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StrangenessDSS: 2006-03-09 12:18:14 am
Secret of Mana
Hello i am a french player and i apologize for my bad language  Tongue

I can finish Secret of Mana under 7 hours ( single-segment  ;)), do you think it's a nice or a bad time ? Is there a WR ? I haven't found it on the net.

Now i've too work but for 07/08 2005 i will have the time to do this run, i am sure, really.

But i want to know before that if it will be interresting or boring ?
And i can now speak a little of this run before to make the run in these next months.

I know a few tricks and i take 0 damages for each char before the fight with spiky tiger ( i know it's just fun ), i know where are my shorts training areas.

But if you know a few tricks for to kill the boss with low magic  Tongue ( for example i killed Frost Gigas with fire magic at level 0 but i understood that it was slower than a short training before this fight ), it will be nice !

And note Pure Land is a nightmare for a speed run  Angry This part takes an enormous time in my speed run  Angry
Thread title:  
Edit history:
Molotov: 2005-03-12 11:13:45 pm
Hey. I'd like to see a Secret of Mana run, so under 7 hours would be good for me.

You might want to split it up into a few segments if it will save you time on a trouble area.

Saving before the Pure Lands in particular would probably save you a potential headache...since you never know when a bad guy might hit you with a critical.

Even on a normal game the Pure Lands are evil, as the enemies deal way too much damage. I don't even think the Mana Fortress is THAT bad...  Shocked

Remember to spam magic on a bad guy without stopping, and to suck MP from flower enemies as necessary (pink for 10, blue for 20).

I use that to power up Sprite's magic, but it might be a bit more than you can afford.

Lunar Magic might be useful if you saved it recently, but I doubt it (a good effect is always a plus though, even at 8 MP).

Good luck with the run.  Grin
Wasted, Not Worried!
that would be a run I'd shell out cash for the DVD for.

Do it, because I'm waiting now Grin
Secret of Mana
I want to do a single segment because it's for me more impressive and more nice.

And if for example i die in Pure Land it isn't lost time because it's training for the next time  ;).

In fact Pure Land is easy if we are 2 or 3 humans but i make this run alone. The worst matter is the chars played by the game are idiots when they move, everybody know it, but it's really a catastrophe in Pure Land for a speed run : to use lost of time "select" or to cut with sword all the time takes time.
I'ts strange that ennemies of Pure Land are stronger than ennemies of Mana Forteress  (except master ninja ! ) ... perhaps because it's source of mana ?

Thanks for the conseils, i know these tricks  Wink
And do you how how to kill the first boss with 0 damage in a few secondes each time ( used for speed run ) or to kill the final boss without mana sword ( not used for speed run !!! ) ? Wink

Thanks for encouragements  Wink

Oh, and for the speed run, i wanted to do a version with other musics but on a 6-7 hours run... Huh?
Quote:
And do you how how to kill the first boss with 0 damage in a few secondes each time ( used for speed run ) or to kill the final boss without mana sword ( not used for speed run !!! ) ? Wink

Oh, and for the speed run, i wanted to do a version with other musics but on a 6-7 hours run... Huh?


Hey. I don't know how to kill the first boss that way, but I do know how to kill the final boss without the Mana Sword (we used to do it all the time, until I grasped how Mana Magic works).

My sister figured out a long time ago that by using Cure Water during his flame attack, you're invincible. Remedy works too, but why not heal yourself while you're at it?

Besides, you wouldn't have to sit through a longer animation and that stupid sound it makes.  Grin

About the other music though, are you meaning adding something of your own in there? If so, Radix wouldn't like that.
Edit history:
seiken: 2013-05-21 10:06:43 pm
seiken: 2013-05-21 09:46:05 pm
Secret of Mana
Ok no music for the speed run ( i thought about som remix etc... but that's not a matter )  Wink

I found alone this little trick to kill the first boss :
At the begining of the fight go to the top north-east of the room. Then walk 1 s to the left. Watch up and use the sword. While this time, the boss is jumping and repeats this action.
This would be fantastic, but are you sure you can raise enough of your character levels for the harder fights towards the end. What is or would you think your main characters energy level will be by the time your in the Mana Fortress?
y halo thar buttsecks? D:
Hello, I'm currently working on a tool-assisted timeattack of this game, I'm only at the dwarf village yet though.
Maybe you can learn something from the movie and see what's theoretically possible, and if you have critique about the movie or know some better strategies please tell me Smiley

The thread
http://bisqwit.iki.fi/nesvideos/forum/viewtopic.php?t=425&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=135

And please nobody start a flame war about the emulator movies here, we've had enough of this shit already ._.

