Speedruns on TV

tmont

Edit history:

tmont: 2005-12-10 08:45:01 pm

2005-12-10 08:44:36 pm

Not going to school today

Quote:

And what's the deal with bands being able to record a song for there album which is a complete cover? EG: Alien Ant Farm, Limp Bizkit

Copyrights are temporary, they don't last forever. Music copyrights last like 75 years or the lifetime of the composer, whichever is longer (something like that, I don't remember exactly). But anyway, performing a cover of somebody's music is perfectly legal without getting their permission, as long as you don't charge for it (and maybe even if you do charge for it, I don't remember exactly). Otherwise, if you plan on pulling a profit from someone else's copyrighted material, you need the permission of the copyright holder. So, Alien Ant Farm needed Michael Jackson's (or whoever owns the copyright for Smooth Criminal) permission before they could record Smooth Criminal.

Radix

2005-12-10 09:01:35 pm

I'm addicted to games

Quote:

Copyrights are temporary, they don't last forever.

In the past, yes.
Now... no. They are essentially forever.

slYnki

2005-12-10 09:07:05 pm

XXY

If it were my speedrun in question, I wouldn't care if they aired it and I didn't profit from it. It was just something I did for fun. As long as they gave proper credit, it wouldn't be a problem at all ^_^;

But unfortunately.... <_<;

Arrow

2005-12-10 09:33:28 pm

Now a hit show on the CW

Sir_VG, I'm sorry you misunderstood what I was trying to say. I'm not trying to place myself above you, and I know that just because you misspell one word it doesn't mean you don't know what you're talking about. Personally, I don't really care (plagiarism is a retarded spelling anyway Tongue

), I was just trying to say that the moderator, who can only base his opinion of you from that one post, might think otherwise. I didn't mean it as an insult, I apologize.

grndino

Edit history:

grndino: 2005-12-11 06:15:56 am

2005-12-11 06:04:36 am

G4 seems to be castrated for the moment, but that won't stop others from doing the same thing. I like the idea of a watermark similar the one Divx puts on its avis. I think it fades in and out every five minutes or so, only being up there for a couple seconds, and indiscreet enough to not be annoying. For shorter videos I guess it would have to appear a set number of times.

I poked around for watermarking software, but I haven't found anything that is both fuctional and free....go figure. However, Camtasia does basic watermarking (but it's always there), so I made a little test video to see how distracting/protective it would be.

http://rapidshare.de/files/8964898/lolsda.avi.html

Pic of test watermark:

illuminated

2005-12-11 06:10:51 am

I could actually do that, but I lost the wire that allows my capture card to get sound. If I could replace it I'd like to help with that. If anyone feels it necesary. If not...no big deal.

Sir VG

2005-12-11 06:26:37 am

Fucking Weeaboo

If you're going with just text for your watermark, you can use VobSub's VirtualDub plugin to stick some text in the one corner or something.

illuminated

2005-12-11 06:30:41 am

I was thinking windows movie maker, but you have a point there.

darkwasabi

2005-12-11 07:07:57 am

King of hearts

Ok,

1. If Radix would want watermarks he would've done so a long time ago.

2. Watermarks are very annoying, and would be a real pain to add into all the runs. It would be stupid to have a coulple with them.

3. Adding a watermark doesn't make something copyrighted.

4. Cinematech has decided to stop playing speedruns so this is pretty much pointless.

Sir VG

Edit history:

Sir VG: 2005-12-11 07:15:18 am

2005-12-11 07:10:51 am

Fucking Weeaboo

Windows Movie Maker? Microsoft product ugh.

I wonder if there's anything I could do in WinDVD Creator 2. That's what I have for DVD making software. Although the one thing I hate about the software is it's audio output. It puts it out in some dumb format that can't be compressed by any MP3 compression tool...virtualdub, CDex, you name it.

I'll keep looking around myself, preferably for some VirtualDub plugin.

Quote:

3. Adding a watermark doesn't make something copyrighted.

I don't see this fight really as about copyright, but about getting recognition for the work we did.

Quote:

4. Cinematech has decided to stop playing speedruns so this is pretty much pointless.

Some mod said that, yes. But the following could happen.

1) All speedruns are indeed canned.
2) They could have a couple more episodes ready and still be showing a couple more before it gets canned.
3) They could stop for now, wait for us to get off their backs, then bring them right back doing the same thing.

We don't know...we'll just have to see.

Windows Movie Maker?  Microsoft product ugh.

