Super Mario Galaxy (Wii)

2007-11-25 04:48:15 am

Quote:

I haven't played the game, but from what I'm hearing, playing through as Luigi is no different except he jumps higher (farther maybe?) and runs faster. This means playing as Luigi is a separate category from playing as Mario due to Luigi's advantages. However, a run with Mario needs to be done first as Luigi can't be played until he is unlocked. If there is something wrong with what I said, then correct me.

I'm sure everyone else in this topic knows this, but this message is for Jambo_Harv.

You are correct, but you get to get an extra star after getting all the stars with both Mario and Luigi. I don't recall if you can get that extra star with both Mario and Luigi.

DJGrenola

2007-11-25 04:53:37 am

guffaw

if you can collect the bonus star with mario after 3 playthroughs, then I'd say 100% would be 121 stars and you'd have separate categories for M and L.

Paraxade

Edit history:

Paraxade: 2007-11-25 04:56:29 am

2007-11-25 04:54:08 am

Quote:

I don't recall if you can get that extra star with both Mario and Luigi.

You can.

Quote:

if you can collect the bonus star with mario after 3 playthroughs, then I'd say 100% would be 121 stars and you'd have separate categories for M and L.

The Luigi playthrough is on the same file as the Mario playthrough, so it's sort of like a file within a file - to switch between them you press a button on the file selection screen. Finishing the Luigi playthrough would open the Grand Finale Galaxy for both Mario and Luigi but only on that file.

Jambo_Harv

2007-11-25 04:54:31 am

Quote:

I haven't played the game, but from what I'm hearing, playing through as Luigi is no different except he jumps higher (farther maybe?) and runs faster. This means playing as Luigi is a separate category from playing as Mario due to Luigi's advantages. However, a run with Mario needs to be done first as Luigi can't be played until he is unlocked. If there is something wrong with what I said, then correct me.

I'm sure everyone else in this topic knows this, but this message is for Jambo_Harv.

All I'm trying to say is SMG is not really your typical game. Unlocking Luigi (If you can call it that) is only available on that saved file, and since you can proceed further with both Mario and Luigi, after 'completing' the game with Luigi, this would surely be the true 100% completion of the game and the Mario run is clearly a part of this.

I'm not trying to get at anyone, I simply believe that a 100% run of a game should have documentation of everything to do with that run (I know that simply playing with Luigi is a clear indication that 120 stars has already been achieved with Mario. But let's not forget that this is a speed running website and evidence that the Mario run was achieved in an optimum time should be provided even if the Mario and Luigi runs are split into two segments.

[quote]I haven't played the game, but from what I'm hearing, playing through as Luigi is no different except he jumps higher (farther maybe?) and runs faster.  This means playing as Luigi is a separate category from playing as Mario due to Luigi's advantages. However, a run with Mario needs to be done first as Luigi can't be played until he is unlocked.  If there is something wrong with what I said, then correct me.

I'm sure everyone else in this topic knows this, but this message is for Jambo_Harv.
[/quote]
All I'm trying to say is SMG is not really your typical game. Unlocking Luigi (If you can call it that) is only available on that saved file, and since you can proceed further with both Mario and Luigi, after 'completing' the game with Luigi, this would surely be the true 100% completion of the game and the Mario run is clearly a part of this.

I'm not trying to get at anyone, I simply believe that a 100% run of a game should have documentation of everything to do with that run (I know that simply playing with Luigi is a clear indication that 120 stars has already been achieved with Mario. But let's not forget that this is a speed running website and evidence that the Mario run was achieved in an optimum time should be provided even if the Mario and Luigi runs are split into two segments.

DJGrenola

2007-11-25 04:57:42 am

guffaw

Quote:

But let's not forget that this is a speed running website and evidence that the Mario run was achieved in an optimum time should be provided even if the Mario and Luigi runs are split into two segments.

This is silly. If you run Castlevania: SotN as Richter, we don't require you to prove that you beat the game in record time with Alucard first.

Reagle

Edit history:

Reagle: 2007-11-25 04:59:32 am

2007-11-25 04:57:59 am

Quote:

All I'm trying to say is SMG is not really your typical game. Unlocking Luigi (If you can call it that) is only available on that saved file, and since you can proceed further with both Mario and Luigi, after 'completing' the game with Luigi, this would surely be the true 100% completion of the game and the Mario run is clearly a part of this.

I'm not trying to get at anyone, I simply believe that a 100% run of a game should have documentation of everything to do with that run (I know that simply playing with Luigi is a clear indication that 120 stars has already been achieved with Mario. But let's not forget that this is a speed running website and evidence that the Mario run was achieved in an optimum time should be provided even if the Mario and Luigi runs are split into two segments.

