Tales of Phantasia

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2008-10-08 07:59:23 pm

2006-05-09 10:03:16 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

Quote from Enhasa:

There doesn't seem to be a topic for this so I'm making one. Anyway, sorry, I'm not going to be doing this. I just have a question:

Weren't 3-4 of you guys all over each other trying to get dibs on running this when it came out? What happened? Were you all disgusted by the GBA port?

I remember Maur was one of those people (because of the avatar) and I think he didn't like the GBA port.

Yeah so this topic is mine now I guess, I have a few old replays of the SNES version here and I might try again sometime. Maur also needs to work on this =p

Thread title:

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-05-09 10:25:41 pm

2006-05-09 10:24:53 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

ugh. *looks at sig*

i basically took back what i said about the gba version of this game in the bk2 thread, since i got rather bored with it after the first visit to thor.

at any rate, i fail to have anything i particularly want to do (especially now that i ruined one of my tapes that had radiance on it and have to redo that...). i could try working on this game, but as easy as i found the gba version, i have a strong feeling that i really suck at it.

this is the same thing i thought about super heroes when i started to practice it as well.

VorpalEdge

Edit history:

VorpalEdge: 2006-05-09 10:29:04 pm

2006-05-09 10:27:05 pm

welcome to the machine

I can't see myself running anything other than the snes version. And that has obvious difficulties attached to it.

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-05-09 10:34:00 pm

2006-05-09 10:33:13 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

i think you could practically do gba without leveling, but the battles are so slow that sfc could still be faster.

i defeated maxwell again last night (must...separate...from my brother's states). he kicked me so hard, repeatedly. Sad

VorpalEdge

2006-05-09 10:38:31 pm

welcome to the machine

iirc, physical attacks don't hurt Dhaos in the sfc version but do in the gba, and some enemies got nerfed in the gba version (ogres, charons, druids). I think levelling is pretty much equal once you factor those in - there aren't any super-powerful things that absorb all and/or chain-stun you anymore, and druids don't own you in the face. Tongue

Then again, I haven't played the sfc version in ages. Do holy bottles do as little when you're underlevelled in the sfc version as they do in the gba?

spineshark

2006-05-09 10:59:12 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

incidentally, i'm going to state that the single worst thing about running the gba version almost has to be the fact that there are only two save slots.

i don't really know about playing underleveled as i've completed top a grand total of 1 1/3 times or so. i wasn't even aware that your level had anything to do with how many encounters you enter. or is that only with holy bottles or...

charons are harder on sfc? (actually not terribly surprising as basically all the enemy spells are far more vicious) shit, i already basically reset if i see "charon 5" on the little window in the corner Lips Sealed

VorpalEdge

2006-05-09 11:12:22 pm

welcome to the machine

charons absorb all elements in the sfc version. If you're wearing a moon falux in dhaos's first castle, cless is useless.

At least, if my memory serves.

I'd love to see what you could do with this game.

Enhasa

2006-05-09 11:30:28 pm

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

at any rate, i fail to have anything i particularly want to do

That's ok, you have a lot of games to be playing. Wink

Quote:

incidentally, i'm going to state that the single worst thing about running the gba version almost has to be the fact that there are only two save slots.

Haha, FF2 has 4, but I only used 2 of them because the guy I borrowed it from didn't want either his or his brother's slots being erased. Yes, it was very annoying and required some guess-timation.

I guess this is as good a place to put it as any. I noticed your sig before was how you needed to find Valkyrie Profile, Alundra 1, and Rhapsody, and that your avatar was from Rhapsody's cover. (What is it now anyway? It looks like something from a Daft Punk video heh.)

Anyway VP you already know, but I think you would love Alundra, since you like Landstalker (I need to play this myself) and it is reknowned for its puzzles. Rhapsody you probably want since it's NIS, but back in the pre-Disgaea days, this game was on many people's "worst game ever" lists. This might be saying more about the maturation of this generation of gamers than the game itself, which oozes NIS, but I think you should know that. I've only played a little of it myself, but I like NIS. =)

Here is a funny quote I found on another site's board somewhere: Of all things, this came up on a Rez discussion at super-play actually.

