Twilight Princess (GCN)

2006-11-25 11:54:02 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Well I finished in about 33 hours. Got like 3 bugs, 23 or so poes, and maybe 4 hearts into the second row of life (not sure how many). Kinda weird that pausing the game counts on time played. I really enjoyed the game. I'll probably go through it again pretty quickly, then a 3rd time this winter break going for 100%.

petrie911

2006-11-26 04:29:37 am

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

I finished the game last night. ~35 hours spent, although I did a lot of sidequests. I've been taking a break to play my newly downloaded Super Mario 64 on the virtual console. I can't believe I missed that game on the N64. It's really quite awesome.

SkippyJr

2006-11-26 04:57:18 am

Signboard of Hyrule

Might someone in the area (Fierce) try this? There might be a (possibly pointless timewise) SB in LT. In the top part of the gear room to the left, you can see two doors below. Jumping off the edge, you can reach (and then slide off of) the rock formation that covers the ledge for the doors. However, back-flipping or side-hopping from further in might get you to the ledges (avoiding the covering). The front corners of each ledge are not covered. Getting the CS early might be able to change the stair room state, like petrie911's LT glitch on page 6.

Here's a bit of a QA thing. If you lose your shield and try to learn a HT, the sequence starts but then you get kicked out. However, if you lost a shield, bought another one and did not equip it, the guy continually and unsuccessfully trys to teach you the HT (but does not tell you to equip the needed shield).

Acryte

Edit history:

Acryte: 2006-11-26 07:38:39 am

2006-11-26 06:57:14 am

Zelda Scientist®

Okay so might I add that you can do this:

Damage Boosts in TP:
Pull bomb, jump off edge, use specific item (Bow, Slingshot, Gale boomerang, lantern, bottle, clawshot) and it will drop the bomb. You can also press B or draw the sword. You can then follow it w/ a jumpslash. This may be useful since just holding it and jumping knocks you sideways or backwards which doesn't work. We may be able to use damage boosts off bombs in TP.

Edit: It works I damage boosted straight forwards and almost made it across a gap I can't jump over normally, I'll keep trying.

Edit: In the Yet's House I was SOOO close to getting to the second level of the house by damage boosting up the broken staircase. I am almost convinced this is possible. I landed up top and bounced off the stairs up top...

Also, if you want the bomb to instantly blow up when you drop it, use the gale boomerang and set staggered waypoints so that it loops alot. Then jump and shield drop it when it passes by you and the wind/boomerang will blow up the bomb. So, stagger waypoints then sworddrop jumpslash may be useful if timing it is easier. I usually time bombs though by letting it flash red 6 times and then jumping immediately.

Okay so might I add that you can do this:

Damage Boosts in TP:
Pull bomb, jump off edge, use specific item (Bow, Slingshot, Gale boomerang, lantern, bottle, clawshot) and it will drop the bomb. You can also press B or draw the sword. You can then follow it w/ a jumpslash. This may be useful since just holding it and jumping knocks you sideways or backwards which doesn't work. We may be able to use damage boosts off bombs in TP.

Edit: It works I damage boosted straight forwards and almost made it across a gap I can't jump over normally, I'll keep trying.

Edit: In the Yet's House I was SOOO close to getting to the second level of the house by damage boosting up the broken staircase. I am almost convinced this is possible. I landed up top and bounced off the stairs up top...

Also, if you want the bomb to instantly blow up when you drop it, use the gale boomerang and set staggered waypoints so that it loops alot. Then jump and shield drop it when it passes by you and the wind/boomerang will blow up the bomb. So, stagger waypoints then sworddrop jumpslash may be useful if timing it is easier. I usually time bombs though by letting it flash red 6 times and then jumping immediately.

Manocheese

2006-11-26 08:00:29 am

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

Quote:

Kinda weird that pausing the game counts on time played.

