Question about bunny hopping.

2019-09-30 08:58:27 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Hi there. I got nostalgic after seeing so many awesome demos lately and downloaded/installed Quake. I am trying to understand how guys are gaining such tremendous speed nowdays and seeing if I can learn to do the same. I found a Youtube video by Elgu explaining "power bunnyhops", and I am amazed at how he reaches and maintains speeds of around 600 units/second. I always recalled having a hard time staying over 500 Cheesy

So I downloaded the 100m map since it's very basic and I just want to test this technique. I found an old demo of mine of a 10.58 seconds, and after a few high 10's I actually got a 10.58 to my surprise, matching my 15 year old demo. I think the bunny comparisson page must have lost all it's demos after a certain date, as there is no way my best times submitted back then were 8.12 in e2m1 and 23.93 (!) in e1m1. In fact I got faster than 8.12 in a few minutes of toying around in e2m1 a couple of days ago, after over a decade of not playing Quake (or any other videogame for that matter).

Anyways, I had a question. In Elgu's video he stated that cl_forwardspeed should be set to 200. I tried this and I seem to be slower. The initial bunny is very bad with this setting, as one seems to be able to move sideways faster than forward, so feels very strange to make that initial bunny. My question is: are these new guys playing with that "always run off" through their entire demos? What about sections of the map where they have to actualy walk? Do they change cl_forwardspeed throughout the runs when it's convenient?

I am very intrigued because I want to see what it feels to attain 600 speed. In the 10.5 I got after toying around for a few minutes, it takes me about 5 bunnies to get over 500 speed (I downloaded Kay's demo and he gets 500 on his second landing!), and I seem to max out at about 560 at some points near the end of the run. This is with cl_forwardspeed 400 mind you. Like I said, setting it to 200 didn't seem to help at all... am I doing something wrong or is it just a matter of working on timing that first bunny better?

Thread title:

Hi there. I got nostalgic after seeing so many awesome demos lately and downloaded/installed Quake. I am trying to understand how guys are gaining such tremendous speed nowdays and seeing if I can learn to do the same. I found a Youtube video by Elgu explaining "power bunnyhops", and I am amazed at how he reaches and maintains speeds of around 600 units/second. I always recalled having a hard time staying over 500 :D

So I downloaded the 100m map since it's very basic and I just want to test this technique. I found an old demo of mine of a 10.58 seconds, and after a few high 10's I actually got a 10.58 to my surprise, matching my 15 year old demo. I think the bunny comparisson page must have lost all it's demos after a certain date, as there is no way my best times submitted back then were 8.12 in e2m1 and 23.93 (!) in e1m1. In fact I got faster than 8.12 in a few minutes of toying around in e2m1 a couple of days ago, after over a decade of not playing Quake (or any other videogame for that matter).

Anyways, I had a question. In Elgu's video he stated that cl_forwardspeed should be set to 200. I tried this and I seem to be slower. The initial bunny is very bad with this setting, as one seems to be able to move sideways faster than forward, so feels very strange to make that initial bunny. My question is: are these new guys playing with that "always run off" through their entire demos? What about sections of the map where they have to actualy walk? Do they change cl_forwardspeed throughout the runs when it's convenient?

I am very intrigued because I want to see what it feels to attain 600 speed. In the 10.5 I got after toying around for a few minutes, it takes me about 5 bunnies to get over 500 speed (I downloaded Kay's demo and he gets 500 on his second landing!), and I seem to max out at about 560 at some points near the end of the run. This is with cl_forwardspeed 400 mind you. Like I said, setting it to 200 didn't seem to help at all... am I doing something wrong or is it just a matter of working on timing that first bunny better?

Arturo

2019-09-30 02:38:48 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Played for a while and managed to go above 500 right after the 2nd landing. Got 10.38 and for a tiny fraction of a second saw speed reaching 581, but overall sucked because I lost a ton of speed on most of the landings. Still using cl_forwardspeed 400 and not 200.

I gotta say in the comments section of Elgu's youtube video, he states most people use the middle mouse button for +forward. I never used that, I tap it with the hand that controls the movement keys. Maybe that makes me more inefficient (??).

After half hour of 100m I am feeling it on my fingers... Cheesy

So I don't think this newfound urge to play will last long, hehe. Will sit back and enjoy the amazing demos the new crop of players are producing, they are truly other-wordly. Noone would have thought e4m5_010 was possible, for example. And I found a youtube video of a guy getting 7.28 in e2m1 !! Just wow. Those bunnies look so incredibly.... long. I don't know how else to describe them. It's trully remarkable.

jukebox

2019-10-01 03:40:18 am

If you don't use 'always run on' you need to have +speed active as it functions as your 'run' command. When you transition to using powerbunnies from regular bunnies you need to adjust the way you perform groundstrafes/prestrafes since when you use 'always run on' the speed isn't applied to sideways movement, unlike +speed.