Quote:

everyone wanted it because it's rare, then it un-rared, now they are stuck with a game about singing fairies made for 12 year old girls.

Anyway, since you're going back and playing things like FF2 (you might wanna PM me and tell me what RPGs you have and haven't played yet), I have to give my strongest US-released SNES recommendation to Lufia 2, which besides being awesome, you will like from the great puzzles. However, if you want to see the story the right way, you should play 1 first. It plays completely differently and a modern gamer might find it "archaic" (as DTK put it) but I love it all the same.

[quote]at any rate, i fail to have anything i particularly want to do[/quote]
That's ok, you have a lot of games to be playing. ;)

[quote]incidentally, i'm going to state that the single worst thing about running the gba version almost has to be the fact that there are only two save slots.[/quote]
Haha, FF2 has 4, but I only used 2 of them because the guy I borrowed it from didn't want either his or his brother's slots being erased. Yes, it was very annoying and required some guess-timation.

I guess this is as good a place to put it as any. I noticed your sig before was how you needed to find Valkyrie Profile, Alundra 1, and Rhapsody, and that your avatar was from Rhapsody's cover. (What is it now anyway? It looks like something from a Daft Punk video heh.)

Anyway VP you already know, but I think you would love Alundra, since you like Landstalker (I need to play this myself) and it is reknowned for its puzzles. Rhapsody you probably want since it's NIS, but back in the pre-Disgaea days, this game was on many people's "worst game ever" lists. This might be saying more about the maturation of this generation of gamers than the game itself, which oozes NIS, but I think you should know that. I've only played a little of it myself, but I like NIS. =)

Here is a funny quote I found on another site's board somewhere: Of all things, this came up on a Rez discussion at super-play actually.
[quote]everyone wanted it because it's rare, then it un-rared, now they are stuck with a game about singing fairies made for 12 year old girls.[/quote]

Anyway, since you're going back and playing things like FF2 (you might wanna PM me and tell me what RPGs you have and haven't played yet), I have to give my strongest US-released SNES recommendation to Lufia 2, which besides being awesome, you will like from the great puzzles. However, if you want to see the story the right way, you should play 1 first. It plays completely differently and a modern gamer might find it "archaic" (as DTK put it) but I love it all the same.

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-05-10 12:37:17 am

2006-05-09 11:31:52 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

haha, after i said that i doubt i'm very good at the game and don't really know much about it? awesome.

anyway, my brother is in town this week, and he's all about smash bros and warcraft 3 (haha, "come play for me, i'm going to go see a movie!" >.<) and crap, so next week i may be able to take a look at this game. something tells me i'm going to need a hellacious amount of help on this.

edit: whoa.

anyways, yes, i want rhapsody for the utter humor factor first and foremost (and it's supposed to be short, so it could be funny to speed run though i'll reserve judgements until i've really seen it (though i listened to a bit of the soundtrack and couldn't stop laughing))

the alundra reccommendation came from chanoire of m2k2 (after i mentioned that i liked landstalker). it's also got an ocremix by shnabubula, so of course i absolutely have to play it now (how i found landstalker >.< ).

must go now...may have more to say later. the avatar is from "interstella 5555" though i just saw the vp2 cover and...

haha, after i said that i doubt i'm very good at the game and don't really know much about it?  awesome.

anyway, my brother is in town this week, and he's all about smash bros and warcraft 3 (haha, "come play for me, i'm going to go see a movie!" >.<) and crap, so next week i may be able to take a look at this game.  something tells me i'm going to need a hellacious amount of help on this.

edit: whoa.

anyways, yes, i want rhapsody for the utter humor factor first and foremost (and it's supposed to be short, so it could be funny to speed run though i'll reserve judgements until i've really seen it (though i listened to a bit of the soundtrack and couldn't stop laughing))

the alundra reccommendation came from chanoire of m2k2 (after i mentioned that i liked landstalker).  it's also got an ocremix by shnabubula, so of course i absolutely have to play it now (how i found landstalker >.< ).

must go now...may have more to say later.  the avatar is from "interstella 5555" though i just saw the vp2 cover and...