Pause time counts? I see. I often kept the game paused while I took a break to eat or use the restroom, so my time is probably closer to 35 hours instead of 40.

Kazooie

2006-11-26 09:33:46 am

Zelda Rulez!

Wow, awesome trick fierce Shocked

It's almost same than that your Forest Temple trick Smiley

TSA

2006-11-26 08:04:53 pm

Retired

http://www.thehylia.com/completion_time.jpg

I got a ton of Poe's Souls, and I did collect a ton of bugs (I think 14 out of 24) and I fished for about 2 hours (and did some of the mini-games to get the Frog's Lure).

AKA

2006-11-26 08:36:55 pm

He's back!

Just wondering...

Is the final completion time displayed at the end of the game.

Manocheese

2006-11-26 09:01:05 pm

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

Quote:

Just wondering...

Is the final completion time displayed at the end of the game.

No.

I am starting to really detest the controls in this game. No, not the remote--that works very well. Just the Wind Waker-esque inability to move fluidly like in OoT... I'm sure you all know what I mean.

Anyway, in Lakebed Temple, I think I just found something that could save a good bit of time, but I'm not sure... I'd have to go through a new file and get to that point to see if it actually helps much.

YautjaElder

2006-11-26 09:04:43 pm

Speed is the key.

Quote:

I am starting to really detest the controls in this game. No, not the remote--that works very well. Just the Wind Waker-esque inability to move fluidly like in OoT... I'm sure you all know what I mean.

Heh, I always thought it was easier to move around in The Wind Waker than OoT. But MM takes the price when it comes to flawed controls. Tongue

Kazooie

2006-11-26 09:21:17 pm

Zelda Rulez!

So if I'm right anybody have't found timesave tricks yet, right?
I think fierce have found first "main glitch" from TP. Like groung jump or superslide in OoT Roll Eyes

Manocheese

2006-11-26 09:26:03 pm

Yes, a cucco riding the ground.

Quote:

So if I'm right anybody have't found timesave tricks yet, right?

Someone found one where you can sidehop off a certain area and land on a platform you're not supposed to get to until a little later. I also found one that saves a negligible amount of time, and another that saves about a minute, but only helps you get a Heart Piece... Then there are those bridge things Fierce found, and I think I may have an application for one of them, but I'm not sure.

petrie911

2006-11-26 11:26:07 pm

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

Quote:

Heh, I always thought it was easier to move around in The Wind Waker than OoT. But MM takes the price when it comes to flawed controls. Tongue

What was so wrong with MM's controls, exactly?

mwl

Edit history:

mwl: 2006-11-27 12:46:28 am

2006-11-27 12:24:37 am

Quote:

I finished the game last night. ~35 hours spent, although I did a lot of sidequests.

Quote:

I often kept the game paused while I took a break to eat or use the restroom, so my time is probably closer to 35 hours instead of 40.

Quote:

I got a ton of Poe's Souls, and I did collect a ton of bugs (I think 14 out of 24) and I fished for about 2 hours (and did some of the mini-games to get the Frog's Lure).

Looks like the competition's on...

Quote:

Just wondering...

Is the final completion time displayed at the end of the game.

No, but your cumulative playing time is displayed on the file select screen. To find out your time, just look there after you've beaten the game.

FIERCELINKMASTER

2006-11-27 02:13:00 am

No the Quail is not riding the Q

Snowboard Trick

laughing_gas

2006-11-27 02:30:35 am

Existence as you know it is over

this game seems to have a lot of clipping glitches.

petrie911

Edit history:

petrie911: 2006-11-29 01:22:52 am

2006-11-27 02:34:06 am

Everybody loves Hypnotoad!

Which is good, right?

Edit: This was my 666th post...

TSA

Edit history:

TSA: 2006-11-27 05:17:23 am

2006-11-27 05:15:53 am

Retired

Hmm...apparently I beat the Water Temple a way that wasn't the way you're supposed to (and on my first try). I beat one whole area, making the water flow, without spinning some gears (not vertical gears, but horizontal)...comparing to the Player's Guide walkthrough.