But just because you get bonus stuff after all that, you shouldn't group two separate characters into one 100% playthrough. I'd consider 121 stars for one character 100% as that is the maximum number of stars for one character's separate playthrough.

[quote]
All I'm trying to say is SMG is not really your typical game. Unlocking Luigi (If you can call it that) is only available on that saved file, and since you can proceed further with both Mario and Luigi, after 'completing' the game with Luigi, this would surely be the true 100% completion of the game and the Mario run is clearly a part of this.

I'm not trying to get at anyone, I simply believe that a 100% run of a game should have documentation of everything to do with that run (I know that simply playing with Luigi is a clear indication that 120 stars has already been achieved with Mario. But let's not forget that this is a speed running website and evidence that the Mario run was achieved in an optimum time should be provided even if the Mario and Luigi runs are split into two segments.[/quote]

But just because you get bonus stuff after all that, you shouldn't group two separate characters into one 100% playthrough. I'd consider 121 stars for one character 100% as that is the maximum number of stars for one character's separate playthrough.

Serris

Edit history:

Serris: 2007-11-25 05:32:14 am

2007-11-25 05:31:08 am

120 Stars with Mario unlocks Luigi. 120 Stars with Luigi unlocks the galaxy with the 121st star for both Mario and Luigi. Luigi is only available on the file you got 120 stars with Mario on. If you want to make M and L separate categories, I think it's best to completely ignore the Grand Finale Galaxy, it's more of a bonus for getting everything, and no gameplay worth seeing takes place there, so you can just call 120 stars 100% and leave it at that.

Quote:

But just because you get bonus stuff after all that, you shouldn't group two separate characters into one 100% playthrough. I'd consider 121 stars for one character 100% as that is the maximum number of stars for one character's separate playthrough.

You cannot get 121 stars with Mario without getting 120 stars with Luigi first. So, a 242 star run would be 120 stars with Mario -> 120 stars with Luigi -> 121st star with Mario -> 121st star with Luigi. I'm pretty sure the run has to end with final battle + credits, so you would have to beat Bowser a fifth time with either Mario or Luigi.

120 Stars with Mario unlocks Luigi. 120 Stars with Luigi unlocks the galaxy with the 121st star for both Mario and Luigi. Luigi is only available on the file you got 120 stars with Mario on. If you want to make M and L separate categories, I think it's best to completely ignore the Grand Finale Galaxy, it's more of a bonus for getting everything, and no gameplay worth seeing takes place there, so you can just call 120 stars 100% and leave it at that.

[quote]

But just because you get bonus stuff after all that, you shouldn't group two separate characters into one 100% playthrough. I'd consider 121 stars for one character 100% as that is the maximum number of stars for one character's separate playthrough.[/quote]

You cannot get 121 stars with Mario without getting 120 stars with Luigi first. So, a 242 star run would be 120 stars with Mario -> 120 stars with Luigi -> 121st star with Mario -> 121st star with Luigi. I'm pretty sure the run has to end with final battle + credits, so you would have to beat Bowser a fifth time with either Mario or Luigi.

DK64_MASTER

2007-11-25 06:57:04 am

Is the 2 player super jump helpful for anything?

mwl

Edit history:

mwl: 2007-11-25 09:34:48 am

2007-11-25 07:33:41 am

A Luigi run is treated as a New Game+

Example 1
Example 2
Example 3

End of discussion.

Quote:

I think it's best to completely ignore the Grand Finale Galaxy, it's more of a bonus for getting everything, and no gameplay worth seeing takes place there, so you can just call 120 stars 100% and leave it at that.

It's still a level, and it still has an objective (namely, collecting purple coins). Personally, I'd prefer including it in a Luigi run but ignoring it in a standard Mario run.

Quote:

So, a 242 star run would be 120 stars with Mario -> 120 stars with Luigi -> 121st star with Mario -> 121st star with Luigi. I'm pretty sure the run has to end with final battle + credits, so you would have to beat Bowser a fifth time with either Mario or Luigi.

Why? The Bowser ending is the exact same, and the viewer would have just seen it from the 120-star completion.

A Luigi run is treated as a New Game+

[url=http://speeddemosarchive.com/Zelda1.html]Example 1[/url] 
[url=http://speeddemosarchive.com/Zelda2.html]Example 2[/url] 
[url=http://speeddemosarchive.com/CastlevaniaAoS.html]Example 3[/url]

End of discussion.

[quote]I think it's best to completely ignore the Grand Finale Galaxy, it's more of a bonus for getting everything, and no gameplay worth seeing takes place there, so you can just call 120 stars 100% and leave it at that.[/quote]
It's still a level, and it still has an objective (namely, collecting purple coins). Personally, I'd prefer including it in a Luigi run but ignoring it in a standard Mario run.