Amazing Ampharos

2006-05-10 12:01:39 am

I've thought about it; it could make a really good speed run. Good luck in the fire tower though; that place will be "fun". Also, deciding when to permanently drop Mint for Chester is a tricky issue. Mint does have Sharpness and Pow Hammer which speed up fights a lot more than low level Chester, but most fights later on you can't safely run from so Chester will get enough levels to be useful eventually. If you could somehow get his last tech, you basically have a fast, automatic win against every boss.

I suspect the reason you lose Chester for over half the game is that he's the blatently best character.

Enhasa

2006-05-10 12:35:03 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

spineshark: Lots of games have OC remixes (unless you are specifically talking about this shnabubula fellow), so if you went by that your head would surely explode from the all the games you must play!

Aha! It WAS Daft Punk, I knew it!

About the VP2 cover, do you mean anything other than that blue valkyrie profile (these are uncapitalized for a reason) logo? Or is there some cover art I don't know about? I am going to make a VPS thread later.

Amazing Ampharos: Maybe I'm missing something, but I figured you would just sub out Mint for Chester ASAP.

spineshark

Edit history:

spineshark: 2006-05-10 03:53:23 am

2006-05-10 12:43:38 am

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

http://image.www.rakuten.co.jp/edigi-game/img10072137085.jpeg
linked from gamefaqs like last week or something, but i didn't check the board for about two weeks until this morning. obviously, that's the japanese, and the american will probably suck, but i can sit here and admire pretty things in the meantime Smiley

yes, i meant games with music remixed specifically by shnabubula. i think he's an absolute fucking genius (with my favorite being surprise surprise landstalker 'rare mineral addict' but...he's just totally awesome in my opinion)

and seeing as mint does essentially no damage, yes, you'll just put chester in as soon as possible.

edit: other thing is, if anybody is waiting for like, more than two runs from me this year (i don't see how that could be, but hey, maybe they're from fess Grin

), i have to reiterate as i did in fe9 that my recording situation quite sucks. even after i get a job this summer, i will probably be unable to buy both a dvd recorder and a playstation 2, and inevitably that decision will be made in favor of a new game console unless by some freak coincidence a store shows up less than 50 miles from my house that carries a good selection of sega games. even then, i'd probably opt for a ps2 Tongue

http://image.www.rakuten.co.jp/edigi-game/img10072137085.jpeg
linked from gamefaqs like last week or something, but i didn't check the board for about two weeks until this morning.  obviously, that's the japanese, and the american will probably suck, but i can sit here and admire pretty things in the meantime :)

yes, i meant games with music remixed specifically by shnabubula.  i think he's an absolute fucking genius (with my favorite being [i]surprise surprise[/i] [url=http://www.ocremix.org/remix/OCR01380/]landstalker 'rare mineral addict'[/url] but...he's just totally awesome in my opinion)

and seeing as mint does essentially no damage, yes, you'll just put chester in as soon as possible.

edit: other thing is, if anybody is waiting for like, more than two runs from me this year (i don't see how that could be, but hey, maybe they're from fess ;D ), i have to reiterate as i did in fe9 that my recording situation quite sucks.  even after i get a job this summer, i will probably be unable to buy both a dvd recorder and a playstation 2, and inevitably that decision will be made in favor of a new game console unless by some freak coincidence a store shows up less than 50 miles from my house that carries a good selection of sega games.  even then, i'd probably opt for a ps2 :P

Enhasa

2006-05-10 03:34:37 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Wow, that box art is very pretty, and SE being SE, I bet they will use that for the US version too.

