3D Gex Games

exe

Edit history:

exe: 2013-12-02 04:08:34 pm

2013-12-02 04:08:13 pm

from PAListan

And the new WR with a time of 58:05

http://www.twitch.tv/exe_de/c/3332745

Bad luck @ Rez (like in 80% of my runs) and a very stupid mistake in MTT. Some Minor mistakes here and there but the biggest problem (and reason why this isn't an SDA run) was MTT Sad

andypanther

2013-12-08 04:56:43 am

Ok, let's start with the good news first: I experimented with the Rez fight and found out how the RNG works. But the bad news is: You won't be able to manipulate it in a speedrun Sad

The spawning location for the buttons isn't dependent on a pattern chosen beforehand, it's just about the inputs of the player. You can easily see this by making a savestate during the cutscene for the start of the second phase (where Rez grows big). If you don't move Gex in any way before the spawn of the button, the location will always be the same. But if you vary it even slightly, you will get different results.

I'm sorry, exe Sad

exe

2013-12-08 07:57:55 am

from PAListan

Ok thank you Andy. I know that this fight is completely random now.
So bad that this RNG Boss can still destroys very good runs in the future. It destroyed near 80% of my runs in the past Sad

andypanther

2013-12-10 09:14:25 am

First of all, congrats to exe for his new WR. That was, RNG aside, your best run so far Smiley

I did some research again, but this time with TAS tools. I learned 2 new things this way:

- On slippery slopes, when Gex is in his sliding animation, you have exactly 1 frame to make a jump at the very edge. Normally, the game just drops you down. The timing for a single jump is doable in real time, but getting many in a row is not realistic.
- When you slide down any rope in Mao Tse Tongue, you can actually do a jump at the end instead off dropping (thanks to exe for telling me about this). The timing window is always 4 frames. These frames are actually the last 3 ones where Gex is in his hanging animation, plus the first one where he is in the air. I can't say if the timing is learnable, but on one part of the level you can save some seconds with it and trying doesn't waste any time.

exe

2013-12-10 10:00:43 am

from PAListan

Thank you Andy ^^

This is the Run btw: http://www.twitch.tv/exe_de/c/3368719

Nice new facts you have found. Especially the first one is a really cool trick to upgrade the outdated TAS.

andypanther

2013-12-11 10:10:23 am

I started to experiment with Gex 3. So far, the most important discovery was that the reentering skip still works:

Also, I found a alternative method for skipping the switch in Clueless in Seattle. This is probably already known, but the TAS and the speedrun don't use it. I think it's a good backup strat Smiley

And if you want some old school Gex, here's another OoB in Out of Toon:

I hope I can find more in both games.

exe

Edit history:

exe: 2013-12-11 12:19:23 pm

2013-12-11 12:18:51 pm

from PAListan

Yeah it's nice that you work on Gex 3 too.
I'll pick up this game next year and hope that i can find new stuff too.
Let us destroy this games XD

andypanther

2013-12-12 02:42:11 pm

Another Gex 3 update:

The first skip is the old TAS strat by Mukki. I can confirm that it is possible to get consistent at it. Doing it fast saves around 50 seconds, so there is no excuse to not do it in a run. The second skip is primarily useful for the "collect 5 of a kind" remote that forces you to take the normal way through the cave. You could also use it as an easier alternative to Mukkis strat.

However, there are also the shortcuts found by Scrimpeh, which are even faster and don't use the donkey at all. I don't know if they can be pulled off in a run, though.

Next, we have some small stuff for 100%:

And a glorious softlock Grin

andypanther

Edit history:

andypanther: 2013-12-15 10:54:37 am

2013-12-15 04:07:42 am

Back to Gex 64, because I found a ~15 second timesaver for any%. I was always hoping this skip would one day be possible:

Yes, it is the so far longest "space jump" in the game and therefore very risky. You can try aiming for the platform on the left, but this is slower and IMO not really easier. I hope you can get consistent at it, so that it isn't a "segmented only" thing.

I can't believe I found this the same day the new WR was submitted Tongue

Edit:
There seems to be more to this skip. Because when I went back to the level and tried it again, I couldn't even get near the platform with the lasers without dying. No matter what angle I tried, I hit the kill planes without even seeing the platform. But when I first jumped on the metal platform (the one after the platform I'm jumping from) before making my jump, it worked fine again. I have only one explanation for this: To make the flight sequence with the spaceship possible, the developers needed to remove a lot of kill planes, because the sequence isn't a cutscene. But instead of removing them permanently from the level, they just put a trigger on a certain point near the spaceship that unloads them.

Speedrunning is science!

Back to Gex 64, because I found a ~15 second timesaver for any%. I was always hoping this skip would one day be possible:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFLLq4JIXOk

Yes, it is the so far longest "space jump" in the game and therefore very risky. You can try aiming for the platform on the left, but this is slower and IMO not really easier. I hope you can get consistent at it, so that it isn't a "segmented only" thing.

