Speedrun Leaderboards Discussion Topic (SRL)

2013-08-13 10:25:44 pm

@tiburonCS

My general feelings are that everybody has avenues available to them to deal with the feedback they get, good or bad. You don't like people commenting on your video, disable Youtube comments. You don't want anyone knowing you got a certain time, take it off the Web. Some guy bugging you, block him, etc.

I agree with more casual runs / let's play times not necessarily going on leaderboards; however, considering the focus of the leaderboards will be (as Mike89 said) to find the fastest times, that scenario doesn't worry me too much.

Hsanrb

Edit history:

Hsanrb: 2013-08-13 10:29:46 pm

2013-08-13 10:26:03 pm

Quote from presjpolk:

In any case it sounds like the way to thwart the use of any SDA time is to beat it. Then it's not a WR anymore, and then you have no video to link to.

They will just snap back to the last available time for you, just because theres no video of the WR run, doesn't mean theres no video of a top tier run. If it happens to be yours so be it. This all comes back to the issue I have with the idea, the runner is not in control of runs that end up on the leaderboard if that runners time happens to be the best known time on the internet. I looked long and hard for any Jumping Flash speedruns for anything I may have missed (and just because you spend 1000 hours on a game, doesn't mean you won't miss anything,) and chances are I'm the only one your going to find. And before you ask, yes I did try Nico, found 2 IL's for the sequel, but thats about it.

@Reed Even if I use all those functions, they will still be on SDA (because they were accepted) and they probably wouldn't take them down over something like this. While I could replace them, the leaderboards would just update to the new run... so what good is it?

[quote="presjpolk"]In any case it sounds like the way to thwart the use of any SDA time is to beat it. Then it's not a WR anymore, and then you have no video to link to.[/quote]

They will just snap back to the last available time for you, just because theres no video of the WR run, doesn't mean theres no video of a top tier run. If it happens to be yours so be it. This all comes back to the issue I have with the idea, the runner is not in control of runs that end up on the leaderboard if that runners time happens to be the best known time on the internet. I looked long and hard for any Jumping Flash speedruns for anything I may have missed (and just because you spend 1000 hours on a game, doesn't mean you won't miss anything,) and chances are I'm the only one your going to find. And before you ask, yes I did try Nico, found 2 IL's for the sequel, but thats about it.

@Reed Even if I use all those functions, they will still be on SDA (because they were accepted) and they probably wouldn't take them down over something like this. While I could replace them, the leaderboards would just update to the new run... so what good is it?

presjpolk

Edit history:

presjpolk: 2013-08-13 10:27:38 pm

2013-08-13 10:27:19 pm

HELLO!

Hsanrb: I'll have a video up. On Youtube or something. But every time they link to it I'll just break the link and re-upload or something

Reed

Edit history:

Reed: 2013-08-13 10:30:22 pm

2013-08-13 10:28:53 pm

@tiburonCS

Quote from Hsanrb:

Quote from presjpolk:

In any case it sounds like the way to thwart the use of any SDA time is to beat it. Then it's not a WR anymore, and then you have no video to link to.

They will just snap back to the last available time for you, just because theres no video of the WR run, doesn't mean theres no video of a top tier run. If it happens to be yours so be it. This all comes back to the issue I have with the idea, the runner is not in control of runs that end up on the leaderboard if that runners time happens to be the best known time on the internet. I looked long and hard for any Jumping Flash speedruns for anything I may have missed (and just because you spend 1000 hours on a game, doesn't mean you won't miss anything,) and chances are I'm the only one your going to find. And before you ask, yes I did try Nico, found 2 IL's for the sequel, but thats about it.

Isn't that the point of the leaderboards, though? So that you don't have to look all over for any possible speedrun of a given game. I mean all of us who run games have done that dance, where we look high and low on twitch archives, youtube, nico, community sites etc. for an existing run. I'd be glad to not have to deal with that.

I think it's fair to anonymize the runner ID in cases where you don't want your (e-)name on it.

