if possible.
Ally with bohdi.

Chapter 3:
Steal the package from mook.
Get my party members to die somehow around here.
Return to Bohdi.
Kill escort guy.
Kill Aran.
Remaining party members should die here.
Go to bohdi; spellhold
[/quote]

Suggestion for an alternative route for Chapters 2/3, which only works if the Mook on the Shadow Thief quest has the package on her corpse (I can't remember):
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Go to Guildhall; get the first Shadow Thief quest from Aran
Kill aran
Kill Mook and take the package
Ally with Bodhi and give her the package
Kill escort guy
Return to Bodhi
Spellhold

I'm not sure if this is possible, and if so I'm not sure if it's quicker.[/quote]

[quote]Chapter 4:
Jump to underdark.

Chapter 5:
Steal/kill gnome for light gem, kick out that member. (Leaves me with 2 or 3 bodies. Imoen, ?[yoshimo]?, jahiera/minsc)
Surface

Chapter 6:
Jump to Bohdi.
Stake and kick a member (leaves me with 1 or 2 bodies. Imoen, ?[Yoshimo]?)[/quote]
Why kick them? Just arrange for them to die in some way and keep a body.

[quote]Chapter 7:
Send my one or two people around collecting things. Gotta work on the specifics of this.
Kill the dragon (somehow)
?Skip the cutscene with the Avatar? I put this in question marks because skipping cut scenes is REALLY hard. It's a matter of milliseconds. I suppose I'd have to do it in a segmented run though.

Tree:
Send my people to lay traps for parasites if they can. Mabye do some backstabbing. Should work on this when I know who I'll have and what level they'll be.[/quote]
I think Cowled Wizards drop Horrid Wilting scrolls. That might be the quickest way to take down the elementals? Or does the damage depend on level? You could also get a Wail Of The Banshee in there from a Limited Wish scroll, not sure what the odds of success are.
[quote]Skull trap Irenicus, would be a good job for imoen if she turns out to be useless for traps/killing.

Hell:
Get a tear, not exactly sure what's quickest.
Lay a bunch of traps.
Win.[/quote]

Sounds awesome.

ExplodingCabbage

2008-12-06 12:04:20 pm

Quote from ronrab:

Wouldn't bribing the dragon (even if you use the trick of dropping everything you need first) be strictly quicker than fighting it? I can't imagine any strategy technique that will get you out of there faster than just saying 'ok, take all my stuff'. It's not like your strategy for the rest of the run needs any money ...

We considered this. With an instant-death spell, the dragon can be killed pretty much instantly. Dropping everything and re-equipping it takes like 40 seconds.

Smilge

2008-12-06 12:44:55 pm

Quote:

Do we actually need to do this? I don't know whether Familiars can be ordered to leave an area; if they can, couldn't you take your familiar into your pack, jump the door by polymorph, letting your party die, then let your familiar out near the exit, order your character to talk to the familiar and then send the familiar out so that you start the conversation with it right as you leave the area?

The cutscene skip is very delicate and difficult. You need to be forced into conversation, can't just talk to someone. I plan on using the familiar to exit the area, but I still need a party member that I can kick out to be with me (like right next to me). If I can somehow get a party member outside the door instead of me, I guess I could have them leave the area while I stand next to the person I'll kick out.

Quote:

On reflection, I doubt this will actually save time. Remember you need to boot them from the party so you can get into the Adventurer's Mart, and the time spent kicking them out of the party and taking them back in again probably outweighs the tiny amount of walking time saved.

Adventure mart isn't a party required area luckily. It'll save me the walk to the other spell merchant, which ate up quite some time.

Quote:

Suggestion for an alternative route for Chapters 2/3, which only works if the Mook on the Shadow Thief quest has the package on her corpse (I can't remember):
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Go to Guildhall; get the first Shadow Thief quest from Aran
Kill aran
Kill Mook and take the package
Ally with Bodhi and give her the package
Kill escort guy
Return to Bodhi
Spellhold

Mook doesn't drop the package unless the Bohdi quest is triggered. Also, if I accept a quest from Aran, it sets me as working for the shadow thieves. And I think we all know what happens if you attack a shadow theif when you're working for them.

Quote:

Why kick them? Just arrange for them to die in some way and keep a body.

It's sometimes difficult to arrange for them to die in a timely manner. Also, I don't think I need any more bodies.

Quote:

I think Cowled Wizards drop Horrid Wilting scrolls. That might be the quickest way to take down the elementals? Or does the damage depend on level? You could also get a Wail Of The Banshee in there from a Limited Wish scroll, not sure what the odds of success are.

I've got a very good strategy for the elementals. I just tried it out and it worked better than I had hoped.

I did a test run of my SS route, and wow, it was great. There were a couple complications, but not too bad. I'll post a summary in a few hours.

