World in Danger - February 13, 2018

Edit history:

SDAVerification: 2018-02-13 02:21:15 pm

2018-01-16 07:57:17 am

Game Page: Doesn't exist yet

World in Danger () (pc) [Any %] [Single Segment] [Easy] [All Missions]

Decision: Reject

Reason: In many ways a good attempt, but more time can still come off

https://queue.speeddemosarchive.com/verificationfiles/2128/

This run will be available for a month. After that these link(s) will no longer work.

Thread title:

SDAVerification

2018-01-16 07:57:18 am

Run Information

World in Danger () (pc) [Any %] [Single Segment] [Easy] [All Missions]

Verification Files

http://v.speeddemosarchive.com/worldindanger-20180109/

Please refer to the Verification Guidelines before posting.

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ktwo

2018-01-21 01:27:21 am

A few questions:

1. You made a detour around 2:55 for 10+ seconds. Can there be hostages in that area? Assuming yes, wouldn't it still be reasonable to just skip that area and hope for good RNG (like in this attempt)? Since it's so early in the run and the massive cost of time for the detour, maybe it's worth just accepting it's going to be a reset point for certain percentage of the attempts?
2. At around 26:08, you made another detour for seemingly no reason. Could there be enemies there? If yes, I then assume all enemies had to be dealt with before proceeding to the door?
3. You've labeled this "All Missions". But isn't this simply the only way to play the game? Sure, you can select which level you'd like to play, but the only meaningful way to say you have completed the game is to beat all levels, right?

S4M

2018-01-21 06:44:39 am

(✿╹◡╹)

Addressing your questions.

1. There can be hostages in that location and it is actually very rare for there to NOT be a hostage there. But, you do make a good point. It is only 2-3 minutes into the run and could be a reset point. This is where my newbie-ness in speed running really shows (>~<;)
2. In that mission enemies usually spawn from both directions. And yes, you need to kill all the enemies before you can proceed to the next part of the level. The "enter" icon thingy doesn't show up otherwise, you can't just run all the way to the end.
3. And yeah, playing those missions is the only way to play the story of the game. The reason I can select any level is because I already beat the game, at that point all levels are available to be replayed even with the bonus characters.
There is an optional boss attack mode that unlocks after completing the story; that just does all the bosses one after an other with a dedicated ranking page. I was hoping to post a run of that on the highest difficulty at some point.
But to the topic at hand, it would be accurate to say that the "all-missions" could also just be considered "beating the game" or "story mode" as I believe the game calls it in the menu.

I hope this answers your questions.

Addressing your questions.

1. There can be hostages in that location and it is actually very rare for there to NOT be a hostage there. But, you do make a good point. It is only 2-3 minutes into the run and could be a reset point. This is where my newbie-ness in speed running really shows (>~<;)
2. In that mission enemies usually spawn from both directions. And yes, you need to kill all the enemies before you can proceed to the next part of the level. The "enter" icon thingy doesn't show up otherwise, you can't just run all the way to the end.
3. And yeah, playing those missions is the only way to play the story of the game. The reason I can select any level is because I already beat the game, at that point all levels are available to be replayed even with the bonus characters. 
There is an optional boss attack mode that unlocks after completing the story; that just does all the bosses one after an other with a dedicated ranking page. I was hoping to post a run of that on the highest difficulty at some point.
But to the topic at hand, it would be accurate to say that the "all-missions" could also just be considered "beating the game" or "story mode" as I believe the game calls it in the menu.

I hope this answers your questions.

ktwo

2018-01-25 09:28:51 am

Sorry for not being very timely with my reply. This week is a bit bad for me.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it doesn't seem like it's a particularly risky run overall. Your health was usually in pretty good shape and it didn't look like there were any very precise tricks. So it then boils down to getting the overall execution right and hope for a good combination of random factors.

From what I could see, the execution in this run was mostly accurate and looked overall good without major mistakes. However, I also have to say that I don't think it looked "unmatchable".
The random factors seem to have been a bit meh. And add to that the 10+ seconds detour that could have been avoided.

Considering you achieved this run in a fairly short time span, the above observations tell me that the time could still go down a bit with more attempts. Are you still interested in making attempts of this game?

