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afti: 2016-01-13 03:36:33 am
Okay, so first things first: new here, and as such let me apologize in advance for anything dumb I might do.

Anyway! Playing this recently, it kept occurring to me that it could actually make a really cool speedrun given how large, open-form, and kinda sorta super-broken the game is. I don't think you're exactly going to get it under an hour, but you've got a huge amount of time you can shave off, and it should be possible to get those strategies relatively consistent.

The troublesome part, of course, is just how many different variables you have to route around. You're going to need research probes, definitely, to get the Skell license; travel routes and the like will have to be constructed around that. And you want to get that license as soon as possible because of how much faster Skells make locomotion - in particular, if you need to do anything in Sylvalum or Cauldros, you're basically screwed without the Skell license. I want to say you're probably better off actually dumping the Skell as a combat tool for the last part of the run, since you're never going to get a level 50 frame in a speedrun and you need a pretty badass ground gear setup for Lao anyway - but even then, it's invaluable as a vehicle.

Experience, class experience, and battle points are going to be the biggest problems for the run, of course. You want to get through battles fast, except you're skipping basically every optional quest and you're avoiding every fight you can by abusing the hell out of Shadowrunner. The good news: Irina is a party member made available by the main story progression, very early on, and she gets Brainjack + Servant Sacrifice. Which means you can find something big and overleveled (spitballing here: the level 81 gorilla dude right outside of NLA seems pretty perfect, as long as he's not immune to control) and auto-kill it for preposterous amounts of experience and class experience. She's basically useless in battle apart from that, but that's more than enough - you get her to Psycorruptor 13, switch leaders to her, and then just save in front of Donkey Kong, Brainjack+SS, and reload until it works. It'll take a few times, then you get a giant pile of experience. Rinse, lather, and repeat until you're positioned to hit the level threshold for chapter 12 after the remaining mandatory quests. (I know the displayed EXP from a battle caps at 9999; does that actually apply to the received experience, though, or is it just the display? Because this'll go much faster if you get the full yield after factoring in the level difference.)

NPC builds - you control Elma to run past things with Shadowrunner as much as possible, but you really don't want her to have any TP arts but Ghost Factory (once you get it) when you're actually fighting something. Basically, build her to produce TP and spent it to spam Ghost Factory; Decoy is kinda crazy, and it's what's gonna keep you alive.

PC build - Duelist is probably mandatory for your initial class; the damage output is going to be a requirement. Once you have Irina up and running, you probably want to switch classes to the Full Metal Jaguar line at some point, though? Lao is basically going to require you to abuse Overdrive cooldown in order to spam Decoy; he hits too hard and his adds are jerks. If you max FMJ it's probably wise to switch back to Longsword+Dual Guns Duelist. (You're using the Longsword no matter what, of course.)

Skell build -I wanna say, dump the Urban 20 because it's a piece of shit that's going to get itself blown up. Buy a level 30 frame from the shop - light is optimal for movement speed. [Movement trick that's worth noting: you can turn on a dime in vehicle mode by pressing the stick in, inputting the direction you're turning in during the transform animation, and then pressing the stick in again. It's not twitchy or frame-perfect or anything - it's just that you hold onto your vehicle mode momentum during the transform animation, but have the handling of the robot mode.] Verus is probably the best pick here - G-Buster can one-shot things that you have to fight in the Skell.

The big open problem I see here is keeping up with level requirements (hard and de facto for bosses) before Irina hits Psycorruptor 13. The game's really balanced around the assumption that you aren't just going to bumrush everything. Hypothetically, there are probably a few spots where the fastest option is to try and suicide on the boss three times so you can put it into easy mode.