[quote]So, a 242 star run would be 120 stars with Mario -> 120 stars with Luigi -> 121st star with Mario -> 121st star with Luigi. I'm pretty sure the run has to end with final battle + credits, so you would have to beat Bowser a fifth time with either Mario or Luigi.[/quote]
Why? The Bowser ending is the exact same, and the viewer would have just seen it from the 120-star completion.

Jambo_Harv

Edit history:

Jambo_Harv: 2007-11-25 12:38:35 pm

2007-11-25 11:19:05 am

Quote:

A Luigi run is treated as a New Game+

Example 1
Example 2
Example 3

End of discussion.

It's still a level, and it still has an objective (namely, collecting purple coins). Personally, I'd prefer including it in a Luigi run but ignoring it in a standard Mario run.

Why? The Bowser ending is the exact same, and the viewer would have just seen it from the 120-star completion.

Right ok,
I stand corrected, i suppose luigi is technically an unlockable character and since you are just really collecting they same things, it would be kinda stupid to include they together.

Can i have once question answered then,
what runs will be accepted here as there do seem to be quite a few possible.
1. 61 star, mario run
2. 120 star, mario run
3. 61 star luigi run
4. 120 star luigi run
5. 121 star mario run
6. 121 star luigi run
(could all these not also be done with the help of a second player (co-op mode)

So this woud technically be 12 different runs ( i know that some of these will count in the same section tho)

So which of these would be hosted (and have i missed any)?

(ps. sorry about those comments in caps early, i came in drunk and decided to check the forum, and decided to leave some comments:-[ , sorry about it tho, i know i was being kinda stupid)
(would still love to see a SS 242 star run Tongue

, but that is most likely impossible)

[quote]A Luigi run is treated as a New Game+

[url=http://speeddemosarchive.com/Zelda1.html]Example 1[/url] 
[url=http://speeddemosarchive.com/Zelda2.html]Example 2[/url] 
[url=http://speeddemosarchive.com/CastlevaniaAoS.html]Example 3[/url]

End of discussion.

It's still a level, and it still has an objective (namely, collecting purple coins). Personally, I'd prefer including it in a Luigi run but ignoring it in a standard Mario run.

Why? The Bowser ending is the exact same, and the viewer would have just seen it from the 120-star completion.[/quote]
Right ok,
I stand corrected, i suppose  luigi is technically an unlockable character and since you are just really collecting they same things, it would be kinda stupid to include they together.

Can i have once question answered then,
what runs will be accepted here as there do seem to be quite a few possible.
1. 61 star, mario run
2. 120 star, mario run
3. 61 star luigi run
4. 120 star luigi run
5. 121 star mario run
6. 121 star luigi run
(could all these not also be done with the help of a second player (co-op mode)

So this woud technically be 12 different runs ( i know that some of these will count in the same section tho)

So which of these would be hosted (and have i missed any)?

(ps. sorry about those comments in caps early, i came in drunk and decided to check the forum, and decided to leave some comments:-[ , sorry about it tho, i know i was being kinda stupid)
(would still love to see a SS 242 star run :P , but that is most likely impossible)

DeweyIsOverrated

Edit history:

DeweyIsOverrated: 2007-11-25 02:11:27 pm

2007-11-25 02:05:19 pm

Quote:

Complete and under nonsense and caps lock for 2+ pages.

Did you ever think that maybe different characters have different rules that defines what 100% is? Why would you have to prove by playing as Luigi that you played as Mario first, isn't that implied? Does caps lock really help you deliver your point more effectively, or just make you look like a blabbering idiot?

Edit: just saw Jambo's contrition post. Personally, I don't think a Mario 120/121 star category should be separate. Is anyone seriously going to rewatch an entire run for one star at the end? Doubtful. Plus, 121 is essentially a New Game +, because you're basically modifying that file from the contents of another file.

And before I get into it, no, I wouldn't consider Luigi new game + material. I consider it the same as unlocking Hypermode difficult on Metroid Prime 3 after you beat it on easy/normal. Would you consider unlocking hard difficulty a new game +? If you do... well then it's pointless to argue with you.

[quote]Complete and under nonsense and caps lock for 2+ pages.[/quote]

Did you ever think that maybe different characters have different rules that defines what 100% is?  Why would you have to prove by playing as Luigi that you played as Mario first, isn't that implied?  Does caps lock really help you deliver your point more effectively, or just make you look like a blabbering idiot?

Edit: just saw Jambo's contrition post.  Personally, I don't think a Mario 120/121 star category should be separate.  Is anyone seriously going to rewatch an entire run for one star at the end?  Doubtful.  Plus, 121 is essentially a New Game +, because you're basically modifying that file from the contents of another file.

