Papyrus skip. get caught 3 times by getting dmg. attack by blue attack 4 times for the first cycle. movement out of the Doghouse. he will always heal you to full 20 hp so dmg boosting before hand won't work. this should save 1-2 mins off the normal 5-7 min fight.
(Testing) Laser skips- after the metaton fight heal with bandage so you'll get 11 hp. go past volcano and tsudere like normal but reduce back to 1 hp. when you get to the first set of lasers stand still on the first orange laser. dodge all the attacks. this will deactivate plus a few words. *don't get hit otherwise will be greeted with a much longer text* the laser that will deactivate is the bomb fight.
If you aim for 12,000 points you can beat Mettaton EX before he does his first Heart attack, which is pretty awesome. It might be possible to score enough points by shooting things to end the fight before the essay question. I'm still trying to make that happen.
The fight ends when you give a command after you hit at least 12,000 ratings. If you break 12,000, dip below 12,000 immediately after, and then get back up to 12,000 with your next action (eg, pose) the fight will still end on time. That might not even be necessary - I didn't test what happens if you dip below and just keep going.
There are six types of armor available to that point (Ribbon, Mandanna, Old Tutu, Apron, Cloudy Glasses and Cowboy Hat, bandages don't help you because you can't equip them again). If you use five of those, you'll get 7,500 points on top of your starting 4,000 for a total of 11,500. The item you have equipped at the start of the fight doesn't count, so you'll either need all six types of armor, or you'll have to keep the bandages equipped up to the Mettaton EX fight so you can get away with just five types of armor.
You can score 350 points on the essay if you give any answer including the word "legs" (or if you just type 'legs' and nothing else). Most other answers net you 200 points. This might not be the highest scoring answer, but it gets you to 11,850 minus whatever you lost for time spent in menus. I don't think there's any benefit to looking for a higher scoring answer.
You'll score points for taking damage (starting with 50 points, diminishing each time you take damage) and for shooting anything, though enemies like the mini-mettaton and bombs seem to be worth more. If you do the essay question, this will effortlessly add up to 12,000 after the essay. With enough of these points, you might be able to skip the essay too.
If you plan ahead, you can arrange the order you equip the armor to end on your preferred armor for the finale, which is probably going to be the apron. Just don't mess up and equip the same item twice and waste a turn!
All the armor seems to be along the main path, and if you're doing 100% yellow names you should have enough gold to buy the Mandanna, Cloudy Glasses and Cowboy hat with some room to spare. You don't even need to use the stick!
^SirNiko that totally legit. tested it out and it fees-able to do this in the run. getting the cowboy hat and the empty gun would be the obstacle but that could be work around. the issue now is how quick would this be in the overall run. Only further tests are necessary.
The fight ends when you give a command after you hit at least 12,000 ratings. If you break 12,000, dip below 12,000 immediately after, and then get back up to 12,000 with your next action (eg, pose) the fight will still end on time. That might not even be necessary - I didn't test what happens if you dip below and just keep going.
I would assume that you would have to boost it back up to 12k in order to end the fight. That's how it works for ending the fight normally with 10k, if memory serves; it has to be at 10k when Mettaton starts his turn.
*SirNiko* done some testing with the boss fight with and without and using 4 items. Items 1min 4s. without 3min+. 4 item 1 min 20s.
Notes-Overall you save about 2 mins but you probably lose 1 min for getting certain items and unable to skip some fights. that doesn't matter for yellow but the regular run this kinda matters a bit since we usually need 350 by the hotel for gun. we can't skip volcan 20g or candle 60g (guess-imated drops). the dogs fights pays for the book 45g and mandana 50g. ribbon and tutu loses movement time by 10s total. Cowboy Hat unfortunately can't be substituted over empty gun since gun "potentially" make a 19-20 cycle Asgore into 15-18 cycle Asgore (11 if we somehow manage pure perfects hits).
*SirNiko* done some testing with the boss fight with and without and using 4 items. Items 1min 4s. without 3min+. 4 item 1 min 20s.
Notes-Overall you save about 2 mins but you probably lose 1 min for getting certain items and unable to skip some fights. that doesn't matter for yellow but the regular run this kinda matters a bit since we usually need 350 by the hotel for gun. we can't skip volcan 20g or candle 60g (guess-imated drops). the dogs fights pays for the book 45g and mandana 50g. ribbon and tutu loses movement time by 10s total. Cowboy Hat unfortunately can't be substituted over empty gun since gun "potentially" make a 19-20 cycle Asgore into 15-18 cycle Asgore (11 if we somehow manage pure perfects hits).