Pres, that sounds less like SRL harassing you and more like you harassing yourself.

[quote="Hsanrb"][quote="presjpolk"]In any case it sounds like the way to thwart the use of any SDA time is to beat it. Then it's not a WR anymore, and then you have no video to link to.[/quote]

They will just snap back to the last available time for you, just because theres no video of the WR run, doesn't mean theres no video of a top tier run. If it happens to be yours so be it. This all comes back to the issue I have with the idea, the runner is not in control of runs that end up on the leaderboard if that runners time happens to be the best known time on the internet. I looked long and hard for any Jumping Flash speedruns for anything I may have missed (and just because you spend 1000 hours on a game, doesn't mean you won't miss anything,) and chances are I'm the only one your going to find. And before you ask, yes I did try Nico, found 2 IL's for the sequel, but thats about it.[/quote]
Isn't that the point of the leaderboards, though? So that you don't have to look all over for any possible speedrun of a given game. I mean all of us who run games have done that dance, where we look high and low on twitch archives, youtube, nico, community sites etc. for an existing run. I'd be glad to not have to deal with that.

I think it's fair to anonymize the runner ID in cases where you don't want your (e-)name on it.

Pres, that sounds less like SRL harassing you and more like you harassing yourself.

WingDingsLies

2013-08-13 10:56:02 pm

How is putting someone's name, time and link to the video on a leaderboard different than posting the same thing on a forum when it's not your own? Which happens in any number of game threads here. There's never been a requirement to only post videos of your own runs, just to credit them.

Patashu

2013-08-13 11:00:24 pm

Does the purported behaviour described in recent posts happen? Do people go on zeldaspeedruns, find that TheMakaron has the second best ocarina of time any% run and send him a rude twitch PM saying 'LOL u noob pydoyks #1' or whatever? Is this a real thing? Speedrunning seems to be pretty friendly in general honestly.

zewing

2013-08-13 11:29:28 pm

just( •_•)>⌐■-■ ..... (⌐■_■)wing it

If you stream or upload it's public knowledge that's something any reasonable person can agree too.

AdamAK

2013-08-14 01:06:22 am

Totally rad

Quote from Patashu:

Does the purported behaviour described in recent posts happen? Do people go on zeldaspeedruns, find that TheMakaron has the second best ocarina of time any% run and send him a rude twitch PM saying 'LOL u noob pydoyks #1' or whatever? Is this a real thing? Speedrunning seems to be pretty friendly in general honestly.

I was about to post the exact same thing. The argument of mass harassment is about as devoid of evidence as the fabled rift between SDA and SRL.

presjpolk

2013-08-14 01:46:57 am

HELLO!

Quote from Reed:

Quote from Hsanrb:

Quote from presjpolk:

In any case it sounds like the way to thwart the use of any SDA time is to beat it. Then it's not a WR anymore, and then you have no video to link to.

They will just snap back to the last available time for you, just because theres no video of the WR run, doesn't mean theres no video of a top tier run. If it happens to be yours so be it. This all comes back to the issue I have with the idea, the runner is not in control of runs that end up on the leaderboard if that runners time happens to be the best known time on the internet. I looked long and hard for any Jumping Flash speedruns for anything I may have missed (and just because you spend 1000 hours on a game, doesn't mean you won't miss anything,) and chances are I'm the only one your going to find. And before you ask, yes I did try Nico, found 2 IL's for the sequel, but thats about it.

Isn't that the point of the leaderboards, though? So that you don't have to look all over for any possible speedrun of a given game. I mean all of us who run games have done that dance, where we look high and low on twitch archives, youtube, nico, community sites etc. for an existing run. I'd be glad to not have to deal with that.

I think it's fair to anonymize the runner ID in cases where you don't want your (e-)name on it.

Pres, that sounds less like SRL harassing you and more like you harassing yourself.

Tell that to all the nasty Youtube comments I've had to delete and ban, and my Twitch inbox.