Really rough conjectural idea as to a sequence of mandatory content:

prologue
ch1
ch2
start probefessional
ch3
renewed will?
BLADE level basics
ch4
renewed will?
ch5
nine lives?
a friend in need
Noctilum 20%
ch6
nine lives?
skell license
noctilum license reqs [12 blitz blattas, solar starship map, armadillos if not already 8, mirrorstone if not already 1]
primordia license reqs [Shatshikh, ladybugs if not already 6]
Pip-Squeak?
oblivia license req [squashes if not already 3]
need lv30/$$ for Verus 30 by this point - dump Urban 20 immediately
close comrades? [during skell license test?]
matchmaker?
Oblivia 25%
ch7
nine lives?
spy games?
matchmaker?
Mira 10%
ch8
nine lives?
manhunt?
spy games?
sylvalum seabird's beak FN point
ch9
a girl's wings?
nine lives?
manhunt?
Sylvalum 15%
ch10
nine lives?
boot camp
Cauldros 15%
ch11
ch12

I'm not sure exactly when the fastest time to do a lot of the mandatory affinity quests/normal missions is.

EDIT:

Okay, so Control on tyrants is a no-go. No big deal, though, because you know what you can control?

The Everlasting Millesaurs by Biahno Lake. And they give you a shitload of experience. So - you get Irina to Psycorruptor 13, and that lets you Brainjack one of those, go into Overdrive, and start spamming Servant Sacrifice until it dies. Loads of experience.
Thread title:  
Hi, new here too (long time lurker, first time poster). I love Xenoblade X and am working on this as my first speedrun. After beating it for the first time, I have done several more playthroughs trying to figure things out. My best time so far is 10 hours 13 minutes (should be possible to lower this by a lot still).

I found the biggest issue to be lack of gear for the final Lao phase and so far I've tried to get around this by leveling to max. It would probably be faster to do it at a lower level and possibly drop the difficulty, which is what I'll be trying in my next runs. Another thing that needs to be planned around is getting affinity with Lao and Gwin.

My route was something like this:

(control Elma from Prologue until end of chapter 3)
Prologue
ch1
ch2
at start of ch. 3 get xp gear; do the Probe-fessional tasks (levels you to 8 for Glennar)
after ch. 3, control Gwin and level Cross/Elma/Lin to ~lvl 22 (til Cross gets Incendiary Edge) (hit blade level 2, maybe 3 during this)
[at some point during this part, I do Primordia 15% and some survey in lower Noctilum; I also get some FN sites in Oblivia and set up mining probes there to make good Theroid Slayer augments early]
Turn in Probefessional, Blade-level Basics
Renewed Will
start ch. 4, get Lao, control Cross, level to ~28 (to hit 30 just after skell license) ; should get you to blade level 4
do remaining part of noctilum 20%
stomp through ch4, ch 5, A friend in need, ch6
get skell license
Pick up treasure until enough money to buy 3 skells (need blade lvl 4 for this); most of it in oblivia, will get you 25% survey there
get sylvalum probe, farm phoenix/buster (I want at least 1 phoenix and 4 busters)
level to ~40 (keep Lao in team until he likes you enough, then get Gwin)
Close Comrades
Ch. 7
Matchmaker
Ch. 8
Spy Games
Manhunt
Ch. 9 (get 1 Upgraded Coil at the start)
Get 1 light speed jet fin (if I don't have it yet)
A Girl's Wings
15% Sylvalum + 10% Cauldros
buy fourth skell
Level to 60 on Tersqual in Sylvalum, then Aeviters in top part of noctilum (gets you some lvl 60 gear too)
Ch. 10
Nine Lives
Boot Camp
Ch. 11
spend remaining money on skell/ground gear
Ch. 12

In total I spend between 3 and 4 hours leveling which is...a lot I guess.

Other things I've noted:
You can do stuff on the GamePad during loading screens. I use this time to set up probes and move the map to the place I next want to teleport to to save a little time.

"Longjumping" is faster than running by about 10-15%.

Cross doesn't have good dps at least until (going for Duelist) Offensive Stance or even Incendiary Edge, so it's faster not to play him in the early game.

Theres a Research G5 probe in Noctilum in the cave Ensanguined Font (near FN 221; use Shadowrunner to get it) that you can use on FN 221 (can get both viewpoints there without skell) for 9k revenue; it's a big help for getting the 15k revenue for the skell license

The japanese xeno wiki is really helpful to get info. Chrome/Google translate does a good enough job of translating it. http://kamikouryaku.xsrv.jp/xenobladex/ It has all treasure locations and lots of other useful stuff.