[quote]Do we actually need to do this? I don't know whether Familiars can be ordered to leave an area; if they can, couldn't you take your familiar into your pack, jump the door by polymorph, letting your party die, then let your familiar out near the exit, order your character to talk to the familiar and then send the familiar out so that you start the conversation with it right as you leave the area?
[/quote]
The cutscene skip is very delicate and difficult. You need to be forced into conversation, can't just talk to someone. I plan on using the familiar to exit the area, but I still need a party member that I can kick out to be with me (like right next to me). If I can somehow get a party member outside the door instead of me, I guess I could have them leave the area while I stand next to the person I'll kick out.

[quote]
On reflection, I doubt this will actually save time. Remember you need to boot them from the party so you can get into the Adventurer's Mart, and the time spent kicking them out of the party and taking them back in again probably outweighs the tiny amount of walking time saved.
[/quote]
Adventure mart isn't a party required area luckily. It'll save me the walk to the other spell merchant, which ate up quite some time.

[quote]
Suggestion for an alternative route for Chapters 2/3, which only works if the Mook on the Shadow Thief quest has the package on her corpse (I can't remember):
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Go to Guildhall; get the first Shadow Thief quest from Aran
Kill aran
Kill Mook and take the package
Ally with Bodhi and give her the package
Kill escort guy
Return to Bodhi
Spellhold
[/quote]
Mook doesn't drop the package unless the Bohdi quest is triggered. Also, if I accept a quest from Aran, it sets me as working for the shadow thieves. And I think we all know what happens if you attack a shadow theif when you're working for them.

[quote]Why kick them? Just arrange for them to die in some way and keep a body.[/quote]
It's sometimes difficult to arrange for them to die in a timely manner. Also, I don't think I need any more bodies.

[quote]I think Cowled Wizards drop Horrid Wilting scrolls. That might be the quickest way to take down the elementals? Or does the damage depend on level? You could also get a Wail Of The Banshee in there from a Limited Wish scroll, not sure what the odds of success are.
[/quote]
I've got a very good strategy for the elementals. I just tried it out and it worked better than I had hoped.

I did a test run of my SS route, and wow, it was great. There were a couple complications, but not too bad. I'll post a summary in a few hours.

ExplodingCabbage

Edit history:

ExplodingCabbage: 2008-12-06 06:21:32 pm

2008-12-06 02:31:19 pm

Quote from Smilge:

Quote:

Do we actually need to do this? I don't know whether Familiars can be ordered to leave an area; if they can, couldn't you take your familiar into your pack, jump the door by polymorph, letting your party die, then let your familiar out near the exit, order your character to talk to the familiar and then send the familiar out so that you start the conversation with it right as you leave the area?

The cutscene skip is very delicate and difficult. You need to be forced into conversation, can't just talk to someone. I plan on using the familiar to exit the area, but I still need a party member that I can kick out to be with me (like right next to me). If I can somehow get a party member outside the door instead of me, I guess I could have them leave the area while I stand next to the person I'll kick out.

Nah you couldn't. They wouldn't be able to leave without you near them.
Edit: Oh wait. They can.

Quote:

On reflection, I doubt this will actually save time. Remember you need to boot them from the party so you can get into the Adventurer's Mart, and the time spent kicking them out of the party and taking them back in again probably outweighs the tiny amount of walking time saved.

Adventure mart isn't a party required area luckily. It'll save me the walk to the other spell merchant, which ate up quite some time.

Ah, I was convinced it was. Nice!

Quote:

Suggestion for an alternative route for Chapters 2/3, which only works if the Mook on the Shadow Thief quest has the package on her corpse (I can't remember):
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Go to Guildhall; get the first Shadow Thief quest from Aran
Kill aran
Kill Mook and take the package
Ally with Bodhi and give her the package
Kill escort guy
Return to Bodhi
Spellhold

Mook doesn't drop the package unless the Bohdi quest is triggered. Also, if I accept a quest from Aran, it sets me as working for the shadow thieves. And I think we all know what happens if you attack a shadow theif when you're working for them.

That's a point - can you brainsuck Arkanis Gath and get his sword of ownage? Not that it would actually save time, I'm just curious.

Quote:

Why kick them? Just arrange for them to die in some way and keep a body.

It's sometimes difficult to arrange for them to die in a timely manner. Also, I don't think I need any more bodies.

Alright.

Quote:

I think Cowled Wizards drop Horrid Wilting scrolls. That might be the quickest way to take down the elementals? Or does the damage depend on level? You could also get a Wail Of The Banshee in there from a Limited Wish scroll, not sure what the odds of success are.

I've got a very good strategy for the elementals. I just tried it out and it worked better than I had hoped.

Gonna give us any clues?

Quote:

I did a test run of my SS route, and wow, it was great. There were a couple complications, but not too bad. I'll post a summary in a few hours.