[quote="Reed"][quote="Hsanrb"][quote="presjpolk"]In any case it sounds like the way to thwart the use of any SDA time is to beat it. Then it's not a WR anymore, and then you have no video to link to.[/quote]

They will just snap back to the last available time for you, just because theres no video of the WR run, doesn't mean theres no video of a top tier run. If it happens to be yours so be it. This all comes back to the issue I have with the idea, the runner is not in control of runs that end up on the leaderboard if that runners time happens to be the best known time on the internet. I looked long and hard for any Jumping Flash speedruns for anything I may have missed (and just because you spend 1000 hours on a game, doesn't mean you won't miss anything,) and chances are I'm the only one your going to find. And before you ask, yes I did try Nico, found 2 IL's for the sequel, but thats about it.[/quote]
Isn't that the point of the leaderboards, though? So that you don't have to look all over for any possible speedrun of a given game. I mean all of us who run games have done that dance, where we look high and low on twitch archives, youtube, nico, community sites etc. for an existing run. I'd be glad to not have to deal with that.

I think it's fair to anonymize the runner ID in cases where you don't want your (e-)name on it.

Pres, that sounds less like SRL harassing you and more like you harassing yourself.[/quote]

Tell that to all the nasty Youtube comments I've had to delete and ban, and my Twitch inbox.

mikwuyma

2013-08-14 01:55:52 am

My feelings on The Demon Rush

PresJPolk: Don't derail leaderboards discussion with this talk about stealing your runs again.

We get it, you don't like how the leaderboards are going to use your times, but how is that bad?

1. When you submit your run to SDA, while it is your run, people can still see you run, and the time you got. It's not like you can effectively hide your time from the leaderboard. The video is publically available for all to see.

2. So if the leaderboard posts your time, is that the end of the world? They're not stealing the video. If anything, they're helping the video because it's going to get more views when the leaderboards links to the SDA run.

Also, I don't know about all those troll twitch and youtube comments, but I haven't had any from trolls, SRL or otherwise, and I'm one of the biggest targets people could aim for on SDA. When you go into #leaderboards on SRL and throw down fighting words, people are going to fight back, and one of the ways people fight back is by trolling.

If you really have to fight the leaderboards, then do it somewhere else, youtube, twitch, twitter, facebook, but this isn't the place to do it. Frankly, a lot of people on SDA staff like the idea of the leaderboards and has no problem with them.

PresJPolk: Don't derail leaderboards discussion with this talk about stealing your runs again.

We get it, you don't like how the leaderboards are going to use your times, but how is that bad?

1. When you submit your run to SDA, while it is your run, people can still see you run, and the time you got. It's not like you can effectively hide your time from the leaderboard. The video is publically available for all to see.

2. So if the leaderboard posts your time, is that the end of the world? They're not stealing the video. If anything, they're helping the video because it's going to get more views when the leaderboards links to the SDA run.

Also, I don't know about all those troll twitch and youtube comments, but I haven't had any from trolls, SRL or otherwise, and I'm one of the biggest targets people could aim for on SDA. When you go into #leaderboards on SRL and throw down fighting words, people are going to fight back, and one of the ways people fight back is by trolling.

If you really have to fight the leaderboards, then do it somewhere else, youtube, twitch, twitter, facebook, but this isn't the place to do it. Frankly, a lot of people on SDA staff like the idea of the leaderboards and has no problem with them.

Blechy

2013-08-14 02:29:17 am

One of the questions on the gdoc:

Quote:

How do we feel about hosting a single any% time/record for any obscure game for the NES?

In a wonderworld, I would hope that every game can find its way onto the leaderboard in some form or another. I don't think a game should be omitted just because the competition for it is low. Oftentimes if people see a lone time that's considered easy to beat, it will inspire them to go for it and thus breed further competition in a game that might otherwise go unnoticed.

nmaster64

2013-08-14 02:38:46 am

I'm hesitant to broach the topic, but...

Why exactly are the leaderboards "the SRL leaderboards", and not something independent? What is the point in them have been tied in with racing accounts?