I'm really looking forward to see your speedrun, and good luck with it
That would be awesome. Grin

But I never beat it because I kept getting stuck. Angry
bläää
Yes, I must see this run. I thought its impossible to make a run so fast, so I higly waiting for this run Cheesy
Secret of Mana
Actually I have a week end with 3 days so i have a little time for secret of mana.
Today i made a attempt of speed run.


Enter the name of randi -) Mech Rider 3 dies
Single segment : 5h35 real time and i played alone.  I can do really better  Wink

I die in Pure Land  Grin

My stats just after Mech Rider 3 :

Randi Level 34 - exp 183415
Lol i have 340 HP  ( level 31 ) just before Hexas and i have 369 HP just after Meka 3 ( level 34 )  Wink -) and i win 2 levels with Hexas  Wink
Sword 3.12 and other at 0.00


Purim Level 33 - exp 178316
286 HP - 25 MP
Magic Level :
Undine 4.15
Lumina 0.18
Dryad 0.27 and other at 0.00


Popoie Level 34 - exp 198050
289 HP - 26 MP
Magic Level :
Undine 7.0
Gnome 6.0
Sylphid 4.30
Salamando 5.12
Shade 2.14
Luna 7.0
Dryad 0.0

After Mech Rider 3 :
Purim and Popoie have just their initial equipement...
Randi has just 120 GP+70 GP equipement ( sorry i don't know US names ) i bought just before the fight with Tropicallo...

I used Shade ( Dark Force ) in tree palace for to circumvent the monsters because Dark Force is a very long animation.

I die in Pure Land but i don't have recorder ( because i am testing lots of strats and the time 5h35 include these strats ) the run so i could safeguard my game just before the fight with hexas and mech rider 3  Wink
Today i'm tired but tomorrow i finish the game and post the final time and the final stats  Wink and i can test lots of strats in Pure Land but i finally made this decision : i controll just the girl, the two other can die, and i use resurection for the sprite and the boy at each boss. Tree Palace is hard and long and Pure Land is harder but faster.
I think finally my run will be very under 7 hours  Wink


I have 3 questions for Radix :

1) What sort of run is better for an RPG Huh?
-1 h 30 single segment
-1 h in few parts

2) For Secret of Mana :
If i do a run alone and if an other person made a run with two others humans with a better time it's an other category or my run is delete of sda ?

3) Which quality of the movie for a run of 6h+ ?
I'm addicted to games
Quote:
1) What sort of run is better for an RPG Huh?
-1 h 30 single segment
-1 h in few parts


You could do both... a slower SS run is a separate category from a segmented run.

Quote:
2) For Secret of Mana :
If i do a run alone and if an other person made a run with two others humans with a better time it's an other category or my run is delete of sda ?


Hmm, not sure... theoretically one player could be holding two controllers to move the characters around in the overworld, so you can't really prove that a run was only one player or not.  What do others think?

Quote:
3) Which quality of the movie for a run of 6h+ ?


Are you capturing yourself, or mailing to nate?
Ben Goldberg
Quote:
Hmm, not sure... theoretically one player could be holding two controllers to move the characters around in the overworld, so you can't really prove that a run was only one player or not.  What do others think?


I would have them be seperate catagories. The way I'm hearing it, it's like having a single player run and a co-op run, you wouldn't have a co-op run take over a SP run, since they're different.
Bisquit separates multiplayer games so ya. separate them. Especially since SoM AI sucks.

If you happen to have a multi-tap you can also play with 3 players in SoM as well.
Quote:
Bisquit separates multiplayer games so ya. separate them. Especially since SoM AI sucks.

If you happen to have a multi-tap you can also play with 3 players in SoM as well.