I wonder if there's anything I could do in WinDVD Creator 2.  That's what I have for DVD making software.  Although the one thing I hate about the software is it's audio output.  It puts it out in some dumb format that can't be compressed by any MP3 compression tool...virtualdub, CDex, you name it.

I'll keep looking around myself, preferably for some VirtualDub plugin.

[quote]3.  Adding a watermark doesn't make something copyrighted. [/quote]

I don't see this fight really as about copyright, but about getting recognition for the work we did.
 
[quote]4.  Cinematech has decided to stop playing speedruns so this is pretty much pointless. [/quote]

Some mod said that, yes.  But the following could happen.

1) All speedruns are indeed canned.
2) They could have a couple more episodes ready and still be showing a couple more before it gets canned.
3) They could stop for now, wait for us to get off their backs, then bring them right back doing the same thing.

We don't know...we'll just have to see.

Radix

Edit history:

Radix: 2005-12-11 07:11:12 am

2005-12-11 07:10:58 am

I'm addicted to games

Quote:

I like the idea of a watermark similar the one Divx puts on its avis. I think it fades in and out every five minutes or so, only being up there for a couple seconds, and indiscreet enough to not be annoying.

DivX does not put a watermark in its avis, or we wouldn't be using it.

By default it displays its logo for a small amount of time when you play a video, but you can turn that off. It's not encoded into the video unless someone does something stupid like encode an already encoded to divx avi to divx again.

Sir VG

2005-12-11 07:18:41 am

Fucking Weeaboo

Quote:

DivX does not put a watermark in its avis, or we wouldn't be using it.

By default it displays its logo for a small amount of time when you play a video, but you can turn that off. It's not encoded into the video unless someone does something stupid like encode an already encoded to divx avi to divx again.

Actually, even if you reencode a DivX AVI with DivX again, it still is only the typical way DivX displays it. They'd have to screencapture it for it to be embeded. Now THAT is stupid.

slYnki

2005-12-11 07:52:31 am

XXY

The only areas in a run I would see watermark being useful, would be during a small pause in time. For example, in the Unreal run while Allantois is on that plank of wood and riding it to the next area, a little water-like text could appear in the corner for a few seconds. That's my thinking anyways.

For me personally, when I start doing PC runs, I'll be putting an introduction screen or something, similar to the one Spider-Waffle has on his Opposing Force run.

Gorash

2005-12-12 06:01:05 pm

${$uid.$user}{' usertext'}

You could embed subliminal messages into the loading screen. Everytime Mario enters a painting or Samus changes a room a large "visit SDA" flashes up.

...just kidding...

Optime

2005-12-12 06:34:35 pm

March 16, 2010

Someone mentioned a video game speedrunning channel. It would take an epic level of ambition, but people supposedly laughed at Ted Turner when he dreamed up CNN.

If Radix & the twingalaxies top dog(s) and any other major owners ever formed an alliance and had a solitary vision for quality television...G4 would have a day of reckoning for their humble acts of hubris.

The way I see it, unoccupied people have watched the same stuff on the Game Show network over and over and over. Yet the average "big kid" today has never met and likely never will meet Alex Trebek or Pat Sajak. The principle of the entertaining TV game still holds, especially at a time when people (i.e. - males) can easily get burned with "reality tv" and its repetitive dumb-bloke jokes and recycled cutesy background themes. Don't they thirst to see something they know already -perhaps Link, Mario, Samus, Sonic, or Chrono? Air your oldest classics in the morning, mid90's games in the afternoon and contemporary runs in the evening/night. Have the runners and hosts do an audio commentary.

Someone mentioned a video game speedrunning channel.  It would take an epic level of ambition, but people supposedly laughed at Ted Turner when he dreamed up CNN.

If Radix & the twingalaxies top dog(s) and any other major owners ever formed an alliance and had a solitary vision for quality television...G4 would have a day of reckoning for their humble acts of hubris.

The way I see it, unoccupied people have watched the same stuff on the Game Show network over and over and over.  Yet the average "big kid" today has never met and likely never will meet Alex Trebek or Pat Sajak. The principle of the entertaining TV game still holds, especially at a time when people (i.e. - males) can easily get burned with "reality tv" and its repetitive dumb-bloke jokes and recycled cutesy background themes. Don't they thirst to see something they know already -perhaps Link, Mario, Samus, Sonic, or Chrono?  Air your oldest classics in the morning, mid90's games in the afternoon and contemporary runs in the evening/night.  Have the runners and hosts do an audio commentary.

TSA

2005-12-12 06:49:37 pm

Retired

Under current US Copyright Law, publishing something online constitutes the creator (C) protection. Your work counts as a "published" act, just like a published book.