Binding +forward to mouse2 is a pretty common method for doing powerbunnies.

A few runners do switch between cl_forwardspeed 200 and 400 during runs (I know Elgu does at least), but I think it's mainly for wallrunning purposes(?).

Arturo

2019-10-01 08:42:11 am

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Thank you jukebox. Using the +speed command I can definitely start the bunnies better, but I am still slower in a 100m run compared to regular bunnies. I did however tried just bunnyhopping back and forth in 100m (without exiting) seeing if I could achieve a decent speed at some point, and managed to see the elusive 600 in the show_speed bar a couple of times. But it's very inconsistent for me, can't keep it at all times, and it takes me a LOT of bunnies to reach that speed so it's obviously a poor technique issue.

I guess maybe I'd need a lot of practise with the cl_forwardspeed 200 and +speed command in order to get the hang of starting a bunny sequence that way. And I did indeed noticed that wall-hugging was very ineffective with these settings (at least in the 100m map but I guess it applies to all maps).

jukebox

2019-10-01 01:50:54 pm

Yeah, learning to strafe properly with +speed and always run off was hard to learn after being so used to the old method of strafing - like anything else it's just practice. When changing your always run setting, the optimal angle at which to wallrun also changes. You kind of look away from the wall as opposed to towards it when you have it turned off and using +speed.

LotBlind

2019-10-02 07:27:47 am

Hasn't anyone updated the wiki for so long? This is why they exist. I assure you it makes everything more efficient.

Arturo

2019-10-02 04:09:02 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Oh, I didn't even know about a wiki for this, so my bad, perhaps I should've searched for it first!

LotBlind

2019-10-03 11:25:53 am

Yeah, here for reference: https://kb.speeddemosarchive.com/Quake

I always build a wiki for each game I look into. It definitely feels more pro that way... BTW: I think Thomas mentioned some special Ogre-related trick he used in the any% of the level he uploaded on the QdQ channel just now. I can't see that one in the wiki at first glance. Perhaps someone with expertise should update it now, as little as I like to point these things out when I'm not otherwise involved.

Arturo

2019-10-24 01:41:06 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

I just want to make a trivial comment: after so many years of not playing I kindof wanted to run a map in a time that would make me somewhat happy. After so many low 31's I finally got a :30 in e1m2 and THAT made my day Smiley

haha. Just firing up Quake for about 10-15 minutes every few days. I could not for the life of me dedicate myself to learn how to bunny with these settings that the good players of today use, so I used the old settings which I now understand are not even close to optimal. At least now I have a much better understanding of WHY these players are moving the way they do and why they gain so much speed. I remember when I got :29 in e1m2, I tried a whole bunny sequence through the spikes area and did not find it to save much time.. but of course, with the old settings I couldn't get anywhere near close the speed these guys get nowdays. The e1m2_028 shows the player finishing that bunny sequence with around 580 speed (!!!). He also finishes the sequence that starts after getting the Silver Key with incredible speed - in my :29 that sequence was slower than usual, I could do it faster but not even close to how he does it. He moves so smoothly, I love that demo.

Anyways just getting :30 with "the old technique" was fun after so many years of not playing. Don't think I'll play much but I'll surely keep enjoying the records that are being broken. Those marathons are incredibly sharp, I'm loving them as well.

I just want to make a trivial comment: after so many years of not playing I kindof wanted to run a map in a time that would make me somewhat happy. After so many low 31's I finally got a :30 in e1m2 and THAT made my day :) haha. Just firing up Quake for about 10-15 minutes every few days. I could not for the life of me dedicate myself to learn how to bunny with these settings that the good players of today use, so I used the old settings which I now understand are not even close to optimal. At least now I have a much better understanding of WHY these players are moving the way they do and why they gain so much speed. I remember when I got :29 in e1m2, I tried a whole bunny sequence through the spikes area and did not find it to save much time.. but of course, with the old settings I couldn't get anywhere near close the speed these guys get nowdays. The e1m2_028 shows the player finishing that bunny sequence with around 580 speed (!!!). He also finishes the sequence that starts after getting the Silver Key with incredible speed - in my :29 that sequence was slower than usual, I could do it faster but not even close to how he does it. He moves so smoothly, I love that demo.

Anyways just getting :30 with "the old technique" was fun after so many years of not playing. Don't think I'll play much but I'll surely keep enjoying the records that are being broken. Those marathons are incredibly sharp, I'm loving them as well.

Arturo

2019-10-31 01:42:14 pm

I love YaBB 1G - SP1!

Just wanted to say I stumbled upon e1m3_031 ER... what an awesome-looking bunny sequence at the beginning!