Yeah, there's a lot of clipping bugs, but here's a good example of how much they checked out sequence breaks - I can get past the Gorons without Iron Boots, but even if you PASS them, they ROLL BACK AT YOU against GRAVITY AND MOMENTUM and HIT YOU BACK. Nice, huh?

I wonder if that was faster or slower.

TSA

2006-11-27 07:06:59 am

Retired

Alright, my first trick:

http://www.thehylia.com/no_iron_boots.avi

Saves maybe 20 seconds.

Aftermath

2006-11-27 07:41:33 am

Quits halfway

Has anyone checked out possible tricks in the Sky Temple yet? I know that my first time through I kept getting stuck on puzzles and found a couple ways around the fans that saves maybe 5 seconds or so each, but nothing major. Also, it seems like in the rooms where you need to drop down a great deal you can just spinner your way down, although I didn't check to see how many room this will work on yet. I'm thinking it'll mainly come in before the Double Clawshot.

Also, do fairies revive you if you drown? If so, then someone should do a Zora-less LT.

Amazing Ampharos

2006-11-27 08:36:05 am

I just beat the game with around 40 hours but several hours sitting on pause and adequate screwing around/sidequests.

I am SPOILING things here. If you don't want to read SPOILERS, don't read onward. I can't be blamed if you find out that Error is the final boss or something from reading my post because I've triple marked for SPOILERS.

*

Okay, I did find the great hylia bridge thing too. The easiest way to the other side before you're supposed to is to jump into the fire off one of the boxes as a wolf. If you jump deep enough into the fire, you should be ejected the wrong way for great justice. You take two hits and then a third phantom hit when nowhere near the fire. It's basically the same as the other method in needing a fairy unless you have 7 heart containers, but it's faster as you don't have to wait for the fire to converge on the center. I still don't know if there's anything useful on the other side of the bridge, but it felt good to slay the jerk who set the fire.

I have played around a bit with the Iron Boots, and I realize that they didn't fix them like they fixed normal movement. Sidehops and rapid jumpslashes are both clearly faster than walking and rolling. Sidehops seem ever so slightly faster, and I was able to pull a minor trick in sky city because of it. I think you're supposed to stop a fan so you can cross the rapidly falling blocks early in the dungeon, but by using sidehops with the Iron Boots, I was able to cross it with the full force wind in my face(or rather, at my side). Running, rolling, and rapid jumpslashes all ended with me falling so I assume I did it an unintended way, but I'm unsure. This leads me to believe that sidehops might be slightly faster than rapid jumpslashes like this, but rapid jumpslashes are still really fast. I don't think you can use the third hidden skill while wearing Iron Boots either so that wouldn't be a problem.

Speaking of hidden skills, some people on gamefaqs claimed to have gotten through some walls in the Temple of Time by using the Helm Splitter at the right spots. That could be profitable in general. You aren't invincible while using the helm splitter either so you could really knock yourself high by cleverly using it. I'm envisioning using the gale boomerang to set a bomb to hit the right spot at the right time and then helm splittering up really high to get hit by the blast. That could probably get you onto a lot of ledges before you were intended to, and it just requires and enemy. Also, obligatory note that the third hidden skills brutalizes Ganon really badly. I'm shocked that the game's designers didn't notice that you can win the epic final battle almost effortlessly by just spamming it. All that together leads me to believe that getting the first four hidden skills would be highly beneficial for a speedrun. The last three are kinda useless so you'd probably leave them out(seriously, mortal draw is cool in theory but leaves you way too open, and the sixth hidden skill just never, ever works - added spin attack damage at full health isn't exactly shocking either).

I did accidentally clip through a wall in the sacred grove near the ToT entrance while playing normally, but I ended up getting ejected out without incident. It goes without saying that clipping shenanagans in the Sacred Grove would be ridiculously good for a speedrun.