S4M

2018-01-30 04:39:14 am

(✿╹◡╹)

It is not a super technical run, you just have to know where to go and know the clue behind each boss. And of course be lucky with the RNG. I'm confident I took the shortest possible routes and all and all got pretty lucky with the randomness (quick level 4, where I found the bombs about 60-70% through the normal path I usually follow to find them. Quick Red Wolf boss as he didn't do his super attack even once.)

I do plan on doing some more attempts. I'm working/trying to do an Any% run on challenge mode; in this mode it only takes two hits (especially with the speedy characters) for the player to be defeated and results in a level retry and thus major time loss. Trying to find a balance between surviving and speeding past it all is tricky.
Another attempt I want to do is the "Ironman Boss Attack" mode. All the bosses back to back without health refills.

LotBlind

2018-02-02 10:44:52 am

A very common mistake especially with newer runners is looking for great RNG when you don't quite have great planning or great practice down. The runs ends up lacking more in the latter two departments than the former. We also have quite high expectations regardless of whether the game is more straightforward or involved to run. In fact, the simpler the game, the more scrutiny we will place on it because it's easier to tell what's going on. It's only fair though seeing as you won't have had to work so hard otherwise.

Here's some very small and slightly bigger points

0:39 - here you veer to the right further than necessary. Fastest path is touching the corner of the building on the left. If necessary, kill the other guy when you're coming back to the right.
3:15 - An unnecessarily wide turn going around the baddie I think.
3:25 - a really small point: should probably have rescued this guy from the bottom side, not the right side.
4:23 - I don't see why you shouldn't move diagonally at the start of this mission... or do you have to wait for a greater chance that the guy is facing the other way? I think in general there must be a possibility of luring the guy further away from the pillar thing in the middle earlier so you can then keep circling around him, making it a bit faster despite the i-frames the guy has. It looks like he only ever turns rapidly after you've stepped into the cone and never outside that, so I don't get why you're being so conservative. Is there something I'm missing?
8:44 - Waited a bit too long after she'd already started dying.
10:42 - What do you do here? Mistake?
11:53 - You keep spamming fire a lot, which doesn't lose you time, but you're not always spamming at potential locations where the boss will appear, which would actually save some time.
13:38 - Could have spammed fire as you go around the corner here, not only after. This is called pre-firing.
13:59 - I noticed you don't actually pre-place the cursor coming from the score screen to the mission select screen. You could put it somewhere close to where the next mission will be, or even directly on it using cues from the score screen itself. Is it possible to do this on other screens as well, as clicking "proceed" to enter a mission? I think you do do it sometimes, just not every time.
18:12 - How can you tell which one's real? Is it just where the sound's coming from? Also, is there any kind of warning for the first gas grenade? I couldn't see where it came from at all. Any point trying to spam fire during the "malfunction" time, or in general?
21:20 - So in this mission, somewhat like the first one, I feel you're wasting time by stopping completely until you've killed each enemy. Instead, you've got to start moving before they're dead, hurling the last bullets from a longer distance.
22:54 - Is there by any chance enough room to maneuver around each/some of the terminals so you could attract a missile on the far left but keep hacking on the far right? I think there's a bit of leeway to be more efficient here seeing as the second missile blows up pretty close to you and you're typically way far away from the explosions. It's something you can use visual/audio cues to make a consistent setup where you know you're not taking damage seeing as you can exactly manipulate where the explosions will be. How much damage is it btw and does it actually interrupt the hacking? A small thing but you could have also started moving before it reaches 100% each time, positioning yourself to be as close to the next terminal as possible.
23:32 - These bullets look dodgeable without stopping the hack. The damage is really small as well.
24:20 - I think you could definitely just hover around these terminals until they're fully hacked, saving a little bit of time lost when traveling between them.
28:20 - This boss fight seemed to go well. Same with the next one (how can the final boss be so easy?)

The mission-end summary screen says something can be skipped. Is that just the score countdown?

Are you absolutely sure it isn't faster to run around as the ninja guy? His ability gives him a huge movement boost.

I wonder if spamming fire less in some fights would help you concentrate on taking more of those difficult predictive long-range shots? There's just not that much to do to speed it up in many places so little things (and the lack thereof) get highlighted.