Sweet.

[quote="Smilge"]
[quote]Do we actually need to do this? I don't know whether Familiars can be ordered to leave an area; if they can, couldn't you take your familiar into your pack, jump the door by polymorph, letting your party die, then let your familiar out near the exit, order your character to talk to the familiar and then send the familiar out so that you start the conversation with it right as you leave the area?
[/quote]
The cutscene skip is very delicate and difficult. You need to be forced into conversation, can't just talk to someone. I plan on using the familiar to exit the area, but I still need a party member that I can kick out to be with me (like right next to me). If I can somehow get a party member outside the door instead of me, I guess I could have them leave the area while I stand next to the person I'll kick out.[/quote]
Nah you couldn't. They wouldn't be able to leave without you near them.
Edit: Oh wait. They can.

[quote][quote]
On reflection, I doubt this will actually save time. Remember you need to boot them from the party so you can get into the Adventurer's Mart, and the time spent kicking them out of the party and taking them back in again probably outweighs the tiny amount of walking time saved.
[/quote]
Adventure mart isn't a party required area luckily. It'll save me the walk to the other spell merchant, which ate up quite some time.[/quote]
Ah, I was convinced it was. Nice!

[quote][quote]
Suggestion for an alternative route for Chapters 2/3, which only works if the Mook on the Shadow Thief quest has the package on her corpse (I can't remember):
Attribute drain Bayle, grab key.
Go to Guildhall; get the first Shadow Thief quest from Aran
Kill aran
Kill Mook and take the package
Ally with Bodhi and give her the package
Kill escort guy
Return to Bodhi
Spellhold
[/quote]
Mook doesn't drop the package unless the Bohdi quest is triggered. Also, if I accept a quest from Aran, it sets me as working for the shadow thieves. And I think we all know what happens if you attack a shadow theif when you're working for them.[/quote]

That's a point - can you brainsuck Arkanis Gath and get his sword of ownage? Not that it would actually save time, I'm just curious.

[quote][quote]Why kick them? Just arrange for them to die in some way and keep a body.[/quote]
It's sometimes difficult to arrange for them to die in a timely manner. Also, I don't think I need any more bodies.[/quote]
Alright.

[quote][quote]I think Cowled Wizards drop Horrid Wilting scrolls. That might be the quickest way to take down the elementals? Or does the damage depend on level? You could also get a Wail Of The Banshee in there from a Limited Wish scroll, not sure what the odds of success are.
[/quote]
I've got a very good strategy for the elementals. I just tried it out and it worked better than I had hoped.
[/quote]
Gonna give us any clues?

[quote]
I did a test run of my SS route, and wow, it was great. There were a couple complications, but not too bad. I'll post a summary in a few hours.
[/quote]

Sweet.

ExplodingCabbage

2008-12-06 02:38:17 pm

Quote:

Chapter 3:
Steal the package from mook.
Get my party members to die somehow around here.

I missed this earlier. You need to actually have the package on you when you return to Bodhi, right? So you need to kick the party member who steals it out of the party, not just have them die, and you're not going to be able to get them back without a detour. So I think you will need to have whoever stakes Bodhi die instead of kicking them out.

Smilge

Edit history:

Smilge: 2008-12-06 03:26:11 pm

2008-12-06 03:15:50 pm

Here's an updated version of the Single Segment run route.

Chapter 1:
Grab Jaheria, Minsc.
Pick up Yoshimo, kill mephits.
Save time on the surface by sending party members to different merchants.
Hit the Slums.

Chapter 2:
Ally with Bayle.

Chapter 3:
Send one party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 2)
Kill mook
Send one party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 1)
Go to bridge district kill traitors.
Send last party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 0)
Kill vampires
Get party members back at Aran ~~(Hopefully)~~
Spellhold

Chapter 4:
Party members can be left to die from vampires ~~or something~~. They're better as bodies.
Jump to underdark

Chapter 5:
~~Steal/~~kill gnome for light gem, kick out that member. (Leaves me with ~~1 or~~ 2 bodies: Yoshimo and Minsc)
Surface

Chapter 6:
Protection from undead scroll
Jump door to Bohdi
Have Improved haste Drizzit kill Bohdi.

Chapter 7:
Send my ~~one or~~ two people around collecting things.
Map:

Sorry for the crappy quality, it was done in paint. You should be able to get the basic idea though. Yoshimo and Minsc will die by the time I need to go to the Avatar.
Bribe the Dragon

Tree:
Yoshimo lays all his traps at one parasite. Instantly kills them and the parasite. He goes and uses the dual class trick (lets him lay his traps again) and lays all his traps at Jon Irenicus.
Meanwhile I go to other parasites. Base THAC0 is 14, reduced to 11 by my strength bonus of my belt. Reduced to 7 by my +4 sword. Reduced to 3 with Improved invisibility. Elementals armor class is 2, so I basically hit every time. I use the ring of air control to charm an Elemental, just like my segmented run shows. However, instead of running away I use improved invisibility and backstab for 27 to 47 damage (4[1d6 + 4] + 7) Enemy dies quick, I can choose to lay a trap if the living friendly elemental has high life. If not, just backstab twice before it becomes hostile. Do it to the remaining two parasites. Yoshimo should have his traps laid by now.