Any work that is published, even if you don't file for (C) protection, is still protected by basic (C) law if you can prove you are the original creator and your work predated any others claiming to be the originals.

Radix

2005-12-12 07:30:04 pm

I'm addicted to games

I already said that TSA. Tongue

Anyway I did some more looking, and thanks to wikipedia, I believe I found the key thing that can be used for our favor: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feist_v._Rural

It was a supreme court case where one phone book sued another phone book for copying listings in their book. The court said the individual listings don't fall under copyright, only the compilation of them.

You can look at any individual portion of a speed run, whether is one audio effect, music track, individual character in a single frame of the image, font in the game etc, and clearly say that's copyright of the video game company.

But the compilation of all of these things into a video, the speed run, is copyright by the runner. The article also says "The court ruled that Rural's directory was nothing more than an alphabetic list of all subscribers to its service, which it was required to compile under law, and that no creative expression was involved." I think speed runs involve some creative expression, don't you?

I already said that TSA.  :P

Anyway I did some more looking, and thanks to wikipedia, I believe I found the key thing that can be used for our favor: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feist_v._Rural

It was a supreme court case where one phone book sued another phone book for copying listings in their book. The court said the individual listings don't fall under copyright, only the [i]compilation of them[/i].

You can look at any individual portion of a speed run, whether is one audio effect, music track, individual character in a single frame of the image, font in the game etc, and clearly say that's copyright of the video game company.

But the compilation of all of these things into a video, the speed run, is copyright by the runner. The article also says "The court ruled that Rural's directory was nothing more than an alphabetic list of all subscribers to its service, which it was required to compile under law, and that no creative expression was involved." I think speed runs involve some creative expression, don't you?

DK64_MASTER

2005-12-12 07:48:48 pm

Yep, they involve creativity, and artistic expression. I mean, just look at Trihex's YI run. He sticks his tounge up Bowser's ass.

We have sequence breaks, which go against the intent of the original game programmers notions of how to progress in the game, and we often resort to damage boosting. Hell, look in that topic of speedrun techniques posted a month or 2 ago.

If that doesn't define creativity or originality, you can go dig up Picasso out of his grave, make the words "Plagiarist" out his bones, and sue his living descendants for Picasso being un-original in his art!

I still stand firm on my stance, that Cinematch is stuck in some deep shit, and they are just trying to ignore the problem and hope it goes away.

BTW, I'm starting to think the mod will never reply to my PM (no shit sherlock).

Optime

2005-12-12 08:19:05 pm

March 16, 2010

Quote:

Yep, they involve creativity, and artistic expression. I mean, just look at Trihex's YI run. He sticks his tounge up Bowser's ass.

That's almost as bad as that one time when I had Simon whip out his golden dagger in a midair freeze frame after destroying Dracula in Castlevania II.

(Ahem, cough, vomit)

Yes, the case cited should be considered relevant assuming electronic and print media follow the same laws.

DK64_MASTER

2005-12-12 08:27:46 pm

Technically video is a bunch of print (images) played strung together and played at 60 (or 50) Hz. So I can't see why not...

InsipidMuckyWater

2005-12-12 09:28:39 pm

Visit my profile to see my runs!

Quote:

Anyway I did some more looking, and thanks to wikipedia, I believe I found the key thing that can be used for our favor: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feist_v._Rural

It was a supreme court case where one phone book sued another phone book for copying listings in their book. The court said the individual listings don't fall under copyright, only the compilation of them.

But the compilation of all of these things into a video, the speed run, is copyright by the runner. The article also says "The court ruled that Rural's directory was nothing more than an alphabetic list of all subscribers to its service, which it was required to compile under law, and that no creative expression was involved." I think speed runs involve some creative expression, don't you?

Nice find. If only there were such particularly useful Supreme Court cases concerning landlordship and its many abuses... Angry

Quote:

Someone mentioned a video game speedrunning channel.

Ahhh... so someone did read that. Though, I didn't just mention it, I [b]whole-nine-yards[/b]'ed that motherf***er.

Quote:

You know, the day that television devotes like a dozen channels to each topic of popculture will be interesting. Imagine a speedrun channel....

There are already quite enough runs to keep a channel running for well over a couple of days, I believe, and were a channel to actually hit the television airwaves that was specifically catered to gamers of the running variety, I doubt we would need to worry about accumulating more.

