Rosenkreuzstilette/Freudenstachel

Edit history:

bjw: 2013-03-23 02:56:19 pm

2013-03-23 02:54:05 pm

These are the two Iris 1 jetslides. The second one is the easy one but since it consumes a fair amount of flugel energy, you'll end up with about 3 or so bars left for Iris 3. Thus, depending on your Iris 3 strat, you may need to reroute how you fly it (or forgo flying entirely).

Now, the first slide... Woo boy. Getting the slide itself isn't hard, and even if you mess it up you'll usually land safely on the platform (though if you descend too early then you do put yourself at risk of colliding with the laser). The followup is what makes this trick very difficult, and in my opinion, the most terrifying trick to perform in this entire game that I currently know of. You need to slide to the eggmet, swap 5 times to the left (or 6 to the right), freeze it, continue sliding, swap one to the right, continue sliding, time slow, continue sliding... It's the combination of all of this at once which makes this so difficult to do. If you could time slow while sliding then it would be slightly easier, but the fact that you need to be standing to do it just makes it all the more annoying to execute, especially because if you mess up your continuous slides while directly over a laser, this pretty much always results in an instant death. In theory you can time slow immediately after freezing the eggmet (that is to say, have no slides between the two weapon usages), but this puts you at risk of colliding with floor directly above the eggmet, and this will result in your jetslide speed resetting to normal.

As for the Schirach jetslide, I'll try to get a video up soon. I tried getting a replay of it a few times but I kept failing the followup. I'll try to describe it though: in the first quake met room, fly at the start normally but instead of getting off of it to start sliding after the first missile firing eggmet, keep flying and descend a bit. Weave through the two time bombs in front of you and jetslide on the long platform directly in front of you. The missile barrage here has the same pattern everytime, so quickly swap to eisschwert and freeze the one missile directly in front of you when you get to it, then continue sliding until the end.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMeZJwzXVKs

These are the two Iris 1 jetslides. The second one is the easy one but since it consumes a fair amount of flugel energy, you'll end up with about 3 or so bars left for Iris 3. Thus, depending on your Iris 3 strat, you may need to reroute how you fly it (or forgo flying entirely).

Now, the first slide... Woo boy. Getting the slide itself isn't hard, and even if you mess it up you'll usually land safely on the platform (though if you descend too early then you do put yourself at risk of colliding with the laser). The followup is what makes this trick very difficult, and in my opinion, the most terrifying trick to perform in this entire game that I currently know of. You need to slide to the eggmet, swap 5 times to the left (or 6 to the right), freeze it, continue sliding, swap one to the right, continue sliding, time slow, continue sliding... It's the combination of all of this at once which makes this so difficult to do. If you could time slow while sliding then it would be slightly easier, but the fact that you need to be standing to do it just makes it all the more annoying to execute, especially because if you mess up your continuous slides while directly over a laser, this pretty much always results in an instant death. In theory you can time slow immediately after freezing the eggmet (that is to say, have no slides between the two weapon usages), but this puts you at risk of colliding with floor directly above the eggmet, and this will result in your jetslide speed resetting to normal.

As for the Schirach jetslide, I'll try to get a video up soon. I tried getting a replay of it a few times but I kept failing the followup. I'll try to describe it though: in the first quake met room, fly at the start normally but instead of getting off of it to start sliding after the first missile firing eggmet, keep flying and descend a bit. Weave through the two time bombs in front of you and jetslide on the long platform directly in front of you. The missile barrage here has the same pattern everytime, so quickly swap to eisschwert and freeze the one missile directly in front of you when you get to it, then continue sliding until the end.

Senovit

2013-03-24 10:15:48 pm

I hit sub 34 for Pamela: http://www.twitch.tv/senovit/c/2067774
Replay file attached for those who want it.

Interesting notes:

Apparently defense does not quite work the way I had thought. While most bosses take 3 damage from charged and 2 damage from 3rd combo hit, things with heavier defense (Schirach blocking, Luste flashing, Dark Devil) take 1 point less damage from each of these things. However, while Seraph Iris takes 2 damage from charged, somehow she takes 2 damage from 3rd combo hit anyway. For this reason, it becomes worth it to tank the green homing balls if she spawns in either of the two lowest positions and just spam combo her. I had assumed all this time it would only do 1 damage...