BTW: Do you think going for all S's would be very different from just running challenge mode normally? If they're fairly similar, maybe going for an all S run would be the most interesting instead of just challenge mode?

I think I'll wait for your response.

A very common mistake especially with newer runners is looking for great RNG when you don't quite have great planning or great practice down. The runs ends up lacking more in the latter two departments than the former. We also have quite high expectations regardless of whether the game is more straightforward or involved to run. In fact, the simpler the game, the more scrutiny we will place on it because it's easier to tell what's going on. It's only fair though seeing as you won't have had to work so hard otherwise.

Here's some very small and slightly bigger points

0:39 - here you veer to the right further than necessary. Fastest path is touching the corner of the building on the left. If necessary, kill the other guy when you're coming back to the right.
3:15 - An unnecessarily wide turn going around the baddie I think.
3:25 - a really small point: should probably have rescued this guy from the bottom side, not the right side.
4:23 - I don't see why you shouldn't move diagonally at the start of this mission... or do you have to wait for a greater chance that the guy is facing the other way? I think in general there must be a possibility of luring the guy further away from the pillar thing in the middle earlier so you can then keep circling around him, making it a bit faster despite the i-frames the guy has. It looks like he only ever turns rapidly after you've stepped into the cone and never outside that, so I don't get why you're being so conservative. Is there something I'm missing?
8:44 - Waited a bit too long after she'd already started dying.
10:42 - What do you do here? Mistake?
11:53 - You keep spamming fire a lot, which doesn't lose you time, but you're not always spamming at potential locations where the boss will appear, which would actually save some time.
13:38 - Could have spammed fire as you go around the corner here, not only after. This is called pre-firing.
13:59 - I noticed you don't actually pre-place the cursor coming from the score screen to the mission select screen. You could put it somewhere close to where the next mission will be, or even directly on it using cues from the score screen itself. Is it possible to do this on other screens as well, as clicking "proceed" to enter a mission? I think you do do it sometimes, just not every time.
18:12 - How can you tell which one's real? Is it just where the sound's coming from? Also, is there any kind of warning for the first gas grenade? I couldn't see where it came from at all. Any point trying to spam fire during the "malfunction" time, or in general?
21:20 - So in this mission, somewhat like the first one, I feel you're wasting time by stopping completely until you've killed each enemy. Instead, you've got to start moving before they're dead, hurling the last bullets from a longer distance.
22:54 - Is there by any chance enough room to maneuver around each/some of the terminals so you could attract a missile on the far left but keep hacking on the far right? I think there's a bit of leeway to be more efficient here seeing as the second missile blows up pretty close to you and you're typically way far away from the explosions. It's something you can use visual/audio cues to make a consistent setup where you know you're not taking damage seeing as you can exactly manipulate where the explosions will be. How much damage is it btw and does it actually interrupt the hacking? A small thing but you could have also started moving before it reaches 100% each time, positioning yourself to be as close to the next terminal as possible.
23:32 - These bullets look dodgeable without stopping the hack. The damage is really small as well.
24:20 - I think you could definitely just hover around these terminals until they're fully hacked, saving a little bit of time lost when traveling between them.
28:20 - This boss fight seemed to go well. Same with the next one (how can the final boss be so easy?)

The mission-end summary screen says something can be skipped. Is that just the score countdown?

Are you absolutely sure it isn't faster to run around as the ninja guy? His ability gives him a huge movement boost.

I wonder if spamming fire less in some fights would help you concentrate on taking more of those difficult predictive long-range shots? There's just not that much to do to speed it up in many places so little things (and the lack thereof) get highlighted.

BTW: Do you think going for all S's would be very different from just running challenge mode normally? If they're fairly similar, maybe going for an all S run would be the most interesting instead of just challenge mode?

I think I'll wait for your response.

S4M

2018-02-06 02:10:47 pm

(✿╹◡╹)

Wow, thank you for the insight. I can fully understand the high standards for the runs archived on this site. And as a starter, I do need to focus more on a good plan, rather than good RNG.