The traps go off and kill Irenicus as soon as he finishes talking. It's the same as skull trap trick but no danger of dying myself.

Hell:
Get a tear, not exactly sure what's quickest.
~~Mind flayer Time stop, as in current run.~~
Lay the maximum of 7 traps. Yoshimo and I are both level 11 by now, so we both get the added poison damage every round for 4 rounds. Yoshimo uses the dual class trick again for the 7th trap.
Win.

Quote:

I missed this earlier. You need to actually have the package on you when you return to Bodhi, right? So you need to kick the party member who steals it out of the party, not just have them die, and you're not going to be able to get them back without a detour. So I think you will need to have whoever stakes Bodhi die instead of kicking them out.

I'm going to steal it. I have shapechange still on me at this point, so my super speed Iron Golem will make the walk very short.

Here's an updated version of the Single Segment run route.

Chapter 1: 
Grab Jaheria, Minsc.
Pick up Yoshimo, kill mephits.
Save time on the surface by sending party members to different merchants.
Hit the Slums.

Chapter 2:
Ally with Bayle.

Chapter 3:
Send one party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 2)
Kill mook
Send one party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 1)
Go to bridge district kill traitors.
Send last party member to Aran, kick them out (leaves me with 0)
Kill vampires
Get party members back at Aran [s](Hopefully)[/s]
Spellhold

Chapter 4:
Party members can be left to die from vampires [s]or something[/s]. They're better as bodies.
Jump to underdark

Chapter 5:
[s]Steal/[/s]kill gnome for light gem, kick out that member. (Leaves me with [s]1 or[/s] 2 bodies: Yoshimo and Minsc)
Surface

Chapter 6:
Protection from undead scroll
Jump door to Bohdi
Have Improved haste Drizzit kill Bohdi.

Chapter 7:
Send my [s]one or[/s] two people around collecting things. 
Map: [IMG]http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y187/PeonUprising/Suldenessalar.jpg[/img]
Sorry for the crappy quality, it was done in paint. You should be able to get the basic idea though. Yoshimo and Minsc will die by the time I need to go to the Avatar.
Bribe the Dragon

Tree:
Yoshimo lays all his traps at one parasite. Instantly kills them and the parasite. He goes and uses the dual class trick (lets him lay his traps again) and lays all his traps at Jon Irenicus.
Meanwhile I go to other parasites. Base THAC0 is 14, reduced to 11 by my strength bonus of my belt. Reduced to 7 by my +4 sword. Reduced to 3 with Improved invisibility. Elementals armor class is 2, so I basically hit every time. I use the ring of air control to charm an Elemental, just like my segmented run shows. However, instead of running away I use improved invisibility and backstab for 27 to 47 damage (4[1d6 + 4] + 7) Enemy dies quick, I can choose to lay a trap if the living friendly elemental has high life. If not, just backstab twice before it becomes hostile. Do it to the remaining two parasites. Yoshimo should have his traps laid by now.

The traps go off and kill Irenicus as soon as he finishes talking. It's the same as skull trap trick but no danger of dying myself.

Hell:
Get a tear, not exactly sure what's quickest.
[s]Mind flayer Time stop, as in current run.[/s]
Lay the maximum of 7 traps. Yoshimo and I are both level 11 by now, so we both get the added poison damage every round for 4 rounds. Yoshimo uses the dual class trick again for the 7th trap.
Win.

[quote]I missed this earlier. You need to actually have the package on you when you return to Bodhi, right? So you need to kick the party member who steals it out of the party, not just have them die, and you're not going to be able to get them back without a detour. So I think you will need to have whoever stakes Bodhi die instead of kicking them out.[/quote]
I'm going to steal it. I have shapechange still on me at this point, so my super speed Iron Golem will make the walk very short.

ExplodingCabbage

Edit history:

ExplodingCabbage: 2008-12-06 08:09:55 pm

2008-12-06 04:50:36 pm

Quote:

I missed this earlier. You need to actually have the package on you when you return to Bodhi, right? So you need to kick the party member who steals it out of the party, not just have them die, and you're not going to be able to get them back without a detour. So I think you will need to have whoever stakes Bodhi die instead of kicking them out.

I'm going to steal it. I have shapechange still on me at this point, so my super speed Iron Golem will make the walk very short.[/quote]

Ah, nice. That probably is the quickest way. Bear in mind the possibility of someone else doing the shapechange, though. Do you know if they keep the ability if they're killed and revived?