I fall off Sepperin. If it wasn't for that, I'd be really really happy about this run, minor mistakes and all, but falling off Sepperin just makes me feel bad. This is mitigated somewhat by the fact that had I stayed on Sepperin I would have eaten two fireballs and thus been forced to e-tank anyway and lose a bit of time, but all the same. I FELL OFF SEPPERIN ;______;

I hit sub 34 for Pamela: http://www.twitch.tv/senovit/c/2067774
Replay file attached for those who want it.

Interesting notes:

Apparently defense does not quite work the way I had thought.  While most bosses take 3 damage from charged and 2 damage from 3rd combo hit, things with heavier defense (Schirach blocking, Luste flashing, Dark Devil) take 1 point less damage from each of these things.  However, while Seraph Iris takes 2 damage from charged, somehow she takes 2 damage from 3rd combo hit anyway.  For this reason, it becomes worth it to tank the green homing balls if she spawns in either of the two lowest positions and just spam combo her.  I had assumed all this time it would only do 1 damage...

I fall off Sepperin.  If it wasn't for that, I'd be really really happy about this run, minor mistakes and all, but falling off Sepperin just makes me feel bad.  This is mitigated somewhat by the fact that had I stayed on Sepperin I would have eaten two fireballs and thus been forced to e-tank anyway and lose a bit of time, but all the same.  I FELL OFF SEPPERIN ;______;

Attachment:

rks012.rpy

072

2013-03-25 10:55:04 am

Quote from bjw:

So it finally happened: sub 33 Freudia. And it wasn't by a hair of a second either, but by a fairly big margin producing a 32:50.76 ingame time. I still remember when I first saw 072 mention sub 33 and I thought it sounded absolutely crazy, but I guess he predicted the future on this one.

From my experience with RKS 1, I'd say it is often easy to underestimate how much room for improvement there is at any time.

Big congrats on the run. I will definitely watch as soon as I have time.

...Also, those Iris 1 slides are crazy.

nate

2013-03-25 04:09:31 pm

bjw, congrats on sub 33. if you are moving on to the first game, then imo you should submit this run. the submission process should be trivial because it is just the replay file. i will handle the rest.

nate

2013-05-07 05:31:37 pm

be sure to sign up to verify the run that was submitted if you are/were active running freudenstachel.

Senovit

2013-05-13 09:03:12 pm

I've been working on Grolla for the past couple weeks, with some new strats to improve upon the old run. Just hit 29:48.50, and I might take a break for awhile here after hitting that milestone. It seems like I can't record it at the proper framerate, so I attached the replay file here too.

In general it was a pretty sloppy run with no sub 12 eight bosses and lots of little mistakes all around but with Iris RNG really pulling it out for me in the end. I'm disappointed that I missed a 5 cycle devil by choking and failing to jump up for the final hit, but well, it happens. Devil can actually be 4-cycled if you perform it perfectly, saving another 26-30 seconds off this run but that's rare for me even in grinding mode though, so I think 5-cycle is probably a good goal in an RTA setting. Still, I've been working on this for so long that sub 30 has got me feeling pretty giddy. Cheers.

Attachment:

rks010.rpy

bjw

2013-05-14 10:58:14 am

Beastly run, nice job Senovit. It's crazy how a low 29, maybe even sub 29 might be possible for Grolla. Tia will definitely be seeing a sub 31 SS run in the future but who knows when, and anything better than that will probably be close to impossible unless something huge is discovered.

072

Edit history:

072: 2013-05-15 07:39:10 pm

2013-05-15 04:45:42 pm

Have you discovered anything new since I did my segmented run? Right now I'm thinking about the cutscene before Iris 1 that you wouldn't be able to skip in an SS, and it seems like sub-31 shouldn't be possible.