About using Irina: the thing is that leveling her up takes time and she is not needed otherwise. You need to get 1 heart affinity with Lao by Chapter 8 and 1 heart with Gwin by Chapter 11 and playing more with Irina would mean less time with Lao/Gwin.
Also I haven't been able to get her Brainjack+Servant Sacrifice combo with any consistency. Takes me about 10 tries just to get one successful max XP kill (I never get it without the debuff soul voice and according to Prima guide that has only a ~20% chance on Draw Ranged to occur with characters that have it). You can't just save and reload because the game resets your TP to zero, so on every fail you need to get your TP up again. Still, there is a potential time saver in this if you could make it work more reliably. Maybe her Rank 16 talent helps with this, I haven't tried with that yet.

You said something about getting light skells for movement speed. Are light skells indeed faster or just more mobile?

Hope we can have a productive discussion on this game!
Light skells are definitely faster from anecdotal experience, though I don't have hard data. I mean, let's be clear here - I'm not nearly patient enough to run this as it is now; I'm mostly here to try and help you figure out routing. Hope I can be useful there.

Something that occurs to me: I was originally thinking that level 50 Skell frames were unattainable in speedruns, but they just need Sakuraba 5, right? That's a lot of miranium, but it's not nearly as much as the other AMs. And a decent level 50 frame can basically solo everything up to final Lao.

So here's something totally out of left field. I'd try building something to test the logistics out on my main but, unfortunately, you can't re-fight Lao: fight him in a level 50 skell. Don't even bother with ground gear or endgame party skells, just build one ludicrously OP lv50 and solo everything.

Lao drains all your fuel, yeah. But you can get a G-Buster or a Heathorn in before he does that, and that'll stagger him and let you get a bind. Idea is basically to stunlock him - as long as you keep at least one Stagger-inducing art available at all times, you should be able to burn the fuel you got out of the bind on that before he drains all your fuel again, which means you just get to smack him with a G-Buster as soon as it's ready while your party is able to safely chip away at his health during the bind.

The big question mark with this strat would be the adds. I think Lao has to spawn them in himself, but I'm not positive, and they could be a problem if they attack you while you're stunlocking him. Of course, even if that's the case - you have Sakuraba 5 and a level 50 skell frame with this strat, so you'd probably be fine as long as you built it for evasion.
Edit history:
Moostache15: 2016-01-20 09:53:46 am
Just wanted to pop in, also a long-time lurker and speedrunning fan, but never tried it myself. I've been pretty addicted to this game since release and feel like optimizing this would be lots of fun. Can't realistically run it myself, but I want to keep tabs on this thread and hopefully be able to help out. Already at 10hrs is encouraging, Nepumuk!

I do think afti you're right about just getting a lv 50 to stun lock Lao. That's what I did in my 2nd playthrough and I beat him pretty fast. Of course I had many more hours to develop it than what's realistic for a speedrun, but I think it's worth looking into. Oh and I just noticed there is a nice 8hr speedrun already up on speedrun.com.
Edit history:
afti: 2016-01-20 09:26:24 pm
afti: 2016-01-20 09:26:19 pm
afti: 2016-01-20 09:24:42 pm
afti: 2016-01-20 09:22:59 pm
afti: 2016-01-20 07:37:39 pm
afti: 2016-01-20 07:36:50 pm
afti: 2016-01-20 07:36:24 pm
Oh, right, some Skell movement optimization stuff:

As far as I can tell, the single fastest movement type in the game is when you have a Skell hovering over water. Animation's the same as flying, but if you're considered "grounded" on the water surface you're going to move a hell of a lot faster.

The major takeaways with this:

- Seabird's Beak approach. Don't use the archipelago leading up there like you're "supposed" to, because it'll kick you out of hover mode. Keep to the open ocean as long as possible.