By the way, I'm now back home and planning on playing through your route looking for new timesavers. Found a minor one already; if you set find familiar casting AFTER you make your death sound and fall over at the beginning, but before the cutscene of you being tortured starts, you'll cast during the cutscene and not have to spend time doing it after being released.

Sadly you can't unlock your own cage.

I'm wondering if it's possible to kill Irenicus during the cutscene. I'm gonna cheat myself in a high-level character with Meteor Storm and see if that'll kill him and what happens if it does. I'm also curious as to what happens if I trap him in a web before he reaches the cage.

Edit: Messing with the cutscene only delays your release, at worst forever. No use.

By the way, just occurred to me that if you want to skip killing the mephit portals in the segmented run, you should have Imoen get 'killed' just as you leave the area. Her 'I'm not dying here' dialog plays even if she's not near you. Also, you can, with a few summons and without too much difficulty, mustard-jelly teleport from the right-hand corner of the room with the portals down and to the right to near the exit. Should save a few seconds. I tried for hours (literally) to fill this same corner up with summons and then summon a familiar on top to get it to spawn there, but there's just no way to fill the whole space needed with 5 party members, 5 summons and 4 mephits without leaving a familiar-sized gap. Doing it the polymorph way is quicker anyway because it would take ages to position everything for the familiar way.

I recognise that what I'm proposing would possibly be the hardest segment in the whole run to pull off and this would be to save around 15 seconds. Your call whether that's worth it.

[quote]I missed this earlier. You need to actually have the package on you when you return to Bodhi, right? So you need to kick the party member who steals it out of the party, not just have them die, and you're not going to be able to get them back without a detour. So I think you will need to have whoever stakes Bodhi die instead of kicking them out.[/quote]
I'm going to steal it. I have shapechange still on me at this point, so my super speed Iron Golem will make the walk very short.[/quote]

Ah, nice. That probably is the quickest way. Bear in mind the possibility of someone else doing the shapechange, though. Do you know if they keep the ability if they're killed and revived?

By the way, I'm now back home and planning on playing through your route looking for new timesavers. Found a minor one already; if you set find familiar casting AFTER you make your death sound and fall over at the beginning, but before the cutscene of you being tortured starts, you'll cast during the cutscene and not have to spend time doing it after being released.

Sadly you can't unlock your own cage.

I'm wondering if it's possible to kill Irenicus during the cutscene. I'm gonna cheat myself in a high-level character with Meteor Storm and see if that'll kill him and what happens if it does. I'm also curious as to what happens if I trap him in a web before he reaches the cage.

Edit: Messing with the cutscene only delays your release, at worst forever. No use.

By the way, just occurred to me that if you want to skip killing the mephit portals in the segmented run, you should have Imoen get 'killed' just as you leave the area. Her 'I'm not dying here' dialog plays even if she's not near you. Also, you can, with a few summons and without too much difficulty, mustard-jelly teleport from the right-hand corner of the room with the portals down and to the right to near the exit. Should save a few seconds. I tried for hours (literally) to fill this same corner up with summons and then summon a familiar on top to get it to spawn there, but there's just no way to fill the whole space needed with 5 party members, 5 summons and 4 mephits without leaving a familiar-sized gap. Doing it the polymorph way is quicker anyway because it would take ages to position everything for the familiar way.

I recognise that what I'm proposing would possibly be the hardest segment in the whole run to pull off and this would be to save around 15 seconds. Your call whether that's worth it.

Smilge

Edit history:

Smilge: 2008-12-06 08:55:31 pm

2008-12-06 08:32:11 pm

I'm curious on the best way to kill the people you need to. For Mook, I send the PC, lay a trap, backstab, then vampiric touch. It seems to kill her almost every time, and if it doesn't, a whack with the weapon or another vampiric touch will do it.

I still need to work on the Bridge District Inn fight. I think I should have yoshimo around, and if he can lay traps reliably that may be the way to go.

Then there's Lassal. I like killing him with flame arrow, but it takes quite some time to cast those spells. Plus he won't always die from just 3 if he saves.

The gnome with the light gem is next, I had Jaheria summon animals and talk lock him. It worked well because I had time to run my other character to the dragon's lair.

After that it's the parasites, and I feel like that one is really well done. Jon Irenicus comes twice more, and those traps are amazing. I don't see it being done quicker.

Quote:

By the way, just occurred to me that if you want to skip killing the mephit portals in the segmented run, you should have Imoen get 'killed' just as you leave the area. Her 'I'm not dying here' dialog plays even if she's not near you.

Man, skipping that cutscene is really hard to do even when you've got the person standing right next to you. If you can get any success with imoen dying the exact moment you try to leave, I guess it'll have to be done. But I tried for hours just to get it working exactly as was shown on the video. DAMURDOC couldn't get it working at all on his run.