The specific points:
0:39 - You are correct, that could have been better. I do want to point out that the player's bullets don't travel much further than the edge of the screen. But you are correct, looking back I could have kept further to the right.
3:15 - True I could have stuck closer to the enemy.
3:25 - As in it would have put me closer to the next route?
4:23 - Inspired by your suggestions, I did some experimenting. To start off, yes you can easily guide him away from the pillar to any other spot. He just keeps running towards the last position he has seen you. I further explored the idea of continually circling him and keeping his back towards me. And to my surprise it is possible! You can manipulate the turning direction of the vision cone with correct positioning.
I also found a good spot between two tables, where I can fire at the boss, hide when he turns around towards me and because I'm hiding the boss turns back around to walk to the other side of the table, opening himself up for attack again.
8:44 - It could have been slightly faster yes.
10:42 - Accidentally pressed escape ( 〃．．)
11:53 - Essentially I should just keep firing non-stop and aim toward the likely reappear points.
13:38 - You are correct I could have fired sooner.
13:59 - I did for the character menu, but yes, I could also do this for the mission selection menu or atleast stick to a location closer to the next mission select click.
18:12 - Yes the sound, but also the shadow on the ground. The real one has a shadow, the clones don't. That first grenade is thrown just like any other, I just need to spot where the boss comes from before he gets a chance to surprise me.
During the "signal lost" moment I can't really do anything. I think the controls get locked out.
21:20 - Keep moving sounds like a better idea, yes.
22:54 - Yes, I have done this before it is possible in a few locations to get a missile lock near one terminal and then run to a nearby terminal. I never considered deliberately manipulating the target locations, other then to avoid the incoming missile and run to the closest alternate terminal.
In terms of damage, on Easy mode it takes five missile hits to kill me. Getting hit doesn't interupt the hacking.
And you're right I should move sooner, just before the 100% is reached.
23:32 - Yes you can dodge these while remaining in range of the terminals, I do this on a few occassions.
24:20 - I will give this strategy a try then.
28:20 - Well... it is on Easy mode. On the harder difficulty the robot boss can insta-kill you with the missiles and the stomps.

The skipping in the score menu is only to speed up the game displaying the time, kills, etc. outcome and the points earned. Especially the points take long as they literally count the points from 0 to whatever you earned.

The girl character runs consistantly fast, the ninja guy has a speed boost you have to steer with aiming and it has a 5-6 second cooldown. Still I could do some testing to see which is faster over a fixed distance.

And getting all S-ranks in on itself is a difficult feat. To start the game needs to be in challenge mode, otherwise ranks are limited. It took me ages to do that in a casual play... I hadn't planned on doing an all S-rank speed run. It would be an impressive achievement indeed.

You have given me a lot to consider and test. This is exciting, now I can try to go even faster with some new strats (๑˃̵ᴗ˂̵)و
Thank you for the insight and suggestions!

Wow, thank you for the insight. I can fully understand the high standards for the runs archived on this site. And as a starter, I do need to focus more on a good plan, rather than good RNG.

The specific points:
0:39 - You are correct, that could have been better. I do want to point out that the player's bullets don't travel much further than the edge of the screen. But you are correct, looking back I could have kept further to the right.
3:15 - True I could have stuck closer to the enemy.
3:25 - As in it would have put me closer to the next route?
4:23 - Inspired by your suggestions, I did some experimenting. To start off, yes you can easily guide him away from the pillar to any other spot. He just keeps running towards the last position he has seen you. I further explored the idea of continually circling him and keeping his back towards me. And to my surprise it is possible! You can manipulate the turning direction of the vision cone with correct positioning.
I also found a good spot between two tables, where I can fire at the boss, hide when he turns around towards me and because I'm hiding the boss turns back around to walk to the other side of the table, opening himself up for attack again.
8:44 - It could have been slightly faster yes.
10:42 - Accidentally pressed escape ( 〃．．)
11:53 - Essentially I should just keep firing non-stop and aim toward the likely reappear points.
13:38 - You are correct I could have fired sooner.
13:59 - I did for the character menu, but yes, I could also do this for the mission selection menu or atleast stick to a location closer to the next mission select click.
18:12 - Yes the sound, but also the shadow on the ground. The real one has a shadow, the clones don't. That first grenade is thrown just like any other, I just need to spot where the boss comes from before he gets a chance to surprise me.
During the "signal lost" moment I can't really do anything. I think the controls get locked out.
21:20 - Keep moving sounds like a better idea, yes.
22:54 - Yes, I have done this before it is possible in a few locations to get a missile lock near one terminal and then run to a nearby terminal. I never considered deliberately manipulating the target locations, other then to avoid the incoming missile and run to the closest alternate terminal.
In terms of damage, on Easy mode it takes five missile hits to kill me. Getting hit doesn't interupt the hacking.
And you're right I should move sooner, just before the 100% is reached.
23:32 - Yes you can dodge these while remaining in range of the terminals, I do this on a few occassions.
24:20 - I will give this strategy a try then.
28:20 - Well... it is on Easy mode. On the harder difficulty the robot boss can insta-kill you with the missiles and the stomps.