Other than continuous speedrunning, there could be blooper shows, top 10's, tournaments (with heavyweights over 4 hours, middleweights over 2 hours, light weights over 1/2 hour, and feather weights below 1/2) where viewers voted on their favorites ala the unscrupulous American Idol, upcoming previews, training spotlights, viewer feedbacks and submissions, and who knows what else...

EDIT: Imagine, if you will, an apartment with nine men all pushed to the limit, fighting to survive... attempting to make the BEST speedrun of them all.... I give you, "Speedrun to Hell." Watch as Uyama unplugs Marshmallow's VCR during the Sephiroth battle; watch as Snapdragon partially strangles Moody during the loading screens for Resident Evil 5; watch as Radix can't get any sleep from their infernal racket... Who will make the best speedrun? Who's run will be eliminated? Who will go home in a bodybag?
Find out Tuesdays at ten.

Well, as an effort to keep this absurdly ridiculous post related to the rest: This is what G4TV should be like; none of this plagiarist-esque scavenging crap!

I'm such a child.

[quote]Anyway I did some more looking, and thanks to wikipedia, I believe I found the key thing that can be used for our favor: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feist_v._Rural

It was a supreme court case where one phone book sued another phone book for copying listings in their book. The court said the individual listings don't fall under copyright, only the [i]compilation of them[/i].

But the compilation of all of these things into a video, the speed run, is copyright by the runner. The article also says "The court ruled that Rural's directory was nothing more than an alphabetic list of all subscribers to its service, which it was required to compile under law, and that no creative expression was involved." I think speed runs involve some creative expression, don't you?[/quote]

Nice find.  If only there were such particularly useful Supreme Court cases concerning landlordship and its many abuses...  >:(

[quote]Someone mentioned a video game speedrunning channel.[/quote]

Ahhh... so someone did read that.  Though, I didn't just mention it, I [i][b]whole-nine-yards[/i][/b]'ed that motherf***er.

[quote]You know, the day that television devotes like a dozen channels to each topic of popculture will be interesting.  Imagine a speedrun channel....
 
There are already quite enough runs to keep a channel running for well over a couple of days, I believe, and were a channel to actually hit the television airwaves that was specifically catered to gamers of the running variety, I doubt we would need to worry about accumulating more.  
 
Other than continuous speedrunning, there could be blooper shows, top 10's, tournaments (with heavyweights over 4 hours, middleweights over 2 hours, light weights over 1/2 hour, and feather weights below 1/2) where viewers voted on their favorites ala the unscrupulous American Idol, upcoming previews, training spotlights, viewer feedbacks and submissions, and who knows what else...
 
EDIT: Imagine, if you will, an apartment with nine men all pushed to the limit, fighting to survive... attempting to make the BEST speedrun of them all....  I give you, "Speedrun to Hell."  Watch as Uyama unplugs Marshmallow's VCR during the Sephiroth battle; watch as Snapdragon partially strangles Moody during the loading screens for Resident Evil 5; watch as Radix can't get any sleep from their infernal racket... Who will make the best speedrun?  Who's run will be eliminated?  Who will go home in a bodybag?  
Find out Tuesdays at ten.
 
Well, as an effort to keep this absurdly ridiculous post related to the rest: This is what G4TV should be like; none of this plagiarist-esque scavenging crap!   [/quote]

I'm such a child.

VorpalEdge

2005-12-12 09:36:38 pm

welcome to the machine

Overactive imagination there.

Personally, though, I doubt there'll ever be a dedicated speedrun channel. This is like the most niche group ever. Way too many people consider this obsessive for it to become regular.

InsipidMuckyWater

Edit history:

InsipidMuckyWater: 2005-12-12 09:44:25 pm

2005-12-12 09:43:30 pm

Visit my profile to see my runs!

Yeah, well, have you seen half the crap satellite and digital cable channels offer? I'm pretty sure there's a tattered-book-restoration channel in there somewhere...

Okay, maybe not.

illuminated

2005-12-13 05:28:59 am

Well...

Arrow

Edit history:

Arrow: 2005-12-13 07:30:38 am

2005-12-13 07:28:58 am

Now a hit show on the CW

I think a channel with not just speed runs, but all those other gaming related facets Insipid mentioned isn't too far-fetched. It would primarily have to be a game competition/tournament network to appeal to the widest audience. But then there could be a show (or shows) specifically dedicated to solo gaming achievements - high scores, fast times, maybe even TASs. I can just imagine some guy in a suit at a desk coming on screen in the middle of a broadcast of the newest speed run saying, "We're sorry to interrupt our regular programming, but we just received word that the current Legend of Zelda world record has been broken by none other than Mike "TSA" Damiani. We'll have more details at the end of this show." Grin