Popful Mail (Sega CD)

scaryice

2008-09-09 10:01:48 pm

Bump. Still on the verification list. Help out if you can.

scaryice

2008-12-19 09:30:21 pm

http://speeddemosarchive.com/PopfulMail.html

Run is now on the site, although it hasn't been posted on the main page yet. Check it out.

As I said in the comments, I think there are three boss fights where the run could be improved: Mythril Guardian, Nutscracker #2, and Necros. However, I did get some pretty good luck on a couple of the fights, like the Fire Golem and Fright Knight.

Also, a couple days ago I downloaded the Japanese rom and tried it out. I'd heard for the longest time that Working Designs upped the difficulty for the American release. Well, that's definitely the case. Not only do you take less damage, but almost every single boss in the game can be killed in fewer hits. As a matter of fact, I think the only bosses that were the same was the first two and Morgal.

For example, the last two bosses and Goradus can be killed in 25 hits instead of 34. The biggest change was Sven, who I believe took only 10 hits to kill in the Japanese version compared to 34 stateside. That one fight would've been a minute faster.

In addition, selling the gold bullion gets you 1,000 gold instead of 500. I believe the weapons were cheaper too.

I didn't notice any actual gameplay changes however.

http://speeddemosarchive.com/PopfulMail.html

Run is now on the site, although it hasn't been posted on the main page yet. Check it out.

As I said in the comments, I think there are three boss fights where the run could be improved: Mythril Guardian, Nutscracker #2, and Necros. However, I did get some pretty good luck on a couple of the fights, like the Fire Golem and Fright Knight.

Also, a couple days ago I downloaded the Japanese rom and tried it out. I'd heard for the longest time that Working Designs upped the difficulty for the American release. Well, that's definitely the case. Not only do you take less damage, but almost every single boss in the game can be killed in fewer hits. As a matter of fact, I think the only bosses that were the same was the first two and Morgal.

For example, the last two bosses and Goradus can be killed in 25 hits instead of 34. The biggest change was Sven, who I believe took only 10 hits to kill in the Japanese version compared to 34 stateside. That one fight would've been a minute faster.

In addition, selling the gold bullion gets you 1,000 gold instead of 500. I believe the weapons were cheaper too.

I didn't notice any actual gameplay changes however.

getter77

2008-12-20 04:55:42 am

100% runs=great to watch

Congrats on it making it up to the main page! I'm definitely going to give this a watch today or tomorrow in normal quality once I free up enough HD space for it! 8)

Thanks for all the hard work you put into this.

Ghoti

2008-12-22 08:25:27 pm

Currently occupying the grey area.

Just watched the run, and i have to say, it's highly impressive. Maybe 4-5 tiny mistakes that i noticed, but for a run this long, that's outstanding. You also showed great knowledge of what was coming up, and it's obvious that you knew the game inside and out. One of the best on the site IMO.

RatFunk

2014-06-19 04:58:08 pm

Fun game blinded recently and started working on some runs, the voices are great, i shall not underestimate the soup XD. been getting run times down over the week 1:20:07 real but i think can go down a few more, that boomerang is the shit, and blarg ... gaw.

RatFunk

2014-06-19 10:13:43 pm

also theres a frame perfect health glitch foudn recenlty by gankro if u die on second boss on the frame of the pause u will have infinite health, also harder to work out is save corruption, to gett a radom assortment of items early in game, <- 2 annoying to figure out or use tho.

scaryice

2014-06-20 11:02:13 pm

You forgot to mention that you're playing the Japanese version, which is a lot easier than the US version. Smiley

So it's not really a comparable time to mine.

Still, I'm happy to see someone else running it. Are you gonna try to run the US version?

I haven't heard of any glitches like that, although I did have my game crash a couple times after beating the Thrashmaster+ which I assume is related to what you mentioned.

RatFunk

2014-06-21 12:58:58 am

I only do us version for cutscene percent, otherwise as per usual fastest version. And yea its on thrashmaster , while save corruption works sparsely on ethier

Napstrpsx

Edit history:

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-13 10:05:21 am

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-13 10:05:14 am

2015-01-13 09:59:40 am

Hey RatFunk and scaryice. After watching AGDQ, it got me thinking about this game again!

I had thought about practicing this last year, never did, but still never gave up on the idea, either. I'm interested in practicing a game, I've toyed around with several ideas but Popful Mail is the one I always come back to. It's pretty obscure, but a very strong candidate for speedrunning imo. 3 varied characters to play as, and by my count... ~22 bosses?

Interesting to hear about the glitches. I think for entertainment value, though... glitchless would be the way to go.

Never thought about the JP version. I tried to get a Sega CD emulator up and running the other day, no luck. I still have a Sega CD, though.

RatFunk

2015-01-14 07:46:59 pm

hey thats cool man i love the series enough to also run the snes and turbo graphics version i would try kega fusion if u want to practice the sega cd one http://www.twitch.tv/ratfunk/c/4492104 u can find the video there as well as the other versions good luck.