alexpenev

Edit history:

alexpenev: 2006-05-10 08:18:38 pm

2006-05-10 08:17:55 pm

The biggest problem in this game is constantly running out of TP Grin

The PSX battle system makes chaining skills so tempting (and big skill chains makes mincemeat of enemies), but that sucks up lots of TP.
I don't see why you would want to use Mint anywhere...
One nice thing is you've got "automatic" Jet Boots in this version, and IIRC running inside a dungeon doesn't cut down the steps-til-next-battle counter in half. Coupled with having a lower encounter rate anyway, perhaps it might end up quicker than the SFC (granted, most of the SFC dungeons can be completed by spamming 15 holy bottles and avoiding most random encounters).
The hard part would be the start, I guess... the end of the game is quite easy because of Chaos Blade. Fortunately, the tricky enemies of SFC are easy this time around (Demitel lost a few assistants, Gnome doesn't move if Cless doesn't move and can be whacked with magic free of charge, Jahmir is a wimp, Dhaos can be comboed in the hundreds and shouldn't lay a finger on you, ever. Etc.)

Nobody wants to run this game? It's about 5hrs long... it's got cutscenes, so make it ~10 segments. You've never been bored for 5 hours in a row? Roll Eyes

The biggest problem in this game is constantly running out of TP ;D The PSX battle system makes chaining skills so tempting (and big skill chains makes mincemeat of enemies), but that sucks up lots of TP.
I don't see why you would want to use Mint anywhere...
One nice thing is you've got "automatic" Jet Boots in this version, and IIRC running inside a dungeon doesn't cut down the steps-til-next-battle counter in half. Coupled with having a lower encounter rate anyway, perhaps it might end up quicker than the SFC (granted, most of the SFC dungeons can be completed by spamming 15 holy bottles and avoiding most random encounters).
The hard part would be the start, I guess... the end of the game is quite easy because of Chaos Blade. Fortunately, the tricky enemies of SFC are easy this time around (Demitel lost a few assistants, Gnome doesn't move if Cless doesn't move and can be whacked with magic free of charge, Jahmir is a wimp, Dhaos can be comboed in the hundreds and shouldn't lay a finger on you, ever. Etc.)

Nobody wants to run this game? It's about 5hrs long... it's got cutscenes, so make it ~10 segments. You've never been bored for 5 hours in a row? ::)

Amazing Ampharos

2006-05-10 10:54:34 pm

If you avoid almost all random encounters in Volt's cave, Chester will still be level 15 or something horrible against Volt. Mint will help you more if you have her cast Sharpen and then spam Pow Hammers until she dies. I think you'd still use Chester in random battles, but against Volt himself I think Mint would actually help. Also, Volt is hard to hold back with combos compared to most bosses, and a low level Chester is really likely to die.

As per Arche spells, you basically get Debris Fall right when you get her(you already have Gnome by then so it isn't a worry), use that exclusively until Indignation, and then pick up Judgment in Thor to replace Indignation where needed(Volt for instance). By the way, the Thor segment will suck badly. You have a 1/9 of getting a good segment just based on getting Judgment and then the main computer room on the first tries.

One choice is whether to stay in the Miguel inn right when you reach the future twice. The upside is Dark Blade for Cress and a lot of experience with Chester; in other words, all of your battles will be faster. The bad side is that those cutscenes are slow.

As per fighting style with Cress, you just spam A until you get Swallow Dance which you then spam until Tiger Blade. I think Tiger Blade can be used very well as your primary attack; Sword Rain and Lightning Tiger might help in a few places. Of course, Distortion Blade and Chaos Blade help at the very end, but that's at the very end. As per his weapon, I think Long Sword -> Something bought in past Euclid -> Gugnir -> Mech Halberd(Dhaos's castle, easily obtained) -> Laser Blade(buy when you go to temple of ice; do it before fire tower) -> Sword of Time is ideal. Chester's bows mostly take care of themselves; just have rune bottles at the right times.

There are some real strategic decisions to be made in this run; I think you should probably run from all random encounters you can reasonably escape, but it's not exactly easy to escape them all, and many you're better off fighting. Working all that out is obvoiusly important. Deciding what to put on the shortcuts and how to menu manage is an issue too. Handling the finances is key as there are a lot of things to buy that could really speed things up, but you only have so much money.

If you avoid almost all random encounters in Volt's cave, Chester will still be level 15 or something horrible against Volt.  Mint will help you more if you have her cast Sharpen and then spam Pow Hammers until she dies.  I think you'd still use Chester in random battles, but against Volt himself I think Mint would actually help.  Also, Volt is hard to hold back with combos compared to most bosses, and a low level Chester is really likely to die.