EDIT: Great run, Senovit. Just curious... how many attempts ended on the Tia refight? I was expecting you to use an e-tank, but I guess they come with a big penalty for Grolla.

Senovit

2013-05-16 06:12:29 pm

None, actually! Refight scares me so I tend to do the safer strategy of forcing her into water as opposed to leaving her in Freudenstachel mode. As far as the other refights go, I've only had a couple runs end to Sichte refight, and once to Luste (lol).

Taco Sauce

Edit history:

Taco Sauce: 2013-06-18 07:50:29 am

2013-05-17 09:07:39 am

nate

2013-05-17 03:36:37 pm

oh, weird. i always thought the replay file format was known and people were writing replay files by hand.

Senovit

2013-06-02 09:59:18 pm

Hi nate, I decided I wanted to submit my Pamela run, but the submission form didn't seem to have a place to attach anything aside from comments. I probably missed something but just in case, this is the replay I want to submit 'o'

Attachment:

rks012.rpy

nate

2013-06-03 09:22:02 am

cool. it's normal; usually after the submission form is received, an admin makes a pm that contains instructions for sending the file. however in this case since it's just the replay file i can attach it just as easily. thanks.

bjw

Edit history:

bjw: 2013-06-06 07:50:02 am

2013-06-06 07:30:36 am

Quote from 072:

Have you discovered anything new since I did my segmented run? Right now I'm thinking about the cutscene before Iris 1 that you wouldn't be able to skip in an SS, and it seems like sub-31 shouldn't be possible.

I currently have a 31:20 and this run includes about 15 seconds worth of easily avoidable mistakes (I lose 10 seconds alone due to completely screwing up the second machine fight). Most of this run uses your strats though, as well as strats from other old runs; not getting Lilli saves a nice amount of time.

The real kicker here though is that I recently discovered that a 3 cycle devil fight isn't TAS only (though it's still very difficult), and this saves more than enough time to make sub 31 a reality. I'll probably post a clip of a 3 cycle devil fight here sometime in the near future.

Edit: I just noticed that this is a super late response to your post. I should check this thread more often >_>

072

2013-06-06 10:24:45 am

Wow, nice. I'm looking forward to seeing that.

Senovit

2013-07-02 10:15:03 pm

By the way, to anyone still running RKS, the almighty community has determined that we will all switch back to 60 fps. 62.5 shenanigans are too silly. Not sure how records will be handled, probably just a straight conversion for now?

nate

2013-07-03 04:52:05 pm

live by the in-game timer, die by the in-game timer.

Vucious Creed

2013-10-17 09:06:38 pm

Glad my fanboy lvls aren't THIS high

Oh hey... thread necromancy, ha!

Seriously though, while it's been a while since I posted in the thread, I just thought I share something a little interesting. No, it's not a new run... yet, but it might be something that can be used in a run (strong emphasis on the word "might"). Anyway, I was messing around with Trauare's stage trying to get improve on consistancy enroute to obtaining sub-32:40 when something special happened. Please note that I'm under the assumption that no one else has done this, so if anyone knew about this before now, let me know... so, continuing.

This is going to be a bit lengthy and complicated but here goes: I'm sure some of you who have ran the game or followed the game enough are aware of the glitch in Trau's stage that stops the current, then gets rid of the water altogether, and ultimately softlocks the game, right? Well, what I've done is somewhat related to that. The replay I'm about to post is an Individual Level run of Trau's stage that skips half of the current section. I'm not sure how to explain how this happened, but I'm to believe that you need to cause the screen to delay scrolling at the first major turn to the right after the current begins to flow while moving to the point where you reach the next turn upwards. By this time, you should be practically at the right edge of the screen or close to it before the upward turn. At that point, when the current turns you upward, you should not be scrolling upwards at all... to a point. It's that point where apparently you zip through the remainder of the current section and reach the midpoint if you wiggle around the upper right corner (assumingly).