Napstrpsx

2015-01-20 08:44:57 am

sweet, thank you. I just followed you.

I think I tried that one but couldn't get it to work. I may PM you over twitch to see if I'm missing something. I'm very happy to say, I just finished Lunar: Eternal Blue on Sega CD last night. Which means I finally finished all the Sega CD games I've intended to play for almost 2 years now. That's been my biggest hangup on getting started w/ Popful Mail.

I plan on getting another copy of Popful Mail and piddling around w/ practicing. If I start getting into it, streaming would be cool but my upload speed isn't very good on DSL, even though it's the highest I can get. Sad

Napstrpsx

Edit history:

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 05:11:54 pm

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 05:11:04 pm

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 05:08:05 pm

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 05:07:15 pm

2015-01-25 05:06:53 pm

After clearing out the backlog, I'm finally learning this game. As RatFunk already knows from some PM'ing on twitch. Smiley

RatFunk, I haven't watched your run from beginning to end yet to see how it differs from scaryice's, but I know you opted for the Boomerang as you mentioned. I don't know all the detailed differences between the 2 versions (yet) For now, I've got my hands full just learning the maps and mirroring scaryice's run. I'm making minor execution changes as I go, but if/when I get a run completed it will be very similar to his. I watched the full run today and set up splits based on it to compare to as I learn.

For how old it is, your run is very solid, scaryice. This game is full of very tight timing windows and leaves very little room for error especially when it comes to taking damage.

I just wanted to clarify something about the timing: I start my timing as soon as I hit NEW GAME because that's when you first have control to skip the first cutscene. I have 22 splits, one for each boss, and hit each split as soon as the last note starts on the post-boss fanfare. So the last split may be a little behind because the last boss is already dead and the game is over.

Anyway, by my method of timing, scaryice's run clocks in at 1:23:39, RatFunk's at 1:19:59. A 3m40s difference, maybe not as big as scaryice might've thought. I have no idea how version of the game factors in. I've been practicing pretty solidly, learning one split at a time, and am currently at Boney Rubbler. I haven't been able to shave off a whole lot of time off scaryice's run. After my improvements, if I get as clean of run as he did I'd be surprised if mine was more than a minute faster.

Unfortunately, I can't stream because of local Internet speeds. The fastest upload I can get from my DSL provider is < 1 Mbps. I do have screen recording software, though. In the future, if I get good, I would look into doing occasional streams from a friend's house. I'm really enjoying making a legit effort at learning a game finally. I definitely think this is a game that deserves some more attention. It's a very intense run, has tons of variety, and is easy to follow!

After clearing out the backlog, I'm finally learning this game. As RatFunk already knows from some PM'ing on twitch. :)

RatFunk, I haven't watched your run from beginning to end yet to see how it differs from scaryice's, but I know you opted for the Boomerang as you mentioned. I don't know all the detailed differences between the 2 versions (yet) For now, I've got my hands full just learning the maps and mirroring scaryice's run. I'm making minor execution changes as I go, but if/when I get a run completed it will be very similar to his. I watched the full run today and set up splits based on it to compare to as I learn.

For how old it is, your run is very solid, scaryice. This game is full of very tight timing windows and leaves very little room for error especially when it comes to taking damage.

I just wanted to clarify something about the timing: I start my timing as soon as I hit NEW GAME because that's when you first have control to skip the first cutscene. I have 22 splits, one for each boss, and hit each split as soon as the last note starts on the post-boss fanfare. So the last split may be a little behind because the last boss is already dead and the game is over.

Anyway, by my method of timing, scaryice's run clocks in at 1:23:39, RatFunk's at 1:19:59. A 3m40s difference, maybe not as big as scaryice might've thought. I have no idea how version of the game factors in. I've been practicing pretty solidly, learning one split at a time, and am currently at Boney Rubbler. I haven't been able to shave off a whole lot of time off scaryice's run. After my improvements, if I get as clean of run as he did I'd be surprised if mine was more than a minute faster.

Unfortunately, I can't stream because of local Internet speeds. The fastest upload I can get from my DSL provider is < 1 Mbps. I do have screen recording software, though. In the future, if I get good, I would look into doing occasional streams from a friend's house. I'm really enjoying making a legit effort at learning a game finally. I definitely think this is a game that deserves some more attention. It's a very intense run, has tons of variety, and is easy to follow!

Napstrpsx

Edit history:

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 06:42:05 pm

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 06:41:44 pm

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 06:41:09 pm

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 06:40:53 pm

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 06:40:44 pm

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 06:40:30 pm

Napstrpsx: 2015-01-25 05:22:19 pm

2015-01-25 05:21:44 pm

I just checked for any version differences for the final trio of bosses, since they take a while to kill and you're using the same weapon in both versions.

Morgal takes 5 damage from Gaw in both versions.
Necros takes 5 damage from Tatt in JP, 4 in US. (20 hits vs. 25)
The Overlord takes 4 damage from Mail in JP, 3 in US. (25 hits vs. 34)

The difference on The Overlord alone accounts for at least 50 seconds. Just an interesting FYI.