As per Arche spells, you basically get Debris Fall right when you get her(you already have Gnome by then so it isn't a worry), use that exclusively until Indignation, and then pick up Judgment in Thor to replace Indignation where needed(Volt for instance).  By the way, the Thor segment will suck badly.  You have a 1/9 of getting a good segment just based on getting Judgment and then the main computer room on the first tries.

One choice is whether to stay in the Miguel inn right when you reach the future twice.  The upside is Dark Blade for Cress and a lot of experience with Chester; in other words, all of your battles will be faster.  The bad side is that those cutscenes are slow.

As per fighting style with Cress, you just spam A until you get Swallow Dance which you then spam until Tiger Blade.  I think Tiger Blade can be used very well as your primary attack; Sword Rain and Lightning Tiger might help in a few places.  Of course, Distortion Blade and Chaos Blade help at the very end, but that's at the very end.  As per his weapon, I think Long Sword -> Something bought in past Euclid -> Gugnir  -> Mech Halberd(Dhaos's castle, easily obtained) -> Laser Blade(buy when you go to temple of ice; do it before fire tower) -> Sword of Time is ideal.  Chester's bows mostly take care of themselves; just have rune bottles at the right times.

There are some real strategic decisions to be made in this run; I think you should probably run from all random encounters you can reasonably escape, but it's not exactly easy to escape them all, and many you're better off fighting.  Working all that out is obvoiusly important.  Deciding what to put on the shortcuts and how to menu manage is an issue too.  Handling the finances is key as there are a lot of things to buy that could really speed things up, but you only have so much money.

VorpalEdge

2006-05-10 11:35:42 pm

welcome to the machine

Does the gba timer count cutscenes?

If so, I laugh at that horribly long intro cutscene being counted. Tongue

spineshark

2006-05-11 12:03:38 am

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

all right, this is what i wanted to see, haha.

Quote:

By the way, the Thor segment will suck badly. You have a 1/9 of getting a good segment just based on getting Judgment and then the main computer room on the first tries.

oh dear, thor is random? *cries*

Quote:

As per his weapon, I think Long Sword -> Something bought in past Euclid -> Gugnir -> Mech Halberd(Dhaos's castle, easily obtained) -> Laser Blade(buy when you go to temple of ice; do it before fire tower) -> Sword of Time is ideal.

for the beginning of the game, i used long sword, then switched to rapier in the sewers. the down+a move is ridiculous, and the rapier also works better with swallow dance. i bought the walloon sword in hamel on my first gba playthrough, and i thought that worked quite well, but i don't know.

i feel pretty sure the cutscenes are counted. including the first one (because my first save on the gba was like 18 minutes or something).

VorpalEdge

Edit history:

VorpalEdge: 2006-05-11 12:59:07 am

2006-05-11 12:54:39 am

welcome to the machine

I think you can skip the part where dhaos's spirit/whatever is flying around in a stormy timestream or whatever it's supposed to represent. But you still have the fight to take care of, and that's 90% people standing around waiting for tornix to cast a spell. And dhaos going "What the heck is that?!?"

You may want to look into getting the knight sword from the ruins of toltus after the sewers. If you don't collect it before getting caught by mars, it's still there, and you can get it later and keep it. And it's much better than the rapier iirc.

For the fire tower/whatever it's name is, where you get the flamberge, I'd just kill off the entire party except Cless and run through with him alone if that's possible. Saves you time on ice charms, and you have the vorpal sword, so stuff should die relatively quickly.

Enhasa

2006-05-11 08:54:26 am

everybody wanna tell you the meaning of music

Quote:

One choice is whether to stay in the Miguel inn right when you reach the future twice. The upside is Dark Blade for Cress and a lot of experience with Chester; in other words, all of your battles will be faster. The bad side is that those cutscenes are slow.

I think the cutscenes are too slow but I don't know for sure.

