Sonic Generations SS

2012-03-11 06:03:07 am

Ganondorf = Donkey Kong LOOK IT UP!!

Quote from Animach1ne:

Just so you know : admins have said that the fact speed glitch is easier on consoles than on PC is not enough to make separate categories.

Well there goes any chance of me ever SSing, lol

Animach1ne

2012-03-11 06:17:24 am

Same for me I think :/ gonna stick with some individual Act 2 runs!

Paraxade

2012-03-11 06:28:00 am

Ahh, sucks :/

I use it on GH1, GH1-2, SS1, CE1, SeH1, and PW1. So sounds like it's actually not as often as I thought... and actually, out of those the only place it's really "necessary" is CE1. So I guess you aren't at -too- much of a disadvantage...

talon2461

2012-03-11 06:50:13 am

Sonic speedrunner

Actually I only use it on GH1, CE1 and PW1, You don't even need to use it on CE1 and you can still get around 1:20.

I have almost finished with my target times. Just a few stages I need to get a bit more consistent on. Hopefully I can start running it soon.

Da1AndOnlySonic

2012-03-11 05:17:55 pm

I could go SU-PER-SO-NIC!! !

I'll elaborate a bit about the speed glitch and my findings thus far.

The speed glitch is performed when you have your analog stick tilted slightly forward as little as possible to the point that Sonic is moving, whether your movement be left or right, -and- you have enough speed built up. The up-right method works because of this, and typically allows the player to have more control over keeping the analog stick in position while performing the glitch. However, it is because of how the speed glitch works that doesn't allow the up-right method to work when the camera shifts, since holding up-right with a camera change will also change up the amount of forward tilt. For example, if I hold the analog stick slightly forward and lock it in that position, Sonic will be able to perform the speed glitch on any section of GH1 (including the section after the s-tube where the camera shifts). The same cannot be said for using the up-right method, because when the camera changes in the section that follows the s-tube leading to the spring, you are no longer tilting the analog stick slightly forward, you are now holding forward with respect to the camera.

I have also done some speed glitch tests on the PC version in terms of amount of tilt. Using one of my old ps2 controllers that stays tilted slightly forward instead of centered sometimes, and a program that allows me to adjust the sensitivity of the controllers tilt, I did some thorough testing one day. Using GH1 as the test stage, I could not get a noticeable speed glitch for the very beginning of the stage, and only a moderate speed increase after jumping off of the first hill (enough to allow me to land on the section above the s-tube however). Later, in the section where the camera shifts, the was a major speed increase with the current tilt, enough to allow me to jump over the spring that leads to the first checkpoint and land on the section above the next s-tube! (which is RIDICULOUS if I may add).

Overall, it seems that on the console, the amount of tilt has more values it can take on than the PC version does. What I mean by this is that the console players not only have an easier time using the speed glitch, but can also use it in more places and with more effect than the PC players can. I'm not saying this out of observation, but instead out of experience, since I have both the PC and PS3 versions. I am not completely done with my testing yet though, because the type of controller used could be another factor to doing the speed glitch on PC. I haven't thoroughly tested using different controllers for PC yet, but out of all of the controllers I've used so far, the results have been the same.

I'll elaborate a bit about the speed glitch and my findings thus far.

The speed glitch is performed when you have your analog stick tilted slightly forward as little as possible to the point that Sonic is moving, whether your movement be left or right, -and- you have enough speed built up. The up-right method works because of this, and typically allows the player to have more control over keeping the analog stick in position while performing the glitch. However, it is because of how the speed glitch works that doesn't allow the up-right method to work when the camera shifts, since holding up-right with a camera change will also change up the amount of forward tilt. For example, if I hold the analog stick slightly forward and lock it in that position, Sonic will be able to perform the speed glitch on any section of GH1 (including the section after the s-tube where the camera shifts). The same cannot be said for using the up-right method, because when the camera changes in the section that follows the s-tube leading to the spring, you are no longer tilting the analog stick slightly forward, you are now holding forward with respect to the camera.