Hey. That's an understatement...  Cry

Anyway, I'd recommend two players to get the most speed, since I think you need to be a character other than the one you're controlling to rapidly cast spells (correct me if I'm wrong).

Then again, you could have a third player who quits during a boss fight...which should be faster than two players (getting there that is).
Edit history:
seiken: 2005-04-12 07:13:54 pm
Secret of Mana
edit : i put boss pic because they have a little size and it's more nice  8)
i erase him if moderators think there is too pics or have a too big size for low connections.

Hello  Cheesy

Quote:
Are you capturing yourself, or mailing to nate?


I had never recorder a speed run.
I have a board of acquisition but i have no precise idea for XXXX KB/s  Tongue

Quote:
You could do both... a slower SS run is a separate category from a segmented run.



OK  Wink
But i wanted to say it's the same matter that the question 3)  Huh?

Quote:
Hmm, not sure... theoretically one player could be holding two controllers to move the characters around in the overworld, so you can't really prove that a run was only one player or not.  What do others think?


I think it's must be separate  Tongue

-)) Secret of Mana speed run

Enter the name of Randi -) the final boss
Real time and played alone in 2 segments ( because i die in Pure Land ) : under 6h40

Lol i die against the final boss :
I had Sword Mana with Dryad but i had only 4/8 spheres and he lost 0 HP ! I never tought me must have 8/8 sphere for to kill the final boss  :-[ because i never test it  :-[ i had always 8/8 sphere  Tongue
Strong of my Sword with Dryad : 189

Just after Pure Land i had 21X XXX GP so i bought the best armor we can have in shop ( 240 ) at the tree palace 3*65500 GP.
With it Mana Forteress was really easy  Wink
I take a few minutes for traning of Shade 2.XX -) 5.0
Finally i must have 8/8 sphere and only 2/3 best armor but Mana Forteress remains easy  8)

I think if i had 8/8 spheres i finished the game under 6h45 including introduction but not the credits...
This time includes tests of way.

Stats :

Just after Pure Land ( for addaman ) :

Randi and Purim Level 37
Popoie Level 41

Just after Dark Lich :

Randi Level 41 - exp 378345
437 PV
Sword 3.33 and other at 0.0

Purim Level 41 - exp 375467
348 PV
Magic Level :
Undine : 4.55
Lumina : 0.18
Dryad : 0.63 and other at 0.00

Popoie Level 44 - exp 478845
366 PV
Magic Level :
Undine : 8.27  Grin
Gnome : 6.78
Sylphid : 5.24
Salamando : 5.64
Shade : 5.88
Luna : 7.72
Dryad : 0.00

I used Undine for to kill Buffy and Dark Lich and many other boss.

Here is the list of the difficults boss for a speed run :

1) : just because it's a long fight.

2) : just because it's a long fight.

3 ) : he's the MOST dangerous boss. Why ? If you don't spam it correctly immediatly at the beginning of the fight with Luna he does immediatly "Wall" and you can't win because it's Wall level 7 and "Dispel Magic" can't defeat this magic ( Shade's level is too bad ).

4) : you can't spam it very good because you must wait animation "Fireball" is finished (pratically ) before to do new fireballs. And the heads are very dangerous in this little room.

5) : it's a long fight and he's very dangerous when he runs.

6) : He can be fast when he runs and i don't have armor.

7) : i don't rember exactly if all the dragons of Pure Land can do that ( i put only the pic of the first dragon the two others have just others colors ) but if they want they can hit all your chars with 700 damages and not with a spell of the eight magics but with a personnal capacity... Lips Sealed But it's very random so you must really spam these Dragons.

Now i don't needs of tricks for training level/magic  Wink

I must learn better the maps for better runs of Randi/Purim/Popoie : i use "select" many times when they runs : when a char has finish to run in a direction i use "select" and i run in an other direction with an other char before the bar becomes 100% for the first char.
I can do better these improvements with a better knowledge of the maps.
Edit history:
Skunk: 2005-04-03 07:16:51 pm
Wasted, Not Worried!
maybe after you complete the SoM run, you should do the other games in the series.