First off - SirNiko and Hatter, thank you for the research and the timing information. I've been mulling over this since lunch today and may have some ideas for TPE.
(1) Scratch the Cowboy Hat. That's not feasible for TPE. (2) Bandana can be easily retrieved at the start of the game. This now forces us to spare the Pyrope (60G). (3) Tutu is a must-get. Movement loses very little time and we save 2 cycles optimally. (4) Notebook might be useful. Haven't discovered how to make up the cost for this optimally, but I'm thinking Shyren (25G), because we should have gold left over to grab it.
We finally broke 2 HOURS! Big shoutout to everyone in this thread for all the tricks and strats we have discovered together. A big list of all of them here for future runners to look into:
Wallhumping (Ruins, Waterfall, etc. - saves in total about 30 sec.) Papyrus Skip (saves 45 sec.) Undyne AI Manipulation (consistency strat) Conveyor Belt Skip (saves 1.5 sec.) Mettaton Quiz Skip (saves 45-60 sec.) Mettaton Opera Skip (saves 30 sec.) Mettaton Fight Skip (saves 2 min.!)
And of course the stick strats (~1-2 min.) and the Muffet Skip (5 min.)!
A MAJOR update with the Mettaton Fight for TPE: we now do not need to farm ANY gold! In fact, we grab all armor except for the Cowboy Hat up to the Mettaton fight, which (although riskier) allows us to complete the fight right after the essay sequence!
A little while ago I confirmed you can beat Mettaton EX before the essay by earning enough points from shooting and taking damage. I'm pretty sure it's impossible to beat the fight faster than that.
Just like you said, spam bullets against the arms in the first phase (although try not to get hit, using an even number of bullets ensures the arm stops moving when you're ready to dodge it). When Mettaton sends bombs and robots against you, take as much damage as necessary to make sure you destroy nearly all of them. In the third attack, spam the arms for points, and in the fourth attack make sure you kill all the mini-mettatons for points. If you get to the end with HP to spare, take damage for a few more Violence points.
It's kind of nice the points work out so precisely to make this possible.
Found a warping glitch in Undertale a few days ago and thought I might post it here for more people to check out/potentially test. Essentially if you have a dimensional box open as you hit a loading zone then you warp to diff location on the map that you are loading into. Currently softlocks, but it has potential and is pretty neat.
If anyone can think of any other places where you can are automatically moved into a loading zone then that'd be great to test. I've currently only tried in the lab.
I leave to study for midterms for a week and come back to this? Congratulations to you and Tux! Hopefully I can stick around streams for a while now and see a sub 1:50. Although I should probably practice a lot more now.
Speaking of loading zones, it's possible to get an encounter while loading onto the next screen. This just skips the encounter and the game continues as normal. Although maybe worth to remember if by chance we find a way to manipulate encounters, it would have benefit in pacifist.
Dimensional Box Warping looks EXTREMELY promising. As for potential usages (will test later):
(1) Hotlands - Room before puzzle containing moving area with 3 blue lasers - what happens if we get into an encounter on the blue lasers this way? (2) Any difference if we use Box A as opposed to Box B? If this is an intentional effect, then this could be interesting...
As for the frame-perfect encounter setup, I have encountered that a while ago and can confirm that it wouldn't be useful in most cases, and the only potential usage is the encounter in Hotlands with Tsundereplane + Vulcan, since we can move into the puzzle room ahead. But in the end unless there's an advantage to using this (i.e. wrong warp, etc.) it probably won't save any time and is "random" enough anyways.
(1) Good Question (2) I tested with A and B, and whether changing items in the box/in your inventory effect anything, and no it does not. It is having the dimensional box menu up that causes the glitch to happen.
I've found a few frame savers that I didn't see the current WR run use, so I'm assuming they haven't been discovered yet:
(1) In the Ruins, the first rock you have to push can be pushed by holding down+right from the top side (or up+right from the bottom side), which is a little faster than pushing it from behind as intended. (2) In Hotland, you can skip Alphys' phone call explaining the orange and blue lasers by hugging the bottom edge of the corridor. (You'll still get the "OMG I DID IT" and subsequent notifications regardless.)
hey I got a wr but I don't feel like taking up the page seeing as it doesn't have any new tricks, just a summarization of the genocide route as I know it. The Empty Gun isn't the only option, so if you hate it, the time loss won't be too God-awful.
I'm going to explain the route for Genocide because Genocide, despite being one of the shortest routes, has fewer competitors than the other categories. I personally enjoy it because it's the shortest category, and also provide save files. I know there's probably already an explanation of it somewhere on here or speedrun.com, but I'm going to try to explain what I can to the extent of practicality.