Yagamoth

2013-08-14 02:51:27 am

INTJ

Quote from Blechy:

One of the questions on the gdoc:

Quote:

How do we feel about hosting a single any% time/record for any obscure game for the NES?

In a wonderworld, I would hope that every game can find its way onto the leaderboard in some form or another. I don't think a game should be omitted just because the competition for it is low. Oftentimes if people see a lone time that's considered easy to beat, it will inspire them to go for it and thus breed further competition in a game that might otherwise go unnoticed.

I think this was basically answered by Cosmo

Quote:

It is to spread information about what speedruns for that game/category are available online. The leaderboards are a resource to find speedruns.

So, it would align with your idea I guess.

mike89

2013-08-14 02:53:52 am

SEGA Junkie

Quote from nmaster64:

I'm hesitant to broach the topic, but...

Why exactly are the leaderboards "the SRL leaderboards", and not something independent? What is the point in them have been tied in with racing accounts?

THANK YOU for touching on what, I think, is the real elephant in the room. If these are really intended to encompass all of speedrunning, they should simply be the speedrun leaderboards. Now, in practice, this is probably just facile - trusted runners are trusted runners everywhere - but I do think it should be a separate entity to be completely inclusive.

iotku

2013-08-14 03:06:49 am

Quote from mike89:

Quote from nmaster64:

I'm hesitant to broach the topic, but...

Why exactly are the leaderboards "the SRL leaderboards", and not something independent? What is the point in them have been tied in with racing accounts?

THANK YOU for touching on what, I think, is the real elephant in the room. If these are really intended to encompass all of speedrunning, they should simply be the speedrun leaderboards. Now, in practice, this is probably just facile - trusted runners are trusted runners everywhere - but I do think it should be a separate entity to be completely inclusive.

Maybe a more apt name would be something around "SRL Hosted Leaderboards", "SRL Leaderboards" (might not be the final name) adds a bit of confusion into SRL's involvement and perhaps confusion about normal SRL things such as streamers (on the front page), the IRC, races, and the race pages, which are completely separate for the most part.

Just my two cents of course.

vorpal

2013-08-14 03:12:26 am

Quote from mike89:

THANK YOU for touching on what, I think, is the real elephant in the room.

the real elephant in the room is what it's called?

Graviton

Edit history:

Graviton: 2013-08-14 03:34:05 am

2013-08-14 03:33:20 am

Quote from mike89:

but I do think it should be a separate entity to be completely inclusive.

Considering there is no verification currently planned for posted times anymore, I don't think the leaderboards' name or those who are hosting it really make a difference. I think it makes sense for leaderboards to be paired with the SRL name because it is going to be created by those who are already heavily involved with SRL, and making some independent site exclusive from the proven system they have been working with for so long seems needless and illogical, especially considering the time it will already take to bring this project to fruition with current resources.

What notion of inclusion is there to worry about when a bunch of speedrun times are just being referenced in one place without any "authority" saying anything else about them other than strictly a time and some miscellaneous meta data? I would understand the problem people might have if every time that got posted had to be individually verified by SRL moderators/admins, but that won't exist to my knowledge.

I guess there is still the issue of SRL affiliated people deciding if runs that are flagged by users are actually cheated or not. Since there is a plan for individual game moderators to exist alongside general SRL leaderboard moderators and admins, I assume established members of the previously self-policing communities for each game could apply to become these game moderators with the ability to remove flagged runs on their own. This would make the SRL-only controlled aspect not really an issue to worry about I think.

That's my perspective at least.

[quote="mike89"]
but I do think it should be a separate entity to be completely inclusive.[/quote]

Considering there is no verification currently planned for posted times anymore, I don't think the leaderboards' name or those who are hosting it really make a difference. I think it makes sense for leaderboards to be paired with the SRL name because it is going to be created by those who are already heavily involved with SRL, and making some independent site exclusive from the proven system they have been working with for so long seems needless and illogical, especially considering the time it will already take to bring this project to fruition with current resources.