Quote:

Also, you can, with a few summons and without too much difficulty, mustard-jelly teleport from the right-hand corner of the room with the portals down and to the right to near the exit.

Is there a way of getting a scroll or spell of polymorph at this point in the game?

I'm curious on the best way to kill the people you need to. For Mook, I send the PC, lay a trap, backstab, then vampiric touch. It seems to kill her almost every time, and if it doesn't, a whack with the weapon or another vampiric touch will do it.

I still need to work on the Bridge District Inn fight. I think I should have yoshimo around, and if he can lay traps reliably that may be the way to go.

Then there's Lassal. I like killing him with flame arrow, but it takes quite some time to cast those spells. Plus he won't always die from just 3 if he saves.

The gnome with the light gem is next, I had Jaheria summon animals and talk lock him. It worked well because I had time to run my other character to the dragon's lair.

After that it's the parasites, and I feel like that one is really well done. Jon Irenicus comes twice more, and those traps are amazing. I don't see it being done quicker.

[quote]By the way, just occurred to me that if you want to skip killing the mephit portals in the segmented run, you should have Imoen get 'killed' just as you leave the area. Her 'I'm not dying here' dialog plays even if she's not near you.[/quote]
Man, skipping that cutscene is really hard to do even when you've got the person standing right next to you. If you can get any success with imoen dying the exact moment you try to leave, I guess it'll have to be done. But I tried for hours just to get it working exactly as was shown on the video. DAMURDOC couldn't get it working at all on his run.

[quote]Also, you can, with a few summons and without too much difficulty, mustard-jelly teleport from the right-hand corner of the room with the portals down and to the right to near the exit.[/quote]
Is there a way of getting a scroll or spell of polymorph at this point in the game?

Smilge

2008-12-06 09:54:45 pm

Just did another test run. Man, Irenicus goes down so nicely.

I've actually been able to jump the door in a Single Segment run easily with all those party members around. They usually won't die before I get out of the dungeon.

Also, I can jump the door in Bohdi's lair without trouble. Protection from Undead make me impervious to them. I summon a monster and the vampires come rape it, but while they do I can use them to jump the door. If I run into the room where Drizzt and friends are killing vampires, the vampires won't attack my summons and I can jump it that way if need be.

I've been able to buy a lot less equipment at the start. I believe all I bought was
3 rings of air control
Zerth's sword,
Venca's robe,
Belt of Giant Strength,
rod of resurrection...
2 Protection from Undead scrolls,
3 Flame Arrows,
6 Monster summoning spells (could be less I think, if I memorized spells when I should have),
Improved haste,
2 Polymorph self...
3 invisibility pots,
and like 13 haste pots (haha, will probably be less by the time I finalize it).
I think that's it. Mabye forgetting something obvious, I dunno.

I was able to skip the spell vendor in the Adventure Mart.
I didn't end up using any limited wishes. I guess I could shapechange for a faster run speed, but I'd need to make up enough time to offset going to the store.

Since I don't need the time stop scroll in Suldenessalar, I think it would be faster to kick Minsc from the party as soon as he gets the amulet. I don't use him from that point on anyways.

I'm really happy with how this run is shaping up. It's definitely harder to control a bunch of characters instead of one, but I think it'll make for a much better video.

Just did another test run. Man, Irenicus goes down so nicely.

I've actually been able to jump the door in a Single Segment run easily with all those party members around. They usually won't die before I get out of the dungeon.

Also, I can jump the door in Bohdi's lair without trouble. Protection from Undead make me impervious to them. I summon a monster and the vampires come rape it, but while they do I can use them to jump the door. If I run into the room where Drizzt and friends are killing vampires, the vampires won't attack my summons and I can jump it that way if need be.

I've been able to buy a lot less equipment at the start. I believe all I bought was 
3 rings of air control 
Zerth's sword, 
Venca's robe, 
Belt of Giant Strength, 
rod of resurrection... 
2 Protection from Undead scrolls, 
3 Flame Arrows, 
6 Monster summoning spells (could be less I think, if I memorized spells when I should have), 
Improved haste, 
2 Polymorph self...
3 invisibility pots, 
and like 13 haste pots (haha, will probably be less by the time I finalize it).
I think that's it. Mabye forgetting something obvious, I dunno.

I was able to skip the spell vendor in the Adventure Mart.
I didn't end up using any limited wishes. I guess I could shapechange for a faster run speed, but I'd need to make up enough time to offset going to the store.

Since I don't need the time stop scroll in Suldenessalar, I think it would be faster to kick Minsc from the party as soon as he gets the amulet. I don't use him from that point on anyways.

I'm really happy with how this run is shaping up. It's definitely harder to control a bunch of characters instead of one, but I think it'll make for a much better video.