RUINS (Can someone provide an encounter total for this? I have a really bad history of losing count. I think it's 20 but I'm not confident in my number retention skills.) -Mash with ZX and Enter/Shift. Not only will it make it more consistent that you don't have half-a-second pauses, but it'll make your text mashing more consistent. -It's faster to memorize the menu path to talk to the dummy (right z z right z) than it is to just mash z/enter and kill it with the weakest attack you can. -Kill the first froggit, as it counts for your encounter total iirc (Reset if you don't because this Froggit has 20 HP; less than pretty much anything else in the game) -Grab the monster candy (room north of the first save) for candy strats (CANDY STRAT EXPLANATION) Candy strats are basically "I can reduce the time an attack takes by ramming into certain attacks (Migosp when no other monsters are in the battle, and Froggit when it uses its jumping attack) and use the Monster Candy to heal for 10 HP per candy." -Go through the ruins as fast as possible. Don't stay behind at the start and grind encounters. -The room with the three rocks: you should just move the bottom rock, as the middle and upper rock have no effect on the spikes being disabled. -Get the Toy Knife and equip it. -Grind encounters (Check periodically, try to keep count to 20-ish and check frequently for "But nobody came." -Mash through dialogue, pick up the pie, more dialogue, ask to leave, mash through dialogue, kill Toriel, split ends when you regain control, then you weep gently to yourself as you're probably really desensitized to this kind of travesty anyway -You monster
SNOWDIN Encounters: 16 -Get tough glove, drop everything inside (pie optional if you're scared you might use it preemptively) after reequipping -Grind encounters until you've got one left -Breeze through the text -Doggo: Just kill him. -Dogamy/Dogaressa: Kill the Dogaressa first, and then you can one-shot Dogamy and even if you don't, his attack is pathetic. -Take lower route through puzzle -Go through ice puzzle, head forward -Two-shot Greater Dog (You can Candy Strat him if he's using the attack where he lays down and barks at your hitbox) -Last of the papyrus japes, enter snowdin town, exit, fight last encounter east of the bridge, run away after you've killed your last necessary monster (GOD I HATE JERRY SO MUCH), consider resetting if your standards are high and you get three monsters. -Don't steal anything, nothing's useful -Take the igloo tunnel (duh) -Kill off papyrus (Split ends when you regain control) -You monster
WATERFALL Encounters: 18 -Skip old tutu, sigh angrily as you sit through the undyne cutscenes for the millionth time -Get the ballet shoes (Take the first west path you encounter during the luminescent swamp area (I dunno what it's called)) -More Undyne scene RNG MANIPULATION STRATS FOR THE BRIDGE SPEARS: Undyne's RNG lances create their locations based on what direction you're moving in at that moment. You can twitch in the opposite direction to manipulate the spears and minimize potential time loss. Also, in the final room, you can start moving back as soon as you see the shore (maybe earlier?) PART 2: Kill the dummy with one very weak shot (it's got as much HP as the dummy from the beginning of the game) to save time At this point you should have 12 encounters left. -Memorize the path through the dark maze because nobody wants to take the time to go to the Temmie village just to be able to see where they're going -Hint: The Temmie Village is useless. -Temmie is actually a pretty good encounter because you can one-shot them like you would one-shot a dummy: mashing z/enter -REMEMBER YOUR ENCOUNTER NUMBER BECAUSE THERE'S NO SAVE POINT UNTIL RIGHT BEFORE UNDYNE AND IT'S A BIT OF A TIME LOSS TO WAIT UNTIL CHARA (red text) TELLS YOU THAT YOU DIDN'T KILL EVERYONE YET -Dummy-style one-shot the monster kid that gets blocked by Undyne -Wreck Undyne the Undying because you practiced this fight like you would a music recital, right? This fight is 90% memo and 10% dodging skill if you're good at the timed hits. If you're not good at timed hits it becomes 50% memo and 50% dodging skill (Good luck in that case) -You just killed the people's hero -You monster
HOTLAND Encounters: 40 -Don't worry about counting encounters yet because most of your encounters will be in the core (has its own section because I really have a bit to say here) -GRAB. THE. INSTANT. NOODLES. They restore 90 HP which is practically a second pie. -Skip the Burnt Pan because you're going to kill the hell out of the 5-10 enemies you fight anyway and most of your fights from here on will be in the Core, which by that point you'll be getting the Cowboy Hat and Empty Gun. -Left Floor 3 -One-shot Muffet -Do any beverage consumption, chat reading, etc when you kill her, because the cutscene for the spider mourning Muffet is long enough that you can get comfortable again or something. -You monster -Go to the shop east of the MTT entrance, get the Empty Gun and Cowboy Hat (second and third item in stock), be careful that you don't throw out/eat your pie or your noodles because unless you're confident with your skills against Sans, that's a reset. OPTIONAL/SITUATIONALYou can skip the Empty Gun here if you're really not confident in your abilities with it, as Tuxwizzle has said that it's very unwieldy (not an actual quote) and, while it's more reliable to me, I HAVE gotten PB hotland splits with Ballet Shoes before, so if you're good at Ballet Shoes, give it a try. If you accidentally throw away the Empty Gun through menu shenanigans, you can still get a pretty decent time with the Ballet Shoes. -Get a Mettaton face steak if you're not confident in your abilities to fight Sans