I have also done some speed glitch tests on the PC version in terms of amount of tilt. Using one of my old ps2 controllers that stays tilted slightly forward instead of centered sometimes, and a program that allows me to adjust the sensitivity of the controllers tilt, I did some thorough testing one day. Using GH1 as the test stage, I could not get a noticeable speed glitch for the very beginning of the stage, and only a moderate speed increase after jumping off of the first hill (enough to allow me to land on the section above the s-tube however). Later, in the section where the camera shifts, the was a major speed increase with the current tilt, enough to allow me to jump over the spring that leads to the first checkpoint and land on the section above the next s-tube! (which is RIDICULOUS if I may add).

Overall, it seems that on the console, the amount of tilt has more values it can take on than the PC version does. What I mean by this is that the console players not only have an easier time using the speed glitch, but can also use it in more places and with more effect than the PC players can. I'm not saying this out of observation, but instead out of experience, since I have both the PC and PS3 versions. I am not completely done with my testing yet though, because the type of controller used could be another factor to doing the speed glitch on PC. I haven't thoroughly tested using different controllers for PC yet, but out of all of the controllers I've used so far, the results have been the same.

Animach1ne

2012-03-12 05:54:46 am

Nice post man Smiley

thanks!

Paraxade

Edit history:

Paraxade: 2012-03-12 11:59:41 am

Paraxade: 2012-03-12 11:57:59 am

Paraxade: 2012-03-12 11:57:42 am

2012-03-12 11:50:57 am

1:13. Still needs lots of work, but this is the first run I had where a pretty decent chunk of the run went right. Mostly just sharing it because of that, but of course if anyone's got any improvements feel free to point them out.

I really need to get CC2 more consistent :/

Sonikkustar

2012-03-12 01:15:20 pm

The Loony Bin

As someone who hasnt played Generations yet, I cant watch this. >_<

Which is a shame because that time sounds awesome.

Animach1ne

2012-03-12 02:40:06 pm

Great man, gonna have a look at that asap, exams right now Sad

But just one comment : CC2 is a bitch :>

dballin

2012-03-12 04:01:51 pm

Balls jerky

I haven't played Generations yet either. From what I can see the game consists of 5% platforming and 95% go really fast in a straight line. Sad

AxonZin

2012-03-12 06:22:37 pm

I am encyclopedia

Quote from dballin:

I haven't played Generations yet either. From what I can see the game consists of 5% platforming and 95% go really fast in a straight line. Sad

You must not have seen much, then.

dballin

2012-03-12 08:13:32 pm

Balls jerky

I will admit to not watching much, but 2 out of the first 3 stages were exactly that.

Paraxade

2012-03-12 08:14:22 pm

You mean the first two stages in the game were easy?!?!

Shocker!

bmn

2012-03-12 08:15:40 pm

I'm just impressed you did Wisp 2 first try.

Paraxade

2012-03-12 08:16:03 pm

PW2 is actually really consistent. It just about never goes wrong.

footbigmike

2012-03-12 08:16:19 pm

That was an amazing run, Paraxade. From the start, I figured it was going to be just a really speedy run through the game as it was intended. Then Speed Highway 2 happened. And then Planet Wisp. Nice to see that the games are just as solid as they've always been.

I look forward to seeing the final version of this run - it's sure to become one of my favourites.

kirbymastah

2012-03-12 08:51:44 pm

<(^_^)>

I actually never played the game, I like watching speed runs of it though...

But from what I know about it, and from watching your speed run, I think it was pretty decent given how much time was spent on it so far. Obviously, there're tons of improvements, especially not dying on a few of the challenges and that last boss (that costed a lot...) But keep up the work! I really look forward to the final, polished product!!! thumbsup

AxonZin

2012-03-13 12:50:51 pm

I am encyclopedia

Quote from Animach1ne:

Ok, I wanted to know how often speed glitch could be used.

Just so you know : admins have said that the fact speed glitch is easier on consoles than on PC is not enough to make separate categories.