ExplodingCabbage

2008-12-07 03:06:57 am

Quote:

Also, you can, with a few summons and without too much difficulty, mustard-jelly teleport from the right-hand corner of the room with the portals down and to the right to near the exit.

Is there a way of getting a scroll or spell of polymorph at this point in the game?

Yes: play as a pure mage, not a mage/thief. I'm pretty sure doing so doesn't slow you down at all except for when trap laying (okay, so have your main character cast skull traps while Yoshimo lays traps) and when pickpocketing the gnome (slap him with a finger of death instead).

ExplodingCabbage

2008-12-07 03:45:21 am

Interesting fact: selecting attack (or a weapon) and clicking on the exit from Irenicus's dungeon will instantly make you leave the level if you're close enough. The area transition seems to work differently to elsewhere.

ExplodingCabbage

2008-12-07 06:40:07 am

After many hours I now fully appreciate how retardedly hard it is to skip that cutscene.

Smilge

2008-12-07 09:10:04 pm

Minor improvements after another test:

Lassal dies quicker if you backstab him and then use only 2 flame arrows on him.

Clairvoyance in the Underdark and Tree of Life lets you send your team in different places faster and easier.

I think I'm going to talk lock the two Inn traitors, have yoshimo fireball himself (drink potion, replace with scroll) once or twice since his trap skill is crap at that point. My PC will lay traps and/or backstab before they become hostile.

Jumping the door in the imp portal room isn't as fast as killing the portals. At least not reliably. I just have jaheria turn into a bear and yoshimo and she kill the portals while my PC looks around for potions and a gem to get money later on. By the time I find them, the door is open.

Bohdi's door is actually easier to jump than ever. I don't know why, but the vampires don't seem to attack my summons. It makes it trivial to get over the door.

I still need to test if stopping at the thief's shop and buying the scroll of improved haste takes less time than the improvement of Drizzit killing Bohdi. I'm pretty sure it's a few seconds faster, but that may be my perception.

I'll update this if I think of any more things. If anyone else is out there lurking in this post, feel free to comment even if you don't have any great ideas.

Minor improvements after another test:

Lassal dies quicker if you backstab him and then use only 2 flame arrows on him.

Clairvoyance in the Underdark and Tree of Life lets you send your team in different places faster and easier.

I think I'm going to talk lock the two Inn traitors, have yoshimo fireball himself (drink potion, replace with scroll) once or twice since his trap skill is crap at that point. My PC will lay traps and/or backstab before they become hostile.

Jumping the door in the imp portal room isn't as fast as killing the portals. At least not reliably. I just have jaheria turn into a bear and yoshimo and she kill the portals while my PC looks around for potions and a gem to get money later on. By the time I find them, the door is open.

Bohdi's door is actually easier to jump than ever. I don't know why, but the vampires don't seem to attack my summons. It makes it trivial to get over the door.

I still need to test if stopping at the thief's shop and buying the scroll of improved haste takes less time than the improvement of Drizzit killing Bohdi. I'm pretty sure it's a few seconds faster, but that may be my perception.

I'll update this if I think of any more things. If anyone else is out there lurking in this post, feel free to comment even if you don't have any great ideas.

ExplodingCabbage

Edit history:

ExplodingCabbage: 2008-12-08 07:07:54 am

2008-12-08 06:37:17 am

Just one more idea. Remember my alternate route for chapter 3 I suggested earlier? Is it possible to get it to work by going to the graveyard district first so Bodhi spawns there, leaving before she speaks to you, going to the docks and getting the first thieves quest and killing Aran, killing Mook and getting the package, then returning to the graveyard district and allying with Bodhi? Or does Bodhi disappear after you speak to Aran?

Edit 2: Also, can you get the mace of disruption without losing any time? If you could it would probably be the quickest way to take down Bodhi.

Edit 3: I'm sure you've tried this, but can Death Spell kill elementals? I'm thinking they might count as summons.

Edit 4: I'm thinking about when you go from the meeting with Drizzt to the Graveyard here. Is it possible to quaff an oil of speed just before you leave the Drizzt area so that it takes effect after you arrive in the graveyard?

Edit 5: One spell we haven't thought about exploiting yet is Maze. Can you leave an area while a party member is mazed?

Just one more idea. Remember my alternate route for chapter 3 I suggested earlier? Is it possible to get it to work by going to the graveyard district first so Bodhi spawns there, leaving before she speaks to you, going to the docks and getting the first thieves quest and killing Aran, killing Mook and getting the package, then returning to the graveyard district and allying with Bodhi? Or does Bodhi disappear after you speak to Aran?

Edit 2: Also, can you get the mace of disruption without losing any time? If you could it would probably be the quickest way to take down Bodhi.