I can't believe I found this the same day the new WR was submitted :P

Edit: 
There seems to be more to this skip. Because when I went back to the level and tried it again, I couldn't even get near the platform with the lasers without dying. No matter what angle I tried, I hit the kill planes without even seeing the platform. But when I first jumped on the metal platform (the one after the platform I'm jumping from) before making my jump, it worked fine again. I have only one explanation for this: To make the flight sequence with the spaceship possible, the developers needed to remove a lot of kill planes, because the sequence isn't a cutscene. But instead of removing them permanently from the level, they just put a trigger on a certain point near the spaceship that unloads them.

Speedrunning is science!

exe

2013-12-15 11:24:26 am

from PAListan

Hahahah awesome Andy!!! Awesome!

You know that we talked about this situation and we both hope that anyone of us can find a skip for this.
So it's a great find! Hope you find find a constant way. If it's only a precise trick, than it's only a practise thing.

andypanther

2013-12-16 07:51:12 am

I already found many new tricks, I hope you like them:

1: This one uses a really precise Super Tailbounce and is probably too hard for a single segment. It completely skips the wall climb part.
2: This longjump skip is only relevant for TAS. It proves that, if both tricks in this video are combined, a TAS can do the entire first area of the level with just one green power up.

I really should have called the vid "skip 99% of the second part of the first area in Honey I Shrunk the Gecko" xD

Here we have a "high risk, low reward" trick in Rezopolis. I really wouldn't advise anyone to go for that one at the very end of a 100% SS.

Next is an OoB in the same level that gives us the illusion of an awesome skip.

And my favorite Gex glitch ever Grin

Crash41596

2013-12-17 05:44:48 am

Nice finds Andy. I will try and upload some of the skips that I have found for gex 3 later.

andypanther

2013-12-17 06:23:56 am

@Crash: That's great, I love seeing Gex 3 just as broken. If I ever finish the Gex 64 TAS, that one will definitely be next Smiley

Also, another skip I found, although I think it's much too hard outside of a TAS:

Crash41596

2013-12-17 06:39:28 am

Here's one of many skips that I have found

This skip is already known, but this is an easier way to do it. I have also learned that if you hold down start after you select which remote you will do, you will skip the intro cutscene to the level automatically.

exe

2013-12-17 11:34:49 am

from PAListan

Omg i must get into Gex 3 as fast as possible. Hopefully i can find 1-2 tricks too.
Great founds from both of you guys.

Waifu Wrecker

2013-12-17 09:06:52 pm

There's surprisingly a lot of tricks and skips with these games. However, I don't think these games are optimized enough for a TAS yet, and if they are, that's kind of discouraging for potential runners, since it takes the fun out of competing for better times.

Who in particular streams Gex 3?

andypanther

Edit history:

andypanther: 2013-12-18 02:48:26 am

2013-12-18 02:47:56 am

There are TASes for both games, but they are very outdated, especially in the case of the first one. You could save minutes with a better route and all the new tricks.

Generally, you shouldn't be discouraged by TASes, as they're not meant to compete with speedruns. The good thing about these two communities is, that they can learn from each other: Like when runners find setups to do so called "TAS only" tricks, and TASes get improved thanks to new finds of the runners.

Crash41596

2013-12-19 06:44:22 am

umm yeah, I think I may have found a way to wrong warp. Not sure how I managed this but I got the last remote in western station and got back on the mule, then waited for the remote to appear again then got off the mule. Then the loading screen said this http://puu.sh/5RFjZ.jpg But yeah, doesn't seem to be loading so idk.

Crash41596

2013-12-19 06:52:31 am

Here's a video of it

Crash41596

2013-12-19 02:34:08 pm

Here's a trick that allows you to get all 3 remotes in western station in 1 go

andypanther

2013-12-19 02:49:32 pm

Wow, this trick is incredible! Now Gex just got much more glitchy!

Can you explain how it works? Because I had no luck replicating it (I was using the N64 version, however)

Crash41596

2013-12-19 02:57:06 pm

If you are talking about the wrong warp, you need to already have the remote complete (I think), then you have to grab the remote and turn the camera away from the tv so it resets, then get off the mule. This should try and warp you to the first level, but then freeze. For the triple remote thing you just have to get back on the mule after canceling the remove pad thingy.

andypanther

2013-12-19 03:19:10 pm

I just couldn't get back on the mule. The method that I use in Gex 64 to do the Reentering Skip, cancelling the collection with a Tailslap, doesn't work because it won't let me interact with the mule. But I can't do it with just jumping.

exe

2013-12-20 01:19:34 am

from PAListan

Crash this is one of the most awesome finds in Gex History. It's maybe possible to use this mechanics on other spots.
I'm curious how broken this game can be.

So great work Crash!

Crash41596

2013-12-22 05:06:30 am

I am back with some great news. You can do both the wrong warp and the triple remote collection on the first visit. Also I found a small 5-10 second timesaver