If the wolf has a higher backflip, that would mean that maybe you could transform into a wolf and then get hit by a bomb set up as a human. That could be a little extra distance.

As per the fastest means of locomotion, I think it's Epona > wolf > human > iron boots. Epona just runs, the wolf rapidly dashes, the human rolls a lot, and the iron boots use sidehops. Note that the Iron Boots underwater behave completely differently and sidehops are not the fastest there. In that case, I can't tell if basic running or rolling is faster, but I think swimming is faster than both either way.

As per damage, I have to point out the insane damage that the ball and chain does to everything. It's ridiculously hard to hit stuff with, but if you master it, it would probably be the fastest way to fight strong enemies. I don't know if it works against any bosses other than the obvious one, but if it does it could potentially be used to cut cycles.

Also, I wonder if getting the second clawshot chest when you don't have the original clawshot still gives you double clawshots. It's probably inconsequential as the clawshot seems absolutely mandatory on the third boss, but it's interesting to think about. The third boss is also the reason that the tunic of swimming is very much so mandatory. You will drown many times over against that boss, way more than fairies could revive you from.

Remember that the bottle of great fairy potion you get from Jovani for getting 20 poes could really speed things up. If you use it after the last damage boost in the game and then just not get hit again, you could retain double damage through the very long Zant and Ganon battles. It could probably make up for gathering 20 poes since 5 are automatic and many are pretty much on the way to where you are going anyway.

I hope my musings have been of help.

I just beat the game with around 40 hours but several hours sitting on pause and adequate screwing around/sidequests.

I am SPOILING things here.  If you don't want to read SPOILERS, don't read onward.  I can't be blamed if you find out that Error is the final boss or something from reading my post because I've triple marked for SPOILERS.

*

Okay, I did find the great hylia bridge thing too.  The easiest way to the other side before you're supposed to is to jump into the fire off one of the boxes as a wolf.  If you jump deep enough into the fire, you should be ejected the wrong way for great justice.  You take two hits and then a third phantom hit when nowhere near the fire.  It's basically the same as the other method in needing a fairy unless you have 7 heart containers, but it's faster as you don't have to wait for the fire to converge on the center.  I still don't know if there's anything useful on the other side of the bridge, but it felt good to slay the jerk who set the fire.

I have played around a bit with the Iron Boots, and I realize that they didn't fix them like they fixed normal movement.  Sidehops and rapid jumpslashes are both clearly faster than walking and rolling.  Sidehops seem ever so slightly faster, and I was able to pull a minor trick in sky city because of it.  I think you're supposed to stop a fan so you can cross the rapidly falling blocks early in the dungeon, but by using sidehops with the Iron Boots, I was able to cross it with the full force wind in my face(or rather, at my side).  Running, rolling, and rapid jumpslashes all ended with me falling so I assume I did it an unintended way, but I'm unsure.  This leads me to believe that sidehops might be slightly faster than rapid jumpslashes like this, but rapid jumpslashes are still really fast.  I don't think you can use the third hidden skill while wearing Iron Boots either so that wouldn't be a problem.

Speaking of hidden skills, some people on gamefaqs claimed to have gotten through some walls in the Temple of Time by using the Helm Splitter at the right spots.  That could be profitable in general.  You aren't invincible while using the helm splitter either so you could really knock yourself high by cleverly using it.  I'm envisioning using the gale boomerang to set a bomb to hit the right spot at the right time and then helm splittering up really high to get hit by the blast.  That could probably get you onto a lot of ledges before you were intended to, and it just requires and enemy.  Also, obligatory note that the third hidden skills brutalizes Ganon really badly.  I'm shocked that the game's designers didn't notice that you can win the epic final battle almost effortlessly by just spamming it.  All that together leads me to believe that getting the first four hidden skills would be highly beneficial for a speedrun.  The last three are kinda useless so you'd probably leave them out(seriously, mortal draw is cool in theory but leaves you way too open, and the sixth hidden skill just never, ever works - added spin attack damage at full health isn't exactly shocking either).