What notion of inclusion is there to worry about when a bunch of speedrun times are just being referenced in one place without any "authority" saying anything else about them other than strictly a time and some miscellaneous meta data? I would understand the problem people might have if every time that got posted had to be individually verified by SRL moderators/admins, but that won't exist to my knowledge.

I guess there is still the issue of SRL affiliated people deciding if runs that are flagged by users are actually cheated or not. Since there is a plan for individual game moderators to exist alongside general SRL leaderboard moderators and admins, I assume established members of the previously self-policing communities for each game could apply to become these game moderators with the ability to remove flagged runs on their own. This would make the SRL-only controlled aspect not really an issue to worry about I think.

That's my perspective at least.

CosmoWright

Edit history:

CosmoWright: 2013-08-14 03:35:26 am

2013-08-14 03:35:05 am

One reason I didn't call SRL "The Race Place" or something race-centric because I realized the potential that live streaming had back the day Jiano first ever pointed his webcam at his CRT. I saw that there was a lot of potential growth + cool things that could come about that were not related to racing.

Originally the front page was a list of recent races. We had a streams page in the top tab that would show races happening and also a list of everybody with a set stream in the IRC bot.

As the site evolved and I paid attention to the analytics I realized that the streams were truly the main draw of the site and the race data did not need to appear on the front page. I did an entire site redesign to reflect this.

As speedrunning's popularity was growing steadily ever since livestreaming became popular, the desire for leaderboards also grew as a direct result of this (desire to see more than the #1 time, desire to participate even though they weren't a top competitor, etc). In preparation for this, I did another redesign of SRL, to unify things and to prepare for "Leaderboards" being a clickable tab in the header. Every bit of race information (the live races, the game list, the stats, the past results, the inclusion of seasons, the bulletin board etc) have all been unified into "SRL Races," one subset of the SRL website. I even color coded everything (Streams = blue, races = red, leaderboards = purple). I've already done a lot of work on leaderboard visual design and stylesheets.

I feel SRL's community was really the driving force behind a lot of the modern speedrunning developments. I remember years ago I desired SDA to be a leaderboards site, but SDA does not want to be a leaderboards site. SRL does, hence the SRL Leaderboards. I've personally poured many hours of my life facilitating discussion and trying to figure out the optimal way to approach things. It's been a long and grueling process.

There is a strong benefit to having a unification of these different systems. You would have your SRL profile, which would contain your general information such as location, stream, twitter, yt, etc. at the top. These could then tie in to things such as the front page (uses your stream), your IRC name (could be set on the profile, perhaps allow multiple irc nicks!), the leaderboards (could let people find your youtube/twitter and it would use your country flag in the display). Additionally, you could find forum posts in one tab, your race stats/history/seasons stuff in another, and your leaderboard times in a third tab. This is what I want to accomplish and I find the unification of all of this to be a potentially really great asset.

"Streams" "Leaderboards" "Races" "Channel" "Forums" "Tools" being in the header would be ideal.

tl;dr - as SRL itself has birthed the desire for the leaderboards, I don't see a reason to make a brand new website that would have less functionality than if you could have a unification of accounts. plus I have already spent a bunch of time designing layouts etc. that would fit into the SRL website. also read Grav's post because it should sufficiently explain that there will not be the issue "SRL oldboys" verifying runs and eternalizing data.

One reason I didn't call SRL "The Race Place" or something race-centric because I realized the potential that live streaming had back the day Jiano first ever pointed his webcam at his CRT. I saw that there was a lot of potential growth + cool things that could come about that were not related to racing.

Originally the front page was a list of recent races. We had a streams page in the top tab that would show races happening and also a list of everybody with a set stream in the IRC bot.

As the site evolved and I paid attention to the analytics I realized that the streams were truly the main draw of the site and the race data did not need to appear on the front page. I did an entire site redesign to reflect this.