Quote:

There are some real strategic decisions to be made in this run; I think you should probably run from all random encounters you can reasonably escape, but it's not exactly easy to escape them all, and many you're better off fighting.

Anecdotally, I think most people don't run away from enough fights while running RPGs. The temptation is to always say "well I can kill them quickly and I'll get some EXP." If you move formation to the edge you can run away from most everything easy enough I think.

Now time for something I personally found amusing. You may have seen that new Jack in the Box commercial, "bread is back" or somesuch. Here, I took a capture:

Anyone else think of Mimmy Bread? ^_^

[quote]One choice is whether to stay in the Miguel inn right when you reach the future twice.  The upside is Dark Blade for Cress and a lot of experience with Chester; in other words, all of your battles will be faster.  The bad side is that those cutscenes are slow.[/quote]
I think the cutscenes are too slow but I don't know for sure.

[quote]There are some real strategic decisions to be made in this run; I think you should probably run from all random encounters you can reasonably escape, but it's not exactly easy to escape them all, and many you're better off fighting.[/quote]
Anecdotally, I think most people don't run away from enough fights while running RPGs. The temptation is to always say "well I can kill them quickly and I'll get some EXP." If you move formation to the edge you can run away from most everything easy enough I think.

Now time for something I personally found amusing. You may have seen that new Jack in the Box commercial, "bread is back" or somesuch. Here, I took a capture:

[img]http://www.cs.clemson.edu/~kjuang/files/bread.jpg[/img]

Anyone else think of Mimmy Bread? ^_^

getter77

2006-05-11 01:32:31 pm

100% runs=great to watch

Above scene was straight up RIPPED from the first opening of an anime by the name of Yakitate! Japan!. Still....always a funny scene.

On topic: I'd suggest a slight wait/ detour to get the Knight's Saber left in the ruins RIGHT BEFORE before you go to that cave and start winding up in the past since it is better than anything else ya can get in the present...and would surely help with a low level Golem Twin boss.

TSA

2006-05-11 03:53:20 pm

Retired

I've been playing this game. I'm a newbie to it, but I found the random battle encouters way too high. I got some item that reduces TP consumption by 1/3, I've never had a TP problem since I got it.

There's ways to spam attacks in corners on enemies to just keep damaging them, some bosses, though, this does not work for unless you keep using TP attacks.

Also, tapping "R" on the GBA will actually impair movement by foes, while you will stove move normally (but everything looks like slow-motion). This could be abused somehow.

spineshark

2006-05-11 04:59:44 pm

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

yeah, stun lock is pretty easy in this game compared to symphonia and especially snes top.

have you used holy bottles, tsa? they make some of the longer dungeons much more tolerable.

i need to check where some of the items are...especially the one that reduces spell cast time by 50%, since if i'm not mistaken, arche bombing people with indignation like ONCE A SECOND is a very good thing.

VorpalEdge

2006-05-11 06:17:51 pm

welcome to the machine

Mystic Symbol.

Chest in the dock east of Belladem and early on in Dhaos's castle iirc.

spineshark

2006-05-12 02:26:56 am

新世紀進歩的羽扇子音楽

all right, here we go. i've been messing with this tonight...first, the beginning of the game (obviously). i have saved twice.

first save: the aqueduct 0:15
second save: the golem in the catacombs at 0:24

there's probably two minutes of easy improvements. i didn't grab the knight sword for this go, and i'm right now trying to figure out how to get cress the swallow kick tech as he can't beat the golem twins without it. my idea is to have the golem kill chester and mint, but it seems to take a long time.

getter77

2006-05-12 02:41:19 am

100% runs=great to watch

If chester has any arrow techs yet just have him spam it on one of them until it dies along with all the other attacks. Those Golems are WAY nastier in this version compared to the SNES one...surely.

Fun fact from my now defuncly stalled project for fun: You can get all the way to the Cless vs "swordswoman" ship fight with just your bare kick. It is hilarious and in some cases the kick works VERY well....even better than some of the usual hits oddly enough. I had a Justice Kick Challenge thread over at Gfaqs with it awhile back.

So yeah, those golems are the early run breaker for sure.