I did accidentally clip through a wall in the sacred grove near the ToT entrance while playing normally, but I ended up getting ejected out without incident.  It goes without saying that clipping shenanagans in the Sacred Grove would be ridiculously good for a speedrun.

If the wolf has a higher backflip, that would mean that maybe you could transform into a wolf and then get hit by a bomb set up as a human.  That could be a little extra distance.

As per the fastest means of locomotion, I think it's Epona > wolf > human > iron boots.  Epona just runs, the wolf rapidly dashes, the human rolls a lot, and the iron boots use sidehops.  Note that the Iron Boots underwater behave completely differently and sidehops are not the fastest there.  In that case, I can't tell if basic running or rolling is faster, but I think swimming is faster than both either way.

As per damage, I have to point out the insane damage that the ball and chain does to everything.  It's ridiculously hard to hit stuff with, but if you master it, it would probably be the fastest way to fight strong enemies.  I don't know if it works against any bosses other than the obvious one, but if it does it could potentially be used to cut cycles.

Also, I wonder if getting the second clawshot chest when you don't have the original clawshot still gives you double clawshots.  It's probably inconsequential as the clawshot seems absolutely mandatory on the third boss, but it's interesting to think about.  The third boss is also the reason that the tunic of swimming is very much so mandatory.  You will drown many times over against that boss, way more than fairies could revive you from.

Remember that the bottle of great fairy potion you get from Jovani for getting 20 poes could really speed things up.  If you use it after the last damage boost in the game and then just not get hit again, you could retain double damage through the very long Zant and Ganon battles.  It could probably make up for gathering 20 poes since 5 are automatic and many are pretty much on the way to where you are going anyway.

I hope my musings have been of help.

Aftermath

2006-11-27 09:46:55 am

Quits halfway

Yeah, your musings did help, and I did the same Sky Temple thing you did, since I didn't find out about that switch until I was on my way back. I did jumping slashes to get across, couldn't find the right angle for sidehopping. Either way, it seems unintended that you cross without first turning off the fan.

Also, although inconsequential, found a psuedo-sequence break thing in the Cave of Ordeals. When you get to the part that is supposed to need the double clawshot, you can jump down, kill all the enemies, clawshot up to the original platform, and then rather easily clawshot over the wall and continue on without the double clawshot.

Amazing Ampharos

2006-11-27 10:07:13 am

I SPOIL things again!

I think the big hopeful place to break would be getting past the owl statue in the basement of sanctuary. That would let you do Sky City right after you had the Master Sword, it would cut out the long nonsense in getting to Sky City(or most of it at least), and it would give you the double clawshot for Snowpeak Ruins and the Temple of Time(neither the ball and chain nor the dominion rod are needed in Sky City). I have thought about trying to do it right before lakebed temple, but I realized that without the clawshot you can't use the cannon, and becoming a wolf for the warp would probably get you stuck as a wolf with no way to turn back. The other concern is that Midna might tell you to get rid of Shad even though he's clearly not there if you glitch into the room.

As per Sky City, I wonder if you can use the vines in the fan at the top of the main room for a break. Maybe set up a bomb with the gale boomerang and get blasted into the fan right before it would knock you away. That might cause the game to eject you above the fan instead of below it. That's an overall positive direction of motion, and if you did it right after getting the double clawshot, you could snag the big key and and go straight to the boss chamber(in my estimation, that would cut out about 1/3 of the dungeon). Another possible shenanagan might be using a damage boost to get on top of the railing on the north end of the same room. I think from on top of that you could clawshot the lever to turn on the fan that lets you get to the boss chamber which could cut out some walking in general. The last thing to note is that you can make it pretty far across that room with the many pits without the fan. If you clawshot the very top of the spinning things, you can climb on top of them. I got stuck on top of the one that's turned the other direction, but I was able to cross half the room in an unintended way so maybe there's another trick to cross the rest.