CORE Encounters: Around 35. Check because it's based on how many are left in Hotland. -Enter core, use elevator -At the first crossroad, north west north east, three scripted encounters on the bridge to get some free enemies. -Grind encounters on the bridge west of the door to Mettaton for about ten, fifteen minutes (I forget how long) and check your enemy count periodically if you're not good at counting. -Enemy HP because I get really annoyed when I don't one-shot Whimsalot: 90-100 Final Froggit: 100 Astigmatism: 120 Knight Knight: 230-240 Madjick: 180-200 -One-shot Mettaton NEO, the Underground's most beloved celebrity! -You monster. -Walk to the castle that looks a lot like Toriel's house -Grab the keys while mashing through Flowey's text -More mashing as you walk to Sans's room -Save before Sans to make yourself feel more comfortable -I hope you learned how to deal with Sans's fight because I'm not explaining the attacks. If you're good enough, you can figure out a route. All I'm going to say is that anything with three vertical tiers, it's best that you tend towards the bottom/middle. If you go to the top you risk shenanigans and damage. I could insert an adage about Greek mythology and wax wings and the sun and stuff but I don't think it's necessary. Do what I do if you're having trouble with a particular section, as I think I've practiced the fight enough to provide an example. -Wait for Sans to fall asleep before moving your frame to the fight command and killing Sans while he's asleep. -You monster. -Walk to the throne room (just keep walking up and right for as long as you can) -Kill Asgore. -You monster. -Kill Flowey. -You monster. -Talk to the Fallen Human for about 2 minutes (you can't skip through his text; have fun). -The split ends whether you choose to delete the world or you choose not to. You monster.
Removed spoilers for noticeability for when this game's discussion swamps this post
* Speedrunning is hard, yo. Parts of the game that I can just waltz through first-try on a casual run become difficult in the middle of a speedrun. (I'm looking at you, Undyne.) * My text mashing is decent, but I need to work on my menuing. * Three pets on Lesser Dog is enough to get the snowdogs built, but NOT enough to get the yellow text. So, this attempt was invalid. No biggie, it was good practice. I'll stick with Tux's 5 pets in the future. * I'm still unsure what gets Dummy's yellow text, but I've narrowed it down to not needing to Talk the entire fight. I talked once during the fight (first turn) and once after befriending Undyne, and got it. Not sure which did it. Talked to the first dummy, didn't interact with the second. * Useful: The Hotland steam-switch jumping puzzle can be glitched through. If you hit C/Ctrl on the same frame that you land, pulling up the menu overrides the vents switching, so you can jump straight across if you time it perfectly. This should be useful on all run categories, if you can consistently time the key. * I need to git gud at the Core enemies. Should've spent more time practicing those guys; they always gave me trouble without healing items. * Also need to git gud at using the gun. Never landed a crit against Asgore. Oh well, at least I'm good at dodging his attacks. * Useful: Throwing the stick for Amaldogmation stops it from attacking and still allows you to get its yellow text if you then do the usual steps. (Oh, Tux used this too in his new run.) The dogs in Snowden, however, still do their attacks even if you throw the stick, so no time to be saved with them. * 2:23:43 is a half-decent first try, but not good enough that I'd have submitted it even if it were valid. Still a ways to go before I'm satisfied.
I don't know if this is true or not, but during the ASRIEL lost soul portions, eating the butterscotch pie while saving ASGORE and TORIEL instantly saves them. If this is true, how much time would this add to the asgore fight (not eating the pie there), and how much time would it save on the asriel fight?
I don't know if this is true or not, but during the ASRIEL lost soul portions, eating the butterscotch pie while saving ASGORE and TORIEL instantly saves them. If this is true, how much time would this add to the asgore fight (not eating the pie there), and how much time would it save on the asriel fight?
Considering you reload your save after the asgore fight, you'd get to use it in both places.