FInal Fantasy Adventure, Legend Of Mana (I'm not even sure is that's a part OF the series), and Seiken Densutsu 3 is you can find a boneheaded half wit who you can get it cheap off of.

I'd do FFA, because I used to blitz through that game in a single sitting 2 1/2-3 hours, but not only were all my gameboy carts stolen, I lack the Super Game Boy, a working snes, and the general knowledge on how to capture a run.
thanks. SoM is possibly the greatest RPG ive ever played. I just never thought of a speed run for it. I would help if i could i know the game inside out (pretty Much) but i just dont know how to help. Also you have to play with 3 people to complete it. The computer will take too long You need 3 dedicated players for it to work. I wish anyone trying this the best of luck you will need it.
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Quote:
Hmm, not sure... theoretically one player could be holding two controllers to move the characters around in the overworld, so you can't really prove that a run was only one player or not.  What do others think?


Actually he could prove.
If a second controller is plugged in a small "2" appears next to the character the second controller is currently controlling. If the tape is not too crappy this should be verifiable.

So, well, do a run, and if a 2-player run pops up that is at equal quality faster, make it two categories.
I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
I'll watch your run when it's done, Seiken.  I'm looking forward to it.

Gorash, I think Radix meant that one player could theoretically use two controllers at once.  The 2 would be at the bottom of the screen, but it would only be one person playing.

I think there should be seperate categories for multiple players and 1 player.  You could just say that one player doesn't allow the use of a second controller, even if the same person's playing them both.  Not ideal, but it's the only way to prevent cheating.
Edit history:
seiken: 2005-04-12 08:30:08 pm
Secret of Mana
Hey today because it's hollidays for me i had the time to do a new attempt of speed run.

Without test of ways now i kill mech rider 3 in 5h10  Wink sow i think i will finish the game under 6h20 finally   Wink
In fact today i die in pure land because the first dragon kill me in one hit with his "special capacity - a few circles". With my training in fact there is only aegagropilion and these dragons who are really very dangerous.

Don't worry for all the cheats for to controll the chars and just see their stupid ai and you will see it's impossible to play so bad  Angry Angry i'ts a catastroph at the tree palace and in pure land  Shocked nobody human run just behind a boss and wait to be killed...

My levels were more lower in pure land than the other times : level 33-31-33.
But in fact that's not important because since the tree palace all the monsters kill me with one hit because i haven't armor... so you can be at level 40 i'ts the same thing when you lost 550 HP in pure land...

Finally i use undine for all the boss who haven't weakness...  :bird:  the blue tigger, borealia, the robots, hexas, mech rider 3, buffy, dark lich, etc... :shoot:

There is only a little matter : at the end of the fight with dark lich undine is more than 8.00 and you can have the "super animation" and it's bad for to spam it Tongue
But that's not important  Wink

And i hate at the tree palace. Finally i think it's the worst ennemie because it always blocks the passage.
Then it's in pure land   and because it's a catastroph when you have with you 2 ai.

The other bad ennemies for my speed run are :




Now the speed run isn't really a matter.
In fact i have problems of record.
We can speak about it in this topic or i must make an other topic in the category of problems  Huh?
I read the FAQ but there is no answer for my problems...
It's not really a problem of size because i can later compress it with divx but my movies recorded are more lit... And when i play the screen is trembling... but not in the movie record it's just on my tv...
A friend lend me pinnacle 9 with the card and i have these problems with it.

If you can help me now i think - if radix accept it - i can send him my record of my run before may. After that i can only record it for July-August 05  Tongue but that's not a catastroph 8).
So please tell me if i must make a new topic for problems of recoding with pinnacle.




Quote:
maybe after you complete the SoM run, you should do the other games in the series.

FInal Fantasy Adventure, Legend Of Mana (I'm not even sure is that's a part OF the series), and Seiken Densutsu 3 is you can find a boneheaded half wit who you can get it cheap off of.

I'd do FFA, because I used to blitz through that game in a single sitting 2 1/2-3 hours, but not only were all my gameboy carts stolen, I lack the Super Game Boy, a working snes, and the general knowledge on how to capture a run.