Are you sure about this? Because it's not simply "easier" on console... it doesn't even work in 90% of the spots on PC. It only works in very very specific spots. If they really aren't considered different categories, then that makes the PC version pretty much unrunnable due to the time lost in stages like CE1.

mikwuyma

Edit history:

mikwuyma: 2012-03-13 01:10:23 pm

2012-03-13 01:07:12 pm

My feelings on The Demon Rush

We made the speed glitch ruling because it sounded like it was simply easier to perform on console, rather than it's actually possible in more spots on console. We can probably make PC and console separate categories (it's not really a big deal to me), let me just check with some other admins.

AxonZin

2012-03-13 01:14:53 pm

I am encyclopedia

Quote from mikwuyma:

We made the speed glitch ruling because it sounded like it was simply easier to perform on console, rather than it's actually possible in more spots on consoles. We can probably make PC and console separate categories (it's not really a big deal to me), let me just check with some other admins.

I was actually thinking about this. While it would be more fair to runners to have separate for PC and Console, as far as the actually runs go, I can understand how it may be redundant to have two similar runs on the site with the only differences being that the PC uses the glitch much less often. Would it be better to simply have two categories, one using the speed glitch and one without using the speed glitch? That way both PC and Console players can compete in the latter category, and there won't be the problem of having two similar runs on the site.

Paraxade

Edit history:

Paraxade: 2012-03-13 02:29:13 pm

Paraxade: 2012-03-13 02:28:44 pm

Paraxade: 2012-03-13 02:28:23 pm

2012-03-13 02:22:15 pm

tbh, the bulk of the places I'm using the glitch are for consistency; the only place it seriously saves time is CE1, so we're looking at a difference of... maybe one minute, max, in a run lasting an hour, with the vast majority of the stages being unaffected. Seems like a pointless separate category to me.

Not that I don't see why this is a big deal for PC players, but I dunno... it just seems pointless to have a separate category where the only difference is two levels out of 30+ are done slightly differently. But it's not a huge deal to me either way. I'm just not really convinced that the PC version is "unrunnable" as it is.

AxonZin

2012-03-13 03:18:05 pm

I am encyclopedia

I guess it's not really "unrunnable", but there are still a lot of factors to be considered here. Just because the speed glitch isn't very useful now doesn't mean there won't be more discoveries and more ways to utilize it later on.

I understand both sides here. It makes sense to create a new category because it's pretty unfair to make PC players have to compete against a faster version. A minute is a lot of time. However, it's also sort of redundant to make a new category out of it because while there are certainly differences, it's not necessarily enough to differentiate between two different categories.

Miles

2012-03-13 03:35:51 pm

Quote from AxonZin:

Just because the speed glitch isn't very useful now doesn't mean there won't be more discoveries and more ways to utilize it later on.

Just because no one knows how to use it anywhere in the PC version now doesn't mean there won't be a way found to do it later on.

Paraxade

Edit history:

Paraxade: 2012-03-13 05:07:13 pm

Paraxade: 2012-03-13 05:06:38 pm

Paraxade: 2012-03-13 05:06:37 pm

2012-03-13 05:06:22 pm

Anyway. I'm changing a couple of my goals.

GH1: 0:42.xx
CP1-5: 0:39.xx
CC2: 1:50.xx

I've been doing some SS attempts last night and tonight, but I'm having a hell of a time getting any runs past chemical plant, blah. All the ones that do get killed on SS1.

AxonZin

Edit history:

AxonZin: 2012-03-13 07:07:08 pm

2012-03-13 07:06:14 pm

I am encyclopedia

Quote from Miles:

Quote from AxonZin:

Just because the speed glitch isn't very useful now doesn't mean there won't be more discoveries and more ways to utilize it later on.

Just because no one knows how to use it anywhere in the PC version now doesn't mean there won't be a way found to do it later on.

I suppose that makes sense. Category decisions should be made based on the tricks that exist now, not potential ones.

So then, I'm out of ideas.