Edit 3: I'm sure you've tried this, but can Death Spell kill elementals? I'm thinking they might count as summons.

Edit 4: I'm thinking about when you go from the meeting with Drizzt to the Graveyard here. Is it possible to quaff an oil of speed just before you leave the Drizzt area so that it takes effect after you arrive in the graveyard?

Edit 5: One spell we haven't thought about exploiting yet is Maze. Can you leave an area while a party member is mazed?

ronrab

2008-12-08 07:56:30 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Nothing to say at this point, but still watching things closely. =)

Smilge

Edit history:

Smilge: 2008-12-08 10:11:47 pm

2008-12-08 08:14:13 pm

I just recorded a test run, and by no means was it submission worthy. I was in underdark when I had to stop (I forgot to buy a rod of ressurection, DO'H!). The time was around 33 minutes. The segmented run for comparasion is 24 minutes to get to this point. That's really not too bad, and I think I can take it down a few minutes with practice. I'm confident that I can get under an hour for the total time. Probably around 50-55 minutes.

Edit: to Suldanessallar is another 10:30, so 43:30 total. Versus the current segmented run it's 31:00. I can only see myself going faster than the segmented run through suldanessallar and hell, so I'm betting I should easily get sub 50:00 in the final SS run. 45:00 is a good goal. We'll see how crazy I go trying single segment runs. Another week and a few days before I'm off work and my girlfriend goes on a plane, which is when the real runs will get started.

Smilge

2008-12-19 01:47:08 pm

This is progressing pretty well. I can't really upload segments as I go because it's all one segment Smiley

Things giving me trouble:
-Party members dying from big criticals or level drain, preventing them from resurrecting.
-Traps in the first dungeon randomly killing me.
-That god damn kuo-toa who runs up to you in underdark. I must have avoided him in my segmented run, but he's a major pain in the ass.
-Menu screens. Like inventory, leveling up, spell memorization. Those are tough for me to do smoothly and quickly.
-My nerves/lack of practice.
-Fallout 3 and World of Warcraft expansion that I got for Christmas.

Things not giving me trouble:
-Hard drive space. I cleared off and installed my 250gb second hard drive. This means I can do full screen video capture and without lag!
-Vampire spike room. I ran all around in there and couldn't get a spike to go off and hit me. This is good, because my stoneskin idea failed when I couldn't find a stoneskin scroll.
-The Inn fight with the thieves. I am able to now consistently kill the 108 hp one with a lightning bolt bounce. 95% of the time at least. The other gets chopped up by Yoshimo and I while the bolt is bouncing.
-The final Irenicus fight. The traps seem to kill him 100% time. I don't know if I'm really lucky or what, because all the damage is dice rolls.
-The one tear trick. When you hear the sound, drop the tear. When you see the graphic, pick up the tear. It's very very easy, you have like 3 seconds of leeway.

45 minutes may have been ambitious, but I definitely think it'll be under 50.

This is progressing pretty well. I can't really upload segments as I go because it's all one segment  :)

Things giving me trouble:
-Party members dying from big criticals or level drain, preventing them from resurrecting.
-Traps in the first dungeon randomly killing me.
-That god damn kuo-toa who runs up to you in underdark. I must have avoided him in my segmented run, but he's a major pain in the ass.
-Menu screens. Like inventory, leveling up, spell memorization. Those are tough for me to do smoothly and quickly.
-My nerves/lack of practice.
-Fallout 3 and World of Warcraft expansion that I got for Christmas.

Things not giving me trouble:
-Hard drive space. I cleared off and installed my 250gb second hard drive. This means I can do full screen video capture and without lag!
-Vampire spike room. I ran all around in there and couldn't get a spike to go off and hit me. This is good, because my stoneskin idea failed when I couldn't find a stoneskin scroll.
-The Inn fight with the thieves. I am able to now consistently kill the 108 hp one with a lightning bolt bounce. 95% of the time at least. The other gets chopped up by Yoshimo and I while the bolt is bouncing.
-The final Irenicus fight. The traps seem to kill him 100% time. I don't know if I'm really lucky or what, because all the damage is dice rolls.
-The one tear trick. When you hear the sound, drop the tear. When you see the graphic, pick up the tear. It's very very easy, you have like 3 seconds of leeway.

45 minutes may have been ambitious, but I definitely think it'll be under 50.

niebezimienny

2008-12-20 07:10:06 am

pierdole zdejmuje kominiare

Hey, I really enjoyed your improved segmented run, infinity engine games are always awesome to watch. I want to wish you good luck with your SS run, even though I'm not a very big fan of those (of course they require more skill, but segmented runs are by definition more 'perfect' and smooth)! One more thing, if possible, could you tell me which version of BG you are using and where are the major strategic problems located (such as getting rid of the elementals, etc), and I will get working on these and should I find any improvements, I'll let you know asap!