EDIT: I found another pretty significant boss difference. Won't bother into looking/list anymore for now but both the body and head of Thrasmaster+ take 10 damage in JP, only 5 in US. This is significant because you have to destroy the body twice in the US version. I just spent a good while trying to see if it was possible to 1-cycle him in the US version, the lowest I can get the head on the first cycle is 15 health. I'm sure a TAS could do it. RatFunk's kill only takes ~30 seconds, scaryice's ~1m.

RatFunk

2015-01-26 12:44:03 am

there is no doubt which is faster choice to use for any%

zip_gun

Edit history:

zip_gun: 2015-02-19 10:39:03 pm

2015-02-19 10:32:09 pm

Thought I'd breathe a little life back into this thread, as I've been working on bringing new life to the game. (Napstrpsx is my old account)

I just finished my first single-segment run through the first 1/2 of the game, aka beating Fire Golem. Been playing pretty solidly for the past month, working hard to optimize the first half of the game as best I can.

Ever since I started, I've been running against splits I made using the SDA run by scaryice. Makes for 22 splits, one for each boss fought and I split on the last note of the post-boss fanfare. scaryice's Fire Golem split is at 45:18, with his final split at 1:23:39.

The run I just did, I was -2:29 after beating Fire Golem: http://i.imgur.com/OYKabLF.png

(I have a recording, but it looks tacky because I made the mistake of capturing the whole emulator window like in the link.)

scaryice's run and execution is very good. Most of the time saved is due to buying the Boomerang for Mail instead of the Electro Cane for Tatt. scaryice used Tatt+Electro Cane for Thunder Dragon, Goradus, Mythril Golem, Sven T. Uncommon, Chargon, and Fire Golem, whereas I use Boomerang for all of those fights. scaryice knew there was a chance this route would end up faster. I did a lot of testing on bosses and the Boomerang is the winner for speed, for pretty much every boss except Chargon.

Next time I stream, I'm just going to do more attempts of the same thing - trying to get through the first half of the game. I haven't played anything past Fire Golem since I played casually over a year ago. But, I'm excited to see what further optimizations there may be.

There isn't much of a community for this game yet outside of scaryice, RatFunk, and myself. But, I think this is a great speed game (a standout non-Nintendo Action-RPG) and it's very challenging. I'm the only one actively running the US version afaik. Would enjoy seeing some new faces! I can't stream regularly, but I am when I can from a friend's house.

https://twitter.com/zip_gunSDA
http://www.twitch.tv/zip_gun

Anyone interested, more than happy to have some company. Even if it's just a hello in chat or get some more eyes on the game to help optimize it. Smiley

Thought I'd breathe a little life back into this thread, as I've been working on bringing new life to the game. (Napstrpsx is my old account)

I just finished my first single-segment run through the first 1/2 of the game, aka beating Fire Golem. Been playing pretty solidly for the past month, working hard to optimize the first half of the game as best I can.

Ever since I started, I've been running against splits I made using the SDA run by scaryice. Makes for 22 splits, one for each boss fought and I split on the last note of the post-boss fanfare. scaryice's Fire Golem split is at 45:18, with his final split at 1:23:39.

The run I just did, I was -2:29 after beating Fire Golem: http://i.imgur.com/OYKabLF.png

(I have a recording, but it looks tacky because I made the mistake of capturing the whole emulator window like in the link.)

scaryice's run and execution is very good. Most of the time saved is due to buying the Boomerang for Mail instead of the Electro Cane for Tatt. scaryice used Tatt+Electro Cane for Thunder Dragon, Goradus, Mythril Golem, Sven T. Uncommon, Chargon, and Fire Golem, whereas I use Boomerang for all of those fights. scaryice knew there was a chance this route would end up faster. I did a lot of testing on bosses and the Boomerang is the winner for speed, for pretty much every boss except Chargon.

Next time I stream, I'm just going to do more attempts of the same thing - trying to get through the first half of the game. I haven't played anything past Fire Golem since I played casually over a year ago. But, I'm excited to see what further optimizations there may be.

There isn't much of a community for this game yet outside of scaryice, RatFunk, and myself. But, I think this is a great speed game (a standout non-Nintendo Action-RPG) and it's very challenging. I'm the only one actively running the US version afaik. Would enjoy seeing some new faces! I can't stream regularly, but I am when I can from a friend's house.

https://twitter.com/zip_gunSDA
http://www.twitch.tv/zip_gun

Anyone interested, more than happy to have some company. Even if it's just a hello in chat or get some more eyes on the game to help optimize it. :)

zip_gun

Edit history:

zip_gun: 2015-02-20 12:47:30 pm

2015-02-20 09:02:54 am

I went ahead and uploaded the run, warning: video quality is bad!! lol. Should've exported better quality, lesson learned. If I can edit this post later I'll replace the link with an upgrade.

Some really good parts, some not-so-stellar parts, but no major mistakes.

EDIT: I added lots of annotations to the video to help explain the run. Please check it out if you're interested, any feedback appreciated.