The skipping in the score menu is only to speed up the game displaying the time, kills, etc. outcome and the points earned. Especially the points take long as they literally count the points from 0 to whatever you earned.

The girl character runs consistantly fast, the ninja guy has a speed boost you have to steer with aiming and it has a 5-6 second cooldown. Still I could do some testing to see which is faster over a fixed distance.

And getting all S-ranks in on itself is a difficult feat. To start the game needs to be in challenge mode, otherwise ranks are limited. It took me ages to do that in a casual play... I hadn't planned on doing an all S-rank speed run. It would be an impressive  achievement indeed.

You have given me a lot to consider and test. This is exciting, now I can try to go even faster with some new strats (๑˃̵ᴗ˂̵)و
Thank you for the insight and suggestions!

LotBlind

2018-02-07 08:22:05 am

3:25 - Yes.
4:23 - Call it my instinct Wink

I've seen quite a few runs by now.
11:53 - Yup.
13:59 - This is a trick particularly relevant to anyone who ever does point-and-click adventure speedruns, because in those games, there's typically not a lot to do to make it faster, and so I encourage people to actually find visual cues in the previous screen that helps you pre-position the cursor on the exact right spot. It's not like you're busy doing anything else at those times, so it looks lazy if you don't try, as you say.
18:12 - I encourage experimenting with counter-intuitive strategies here. Maybe there's some particular area where you can stand to make the boss spawn consistently close to you, or not throw grenades, or whatever it is.
22:54 - So you could basically just tank several hits wherever that saves the most time. Also, what I meant was is it possible to dodge a missile without interrupting hacking OR taking damage anywhere or are the explosions too big?

We're always happy when runners don't give up straight away! I'm looking forwards to seeing what you can come up with!

reject for now

3:25 - Yes.
4:23 - Call it my instinct ;) I've seen quite a few runs by now.
11:53 - Yup.
13:59 - This is a trick particularly relevant to anyone who ever does point-and-click adventure speedruns, because in those games, there's typically not a lot to do to make it faster, and so I encourage people to actually find visual cues in the previous screen that helps you pre-position the cursor on the exact right spot. It's not like you're busy doing anything else at those times, so it looks lazy if you don't try, as you say.
18:12 - I encourage experimenting with counter-intuitive strategies here. Maybe there's some particular area where you can stand to make the boss spawn consistently close to you, or not throw grenades, or whatever it is.
22:54 - So you could basically just tank several hits wherever that saves the most time. Also, what I meant was is it possible to dodge a missile without interrupting hacking OR taking damage anywhere or are the explosions too big?

We're always happy when runners don't give up straight away! I'm looking forwards to seeing what you can come up with!

reject for now

ktwo

2018-02-09 07:06:25 am

I think there are many good points to take away from this run, but I also think there is potential for improvement in several areas. This is a pretty neat-looking speedgame, so I'm looking forward to hopefully seeing a faster run that addresses some of the feedback that has been brought up here. While waiting for a potential improvement, I think this submission should be put on hold.

SDAVerification

2018-02-13 02:21:16 pm

Decision posted.

S4M

2018-02-19 12:54:59 am

(✿╹◡╹)

Thanks for the input everyone, I'll give submitting a run another go after perfecting a run. (￣`Д´￣)9