The effects of this is that you will arrive at the screen where the midpoint is, but you will not see the screen above you, which is the area you normally exit out of the current from to reach said midpoint. This makes navigating downward tricky since you won't be able to know where you are at all when the screen transitions there. Also, the entire vertical section is separated by individual screens which means that once you swim down at the bottom of the screen, it will transition to the next screen below (like a few other individual screens in the game) until you reach the fork of the stage where the game returns to normal. Take note that since the area is filled with spikes, if you don't know the layout of the stage, you reach the screen transition point, and end up INSIDE any spike trap... it's your ass, and you will be sent back to the beginning of the stage as the midpoint wasn't activated properly.

As far as the difficulty of the tech, it can be quite fidgety due to the fact that you need the right turning speed to cause the screen to delay scrolling on the first turn long enough (which may be, at most, about a second tops, give or take some frames) without either moving at normal pace (screen scrolling is normal and move through currents as you're supposed to) or being at risk of moving too fast and performing the current glitch (screen transitions to the next screen immediately as if the screens are separated by a hard transition point after the turn leading to said glitch).

Apparently, this shaved nearly 2 seconds from my best run of the stage so far, which questions if this is worth it in a single-segment run, but this is considering the fact that the movements while performing the Current Skip/Zip/Whatever and moving down the vertical shaft afterwards weren't completely optimal. I want to believe that maybe a couple of more seconds can be gained if movement is optimized fully, but that is spotty in and of itself. Anyway, this was a long a hell post, so I'll just let those who are able see the replay and judge for yourself on the validity of this, assuming no one has known about this already.

Oh hey... thread necromancy, ha!

Seriously though, while it's been a while since I posted in the thread, I just thought I share something a little interesting.  No, it's not a new run... yet, but it might be something that can be used in a run (strong emphasis on the word [i]"might"[/i]).  Anyway, I was messing around with Trauare's stage trying to get improve on consistancy enroute to obtaining sub-32:40 when something special happened.  Please note that I'm under the assumption that no one else has done this, so if anyone knew about this before now, let me know... so, continuing.

This is going to be a bit lengthy and complicated but here goes: I'm sure some of you who have ran the game or followed the game enough are aware of the glitch in Trau's stage that stops the current, then gets rid of the water altogether, and ultimately softlocks the game, right?  Well, what I've done is somewhat related to that.  The replay I'm about to post is an Individual Level run of Trau's stage that skips half of the current section.  I'm not sure how to explain how this happened, but I'm to believe that you need to cause the screen to delay scrolling at the first major turn to the right after the current begins to flow while moving to the point where you reach the next turn upwards.  By this time, you should be practically at the right edge of the screen or close to it before the upward turn.  At that point, when the current turns you upward, you should not be scrolling upwards at all... to a point.  It's that point where apparently you zip through the remainder of the current section and reach the midpoint if you wiggle around the upper right corner (assumingly).

The effects of this is that you will arrive at the screen where the midpoint is, but you will not see the screen above you, which is the area you normally exit out of the current from to reach said midpoint.  This makes navigating downward tricky since you won't be able to know where you are at all when the screen transitions there.  Also, the entire vertical section is separated by individual screens which means that once you swim down at the bottom of the screen, it will transition to the next screen below (like a few other individual screens in the game) until you reach the fork of the stage where the game returns to normal.  Take note that since the area is filled with spikes, if you don't know the layout of the stage, you reach the screen transition point, and end up INSIDE any spike trap... it's your ass, and you will be sent back to the beginning of the stage as the midpoint wasn't activated properly.

As far as the difficulty of the tech, it can be quite fidgety due to the fact that you need the right turning speed to cause the screen to delay scrolling on the first turn long enough (which may be, at most, about a second tops, give or take some frames) without either moving at normal pace (screen scrolling is normal and move through currents as you're supposed to) or being at risk of moving too fast and performing the current glitch (screen transitions to the next screen immediately as if the screens are separated by a hard transition point after the turn leading to said glitch).

Apparently, this shaved nearly 2 seconds from my best run of the stage so far, which questions if this is worth it in a single-segment run, but this is considering the fact that the movements while performing the Current Skip/Zip/Whatever and moving down the vertical shaft afterwards weren't completely optimal.  I want to believe that maybe a couple of more seconds can be gained if movement is optimized fully, but that is spotty in and of itself.  Anyway, this was a long a hell post, so I'll just let those who are able see the replay and judge for yourself on the validity of this, assuming no one has known about this already.