As speedrunning's popularity was growing steadily ever since livestreaming became popular, the desire for leaderboards also grew as a direct result of this (desire to see more than the #1 time, desire to participate even though they weren't a top competitor, etc). In preparation for this, I did another redesign of SRL, to unify things and to prepare for "Leaderboards" being a clickable tab in the header. Every bit of race information (the live races, the game list, the stats, the past results, the inclusion of seasons, the bulletin board etc) have all been unified into "SRL Races," one subset of the SRL website. I even color coded everything (Streams = blue, races = red, leaderboards = purple). I've already done a lot of work on leaderboard visual design and stylesheets.

I feel SRL's community was really the driving force behind a lot of the modern speedrunning developments. I remember years ago I desired SDA to be a leaderboards site, but SDA does not want to be a leaderboards site. SRL does, hence the SRL Leaderboards. I've personally poured many hours of my life facilitating discussion and trying to figure out the optimal way to approach things. It's been a long and grueling process.

There is a strong benefit to having a unification of these different systems. You would have your SRL profile, which would contain your general information such as location, stream, twitter, yt, etc. at the top. These could then tie in to things such as the front page (uses your stream), your IRC name (could be set on the profile, perhaps allow multiple irc nicks!), the leaderboards (could let people find your youtube/twitter and it would use your country flag in the display). Additionally, you could find forum posts in one tab, your race stats/history/seasons stuff in another, and your leaderboard times in a third tab. This is what I want to accomplish and I find the unification of all of this to be a potentially really great asset.

"Streams" "Leaderboards" "Races" "Channel" "Forums" "Tools" being in the header would be ideal.

tl;dr - as SRL itself has birthed the desire for the leaderboards, I don't see a reason to make a brand new website that would have less functionality than if you could have a unification of accounts. plus I have already spent a bunch of time designing layouts etc. that would fit into the SRL website. also read Grav's post because it should sufficiently explain that there will not be the issue "SRL oldboys" verifying runs and eternalizing data.

nmaster64

2013-08-14 04:29:49 am

Quote from CosmoWright:

There is a strong benefit to having a unification of these different systems. You would have your SRL profile, which would contain your general information such as location, stream, twitter, yt, etc. at the top. These could then tie in to things such as the front page (uses your stream), your IRC name (could be set on the profile, perhaps allow multiple irc nicks!), the leaderboards (could let people find your youtube/twitter and it would use your country flag in the display). Additionally, you could find forum posts in one tab, your race stats/history/seasons stuff in another, and your leaderboard times in a third tab. This is what I want to accomplish and I find the unification of all of this to be a potentially really great asset.

I agree with this in the long-term, however I still feel like this project already suffers from perfection syndrome to the point it risks not being done 'til 2015. It may make more sense to worry about integration w/ IRC and other things *after* the leaderboards actually have something to work with. One step at a time.

Unless somebody actually wants to pay me so I could focus on this stuff instead of how the hell I'm gonna pay the rent this month. Tongue

[quote="CosmoWright"]There is a strong benefit to having a unification of these different systems. You would have your SRL profile, which would contain your general information such as location, stream, twitter, yt, etc. at the top. These could then tie in to things such as the front page (uses your stream), your IRC name (could be set on the profile, perhaps allow multiple irc nicks!), the leaderboards (could let people find your youtube/twitter and it would use your country flag in the display). Additionally, you could find forum posts in one tab, your race stats/history/seasons stuff in another, and your leaderboard times in a third tab. This is what I want to accomplish and I find the unification of all of this to be a potentially really great asset.[/quote]
I agree with this in the long-term, however I still feel like this project already suffers from perfection syndrome to the point it risks not being done 'til 2015. It may make more sense to worry about integration w/ IRC and other things *after* the leaderboards actually have something to work with. One step at a time.

Unless somebody actually wants to pay me so I could focus on this stuff instead of how the hell I'm gonna pay the rent this month. :P

presjpolk

Edit history:

presjpolk: 2013-08-14 06:10:59 am

2013-08-14 06:10:43 am

HELLO!