In terms of skippable dungeon treasures, I think the Dominion Rod is our only real hope. You absolutely need the Gale Boomerang, the Bow, the Clawshot, the Ball and Chain, and the Double Clawshot to beat the bosses of the respective temples, and you need the spinner to be able to use the Mirror of Twilight(and probably to beat the boss too, unless you have some absolutely brilliant trickery). If there's a way through that owl statue in Kakariko and a way through the statue door in the Temple of Time, it would be completely cut out. That would also cut out over half of the Temple of Time itself which would be pretty awesome. Of course, getting past both those barriers is pretty daunting and probably impossible, but if you're looking for a wall to blast yourself into hoping for something good to happen, those would be the walls.

I SPOIL things again!

I think the big hopeful place to break would be getting past the owl statue in the basement of sanctuary.  That would let you do Sky City right after you had the Master Sword, it would cut out the long nonsense in getting to Sky City(or most of it at least), and it would give you the double clawshot for Snowpeak Ruins and the Temple of Time(neither the ball and chain nor the dominion rod are needed in Sky City).  I have thought about trying to do it right before lakebed temple, but I realized that without the clawshot you can't use the cannon, and becoming a wolf for the warp would probably get you stuck as a wolf with no way to turn back.  The other concern is that Midna might tell you to get rid of Shad even though he's clearly not there if you glitch into the room.

As per Sky City, I wonder if you can use the vines in the fan at the top of the main room for a break.  Maybe set up a bomb with the gale boomerang and get blasted into the fan right before it would knock you away.  That might cause the game to eject you above the fan instead of below it.  That's an overall positive direction of motion, and  if you did it right after getting the double clawshot, you could snag the big key and and go straight to the boss chamber(in my estimation, that would cut out about 1/3 of the dungeon).  Another possible shenanagan might be using a damage boost to get on top of the railing on the north end of the same room.  I think from on top of that you could clawshot the lever to turn on the fan that lets you get to the boss chamber which could cut out some walking in general.  The last thing to note is that you can make it pretty far across that room with the many pits without the fan.  If you clawshot the very top of the spinning things, you can climb on top of them.  I got stuck on top of the one that's turned the other direction, but I was able to cross half the room in an unintended way so maybe there's another trick to cross the rest.

In terms of skippable dungeon treasures, I think the Dominion Rod is our only real hope.  You absolutely need the Gale Boomerang, the Bow, the Clawshot, the Ball and Chain, and the Double Clawshot to beat the bosses of the respective temples, and you need the spinner to be able to use the Mirror of Twilight(and probably to beat the boss too, unless you have some absolutely brilliant trickery).  If there's a way through that owl statue in Kakariko and a way through the statue door in the Temple of Time, it would be completely cut out.  That would also cut out over half of the Temple of Time itself which would be pretty awesome.  Of course, getting past both those barriers is pretty daunting and probably impossible, but if you're looking for a wall to blast yourself into hoping for something good to happen, those would be the walls.

coolcwer/triforce

2006-11-27 01:07:58 pm

I'm not THAT bad.

I"m in the lakebed temple right now. It's hard. . .

But I made a new file made especially for finding glitches. Cheesy

Rumina

2006-11-27 01:20:44 pm

!!!

More useless glitches, here are two that you will have to restart your game if you do.

Eldin Bridge Glitch: If you save and quit immediately after the large section of the bridge gets knocked out you start up in Kakariko and you have to restart your game.

Cannon Warp Glitch: Apparently, if you enter the room with the cannon below the graveyard which makes Shad move out of the way and then save/quit you will be unable to warp the cannon to lake Hylia because the game will treat the room as though Shad was still there even though he isn't.

I haven't seen either of these myself but apparently lots of people are having problems with them.