Attachment:

VC_Trauare_Run_WTF_104a.rpy

bjw

2013-10-20 09:31:02 pm

What the hell did I just watch? This is amazing, great find Smiley

Vucious Creed

2014-07-07 10:59:06 pm

Glad my fanboy lvls aren't THIS high

Another necro-post... and Pamela runners aren't necessarily going to like what I've found.

For those that remember the skip I found in Trauare's stage with Freudia several months ago, there were assumptions that this could be done with Pamela as well, but there was no way to prove it to the point that it might not even be possible. It should be safe to assume that you know what I just found:

http://www.twitch.tv/lvcreed/c/4618534

From what I gathered, the Current Skip setup is even more complicated for Pamela than Freudia. This is because you have to account for Pamela's decent speed while starting the current area. Not only that, it's tough to get the screen scrolling to delay while she's at dashing speed during said decent; so stoping that speed by grasping the wall seemed to be the solution for that, and then continue the initial setup. The next issue is getting by the Cheep-Cheeps and then get a well-timed dash jump right before the next upward vertical current. Right now, the timing is very sketchy and I've only was able to get a proper Current Skip setup a handful of times out of many. And even then, the highlight (and the replay that I'm attaching as well) was the ONLY successful Current Skip out of several attempts that spanned over this weekend.

Of course, the same consequences apply as my first post regarding the skip, so you need to memorize the layout of the midpoint area, but that's if and only if you're even to get the skip to begin with. I'll say this right now, if you think that doing the skip with Freudia was tough, doing this with Pamela is going to drive you nuts. However, if any Pamela runners still want to try it, then be my guest. Just be prepared for a CRAPTON of resets if you're going to depend on this for a competitive time.

Also, pardon the suck during the remainder of the stage. It would appear that I am teh sux with Pammy, lol.

Another necro-post... and Pamela runners aren't necessarily going to like what I've found.

For those that remember the skip I found in Trauare's stage with Freudia several months ago, there were assumptions that this could be done with Pamela as well, but there was no way to prove it to the point that it might not even be possible.  It should be safe to assume that you know what I just found:

[url]http://www.twitch.tv/lvcreed/c/4618534[/url]

From what I gathered, the Current Skip setup is even more complicated for Pamela than Freudia.  This is because you have to account for Pamela's decent speed while starting the current area.  Not only that, it's tough to get the screen scrolling to delay while she's at dashing speed during said decent; so stoping that speed by grasping the wall seemed to be the solution for that, and then continue the initial setup.  The next issue is getting by the Cheep-Cheeps and then get a well-timed dash jump right before the next upward vertical current.  Right now, the timing is very sketchy and I've only was able to get a proper Current Skip setup a handful of times out of many.  And even then, the highlight (and the replay that I'm attaching as well) was the ONLY successful Current Skip out of several attempts that spanned over this weekend.

Of course, the same consequences apply as my first post regarding the skip, so you need to memorize the layout of the midpoint area, but that's if and only if you're even to get the skip to begin with.  I'll say this right now, if you think that doing the skip with Freudia was tough, doing this with Pamela is going to drive you nuts.  However, if any Pamela runners still want to try it, then be my guest.  Just be prepared for a [u][i][b]CRAPTON[/b][/i][/u] of resets if you're going to depend on this for a competitive time.

Also, pardon the suck during the remainder of the stage.  It would appear that I am teh sux with Pammy, lol.

Attachment:

RKSW_Pamela_Current_Skip_104a.rpy

Vucious Creed

Edit history:

Vucious Creed: 2014-07-27 03:24:07 pm

2014-07-27 03:22:27 pm

Glad my fanboy lvls aren't THIS high

One final thread bump, and it's a huge one. It finally happened... the sub-32:20 has finally been cut! It might have been cut by frames, but damn it to hell I don't care; it's been cut. The time is now 32:19.94 saving only 0.47 seconds over my previous best. (Funny how I missed sub-32:20 by frames near the beginning of the year to only reach sub-32:20 by an even smaller amount of frames, lol.) Of course, every single trick, skip and strat has been utilized in this run to get this time. Obviously enough, there are places where time could be clearly saved, but at this point, you got to grind like a bloody madman to get the time even lower because I do believe that a very low 32:1X or even sub-32:10 can be a reality. However, to get that, you got to be completely obsessed with the game to maximize it to its fullest potential.