Quote from mikwuyma:

If you really have to fight the leaderboards, then do it somewhere else, youtube, twitch, twitter, facebook, but this isn't the place to do it. Frankly, a lot of people on SDA staff like the idea of the leaderboards and has no problem with them.

There's a lot in your comment I'd have things to say to. But I'll only reply to this, in the spirit of cooperation with you.

You misunderstand. I'm not trying to fight the boards. What sites Cosmo Wright builds or not would be none of my concern. My only concern is my involuntary participation his boards, through the involuntary inclusion of SDA submissions into the SRL system. That's it.

Good day.

ShadowDraft

2013-08-14 07:27:48 am

Get over here!

Ok here I go. First of all I'd like to say I really love this idea. There's much potential in this and maybe only a few flaws in the structure but I'll get to it in a second. Secondly I hope my opinion on this won't just be ignored because I'm a newcomer because that's what I'm afraid of the most right now as I'm posting this.

My main concern about this project is the simply fact that you might not realise how much work this will be. You want to provide a credible leaderboard for many popular games alongside managing races. Right now the last point is having some problems in my eyes because the mods in the irc chat are limited to maybe one or two people actively doing work. This is not meant to be offensive in any way I know people are busy and all but with this project coming along this might be a huge problem. There's also a minor problem with different timezones. This may or not be a concern because in a forum you could just leave a PM but in irc if someone has an important question and noone answers it leaves a bad impression on that person.

It might be a good idea for the senior moderators to elect people from different timezones but that's just me thinking some steps ahead. It may very well be not needed at all.

This brings me to another concern. People trading votes / falsely using their powers to flag someone else. As I stated above this will be very difficult to supervise. Eventually this project will grow big naturally with more games being added and I don't see how a few people can maintain it to a credible level.

Will you choose more people as more games are added or what's the general idea in that direction?

Ok here I go. First of all I'd like to say I really love this idea. There's much potential in this and maybe only a few flaws in the structure but I'll get to it in a second. Secondly I hope my opinion on this won't just be ignored because I'm a newcomer because that's what I'm afraid of the most right now as I'm posting this.

My main concern about this project is the simply fact that you might not realise how much work this will be. You want to provide a credible leaderboard for many popular games alongside managing races. Right now the last point is having some problems in my eyes because the mods in the irc chat are limited to maybe one or two people actively doing work. This is not meant to be offensive in any way I know people are busy and all but with this project coming along this might be a huge problem. There's also a minor problem with different timezones. This may or not be a concern because in a forum you could just leave a PM but in irc if someone has an important question and noone answers it leaves a bad impression on that person.

It might be a good idea for the senior moderators to elect people from different timezones but that's just me thinking some steps ahead. It may very well be not needed at all.

This brings me to another concern. People trading votes / falsely using their powers to flag someone else. As I stated above this will be very difficult to supervise. Eventually this project will grow big naturally with more games being added and I don't see how a few people can maintain it to a credible level.

Will you choose more people as more games are added or what's the general idea in that direction?

Patashu

2013-08-14 07:36:25 am

If data related to the leaderboards is stored in a historical manner (e.g. if a record on a leaderboard is added, removed or edited the old state will still be in the table but hidden due to not being the most recent version. similarly you could store a history of flags and other actions) then it is easy to revert abuse using simple SQL once it is known.

xcd

2013-08-14 08:03:25 am

Cube Throw = OoB

Quick question: during his short stay in #leaderboards (i wonder why), he told a member of SRL to "kill themselves" and to "die in a fire". He also said he will sue Cosmo (lol) several times. How is this different from dugongue and why exactly should presjpolk be allowed to another marathon again?

Svenne

2013-08-14 08:25:53 am

Smörgåsbord

You know what the told me during my stay? Read the whole log.

xcd

2013-08-14 08:27:03 am

Cube Throw = OoB

I did, twice (it's in my mIRC logs). Still no justification, sorry.