Well i make at first a som speed run because i know this games better the others in the series. A speed run of som is quick to do for me because i play with it since my chilhood but the others games will take more time, but it's possible if some people want it.
In fact i was thinking that my second run will be perharps tales of phantasia ^^

I'm addicted to games
Quote:
I read the FAQ but there is no answer for my problems...
It's not really a problem of size because i can later compress it with divx but my movies recorded are more lit... And when i play the screen is trembling... but not in the movie record it's just on my tv...
A friend lend me pinnacle 9 with the card and i have these problems with it.


If you've never done video capturing before, you'd be much better off to record on some VHS tapes and mail them to nate when you're satisfied. It can be very difficult to get stuff I'm happy with.  Wink
Edit history:
seiken: 2005-04-23 09:07:50 pm
Secret of Mana
Well... Angry

I discovered a very bad thing for secret of mana speed run....

The run will be harder than we thought....
Why ? I am against the final boss with 8/8 sphere and it hit 0 HP... a mana sword charged with level 3 hit 65 HP...
Numbers of shpere hasn't importance, i know just now it because i never test it with a low level and with 8/8 sphere  Cry Cry

Conclusion : I HAD A TOO LOW LEVEL AGAINST THE FINAL BOSS AND I MUST HAVE TRAINING AT MANA FORTERESS  Shocked Shocked  Cry Cry
So i will be able to make a good run only for 07/08 2005...I think with this long training a run under 7 hours is possible.
But i must know where and how training is fastest at Mana Forteress. I can't do it in Pure Land because i haven't "super armor" ( i buy it with gold money of Boss in Pure Land ).
Then i must do lots of test because i needs to know what's the lowest possible level for to kill the final boss in a good time...
But when i will make the run in 07/08 2005 ( it's finally i said in my first post ) i will have the time to make a very nice run, i promise you  Wink
I hope you aren't angry, it's really a bad mistake.



edit : hey i remenber to have seen a time a "low level" faq on gamefaq :

http://db.gamefaqs.com/console/snes/file/secret_of_mana_low_level.txt

The author is a liar !

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BOSS! Mana Beast
Type: Dragon
9990 HP, infinite MP, 0 EXP, 0 GP

Abilities:
Flaming Flight
Swoop Charge
WALL Lv.8
DISPEL MAGIC Lv.8
LUCENT BEAM Lv.8


Preparations:
Party's HP and MP are full.

Strategy:
The trick to this is to heal just after the boss is ready to charge into
you. Do this twice, then use Mana Magic and Moon Energy. This combo
will cause 999 damage every time you make contact
. Don't charge up your
sword. It should only take two cycles to beat him. Now is the time to take
your screenshot.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Congratulations! You have now completed the Secret of Mana Low-Level
Challenge. Following this guide will result in a finishing level of 45,
which is very good! I think the lowest level you can possibly finish at is
around 42 or so.



It's false !! I have about the same level and this combo hit about 50 HP or 100 HP max !!
Edit history:
Sir VG: 2005-04-24 09:57:54 am
Fucking Weeaboo
Quote:

Actually he could prove.
If a second controller is plugged in a small "2" appears next to the character the second controller is currently controlling. If the tape is not too crappy this should be verifiable.

So, well, do a run, and if a 2-player run pops up that is at equal quality faster, make it two categories.


This game can also be a THREE player run (assuming you have the 4-port adapter).

And to answer an earlier question in the thread, Legend of Mana is indeed a part of the series (Secret of Mana is Seiken Densetsu 2, Legend of Mana is Seiken Densetsu 4, and Final Fantasy Adventure/Sword of Mana is Seiken Densetsu 1.  The 3rd game was never released in the US).
lol hey you people out there, im pretty amazed to hear about a 7 hour long speedrun on my favorite and oldest game..., this geme is over 10 years old... Cheesy i guess i gotto get my brother and a friend, ill try this stuff too. so it has to be under 7 hours? hm... can you use the permanent mana sword bug?
this bug where you land on an island... save  on it, restart and beat the first boss again to get mana sword level 9 permanently?... come on you heard about that ';) can you use a bug like that or is it counted teleporting? coz it teleports you back not forward...  Lips Sealed    Huh?