Anyway, as for the run itself. There were a bunch of careless movement errors and luck-based attributes that slowed me down:
-Platform luck during the Luste fight
-Cheep-Cheep luck and a failed superslide in Trauare's stage
-Failing to kill one enemy (another reason why the shield is terribad), and getting the second best pattern on Dolis
-Bad luck on the Eifer Fight
-Input error with sliding on the final stack of rising books in the Refraktia Twin's stage (I hate them so much)
-Missed a superslide in Iris 1
-Sloppy final Tia/Iris fight

And this is neglecting a few other minor slip-ups that could have brought the time lower. Regardless, I still feel very good about this run. So good that, if I can get some help with video editting and such, I think this might be finally submittable to SDA as an improvement over the current run that is hosted. Well, I think that's all that I can really think of at this point. All that's left is to attach the replay file and let it go from there. I'll probably put a Twitch replay regarding the run at a later date for those too lazy to download the replay or don't have the game, but are still curious to see the run. With this, I can finally put this game to rest for a good little while, barring some refresher runs to keep me sharp.

Oh one final thing... shoutouts to Khanster (you suck for this, lol Tongue

) for nearly correcting the sub-32:20 time that I would get when it happened at a trolly 32:19.99 (.05 seconds off). Congratulations... jerk, lmao. Wink

One final thread bump, and it's a huge one.  It finally happened... the sub-32:20 has finally been cut!  It might have been cut by frames, but damn it to hell I don't care; it's been cut.  The time is now 32:19.94 saving only 0.47 seconds over my previous best.  (Funny how I missed sub-32:20 by frames near the beginning of the year to only reach sub-32:20 by an even smaller amount of frames, lol.)  Of course, every single trick, skip and strat has been utilized in this run to get this time.  Obviously enough, there are places where time could be clearly saved, but at this point, you got to grind like a bloody madman to get the time even lower because I do believe that a very low 32:1X or even sub-32:10 can be a reality.  However, to get that, you got to be completely obsessed with the game to maximize it to its fullest potential.

Anyway, as for the run itself.  There were a bunch of careless movement errors and luck-based attributes that slowed me down:
-Platform luck during the Luste fight
-Cheep-Cheep luck and a failed superslide in Trauare's stage
-Failing to kill one enemy (another reason why the shield is terribad), and getting the second best pattern on Dolis
-Bad luck on the Eifer Fight
-Input error with sliding on the final stack of rising books in the Refraktia Twin's stage (I hate them so much)
-Missed a superslide in Iris 1
-Sloppy final Tia/Iris fight

And this is neglecting a few other minor slip-ups that could have brought the time lower.  Regardless, I still feel very good about this run.  So good that, if I can get some help with video editting and such, I think this might be finally submittable to SDA as an improvement over the current run that is hosted.  Well, I think that's all that I can really think of at this point.  All that's left is to attach the replay file and let it go from there.  I'll probably put a Twitch replay regarding the run at a later date for those too lazy to download the replay or don't have the game, but are still curious to see the run.  With this, I can finally put this game to rest for a good little while, barring some refresher runs to keep me sharp.

Oh one final thing... shoutouts to Khanster (you suck for this, lol :P ) for nearly correcting the sub-32:20 time that I would get when it happened at a trolly 32:19.99 (.05 seconds off).  Congratulations... jerk, lmao. ;)

Attachment:

VC_RKSF_Run014_104a.rpy

072

2014-08-07 04:27:00 pm

Congrats! Should be interesting to see a run after so long. It's amazing how quickly I forgot everything in the game Sad

...Except the superslides. I will never forget those.