And before I get into it, no, I wouldn't consider Luigi new game + material.  I consider it the same as unlocking Hypermode difficult on Metroid Prime 3 after you beat it on easy/normal.  Would you consider unlocking hard difficulty a new game +?  If you do... well then it's pointless to argue with you.

Jambo_Harv

Edit history:

Jambo_Harv: 2007-11-25 08:59:15 pm

2007-11-25 03:00:52 pm

Quote:

Personally, I don't think a Mario 120/121 star category should be separate.

Yea i agree, with that fact.

So what how many different runs should/will there be.
1. 61 star mario run
2. 120 star mario run
3. ...? what about luigi, a 61 and a 121.

So that would be 4.

So if we are treating the game as basicly two run throughs (one as mario and one as luigi) should there not be a low% and 100% for both characters?
(plus what about co-op mode, will these be put in the own Category, will these runs even be hosted)

ps. about the cap locks, i know i looked like an idoit Sad

Reagle

2007-11-25 05:37:52 pm

I think the point of a 61 Star Mario run is being lost here. If anyone else plans to do any other different runs, they can decide the different types at that time. Let's focus this awesome run! Grin

Jambo_Harv

2007-11-25 05:42:33 pm

Quote:

I think the point of a 61 Star Mario run is being lost here. If anyone else plans to do any other different runs, they can decide the different types at that time. Let's focus this awesome run! Grin

Agreed, cause a 61 star run will be AWESOME!!!

NK3233

2007-11-25 05:46:55 pm

It's-a me, Stalin!

I might do a 61 star run, but only for YouTube - no DVD Recorder.

Expect Freezeflame's Blistering Core speedrun soon.

Ultimatefool

2007-11-25 06:50:15 pm

The Wii kicks ass.

Frosty Cosmic Race -

This took me 20+ tries to finish, so if your run is segmented, this should be a segment starter.

Serris

2007-11-25 07:25:19 pm

Quote:

Why? The Bowser ending is the exact same, and the viewer would have just seen it from the 120-star completion.

Yeah, I know, it's just that I've never seen a run that doesn't end with credits. Beating Bowser with 120 stars wouldn't be the end of the run, but rather a requirement for the 121st star, after which you would have to beat Bowser again to end the run. After all, the SM64 100% run doesn't end after getting the 120st star. The fact that the viewer would have just seen it is an unfortunate coincidence, but not a reason not to end the run properly.

Arrow

2007-11-25 08:05:30 pm

Now a hit show on the CW

Except that you can't get the 121st star until after you also get 120 stars with Luigi. Really, I think that for now we should just focus on the basics: 61 star Mario. When someone announces that they actually intend to do a 100% run, then we can debate what that entails. Personally, I think it should just be 61 star and 120 star for both characters. I see the 121st star as more of a bonus stage. I suppose for Luigi runs we could tack it on at the end, but it wouldn't make sense for Mario runs.

Jambo_Harv

2007-11-25 08:11:21 pm

Quote:

Except that you can't get the 121st star until after you also get 120 stars with Luigi. Really, I think that for now we should just focus on the basics: 61 star Mario. When someone announces that they actually intend to do a 100% run, then we can debate what that entails. Personally, I think it should just be 61 star and 120 star for both characters. I see the 121st star as more of a bonus stage. I suppose for Luigi runs we could tack it on at the end, but it wouldn't make sense for Mario runs.

Yea no way should there be a 121 star mario run as this would just be stupid as in between the last 2 segments there would be a whole 120 luigi stars to collect jus so that you could get the last star.

So lets stop with other runs atm and lets let people get down to there 61 star runs.

Amazing Ampharos

2007-11-25 09:56:13 pm

Did you save and quit between getting those comets? In one sitting, comets have always religiously followed the rules I described.

About Luigi on Battlerock, had you gotten the green star from the desert? It would be plausible that the trigger is the explanation about the trial galaxies; both my times through with Mario and Luigi it appeared right after the secret star on Buoy Base so I figured it was a correlation.

Also, the benefit to Sweet Sweet early is to try to avoid going to Space Junk until after Battlerock for comet manipulation. Costar would doubtlessly be really useful all around anyway since pretty much all of the hungry Luma stars are really fast; I think it deserves serious consideration.

Arrow

2007-11-25 11:01:41 pm

Now a hit show on the CW

Quote:

Did you save and quit between getting those comets? In one sitting, comets have always religiously followed the rules I described.

I've also had clear instances where the comets didn't follow your rules. On my Mario file, the last 4 or so stars I needed were purple comet stars, and I was able to collect them all consecutively without feeding the Luma or (re)doing any other levels. Of course, that could have something to do with the fact that they were the only ones I needed.

I was messing around with the Honeyhive shortcut and was able to make it with a single jump using Luigi. If Luigi can single jump it, then that's a good sign that Mario should be able to double jump it... will definitely have to try it some more.