- Cauldros movement. You enter over-water hover if you're in a lava pit that's too deep to stand in, too. What this means is that you're generally going to move faster on the bottom level, and you should be trying to plan routes around the magma lakes, to maximize the amount of time you spend in this movement mode. Obviously, don't sacrifice a straight-line flight for a much more convoluted grounded approach - but if you have a decent run over lava take it. If you got the Sylvalum 15% from the lower section of the map, it might be faster to break into Cauldros over water? Jump over the eastern wall and then just move straight until you hit Cauldros.

- Lifehold Core approach. Obvious advantage in staying on the water's surface as long as possible here - though you do want to start ascending as you approach; this isn't faster by such a dramatic degree that it's worth just shooting there at hover level and making a straight vertical climb instead of doing something more efficient. You want to have your heading in when you finally hit ZR, and you should be able to just start climbing from the water level and land directly on the platform; if you're actually spending any time moving in the air outside of the initial climb, though, you're wasting time that could've been spent on the water.

It'd be really useful in Noctilum, too, but unfortunately you should be nearly done with Noctilum for the rest of the game by the time you get Skells.
So I skipped through LeGrandGrands video for a bit. Haven't had time to watch the whole thing (or play much lately) but there's some good stuff in there.

He gets Irina to Rank 13, then starts battles with the monsters NEXT to the Milesaur at the lake and waits until his teammates shout a debuff soul voice, then targets and takes control of the Milesaur and sacrifice it for max XP. Very clever. Also he only gets one Skell and uses that mostly to drive around and for the Chimeras in the boss fight.  Most of the other time he uses Elma and (infinite?) overdrive and just obliterates everything with it. I gotta say, I really underestimated how great overdrive is... it's the way to go for speedruns.


Edit history:
afti: 2016-02-06 12:01:46 am
Overdrive is indeed pretty borked - it's why my initial thought was to ditch Skell combat entirely for the last stretch of the game.

Passing thought: I think the Japanese version would actually be a lot faster, come to think of it? Because the grinding missions aren't postgame unlocks in that version - they're DLC, and they're available as soon as you purchase them. Which is important because it makes miranium something you can actually count on. You get a ton of miranium dumped on you with every clear of the mission, instead of having to fuck with mining. Which means you can definitely level AMs.

It also provides the most efficient means for affinity grinding - so you don't need to worry so much about micro-managing party composition throughout the game, as long as your more-optimal party setup buys enough time to run the affinity grinding quest a few times.

How would you route for that version?
Edit history:
Nepumuk: 2016-02-25 02:29:49 am
Nepumuk: 2016-02-25 01:44:39 am
I'm currently reworking my route to use the Irina leveling trick and Infinite Overdrive (the boss fights are notably harder now). Doing it this way, only about 1.5 hours are needed for leveling and amazingly you still get (just) enough affinity with both Gwin and Lao.

I don't have access to the Japanese version of the game but I guess it would only really affect the leveling phase of the run? You still have to do all the normal stuff, missions, survey etc. So I am not sure if it would really be faster or by how much.
Did my second run with the new route this week. It went quite well overall. Got a 6:14. Gotta improve on the Vita fight and some other stuff.

Hi. I kind of did a run of this game earlier this week. I got a...well, I'll say it wasn't a terribly remarkable time, but the only thing remarkable to note is that I got a sub 30 Glennar with strats that I don't notice others doing as often, so I wasn't sure where the discrepancies lied other than (1) I'm used MC and (2) I get some beam resistant equipment beforehand to take off some of the pressure in the fight. Anyway, if people are curious about my early game, here's the video:
http://www.twitch.tv/doicm/v/50191773
Hi doicm, great to see more people running this game! I like your idea with the beam res gear. The only problem I see is that buying that stuff from the shop costs time (and money). However,  I realized that Elma's starting gear actually has beam resistance, while Cross' Prototype gear has weakness to beam. I tried giving Cross one or two gear pieces from Elma and the beam res really increases his/her survivability. This should make the fight easier/faster. Good find!